Washtub bass (was string bass in New Orleans)
Joseph Scott
the way to the old world, in homemade instruments that served a bass
function but didn't use a washtub in particular, and I bet that's
true, but I'm skeptical that the washtub bass or its U.S. non-washtub
relatives had much popularity in the U.S. until the skiffle era. And
in general, I haven't encountered much evidence that some of the
skiffle-associated homemade-music-associated
street-band-playing-for-tips-associated instruments such as washboards
and kazoos were a major part of 19th century music, the way bones and
harmonica for instance were. Skiffle to a pretty large extent was an
imitation of jazz, on cheaper instruments than the professional jazz
musicians used, and obviously there wasn't imitation jazz before there
was jazz.
How many musicians could we name who were born before 1900 and played
washtub bass? Washboard? Not many, I'd think.
Joseph Scott
David Murray
Joseph Scott wrote:
>...true, but I'm skeptical that the washtub bass or its U.S. non-washtub
>relatives had much popularity in the U.S. until the skiffle era.
>
>
Joseph,
what are the dates that define the "skiffle" era?
dave
Joseph Scott
By skiffle era I meant the era around the '20s-'30s when
street-band-style combos playing homemade instruments and similar were
in vogue in the U.S. and the term "skiffle" was used fairly often in
the U.S. to describe their music (along with other terms such as
"tramp band").
Skiffle-style music definitely went into the '40s some in the U.S.,
and back into the '10s some, but how far back is an interesting
question. From what I can tell, around 1910, the norm for tip-oriented
street performance would have been, roughly speaking, solo, duo, or
trio music made up of instruments such as guitar, fiddle, banjo,
harmonica, accordion, bones, tambourine, sometimes clarinet, cornet,
that sort of thing -- washboards, imitation string basses, jugs,
kazoos weren't very popular yet as of around 1910, best I can tell.
Washboards in particular, they tend to imitate drum sets played in
jazz style, and drum sets, played in any style, of course weren't at
all common in the rural tradition, so again it looks as though skiffle
was to a large extent a slightly later offshoot of the initial
widespread popularity of jazz. Of course you could make an argument
that a certain proportion of the earlier washboard players were
imitating ragtime drummers...
Joseph Scott
Gillespie Gail
j_ns...@msn.com wrote on 11/29/02 4:28 PM:
Interesting thread on basses, washtub basses, washboards & home made
instruments. In the current issue of the Old-Time Herald there's an article
on David Holt that includes a picture of him playing washboard and harmonica
with Susie Brunson (1870-1994) -who was at one time the oldest person in the
world. Mrs. Brunson said that the washboard was the only instrument she
heard growing up around Bamberg, SC in the 1870s. Surely such home made
instruments pre-dated popular rag time and jazz.
And, speaking of basses, I grew up mainly in Florida and up through the 60s
and 70s there were elderly black men around north central Florida who
"played the door" or "played the wall or porch" of a house with a rig that
involved broom wire, eye bolts, a beer bottle bridge & a whiskey bottle
slide. The door was pitched roughly like a guitar but the wall or
occasionally the porch were bass pitched instruments. I don't know how old
these things are but I believe there has been some research into them, some
rural Florida field recordings made by Dwight Devane in Gainesville feature
this instrument.
Gail
peanutjake
David Murray <da...@spectacularopticals.com> wrote in message
news:3DE7B728...@spectacularopticals.com...
>
>
I remember seeing the washtub bass being used in New York in the 1930's.
Any way wasn't skiffle British?
PJ
peanutjake
Instructions are here.
PJ
http://www.ehhs.cmich.edu/~dhavlena/bass.htm
peanutjake
Click here
http://www.sbgmusic.com/html/teacher/reference/instruments/jugbands.html
Joseph Scott
> on David Holt that includes a picture of him playing washboard and harmonica
> with Susie Brunson (1870-1994) -who was at one time the oldest person in the
> world. Mrs. Brunson said that the washboard was the only instrument she
> heard growing up around Bamberg, SC in the 1870s.
Very interesting, thanks Gail! I wonder why I've encountered so few
recordings featuring washboardists born in the 1800s, by musicians
from SC or any other state (as well as so few mentions of washboards
in interviews with musicians around that age). I could probably name
you about 50 recorded guitarists born before 1900 (an instrument that
only really caught on towards the end of the 19th century) but
probably only 2 recorded washboardists born before 1900, if that. Can
anyone name more than 2, on either washboard or washtub bass? Homemade
instruments in general are eternal, but I think some of these homemade
instruments had little popularity (which is not to say no popularity)
before the early decades of the 20th century.
