National Steel guitars
Linda Berris
I would like to start looking around for a National Steel (an old one,
not one of the "new" re-issues). My questions are:
(1) Are there "old" ones to be had, and does anyone have
suggestions about the best way to find one (i.e. stores vs.
?)
(2) Are there different models, and what might be the pros and
cons of each (I currently play a Martin D16M with a fast
neck and low action).
(2) What kind of price range can I expect to be quoted?
(3) What kind of price range should I expect to pay?!
Thanks for any information you can share!
Linda Berris
Bo Parker
In article <32207D...@ntsource.com>, Linda Berris
<ber...@ntsource.com> wrote:
> I would like to start looking around for a National Steel (an old one,
> not one of the "new" re-issues). My questions are:
>
> (1) Are there "old" ones to be had, and does anyone have
> suggestions about the best way to find one (i.e. stores vs.
> ?)
Yes, they're around. You can find them at Mandolin Bros., Elderly
Instruments, or other vintage guitar stores.
> (2) Are there different models, and what might be the pros and
> cons of each (I currently play a Martin D16M with a fast
> neck and low action).
There's the Style 0, which has a single resonator, nickel-plated brass
body with sand-blasted Hawaiian scenes. Fairly sweet-sounding, relatively
speaking. There's also the Duolian, which has a steel body and is much
more raucous sounding. There are also some three-resonator models (I don't
know the model designations, though). I think all of these were available
in either round neck or square neck models (for lap-style playing). All
the ones I've ever seen definitely did _not_ have fast necks or low
action.
> (2) What kind of price range can I expect to be quoted?
>
> (3) What kind of price range should I expect to pay?!
I sold my 1930 Style 0 for $2300 in 1994. Some are more, some are less.
Good luck
-Bo Parker
fbpa...@hiwaay.net
Paul J. Stamler
Linda Berris (ber...@ntsource.com) wrote:
: (1) Are there "old" ones to be had, and does anyone have
: suggestions about the best way to find one (i.e. stores vs.
They are out there; the music store I teach in sees 1-2 a year, and large
vintage instrument dealers such as Elderly, Mandolin Bros., etc. see a
lot of them.
: (2) Are there different models, and what might be the pros and
: cons of each (I currently play a Martin D16M with a fast
: neck and low action).
There were several models of single resonator instruments in the old
days, and several styles of the triple-cone instruments. There's way too
much information to list in a single post; instead, I suggest you get a
copy of Bob Brozman's definitive book on National Resonator Guitars,
which can be found at large dealers, or can be ordered from Elderly
Instruments and other sources. Elderly can be phoned at 517-372-7890;
punch 123 when you get the machine. As far as fast neck and low action,
most of the old instruments don't have it, but the action at least can be
lowered on some instruments by a good repair person. Mine is comparable
to the action of my Martin (which isn't all that low, admittedly).
: (2) What kind of price range can I expect to be quoted?
: (3) What kind of price range should I expect to pay?!
Unless you are extremely lucky and find something in a pawnshop or garage
sale, as I did, expect to pay a minimum of $2000 for a decent single-cone
instrument, and at least $3000 for a triple-cone (I'm talking
round-necked instruments here, not square-necked Hawaiian guitars). Sad
to say, the days of finding these in garage sales are pretty much over.
By the way, you might want to try out one of the new instruments before
you reject them completely. They may not have the cachet of the old ones,
but they sound damned good, and they have a more modern-feeling neck (I
like the old necks myself, but not everyone does).
Let me know how your search turns out.
Peace.
Paul
Ian Anderson
psta...@crl.com (Paul J. Stamler) wrote:
>Unless you are extremely lucky and find something in a pawnshop or garage
>sale, as I did, expect to pay a minimum of $2000 for a decent single-cone
>instrument, and at least $3000 for a triple-cone (I'm talking
>round-necked instruments here, not square-necked Hawaiian guitars). Sad
>to say, the days of finding these in garage sales are pretty much over.
Holy shit! Times *have* changed. I bought my first one off a
hairdresser's wall (!) for 5 pounds (about $7.50?) in 1965, and a Don
for 100 pounds in 1967. Sold the first for 50 pounds in 1968, and the
Don for 150 pounds in 1970. If only I knew then what I know now (and
hadn't been a starving musician in 1970!) Oh, and my pal Mike Cooper
bought his triple-resonator for about 5 pounds in the early '60s too,
but the wise man still owns it . . .
>By the way, you might want to try out one of the new instruments before
>you reject them completely. They may not have the cachet of the old ones,
>but they sound damned good, and they have a more modern-feeling neck (I
>like the old necks myself, but not everyone does).
I'll second that. I've certainly played some good ones which were
more playable than the vintage ones and sound equally good.
Ian Anderson
Folk Roots magazine
fro...@cityscape.co.uk
http://www.cityscape.co.uk/froots/
alijah's daddy
-> I would like to start looking around for a National Steel (an old one,
-> not one of the "new" re-issues). My questions are:
->
-> (1) Are there "old" ones to be had, and does anyone have
-> suggestions about the best way to find one (i.e. stores vs.
-> ?)
->
-> (2) Are there different models, and what might be the pros and
-> cons of each (I currently play a Martin D16M with a fast
-> neck and low action).
->
-> (2) What kind of price range can I expect to be quoted?
->
-> (3) What kind of price range should I expect to pay?!
