REQ: Doc Watson Tuning on "Deep River Blues"
Steve & Caren Comeau
an arrangement where I capo on the 4th fret and start with a first position
C5 chord. However, I hear Doc play bass runs that go below the G# on the
capoed low E string.
My only guess is that I'm trying to figure out something in standard tuning
that Doc plays in an alternate tuning (e.g. Drop-D). Can anyone out there
give me some help or direction?
Thanks in advance,
Steve Comeau, notc...@erols.com
(delete the spam-avoidance word "not" from my address to reply)
---
*"Nothin' to tell now.
* Let the words be yours,
* I'm done with mine." - Barlow
yettoblaster
Hi S & C,
I believe its in standard tuning, in E, but starts
at the 5th position with a couple chords (2nd one
being diminished), first is an arpeggiated E at the
fifth fret (1st through fourth strings = 7576,
fingers =4132, respectively).
Great song. Doc's a National Treasure!
Happy pickin',
-steveY-
basile
>I'm figuring out Doc Watson's "Deep River Blues" by ear
>and I've worked out an arrangement where I capo on the
>4th fret and start with a first position C5 chord. However,
>I hear Doc play bass runs that go below the G# on the
>capoed low E string.
>
>My only guess is that I'm trying to figure out something
>in standard tuning that Doc plays in an alternate tuning
>(e.g. Drop-D). Can anyone out there give me some help or
>direction?
>
>Thanks in advance,
>
>Steve Comeau, notc...@erols.com
Yowwww! You're thinking too hard! Figure this: If he's playing bass notes
below a G#, you can rule out the capo. The song uses pretty common bluesy
licks found in the key of E, standard tuning. That should give you a clue.
The only thing that might give a guy pause in figuring out the tune is the
opening chord, fingered thusly (standard tuning, as previously mentioned):
E----7-----
B----5-----
G----7-----
D----6-----
A----x-----
E----0-----
Move that chord down one fret and you've got the second chord. The
syncopation looks like this:
E--7-----7--------|-6-----6---------|
B----5------------|---4-------------|
G-----(7)-----(7)-|----(6)-----(6)--|
D------6-------6--|-----5-------5---|
A-----------------|-----------------|
E--0-------0------|-0-------0-------|
Just play through the dissonance on the Eb (second) chord, that's what Doc
does... think rhythm and E, E, E.
Good luck! Figuring stuff out by ear can be challenging and frustrating but
it's really worth it in the long run.
Frank
--
"Skee dee boop n' bee dee bop, zee zaa zaa." - Blind Boy Fuller
HappyT
fingering is the same that Frank tabbed out, except that the B string is played
at the 5th, rather than 4th fret. In order to play it smoothly, slide your 3rd
and 4th fingers down one fret (from the 7th to the 6th frets) and reverse your
1st and 2nd fingers so they are both playing the 2nd and 4th strings, 5th fret.
Doc also frets the bass E string with his left hand thumb at the 7th fret for
the first chord (an E7), and 6th fret for the second one (E dim). He also
muffles the sound with the heel of his right hand, so the bass strings get that
"thumpy" sound. Takes practice, but the result is worth the effort. Have fun!
Happy Traum
Homespun Tapes
Mike Sinclair
to vary his material so you will find differences between recordings
over time, but they are all in the same tuning and key. I've seen him
perform this live about 25 to 30 times over the years and except for
one instance of capoing at the first it was open.
There are a couple of published transcriptions of DRB. One is in "The
Guitar of Doc Watson" by Fred Sokolow which is transcribed from the
1964 album Doc Watson which is an early form of Docs DRB. Another is in
"The Songs of Doc Watson" by Doc Watson and is as played during the
early seventies.
There is an instructional video called "Doc's Guitar - Fingerpicking &
Flatpicking" from Homespun Video done by Doc which includes DRB. The
version here is basically what Doc has played for the last 15 years or
so.
Mike Sinclair
Steve & Caren Comeau <notc...@erols.com> wrote in article
<6pd6g6$507$1...@winter.news.erols.com>...
