Soldier's Joy
stevewise
I became intruigued by the words of a gillian welch song from soul
journey:
too much beer and whisky to ever be employed
and when I got to nashville it was too much soldier's joy
this suggests a quite specific meaning for soldier's joy. However The
Fiddler's Companion site (http://www.ibiblio.org/fiddlers/) has this to
say
There is quite a bit of speculation on just what the name
'soldier's joy' refers to. Proffered thoughts seem to gravitate
toward money and drugs. In support of the latter is the 1920's
vintage Georgia band the Skillet Lickers, who sang to the melody:
***
Well twenty-five cents for the morphine,
and fifteen cents for the beer.
Twenty-five cents for the old morphine
now carry me away from here.
I also read on a michelle shocked web site that it refers to morphine -
in the civil war lots of soldiers were given morphine for pain and
became addicted.
Does anyone have any other info on this
apologies if this is an old chestnut but it has intrigued me for a
while
steve wise
bakewell
Robert
"stevewise" <steve...@lycos.co.uk> wrote in message
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hucktunes™ ©
George Washington, so that would lead me to suspect that the tune title
predates the discovery of morphine during the civil war. But according
to the long forgotten article I read, Soldier's Joy is peace.
David Sanderson
I would suggest that Gillian Welch et al. are probably not entirely
reliable sources for such historical information.... The name
"Soldier's Joy" was in use at least by about 1775, when it's referenced
in a Robert Burns piece; likely you'd be looking in the 18th century for
origins of the title.
--
David Sanderson
East Waterford, Maine
Tony
century when Robert Burns wrote a poem to fit it - or to fit a well known
melody called Soldier's Joy. At that time it was no doubt still played as a
hornpipe and it is hard to know how close it was to the tune played today.
I remember little of the poem save that it started with the line "I am
the son of Mars..." which is the sort of line that catches your attention.
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"stevewise" <steve...@lycos.co.uk> wrote in message
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Jason Hill
introducing it, he said something like, "This tune is called Soldier's
Joy, alternatively entitled Love Somebody or Rock the Cradle, Lucy. If
you think about it, there's a connection there somewhere."
Jason
In message <1141051079.2...@v46g2000cwv.googlegroups.com>,
=?iso-8859-1?B?aHVja3R1bmVzmSCp?= <bob....@gmail.com> writes
--
Jason Hill
Rye
told him it was also call "Payday in the Army". Steve then says that
was the soldiers joy.
Makes about as much sense as anything else I've heard.
On 27 Feb 2006 00:39:15 -0800, "stevewise" <steve...@lycos.co.uk>
wrote:
timatp...@yahoo.com
Joy" as "Payday in the Army."
David Sanderson
> For fifty years I've heard all the old fiddlers refer to "Soldier's
> Joy" as "Payday in the Army."
>
Payday, liquor, women - take your choice, I suspect.
Brad Sondahl
> Sometime in the 1960's, I saw Mike Seeger performing Soldier's Joy. When
> introducing it, he said something like, "This tune is called Soldier's
> Joy, alternatively entitled Love Somebody or Rock the Cradle, Lucy. If
> you think about it, there's a connection there somewhere."
>
> Jason
The only version of Rock the Cradle, Lucy, that I've heard, was I think,
by Riley Puckett, and it's a different tune. But I'd never argue with
Mike Seeger about anything...
Brad
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Erik Newman
>
> The only version of Rock the Cradle, Lucy, that I've heard, was I think,
> by Riley Puckett, and it's a different tune. But I'd never argue with
> Mike Seeger about anything...
The Reeltime Travelers do that one, and it's definitely not Soldiers Joy.
hucktunes™ ©
Rock The Cradle Lucy while playing Soldiers Joy, and to my ears it just
doesn't sound right. It sounds like two different tunes, as far as
cadence and phrasing are concerned. Sure the melody is similar, but
heck, that could be said about most tunes.
stevewise
isn't a single answer. I'd forgotten that the tune is sometimes called
Payday in the Army.
What still intrigues me is Gillian Welch's use of it in her song -
because from the context she seems to have something specific in mind,
which is not liquor.
Thanks for the interesting contributions
No way to really find out I guess.
Steve Wise
bakewell
gandlbrothers
talks about morphine as soldier's joy
"stevewise" <steve...@lycos.co.uk> wrote in message
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stevewise
have a listen. This does suggest that there is some substance to the
'morphine' part of this story.
hucktunes™ ©
gandlbrothers wrote:
> Guy Clark has a song about a soldier losing his leg in the Civil War whic
> talks about morphine as soldier's joy
enjoyed pointing that out when playing the tune in public, until I read
about the title predating the discovery of morphine by about a hundred
years. It is all in all about my favorite fiddle tune. That and Chicken
Reel. Oh, and New Five Cents. And Cluck Old Hen. And, and..........
