am a German musician and I play the bansuri (Indian bamboo flute).
I love Hariprasad Chaurasia a lot, for me he is the greatest master of
this wonderful instrument.
I would be interested to learn about more bansuri artists, could
anybody recommend some?
I also have written a small article about the bansuri on my homepage:
http://www.sangitom.de and would be happy to add more links to
related websites.
Many Greetings
Stefan (Sangit Om)
--
Stefan Petersilge
SANGIT OM MUSIC PRODUCTION
listen to my music at www.mp3.com/sangitom
CS
Framedrums wrote:
--
Balwant N. Dixit
University of Pittsburgh
541-2 Salk Hall
Pittsburgh, PA 15261
Tel No:(412) 648-8582
FAX No:(412) 648-8475
Shri Vijay Raghav Rao
Shri Hariprasad Chaurasia
Shri Nityanand Haldipur
Shri Anand Murdeshwar
Shri Ronu Mazumdar
Shri Raghunath Seth
Shri Sunil Kant Gupta
Shri Prakash Wadhera
Shri Rupak Kulkarni
Shri Rakesh Chaurasia
Shri Rajendra Prasanna
Shri Ajay Prasanna
Of this list, I enjoy Nityanand Haldipur's music the most. His impeccable ragadari
and keen aesthetics lend a rare vocal quality to his music. The fact that
Nityanand is one of the finest people that dwell on this planet, makes his music
even more desirable to me. Anand Murdeshwar's latest CD (Ninaad, 2000) "To Dadu
with love" features a very good Yaman. Vijay Raghav Rao is a landmark composer,
and Hariprasad Chaurasia a redoubtable virtuoso.
The finest recordings of Hindustani bansuri music have been made by late Pandit
Pannalal Ghosh and the late Shri Devendra Murdeshwar. Pt. Bholanath Prasanna (the
guru of Hariji) was also a great flautist of the past.
Shri Gour Goswami's line is continued by his disciple Shri Debaprasad (Debu)
Banerjee of Lake Market, Calcutta.
Warm regards,
A
And of course by Steve Gorn, whom Arnab has not seen fit
to mention in his list of living bansuriyas. To my knowledge
Steve has not departed this vale of laughter; I prefer not to
speculate about other reasons for the omission.
WS
But as someone interested in bansuri, you would do well to look
for great bansuri pieces in 'light' Indian music, too. Hariprasad Chaurasiya
is a sycophant of Gandhi dynasty and you can look forward to hearing
a new raag, composed in honour of Priyanka Gandhi's baby. He has
also played some of the most incredible bansuri pieces while lending
a hand to light music. When someone else tells him what to play (and
also probably how to play it), he really can produce sublime music.
You will get to hear about 15 second's bansuri in a 3-minute song.
But it should be well worth it. I understand HPC has played bansuri
for quite a few songs by Hridaynath Mangeshkar. Check out his
Marathi songs, penned by poet Dnyaneshwar in 13th century and
sung by Lata. Also check out Kishori Amonkar's two Marathi songs,
composed by HM. These songs were recorded in 1960s.
One more famous flute player, who was part of Hindi Film Industry
in its halcyon years in 1950s, was one Sumant. He was assistant to
K Datta. I don't remember his full name. (Can you help, Arnab?)
Sumant used to be in great demand.
Post your query on RMIM, soliciting information about great bansuri
pieces in Indian Film Music, if that is okay with you. Ignore all
post-1960 songs, if any are suggested from that period. (This 1960s
rule does not apply if I do the suggesting.) And check out
one lovely flute piece, for starters, from the great Lata solo : 'mujh pe
ilzaam-e-bewafaaii hai', from film Yasmin. In one of the commercially
available versions of this song, this superb flute piece has been criminally
excised. So you will have to be careful. (Don't view this
as a deterrent, but as a word of caution.)
- nani
A statement that pretends to erase itself, but makes sure
that it leaves a trace! One up on Heidegger. :)
Ashok
More importantly, Pt. Dinkarrao Amembal (aka D'Amel or Dinkarmaam) was
another great flutist, harmonium player and a genius of a composer of the
20th century. Anyone that I have spoken to on this topic, has always
mentioned his name with great reverence. He was so averse to fame that it
seems even Arnab has not heard about him. (...... just kidding, Arnie)
I think it was about 10 years or more ago that there was a convention of
bansuri players in Bombay. (probably in Borivili). The organizers had
published a sovenieur publication for the event, containing the program,
probably some articles, some advertizements for funds for the event etc.
