Can Gangsta Rap Still Sell (Poor Sales for G-Rappers in General)
Spirit
guarantees sales. I can list a legion of gangsta rappers who sold under
or barely surpassed sales of 100,000 copies. There are just as many
underground gangsta artists and labels as there are "traditional" (???)
independent labels.
However, mainstream gangsta rap (read: gangsta rap with major
distribution) is having a harder time selling than it used to. I was
predicting the commercial decline of gangsta rap a while back and
everyone thought I was a little crazy. Let me just say that I knew it
was all going bad when Dre abandoned the genre, because Dre started it
(yes, I know people are going to name Ice T or Schooly D, but let's face
it, if there was no NWA, gangsta rap as we know it wouldn't exist).
This all brings up the question: what is gangsta rap? Now, that's a
tough one. If you look at it on a lyrical level, a lot of the emcees who
are labelled gangsta rappers have little "true" gang affiliation. Of
course, those that have read Monster Cody's autobiography (and Cali
residents) understand that very few gang members are the full time
killers that gangsta rappers portray, i.e. the guy (or girl) that's
banging full time, killing as many enemies as he (or she) can. So, just
because someone says "I'm a Crip" doesn't necessarily mean they've
killed anyone, let alone killed the number of people that get massacred
in gangsta rap lyrics.
As I understand it, a lot of guys are affiliated in an "associate" sort
of way. They associate with people who are heavy into the game. But even
if you note people like, say Ice Cube, who may be associated with a few
cats in his neighborhood (I stress "may"), the actual content of his
rhymes is barely gang-related, from any statistical perspective. Some
slang terms here and there. It got a little heavier when cats liek Snoop
came out, say with "It Ain't Nothing But a G Thing" (presumably adapted
from the refrain "It ain't nothing but a Crip thang"). Yet and still,
pure gangsta rap albums, i.e. albums strictly about gang life, such as
"Banging on Wax" have hardly reached the stellar sales of "The Chronic".
Part of the problem, I would argue, is that gang related rhymes would
go over most people's heads in the same way that complex metaphors go
over most people's heads. I mean, if two rappers were battling and one
called the other a "slob", not many people outside the gang lifestyle
(or Southern Cali) would understand any significance beyond "you have a
poorly kept appearance".
Anyway, so you have what's called "gangsta rap", which somehow
encompasses people like Scarface and E-40, who never belonged to any
type of gang. Somehow, the term expanded to essentially mean anyone who
talks about a key set of topics: murder, "bitches", and blunts/chronic,
etc., "the hood", as well as the occasional anti-police song, and didn't
happen to be from New York (if you were from New York and discussed
these things, until recently, you did not get placed in the gangsta rap
category, which still irks me). Replaying or sampling Parliament became
an overused staple after "The Chronic". However, let's face it, once the
media decided violent rap from the south fit in the gangsta category, it
became a little bit easier to sell units as the Pimp Gangsta Clik than
the Peace and Love Crew (or even if you were the CA-based Pimp Gangsta
Klik rather than the NY-based Money Boss Players...hah). With Biggie it
all changed...but let's return to what has traditionally been called
"gangsta rap" and its current commercial status as determined by peeking
at a few recent releases.
Anyway, the point is this. Big Mike debuted at 63 on the pop charts this
week (13 on the R&B charts). Apparently, those garbage commercials
during Rap City didn't help much (nor did the adoption by Rap-a-Lot of
the "Rap-a-LOt Mafia" moniker). No Limit's compilation debuted just
above it at 62 and didn't break the top 20 on the R&B charts (mind you,
compilation albums tend to sell less than single artist albums, as a
general rule). BG, the guy they say is the next star out of Cash Money?
He's at 50-something on the pop charts (and 15 on the R&B charts) after
6 weeks of release. Considering how much press those cats has been
getting predicting they would be the next NO Limit, that's pretty poor
for a second release (one platinum album does not an empire make). If
it's big baller status you want, charting in the teens on the R&B charts
isn't going to get it for you...Soundbombing is at 16 on the R&B charts
(in its second week) and we know Rawkus is hardly about to knock Def Jam
off its commercial throne...
Insane Clown Posse somehow debuted at 4 on the Pop Charts. DMX is doing
well. The epicenter of gangsta rap has apparently shifted eastward. I
expect that Ja Ruyle will sell well also, although I think there are
plenty of more interesting albums out there.
Now, there are key veteran traditional gangsta rappers who will hold
their status: Ice Cube comes to mind, as well as Scarface. However, the
entire second generation of G-rappers (don't start that Schooly D
argument) has virtually vanished, including the careers of the other
Geto Boys (and even the group Geto Boys, with a whooping 250,000 in
sales on their last LP), Spice 1, MC Eiht (who may...possibly, make a
comeback on Mack 10's label, but I doubt it). The current reigning
"champs" in gangsta appear unable to "put on" successors. How many Ice
Cube homies have dropped releases only to disappear in the wind (sole
survivor: Mack 10)? How well did the Lil Soldiers sell? The Gambino
Family? Remember the Dangerous Crew? Part of it is the record
industry...nothing remains hot forever...what used to kill me was cats
like Suge, putting "untouchable" behind their label name like they were
going to be platinum forever...everything fades in time...and shit fades
a lot faster in rap music.
--
Peace,
Spirit
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Share what you know. Learn what you don't.
GoldenChild
able to play all the different roles, the Gangster, the Playa, the
Prophet, the God, the Pimp, ect. And it's all about how well your shit
is marketed. Look at Kool G. Rap, he's one of the origina; Gangster
rappers, especially from the East Coast, and he's better than he's ever
been lyrically. But, his album hasn't sold a fuckin' unit, because he
has no video's, just recently got a commercial for it, and just recently
started puttin' adds in magazines for it. That shit worries me, 'cause I
don't want him and Big Daddy Kane (who also didn't go tin due to poor
marketing) to be like "Fuck it, I'm losing money off this rap shit, I
can't do it no more". And eventually, they're gonna have to say that,
'cause they can't just keep losin' money. And Rec. Labels aren't gonna
want 'em anymore 'cause they won't do any good for them. I urge all of
you, PLEASE, COP THE KOOL G. RAP AND BIG DADDY KANE ALBUMS, DON'T LET
THESE LEGENDS FADE AWAY. Fuck the bootleg, fuck the one you found at a
garage sale for 1.50, cop the one from the store for 15 Bills. Or mail
their rec. label and let 'em know how dope the album is, or somethin',
Hip-Hop can't afford to lose anymore legends. One good thing though, the
Gangster rappers on the East Coast are tryin' their damdest to keep G.
Rap in the game. Noreaga, Mobb Deep, Nas, Raekwon, Punisher, Tragedy and
Jay-Z have all recently done shit with him, not only to better the song,
but also to put him back on I'm sure. I know I drifted but fuck it,
Peace.
"Niggas hangin' off my Two nuts like they were put there by the Ku Klux"
- Kool G. Rap
"I'll have ya hittin' high notes like Kurtis 'cause of the pain they you
May feel (field)" - Kane
Spirit68
>rappers, especially from the East Coast, and he's better than he's ever
>been lyrically. But, his album hasn't sold a fuckin' unit
I mean, he's on his own label ain't he? It's hard being indie. If he was on
MCA, he'd prolly be selling big. Or, imagine G Rap on Def Jam? Sheeeeit. Back
in the day, he had to go through Cold Chillin and Warner Bros. Cold Chillin
seemingly had no idea how to market and WB definitely didn't know shit about
rap. I hear "4, 5, 6" debuted well, bit fell off quickly....hmmmm.
