Coo Coo Bird / Greil Marcus
Cheryl Cline
I'm plowing my way through Greil Marcus' new book, INVISIBLE REPUBLIC.
In the chapter, "The Old Weird America," he makes a big deal (as have
several reviewers) about the Clarence Ashley version of "The Coo Coo
Bird," and the lines "Gonna build me/Log cabin/On a mountain/So high/So
I can/See Willie/When he goes/On by".
Writes Marcus: "It sounds like a children's ditty only until you begin
to realize the verse is made to refuse any of the questions it makes you
ask. Who is Willie? Why does the singer want to watch him? Why must he
put aside his life and embark on a grand endeavor (in versions of "The
Cuckoo" closer to its protean, British form, the log cabin is a castle)
just to accomplish this ordinary act?" (He goes on about the verse's
mystery for several more pages, but you get the drift.)
What I want to know, is Marcus making an er, mountain out of a molehill?
Does anyone here have clues to who Willie is? My first guess would be
not a who, but a what: a river. Is this a reasonable guess? Where should
I look first (besides this newsgroup!) to try to find out?
Much thanks,
--Cheryl Cline
cheryl...@ucop.edu or cl...@well.com
Frank Hamilton
ba...@best.com (Dave Douglass) wrote:
Who is Willie? Why does the singer want to watch him?
Luv. Willie keeps popping up in a lot of mountain tunes. She wants
to watch him because he's unattainable otherwise.
"Build me a cabin, forty feet high
So I can see Willie as he passes by" ---version from On Top of Old
Smoky. And Down In the Valley.
Why must he
>> put aside his life and embark on a grand endeavor (in versions of "The
>> Cuckoo" closer to its protean, British form, the log cabin is a castle)
>> just to accomplish this ordinary act?" (He goes on about the verse's
>> mystery for several more pages, but you get the drift.)
>>
>> What I want to know, is Marcus making an er, mountain out of a molehill?
>> Does anyone here have clues to who Willie is? My first guess would be
>> not a who, but a what: a river.
>I've been singing Clarence Ashley's version of the Coo-Coo for 30 years
>and never wondered once about Willie but I have wondered about the Coo-Coo
>wobblin' as it flies.
Guess the cuckoo's had too much home brew.
Frank
Dave Douglass
> I'm plowing my way through Greil Marcus' new book, INVISIBLE REPUBLIC.
> In the chapter, "The Old Weird America," he makes a big deal (as have
> several reviewers) about the Clarence Ashley version of "The Coo Coo
> Bird," and the lines "Gonna build me/Log cabin/On a mountain/So high/So
> I can/See Willie/When he goes/On by".
>
> Writes Marcus: "It sounds like a children's ditty only until you begin
> to realize the verse is made to refuse any of the questions it makes you
> ask. Who is Willie? Why does the singer want to watch him? Why must he
> put aside his life and embark on a grand endeavor (in versions of "The
> Cuckoo" closer to its protean, British form, the log cabin is a castle)
> just to accomplish this ordinary act?" (He goes on about the verse's
> mystery for several more pages, but you get the drift.)
>
> What I want to know, is Marcus making an er, mountain out of a molehill?
> Does anyone here have clues to who Willie is? My first guess would be
> not a who, but a what: a river. Is this a reasonable guess? Where should
> I look first (besides this newsgroup!) to try to find out?
>
> Much thanks,
> --Cheryl Cline
> cheryl...@ucop.edu or cl...@well.com
I've been singing Clarence Ashley's version of the Coo-Coo for 30 years
and never wondered once about Willie but I have wondered about the Coo-Coo
wobblin' as it flies.
Dave
Eric Berge
In Article<banjo-12069...@banjo.vip.best.com>, <ba...@best.com>
writes:
> In article <339EFA...@ucop.edu>, Cheryl Cline <cheryl...@ucop.edu>
wrote:
>
> > I'm plowing my way through Greil Marcus' new book, INVISIBLE REPUBLIC.
> > In the chapter, "The Old Weird America," he makes a big deal (as have
> > several reviewers) about the Clarence Ashley version of "The Coo Coo
> > Bird," and the lines "Gonna build me/Log cabin/On a mountain/So high/So
> > I can/See Willie/When he goes/On by".
> >
> > Writes Marcus: "It sounds like a children's ditty only until you begin
> > to realize the verse is made to refuse any of the questions it makes you
> > ask. Who is Willie? Why does the singer want to watch him? Why must he
> > put aside his life and embark on a grand endeavor (in versions of "The
> > Cuckoo" closer to its protean, British form, the log cabin is a castle)
> > just to accomplish this ordinary act?" (He goes on about the verse's
> > mystery for several more pages, but you get the drift.)
