*classic albums of 1987*
mr.tim
this shit will happen in 3 stages....
1.nominations (according to year of release)...when nominating an album,
you should do more than simply name the album...take the time to go through
the album (track by track) and refresh everyone's memory (you don't have to
be a great writer...check my lame example)...only the people who make a
nomination or add further comments on a previous nomination will be
eligible to vote on the final list for that year
2. discussion/debate....once the nominations start coming in, they'll
obviously start being measured against each other...this part of the
process could/should go on for a while
3. voting....when the arguments begin to die down it'll be time to vote on
the final list....the voting system hasn't been decided yet (there's time)
------------------------------------------------------------
to kick things off, i nominate public enemy's "Yo! Bumrush the show" as one
of the best albums of 1987
this was the time i was just getting into hiphop...run dmc, ll cool j, salt
'n' pepa... i was still finding it difficult to understand lyrics (new
slang, new accents etc)...chuck d was the first rapper to make me REALLY
WANT to understand what he was saying...before then i was just in love with
the sound...the attitude.....and who knows, if it wasn't for chuck maybe i
wouldn't be a hiphop head today..."Yo! Bumrush the show" isn't my favourite
PE release, but it's probably in my top ten (def top 20) albums of all-time
the album gets off to a great start with the opening bars of "You're Gonna
Get Yours"...classic song that's lost little of it's appeal for me in 15
years
"Understand, I don't drive drunk / My 98's fly, I don't drive no junk /
No cop gotta a right to call me a punk / Take this ticket, go to hell and
stick it"
i never used to like "Sophisticated Bitch" back in the day but it wasn't
quite fast forward material...over the years those guitars have grown on me
"Little is known about her past / So listen to me cause I know her ass"
"Miuzi Weighs A Ton" is the classic nod head/mean face song...seriously, i
think it's physically impossible for me not to nod my head to these
drums...and the little breakdown in the middle is beautiful...it's like my
neck changes gears a couple times, moving into a slightly different headnod
"Cause my rhyme reputation depends on what / Style of record my DJ cuts /
His slice, dice, super mix so nice / So bad, you won't dispute the price /
It's plain to see, it's a strain to be / Number one in the public eye enemy
/ I'm wanted in 50, almost 51 / States where the posse got me on the run"
another hype opening ("hey chuck! we got some non-believers out there!) and
one of chuck's nicest ever flows makes "Timebomb" possibly my favourite
song on the album...extra points for hearing chuck say "i'll be the burger,
you be the bun, girl"
"I'm a MC protector, U.S. defector / South African government wrecker /
Panther power, you can feel it in my arm / Lookout y'all cause I'm a
timebomb / Tickin', tockin', all about rockin' / makin' much dollars while
the crazy one's clockin'"
"Too Much Posse" is one of the few PE songs that has aged poorly for
me....flav is probably the greatest hype man ever, but there are only a few
songs where he comes off nice on his own...this isn't one of em
"I watched all the guys be so damn cruel / Try to get fast, you must be a
fool"
"Rightstarter" also hasn't aged as well as the rest of the album....chuck
brings the lyrics but my old ears find this track a little too noisy these
days (that scratch beat doesn't move me like it used to)....i still love
the song but it's no longer one of the best on the album....
"Our solution, mind revolution / Mind over matter, mouth in motion /
Corners don't sell it, no you can't buy it / Can't defy it cause I'll never
be quiet / Let's start this right"
"Public Enemy Number One" another classic flav intro, "what goes on?", the
gunshot...dope
"For all you suckers, liars, your cheap amplifiers / Your crossed up wires
are always starting fires / For you grown up criers, now here's a pair of
pliers / Get a job like your mother, I heard she fixes old dryers / You
have no desires, your father fixes tires / You try to sell ya equipment,
but you get no buyers / It's you they never hire, you're never on flyers /
Cause you and your crew, is only known as good triers / Known as the
poetical lyrical son / I'm Public Enemy number one"
"MPE" is a decent song but depending on my mood it sometimes grates my
nerves a bit....i have been known to skip this track when listening to the
CD
"When I get to the beach, the ground's so sandy / Girls on my jock like
ants on candy"
the title track "Yo! Bumrush the Show!" was one of my favourites at the
time despite the fact i had no idea what bumrush meant....flav's stomping
of mudholes in asses was enough to compensate for that....and although it
seems kinda corny now (YO!), the chorus was a lot of fun when i was 14
"For the suckers at the door, if you're up and around / For the suckers at
the door, we're gonna knock you back down"
"Raise the Roof" is kind of average....nothing wrong with it but it's never
really done a lot for me...