Peace,
Spirit
Spread Love/Amphibians
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available NOW, on vinyl ($5) and cassettes ($3), add $2 for shipping tapes, $3
for shipping vinyl. E-mail me for more details...
OT
Spirit <Alan...@aol.com> wrote:
> First of all, it's a fantasy that being a gangsta rapper alone
> guarantees sales.
Where did you get this idea???
Sales have nothing to do with genre, its talent based.
>I can list a legion of gangsta rappers who sold
>under
> or barely surpassed sales of 100,000 copies.
100,000 copies is *ALOT* for a small indie label. when you are
independent you get close to $5 an album sale, that translates to
$500,000.
> However, mainstream gangsta rap (read: gangsta rap with major
> distribution) is having a harder time selling than it used to.
that's becuz the 'mainstream' media created the term 'gangsta rap'
there's no such thang...its all hip-hop playa.
>I was
> predicting the commercial decline of gangsta rap a while back and
> everyone thought I was a little crazy.
You still are. You havent read a Billboard lately have you?
Mr. Serv-On knocked Lauryn Hill outta the number one spot on his debut.
No limit has at least 8 lps in the billboard top 200.
> Let me just say that I knew it
> was all going bad when Dre abandoned the genre, because Dre started it
> (yes, I know people are going to name Ice T or Schooly D, but let's
face
> it, if there was no NWA, gangsta rap as we know it wouldn't exist).
that's not true. the Geto Boys, Master P, and Too $hort have all been
out just as long as NWA. So has Cash Money, Esham, and a number of
others.
NWA were the first STUDIO GANGSTAZ. that's the difference.
The Geto Boys had 3 lps out locally before 'We Caint be stopped'
I can remember seeing the Geto Boys on the cuts in Houston back in '89.
And they WERENT fakin'any part of the funk.
> This all brings up the question: what is gangsta rap?
Gangsta rap is a label created by the mainstream hip-hop media to apply
to artists that they do not like. This is true becuz the term is
applied to some artists and not others who rap with the same content and
context of the 'so-called' gangsta rappers.
Take Jay-Z, Nas or MOP for instance.
> If you look at it on a lyrical level, a lot of the emcees
who
> are labelled gangsta rappers have little "true" gang affiliation.
That's not necessarily true either. But, the only way to recognize REAL
gangsterism is by BEING one, so its easy to overstand why so much
misconception exists.
I can number a number of artists who have real affiliation.
>Of
> course, those that have read Monster Cody's autobiography
which to me probably had some degree of 'exaggeration' in it too.
(You dont go around admitting you murdered people in books.)
>(and Cali
> residents)
Acually from my experience the worst gang affiliated areas of the
country TODAY are Chicago and the small towns thru out the South, like
in Arkansas, Oklahoma, Texas (especially Dallas/Ft.Worth), Kentucky,
Ohio, etc.
> understand that very few gang members are the full time
> killers that gangsta rappers portray, i.e. the guy (or girl) that's
> banging full time, killing as many enemies as he (or she) can. So,
just
> because someone says "I'm a Crip" doesn't necessarily mean they've
> killed anyone, let alone killed the number of people that get
massacred
> in gangsta rap lyrics.
Most of the 'gangsta rap' music that I listen to never really talks
about the actual act of killing people, they just reference whut
would/could happen if you fuck with the wrong person.
Most g-rap to me is metaphorical--
The references are used to build rhymes, just like all the 'true school'
hip-hop artists use gems and %5 references, when most of them arent
righteous.
'...its automatic like the nine
bustin' funny lines on them hoez at all times!'
--Fat Pat
>
> As I understand it, a lot of guys are affiliated in an "associate"
sort
> of way. They associate with people who are heavy into the game.
Being in the Game doesnt necessarily have to anythang to do with
gang-bangin'.
Take Houston for instance. There are plenty of people out on the grind,
but Houston isnt full of gangs. (except in the latino neighborhoods)
>But
>even
> if you note people like, say Ice Cube, who may be associated with a
few
> cats in his neighborhood (I stress "may"), the actual content of his
> rhymes is barely gang-related, from any statistical perspective.
That's becuz Cube aint in a gang, he's a RAPPER. That's his occupation.
The legal way, baby!
>Some
> slang terms here and there. It got a little heavier when cats liek
Snoop
> came out, say with "It Ain't Nothing But a G Thing" (presumably
adapted
> from the refrain "It ain't nothing but a Crip thang"). Yet and still,
> pure gangsta rap albums, i.e. albums strictly about gang life, such as
> "Banging on Wax" have hardly reached the stellar sales of "The
Chronic".
That's becuz REAL gangsta rap (i.e. rap made by REAL gangstaz) is mostly
underground and its not made for sales its made to be banged in trunks
on the streets.
> Part of the problem, I would argue, is that gang related rhymes would
> go over most people's heads in the same way that complex metaphors go
> over most people's heads.
this is exactly what I was saying above. If you arent affiliated you
dont know what they are talking about half the time.
Most 'gangsta rap' songs are full of phrases that have a duality in
meaning.
"...C is for the WEAK When I speak I SCREAM!!
Afraid to sleep I'm having krazy DREAMs!"
--2Pac from the song, 'Troublesome'
"...You shoulda broke it to the LEFT mane!!"
--Crucial Conflict
But this is the same thang that happens when artists like GooDiemob are
misinterpreted. Just like I said a long time ago...erebody's sang'n
bout 'dem bananas & mayonaise' but hardly nobody knows whut the fuck
they REALLY talkin bout.
> I mean, if two rappers were battling and one
> called the other a "slob", not many people outside the gang lifestyle
> (or Southern Cali) would understand any significance beyond "you have
a
> poorly kept appearance".
Or if I called you a 'crab' or a 'creep'
> Anyway, so you have what's called "gangsta rap", which somehow
> encompasses people like Scarface and E-40, who never belonged to any
> type of gang.
That's where you're lost. Both of these artists were affiliated, they
might neva admit it though.
E-40 and all his crew were 415's
and Scarface didnt have Larry Hoover on his record for nothing....
>Somehow, the term expanded to essentially mean anyone
>who
> talks about a key set of topics: murder, "bitches", and
blunts/chronic,
> etc., "the hood", as well as the occasional anti-police song,
Damn...this would include about 90% of all hip-hop artists, huh???
>and
>didn't
> happen to be from New York (if you were from New York and discussed
> these things, until recently, you did not get placed in the gangsta
rap
> category, which still irks me).
This is part of the eastcoast hip-hop media conspiracy.
>Replaying or sampling Parliament
became
> an overused staple after "The Chronic".
This is another factor that folks who really arent into the genre dont
overstand.
Parliament samples didnt start being overused after 'The Chronic'
Erebody on the westcoast was overusing them.
But that's becuz P-funk was REALLY popular in Cali.
It's sort of like how erebody on the eastcoast was overusing James Brown
samples in the late eighties.
> However, let's face it, once
>the
> media decided violent rap from the south fit in the gangsta category,
>it
> became a little bit easier to sell units as the Pimp Gangsta Clik than
> the Peace and Love Crew (or even if you were the CA-based Pimp Gangsta
> Klik rather than the NY-based Money Boss Players...hah).
People in the South always supported people from the South when nobody
else on either coast did. We developed our own scene.
that's why the music sells...not becuz the media decided it.
the South neva used to get media coverage outside of Luke and OutKast
(and still barely does) so how could this be true???
