Non inflammatory talk?

[heather borean]

I had like many I assume forgotten about here. Usually I’m not quite so bold in choosing my topics. Heather Borean is a quiet self effacing person. Well, for the most part I still am, even if I starting to revert to Heather Margetson a name few of you ever knew me under. I get the feeling that my wish to avoid politics in general at this time isn’t going to happen here. Such is life.

My blasted head begins to make its presence known. This makes it harder than usual to look coherent. And I have got to get shopping done even if I really don’t want to.

Heather

[Leslie]

*Snort* I've come to the conclusion that "hate speech" is any speech, in any form, that somebody somewhere hates. As such, it's too subjective a term to be used in any legal or contractual proceeding and should be abolished.

--Leslie <;)))>< )O(

[Keith F. Lynch]

Leslie <lesli...@cox.net> wrote:
> I've come to the conclusion that "hate speech" is any speech, in any
> form, that somebody somewhere hates. As such, it's too subjective a
> term to be used in any legal or contractual proceeding and should be
> abolished.

I agree completely. But the sentence of Balticon's code of conduct
that people were objecting to didn't mention hate speech. It banned

Slurs and derogatory comments about a person, group, or category
of people.

So your filk song that criticizes Jack the Ripper couldn't be sung, if
the code of conduct is taken literally. Nor can anyone criticize the
KKK, since that's an organization. Or totalitarian dictators, since
that's a category of people.
--
Keith F. Lynch - http://keithlynch.net/
Please see http://keithlynch.net/email.html before emailing me.

[John Davis]

Well that is the position of the haters. You point out that things like "Those people are all animals" and "Those people do not deserve to live" and they instantly accuse you of hating them.

Even "Put criminals in prison" is hate speech to criminals.

[Leslie]

Yep. Censorship is always a bad idea, no matter how well-intentioned. My take on it is, if a song "offends" you, write a song that's a counter-argument. Enough such songs and you'll have a classic Bardic Duel, which is great fun for the audience.

--Leslie <;)))>< )O(

[heather borean]

Ok. This is actually the very definition of something that was explained to me a few years back. The Politics of fear, somewhere someplace, there is a group of people, not lead by lizard people, who are running things behind the scenes. I know this sounds like conspiracy, but in my mind there is not other way to explain many things that have happened in Canada at least over the last 10 - 15 years.

They, who ever they are want us afraid, they want us to be so afraid that we loose all sense of proportion. You talk about haters, and I have no idea about who you mean. Most of you call those of us who actually care about how other people live bleeding heart liberals. Or similar. Well, yes what is wrong with wanting to know that my fellow man is able to have a place to sleep, clothes to wear, food to eat etc and so on. We are a society, we ought to be helping each other not tearing each other down.

Of course what I've just said is political, has nothing to do with filking, and should have been presented in the form of a song, rhyme or other pleasing form. Sorry no can do.

[heather borean]

On Thursday, June 3, 2021 at 6:48:40 AM UTC-4, wa8...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Tuesday, June 1, 2021 at 1:13:08 PM UTC-4, heather...@gmail.com wrote:
> > I had like many I assume forgotten about here. Usually I’m not quite so bold in choosing my topics. Heather Borean is a quiet self effacing person. Well, for the most part I still am, even if I starting to revert to Heather Margetson a name few of you ever knew me under. I get the feeling that my wish to avoid politics in general at this time isn’t going to happen here. Such is life.
> >
> > My blasted head begins to make its presence known. This makes it harder than usual to look coherent. And I have got to get shopping done even if I really don’t want to.
> >
> > Heather
> Well that is the position of the haters. You point out that things like
"Those people are all animals"

Homo Sapiens are animals,

and "Those people do not deserve to live" and they instantly accuse you of hating them.
>

Those people do not deserve to live. Who? Why?

> Even "Put criminals in prison" is hate speech to criminals.

Actually the criminals I have met understand that prison or jail is the price for choosing a life of crime. Some of them had siblings who went "straight" and I had the chance to met one of them. She was a Social Service Worker, like me. She said, the potential cost was just to high. Then she sighed, and said, besides I prefer helping people. Some criminals might take it as an afront, like the really rich ones who have always traded on their privilege. But your regular guy on the street? they know.

[heather borean]

In Grade 10 English, our first coming of age book was Catcher in the Rye. My Father was angry, confiscated the book and talked to the school board. We all had to return our books. Now what we got instead was WAY better. First they were Canadian Books, second, Cabbagetown by Hugh Garner was full of fairly explicit sex. but it wasn't on any lists. Nor were, Death In Don Mills (Necrophila) also by Hugh Garner, and The Apprenticeship of Duddy Kravitz by Mordecai Richler Lots and lots of Language. I was actually popular for a little while. Much better books. They are still the books used in grade 10 to this day, at least in Peel.
Censorship is not the same as recognizing that some words are hate speech. Not in Canada any way, The man who I would love to see as out next Prime Minister is a Sikh. He has death threats shouted at him om the street, not long ago he was removed from parliment because he refused to apologize to a member of another party for something he said. Given that other members had said worse things well, life gets complicated. The thing is Mr Singh refuses to bow, and he refuses to prosecute. He remains for the most part, polite and calm and simply seems to expect that same behavior from others. I very much want to meet him.
Canadian politics are much cleaner than that of the States. Your politics are broken.

I agree about censorship. Especially when the censor is working with little knowlege, which
most of the time they are, our Hate Speech laws are not the same. They are things like, not
allowing holocaust deniers to speak and spread lies. Since the Holocaust happened.
Out lawing the bombing of abortion clinics and the homes of abortion providors. by making
this a hate crime extra time in jail is added. Our abortion laws are clear. Abortion is leagal.
If you don't like that, don't get an abortion. Those are the only two things I can remember right now.

Things might be different in the States, where the politics of fear have had years to grab hold.
Here in Canada we still try and care about people.

[Leslie]

Beg pardon, but I thought that throwing a bomb at an occupied building was Murder or Attempted Murder. plain and simple. What does it matter if the bomb-thrower did it to stop abortions, or for the greater glory of Allah, or to extort the owners of the buildings on either side? "Hate" is irrelevant; the action is all.