How do they get Paid ??
H.2O
I was just wonderring if anyone here new how do Rappers usually get paid by
there labels ,I was hearing some people here say that some rappers actually
Owed their label money after an album !!! , And I am hearing things like
artists getting about One Dollar for each Album sold ..etc , If that is the
case I don't think rappers are as rich as I might have thought them to be ,
and how the Hell is Puffy sooo rich ?? (I know he is a producer/CEO ..etc)
Anyways other than that I just wanna say that I am reall happy for Nas ,
that he sold well and represented hip-hop on the charts , and movin those
stinkin TLC of the #1 spot ,and oh yeah some peeps here said that there
where loads of heads who said they liked the Nas album at first then changed
their minds afterwards well I just wanna say that I think the Nas album is
Dope and I still like it although I have been bumpin it ever since release
date ,and still like it
Yo amokachi No Offence but I got the feeling that you are one of those "
heads " that got influenced by what people are saying about Nas " I Am.."
:¬p , Oh yeah where in the UK U at ? I'm from the UK too hit me back
(Funkmaster Flex wasn't on last sat. :¬( , he should be on next week Fri.
and Sat. )
Peace
H.2O
"Tell me what the F*** you own / when your skin , flesh and bone / find
their permanent home " - RZA
KSG
> Yo wassup Y'All
>
> I was just wonderring if anyone here new how do Rappers usually get paid by
> there labels ,I was hearing some people here say that some rappers actually
> Owed their label money after an album !!! , And I am hearing things like
> artists getting about One Dollar for each Album sold ..etc , If that is the
> case I don't think rappers are as rich as I might have thought them to be ,
> and how the Hell is Puffy sooo rich ?? (I know he is a producer/CEO ..etc)
They usually get a number of points with each point translating to a number of
cents per album. Usually they get about a dollar per album sold. The other
thing is that artists usually have to cover costs for making the album,
promoting the album, management, etc... On the TLC Ultrasound they broke down
how they got .56/album. They had to pay taxes and these other fees, plus 3
million in videos and promotions. This left them with about 300k each at the
end... and that album sold 10 million copies. That's why you can sell
significantly less as an indie artist and still be doin' aight.
> Anyways other than that I just wanna say that I am reall happy for Nas ,
> that he sold well and represented hip-hop on the charts , and movin those
> stinkin TLC of the #1 spot
I really must be the only who thinks that TLC is good and this is actually their
best album (although their first album was also very good... the middle one was
aight).
--
One Luv,
KSG
Droppin' Science in REAL AUDIO on KSDT Mondays midnight-2am (PST)
ARCHIVED SHOWS: http://www.cs.ucsd.edu/~kgatlin/science.html
Personal: http://www.cs.ucsd.edu/~kgatlin
Noble G Allah
- Noble "G" Allah
T. Tauri
>
> Yo wassup Y'All
>
> I was just wonderring if anyone here new how do Rappers usually get
> paid by there labels ,I was hearing some people here say that some
> rappers actually Owed their label money after an album !!! , And I am
> hearing things like artists getting about One Dollar for each Album
> sold ..etc , If that is the case I don't think rappers are as rich as
> I might have thought them to be , and how the Hell is Puffy sooo
That's a complex question to answer--you might check your local library
for some books on the biz, Donald Passman's *All You Need to Know About
the Music Business*, for example.
A few things of note: among the things usually paid for out of the
artist's share, which is typically something like 15% of
retail--recording costs, producer's fees and royalties, half the video
costs; also royalties are often computed with deductions for packaging
(the theory being that artists ought only be paid for the actual music
bearing object and not the sleeves; very possibly the deduction will be
at a substantial markup from actual cost), and free goods (copies are
often sold with a certain number free for a particular amount paid for
as a bonus. This is often a scam: in fact companies that do this charge
more per record to make up the difference, BUT the free copies are then
exempt from royalties, which are only paid on records *sold*).
In addition, there's a lot of withholding of payment in order to wait
for possible returns to come in. Hopefully Soundscan is helpful in
pushing down the amounts held by the record company for this reason.
Also keep in mind that the advance paid out by the record companies is
really a loan to be paid back out strictly out of your portion of the
pie--it's not applied to the the record company's percentage.
As far as Puffy's royalties as a producer/CEO--well, for one thing,
producers usually have much sweeter deals than artists--they get
royalties without much having to pay for all the things the artist has
to pay for, and if they're big enough, without having to wait for other
costs in the artists share (like recording costs) to be covered. And in
addition Puffy, as CEO, draws a paycheck out of the money taken in on
the company side as well, I imagine.