Plus, IMHO, music from the South is made from a different perspective
than other places. People make music to get the club krunk/trunks
humming FIRST...then they sell it if its popular.
There's not alot of 'pre-packaged' hip-hop in the South becuz all the
major labels are in other places and whites folks down this way for the
most part aint really tryin to hear no rappin'.
> With Biggie it all changed...
That's becuz he stole 2pac's style.
>but let's return to what has traditionally been called
> "gangsta rap" and its current commercial status as determined by
peeking
> at a few recent releases.
>
> Anyway, the point is this. Big Mike debuted at 63 on the pop charts
this
> week (13 on the R&B charts).
That's pretty high for a record. #63 in THE WORLD.
Most 'abstract' hip-hop doesnt even make the charts.
> Apparently, those garbage commercials
> during Rap City didn't help much (nor did the adoption by Rap-a-Lot of
> the "Rap-a-LOt Mafia" moniker).
This had nothing to do with marketing playa...Rap-A-Lot changed their
moniker becuz they ARE like the mafia of rap 4REAL.
they roll deep...i mean DEEEEEEEP and bumrush spots all the time.
And they have the money and the power 4REAL. Nobody in Houston fucks
with them 4REAL.
I just saw Mr. Prince and the Rap-A-Lot Mafia at 'The Pheonix' (probably
the biggest nitespot in Houston) and they were all draped up and
dripped out playa, ridin' in a superstretch big-body Benz limo.
They also performed at a basketball tournamnet near my house and pulled
up in a stretch Hummer.
>No Limit's compilation debuted just
> above it at 62 and didn't break the top 20 on the R&B charts (mind
you,
> compilation albums tend to sell less than single artist albums, as a
> general rule). BG, the guy they say is the next star out of Cash
Money?
> He's at 50-something on the pop charts (and 15 on the R&B charts)
after
> 6 weeks of release. Considering how much press those cats has been
> getting predicting they would be the next NO Limit, that's pretty poor
> for a second release (one platinum album does not an empire make).
Your forgetting that BG has like 5 lps out already, so does Juvenile.
Plus, like i said earlier...just making it ONTO the chart is pretty
damn good in itself.
Do you know how many hip-hop records there are that drop and NEVA make
it onto the charts???
Literally thousands.
> If
> it's big baller status you want, charting in the teens on the R&B
charts
> isn't going to get it for you...
But you're also forgetting the business aspect of this whole thang.
Cash Money, Sick-Wid-It, No Limit, Sauve House, etc. all signed major
distribution deals with CASH signing bonuses in the MILLIONS.
They're ALREADY rich 4REAL. Plus they were already rich from selling
out the trunk before they went major. How do you think Master P got so
rich???
Cash Money signed a $30 million deal, of which they got a *HUGE*
signing bonus. Tony draper got a $15 million sign-on bonus when he
signed Sauve House to Universal, E-40's was something like $17 million.
That's in the pocket playa. They're REALLY ballaz.
Check out Southwest Wholesales sales charts on their website.
there are a ton of indie hip-hop groups moving big units just in the
South alone.
>Soundbombing is at 16 on the R&B
>charts
> (in its second week) and we know Rawkus is hardly about to knock Def
Jam
> off its commercial throne...
I applied for a job a Rawkus. they got ALOT more money than you think.
One of the prerequisites for the job was having a LAW degree.
> Insane Clown Posse somehow debuted at 4 on the Pop Charts. DMX is
doing
> well. The epicenter of gangsta rap has apparently shifted eastward.
That's becuz 'gangsta rap' now is mostly performed
only by STUDIO GANGSTAZ.
you have to be able to decypher the difference.
Becuz ICP is as studio as it gets. I'd kick one of those hoe-azz
marshmellow muthafuckaz' ass if I saw them in REAL-life.
Show them punks how REAL it its.
Just like Nas is a poseur IMHO, and i caint listen to his music.
You can feel the fraud in it.
He was alot betta when he was Halftime, aka Nasty Nas.
>I expect that Ja Rule will sell well also, although I think there are
> plenty of more interesting albums out there.
I probably wont buy it...but I DO like the club context of the single.
Its gets the party krunk.
He's like a bootleg DMX to me.
How much your album sells is usually related more to your label's
marketing and the content of the record, not the context of the record.
>
> Now, there are key veteran traditional gangsta rappers who will hold
> their status: Ice Cube comes to mind, as well as Scarface. However,
the
> entire second generation of G-rappers (don't start that Schooly D
> argument) has virtually vanished,
That's becuz g-rap is more like on its fourth generation...all the 2nd
generation artists are my age and older. They're OLD.
> including the careers of the other
> Geto Boys (and even the group Geto Boys, with a whooping 250,000 in
> sales on their last LP),
Speaking of which, Willie D's new solo lp is bout to drop.
Ive heard some of it and the production is top-notch, and I luv to hear
Willie Dennis kick the REAL, he puts that 5th ward attitude al up in
your face. willie d is one of my favorite hip-hop personalities becuz
he keeps it real on all fronts. His radio show, 'Reality check' used to
be the best thang on. He put senators, doctors, industry execs, prison
officials, etc. on the air and made them answer REAL questions.
plus, he knocked Melle Mel out in the only hip-hop boxing tournament.
Put them gunz own his azz H-town style.
>Spice 1, MC Eiht (who may...possibly, make a
> comeback on Mack 10's label, but I doubt it). The current reigning
> "champs" in gangsta appear unable to "put on" successors.
That's becuz like I said, Cube is old. hip-hop is mostly listened to by
KIDZ.(12-21 year olds) This is a different peer group than he grew up
with.
its the same reason kari orr couldnt feel EPMD like I could becuz he's a
lil younger than i am and missed their heighday.
when the first EPMD lp dropped I was 18, and believe me, I saw a concert
tour at the 'Main Event' in Houston with MC Lyte and Too $hort that was
completely off the hook.
> How many Ice
> Cube homies have dropped releases only to disappear in the wind (sole
> survivor: Mack 10)? How well did the Lil Soldiers sell? The Gambino
> Family? Remember the Dangerous Crew? Part of it is the record
> industry...nothing remains hot forever...what used to kill me was cats
> like Suge, putting "untouchable" behind their label name like they
were
> going to be platinum forever...everything fades in time...and shit
fades
> a lot faster in rap music.
Rap ages in dog years and erebody's only got 15 minutes of fame.
Becuz i'm waitin for the day tat all these 'abstract poets' get off
their high horses and complex rhyme flows and realize hip-hop is Our
common ground.
Becuz I can rememba a day when Afrocentricism was the main thrust of
hip-hop, and people thought that would neva change, 'til Cube came out
and said, "...I'm sick of that shit! listen to the hit!!!..."
Hip-hop is STILL cyclic playa, just like life.
Rememba that playaboy...neva say nobody neva told ya!!!
> --
> Peace,
>
> Spirit
Stay UP!!
OT
"...Word to ME and if that shit dont meet yo EXPECTATIONS
FUCK-YOU CRITICS I do this fo the undaground Nation
Slab-riders, nigga...drug traffickers and JACKERS
HEAT-PACKERS...nigga all my homeboyz AINT RAPPERS!!"
--Eightball from the song,'Nobody But Me'
Greg Wilson
OT wrote in message <7jmjgi$ud6$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>...
>
>100,000 copies is *ALOT* for a small indie label. when you are
>independent you get close to $5 an album sale, that translates to
>$500,000.