"End of the world, are you guessin' yes? / Just say don't delay it, get it
off your chest / Houses of crack, I've seen too much / I go ready, aim,
fire, then I'll blow 'em up"
"Megablast" was a song that often spent hours running around in my
head...sometimes to the point of annoying me...oh please, oh please, oh
please just gimme just one more hit....repeat 2323 times.....hey what is
all the backward speech saying at the end there?
"Ya throw two punches, now you got no wind / Hittin' mega pipes, gettin'
super stupid thin"
"Terminator X Speaks with his Hands" is a great finale....although i wish
the first part went on longer...when that beat changes ("that's right, bass
for your face....yeah y'all, that's right..rock that shit homie) i feel
like the album is over....and after about a minute it is
so, from 12 tracks i'd say about half are top notch....of the other half,
there are only 2 songs that i'd even think about skipping and 90% of the
time i don't
--
mr.tim
======================================================
now ask yourself who's the one with the most to gain (BUSH!)
'fore 9-11 motherfuckers couldn't stand his name (BUSH!)
-paris
will there ever come a time when the cryin' ends?
cause death is just a moment when the dyin' ends...
-edo g
mochaspresso
I can't remember exact release dates and I'm too lazy at the moment to
check. I only remember things that far back in periods. I know where
I was and I what I was doing during that time period and these were a
few albums that served as backdrops.......
1) Jungle Bros "Straight Out The Jungle"
2) De La Soul "3 Ft High and Rising"
3) Queen Latifah "All Hail The Queen"
I chose these because before there were Okayplayers, there were Native
Tongues. All trends just seem to go in cycles over time and they
really aren't that different when you look back.
I don't really want to go through each album track by track....I'm
lazy....but the above represent sort of an overlooked movement or
trend in hip-hop during the time that they were originally released.
When folks get to reminiscing about the good old days, it seems that
these always get overshadowed by NWA, PE and BDP.
齯滌`偕爻,虜,齯滌`偕爻,虜,齯滌`偕爻,虜,齯滌`偕爻,虜,齯滌`偕爻,虜,齯滌`偕爻,虜,齯漱�虜,齯滌`偕爻,虜,齯�
Mochaspresso
"House music all night long...." (another forgotten era)
http://www.walrus.com/%7Esuave/movebody.ram
http://www.walrus.com/%7Esuave/raze.ram
** Banner appears courtesy of the honorable Gortician **
Nesta
>Date: Sun, Dec 15, 2002 1:19 AM
>1) Jungle Bros "Straight Out The Jungle"
>2) De La Soul "3 Ft High and Rising"
>3) Queen Latifah "All Hail The Queen"
>I don't really want to go through each album track by track....I'm
>lazy....but the above represent sort of an overlooked movement or
>trend in hip-hop during the time that they were originally released.
>When folks get to reminiscing about the good old days, it seems that
>these always get overshadowed by NWA, PE and BDP.
not by me...those are all good albums. the de la album was my favorite ever
for a long time. and i just pulled out the JBs album last week - that has some
nasty fuckin drums.
i believe JBs is 88, and the others are 89. i'm sure mr tim will open those
threads up shortly. drop some words on them when he does. you don't gotta go
track by track, just give a couple paragraphs summarizing each for the
discussion.
...nesta...
