Ragas in RANGEELA
K. Rajaraman
Today I got a chance to listen to Rangeela songs carefully.
Since few people asked for ragas in them, I thought I
would take the "rope-walk",i.e. (try to) identify ragas.
Here we go!!
I think there are only three songs with a semblance of
raga in them. Others I didn't listen or fast-forwarded.
The best in the album I think is "Hai Rama" sung by
Swarnalatha and Hariharan. What a original composition
by Rehman! Simply a beautiful piece! And how Swarnalatha
has sung it! I think Rehman just wanted to show the north
indians why she deserved the national award for last year.
Hariharan has tried his best to give her support. The closest
raga i could find is Poorvi(or Poorya or Pooryakalyan).
(The hindustani way of having too many close ragas is the
main confusion here.) Otherwise, it's a great piece!
I wonder why this song hasn't really got the applause what
it deserves. Is it because of the steamy picturization?
"Pyar ye" is another good song by Kavita and Suresh watkar.
(I wonder why S. Watkar is so under utilized. I still can
remember his "O priya" and "Meintho diwani".) The raga seems
to be Kafi. (not sure)
Yaaro sulo Zara is simple to pin down. Because it's a
lift from Ilayaraaja's "Thogai Pullangulal". The raga is
Punnagavarali. I would say Rehman has destroyed the beauty
by catering to the masses. Listen to the Raaja version, you'll
know how it could have been.
About other songs, I don't have much to say, except Janaki would
have done a better job than Asha. Especially for Tanha Tanha.
Anyway, a hit is a hit.
Is it going like a "Classical Rehman" ? :) Well. let me see if
I can continue it, like Lakshmi, if people like it.
Comments?
-Rajaram.
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K. Rajaraman K. Rajaraman |
Dept of Electrical Engg N-6 |
Indian Institute of Science IISc Hostels |
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India - 560 012. Bangalore |
email: raj...@expertix.ee.iisc.ernet.in |
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V. Chandramouli
|>
|> Today I got a chance to listen to Rangeela songs carefully.
|> Since few people asked for ragas in them, I thought I
|> would take the "rope-walk",i.e. (try to) identify ragas.
|> Here we go!!
|> I think there are only three songs with a semblance of
|> raga in them. Others I didn't listen or fast-forwarded.
|>
|> The best in the album I think is "Hai Rama" sung by
|> Swarnalatha and Hariharan. What a original composition
|> by Rehman! Simply a beautiful piece! And how Swarnalatha
|> has sung it! I think Rehman just wanted to show the north
|> indians why she deserved the national award for last year.
|> Hariharan has tried his best to give her support. The closest
|> raga i could find is Poorvi(or Poorya or Pooryakalyan).
|> (The hindustani way of having too many close ragas is the
|> main confusion here.) Otherwise, it's a great piece!
|> I wonder why this song hasn't really got the applause what
|> it deserves. Is it because of the steamy picturization?
|>
|>
Are you sure ? I thought it was something close to Pantuvarali. Maybe it uses a combination of both. I am assuming Poorvikalyan corresponds to Gamansrama of C. music. Perhaps I should listen to it again.
--Chandramouli
V. Chandramouli
|>
|> Today I got a chance to listen to Rangeela songs carefully.
|> Since few people asked for ragas in them, I thought I
|> would take the "rope-walk",i.e. (try to) identify ragas.
|> Here we go!!
|> I think there are only three songs with a semblance of
|> raga in them. Others I didn't listen or fast-forwarded.
|>
|> The best in the album I think is "Hai Rama" sung by
|> Swarnalatha and Hariharan. What a original composition
|> by Rehman! Simply a beautiful piece! And how Swarnalatha
|> has sung it! I think Rehman just wanted to show the north
|> indians why she deserved the national award for last year.
|> Hariharan has tried his best to give her support. The closest
|> raga i could find is Poorvi(or Poorya or Pooryakalyan).
|> (The hindustani way of having too many close ragas is the
|> main confusion here.) Otherwise, it's a great piece!
|> I wonder why this song hasn't really got the applause what
|> it deserves. Is it because of the steamy picturization?
|>
|>
Actually, Pantuvarali or "Kama"vardhini as it is also known, would be an apt choice considering the steamy nature of the picturization, don't you think ? :-)
--Chandramouli
K. Rajaraman
Didn't you know that Pantuvarali is the Carnatic counterpart
of Poorvi. (i mean, in the mela-thaat correspondence)
Siddhartha Chatterjee
|> Hariharan has tried his best to give her support. The closest
|> raga i could find is Poorvi(or Poorya or Pooryakalyan).
|> (The hindustani way of having too many close ragas is the
|> main confusion here.) Otherwise, it's a great piece!
In what sense are Poorvi, Puriya, and Puriyakalyan "close"? Poorvi uses komal
dhaivat, Puriya uses shuddha dhaivat and no pancham, and Puriyakalyan uses
shuddha dhaivat and the pancham.
--
Siddhartha Chatterjee, Assistant Professor http://www.cs.unc.edu/~sc
Department of Computer Science s...@cs.unc.edu
The University of North Carolina (919) 962-1766
Chapel Hill, NC 27599-3175 (919) 962-1799 fax
K. Rajaraman
in RANGEELA". Sorry for the delay. Our mailing system
was down during the whole of last week.
First to Siddharth Chatterjee...)
maybe they are technically different, but I see good resemblances
between Poorvi, Poorya and Poorya dhanashri(btw, I think
I said Pooryakalyan in the post. "slip of the fingers" :) ). I
mentioned them in my post mainly because, you know, we are talking
about film songs. One can't be really sure. But, after that post
I've listened to Hai Rama quite a few times, now I know
It's indeed based on Poorvi.