>
Thanks for making my point. A while back some Real Hip-Hop (tm) person
wrote complaining that De La only went gold. *Only* sold half a million
records. If they're pissed cause they sold 500,000 copies of their most
unremarkable record, then they need to renegotiate their deal and/or get
back with Prince Paul.
>
>that's not true. the Geto Boys, Master P, and Too $hort have all been
>out just as long as NWA. So has Cash Money, Esham, and a number of
>others.
>
Master P? The first P record I heard was "Dead Presidents" where his style
owed more to E-40 than Tupac. This was a bit after Straight Outta Compton.
I have a hard time calling Too $hort a gangsta rapper. Short made what old
folks used to call "party" records, not unlike Redd Foxx or Rudy Ray Moore.
I'm really thinking hard here, but the GB's first "gangsta" record was
"Assassins", back when they were "Prince Johnny C", "Little Billy" (dancer,
later Bushwick Bill), Jukebox, and someone else I can't remember. Anyway,
this still was after/during NWA.
>
>Gangsta rap is a label created by the mainstream hip-hop media to apply
>to artists that they do not like. This is true becuz the term is
>applied to some artists and not others who rap with the same content and
>context of the 'so-called' gangsta rappers.
>
>Take Jay-Z, Nas or MOP for instance.
>
I do not know who MOP is, but I see your point. And it is good.
>
>Most of the 'gangsta rap' music that I listen to never really talks
>about the actual act of killing people, they just reference whut
>would/could happen if you fuck with the wrong person.
>
"The wrong person" being themselves, usually. Most of today's G-rap doesn't
talk about the actual act, possibly because of what happened to that guy
whose lyrics were submitted as evidence against him. (C-Bo?)
>Most g-rap to me is metaphorical--
>The references are used to build rhymes, just like all the 'true school'
> hip-hop artists use gems and %5 references, when most of them arent
>righteous.
>
Yeah, I had to explain this to my little brother when he was about 13.
>'...its automatic like the nine
> bustin' funny lines on them hoez at all times!'
> --Fat Pat
What happened to that "promoter" that fatally wounded FP? Did they slow
down his verse so it would fit in 25 Lighters, or was it intended for that
record? It's been over two years, how did he get on that Lil' Troy record?
It was that same little brother mentioned above that told *me* that Troy's
been around as long as J Prince.
>
>That's becuz REAL gangsta rap (i.e. rap made by REAL gangstaz) is mostly
>underground and its not made for sales its made to be banged in trunks
>on the streets.
>
Another good point.
>But this is the same thang that happens when artists like GooDiemob are
>misinterpreted. Just like I said a long time ago...erebody's sang'n
>bout 'dem bananas & mayonaise' but hardly nobody knows whut the fuck
>they REALLY talkin bout.
>
Hell, *I* need help w/the bananas & mayo line. I thought it was something
they ate cause they was so poor. Like syrup sandwiches when I grew up in
Sunnyside.
>That's where you're lost. Both of these artists were affiliated, they
>might neva admit it though.
>
>E-40 and all his crew were 415's
>and Scarface didnt have Larry Hoover on his record for nothing....
>
Let's play Six Degrees of Separation. Okay, let's play 1 degree. Suge
Knight->E-40->J. Smith. Hint: not a rapper.
>>Replaying or sampling Parliament
>became
>> an overused staple after "The Chronic".
>
>This is another factor that folks who really arent into the genre dont
>overstand.
>
>Parliament samples didnt start being overused after 'The Chronic'
>Erebody on the westcoast was overusing them.
>But that's becuz P-funk was REALLY popular in Cali.
>
It was overused once Erick Sermon got his hands on it.
>It's sort of like how erebody on the eastcoast was overusing James Brown
>samples in the late eighties.
>
Yep. If you had "James Brown's Funky People Vols 1-2" you had the source
of almost every rap record from the mid to late eighties. I want to say
this stopped with Paul's Boutique, but I need to think that through.
>Plus, IMHO, music from the South is made from a different perspective
>than other places. People make music to get the club krunk/trunks
>humming FIRST...then they sell it if its popular.
>
It's funny, cause this is exactly how it used to be on the other coasts.
>There's not alot of 'pre-packaged' hip-hop in the South becuz all the
>major labels are in other places and whites folks down this way for the
>most part aint really tryin to hear no rappin'.
>
And when you do try and "pre-package" it, it never works. See that last
Geto Boys album. It's clear that they were just picking up a check for that
one. Or that "My Homiez" garbage.
>
>> With Biggie it all changed...
>
>That's becuz he stole 2pac's style.
>
I've read this several times, but I cannot hear the Pac/Biggie similarities,
other than the long 'e' that Tupac overused. (wEEd, murder mEEEE,
hennessEE, enemEE)
(About Big Mike's chart position)
>That's pretty high for a record. #63 in THE WORLD.
>Most 'abstract' hip-hop doesnt even make the charts.
>
Still pretty low for a Big Mike record. I haven't heard it yet, and
"Hustlers" isn't making me anxious.
"Somethin' Serious" still gets play in the car. I think Mike tried a bit
too hard to sell o...excuse me, broaden his sales with the follow-up album,
abandoning the dirty beats and funky southern production in favor of a
smooth, love-man image and music similar to the incidental music in "New
York Undercover". "Hustlers" sounds like more of the same.
>I just saw Mr. Prince and the Rap-A-Lot Mafia at 'The Pheonix' (probably
>the biggest nitespot in Houston) and they were all draped up and
>dripped out playa, ridin' in a superstretch big-body Benz limo.
>
>They also performed at a basketball tournamnet near my house and pulled
>up in a stretch Hummer.
>
I hesitate to guess where this money and power comes from. Maybe those old
records sell pretty well, cause the new stuff doesn't even come close to
what they did during the early-mid 90's. I think it stopped with "The
Resurrection". The only good Rap-A-Lot record since then was prolly Devin,
whose style suits the quasi-R&B tracks RAL produces nowadays. I don't care
what label Tela is on, he should've stayed with Smoke One's beats.
>
>But you're also forgetting the business aspect of this whole thang.
>Cash Money, Sick-Wid-It, No Limit, Sauve House, etc. all signed major
>distribution deals with CASH signing bonuses in the MILLIONS.
>
Are these "bonuses" or "advances"? I don't know about any of the above
deals, but whenever I read about the Bad Boy deal w/Arista, they use terms
like "advance", "Line of credit", etc.
>They're ALREADY rich 4REAL. Plus they were already rich from selling
>out the trunk before they went major. How do you think Master P got so
>rich???
>
I don't know, the same way Eazy-E did? :)
>Cash Money signed a $30 million deal, of which they got a *HUGE*
>signing bonus. Tony draper got a $15 million sign-on bonus when he
>signed Sauve House to Universal, E-40's was something like $17 million.
>
I do not understand this. How and/or when will Universal profit from this?
I don't understand music industry accounting, but who at Uni thought 8ball &
MJG, South Circle, etc. ("only" gold records), would eventually make them
$15 million dollars? Esp. w/o publishing rights? E-40?
>That's in the pocket playa. They're REALLY ballaz.
>
(throwing down laptop) Fuck this computer shit. I've gotta make some phone
calls.
>I applied for a job a Rawkus. they got ALOT more money than you think.
>One of the prerequisites for the job was having a LAW degree.
>
Was the job "lawyer"? :)
>Becuz ICP is as studio as it gets. I'd kick one of those hoe-azz
>marshmellow muthafuckaz' ass if I saw them in REAL-life.
> Show them punks how REAL it its.
>
ICP cannot be taken seriously, they're a parody, like Weird Al or Harlem
World.