Most of you can't even comprehend what I am saying to you
Even in my human form the message I'm relaying
One good thing about music
When it hits you feel no pain
Fatboy Roberts
"mr.tim" <timo...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:Xns92E57701AD304t...@130.133.1.4...
> alright we're gonna get started with 1987, 1988 and 1989
>
> this shit will happen in 3 stages....
>
> 1.nominations (according to year of release)...when nominating an album,
> you should do more than simply name the album...take the time to go
through
> the album (track by track) and refresh everyone's memory (you don't have
to
> be a great writer...check my lame example)...only the people who make a
> nomination or add further comments on a previous nomination will be
> eligible to vote on the final list for that year
>
I'm goin with BAD by LL, Yo! by PE and Paid in Full (that was 87, wasn't
it?) by Eric B and Rakim
I think those were all 1987. and there's some shit I'm forgetting, no doubt.
Was "Life is Too Short" 87? or was it 88? that album would make the 87 list,
but if it was 88, I think it gets crowded out of the field.
Jesus, 88 was fucking sick, wasn't it.
Fatboy
ML-78
T La Rock - The Lyrical King
DJ Jazzy Jeff & The Fresh Prince - Rock the House
Tuff Crew/Krown Rulers - Phanjam
ML-78
tim schnetgoeke
>1.nominations (according to year of release)...when nominating an album,
>you should do more than simply name the album...take the time to go through
>the album (track by track) and refresh everyone's memory (you don't have to
>be a great writer...check my lame example)...only the people who make a
>nomination or add further comments on a previous nomination will be
>eligible to vote on the final list for that year
just ice - kool & deadly
i'll elaborate on this later. until then just listen to the album.
peace.
tim
QBa...@webtv.net
Gettin Dumb was in '87....I think it was called Back To The Real Hip
Hop....
most of my 1987 picks have been said
LL - BAD
Eric B & Rakim - Paid In Full
DJ Jazzy Jeff & Fresh Prince - Rock The House
BDP - Criminal Minded
Heavy D & The Boyz - Livin Large
termiNATTY x
Just Ice- Kool & Deadly (I thought it was 88, due to the fact that it was
recorded AFTER Scott died, but I checked---it must have been late 1987)
I'll nominate: "Down By Law" MC Shan
I'm not into this cut by cut requirement. Go get a late pass if you don't know
the mystical juju created by Marley's perfect beats and Shan's microphone
mastery. In a battle these guys would have shit all over Boogie Down
Productions (although BDP's sloppy style had an attraction all it's own.)
Marley's beats sounded like they were made in top studios, Scott's -albeit they
were dope - sounded like they were made in a bedroom.
DAF
termiNATTY x
DAF
HoopKing33
Dana Dane -- With the Fame
Kool Moe Dee -- How Ya Like Me Now
Peace, and I'm out.
--
"I use a buck to wipe my ass 'cause see, my shit is on the money." -- CHOPS
ML-78
> Gettin Dumb was in '87....I think it was called Back To The Real Hip
> Hop....
Actually 'Kool and Deadly' was indeed 1987 while 'Back to the Old School'
(the one with Latoya and Cold Gettin' Dumb) was 1986. And 'Kool and Deadly'
was a huge dip in form from his debut. Replacing Kurtis Mantronik with
KRS-One on the boards - hello?