> I've been singing Clarence Ashley's version of the Coo-Coo for 30 years
> and never wondered once about Willie but I have wondered about the Coo-Coo
> wobblin' as it flies.
I'm unfamiliar with the song or the singer described, so I have nothing to
contribute as to who Willie might be or why the singer needs to see him so
badly; however, I did notice that the quoted verse does scan to the tune of
"Down in the Valley", of which some versions include an "as you ride by"
verse - perhaps "Cuckoo" is some sort of ancestral version?
Also - is this the same song as "The cuckoo is a pretty bird/And she sings as
she flies/She brings us good tidings/And never tells lies"? (I can't offhand
remember the rest of the words)? I notice that the tune for this also scans
to the words listed above.
(Pause for a trip to the bookcase)
OK, I'm back - the song you cite as "The Cuckoo" and "Down in the Valley"
are one and the same. Lomax, Randolph, and Sandburg all cite versions that
include the "build me a castle" verse; None of them mention a cuckoo anywhere.
The song does seem to more or less concern someone going off to jail for a
long time.
The song I've always thought of as "The Cuckoo" is in the Digital Tradition
in multiple versions plus tune, including a note to the effect that the
earliest known version is from 1796; I can't find a print source in my
collection. No version in the digitrad seems to include the castle/riding
verse, but as I already pointed out, the tunes for "Down in the Valley" and
"The Cuckoo" are similar enough (Maybe identical in some versions) to allow
for migratory verses.
The castle/riding by verse seems to have nothing to do with the rest of the
song in any version; this may be an indication that it may have migrated in
from some other song simply by virtue of scanning correctly to the meter and
tune.
In Lomax's notes (I'm looking in his "Folk Songs of North America"), he refers
to "Down in the Valley" as being "based on _Little_Willie_, p.310 of _Our_
Singing_Country_ (Macmillan, NY 1941)." I'm unfamiliar with this one.
There is a "Little Willie" included in Vance Randolph's "Ozark Folksongs"
(It is reproduced in the Digital Tradition, with tune), but it doesn't seem to
be related either to "Down in the Valley" or to "The Cuckoo").
Interesting note - Cecil Sharp's "One Hundred English Folksongs" includes a
version of "The Cuckoo" that appears to be intermeditate between tC and DitV,
inasmuch as the three verses listed include two which deal not with the cuckoo
but with an abandoned lover.
Eric Berge
edb...@ibm.net
Gerry Myerson
In article <banjo-12069...@banjo.vip.best.com>, ba...@best.com
(Dave Douglass) wrote:
-> I've been singing Clarence Ashley's version of the Coo-Coo for 30 years
-> and never wondered once about Willie but I have wondered about the Coo-Coo
-> wobblin' as it flies.
On the off-chance that you're serious, I'll suggest that that bird
is *warblin'* as it flies.
Gerry Myerson (ge...@mpce.mq.edu.au)
Jeri Corlew
...which I am prone to do if I have too many of those cute little
bottles of airplane booze.
Well, in the version Lomax collected from Jean Ritchie, it was:
The cuckoo, she's a pretty bird.
She *sings* as she flies...
Lomax has the Ashley version, a later one, titled "The Fourth Day of
July".
As to the actual "cuckoo" reference, this bird is a symbol of
unfaithful love because of its habit of leaving its eggs in the nests
of other birds. Y'all probably knew that already.
Now, where the heck did the "Jack o' Diamonds" verse come from?
Jeri
Anti-Spam Alert:
Please change "nonet" to "inet" in my address when replying
Frank Hamilton
Eric Berge <edb...@NOSPAM.ibm.net> wrote:
I did notice that the quoted verse does scan to the tune of
> "Down in the Valley",
Build me a ca--bin, (castle) forty feet high,
(So I) can see Willie as he passes by
Does scan. I believe that tunes are often elongated to accomodate
irregular scansions, but it this case I believe it fits.
of which some versions include an "as you ride by"
>verse - perhaps "Cuckoo" is some sort of ancestral version?
>Also - is this the same song as "The cuckoo is a pretty bird/And she sings as
>she flies/She brings us good tidings/And never tells lies"? (I can't offhand
>remember the rest of the words)? I notice that the tune for this also scans
>to the words listed above.