>Just like Nas is a poseur IMHO, and i caint listen to his music.
>You can feel the fraud in it.
I can't listen to his music because it's not very good.
>How much your album sells is usually related more to your label's
>marketing and the content of the record, not the context of the record.
>
Exhibit A: Big Willie Style
Exhibit B: The Slim Shady LP
>
>
>> including the careers of the other
>> Geto Boys (and even the group Geto Boys, with a whooping 250,000 in
>> sales on their last LP),
>
There are only two Geto Boys (DMG?), and 250,000 in sales is a nice chunk of
change for what sounded like two weeks' work. This is a key to No Limit's
success. Snoop said it took 6 weeks to make No Limit Top Dogg, and said it
as if it were a long time. How long did we wait for "DoggyStyle"??
If you're independent and can crank out a "No Limit Presents Who You Wit" in
less than a week and sell 50-60,000 copies at $8 a pop, you have made a fat
knot that week. More than what most of us made last year. This might have
had something to do with Death Row's eventual demise, because their records
were so far apart. There's no need to build up excitement for a record when
you've got 12-year old white kids who'll buy every No Limit record so they
can tell their buddies that they're a real nigga cause they got all the
records in all the pretty colors. Yeah, you can find several copies of
"Mean Green" or "Magic" at any used record store right now, but the money's
made.
>Speaking of which, Willie D's new solo lp is bout to drop.
>Ive heard some of it and the production is top-notch, and I luv to hear
>Willie Dennis kick the REAL, he puts that 5th ward attitude al up in
>your face.
Did you hear D at the Reggie Johnson fight? Roy Jones is out of people to
box. Roy, fight Holyfield, get that $25 million, and retire. And quit
fighting them pit bulls.
>willie d is one of my favorite hip-hop personalities becuz
>he keeps it real on all fronts. His radio show, 'Reality check' used to
>be the best thang on. He put senators, doctors, industry execs, prison
>officials, etc. on the air and made them answer REAL questions.
>
"Reality Check" was the shit cause D would play some 5th Ward Boys, Robert
Plant, and Sheryl Crow back to back. Whenever I put on 97.9 and wondered if
they changed formats, I knew that D was on the air. This is why he didn't
last on corporate radio. Okay, and the jail sentence.
>plus, he knocked Melle Mel out in the only hip-hop boxing tournament.
>Put them gunz own his azz H-town style.
>
You are bringing back all kinds of memories.
>
>That's becuz like I said, Cube is old. hip-hop is mostly listened to by
>KIDZ.(12-21 year olds) This is a different peer group than he grew up
>with.
>
Cube's not *old*, he's just not mad anymore. Cube made his greatest records
after he got fucked over by society, (NWA), Ruthless (Amerikka...) and by
the media (Death Certificate). Now they've embraced him, he's making movies
w/George Clooney, etc. Now he wants his face on your thermos. I hate to
wish anguish on a guy, but if something bad happens to Cube, a damn good
record will come out of it.
>its the same reason kari orr couldnt feel EPMD like I could becuz he's a
>lil younger than i am and missed their heighday.
>when the first EPMD lp dropped I was 18, and believe me, I saw a concert
>tour at the 'Main Event' in Houston with MC Lyte and Too $hort that was
>completely off the hook.
>
EPMD had us all banging that beat on cafeteria tables. I even bought that
Steve Miller record.
Man, you just brought back "The Main Event". I almost wanna say I remember
that show. I saw Andre Ware at the Main Event with bitches all over him. I
think he plays for Scotland now. Same thing, but to a lesser extent.
>
>Rap ages in dog years and erebody's only got 15 minutes of fame.
>Becuz i'm waitin for the day tat all these 'abstract poets' get off
>their high horses and complex rhyme flows and realize hip-hop is Our
>common ground.
>
If they got off those horses, then they wouldn't be abstract no more. Some
people are happy in their own little box.
>Becuz I can rememba a day when Afrocentricism was the main thrust of
>hip-hop, and people thought that would neva change, 'til Cube came out
>and said, "...I'm sick of that shit! listen to the hit!!!..."
>
Cube was sick of niggas dancing in the videos. The next line was "And one
thing I hate to see are the brothers/on a video trying to outdance each
other".
"Im'a tell t-bone to pass the barrel/and don't let me hear shit about a role
model/It ain't wise to chastise and preach just (...) the words of
each/cause laws are made to be broken up/what a nigga need to do is start
loc'in up/and build, mold & fold/theyself in the shape/of the nigga you love
to hate"
Sorry, once I get started...Damn, I'm gonna have to pull out that record
now. That, and Da Lench Mob, almost a West Coast Public Enemy of sorts.
It's odd, cause Cube kinda busts a move in that Mack 10 joint.
GW
OHHLA Webmaster: 'Flash'
says...
> >'...its automatic like the nine
> > bustin' funny lines on them hoez at all times!'
> > --Fat Pat
>
> What happened to that "promoter" that fatally wounded FP? Did they slow
> down his verse so it would fit in 25 Lighters, or was it intended for that
> record? It's been over two years, how did he get on that Lil' Troy record?
> It was that same little brother mentioned above that told *me* that Troy's
> been around as long as J Prince.
Wait wait wait..
Are you tellin me that that Fat Pat from "25 Lighters" is *dead*???
Who the heck was that in the video? Did they get a body double?
I've never seen Duke before, so I assumed that was him!
--
"Feel the beauty of futility served with arsenic cookies" --> El-P
"If you don't own the master, then the master own you..." --> Chuck D
Steve 'Flash' Juon --> contact dj.f...@pobox.com for e-mail
Hip-Hop Lyrics Archive --> http://www.OHHLA.com/index.htm
Suite 101's Hip-Hop --> http://suite101.com/welcome.cfm/116
(coming soon!) --> http://www.Tame-One.com
end22
news:92904472...@news.remarQ.com...
>
> OT wrote in message <7jmjgi$ud6$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>...
>
> >
> >100,000 copies is *ALOT* for a small indie label. when you are
> >independent you get close to $5 an album sale, that translates to
> >$500,000.
Yeah look what happened when Rodney O and Joe Cooley came out with "Ready to
Roll" They made like $6 mil off of the single and album.
> >
>
> Thanks for making my point. A while back some Real Hip-Hop (tm) person
> wrote complaining that De La only went gold. *Only* sold half a million
> records. If they're pissed cause they sold 500,000 copies of their most
> unremarkable record, then they need to renegotiate their deal and/or get
> back with Prince Paul.
Well De La didn't see much money off of that because they were still signed
to Tommy Boy. I think the album is Stakes is High that went gold. Now that
they are indie, they may have a chance to make some loot if the young heads
will feel them.
>
> I have a hard time calling Too $hort a gangsta rapper. Short made what
old
> folks used to call "party" records, not unlike Redd Foxx or Rudy Ray
Moore.
>
I would have to agree with you. Also, does anyone notice how funny Eazy E,
NWA and the DOC's first album were?
> >Gangsta rap is a label created by the mainstream hip-hop media to apply
> >to artists that they do not like. This is true becuz the term is
> >applied to some artists and not others who rap with the same content and
> >context of the 'so-called' gangsta rappers.
> >
> >Take Jay-Z, Nas or MOP for instance.
The term Gangsta rap has been misused by the mainstram just as the term
rapper. Hell they call TLC and Next rappers.
> >
> >Most of the 'gangsta rap' music that I listen to never really talks
> >about the actual act of killing people, they just reference whut
> >would/could happen if you fuck with the wrong person.