ML-78
leonid
commentary,
so here are my thoughts: PIF is the most influential album of that
year--
PE, in their later releases, reached a greatness unequaled to this
day, but
Yo has always felt to me (I heard it after hearing Millions) a
precursor to a
classic rather than a classic, & though they influenced everyone
culturally
(which must be what Chuck D meant at the Billboard Awards when he said
Run DMC
has influenced Kurt Cobain,) & politically, their actual style was not
as
influential as EBAR's. Rakim's flow was the gold standard of the New
School,
& though few could copy it, everyone probably tried to, rapping along
with
"I Ain't No Joke," or "Paid in Full." Had a rapper ever sounded so
deadly
cool, so intelligent, so in control of his voice? People still want
to sound
like that. Eric B, as Stetsasonic reminded us, made "old" James Brown
into the most sampled man alive with "I Know You Got Soul." The
lyrics (this was
before Rakim's conscious period began) influenced the Jiggy era,
especially
the title cut. Pre-PIF hip-hop always was in danger of being
swallowed by its
novelty acts. This is, admittedly, a genre whose first hit record
featured a
verse about a friend's wife's bad cooking, & then you had your Rappin'
Dukes,
your Boys both Beastie & Fat, hell, you even had dope groups like Run
DMC
letting rehab rockers bust through their dressing room wall. "I Ain't
No Joke"
was EBAR's mission statement, breaking down to, "I'm not going to
clown around
& lose my dignity to please some MTV viewers in Idaho. This is an
art. We're
the best at it, & if you can't appreciate mastery & only want gimmicks
then we don't even want to know you." This, to paraphrase some fool
on a soundstage
somewhere in New Mexico in 1969, was "one small step for the R, but
one giant
leap for hip-hopkind." Classic material. And it wasn't a fluke--the
next two
EBAR albums were also classics.
It was Rakim's
personal mission
seemed in danger of becoming novelty
music, with unserious acts such as the Fat & Beastie Boys,
Nesta
>Date: Sun, Dec 15, 2002 11:19 AM
>Kool Moe Dee -- How Ya Like Me Now
word, there we go.
i believe this was the solo debut for moe dee, the most underrated mc ever.
almost a decade and numerous changes had happened in rap since he first came
out with the treacherous 3, but he with this album he proved he was still on
top of the game.
the album starts with the title track, a vicious attack on ll cool j, who moe
dee accused of biting his style.
"rap is an art, and i'm a picasso
but of course, why else would you try so
hard to paint a picture
and try to get yourself in my shoes
but they won't fit you
i'm bigger and better, forget about deffer
every time i rock the mic i left a
stain on your brain, that will remain
stuck in the back of your brain until you see me again
respect, i come correct
the rhymes i select
are never short of perfect
vernacular's pure
and i can insure
life or death with my breath
my voice is the cure
i heal life from the words i spread
i make a sick man rock on his death bed"
"how ya like me now" is one of the great battle rhymes ever. i wanna quote
every verse of it here. it's to LL's credit that it didn't bury him.
moe dee's vocabulary, use of metaphor, and rhyme schemes were at the pinnacle
of 1987 MCing. he had a deep, distinctive voice, impeccable timing and vocal
inflections.
the weakness on this album is the beats. they have not aged as well as some of
the other top albums of the time. the beats are distinctive, they show good
use of the emerging sampling technology. but a lot feel very "clubby."
they're almost too spruced up with decorative flourishes. these are not
classic head-nodders that would stand alone as instrumentals. moe dee is a
strong enough mc not to let them drag the album down, but the beats are too
obtrusive to be ignored. they don't bother me a lot, as i've been listening to
this album for years. but i could easily see them turning off a new listener
coming to this album now.
it's a well-conceived, well-rounded album. the major theme is his battle with
LL, but only a few songs are dedicated to that. he brags about his skills with
the ladies. he recalls how he used to rumble w/ his crew as a youngster. "way
way back" is a fun joint showing off the old school rhyme techniques he used to
get the crowd open with. these may not be particularly unique topics, but he
addresses them all with his own style.
"the erogenous zone of the female species
attracts them to me, and if not at least she's
stimulated to a point where she sees
something intriguing but to me she's
just suppressing her inner thoughts
your physical drive can't be bought
i got 50 ways to get ya"
that's not a style anyone else has ever really written in.
but his best shit was the attacks on LL:
"you wanted to be
another moe dee
when you started rhyming you see
you had to be
to some degree
an imitation variation of me"
ok, all i got time for now...