Peece,
T. Tauri
OverTiME the Beyonder
<hesha...@ncl.ac.uk> wrote:
> Yo wassup Y'All
>
> I was just wonderring if anyone here new how do Rappers usually get paid by
> there labels ,I was hearing some people here say that some rappers actually
> Owed their label money after an album !!! , And I am hearing things like
> artists getting about One Dollar for each Album sold ..etc , If that is the
> case I don't think rappers are as rich as I might have thought them to be ,
> and how the Hell is Puffy sooo rich ?? (I know he is a producer/CEO ..etc)
A record industry insider emailed this to me a while back when I asked him
the same question. You might find it enlightening.
Stay UP!!
OT
* * *
This is an article from Maximum Rock n' Roll #133 written by Steve
Albini, and it details the problems encountered when dealing with a major
label.
"The problem with music"
by Steve Albini
Whenever I talk to a band who are about to sign with a major label, I
always end up thinking of them in a particular context. I imagine a
trench, about four feet wide and five feet deep, maybe sixty yards long,
filled with runny, decaying shit. I imagine these people, some of them
good friends, some of them barely acquaintances, at one end of this
trench. I also imagine a faceless industry lackey at the other end
holding a fountain pen and a contract waiting to be signed.
Nobody can see what's printed on the contract. It's too far away, and
besides, the shit stench is making everybody's eyes water. The lackey
shouts to everybody that the first one to swim the trench gets to sign
the contract. Everybody dives in the trench and they struggle furiously
to get to the other end. Two people arrive simultaneously and begin
wrestling furiously, clawing each other and dunking each other under the
shit. Eventually, one of them capitulates, and there's only one
contestant left. He reaches for the pen, but the Lackey says "Actually,
I think you need a little more development. Swim again, please.
Backstroke. And he does of course.
1. A & R Scouts
Every major label involved in the hunt for new bands now has on staff a
high-profile point man, an "A & R" rep who can present a comfortable face
to any prospective band. The initials stand for "Artist and Repertoire."
because historically, the A & R staff would select artists to record
music that they had also selected, out of an available pool of each.
This is still the case, though not openly.
These guys are universally young [about the same age as the bands being
wooed], and nowadays they always have some obvious underground rock
credibility flag they can wave. Lyle Preslar, former guitarist for Minor
Threat, is one of them. Terry Tolkin, former NY independent booking
agent and assistant manager at Touch and Go is one of them. Al Smith,
former soundman at CBGB is one of them. Mike Gitter, former editor of
XXX fanzine and contributor to Rip, Kerrang and other lowbrow rags is one
of them. Many of the annoying turds who used to staff college radio
stations are in their ranks as well.
There are several reasons A & R scouts are always young. The
explanation usually copped-to is that the scout will be "hip to the
current musical "scene." A more important reason is that the bands will
intuitively trust someone they think is a peer, and who speaks fondly of
the same formative rock and roll experiences.
The A & R person is the first person to make contact with the band, and
as such is the first person to promise them the moon. Who better to
promise them the moon than an idealistic young turk who expects to be
calling the shots in a few years, and who has had no previous experience
with a big record company. Hell, he's as naive as the band he's duping.
When he tells them no one will interfere in their creative process, he
probably even believes it.
When he sits down with the band for the first time, over a plate of
angel hair pasta, he can tell them with all sincerity that when they sign
with company X, they're really signing with him and he's on their side.
Remember that great gig I saw you at in '85? Didn't we have a blast.
By now all rock bands are wise enough to be suspicious of music industry
scum. There is a pervasive caricature in popular culture of a portly,
middle aged ex-hipster talking a mile-a-minute, using outdated jargon and
calling everybody "baby." After meeting "their" A & R guy, the band will
say to themselves and everyone else, "He's not like a record company guy
at all! He's like one of us." And they will be right. That's one of the
reasons he was hired.
These A & R guys are not allowed to write contracts. What they do is
present the band with a letter of intent, or "deal memo," which loosely
states some terms, and affirms that the band will sign with the label
once a contract has been agreed on.
The spookiest thing about this harmless sounding little memo, is that it
is, for all legal purposes, a binding document. That is, once the band
signs it, they are under obligation to conclude a deal with the label.
If the label presents them with a contract that the band don't want to
sign, all the label has to do is wait. There are a hundred other bands
willing to sign the exact same contract, so the label is in a position of
strength.
These letters never have any terms of expiration, so the band remain
bound by the deal memo until a contract is signed, no matter how long
that takes. The band cannot sign to another laborer even put out its own
material unless they are released from their agreement, which never
happens. Make no mistake about it: once a band has signed a letter of
intent, they will either eventually sign a contract that suits the label
or they will be destroyed.
One of my favorite bands was held hostage for the better part of two
years by a slick young "He's not like a label guy at all," A & R rep, on
the basis of such a deal memo. He had failed to come through on any of
his promises [something he did with similar effect to another well-known
band], and so the band wanted out. Another label expressed interest, but
when the A & R man was asked to release the band, he said he would need
money or points, or possibly both, before he would consider it.