->
-> Thanks for any information you can share!
->
-> Linda Berris
Hi Linda;
one additional note to the good advice you've already gotten in this thread:
check Vintage Guitar Magazine
It lists instruments for sale all over the country and it's not uncommon
to see several of the instruments already mentioned for a range of prices,
occasionally significantly lower than some of the prices quoted.
adr
Wayne Seymour
I concur that you should try the new ones. The new Nationals are
excellent as are the new Gibson Dobros (tm). Old ones cost about as much,
but are likely to need extensive renovation, neck resets, fret work, etc.
The new ones are solid as a rock and prioduce a great loud, funky sound.
Sherman Janes
Linda Berris <ber...@ntsource.com> wrote in article
<32207D...@ntsource.com>...
> I would like to start looking around for a National Steel (an old one,
> not one of the "new" re-issues). My questions are:
Why not a new National? They are great guitars. And their models
are very close the best years of the originals. They sound great
and play great. Are great. I have one and love it. And if it walks
off or something when I'm tooling around, I can replace it.
>
> (1) Are there "old" ones to be had, and does anyone have
> suggestions about the best way to find one (i.e. stores vs.
> ?)
Looking, lots of looking. But your local vintage dealer will have a
network of other dealers he can trade with. Often you pay a
little more through a dealer but generally for a vintage guitar the
help is worth it. And there may be no other way to find a quality
original in a reasonable time frame, say a year. Ok some of
the lesser originals can be had quickly, but is that what ya wont?
For an idea of what's out there try some of the web listed dealers
http://www.elderly.com Usually has several nationals listed. But the
nice ones go quick and are probably never listed. Lets face it
vintage nationals go quick.
>
> (2) Are there different models, and what might be the pros and
> cons of each (I currently play a Martin D16M with a fast
> neck and low action).
There are lots of models and they all very by date. I suggest getting
Bob Brozman's book on National guitars. If you are going to buy a
vintage national read this book. There are also a few websites on
Nationals. But with the amount a vintage national costs the $35 for the
book is a very good investment. Also the book is great reading.
try http://www.amug.org/~necro/clay/national.html
>
> (2) What kind of price range can I expect to be quoted?
That depends on the model. If your looking for a tricone or a Style-O
it can range from 2K to 12K, with an average from 4 to 8K.
One of the painted Nationals you can pick one up for as little as $800
but more common is $1,200 or so.
>
> (3) What kind of price range should I expect to pay?!
>
> Thanks for any information you can share!
>
> Linda Berris
>
--
----------------------------------------------------------------
Sherman Janes: sh...@ibeam.jf.intel.com
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Randy Knott
The new national cones are made to sound as close as possible
to just one of the many classic examples of of the "vintage" National
signature tones. I have to give them credit, they are very close to
that particular sound. I far prefer the sweeter fuller tone that many
of the old guitars had to the harsh abrasive tone of today.
Clint Briley
Lee Asnin
Linda Berris <ber...@ntsource.com> wrote:
>I would like to start looking around for a National Steel (an old one,
>not one of the "new" re-issues). My questions are:
> (1) Are there "old" ones to be had, and does anyone have
> suggestions about the best way to find one (i.e. stores vs.
> ?)
> (2) Are there different models, and what might be the pros and
> cons of each (I currently play a Martin D16M with a fast
> neck and low action).
> (2) What kind of price range can I expect to be quoted?
> (3) What kind of price range should I expect to pay?!
>Thanks for any information you can share!
>Linda Berris
My advice:
#1) Check out Bob Brozman's book, "The History and Artistry of
National Resonator Instruments." A MUST for any serious inquiry into
these wonderful instruments.
#2) True, both Dobro brand and the new National Reso-Phonic Guitar
company are putting out some fine looking, playing and sounding
instruments!
#3). Now in my subjective, humble opinion, after playing and listening
to country blues for 25 years, if you want "the" sound, get an
original vintage National. To my ear, the old Nationals have that
funky blues sound, that I do not "hear," subjectively
speaking/listening, in the newer models. It's a quality difficult to
describe with words, you have to hear it. Obviously, materials and
construction methodologies were different 65 years ago. The materials
and procedures used to produce the cones were different 65 years ago.
This is the difference I "hear" when I listen to a vintage National
compared to a newer model.
However, the harsh realities, vintage Nationals are expensive, watch
out for neck problems, and make sure that what you purchase has the
original cone, or cones if tricone, intact. Price is a function of
both instrument condition as well as "collectability."
Finally, play some new National models, and then play some vintage
stuff. Let your ears decide. You may as well be happy with a new
model, but listen to both
Good luck,
Lee
------------------------------------------------------
Lee Asnin
las...@earthlink.net
Arvada, CO
"The seats on the train of progress all face backwards:
you can see the past but only guess about the future."
E. G. Boring
-------------------------------------------------------
RussSwanson
Dont be discouraged if you got to get an old one. They are still out
there. I found a 1929 Tri Cone a couple years ago by putting a "wanted"
ad in the local paper. Bought it and an old Martin Uke for $300.
The new ones sound good, you just may need to try a couple to find one
that pushes your button.
Russ
Chicago
Doug Wamble
Does anyone have any info about the "Triolian" model? What they're
worth,
and all that? Please e-mail me as my newsgroup access is limited.
Thanks...
Doug