The cover page of this publication had a graphic of all bansuri players
(living and dead) arranged in a circle/spiral. At the top was Bhagawan
Shrikrishna. and as the spiral moved away from Shrikrishna in both
directions, the list moved from the greatest of artists to the youngest. On
the left of Shri Krishna was Pannalal Ghosh and on his right was D'Amel. I
have not been fortunate enough to have heard D'Amel's bansuri - live or
recorded - however this graphic said a lot to me.
Even though not many know about him, D'Amel's compositions are ingrained in
the minds of everyone in Bombay today - to the best of my knowledge (and
this is second hand info - so please feel free to correct me if you know
better) he was the one who composed the two lines of music that start of
Doordarshan in Bombay (g S R N S .... P D S R G ...) where caps is shuddha
svaras, the P D N are obviously of the mandra saptak. He was also the one
who composed the famous composition in Nayaki Kanada played often on Bombay
Radio.
As an aside - If any of you have this sovenieur mentioned above, please send
me an email. I would like to have a copy of the first page - I will gladly
pay for the postage/copying/faxing charges. Unfortunately I was too young at
that time to realize its value.
Regards,
Kedar
Arnab wrote in message <3ABBB0E5...@hampshire.edu>...
>the left of Shri Krishna was Pannalal Ghosh and on his right was D'Amel. I
>have not been fortunate enough to have heard D'Amel's bansuri - live or
>recorded - however this graphic said a lot to me.
There are two old recordings of D. Amel I have heard long ago, in
Raga Hindol Bahar and Tilak Kamod.
Warm regards,
r
it is truly a unique experience listening to them!
aarti n.
"stefan petersilge" <s.pete...@cityweb.de> wrote in message
news:3abb792b...@news.t-online.de...
: for great bansuri pieces in 'light' Indian music, too. Hariprasad Chaurasiya
: is a sycophant of Gandhi dynasty and you can look forward to hearing
: a new raag, composed in honour of Priyanka Gandhi's baby. He has
: also played some of the most incredible bansuri pieces while lending
: a hand to light music. When someone else tells him what to play (and
: also probably how to play it), he really can produce sublime music.
: You will get to hear about 15 second's bansuri in a 3-minute song.
: But it should be well worth it. I understand HPC has played bansuri
: for quite a few songs by Hridaynath Mangeshkar. Check out his
: Marathi songs, penned by poet Dnyaneshwar in 13th century and
: sung by Lata. Also check out Kishori Amonkar's two Marathi songs,
: composed by HM. These songs were recorded in 1960s.
You're perhaps forgetting also that Hariprashad Chaurasia is the "Hari" in
the "Shiv-Hari" duo that has composed for some films e.g "Silsila".
(The "Shiv" being of course Shiv Kumar Sharma).
Let me add two more Hridaynath songs to the ones I have already
mentioned, which feature trascendent flute pieces : 'o ji hari kiit
gaye', a non-filmi solo by Lata from her Meera Bhajans LP. This is
as perfect a song as you will ever hear. And Swatantryaveer
Savarkar's epic Marathi poem : 'ne majasi ne, parat maatrubhumila -
saagaraa praan talamalalaa'. I don't know how many of these
Hridaynath stunners specifically mention HPC as the flautist. But
the grapevine says that he it is who has played most of Hridaynath's
great bansuri pieces.
- nani
Among the 78 rpm discs recorded by D.Amel
are the following:
11. Hindol Bahar
12. Misra Pilu
(HMV N 15903: OML 4684/4685)
13 Darbari Kanada
14. Tilang Thumri
(HMV N 5994: OML 4682/4683)
These are the only two in my collection, but there
are others. His music is really lovely, with very
coherent and attractive gestural contours.
WS
Yes, Pt. Malharrao Kulkarni is definitely among the older guard of flute
players. Despite his aversion to fame, D'Amel's name had reached me, but
unfortunately, I have never heard his music.
It is nice to see Kedar receiving khas taleem in the Naniwadekar Gharana of
Humour (... and now, Kedar... just kidding!!).
Warm regards,
A
Wasn't D Amel composer and conductor of Indian Orchestra on AIR Bombay?
Regards,
Harish Chinai
And by what measure do you decide who is insignificant?
CS
Arnab, I'm afraid it's time for the administration of some
khas taleem in etiquette.
