Discography of Nasiruddin Dagar Branch
naniwadekar
Is Nasiruddin Dagar branch's discography available on the
net or in rmic archives? I did a bit of googling and found
some information but it may not be complete.
Does anybody have a more comprehensive list? I have not included
releases done by Zahiruddin Dagar with his nephew Faiyaz Wasifuddin.
Wasifuddin also has some fine solo releases to his credit.
- dn
The Senior Dagars (Nasiruddin's eldest two sons, Moinuddin
and Aminuddin) :
http://www.raga.com/discographies/discodagarbros.html
Darbari Kanada, Adana: EMI India MOAE 135 LP
Asavari, Bhairavi, Dhamar, Raja Chhatrapati Singh on
pakhawaj: Unesco India III Barenreiter BM 30 L 2018 LP
Kamboji (29:35), Raja Chhatrapati Singh pakhawaj: Unesco
Collection Auvidis D8076 CD
Bhimpalashri khyal (6:24), Multani alap (3:49): Alain Daniélou's
Anthology of Indian Music, Auvidis D8270 CD
Aminuddin solo:
Mian-ki-Malhar, Bhairav, Bhairavi, Vithaldas Gujrati pakhawaj:
EMI India EASD 1420 LP
Bhatiyar alap & dhrupad*, Desh alap & dhamar, Vithaldas Gujrati
pakhawaj EMI India cassette
*the dhrupad is 'Shiva Shiva Shiva,' the same as that published
by PAN records (Shiva Mahadeva) of the Younger Dagar brothers
Moinuddin solo:
Puriya, Piloo thumri: Maharana Mewar (of Udaipur) Foundation private LP
I am also aware of their 3 CD releases from Mewar's Royal Collection.
One CD has Miyan Malhar. One has Megh + Kafi Thmuri or Hori.
And one has Bageshri in dhrupad + khayal form.
Junior Dagars (Nasiruddin Khan Dagar's youngest two sons :
Zahiruddin and Faiyazuddin).
Source of information : www.medieval.org
http://www.medieval.org/music/world/dhrupad.html
Shiva Mahadeva: Dagar Brothers
Nasir Zahiruddin Dagar & Nasir Faiyazuddin Dagar
Ragas Malkauns, Darbari Kanada, Adana, Bhatiyar
Pan Records 4001/02 (2 CDs)
Dagar Brothers
Ustad Nasir Zahiruddin Dagar & Ustad Nasir Faiyazuddin Dagar
Raga Miyan ki Todi
Jecklin Disco 628
The Dagar Brothers
Ustad Nasir Zahiruddin Dagar & Ustad Nasir Faiyazuddin Dagar
Raga Kambhoji
Music of the World CDT-114
Dagar Brothers
Ustad Nasir Zahiruddin Dagar & Ustad Nasir Faiyazuddin Dagar
w/ Mohan Shyam Sharma (pakhawaj)
Raga Miyan ki Todi
Jecklin Disco 628
Contents:
Raga Miyan ki Todi
Alap (61'54)
Dhrupad "Kauna bharama bhule ho" (13'51)
Playing time: 75'45"
Recording date: 1988
Tanpuras by: Nilofar & Wasif Dagar
The "younger Dagar brothers" Nasir Zahiruddin Dagar (1933-1993)
& Nasir Faiyazuddin Dagar (1934-1990) still have the most
impressive recorded discography.
-------------
buh...@ecn.ab.ca
: Does anybody have a more comprehensive list? I have not included
: releases done by Zahiruddin Dagar with his nephew Faiyaz Wasifuddin.
: Wasifuddin also has some fine solo releases to his credit.
i don't know of a comprehensive list offhand, but i have a couple of CDs
of the younger Dagars that weren't in your list:
Dhrupad: Vocal Art of Hindustan
Dagar Brothers
JVC World Sounds VICG-5032
Raga: Multani - Alap, Dhrupad and Dhamar
Pakhawaj by Mohan Shyam Sharma
recorded in 1988
Chant Dhrupad
Nasir Zahiruddin et Nasir Faiayzuddin Dagar
Auvidis Ethnic B 6159
Raga: Bageshri - Alap and Dhrupad (identified on the case as "Dhrut"!)