The new label was afraid the price would be too dear, and they said no
thanks. On the cusp of making their signature album, an excellent band,
humiliated, broke up from the stress and the many months of inactivity.
2. There's This Band
There's this band. They're pretty ordinary, but they're also pretty
good, so they've attracted some attention. They're signed to a
moderate-sized "independent" label owned by a distribution company, and
they have another two albums owed to the label.
They're a little ambitious. They'd like to get signed by a major label
so they can have some security you know, get some good equipment, tour in
a proper tour bus -- nothing fancy, just a little reward for all the hard
work.
To that end, they got a manager. He knows some of the label guys, and
he can shop their next project to all the right people. He takes his
cut, sure, but it's only 15%, and if he can get them signed then it's
money well spent. Anyways, it doesn't cost them anything if it doesn't
work. 15% of nothing isn't much!
One day an A & R scout calls them, says he's 'been following them for a
while now, and when their manager mentioned them to him, it just
"clicked." Would they like to meet with him about the possibility of
working out a deal with his label? Wow. Big Break time.
They meet the guy, and y'know what -- he's not what they expected from a
label guy. He's young and dresses pretty much like the band does. He
knows all their favorite bands. He's like one of them. He tells them he
wants to go to bat for them, to try to get them everything they want. He
says anything is possible with the right attitude. They conclude the
evening by taking home a copy of a deal memo they wrote out and signed on
the spot.
The A & R guy was full of great ideas, even talked about using a name
producer. Butch Vig is out of the question-he wants 100 g's and three
points, but they can get Don Fleming for $30,000 plus three points. Even
that's a little steep, so maybe they'll go with that guy who used to be
in David Letterman's band. He only wants three points. Or they can have
just anybody record it (like Warton Tiers, maybe-- cost you 5 or 7 grand]
and have Andy Wallace remix it for 4 grand a track plus 2 points. It
was a lot to think about.
Well, they like this guy and they trust him. Besides, they already
signed the deal memo. He must have been serious about wanting them to
sign. They break the news to their current label, and the label manager
says he wants them to succeed, so they have his blessing. He will need
to be compensated, of course, for the remaining albums left on their
contract, but he'll work it out with the label himself. Sub Pop made
millions from selling off Nirvana, and Twin Tone hasn't done bad either:
50 grand for the Babes and 60 grand for the Poster Children-- without
having to sell a single additional record. It'll be something modest.
The new label doesn't mind, so long as it's recoupable out of royalties.
Well, they get the final contract, and it's not quite what they
expected. They figure it's better to be safe than sorry and they turn it
over to a lawyer--one who says he's experienced in entertainment law and
he hammers out a few bugs. They're still not sure about it, but the
lawyer says he's seen a lot of contracts, and theirs is pretty good.
They'll be great royalty: 13% [less a 1O% packaging deduction]. Wasn't
it Buffalo Tom that were only getting 12% less 10? Whatever.
The old label only wants 50 grand, an no points. Hell, Sub Pop got 3
points when they let Nirvana go. They're signed for four years, with
options on each year, for a total of over a million dollars! That's a
lot of money in any man's English. The first year's advance alone is
$250,000. Just think about it, a quarter million, just for being in a
rock band!
Their manager thinks it's a great deal, especially the large advance.
Besides, he knows a publishing company that will take the band on if they
get signed, and even give them an advance of 20 grand, so they'll be
making that money too. The manager says publishing is pretty mysterious,
and nobody really knows where all the money comes from, but the lawyer
can look that contract over too. Hell, it's free money.
Their booking agent is excited about the band signing to a major. He
says they can maybe average $1,000 or $2,000 a night from now on. That's
enough to justify a five week tour, and with tour support, they can use a
proper crew, buy some good equipment and even get a tour bus! Buses are
pretty expensive, but if you figure in the price of a hotel room for
everybody In the band and crew, they're actually about the same cost.
Some bands like Therapy? and Sloan and Stereolab) use buses on their
tours even when they're getting paid only a couple hundred bucks a
night, and this tour should earn at least a grand or two every night.
It'll be worth it. The band will be more comfortable and will play
better.
The agent says a band on a major label can get a merchandising company
to pay them an advance on T-shirt sales! ridiculous! There s a gold
mine here! The lawyer Should look over the merchandising contract, just
to be safe.
They get drunk at the signing party. Polaroids are taken and everybody
looks thrilled. The label picked them up in a limo.
They decided to go with the producer who used to be in Letterman's
band. He had these technicians come in and tune the drums for them and
tweak their amps and guitars. He had a guy bring in a slew of expensive
old "vintage" microphones. Boy, were they "warm." He even had a guy come
in and check the phase of all the equipment in the control room! Boy,
was he professional. He used a bunch of equipment on them and by the
end of it, they all agreed that it sounded very "punchy," yet "warm."