> >
>
> "The wrong person" being themselves, usually. Most of today's G-rap
doesn't
> talk about the actual act, possibly because of what happened to that guy
> whose lyrics were submitted as evidence against him. (C-Bo?)
I think the fact that most of the OG rappers are now married with kids and
have millions in their pockets that has changed the course of G-Rap. Also
their were only a handful of extremist G-Rappers out there. Mostly it was
all about the hustle.
> >Most g-rap to me is metaphorical--
> >The references are used to build rhymes, just like all the 'true school'
> > hip-hop artists use gems and %5 references, when most of them arent
> >righteous.
Exactly. I personally think that most music that comes from out west,
especially the bay area is musical and metephorical as it relates to life in
the neighborhood. Unlike back east where there a large religious movements
and every other rapper it seems is a 5 percenter or part of some other
Islamic faction, most cats out here are just hustling and trying to survive.
I don't know if its the weather, but we like to chill, eat and boogie. Our
thought process generally doesn't get too complex. Thus that might be the
reason for our somewhat simplistic rhyme subjects.
> >That's becuz REAL gangsta rap (i.e. rap made by REAL gangstaz) is mostly
> >underground and its not made for sales its made to be banged in trunks
> >on the streets.
Kinda like the Blood and Crip albums, banging on wax. That was some real
ish there!
> >>Replaying or sampling Parliament
> >became
> >> an overused staple after "The Chronic".
> >
> >This is another factor that folks who really arent into the genre dont
> >overstand.
> >
> >Parliament samples didnt start being overused after 'The Chronic'
> >Erebody on the westcoast was overusing them.
> >But that's becuz P-funk was REALLY popular in Cali.
Actually funk has always and will always be popular in Cali. It is our
regional music of choice, like DC and Go Go or Louisiana and Bounce music.
Man when you go to a spot out here and Bad Azz comes on niggas lose they
mind.
>
> It was overused once Erick Sermon got his hands on it.
>
> >It's sort of like how erebody on the eastcoast was overusing James Brown
> >samples in the late eighties.
> >
>
> Yep. If you had "James Brown's Funky People Vols 1-2" you had the source
> of almost every rap record from the mid to late eighties. I want to say
> this stopped with Paul's Boutique, but I need to think that through.
I think that New York and the East generally try to change thier genre and
never really brand one style of music. Call it innovation or Boredom.
Personally I think most of the stuff out there now sounds like West Coast
stuff. Especially Ruff Ryders tracks with all of the Synthesizers and
stuff.
> >Plus, IMHO, music from the South is made from a different perspective
> >than other places. People make music to get the club krunk/trunks
> >humming FIRST...then they sell it if its popular.
> >
Been down south a lot and I agree. It has to get the club krunk first, then
it gets on the radio.
> It's funny, cause this is exactly how it used to be on the other coasts.
>
> >There's not alot of 'pre-packaged' hip-hop in the South becuz all the
> >major labels are in other places and whites folks down this way for the
> >most part aint really tryin to hear no rappin'.
> >
>
Also, the south is not a major market like LA or NY. In major markets,
everything is controlled by big corporations, thus the abundance of
prepackaged radio formats, etc. I remeber back in like '88 when people
would listen to Kiss FM and they would play R&B, Rock, Pop and some Rap.
You can't find an ecletic mix on radio anymore.
> And when you do try and "pre-package" it, it never works. See that last
> Geto Boys album. It's clear that they were just picking up a check for
that
> one. Or that "My Homiez" garbage.
>
Didn't My homies went go Platinum?
> >> With Biggie it all changed...
> >
> >That's becuz he stole 2pac's style.
> >
>
> I've read this several times, but I cannot hear the Pac/Biggie
similarities,
> other than the long 'e' that Tupac overused. (wEEd, murder mEEEE,
> hennessEE, enemEE)
>
Agreed. I think DMX stole Pac's style more than anyone in recent memory.
> >But you're also forgetting the business aspect of this whole thang.
> >Cash Money, Sick-Wid-It, No Limit, Sauve House, etc. all signed major
> >distribution deals with CASH signing bonuses in the MILLIONS.
> >
>
> Are these "bonuses" or "advances"? I don't know about any of the above
> deals, but whenever I read about the Bad Boy deal w/Arista, they use terms
> like "advance", "Line of credit", etc.
That's because they are advances based upon product delivery. When Cash
money puts out a cut, then they get money for promotion, video, etc.
> >They're ALREADY rich 4REAL. Plus they were already rich from selling
> >out the trunk before they went major. How do you think Master P got so
> >rich???
P used his dope money to buy hot songs from down south and remake them.
Like how he bought Young Bleed's clik's "How You Do That There?" and gave
bleed and 'em a distribution deal.
> >Cash Money signed a $30 million deal, of which they got a *HUGE*
> >signing bonus. Tony draper got a $15 million sign-on bonus when he
> >signed Sauve House to Universal, E-40's was something like $17 million.
> >
>
> I do not understand this. How and/or when will Universal profit from
this?
> I don't understand music industry accounting, but who at Uni thought 8ball
&
> MJG, South Circle, etc. ("only" gold records), would eventually make them
> $15 million dollars? Esp. w/o publishing rights? E-40?
>
The bonus is usally aroung $500K to $1 mil and publishing rights are forked
over or split. Most of these deals are a way to sign the artist.
> (throwing down laptop) Fuck this computer shit. I've gotta make some
phone
> calls.
>
> >I applied for a job a Rawkus. they got ALOT more money than you think.
> >One of the prerequisites for the job was having a LAW degree.
> >
>
> Was the job "lawyer"? :)
Yeah Rawkus got a deal with Priority and they are really capitalizing on the
whole "underground" scene. In 5 years they will be just like the rest of
the majors. Its amazing how the rich get richer. Those white boys got
fronted dough by their dads to start the label. Now look,
multi-millionaires.
> >Just like Nas is a poseur IMHO, and i caint listen to his music.
> >You can feel the fraud in it.
>
> I can't listen to his music because it's not very good.
Glad I'm not alone in the world in this opinion. This new album is wacked!
> >How much your album sells is usually related more to your label's
> >marketing and the content of the record, not the context of the record.
> >
>
> Exhibit A: Big Willie Style
> Exhibit B: The Slim Shady LP
>
Ah but what about the failures...Vanilla Ice's 2nd album, MC Lyte, Queen
Latifah, Warren G's 2nd joint. All poised for Platinum plaqued, but only
got wood.
Garth Brooks actually started the trend of releasing product back to back.
5 years ago it was common practice for an artist to make an album and
promote and tour for 2 years. Now since people don't really tour and the
majors don't really cultivate artists anymore product is released more
frequently to keep the act hot. THat's why people come in for 2 years and
then disappear.
> >
> >That's becuz like I said, Cube is old. hip-hop is mostly listened to by
> >KIDZ.(12-21 year olds) This is a different peer group than he grew up
> >with.
> >
I agree and the beats have to adapt to the new standards. Why do you think
Slick Rick is selling like crazy. Same old flow, new and improved beats.
Cube proved that beats make you when he released we be clubbin!
> >Rap ages in dog years and erebody's only got 15 minutes of fame.
> >Becuz i'm waitin for the day tat all these 'abstract poets' get off
> >their high horses and complex rhyme flows and realize hip-hop is Our
> >common ground.
> >
The "abstract" movement is like straight ahead vs. smooth jazz. Some say
that jazz has evolved to the Kenny G state while others call themsleves
purists and say it destroys the art. I think that beauty is in the eye of
the beholder.