Nesta
>Date: Sun, Dec 15, 2002 4:07 PM
>Paid in Full- Eric B & Rakim. It's been mentioned, but without
>commentary,
>so here are my thoughts:
who are you? 2 good reviews on EBAR and PE, keep em coming son
T. Tauri
Really just end to end solid, and I'm trying to get my dates straight to
thing if there was anything prior that didn't have at least one
out-of-place joint on it. The beats are raw and dope, and topically, KRS
brags with authority but still comes with a lot of honesty (or personal
perspective) and scope.
Plus it manages to bring in the various influences on rap's
development--the breaks, reggae, etc--without sounding inconsistent.
Just proper clarity of purpose.
Peece,
T. Tauri
BSE
LL's second album is also his best and very deserving of some of your
votes for 1987.
"I'm Bad" is one of the fiercest tunes of the time. A time when LL could
actually sound threatening, and his "im the greatest" boasts held some
serious weight. The production is a couple of years ahead of its time and
realy atmospheric and filled out. A realy good example of a track using
intro and outro skits to great effect. Stone cold classic.
"Kanday" is dope for its beat alone. A great drum pattern that changes up
throughout(not that usual in 87) for LL to bust some of his better macking
rhymes. how he starts each verse ahead of the beat is realy dope. "wet
steamy and warm just like a hot cup of milk". LL at this time is supremely
arrogant and likeable all at once. For me the very thing that modern
emcees like Jay-Z and Eminem fail to be. L's flow on this track is
excellent and changes up mroe than a lot of rappers in 02 do.
"Get down" uses a few too many samples that have been used better
elsewhere. but that fact that hes "Sounding hungry over beats thats why I
allways eat" makes up for the overfamiliar samples. "What I say is for
real this aint la-la-land". Lots of great lines in here plus some nice
scratches. "Ninja of rap, the boss is back".
"The Bristol Hotel" a song about a place where women sell thier Bristols!
Not the dopest tune on the album but LL flips a nice descriptive story in
the old school manner. People forget what a great storyteller LL was in
his day. Stuff like this hangs with much of what slick rick was doing at
the time. "she lets you inside, make you pay for the ride, take off her
pants and then it smells like somebody died".
"My rhyme aint done" is a real old school smart-rap. Great bragging story
which still stands up today. The beat is functional but well suited for LL
to rock the crazy lyrics. "Then I took a trip to teh center of the earth,
I was kinda scared so E love went first". Wicked. Of note is teh prototype
verse for Ghostface's "The forest".
".357 break it on down" is painfully mastered. It could be a good track if
the levels were right but.... Some good shouting in the hook. Too much
like a weak "Timebomb".
"Go cut creator go" is very dated. The Guitars and samples suck dick but
theres some realy nice scratching in there. Especially the quick stabs.
Nice lyrics about comming through as a rapper.
"The Breakthrough" has a dope beat. Almost EPMD like except for the drums.
Well-funky for its time. he makes Hiphop sound so wicked and appealing
throughout this album but on this track he just kills shit. "Hope my
message reaches you before your 73, an old man, when people ask you what
you did with your life, you say I hated LL and I carried a knife". Dope.
"I need love". This song sucks in unparralelled ways. The way he delivers
his lyrics in a pseudo-sincere whisper. The unfathomably corny lyrics
themselves. The booty beat and super shit keyboard. Ouch, this song is
trailblazingly wack.
"Ahh lets get ill" puts things back on track. "Im the ladies love, legend
in leather, long and lean and I dont wear pleather"!!!!
Prototype for so much of the modern "anthem" Hiphop. LL made whole tracks
not just verses with cuts in between. The amount that "lets get dirty"
riffs on this is silly.
"The doo wop" might well be the most underrated LL track of all time. It's
just stupid ahead of its time. Crazy sample that predates teh Native
Tongues, with some dope flowing over the top. LL at this point is rapping
over an innovative beat with Slick Rick stories, but with a voice like RUN
mixed with Chuck D. How is he not the shit?