Peter Feldmann
<bob....@gmail.com> wrote:
Jason,
These guys are so not getting it.... Time to pack up the
folding suitcase and move down a couple of streets.
-Pete
--
Peter Feldmann
http://www.bluegrasswest.com
Bands, bookings, & etc. for old time and
neo-classic country music.
Kathy Kaiser
Tune-"Soldier's Joy."
I am a son of Mars who have been in many wars,
And show my cuts and scars wherever I come;
This here was for a wench, and that other in a trench,
When welcoming the French at the sound of the drum.
Lal de daudle, &c.
My 'prenticeship I past where my leader breath'd his last,
When the bloody die was cast on the heights of Abram:
and I served out my trade when the gallant game was play'd,
And the Morro low was laid at the sound of the drum.
I lastly was with Curtis among the floating batt'ries,
And there I left for witness an arm and a limb;
Yet let my country need me, with Elliot to head me,
I'd clatter on my stumps at the sound of a drum.
And now tho' I must beg, with a wooden arm and leg,
And many a tatter'd rag hanging over my bum,
I'm as happy with my wallet, my bottle, and my callet,
As when I used in scarlet to follow a drum.
What tho' with hoary locks, I must stand the winter shocks,
Beneath the woods and rocks oftentimes for a home,
When the t'other bag I sell, and the t'other bottle tell,
I could meet a troop of hell, at the sound of a drum.
Recitativo
He ended; and the kebars sheuk,
Aboon the chorus roar;
While frighted rattons backward leuk,
An' seek the benmost bore:
A fairy fiddler frae the neuk,
He skirl'd out, encore!
But up arose the martial chuck,
An' laid the loud uproar.
"Tony" <tspa...@nc.rr.com> wrote in message
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Kathy Kaiser
[also the French Four] we all know and love were the tune.
"Kathy Kaiser" <kai...@mchsi.com> wrote in message
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Lyle Lofgren
whatever from??
Lyle
hucktunes™ ©
Jason Hill wrote:
> Sometime in the 1960's, I saw Mike Seeger performing Soldier's Joy. When
> introducing it, he said something like, "This tune is called Soldier's
> Joy, alternatively entitled Love Somebody or Rock the Cradle, Lucy. If
> you think about it, there's a connection there somewhere."
the same, but different. Offhand, I wouldn't mistake it for Soldiers
Joy.
Lyle Lofgren
the same, but different. Offhand, I wouldn't mistake it for Soldiers
Joy."
But you WOULD mistake Land Norris's version of Love Somebody for
Soldier's Joy, because it's the same tune. He sang the low part:
I love somebody, yes I do
I love somebody true;
I love somebody, yes I do,
I love somebody but I won't tell who.
And for the fine part:
I'm my momma's darling pet (X3)
I won't get married for a good long whet.
That is, Norris's song uses the tune that I call Soldier's Joy; I don't
even remember where I learned it, and it at least follows the same
chord patterns as the other SJs I've heard, but we may not be talking
about exactly the same tune, just as with Love Somebody.
As to Rock That Cradle Lucy, the version I remember (probably the
Skillet Lickers) uses the same fine part as SJ, with a slightly
different low part, but the tunes are close enough that I'm likely to
start playing the wrong one if some drunk comes up and says "I wanna
hear Soldier's Joy."
Since starting this post, I looked through my tapelists, and I have 2
versions of Rock That Cradle Lucy, 4 of I Love Somebody and 14 of
Soldier's Joy, not counting versions by the Brandy Snifters, which of
course would be derivative. It would take days to find them all,
particularly since my reel-to-reel tape recorder has developed an
aversion to Fast Forward, but I'd be surprised if, for example, those
14 SJs were all the same tune.
David Sanderson
Kathy will likely answer, but I'll say something just in case. This
poem is part of a sort of playlet or musical that Burns wrote. I
blundered into it several years ago when I was looking up the original
words to Auld Lang Syne. As I recall there's a plot of sorts, with
recitation and these musical pieces, each set to a tune common enough
that it was unnecessary to do more than mention it. Soldier's Joy is
one of the tunes he used. As you can see from the language, this is
Burns being pretty high class, for him, at least. I forget what the
whole piece is called.
Lyle Lofgren
forgotten about Robert Burns being involved with it; otherwise I should
have figured that out by myself. If you were known as "the plowboy
poet," you'd be tempted to demonstrate some couth, too.
Speaking of couth and its antonym, someone once told me that if a
discussion thread goes beyond a dozen postings, it's sure to have
degenerated into acrimony. There are 23 and counting on this one, and
hardly a discouraging word, much less insults. Maybe we're weird.
Lyle
David Sanderson
Aging weirdos, yes, a phrase I once heard Groucho Marx apply to himself.
Always appealed to me.
Kathy Kaiser
Gutenburg Project (they had the idea of offering the literature of the world
as etext before Google existed). Also, I'm not Kathy; I just use my wife's
high speed connection.
Dave Gardner