All that hard work paid off. With the help of a video, the album went
like hotcakes! They sold a quarter million copies!
Here is the math that will explain just how fucked they are:
These figures are representative of amounts that appear in record
contracts daily. There's no need to skew the figures to make the
scenario look bad, since real-life examples more than abound. income is
underlined, expenses are not.
Advance: $ 250,000
^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^
Manager's cut: $ 37,500
Legal fees: $ 10,000
Recording Budget: $ 150,000
Producer s advance: $ 50,000
Studio fee: $ 52,500
Drum. Amp, Mic and Phase "Doctors": $ 3,000
Recording tape: $ 8,000
Equipment rental: $ 5,000
Cartage and Transportation: $ 5,000
Lodgings while in studio: $ 10,000
Catering: $ 3,000
Mastering: $ 10,000
Tape copies, reference CDs, shipping
tapes, misc. expenses: $ 2,000
Video budget: $ 30,000
Cameras: $ 8,000
Crew: $ 5,000
Processing and transfers: $ 3,000
Off-line: $ 2,000
On-line editing: $ 3,000
Catering: $ 1,000
Stage and construction: $ 3,000
Copies, couriers, transportation: $ 2,000
Director's fee: $ 3,000
Album Artwork: $ 5,000
Promotional photo shoot and
duplication: $ 2,000
Band fund: $ 15,000
New fancy professional drum kit: $ 5,000
New fancy professional guitars [2]: $ 3,000
New fancy professional guitar amp
rigs [2]: $ 4,000
New fancy potato-shaped bass guitar: $ 1,000
New fancy rack of lights bass amp: $ 1,000
Rehearsal space rental: $ 500
Big blowout party for their friends: $ 500
Tour expense [5 weeks]: $ 50,875
Bus: $ 25,000
Crew [3]: $ 7,500
Food and per diems: $ 7,875
Fuel: $ 3,000
Consumable supplies: $ 3,500
Wardrobe: $ 1,000
Promotion: $ 3,000
Tour gross income: $ 50,000
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^
Agent's cut: $ 7,500
Manager's cut: $ 7,500
Merchandising advance: $ 20,000
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^
Manager's cut: $ 3,000
Lawyer's fee: $ 1,000
Publishing advance: $ 20,000
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^
Manager's cut: $ 3,000
Lawyer's fee: $ 1,000
Record sales: 250,000 @ $12 = $3,000,000
Gross retail revenue Royalty
[13% of 90% of retail]: $ 351,000
Less advance: $ 250,000
Producer's points
[3% less $50,000 advance]: $ 40,000
Promotional budget: $ 25,000
Recoupable buyout from previous label: $ 50,000
Net royalty: $ -14,000
^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^
Record company income:
Record wholesale price
$6.50 x 250,000 = $1,625,000 gross income
Artist Royalties: $ 351,000
Deficit from royalties: $ 14,000
Manufacturing, packaging and
distribution @ $2.20 per record: $ 550,000
Gross profit: $ 7l0,000
The Balance Sheet: This is how much each player
got paid at the end of the game.
Record company: $ 710,000
Producer: $ 90,000
Manager: $ 51,000
Studio: $ 52,500
Previous label: $ 50,000
Agent: $ 7,500
Lawyer: $ 12,000
Band member net income each: $ 4,031.25
The band is now 1/4 of the way through its contract, has made the music
industry more than 3 million dollars richer, but is in the hole $14,000
on royalties. The band members have each earned about 1/3 as much as
they would working at a 7-11, but they got to ride in a tour bus for a
month.
The next album will be about the same, except that the record company
will insist they spend more time and money on it. Since the previous one
never "recouped," the band will have no leverage, and will oblige.
The next tour will be about the same, except the merchandising advance
will have already been paid, and the band, strangely enough, won't have
earned any royalties from their T-shirts yet. Maybe the T-shirt guys
have figured out how to count money like record company guys.
Some of your friends are probably already this fucked.
SORDSWINGA
most rappers get around a 15 pt deal which is about 1.00 per album, so you go
platinum you get a million dollars
>how the Hell is Puffy sooo rich ?? (I know he is a producer/CEO ..etc)
>
yeah ceo and producer would probably make at least half the cost of each album
sold, so about 7 dollars per album, plus he does alot of production for other
artists. and he has his own clothing line etc.
StayTuned
JThomp2102
When rappers sign a contract and get an advance it is nothing
but a fancy word for credit. Then the artist has to use usually use the studio
to record. Most major labels charge around $5,000 an hour. Most rappers will
want to be in the studio 6 to 7 hours a day and for about a month. Now times
that and you see why so many artists are not as JIGGY as they claim.
Then you got the video which will cost $200,000 on average to make. Most video
directors like Hype Williams charge $100,000 retainer to just secure you a
place on his time table.Sorry, but you don't get that money back!