One more comment: I said
Yaaro sunlo zara is based on Punnagavarali. Though there
very close similarities, it could simply be a song
based on arabic scale.
And, many people asked for the
movie in which "thogai pullangulal" appeared. It's
"Ilanjodigal", a movie of early 80-s starring Karthik,
Radha and Vijayashanthi(!).
Someone said Yaaro sunlo zara
is not a lift from Raaja's song but from one of Rahman's
itself. Well... then that Superpolice song should be a
lift from Raaja :) . (btw, I have not listened to this
song.)
Talking about close ragas, I want to raise the foll. issue.
Why are there many very close ragas in Hindustani?
How does one really appreciate all these
ragas? I'm sure at least people will agree that the "closeness"
here much more than the closeness talked about in the carnatic
circles, e.g. of Abhogi and Sriranjani.
I'll give one such set of Hindustani ragas:
Hamir, Hamir Kalyan and Kedar
I'm aware they are technically different. But, It's
really very difficult for someone like me to really
differentiate between them, let alone appreciation.
Because the minute difference could be due to, e.g. the
style of the musician rendering raga.
A sincere answer to this will greatly help many
southindians like me and shut some carnatic biased people, who claim
Hindustani is a sortof "bogus" music because it involves singing
hours and hours of very close ragas that can be
really understood by only very few people. (I know
quite a bit of people who have said this personally
to me.)
Rajan P. Parrikar
>Talking about close ragas, I want to raise the foll. issue.
>
>Why are there many very close ragas in Hindustani?
First of all we will have to agree (as of now, from the
example you have provided, we don't) on what is 'close` before
an answer can be attempted.
>How does one really appreciate all these
>ragas? I'm sure at least people will agree that the "closeness"
>here much more than the closeness talked about in the carnatic
>circles, e.g. of Abhogi and Sriranjani.
>
>I'll give one such set of Hindustani ragas:
>Hamir, Hamir Kalyan and Kedar
>
>I'm aware they are technically different.
No, they (Hamir/Hamir Kalyan and Kedar) differ much more than
on mere technical details.
>But, It's
>really very difficult for someone like me to really
>differentiate between them, let alone appreciation.
>Because the minute difference could be due to, e.g. the
>style of the musician rendering raga.
Even in the relatively few cases in Hindustani music where
the Ragas share a common scalic bond (eg., Marwa/Puriya,
Bhoop/Deshkar/Jait Kalyan, Durga/Jaladhar Kedar) the differences
are notable, discernibility of which is often within the ambit of
untrained, albeit careful, listeners. There are, however, very,
very few instances where there is pedantic hairsplitting but the
premise that the Hindustani tradition is rich in them is a false one.
Regards,
r
Sanjeev Ramabhadran
>>
>>I'll give one such set of Hindustani ragas:
>>Hamir, Hamir Kalyan and Kedar
>>
>>I'm aware they are technically different.
>
>No, they (Hamir/Hamir Kalyan and Kedar) differ much more than
>on mere technical details.
>
Carnatic Hamir Kalyani are NOT the same. Hamir Kalyani IS in fact very
close to Kedar (I think you could almost call them equivalent). Hamir of
course is quite different. I would describe it (albeit simplistically)
as two plaid patterns that use the same colors, but the croos-patterns
and
striping is different, to the point that you notice RIGHT away...
.
Sanjeev
Shashidhara
Before anyone points out that we need to agree on what
"near-identical" means before an answer can be attempted,
let me hasten to add that I am not attempting an answer.
But here is a thought for Rajaraman: Considering that you
have 72 (i.e., >> a dozen) melakarta ragas in Carnatic music,
do you not feel that near-identical (by any def) ragas must
be more prevalent in C music ?
Shashidhara
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Rajan P. Parrikar
>In article <48bva2$s...@lace.colorado.edu> parr...@rococo.Colorado.EDU (Rajan P. Parrikar) writes:
>>>
>>>I'll give one such set of Hindustani ragas:
>>>Hamir, Hamir Kalyan and Kedar
>>>
>>>I'm aware they are technically different.
>>
>>No, they (Hamir/Hamir Kalyan and Kedar) differ much more than
>>on mere technical details.
>>
>Actually, there is some confusion here. The Hindustani Hamir and
>Carnatic Hamir Kalyani are NOT the same. Hamir Kalyani IS in fact very
>close to Kedar (I think you could almost call them equivalent). Hamir of
If you read the original post as well as my response to it carefully,
you will notice that neither I nor Rajaraman is confusing Hamir Kalyan
with the Carnatic Hamir Kalyani.
r
Sanjeev Ramabhadran
>>>>
>
>If you read the original post as well as my response to it carefully,
>you will notice that neither I nor Rajaraman is confusing Hamir Kalyan
>with the Carnatic Hamir Kalyani.
>
heard of the Carnatic Hamir KALYANI, I assumed the latter. BTW, what is
Hamir Kalyan (Hindustani)?
Also, I had mentioned the raga Bhavakri Todi earlier, with regards to
the tivra madhyam-komal nishad combo; this is I believe the same as the
Carnatic melakarta raga Bhavapriya (or Bhavakriya).
Sanjeev Ramabhadran
>
>
Rajan P. Parrikar
>BTW, what is
>Hamir Kalyan (Hindustani)?
Hamir is also known as Hamir Kalyan.
r