> If they got off those horses, then they wouldn't be abstract no more.
Some
> people are happy in their own little box.
I marketing, we call this niches. The indie, "underground" scene is a niche
like any other market. Rawkus and Fat beats are exploiting it just like Def
Jam is exploiting the mainstream.
--
e
Greg "Chip" Wilson
OHHLA Webmaster: 'Flash' <dj.flas...@pobox.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.11c9f0d64...@news.earthlink.net...> Wait wait wait..
>
> Are you tellin me that that Fat Pat from "25 Lighters" is *dead*???
> Who the heck was that in the video? Did they get a body double?
> I've never seen Duke before, so I assumed that was him!
>
In the "25 Lighters" video, (is there two?) there's a scene with a guy on a
tv screen, doing his verse in a studio. That's Fat Pat.
GW
Steve S. Jackson
: In article <7j96jg$khe$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
: Spirit <Alan...@aol.com> wrote:
:
: >I was
: > predicting the commercial decline of gangsta rap a while back and
: > everyone thought I was a little crazy.
:
:
: You still are. You havent read a Billboard lately have you?
: Mr. Serv-On knocked Lauryn Hill outta the number one spot on his debut.
: No limit has at least 8 lps in the billboard top 200.
Was this recently? If Mr. Serv-On has a recent No Limit release, someone
tell me what it's like. I think I woulda liked his last if everyone and
they mama from No Limit weren't on EVERY OTHER FREAKIN' SONG. I can deal
with Mystical and Miz X and maybe even P, but God, someone keep Silkk the
Shocker away from.
:
: NWA were the first STUDIO GANGSTAZ. that's the difference.
:
: The Geto Boys had 3 lps out locally before 'We Caint be stopped'
And somehow, 2 of them made their way up to Philly around the time of WE
Can't Be Stopped. I remember looking for that lp in 10th grade in '92
and I saw something else and the copyright was like '89 and I was like
what? They had stuff out before. This was when "My Mind's Playing
Tricks on Me" was my song (and still is...that guitar lick is butta)
:
: > This all brings up the question: what is gangsta rap?
:
:
: Gangsta rap is a label created by the mainstream hip-hop media to apply
: to artists that they do not like. This is true becuz the term is
: applied to some artists and not others who rap with the same content and
: context of the 'so-called' gangsta rappers.
:
: Take Jay-Z, Nas or MOP for instance.
I think in more recent history, East Coast gangsta rap is classified as
thug rap. Even though that term didn't even originate in this region. I
find it difficult to call Jay-Z a thug or a gangsta. Nas is like...
neither. MOP is cool for sheer imagery, violence, and nice Primo stuff.
I can't front, if I thought MOp had some type of substance I'd buy their
lp. I've enjoyed all of their singles though. Always been a fan of
Jay-Z. Nas...*grumble*...
:
: Acually from my experience the worst gang affiliated areas of the
: country TODAY are Chicago and the small towns thru out the South, like
: in Arkansas, Oklahoma, Texas (especially Dallas/Ft.Worth), Kentucky,
: Ohio, etc.
Chicago is notrious for it's gangs...both minorty and white. Places
like Little Rock, Memphis, and even Pittsburgh adopted some of the
Cali-style gangs and then probably just branced off into their own
thang.
What's weird is that NY and all up and down the East Coast...there were
mad minority gangs in the 70s and 80s. What happened to them? Were they
all infiltrated by police and taken down or did they just disband in
favor of something better?
:
: Most g-rap to me is metaphorical--
: The references are used to build rhymes, just like all the 'true school'
: hip-hop artists use gems and %5 references, when most of them arent
: righteous.
F'real...
: Take Houston for instance. There are plenty of people out on the grind,
: but Houston isnt full of gangs. (except in the latino neighborhoods)
This always seems to be the case. Philly doesn't really have gangs
except in the Latino neighborhoods.
: But this is the same thang that happens when artists like GooDiemob are
: misinterpreted. Just like I said a long time ago...erebody's sang'n
: bout 'dem bananas & mayonaise' but hardly nobody knows whut the fuck
: they REALLY talkin bout.
true dat... when I heard that I was like what? I'm still not sure what
that's all about.
:
: > I mean, if two rappers were battling and one
: > called the other a "slob", not many people outside the gang lifestyle
: > (or Southern Cali) would understand any significance beyond "you have
: a
: > poorly kept appearance".
:
: Or if I called you a 'crab' or a 'creep'
even so, aren't somethings universally accepted as disses...I mean if i
called anyone a "crackhead" or told them they was on crack, they'd take
it as a diss, but (and I don't know if this is a Philly thing or not) you
kinda get more of a feel for it here
:
: >Replaying or sampling Parliament
: became
: > an overused staple after "The Chronic".
:
: This is another factor that folks who really arent into the genre dont
: overstand.
:
: Parliament samples didnt start being overused after 'The Chronic'
: Erebody on the westcoast was overusing them.
: But that's becuz P-funk was REALLY popular in Cali.
I've always wondered why this was... are Parliament from Cali or did they
just make an impression there?
:
: It's sort of like how erebody on the eastcoast was overusing James Brown
: samples in the late eighties.
:
True this...
:
: People in the South always supported people from the South when nobody
: else on either coast did. We developed our own scene.
: that's why the music sells...not becuz the media decided it.
How 'bout now? I mean I know Eightball and MJG, No Limit, Rap-A-Lot,
Suave House, etc. had mad support below the Mason-Dixon Line before
Southern Rappers and beats were "in." But f'real, do you think that
they'd have gotten mad play around the country if some media types
weren't like look, if they big in the South, maybe they'll blow up all
over.
:
: Plus, IMHO, music from the South is made from a different perspective
: than other places. People make music to get the club krunk/trunks
: humming FIRST...then they sell it if its popular.
That's interesting. I've always wonderd about this. It's part of the
regional differences in this country amongst our own cultures.
:
: There's not alot of 'pre-packaged' hip-hop in the South becuz all the
: major labels are in other places and whites folks down this way for the
: most part aint really tryin to hear no rappin'.
:
that's interesting, too. I would think that that maybe because
interaction between the races and various cultures isn't forced upon you
as it is here.
: :
: > With Biggie it all changed...
:
: That's becuz he stole 2pac's style.
This should generate alot of responses
:
: That's pretty high for a record. #63 in THE WORLD.
: Most 'abstract' hip-hop doesnt even make the charts.
Who's abstract now?
:
: I just saw Mr. Prince and the Rap-A-Lot Mafia at 'The Pheonix' (probably
: the biggest nitespot in Houston) and they were all draped up and
: dripped out playa, ridin' in a superstretch big-body Benz limo.
:
: They also performed at a basketball tournamnet near my house and pulled
: up in a stretch Hummer.
:
But you ain't nuthin' 'til you pull up in a stretch Naviagator. Yo,
these local cats, the Cauz had a record signing in a local store and they
rolled through in a stretch Nav... mind you, they only have a single out
and they're lp is probably still some weeks away.
: >Soundbombing is at 16 on the R&B
: >charts
: > (in its second week) and we know Rawkus is hardly about to knock Def
: Jam
: > off its commercial throne...
:
: I applied for a job a Rawkus. they got ALOT more money than you think.
: One of the prerequisites for the job was having a LAW degree.
Isn't Rawkus somehow affiliated with Rupert Murdoch somehow?
: > Insane Clown Posse somehow debuted at 4 on the Pop Charts. DMX is
: doing
: > well. The epicenter of gangsta rap has apparently shifted eastward.