Then when the artist goes on the road and wants a limosine, fancy food,
designer clothes and whatever else that is all put on the company bill and
passed on to the artist. So an artist can get a $500,000 advance and be severly
put in the hole off of all the things that I have mentioned.
I don't mean to preach, but the music industry is all about making money. They
usually keep 90% of what the artist makes. Then you got the manager, the agent,
the attorneys, and all the rest of the management team who get paid out of what
the artist makes.
Finally, in the case of Puffy he not only owns his label, he also has been
smart enough to diversify his wealth. He has started outside businesses and the
like. Plus, BadBoy has been bringing in about $100 million anually the past
five years. Just to let you know, Puffy recently got a loan of $50 million from
his partner Arista Records so he is technically in debt.
J Smoove
John Book
>Yo wassup Y'All
>
>I was just wonderring if anyone here new how do Rappers usually get paid
by
>there labels ,I was hearing some people here say that some rappers
actually
>Owed their label money after an album !!! , And I am hearing things
like
>artists getting about One Dollar for each Album sold ..etc , If that is
the
>case I don't think rappers are as rich as I might have thought them to
be ,
etc)
I am sure you are going to get a lot of letters on this one, but here is
my response.
Most artists of any kind, unless they release their own music, are signed
under something similar to a consignment deal. When a record label gives
you X-Amount (as well as DOP) of money, the label hopes that with your
music, you will be able to make that amount back. When a label spends
250,000 dollars on a video, the label hopes that with the help of a video,
your music will sell 25,000 copies or more (usually more, they always
want more).
Basically, they say that an artist usually isn't sitting comfortably
until album number three. In other words, they really do not see any
kind of money of their own until they release their third album. With
pop groups like N'Sync, who know that their fans will buy anything with
their name on it, they'll release one album, and hey, why not a Christmas
album? Wow, we'd like to rent a film and video crew to follow us on tour.
Why don't we sell it for the fans? N'Sync ends up on top of the Music
Video charts.
But we're talking hip hop here. This pretty much means Digable Planets
broke up as broke as they were when they first started. Another good
example is TLC. Everyone thought the success of "CrazySexyCool" would
take them over the top, they were successful, they were known in the
mainstream, but they were bankrupt. Bad investments? Bad management? A
mix of everything and then some. "FANMAIL" is doing quite well, and with
a change in the people who are representing them, they should be able to
see a much clearer future.
I am sure there is someone who can better explain the rise of Puff Daddy
but... wasn't he paid commission when he signed someone for Uptown
Records? Uptown had everyone from Mary J. Blige to Heavy D. to Jodeci,
and Mr. Combs had his share. Look at Biggie's first album on Bad Boy.
Not only did he produce a number of tracks, he also took "songwriting"
credit. Publishing is very lucrative if you know what you're doing, and
with more sales of the album and the singles, more royalties you get. I
may not like his music but his business sense is on point. Maybe he has
a phone sex line like Master P or porn sites like Ice-T. Then again, I
doubt it.
p.e.a.c.e.
-John Book
SORDSWINGA
your quite good at it.
> for every album you sell, you get 36
>cents (yes, I'm serious, 36 cents).
thats wrong
>Now, let's say you sell... oh let's
>say 1 million copies.
>you get $36,000,000.
36 million dollars? if you got 36 cents per album that would be 36 thousand,
and I never heard of anyone signing a deal like that.
>which
>should leave you with no more than $300,000.
how's that? we either went from 36 million to 300 thousand, thats less than 1%
of the original cut. or we went from 36000 to 300000 now thats great
investing that like 850% Ive heard of doubling money in 5 years but thats
incredible.
StayTuned
Neiladri
>I am sure there is someone who can better explain the rise of Puff Daddy
Well, Puffy started Bad Boy (legend has it) with money from Arista Records
after he was fired from Uptown in 1993 with Arista, as distributor, splitting
the profits 50/50 with Bad Boy. That also explains why Puffy, despite the fact
that Bad Boy has been selling music by the boatload, is worth less than Master
P (who's split with Priority is both newer and less costly).
>Maybe he has
>a phone sex line like Master P or porn sites like Ice-T. Then again, I
>doubt it.
Actually, Puffy does own a budding restaurant chain called Justin's. The first
one's been open in NYC for a while, and i think he just opened one in Atlanta
late last year.
He's also recently launched a clothing line of his own called Sean John.
Sorry, no phone sex operation that I know of...
peace,
Neil
Steve 'Flash' Juon
The whole "trench full of shit" thing is dope. In all cases
though I think there are two perfect HIP-HOP examples of the
scandalousness of the industry:
#1: Kool Keith's intro and skits for "The Shit is Wack" off of
the Cenobites album. Fondle the left testicle for airplay and
the right for distribution..