> I'm figuring out Doc Watson's "Deep River Blues" by ear and I've
worked out
> an arrangement where I capo on the 4th fret and start with a first
position
> C5 chord. However, I hear Doc play bass runs that go below the G# on
the
> capoed low E string.
>
> My only guess is that I'm trying to figure out something in standard
tuning
> that Doc plays in an alternate tuning (e.g. Drop-D). Can anyone out
there
> give me some help or direction?
>
> Thanks in advance,
>
> Steve Comeau, notc...@erols.com
basile
>Doc has almost always played this in an open E tuning in E.
>Doc likes to vary his material so you will find differences
>between recordings over time, but they are all in the same
>tuning and key. I've seen him perform this live about 25 to
>30 times over the years and except for one instance of
>capoing at the first it was open.
Hi Mike,
Can you recommend a recording of Doc playing this in open E tuning? All the
examples I've heard from him of this song (admittedly not comprehensive in
the least) have (aurally) been played out of standard tuning in the key of
E. I'd be very interested in hearing how Doc adjusts the arrangement of
this tune for open E!
Thanks,
Bob Henson
>
> an arrangement where I capo on the 4th fret and start with a first position
> C5 chord. However, I hear Doc play bass runs that go below the G# on the
> capoed low E string.
>
> My only guess is that I'm trying to figure out something in standard tuning
> that Doc plays in an alternate tuning (e.g. Drop-D). Can anyone out there
> give me some help or direction?
>
> Thanks in advance,
>
> Steve Comeau, notc...@erols.com
> (delete the spam-avoidance word "not" from my address to reply)
> ---
> *"Nothin' to tell now.
> * Let the words be yours,
> * I'm done with mine." - Barlow
I haven't heard a recording of Doc Watson performing it. I do have an
instructional casette series (with tab) from Homespun Tapes. The
version there is in regular tuning in the key of E. The signature E7 at
the beginning of the tune is at the fifth position.
bas...@my-dejanews.com
> Doc uses a diminished position for the second
> chord in the sequence. The fingering is the
> same that Frank tabbed out,
<snip>
Actually, I just took a fresh look at the video clip (having transcribed from
memory) I have of Doc and the second chord _is_ Edim! Thanks for the tip!
> Doc also frets the bass E string with his left
> hand thumb at the 7th fret for the first chord
> (an E7), and 6th fret for the second one (E
> dim).
I personally haven't heard examples of Doc playing it this way but the
example I'm working from clearly does _not_ include fretting notes on the E
string with the thumb over this section. The performance I'm referring to
specifically is the b/w clip found on "Legends of Traditional Fingerstyle
Guitar", Vestapol 13004. The original tab I posted ends up being amended
like so:
E7 Edim
E----7------6---
B----5------5---
G----7------6---
D----6------5---
A----x------x---
E----0------0---
The tab (bass damped throughout):
E--7-----7--------|-6-----6---------|
B----5------------|---5-------------|
G-----(7)-----(7)-|----(6)-----(6)--|
D------6-------6--|-----5-------5---|
A-----------------|-----------------|
E--0-------0------|-0-------0-------|
Happy's alternative (bass damped throughout):
E--7-----7--------|-6-----6---------|
B----5------------|---5-------------|
G-----(7)-----(7)-|----(6)-----(6)--|
D------6-------6--|-----5-------5---|
A-----------------|-----------------|
E--7-------7------|-6-------6-------|
<snip>
> Takes practice, but the result
> is worth the effort. Have fun!
Yupsville!
Frank Basile
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basile
Traum on rec.music.folk. Read on...
HappyT wrote:
Yupsville!
Frank Basile
--
John L. Dunne
I misspent much of my youth at the Main Point in Bryn Mawr, Pa. and sat
at Docs' feet dozens of times ( stayed for both shows both nights or was
working there by then ) both while on stage and in the basement with
Merle. I've played the song with Doc and he was definitely in regular
tuning - so was I.....
I don't think it can be played in open E actually - just pulled out my
guitar and couldn't make it work right.