Raga: Bhatiyar - Alap and Dhrupad (again identified as "Dhrut")
Pakhawaj by Laxminarayan Pawar
copyright 1989
hth
ajb
--
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Andrew Buhr Savour the Irony!
buh...@freenet.edmonton.ab.ca http://freenet.edmonton.ab.ca/~buhrger
Who are you? What do you want?
Bosma
Amiuddin Dagar made an LP here in 1971 while he was touring with Zia
Fariuddin and Raja Chatrapati Singh. It has Bhimpalasi and Yaman. I
only have a copy of it, no details as to label and number. It's not
mentionned in Kinnear's discography.
The younger Dagar brothers made a double LP in Germany: Darbari
(Sajana Bina, dhamar, Adana (Shiva Shiva Shiva Shankara, sultal, Bihag
(sundara hogayi, chautal, Kedar (Bajre Man Vishvanatha, chautal).
Gopal Das is on pakhawaj. It was recorded in 1980, LOFT 1006/7. Quite
the normal programme that.
A live concert by them in the Moses en Aaronkerk in Amsterdam was
issued locally (1985). It has rag Chandrakauns.
A very beautiful recording by Allabande Rahimuddin Khan was published
recently in Italy (Musicaliu III millennium CDT 0171/2). It has
Asavari (sultal: ana sunai bansuri kanha , chautal:ayo jit hi),
Darbari (chautal: mridang or vina sangha). Gopal Das is on pakhawaj.
The second cd has Rahim Fahimuddin Dagar, Adana (sadra in
jhaptal:darat lanka belanka), Bhairavi (teora jagat janani jvala
mukhi), Malkauns, (chautal:jayati jayati shri ganesh). Dalchand Sharma
is on the pakhawaj, recorded 31-05-02.
Happy new year to everybody.
Hans Bosma
naniwadekar
"Bosma" <leg...@club-internet.fr> wrote -
>
> The younger Dagar brothers made a double LP in Germany: Darbari
> (Sajana Bina, dhamar, Adana (Shiva Shiva Shiva Shankara, sultal, Bihag
> (sundara hogayi, chautal, Kedar (Bajre Man Vishvanatha, chautal).
> Gopal Das is on pakhawaj. It was recorded in 1980, LOFT 1006/7.
> Quite the normal programme that.
>
I have this set on cassette and did suspect that it was from
LP release. Of course, you have listed the LPs in wrong order
and the sequence in which the raags were sung must surely
have been Bihag, Kedar, Darbari, Adana. LPs released in
the '60s typically had length of around 17-18 minutes. But
by 1980, LPs running to 24-25 minutes were being issued;
this double LP release has each side longer than 22 minutes.
Last 50-100 seconds on each LP are missing from my cassette
as a result.
- dn
Bosma
> LP release. Of course, you have listed the LPs in wrong order
> and the sequence in which the raags were sung must surely
> have been Bihag, Kedar, Darbari, Adana. LPs released in
> the '60s typically had length of around 17-18 minutes. But
> by 1980, LPs running to 24-25 minutes were being issued;
> this double LP release has each side longer than 22 minutes.
> Last 50-100 seconds on each LP are missing from my cassette
> as a result.
The order I gave is the one of the original double LP (the concert
order was probably the one you indicated.) Here are the durations:
1. Darbari alap 25.30
2. alap (cont.)and dhamar: 10.10
Adana 12.32
3. Bihag alap 26.24
4. Bihag chautal 13.48
Kedar alap, chautal 11.12
As you can imagine this involved some cutting here and there.
Hans Bosma
naniwadekar
"Bosma" <leg...@club-internet.fr> wrote -
>
> The order I gave is the one of the original double LP (the concert
> order was probably the one you indicated.) Here are the durations:
> 1. Darbari alap 25.30
> 2. alap (cont.)and dhamar: 10.10
> Adana 12.32
> 3. Bihag alap 26.24
> 4. Bihag chautal 13.48
> Kedar alap, chautal 11.12
>
> As you can imagine this involved some cutting here and there.
>
> Hans Bosma
>
Bosma - For Bihag and Kedar, I have the same duration as
mentioned by you. But for the other LP (assuming my source
is LP only) I see 25:30 + 10.10 Darbari Alap only. Then follows
a Dhamar in Darbari (sajan bil khelat) for about 9 minutes.
It is followed by the Adana composition 'shiv shiv shiv';
I have only first 2 min 20 sec of it.