:
: That's becuz 'gangsta rap' now is mostly performed
: only by STUDIO GANGSTAZ.
: you have to be able to decypher the difference.
ICP aren't even studio gangstaz. They're just some white kids trying to
be funny and it's not working.
:
: Becuz ICP is as studio as it gets. I'd kick one of those hoe-azz
: marshmellow muthafuckaz' ass if I saw them in REAL-life.
: Show them punks how REAL it its.
I could take them, and I'm not even a violent person.
:
: Just like Nas is a poseur IMHO, and i caint listen to his music.
: You can feel the fraud in it.
: He was alot betta when he was Halftime, aka Nasty Nas.
you'll get no argument from me...
:
: its the same reason kari orr couldnt feel EPMD like I could becuz he's a
: lil younger than i am and missed their heighday.
: when the first EPMD lp dropped I was 18, and believe me, I saw a concert
: tour at the 'Main Event' in Houston with MC Lyte and Too $hort that was
: completely off the hook.
Kari's about my age, isn't he? I was feelin' EPMD back the day. i was a
youn'un but I was still diggin' them.
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OT
Fat Pat got killed about two years ago. He's like the 2Pac of the
South.
Seriously...he is an underground legend and literally has probably 100
songs floating around on screw tapes.
Flash...the dude in the video is Lil KeKe (the dark-skinned dude with
the chain, piece, and Versace shades) DJ DMD is the dude in the
glasses.
You didnt think they were calling Fat Pat 'Fat' becuz he's a lil dude
like KeKe did you???
They just show KeKe at times rapping Fat Pat's part of the track.
Fat Pat is on the tv screen rapping with the headphones on.
Stay UP!
OT
r.i.p. FatPat
OHHLA Webmaster: 'Flash'
> Fat Pat got killed about two years ago. He's like the 2Pac of the
> South.
I obviously need to be schooled. Before this song, I didn't even know
about any of his ish. He seems pretty tyte on this song though. It's
a shame he got murdered. :(
> Seriously...he is an underground legend and literally has probably 100
> songs floating around on screw tapes.
He's on DJ Skrew tapes? Does he have tapes of his own though?
> Flash...the dude in the video is Lil KeKe (the dark-skinned dude with
> the chain, piece, and Versace shades) DJ DMD is the dude in the
> glasses.
Check.
> You didnt think they were calling Fat Pat 'Fat' becuz he's a lil dude
> like KeKe did you???
Well, Fatboy said he's not really "fat".. I didn't make any assumptions.
I agree, on the surface though, it didn't make much sense.
> They just show KeKe at times rapping Fat Pat's part of the track.
> Fat Pat is on the tv screen rapping with the headphones on.
Check. Let me know if Fat Pat has any full length albums and what label.
I'd like to know as much about this guy as I can find out. What led to
his death anyway? Was it a street thing, or a Roger Troutman type thing?
Peace, Flash
R.I.P.: Scott LaRock, Cowboy, Tupac Shakur, Christopher (B.I.G.) Wallace,
Big L, Freaky Tah, Seagram, Fat Pat, Duke (Psycho Realm), Hood, and all
people who have lost their lives to senseless violence anywhere.
OT
dj.flas...@pobox.com (OHHLA Webmaster: 'Flash') wrote:
> In article <7jrnpg$noe$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>, over...@ev1.net says...
> > Fat Pat got killed about two years ago. He's like the 2Pac of the
> > South.
>
> I obviously need to be schooled. Before this song, I didn't even know
> about any of his ish. He seems pretty tyte on this song though. It's
> a shame he got murdered. :(
>
> > Seriously...he is an underground legend and literally has probably 100
> > songs floating around on screw tapes.
>
Fat Pat has two full length lp's.
'Ghetto Dreams' (an all-time classic in my book, probably one of my top
five favorite albums) &
'Throwed in the Game' his last record madHe's on Wreckshop Records,
with ESG and that gang.
Pat also appears on a number of screw tapes and cameo appearances on damn
near erebody's records from Houston, like the Botany Boys. (Another one
of my all-time favorite groups that should have national acclaim but
nobody outside the South really knows about)
Fat Pat has the killa flow mane. And most of his work is pretty much all
freestyle, like lil KeKe.
> I'd like to know as much about this guy as I can find out. What led to
> his death anyway? Was it a street thing, or a Roger Troutman type thing?
>
> Peace, Flash
Pat got shot by one of his 'promoters' at an apartment complex in
Houston.
Yall must not read my posts all the time...i made a post about Fat Pat
last year some time, and at the time of the shooting.
Stay UP!!
OT
H E N R i . C O M
>>Look at Kool G. Rap, he's one of the origina; Gangster
>>rappers, especially from the East Coast, and he's better than he's ever
>>been lyrically. But, his album hasn't sold a fuckin' unit
>
>I mean, he's on his own label ain't he? It's hard being indie. If he was on
>MCA, he'd prolly be selling big. Or, imagine G Rap on Def Jam? Sheeeeit. Back
>in the day, he had to go through Cold Chillin and Warner Bros. Cold Chillin
>seemingly had no idea how to market and WB definitely didn't know shit about
>rap. I hear "4, 5, 6" debuted well, bit fell off quickly....hmmmm.
>
>Peace,
>
I don't think that G Rap has enough flairt to be on Def Jam.
All the artists that they have signed right now are all of the Jigged
out - much flair type. No underground cats. Kinda like a Rockafella.
How do yoy market G rap? Older cat into underground killing type.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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One4all: CHUO 89.1FM Monday 22.30 to 24.00
Haitian Sensation aka MR. Oktober, baptized Henri
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Spirit68
>All the artists that they have signed right now are all of the Jigged
>out
Ja Rule is "jigged out"? DMX is "jigged out"? Don't make such
overgeneralizations, my man. G Rap could do fine on Def Jam, trust me. They
have a good markleting machine at Def Jam for East Coast hardcore rappers. I am
willing to bet my house that they could get G Rap a gold record. A lot of
hardcore cats respect G Rap, so he'd easily get plenty of guest stars and with
a Def Jam-sized budget, he could afford the best producers in the biz. It would
be a can't miss hit IMO.
OHHLA Webmaster: 'Flash'
> Fat Pat has two full length lp's.
>
> 'Ghetto Dreams' (an all-time classic in my book, probably one of my top
> five favorite albums) &
> 'Throwed in the Game' his last record madHe's on Wreckshop Records,
> with ESG and that gang.
I'll have to look for _Ghetto Dreams_ now. Thanks for the tip!
> Fat Pat has the killa flow mane. And most of his work is pretty much all
> freestyle, like lil KeKe.
His flow on "25 Lighters" was what sold me. He's real smoothed out.
Or I should say, was.. :(
> Pat got shot by one of his 'promoters' at an apartment complex in
> Houston.
> Yall must not read my posts all the time...i made a post about Fat Pat
> last year some time, and at the time of the shooting.
Actually that does sort of ring a bell, but at the time I don't think
I knew who Fat Pat was. I'm sorry I slept on him. :(
Peace, Flash
emda...@my-deja.com
emDASH
In article <29908-37...@newsd-162.iap.bryant.webtv.net>,
Legonda...@webtv.net (GoldenChild) wrote:
> Well, the thing is, you can't just be one thing anymore. You have to
be
> able to play all the different roles, the Gangster, the Playa, the
> Prophet, the God, the Pimp, ect. And it's all about how well your shit
> is marketed. Look at Kool G. Rap, he's one of the origina; Gangster
> rappers, especially from the East Coast, and he's better than he's
ever