John Dunne
ps - I've also got great Joni Mitchell stories and don't even get me
started on Jerry Jeff..... dropping names and going low....... jd
Mike Sinclair wrote:
>
> Doc has almost always played this in an open E tuning in E. Doc likes
> to vary his material so you will find differences between recordings
> over time, but they are all in the same tuning and key. I've seen him
> perform this live about 25 to 30 times over the years and except for
> one instance of capoing at the first it was open.
>
> There are a couple of published transcriptions of DRB. One is in "The
> Guitar of Doc Watson" by Fred Sokolow which is transcribed from the
> 1964 album Doc Watson which is an early form of Docs DRB. Another is in
> "The Songs of Doc Watson" by Doc Watson and is as played during the
> early seventies.
>
> There is an instructional video called "Doc's Guitar - Fingerpicking &
> Flatpicking" from Homespun Video done by Doc which includes DRB. The
> version here is basically what Doc has played for the last 15 years or
> so.
>
> Mike Sinclair
>
> Steve & Caren Comeau <notc...@erols.com> wrote in article
> <6pd6g6$507$1...@winter.news.erols.com>...
George C. Kaschner
John L. Dunne wrote:
> ps - I've also got great Joni Mitchell stories and don't even get me
> started on Jerry Jeff..... dropping names and going low....... jd
Hey John,
Great to have you here. I for one welcome interesting name-dropping stories
if they are meant to entertain or illuminate. It's just the chest-puffy ones
that get old fast.
Anyhow... Just wondering whether any of your Jerry Jeff Walker stories might
include David Bromberg - one of my influences in my former life.
Go for the tone,
George
Wade Ramey
<nos...@trash.com> wrote:
> Doc has almost always played this in an open E tuning in E. Doc likes
> to vary his material so you will find differences between recordings
> over time, but they are all in the same tuning and key. I've seen him
> perform this live about 25 to 30 times over the years and except for
> one instance of capoing at the first it was open.
He doesn't play it in an open tuning. He plays it in standard tuning.
Whether he uses a capo or not has nothing to do with whether an open
tuning is used.
Doc rarely uses an open tuning.
Wade
gne...@mbox5.singnet.com.sg
ra...@math.msu.edu (Wade Ramey) wrote:
> He doesn't play it in an open tuning. He plays it in standard tuning.
> Whether he uses a capo or not has nothing to do with whether an open
> tuning is used.
>
> Doc rarely uses an open tuning.
>
> Wade
As far as I can figure out, on Doc's first Vanguard album, the song is in
standard tuning capo'd at the first fret. I only discovered Doc Watson
recently because of all the hoo-hah regarding the tuning on this song. Went
out and bought his first albu and it's been playing non-stop on my cd player
since I got it. Do you know if he's in standard tuning on all the cuts on
that album? Does he play fingerstyle all the way? Are any of his other albums
mostly just him an dhis guitar? I know he plays a Gallagher now but any idea
what he was playing then?
Peace,
Gerry Nelson
Nicholas Gasnier
>
> As far as I can figure out, on Doc's first Vanguard album, the song is in
> standard tuning capo'd at the first fret. I only discovered Doc Watson
> recently because of all the hoo-hah regarding the tuning on this song. Went
> out and bought his first albu and it's been playing non-stop on my cd player
> since I got it. Do you know if he's in standard tuning on all the cuts on
> that album? Does he play fingerstyle all the way? Are any of his other albums
> mostly just him an dhis guitar? I know he plays a Gallagher now but any idea
> what he was playing then?
>
> Peace,
> Gerry Nelson
>
> -----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
> http://www.dejanews.com/rg_mkgrp.xp Create Your Own Free Member Forum
A great recording of Doc's playing (with his son Merle) is "Doc Watson
On Stage",
(Vanguard, circa ~1968).
It is a double album with him and Merle playing a live show, he plays
many old songs (including "Deep River Blues" (in standard tuning, capo
first fret,
in the style of the great Merle Travis)).
There is both much fingerpicking and bluegrass flatpicking on this
record.