When very great artists make arrogant and prideful statements,
they do not gain in stature thereby -- but their achievements
preclude their diminishment in the eyes and ears of the listening
public. When lesser artists show such attitudes, however, they reduce
themselves accordingly. When a very junior artist makes such
comments about a performer more than twice his age, the
impression given is not of a keen analytic and musical intelligence
in operation, but rather of an adolescent (and very unseemly)
petulance.
The overweening presumption of your comments could only be carried
off by a senior musician, one perhaps three or almost four
times your age. It is to be hoped that by the time you have
acquired sufficient musical experience and aesthetic acumen
to lend gravitas to your hubris, you will have gained the wisdom
to eschew it entirely.
WS
I have not heard Steve Gorn's music, so I am no position to
agree or disagree with Arnab's statement. I do believe, however,
that age and professional standing (of the artist or the listener)
should play no roles in the evaluation of critical opinions.
Veena
Nor should it play a role in respect. If Sri Gour Goswami saw the talent of
Steve Gorn worthy of deeming him a disciple, then who is Arnab to question
that? So he not only disrespects Steve openly, but also the critical decision
of Pandit Goswami, Hariprasad Chaurasia, Professor Deba Prasad Banerjee, and
Pt. Raghunath Seth. Even more so it discredits the words and observations of
Arnab himself for stating comments to begin with. Not a great start of a man
who must "get the gand" with the reputation of Pandit Das Gupta.
CS
Framedrums wrote:
First of all, you are contradicting the very nature of your rebuttal by stating
that "it (age and professional standing) should play no role in respect either".
Now for some more important things....
Why would I question GG's decision to accept SG as a disciple? GG, who was
primarily a teacher, had every reason to take in another student. As for the
outcome, the public has every right to comment. The public can make observations
as to whether or not a perticular disciple of a certain Guru does justice to
his/her taleem. People, as listeners, also have a right to make qualitative
judgements about the taleem itself.
Your observation is fundamentally wrong, so I choose not to contest it. As for
the "critical decision of 'SGG', 'HPC', 'PDPB' and 'PRS'", one has every right
even to challenge opinions of musicians of such stature if they have no solid
critical basis.
Some comments on your attempt to lure me into a flame war by commenting on my
relationship with my Guru.
1. Our relationship (that of my Guru and myself) belongs in the private/personal
domain, and you have no right to talk about any aspect of it in public,
particularly since you do not know either of us.
2. If you have any personal opinions on our music (Guruji's, mine or in stylistic
terms), please feel free to do so.
3. Finally, your use of the World War II phrase to describe my career was
undesirable, distateful and unwarranted. Coming from someone who knows neither me
or my Guru, the use of such slur definitely reveals the hand of a third party
with some vested interest.
A personal dig at Framedrums (he has asked for it) ----> You would probably have
come barking to my defense on a similar issue (had there been one), if I had paid
you money to design my website (a proposition, as evinced by my 'saved messages'
file, that you had made not very long ago).
As of now, I consider this matter closed, and will not respond to any more posts
or emails from Shri Framedrums.
Warm regards,
A
Of course. But Arnab's statement was not presented as
a critical opinion, but as an apodictically framed pronunciamento,
an aesthetic evaluation disguised as a list of "living bansuri
players."
Opinions fly thick and fast around here, but I for one believe
that truth in packaging is an important element in maintaining
the quality of discourse.
One of the things that has been most harmful to HCM in the
development of a broader listener base has been the perception
of its practitioners as a bunch of squabbling egotists who can't
say anything good about one another (as witness all the feuds in
rmic's history). Arnab's use of the term "contenders" is a
relatively lightweight manifestation of this absurd and
unnecessary (albeit chronic and universal) competition --
between people who should be cooperating to help the music
survive and grow.
(Disclaimer: Steve Gorn is an old and valued friend)
WS
No, that was someone elses point, not mine. I believe you should pay respect to
people who are older than you. You may have particular talent at your music,
but your arrogance diminishes the validity of your words. They have spent many
more hours on this earth cultivating their lives and whether you deem their
works worthy of your standards or not, you should at least pay some respect.
You aren't just passively dismissing something, you made a very specific
statement that Steve's role was "insignificant" in the ranks of bansuriya.
>Your observation is fundamentally wrong, so I choose not to contest it.
Weak.
>Some comments on your attempt to lure me into a flame war by commenting on my
>relationship with my Guru.
>1. Our relationship (that of my Guru and myself) belongs in the
>private/personal
>domain, and you have no right to talk about any aspect of it in public,
>particularly since you do not know either of us.