#2: The entire song "Show Business" by A Tribe Called Quest f/
Diamond D and Sadat X. The pain of the game encapsulated for
all time onto wax.
Industry Rule #4,080 y'all.
--
"... like no sleep; I keep a library of lyrics on microfiche" --> Can-I-Bus
"This memoir of madness is actually the psychosis of being dope" --> L'Roneous
Steve 'Flash' Juon --> contact dj.f...@pobox.com for e-mail
Hip-Hop Lyrics Archive --> http://www.OHHLA.com/index.htm
Suite 101's Hip-Hop --> http://suite101.com/welcome.cfm/116
(coming soon!) --> http://www.Tame-One.com
Whateverman69
the reason I ask is I read that Royce got about a million dollars. Anybody
think he can sell that many records?
_______________________________________________________________________________
It's hard to live, knowin' that you doin the same
-Breeze-
Utter Stupidity
www.thethirdrail.com/crack/
KSG
Whateverman69 wrote:
> Is there a type of deal where they just give you money( I doubt it!),
> the reason I ask is I read that Royce got about a million dollars. Anybody
> think he can sell that many records?
It was probably an advance. And if he don't sell that many records and he spends
the money (which often happens when you first get your hands on that type of
money), he'll be in debt.
JThomp2102
>Royce got about a million dollars. Anybody
>think he can sell that many records?
>
>
First of all, Royce got an advance on CREDIT. In this life nothing is free!
J Smoove
Mr Bass
was) . After it was broke down a new artist is lucky to make less than a
good mechanic ($12 an hour). Thats before taxes and if you go gold. Now
platinum is basically double gold so if you go platinum you can expect
about $48,000 a year before taxes.
Of course you better not go on dinners wth the labels and other industry
types cause it is expected to pick up the tab. At the places they like
the go that can be close to $1,000 dollars for about 5 or 6 people. You
can expect to have to do this a couple of times a year to "network" with
insiders so you are loking at an extr $3,000 a year just to keep your
names on the labels lips on top of tours, PR, Studio time etc.. So even
platinum you looking at less than $30,000 a year after taxes and dinners
actually its probably closer to $25,000 after its all said and done.
So f you are in hip hop for the money you are in the wrong biz. You can
go to school and install car stereos for a living in a good shop and
make as much or more every year. Thats why it seems every artist has a
label or atleast a basement studio in thier house. Not to mention the
restraunts, bars, and clothing lines they all have these days.
Shy Killa
"Custar had his last stand and they ask me to feel sorow for this man,
but they never told me he was riding in like the Klan" ~me
Michael Johnston
only pull in that kind of money in profits. 1 million albums sold is
14-15 million in gross sales. If you think artists get fucked that
hard, why would they put out an album, they'd all be working
construction instead. I dont know the figures, but they probably
couldnt afford the body guard by their side, if they made 36k a year.
What, do they get a credit card issued after their album drops? Indepent
labels are the way to go, but you gotta have 10-15 grand to start, plus
the music you put out better sell.
backyard2000
Lisa Baker
They get a certain amount of money for each album that is sold. If they
get like $0.50 per album and they sell 4.5 million copies(which is the
average amount of albums sold) you end up with about $225,000,000. Then
when they take out for the cost of video's, distribution, wardrobe,
transportation, etc., you left with about 1 million, dependin on how
much all that costs. Then, you gotta pay your lawyers and accountants
and stuff like that, and you know how high they are.And then they take
out about 40-50% for taxes so then you end up with roughly half a milion
dollars.
Then, like ya'll said before, if you get like a whole lot up front as
a signing bonus the label is gonna take out of your sales til they get
they money back. So depending on if your album sells you may not get
anything.
Kang Su Gatlin
Isn't $30k about what Ice Cube got for Straight Outta Compton? I heard the
DOC got something like a watch and a pony ride for his first album.
I think both went platinum (the DOC may have only went gold).
--
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Steve 'Flash' Juon
> Isn't $30k about what Ice Cube got for Straight Outta Compton?
I thought it was $30K and a brand new car, but either way, it's butkus.
If that seems bad though, consider that each of the members of TLC only
took away $50K after taxes each after selling TEN MILLION COPIES of their
_CrazySexyCool_ album. If that doesn't tell you how fucking shady the
music industry is, nothing will.
Peace, Flash
miss bee
D. broke it down (and he had everyone on the floor, laughing!!!) along the
same lines as you did.
I think the whole $5,000 for time at the Hit Factory or other studios like
that is so funny!!! A lot of rappers play right into the racket. The labels
make you use these expensive-ass facilities when you could spend the $$$ on
buying the equipment for yourself.