Darbari + Adana may have been recorded first and Bihag + Kedar
some other (later) date; still, it would have been nice if the LPs
were numbered/ordered with Bihag and Kedar on first LP.
By the way, labelling Dhrupad composition as 'drut' is a predictable
reflex; it serves its purpose, in a way. But I would prefer an Indian
shortish word as an expressive substitute for it. Dividing a recital
into alap + dhrupad is not the most satisfactory device to my mind
since 'alap' also falls under the scope of the word 'dhrupad'.
I think the word cheez can be used for dhrupad compositions.
If not, I would like to know why the word doesn't fit.
- dn
Bosma
written on the cover which, after listening is not quite truthful:
the end of the alap (side b) is 10.10 minutes followed by the dhamar
(8.38) which is immediately followed by the Adana sultal (4.31 if my
watch is accurate)
May I conclude by stating that the elder Dagar Bros LP of the same
ragas is so much more beautiful.
Hans Bosma
Nayakan
find, the one that has Bairagi and something
else on it. (sorry about the sketchy details,
but I don't have this one.)
Kumar
leg...@club-internet.fr (Bosma) wrote in message news:<7d9e845d.03123...@posting.google.com>...
Nayakan
These sound very interesting. I'd like to get these...
and I will gladly pay for the expenses and the trouble.
Thanks in advance,
Kumar
p.s.
Bosma, I tried to email you, but the message bounced
back saying there was no space in your Inbox...
leg...@club-internet.fr (Bosma) wrote in message news:<7d9e845d.03123...@posting.google.com>...
Bossk (R)
> A very beautiful recording by Allabande Rahimuddin
> Khan was published recently in Italy (Musicaliu III
> millennium CDT 0171/2).
Does anyone know where this can be ordered? I haven't had
much luck with the label's web site.
Todd Michel McComb
Bossk \(R\) <bossk-...@telia.com> wrote:
>Does anyone know where this can be ordered? I haven't had much
>luck with the label's web site.
I have been in contact with someone from this label:
Claudio Pelati <III.mi...@jumpy.it>
Todd McComb
mcc...@medieval.org
Havanur
the next obvious step of www.d*b*m*t*.com has not been taken. The
contact details I have seen are a)
dagarbrothers...@hotmail.com and b) 379, Asiad Village, New
Delhi 110049, Tel/Fax: 26492886.
The trust has released a Marwa by Zahiruddin and Faiyazuddin Dagars.
This was performed in Paris in 1983 but the CD was mastered in 2003. I
picked it up at Wasifuddin Dagar's concert, don't know where else it
is available.
Havanur
Orlando Fiol
>By the way, labelling Dhrupad composition as 'drut' is a predictable
>reflex; it serves its purpose, in a way. But I would prefer an Indian
>shortish word as an expressive substitute for it. Dividing a recital
>into alap + dhrupad is not the most satisfactory device to my mind
>since 'alap' also falls under the scope of the word 'dhrupad'.
>I think the word cheez can be used for dhrupad compositions.
>If not, I would like to know why the word doesn't fit.
A dhrupad is usually a composition in Chautaal, although it can also be
in Jhampa or Tivra taal. This distinguishes dhrupad from dhamaar, which
would obviously be in Dhamaar taal. Also, the subject matter of
dhamaars tends to be related either to the holi festival or amorous
matters.
Orlando
naniwadekar
"Orlando Fiol" <of...@earthlink.net> wrote -
>
> >since 'alap' also falls under the scope of the word 'dhrupad'.
>
> in Jhampa or Tivra taal. This distinguishes dhrupad from dhamaar, which
> would obviously be in Dhamaar taal. Also, the subject matter of
> dhamaars tends to be related either to the holi festival or amorous
> matters.
>
I was under the same impression until recently but I am not
sure I agree with you. Taal Dhamaar is not Deepchandi's
equivalent in Dhrupad. The taal is chosen for the main raag
of dhrupad recitals quite often, unlike Deepchandi. The
composition 'sajan bin khelat' in Darbari is just a case in point.
Sooltaal is also widely used for Dhrupad compositions, much
more frequently than Tevra. You might perhaps call every
composition set to Dhamar 'a Dhamar' but there is no way
you can distinguish a grave composition like 'sajan bin khelat'
from what we call Dhrupad just because it is set to Dhamar.
However, it might be true that lighter material in Dhrupad
does not use Chautaal and Sooltaal and is almost exclusively
set to taal Dhamar. I would like to hear from forum members
whether taals other than Dhamar are used for lighter items.