I do not know you directly, nor have I met your guruji, but I have been
watching the posting that you participate in this board, and you frequently
represent yourself as a complete opportunist, thus my phrase in general towards
your actions.
>2. If you have any personal opinions on our music (Guruji's, mine or in
stylistic terms), please feel free to do so.
I have only two recordings of your Guruji and they are very worthy of my
respect. I publically state to anyone reading that my original post and future
posts will never and were never intended towards him. You however are insolent.
>3. Finally, your use of the World War II phrase to describe my career was
undesirable, distateful and unwarranted. Coming from someone who knows neither
me or my Guru, the use of such slur definitely reveals the hand of a third
party with some vested interest.
There is no third party interest in this. You have made statements against the
talents of a person who is close to me, yes. I speak solely for myself. Your
ad hominem attacks outside of this discussion don't refute my statements about
your observations of what should be deemed worthy. If I am challenging some
aspect of your critical analysis on a particular musician, then discuss that.
>A personal dig at Framedrums (he has asked for it) ----> You would probably
have come barking to my defense on a similar issue (had there been one), if I
had paid you money to design my website (a proposition, as evinced by my 'saved
messages'
>file, that you had made not very long ago).
That is a non-sequitor attack at an offer I made to you. I too have the mail
saved if you care to discuss this further. This particular statement also has
legal ramifications if you wish to proceed further. It borders on libel. My
statements about your actions are based solely on your behaviour in this
newsgroup, not on outside activities. I have not questioned your ability to
play music, nor of your particular understanding of it. I have challenged your
contempt for another person who is not present to answer your comments.
This statement you made is something I typically get from my child.
CS
"Kedar Naphade" <knap...@sprintmail.com> wrote
> Even though not many know about him, D'Amel's compositions are ingrained
in
> the minds of everyone in Bombay today - to the best of my knowledge (and
> this is second hand info - so please feel free to correct me if you know
> better) he was the one who composed the two lines of music that start of
> Doordarshan in Bombay (g S R N S .... P D S R G ...) where caps is
shuddha
> svaras, the P D N are obviously of the mandra saptak. He was also the one
> who composed the famous composition in Nayaki Kanada played often on
Bombay
> Radio.
I was thinking that the Nayaki Kanada composition, the one played as
signature tune for Vanita Ma.nDaLa was composed by Gajananrao Joshi. May be
I assumed that, because it was played on Violin.
Similarly I had heard that the starting music of AIR, before the chimes, was
composed and played by Pannalal Ghosh.
cheers,
imppio
In that case, his statements should have been denounced on the
bases that you use above. It would have served as a far more
effective rebuttal than bringing his age and seniority into
question.
>
>One of the things that has been most harmful to HCM in the
>development of a broader listener base has been the perception
>of its practitioners as a bunch of squabbling egotists who can't
>say anything good about one another (as witness all the feuds in
>rmic's history).
The two factors are unrelated. The HCM listener base has broadened
at a healthy pace over the years. Moreover, every artistic field
has its share of squabbling egotists; there is no evidence that
that has deterred interested followers. HCM is no different in
this regard. And as for rmic, it has handsomely fulfilled its
role as a forum for exchanging information and ideas, the bitter
feuds notwithstanding.
Veena
Veena, you're correct. I allowed my own pride in the crafting
of a retort to cloud my judgement.
>>One of the things that has been most harmful to HCM in the
>>development of a broader listener base has been the perception
>>of its practitioners as a bunch of squabbling egotists who can't
>>say anything good about one another (as witness all the feuds in
>>rmic's history).
>The two factors are unrelated. The HCM listener base has broadened
>at a healthy pace over the years. Moreover, every artistic field
>has its share of squabbling egotists; there is no evidence that
>that has deterred interested followers. HCM is no different in
>this regard.
I would just point out that a lack of evidence is not evidence
FOR anything. To be sure, those who are really drawn by the
music will be drawn by it regardless of the squabbles of its
adherents -- but I think that many other potential listeners
may well give up, deterred by the difficulty of finding clear
information about the idiom which has not been, shall we say,
"inflected" with various (always unstated) agenda? When a
musicologist compiles a putative reference work and leaves
out the name of a rival musician, this does the music as a whole
a disservice (an example mentioned to me recently).
>And as for rmic, it has handsomely fulfilled its
>role as a forum for exchanging information and ideas, the bitter
>feuds notwithstanding.
No argument there.
WS
>WS
What is the function of the statement in parentheses?