And the video thing... that shit is BANANAS!!! Strictly from the p.o.v. of
someone who's worked on hip hop videos, people get caught up in SO much hype
and bullshit. It's funny to see people who really don't know shit about
film, don't really watch movies, and don't have a particularly interesting
creative vision get put on, move on up and put out highly visible, highly
wack shit.
The issues (that artists deal with) y'all have been breaking down here are
the exact thing that have made a lot of artists "become" producers. Also,
these type of money dealings (which are definitely not in favor ofthe
artists) is what make people (with not necessarily a whole lot of talent
going for them) who FIEND to be "in the industry" become lawyers, managers
and producers (in the looser sense of the word).
In article <19990418211748...@ng64.aol.com>,
-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own
miss bee
to it. Back then (5 yrs ago) I didn't know a whole hell of a lot about the
business aspect of music, but even then I knew it was important to retain
that for yourself. He was like, "Naaaaaah... Puff has them but it was
something I had to work out with him, so he has them." or something like
that. And I was like, "Hmmmm." To me, it sounded like it was one of those
"pay the devil to get the chance to dance" things. So, yes, even Biggie had
to go out like that the first time around.
And how come none of ypu people are talkng about Tupac and his broke ass,
running around doing pick-up tracks for anyone who had an extra 5g's cash
lining their pocket???
> Look at Biggie's first album on Bad Boy.
> Not only did he produce a number of tracks, he also took "songwriting"
> credit. Publishing is very lucrative if you know what you're doing, and
> with more sales of the album and the singles, more royalties you get. I
> may not like his music but his business sense is on point. Maybe he has
> a phone sex line like Master P or porn sites like Ice-T. Then again, I
> doubt it.
>
> p.e.a.c.e.
> -John Boo
reelg...@my-dejanews.com
sords...@aol.complex (SORDSWINGA) wrote:
> >For that (let's do the math)
>
> your quite good at it.
>
> > for every album you sell, you get 36
> >cents (yes, I'm serious, 36 cents).
> thats wrong
>
> >Now, let's say you sell... oh let's
> >say 1 million copies.
> >you get $36,000,000.
>
> 36 million dollars? if you got 36 cents per album that would be 36 thousand,
> and I never heard of anyone signing a deal like that.
A little mathematics: 36 cents would be equal to .36 because it is less than
a dollar which is = 1.00. Got that? ok .36 multiplied by 1million which will
be a one with six zeros like this 1000000. works out to 360,000. That seems
like a pretty good amount of money but what about the rest of it. with one
million copies as our figure and the price of a cd being like 12 bucks,
That's 12 million so 12000000 minus 360000 is $11,640,000 left over. So
where is all that money going? And you know the people getting the most of
that money aren't doing a damn thing.
> >which
> >should leave you with no more than $300,000.
>
> how's that? we either went from 36 million to 300 thousand, thats less than 1%
> of the original cut. or we went from 36000 to 300000 now thats great
> investing that like 850% Ive heard of doubling money in 5 years but thats
> incredible.
>
> StayTuned
>
--
"When I hear the word culture, I reach for my revolver"
Michael Noschese
> In article <371BD559...@cs.ucsd.edu>, kga...@cs.ucsd.edu says...
> > Isn't $30k about what Ice Cube got for Straight Outta Compton?
>
> I thought it was $30K and a brand new car, but either way, it's butkus.
> If that seems bad though, consider that each of the members of TLC only
> took away $50K after taxes each after selling TEN MILLION COPIES of their
> _CrazySexyCool_ album. If that doesn't tell you how fucking shady the
> music industry is, nothing will.
Yo, record companies definitely fuck over artists big time. However the TLC case
is somewhat special. TLC signed an absolutely horrible contract that any
intelligent manager or lawyer would have urged them not to sign. They received
7% of revenues on all sales below 500,000 and it only increased to 8% above a
million. This is well below the 12% figure being bandied about in this thread.
Secondly some of those numbers aren't accurate. TLC declared bankruptcy right
around that time. Declaring bankruptcy is the best option an hot new artist has
to rework his or her contract. For the purposes of bankruptcy it is best to
report a low income, which is what TLC did. With the figure of $50,000 as
income, the debts incurred by the group would be considered impossible to oblige
and provide an unreasonable obstacle to them getting a new start. It also
obliges the label to renegotiate the deal. Most of the debts were disputed, most
vehemently was Left Eye's $1.3 million obligation to Lloyd's of London for
insurance payment on Andre Rison's home after she burned it down. And someone
else mentioned TLC paying 50% in taxes which is somewhat absurd, any halfway
decent accountant would be able to reduce your paper income before you paid that
much in taxes. My God, in 1976 Ford Motor Co. got a tax refund on $798 million
in gross income.
Labels fuck over artists all the time, but a lot of artists buy into the game
and screw themselves. Rule #1 don't live beyond your means. Screw this whole I
gotta look wealthy, be wealthy first. Rule #2, get a good accountant and
lawyer. So what if you pay a lot, if you are a decent selling artist they will
save you a lot more than you pay them. I don't feel bad for artists who make a
bad situation worse.