- dn
Surajit A. Bose
In article <btdmi0$61csp$1...@ID-75735.news.uni-berlin.de>,
"naniwadekar" <nani3...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> "Orlando Fiol" <of...@earthlink.net> wrote -
> > A dhrupad is usually a composition in Chautaal, although it can also be
> > in Jhampa or Tivra taal. This distinguishes dhrupad from dhamaar, which
> > would obviously be in Dhamaar taal. Also, the subject matter of
> > dhamaars tends to be related either to the holi festival or amorous
> > matters.
> >
>
> I was under the same impression until recently but I am not
> sure I agree with you. Taal Dhamaar is not Deepchandi's
> equivalent in Dhrupad. The taal is chosen for the main raag
> of dhrupad recitals quite often, unlike Deepchandi. The
> composition 'sajan bin khelat' in Darbari is just a case in point.
> Sooltaal is also widely used for Dhrupad compositions, much
> more frequently than Tevra. You might perhaps call every
> composition set to Dhamar 'a Dhamar' but there is no way
> you can distinguish a grave composition like 'sajan bin khelat'
> from what we call Dhrupad just because it is set to Dhamar.
Orlando is right. Dhamaars are set to dhamaar taal, they are about the
holi festival, and they are sR^ingaara rasa pradhaan as opposed to viira
rasa pradhaan, textually as well as musically.
That dhamars are considered romantic rather than austere or majestic
does not preclude them from being "grave compositions". Nor does it
disqualify them from being presented as the main raag in a dhrupad
recital. Nor does it make them "diipchandii's equivalent in dhrupad".
-s
naniwadekar
"Surajit A. Bose" <psur...@netscape.net> wrote -
>
> Orlando is right. Dhamaars are set to dhamaar taal ...
>
Surajit, I don't want to spend too much of time addressing
foolish remarks by you. That one-year sabbatical from music
forums seems to have done you no good and you are as
ready as ever to support poorly presented facts by posters
the moment Naniwadekar disputes them. I don't have
much time right now for archives search but I will get to
it this weekend if necessary. If I recall correctly, Orlando
Fiol is the fellow who had made some smug remarks against
Hindus/Indians 18-20 months ago on rmic and I had the
pleasure of showing him his place. I don't know whether
Orlando's knowledge about Dhrupad is poor (like Surajit's)
or he is just terrible at presenting his argument, though, of
course, he can count on people like Surajit to support him.
Orlando Fiol had written :
>
> A dhrupad is usually a composition in Chautaal, although it
> can also be in Jhampa or Tivra taal. This distinguishes dhrupad
> from dhamaar ...
>
I have heard very little Dhrupad and yet I can tell that
Orlando is wrong. The fact is : 'A dhamar is (always?)
a composition set to Dhamar taal, and that distinguishes
it from dhrupad (composition).'
- dn
Pinaki Sengupta
Another couple of Younger Dagar Brothers recordings:
1. Raga Ahir Bhairav (Alap & Dhamar), Pakhawaj: Gopal Das
IIRC, it is in an LP in one of the Unesco series. I don't have the
original LP - made a copy from the Univ. of Illinois Music library.
2. Raga Miyan ki Malhar (Alap & Dhrupad) - Times music under the
Golden Raga Collection series (Vol. III) - Does not mention the
Pakhawaj player.
Pinaki.
Surajit A. Bose
"naniwadekar" <nani3...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> I have heard very little Dhrupad and yet I can tell that
> Orlando is wrong. The fact is : 'A dhamar is (always?)
> a composition set to Dhamar taal, and that distinguishes
> it from dhrupad (composition).'
He is right. You are wrong. The rest of your post is musically
irrelevant.
As for my remarks being ill-supported, in the course of my study and
practise of dhrupad/dhamaar gaayaki, I've asked Uday Bhawalkar about the
nature of dhamaar. Pat yourself on the back as much as you like, spew as
much rotten venom as you want, Nani; it doesn't make you or your
comments any less ignorant or foolish.
-s
Nayakan
This was reissued as part of Danielou's UNESCO recording
released by rounder records, called
"Anthology of World Music" -North Indian Classical
Music" - a 4 CD set with a 30 min
or so (IIRC) Ahir Bhairav ... a lovely rendition that is
unforgettable. The 4 CD box set is worth getting simply for
the pleasure of listening to this piece. It is available at
amazon and other places (shop around):
Warren Senders has written a very good review of this CD set:
http://www.rootsworld.com/rw/feature/india4.html
It is well worth reading.