A walkin' and a talkin',
A walkin' goes I
I'm a waitin' for Willie
He'll come by and by
the tunes for "Down in the Valley" and
>"The Cuckoo" are similar enough (Maybe identical in some versions) to allow
>for migratory verses.
There are many variants of these tunes as well. "Migratory verses" are
a part of many folk songs.
>The castle/riding by verse seems to have nothing to do with the rest of the
>song in any version; this may be an indication that it may have migrated in
>from some other song simply by virtue of scanning correctly to the meter and
>tune.
The linear story line of many folk songs is often obscured by cross
references.
>There is a "Little Willie" included in Vance Randolph's "Ozark Folksongs"
>(It is reproduced in the Digital Tradition, with tune), but it doesn't seem to
>be related either to "Down in the Valley" or to "The Cuckoo").
Do you mean that the tunes are not related? Or do you mean that there
is no apparent reference to connect the different lyrics?
Cordially,
Frank
Frank Hamilton
>Now, where the heck did the "Jack o' Diamonds" verse come from?
Possibly from the song "Rye Whiskey" or "Up on Clinch Mountain", other
variations of the theme.
"Jack o' Diamonds, Jack o' Diamonds
I know you of old.
You rob my poor pockets of
Silver and gold".
Cordially,
Frank
Eric Berge
In Article<5o1pfn$i...@camel12.mindspring.com>, <ham...@atl.mindspring.com>
writes:
> Eric Berge <edb...@NOSPAM.ibm.net> wrote:
> >There is a "Little Willie" included in Vance Randolph's "Ozark Folksongs"
> >(It is reproduced in the Digital Tradition, with tune), but it doesn't seem
> > to be related either to "Down in the Valley" or to "The Cuckoo").
>
> Do you mean that the tunes are not related? Or do you mean that there
> is no apparent reference to connect the different lyrics?
In the case of this "Little Willie", neither the lyrics (quoted from the DT
below) nor the tune seem to be related. Or at least I can't hammer either
"Cuckoo" or "Down in the Valley" to fit.
I would be interested in seeing the "Little Willie" that Lomax was referring
to, if anybody knows where to find it.
Eric Berge
edb...@ibm.net
LITTLE WILLIE 2
Little Willie went to heaven
On a bright and starry night,
When last I viewed him in hid coffin
In his little Sunday suit.
On the shelf his little hat lays,
In this chair he used to sit,
In them cold an' icy fingers
Was his little pony whip.
Put away them little dresses,
That our darlin' used to wear,
He will need them on earth never,
He has clumb the Golden Stair.
Hattie loved her angel brother,
An' she hopes to meet him soon,
Two hundred yards beyond the river,
Little Willie sleeps alone.
An' the angels was descendin'
To convey the spirit home,
Little children all remember
Jesus loves an' bids you come.
From Ozark Folk Songs, Randolph
Collected from Mrs. W.E. Jones, MO 1928
@religion @death @deadbaby
filename[ LTWILLIE
play.exeÿLTWILLIE
RG
John H. Zureick
In article <NEWTNews.866134283.1582.Eric_Berge@tirnanog>,
Eric Berge <edb...@NOSPAM.ibm.net> wrote:
>
>In Article<banjo-12069...@banjo.vip.best.com>, <ba...@best.com>
>writes:
>
>> In article <339EFA...@ucop.edu>, Cheryl Cline <cheryl...@ucop.edu>
>wrote:
>>
>> > I'm plowing my way through Greil Marcus' new book, INVISIBLE REPUBLIC.
>> > In the chapter, "The Old Weird America," he makes a big deal (as have
>> >
>> > to realize the verse is made to refuse any of the questions it makes you
>
>
>I'm unfamiliar with the song or the singer described, so I have nothing to
>contribute as to who Willie might be or why the singer needs to see him so
> "Down in the Valley", of which some versions include an "as you ride by"
>to the words listed above.
>
>
>OK, I'm back - the song you cite as "The Cuckoo" and "Down in the Valley"
>are one and the same. Lomax, Randolph, and Sandburg all cite versions that
>include the "build me a castle" verse; None of them mention a cuckoo anywhere.
When I sing Cuckoo I include the following songs: Moonshiner, House of
Rising Sun and a few verses about playing cards and Jack of Diamonds. Now
that I know this Willie verse I'll tag that onto the ending like a caboose.
Only problem is that most of my verses have 8 lines and this Willie thing
only has four lines. Where is the missing four lines?
I've heard many versions of this song but Townes Van Zandt's version on
Road Songs is where I got the idea to start plugging a lot of extra
verses onto it. Townes rendition is great.
Zuke