>
> And, speaking of basses, I grew up mainly in Florida and up through the 60s
> and 70s there were elderly black men around north central Florida who
> "played the door" or "played the wall or porch" of a house with a rig that
> involved broom wire, eye bolts, a beer bottle bridge & a whiskey bottle
> slide. The door was pitched roughly like a guitar but the wall or
> occasionally the porch were bass pitched instruments. I don't know how old
> these things are but I believe there has been some research into them, some
> rural Florida field recordings made by Dwight Devane in Gainesville feature
> this instrument.
I've read about "white" guys saying grandpa played instruments sort of
like this too. Presumably all goes back ultimately to the use of the
hunting bow to make music when the belly is full and the ears are
hungry.
Joseph Scott
Joseph Scott
"Skiffle" was a U.S. slang name for a U.S. folk/jazz good-time
street-band-associated style, "skiffle"/"scuffle" meaning the same
sort of thing as "busk," and British revivalists repopularized that
style under that name in the '50s. The word "skiffle" and its variants
appeared in a fair number of tune titles around the '20s-'30s but
probably would have fallen out of use altogether if it hadn't been
kept alive by the "black" Northern U.S. pianist Dan Burley (who was an
interesting guy, also a civil rights journalist) during the '40s and
then by U.K. jazz musicians who IIRC knew of Burley's records _and_
heard the word used in Louisiana while visiting, around 1950 or so.
The word might have fallen out of use, but the style wouldn't have
entirely, of course -- there are still busking street bands in the
U.S. today (although not enough if you ask me).
Joseph Scott
Joseph Scott
or at least can go on in -- jug band music today could be misleading
as far as jug band history is concerned:
"...jug bands[...] include homemade instruments too: kazoos,
washboards, washtub bass..."
Judging from the sample I've heard, the great majority of '20s-'40s
recordings with jug in them include no kazoo, and even fewer include
washboard or washtub bass.
"Skiffle music is similar to jug band music. People in Britain after
World War II got the idea for skiffle from listening to jug bands from
the United States."
"Skiffle"-style music and music made by bands including jug are
overlapping categories. People in Britain after World War II got the
idea for their skiffle music from listening to skiffle bands from the
United States.
"Another standard instrument in jug bands is the washboard."
How many bands could we name that included both a jug and a washboard
before 1950? Washboards were not "standard" in jug bands, pre-revival
era.
Best,
Joseph Scott
Kerry Blech
> And, speaking of basses, I grew up mainly in Florida and up through the 60s
> and 70s there were elderly black men around north central Florida who
> "played the door" or "played the wall or porch" of a house with a rig that
> involved broom wire, eye bolts, a beer bottle bridge & a whiskey bottle
> slide.
Gail,
I heard one track of one of those folks on an anthology based on
recordings over the years of the Florida Folk Festival. The
'door-string-slide' instrument was designated a "Diddley-Bow."
I can't remember that fellow's name, but I think I saw him sometime
in the 1970s at the National Folk Festival at Wolf Trap (or elsewhere...
Magic 8-Ball is getting hazy...). If I ever get time, I'll dive into
the vinyl stash and look up his name... or in a National Folk Festival
brochure...
thanks,
Kerry
Carl Baron
http://blues.about.com/c/ht/00/07/How_Diddley_Bow0962932496.htm
http://hometown.aol.com/ujaxmanmike/diddleys.html
http://www.ennuimalaise.com/instruments_03_industrialstrengthdiddleybow.htm
http://www.deltaboogie.com/deltamusicians/pitchfor/
http://www.fayschool.org/art/6art/gr6a.html
for our French friends
http://www.geocities.com/BourbonStreet/6608/lexique.htm
Carl
Heath Curdts
about for guitar played in a style other than "classical"?
heath
(remove x to reply directly)
Joseph Scott
recordings are concerned would be Roy Butin, an associate of Vess
Ossman's. Marches and rags and so on. I don't know about 1890s, but
someone must have, there were tons of cylinders made in the 1890s.
Joseph Scott
peanutjake
"Heath Curdts" <h...@sonic.net> wrote in message
news:ligH9.52566$Ik.14...@typhoon.sonic.net...
Contact the Thomas Edison Museum in West Orange, New Jersey
PJ
ron t. curry
I believe that there were Hawaiian guitar cylinders recorded pre
1900.
Polk Millers Old South Quartet recorded 6 cylinders for Edison around
1904 I think, that included guitar and banjo.
Ron