Ashok
Let me tell you a real life story. I am making no attempt at humour
here. I am telling the story much as it happened. A friend of mine,
during my association with him stretching over a couple of years,
forever talked about attending a concert some day with me.
He chose to miss 20 % of the concerts because they started too
late. 20% concerts because they started at 8 PM. And remaining
60% because they started too early (about 6:30 PM, the standard
concert kick-off time in Delhi).
NOBODY can have ever given up (i.e; refused to take up) because
Times of India and Indian Express failed to publish a joint ranking
list of musicians, by way of clear information. If anything, 'other
potential listeners' (those drawn by non-musical aspects) are an
extremely robust lot. Try distributing 'clear information' about the
artiste before a Banditji concert.
I think the only deterrent about ICM is the sound made by it, which
is perceived as 'absurd' by most children. And it is mostly during teens
that people 'take or do not take' to music. I can speak from personal
experience that Mansur, Kumar, Gangubai, Kishori are the real
deterrents. As you say, those who are really drawn by the music,
do ultimately find their way. Way to Shiv-Hari, at least. From there,
light music by Vasantrao-Bhimsen acts as a bridge to Mansur-Kishori.
(Of course, Vasantrao-BJ belong right up there with MM-KA.)
A big majority follows this path to ICM. Through past rmic posts, most
of us are already agreed that a recondite art form like ICM will never be
able to compete with Zee TV serials in popularity stakes. I don't know
why you are bringing this 'clear information' thingie into the argument.
> When a musicologist compiles a putative reference work and leaves
> out the name of a rival musician, this does the music as a whole
> a disservice (an example mentioned to me recently).
>
Music has always taken such disservices in its stride. Besides, you
can't legislate against them. These things happen. Always have,
always will.
- nani
--
Posted from femail1.sdc1.sfba.home.com [24.0.95.81]
via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG
It is a parenthetical clause.
WS
Okay, I concede all these various points. My perspective in this
regard is that of an educator-cum-missionary. I've spent a lot
of time trying to educate people about HCM in ways that give them
critical and aesthetic tools which they can employ in the service
of their own personal musical understanding. When I give lecture-
demonstrations or other presentations of that ilk, I very often
encounter people whose initial enjoyment of the music has in
some way been soured by some of the distortions to which I
allude. It bothers and saddens me, and I try in my own writing
to present, not an unbiased view, but a perspective in which my
authorial bias is recognized and put in the context of other
opinion. Objectivity is not possible in the evaluation of art, and
artistic criticism which doesn't embrace or in some way
contextualize its subjectivity seems to me to flirt with
intellectual dishonesty.
WS
BTW, I (try) to perform on bansuri myself and am strongly influenced
by Indian music and the system of ragas. But I would never dare to
sincerely compare my music with classical Indian music. Anyway, if
anybody is interested to hear what I am doing (or even would like
to give some comment or advice), my music can be heard at:
www.mp3.com/sangitom .
Examples with bansuri are "Little Princess" or "Sound Of Wisdom".
I also wrote a small section about bansuri in my homepage at
www.sangitom.de . I'm still interested to link to other sites or
bansuri-artists on the web, any such information would
be highly appreciated.
I'm following the discussions in this group with much interest,
although many times I have to give up trying to understand your
"insider" wisdom.
What about G.S. Sachdev?
Esmail Jiwaji
Arnab wrote:
> bdixit wrote:
>
> > There are quite a few BANSURI players who give excellent performances of
> > North Indian classical music. (1) The foremost among the young players, who
> > has received international acclaim, is Pandit Ronu Majumdar. Then there is
> > Nityanand Haldipur who is also excellent. Others I am familiar with are Rupak
> > Kulkarni and Rakesh Chaurasia. Among the very senior ones, Pandit Vijay
> > Raghav Rao is outstanding. I have heard all of them. I have presented in
> > concert tours Hariprasad Chaurasia (140 concerts), Rupak and Rakesh Chaurasia
> > (14 concerts), and Ronu Majumdar (25 concerts). .....Balwant Dixit
> >
> > Framedrums wrote:
> >
> > > I enjoy the music of Hariji as well. I think you'd like the music of Steve
> > > Gorn. He has a website with some audio clips too.
> > >
> > > http://www.stevegorn.com
> > >
> > > CS
> >
> > --
> > Balwant N. Dixit
> > University of Pittsburgh
> > 541-2 Salk Hall
> > Pittsburgh, PA 15261
> > Tel No:(412) 648-8582
> > FAX No:(412) 648-8475