Kumar
naniwadekar
> > Orlando is wrong. The fact is : 'A dhamar is (always?)
> > a composition set to Dhamar taal, and that distinguishes
> > it from dhrupad (composition).'
>
> He is right. You are wrong. The rest of your post is musically
> irrelevant.
>
> As for my remarks being ill-supported, in the course of my study and
> practise of dhrupad/dhamaar gaayaki, I've asked Uday Bhawalkar
> about the nature of dhamaar.
>
Oh yes; 15-16 months ago, Surajit learnt from Bhawalkar
for 10 minutes and then spent 10 hours announcing to the
world how he couldn't claim objectivity while talking
about Bhawalkar's art. Good to know that the tuition has
progressed further.
If Uday Bhawalkar supports Orlando's statement, he, too, would
have to be called a fool. Surajit and he seem to be a good match
for each other. This is not the first time a statement made by
Uday Bhawalkar has been quoted on rmic only for it to be
shown to be idiotic. But it would perhaps be fairer to give
Bhawalkar a tiny benefit of doubt in this case when an ass like
Surajit is quoting him.
If Dhamar taal is suitable for the 'main' raag and thus detailed
exposition, where is the need to distinguish between compositions
in it and and those in other taals that are Dhrupad's equivalent of
'chhota khayal / drut' ? Yes, it is possible that other taals are
not suitable for lighter dhrupad compositions which are the
equivalent of 'thumri', so to speak, and they are distinguished
from 'heavier' dhrupad compositions because they are lighter.
It is an easy guess that the lighter compositions came to be
known after their taal since it was all-pervasive in their case.
This much is unexceptionable.
From here, though, this 'dhamaar' thingy became a convenient
tool for Dhrupad teachers to impress stupid students like Surajit
Bose about its different-ness. These stupid students, in their
turn, seek to impress others with their teacher's 'pearls'.
If it be the case that 'bigger, heavier' dhamar compositions
are invariably about holi or shringar, it will only take someone
who does non-holi, non-shringaric compositions in dhamar
to break the stereotype just as it took just one Jaipur singer
to start doing sargam. The taal has been shown capable of
handling 'graver material', unlike Deepchandi. Some exceptions
might exist in Diipchandii but they would only be exceptions.
In Dhamar's case, though, Senior Dagars have chosen it for
Darbari on their LP and then moved to Chautaal for the
lighter Adana. And this is just one case. I was surprised to
find how often Dhamar is used for bigger raags even
in my very limited exposure to dhrupad.
At any rate, Dhrupad performing shringar rasa is a bit like
Mike Tyson in his bedroom. Sure enough, he must be fondling
his women tenderly when he says that is what he is doing.
But if the shringaric text could testify in a court, it would tell
us about its bones being rattled. It isn't that I don't enjoy
lighter compositions in Dhrupad but I ignore any claims
that the singer is being romantic and enjoy the recital on
other terms.
- dn
allan evans
which are astonishing. These ought to be better known.
ALlan EVans
www.arbiterrecords.com
Surajit A. Bose
"naniwadekar" <nani3...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Oh yes; 15-16 months ago, Surajit learnt from Bhawalkar
> for 10 minutes
Perhaps. It's still ten minutes more musical training than you've ever
had in your entire life, innit?
Uday Bhawalkar doesn't need defending from a cockroach like you. Do you
really think that because you've run a dhrupad CD or two through your
boombox, you can speak more authoritatively about the genre than he, who
has dedicated his life to the genre? You pathetic fool.
For that matter, I don't need defending from the likes of you either.
Everything you've written just betrays your profound ignorance of
dhrupad. For example: you decide that dhamaar can't be shR^i.ngaarik,
because it is not "lighter" music. Just because something is romantic in
rasa, it does not become "lighter" music.
You also keep attacking the idea that dhamaar in dhrupad music is the
equivalent of diipchandii (or thumri; you don't bother to make the
distinction) vis-a-vis khayal music. On this thread, noboby except you
has propounded that idea to begin with.
I reiterate: Orlando was right; you are wrong; and all your lunatic
rantings make not an iota of difference.
-s