- Nick Gasnier
Wade Ramey
wrote:
> As far as I can figure out, on Doc's first Vanguard album, the song is in
> standard tuning capo'd at the first fret. I only discovered Doc Watson
> recently because of all the hoo-hah regarding the tuning on this song. Went
> out and bought his first albu and it's been playing non-stop on my cd player
> since I got it. Do you know if he's in standard tuning on all the cuts on
> that album? Does he play fingerstyle all the way? Are any of his other albums
> mostly just him an dhis guitar? I know he plays a Gallagher now but any idea
> what he was playing then?
Can't say for sure whether it's standard tuning all the way, but it would
be a reasonable bet.
He certainly does not play fingerstyle all the way. Listen carefully to
some of those blistering leads. That's Doc flatpicking with his famous no
wrist technique.
Doc is best known as one of the world's greatest--if not the
greatest--flatpickers. He gets a clarity and solidity in his flatpicking
that is unique. I believe that derives from his unique arm stroke (which I
once tried and gave up on).
Doc's fingerpicking is also great--and his arrangement of the Dellmore
brothers' Deep River Blues is a classic--but it's definitely a sidedish
relative to the main course.
Wade
Rick Ruskin
Rick Ruskin
http://www.itrstudio.com/index.html
http://www.videoprogressions.com
http://fingerstyleguitar.com/books.htm
Mike Sinclair
Sorry not to reply sooner. Been on the vacation that my employer so
grudgingly offers as a "benefit."
Yep, Doc does DRB in standard tuning in E. Looks like I made a mistake
about capoing. It appears on Doc's 60's recordings he is capoing on the
1st fret. Later he plays open tuning in E. Doc hangs a E7 at the 5th
fret, moves to an Edim at the 5th, E7 the Edim again, drops to A7 at
the 1st, E7 at the 1st, B7 at the first, and so on. Of course he varies
it a lot but it's still based on the same chord positions/progressions.
If you want to really see what Doc does I'd recommend the instructional
video "Doc's Guitar - Fingerpicking & Flatpicking" from Homespun Video
done by Doc which includes DRB. Lots of up close shots and DRB is
covered in detail. The video comes with TAB transcriptions which are
"close" to what is done on the video - but there are many errors and a
lot is omitted. You can get everything off the tape.
Mike Sinclair
basile <ze...@earthlink.net> wrote in article
<6pgkv7$cfj$1...@ash.prod.itd.earthlink.net>...
> Mike Sinclair wrote:
>
> >Doc has almost always played this in an open E tuning in E.
> >Doc likes to vary his material so you will find differences
> >between recordings over time, but they are all in the same
> >tuning and key. I've seen him perform this live about 25 to
> >30 times over the years and except for one instance of
> >capoing at the first it was open.
>
>
> Hi Mike,
>
> Can you recommend a recording of Doc playing this in open E tuning?
All the
> examples I've heard from him of this song (admittedly not
comprehensive in
> the least) have (aurally) been played out of standard tuning in the
key of
> E. I'd be very interested in hearing how Doc adjusts the arrangement
of
> this tune for open E!
>
> Thanks,
> Frank
>
Mike Sinclair
Yep, you're right. My brain, such as it is, was on the vacation that my
body was soon to go on. I meant standard tuning in the key of E.
Thanks for pointing out the mistake.
Mike Sinclair
John L. Dunne <jld...@cisnet.com> wrote in article
<35BCF9...@cisnet.com>...
> Mike,
>
> I misspent much of my youth at the Main Point in Bryn Mawr, Pa. and
sat
> at Docs' feet dozens of times ( stayed for both shows both nights or
was
> working there by then ) both while on stage and in the basement with
> Merle. I've played the song with Doc and he was definitely in
regular
> tuning - so was I.....
>
> I don't think it can be played in open E actually - just pulled out
my
> guitar and couldn't make it work right.
>
> John Dunne
>
> ps - I've also got great Joni Mitchell stories and don't even get me
> started on Jerry Jeff..... dropping names and going low....... jd
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Mike Sinclair wrote:
> >
> > Doc has almost always played this in an open E tuning in E. Doc
likes
> > to vary his material so you will find differences between
recordings
> > over time, but they are all in the same tuning and key. I've seen
him
> > perform this live about 25 to 30 times over the years and except
for
> > one instance of capoing at the first it was open.