This album is the DEF in Def Jam and remains a classic. I commend "BAD" to
the newsgroup.
I thank you, BSE.
--
http://www.ukseen.com - There it is!
To reply remove "thepillowfromyourheadandputabookinit"
ML-78
>
> Really just end to end solid, and I'm trying to get my dates straight to
> thing if there was anything prior that didn't have at least one
> out-of-place joint on it.
Schoolly-D 'Schoolly D' and Mantronix 'The Album'. But both of these were so
short.
ML-78
tim schnetgoeke
>Actually 'Kool and Deadly' was indeed 1987 while 'Back to the Old School'
>(the one with Latoya and Cold Gettin' Dumb) was 1986. And 'Kool and Deadly'
>was a huge dip in form from his debut. Replacing Kurtis Mantronik with
>KRS-One on the boards - hello?
i'm as close to a mantronix fan as you can get. i even own some of his
wacker records, because "it's mantronix, so please shut up".
however, the second just ice is better than the first. that's right.
listen to the beats. really simple without any bullshit fx + the odd
"experimental" sample (that water sound). then you've got dmx on the
beatbox, some wacky krs toasting and just rhyming like he could go on
for days. "ey yo, just, the record's over!" "the record's over?"
if i had to move to milan with just five albums, i'd take
"kool&deadly", some ultramagnetics, some pe and i dunno...
peace.
tim
tim schnetgoeke
>Schoolly-D 'Schoolly D' and Mantronix 'The Album'. But both of these were so
>short.
hell yeah. there are two different versions of the schooly d, though.
jive reissued it with a few bonus tracks in 1987. the original on
schooly d records is from 1986.
peace.
tim
ML-78
so
> >short.
>
> hell yeah. there are two different versions of the schooly d, though.
> jive reissued it with a few bonus tracks in 1987. the original on
> schooly d records is from 1986.
I thought Jive only reissued his 2nd album 'Saturday Night - The Album' (in
the same year as Schoolly D had put it out on his own label)? Are you sure
you're not thinking of 'The Adventures of Schoolly D' from 1987, which was
all the tracks (13 in all) from the first two albums?
ML-78
tim schnetgoeke
>I thought Jive only reissued his 2nd album 'Saturday Night - The Album' (in
>the same year as Schoolly D had put it out on his own label)?
right. i should check my crates before i type. i was thinking of
"saturday night". the sleeve of the original says "all music and words
by schoolly-d for schoolly dee music 1986 bmi". my second copy on jive
zomba is (p) & (c) 1987.
peace.
tim
MJ
news:20021215161509...@mb-dh.aol.com...
> >From: hoopk...@aol.com (HoopKing33)
> >Date: Sun, Dec 15, 2002 11:19 AM
>
> >Kool Moe Dee -- How Ya Like Me Now
>
> word, there we go.
>
> i believe this was the solo debut for moe dee, the most underrated mc
ever.
Most underrated yes, solo debut no. He had a self-titled debut.
However, I'm not sure if it came out in '86. My LP says '87,
but it may have been re-issued after "How Ya Like Me Now".
Either way, "Kool Moe Dee" was first and contained definitely
pre-1987 material. It included the infamous "Go See The Doctor"
single and several songs he had already recorded for Sugarhill
which were re-recorded for the album ("Do You Know What
Time It Is", "Bad Mutha", "Dumb Dick").
Matt
Nesta
>Date: Mon, Dec 16, 2002 1:25 PM
>> i believe this was the solo debut for moe dee
>no. He had a self-titled debut.
yup, i remembered that after i posted. i don't have that album, but i was like
wait..."go see the doctor" came out before _how ya like me now_. thanks.
Nesta
Bruce-Bruce
_Hot, Cool &Vicious_ - Salt-N-Pepa
_Living Large_ - Heavy D./Boyz
Each of these LP's spawned a few good ones.
"mr.tim" <timo...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:Xns92E57701AD304t...@130.133.1.4...