Frank
says...
> Yo wassup Y'All
>
> I was just wonderring if anyone here new how do Rappers usually get paid by
> there labels ,I was hearing some people here say that some rappers actually
> Owed their label money after an album !!! , And I am hearing things like
> artists getting about One Dollar for each Album sold ..etc , If that is the
> case I don't think rappers are as rich as I might have thought them to be ,
> and how the Hell is Puffy sooo rich ?? (I know he is a producer/CEO ..etc)
You're right about the one dollar per album. That's the case with most
artists -- not just rappers. Many artists become rich, not only from
record sales, but from concerts and endorsements. Most rappers, however,
don't perform very often, and instead try to begin their own record
labels. After all, that's where the real money can be made.
Many artists have had very successful albums that did not earn them much
money in the end. TLC is a perfect example. Their last album won
numerous awards and was always at the top of the charts, but they were
always in debt. I head that they cut a bad deal and were getting pennies
for each album, but I'm not sure. Anyone know the details?
--
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Spring Break Review Contest
http://www.mainquad.com/springbreak/submit.shtm
STRATEGY3
>From: Figg...@aol.com (Frank)
>Date: 4/20/99 3:16 PM Pacific
> hesha...@ncl.ac.uk
>says...
>> Yo wassup Y'All
>>
>> I was just wonderring if anyone here new how do Rappers usually get paid by
>> there labels ,I was hearing some people here say that some rappers actually
>> Owed their label money after an album !!! , And I am hearing things like
>> artists getting about One Dollar for each Album sold ..etc , If that is the
>> case I don't think rappers are as rich as I might have thought them to be ,
>> and how the Hell is Puffy sooo rich ?? (I know he is a producer/CEO ..etc)
>
>
>You're right about the one dollar per album. That's the case with most
>artists -- not just rappers.
Actually, it's a lot less than that. Probably closer to 10 cents.
Probably the worst rip-off job in history was Slick Rick getting paid $400.00
for "The Show / Ladi Dadi. At the time, it was the best-selling single in
hip-hop history.......
STRATEGY
Whateverman69
Ultrasound that they had to pay Dallas Austin 4.2 million dollarsto
produce thier record? Even though one of them has a baby by him. Either
TLC are the dimmest bulbs in the box or they are running a scam.
> Yo, record companies definitely fuck over artists big time. However the TLC case
> is somewhat special. TLC signed an absolutely horrible contract that any
> intelligent manager or lawyer would have urged them not to sign. They received
> 7% of revenues on all sales below 500,000 and it only increased to 8% above a
> million. This is well below the 12% figure being bandied about in this thread.
> Secondly some of those numbers aren't accurate. TLC declared bankruptcy right
> around that time. Declaring bankruptcy is the best option an hot new artist has
> to rework his or her contract. For the purposes of bankruptcy it is best to
> report a low income, which is what TLC did. With the figure of $50,000 as
> income, the debts incurred by the group would be considered impossible to oblige
> and provide an unreasonable obstacle to them getting a new start. It also
> obliges the label to renegotiate the deal. Most of the debts were disputed, most
> vehemently was Left Eye's $1.3 million obligation to Lloyd's of London for
> insurance payment on Andre Rison's home after she burned it down. And someone
> else mentioned TLC paying 50% in taxes which is somewhat absurd, any halfway
> decent accountant would be able to reduce your paper income before you paid that
> much in taxes. My God, in 1976 Ford Motor Co. got a tax refund on $798 million
> in gross income.
> Labels fuck over artists all the time, but a lot of artists buy into the game
> and screw themselves. Rule #1 don't live beyond your means. Screw this whole I
> gotta look wealthy, be wealthy first. Rule #2, get a good accountant and
> lawyer. So what if you pay a lot, if you are a decent selling artist they will
> save you a lot more than you pay them. I don't feel bad for artists who make a
> bad situation worse.
>
>
>
_______________________________________________________________________________
Black Snow
A      Q U I C K T I M E      H I S T O R Y 
then it was break dancing, then there was
the DJ, and then the MC. Each thing had
its time and its prominence, its moment
in the sun." - Grandmaster Caz
Michael Noschese
Well, I don't know where a particular individual got this pont assumption from, but that (I thought) dosen't exist. And you can't explain how emcees get paid because there's so many labels out there that have diffrent ways of paying folks, you have to take that into consideration. So unless you want to explain how every music label out there pays and sum up the average amount of everyones earnings, you don't have an answer here. This is a question that only an official emcee with a deal can explain. And for the one who started this thread (If you reading this), these assumptions can't be trusted.
JayGee
Michael Noschese wrote in message <3722431D...@bu.edu>...