> >
> > There are a couple of published transcriptions of DRB. One is in
"The
> > Guitar of Doc Watson" by Fred Sokolow which is transcribed from the
> > 1964 album Doc Watson which is an early form of Docs DRB. Another
is in
> > "The Songs of Doc Watson" by Doc Watson and is as played during the
> > early seventies.
> >
> > There is an instructional video called "Doc's Guitar -
Fingerpicking &
> > Flatpicking" from Homespun Video done by Doc which includes DRB.
The
> > version here is basically what Doc has played for the last 15 years
or
> > so.
> >
> > Mike Sinclair
> >
> > Steve & Caren Comeau <notc...@erols.com> wrote in article
> > <6pd6g6$507$1...@winter.news.erols.com>...
Mike Sinclair
The brain is still on that all to short vacation. I wrote "open tuning"
where I meant standard tuning - EADGBE.
Mike Sinclair
Mike Sinclair <nos...@trash.com> wrote in article
<01bdbf76$9564cfa0$f32b56d1@meatball>...
> Yo Frank -
>
> Sorry not to reply sooner. Been on the vacation that my employer so
> grudgingly offers as a "benefit."
>
> Yep, Doc does DRB in standard tuning in E. Looks like I made a
mistake
> about capoing. It appears on Doc's 60's recordings he is capoing on
the
> 1st fret. Later he plays open tuning in E. Doc hangs a E7 at the 5th
> fret, moves to an Edim at the 5th, E7 the Edim again, drops to A7 at
> the 1st, E7 at the 1st, B7 at the first, and so on. Of course he
varies
> it a lot but it's still based on the same chord
positions/progressions.
>
> If you want to really see what Doc does I'd recommend the
instructional
> video "Doc's Guitar - Fingerpicking & Flatpicking" from Homespun
Video
> done by Doc which includes DRB. Lots of up close shots and DRB is
> covered in detail. The video comes with TAB transcriptions which are
> "close" to what is done on the video - but there are many errors and
a
> lot is omitted. You can get everything off the tape.
>
> Mike Sinclair
>
> basile <ze...@earthlink.net> wrote in article
> <6pgkv7$cfj$1...@ash.prod.itd.earthlink.net>...
> > Mike Sinclair wrote:
> >
> > >Doc has almost always played this in an open E tuning in E.
> > >Doc likes to vary his material so you will find differences
> > >between recordings over time, but they are all in the same
> > >tuning and key. I've seen him perform this live about 25 to
> > >30 times over the years and except for one instance of
> > >capoing at the first it was open.
> >
> >
> > Hi Mike,
> >
> > Can you recommend a recording of Doc playing this in open E tuning?
> All the
> > examples I've heard from him of this song (admittedly not
> comprehensive in
> > the least) have (aurally) been played out of standard tuning in the
> key of
Wayne Kelly
Rick Ruskin wrote
>Doc was most difinitely in standard tuning.
>
>Rick Ruskin
>On Sat, 25 Jul 1998 13:59:05 -0400, "Steve & Caren Comeau"
> wrote:
>
>>I'm figuring out Doc Watson's "Deep River Blues" by ear and I've worked
out
>>an arrangement where I capo on the 4th fret and start with a first
position
>>C5 chord. However, I hear Doc play bass runs that go below the G# on the
>>capoed low E string.
>>
A friend of mine taught me this song in the key of E with no capo. The
following seems (to my ear) to be right.
The initial chord is a first position B7 but shifted all the way up to the
7th fret, which makes it an E7. Play this chord with the open 6th (E)
string as the primary bass string. The second chord is the same chord form
as the first one (i.e., a B7 form) but shifted down one fret to the 6th
string (making it an Eb7) and play the 5th string as the primary bass
string.
From there he goes back to the first E7 chord then drops down to first
position A7, A, E and B7 chords.
So, it goes like this:
(E7) Let it rain (Eb7) let it pour (E7) let it rain a (A7) whole lot (A)
more 'cause
(E) I've got them deep river (B7) blues.
