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Musical Realsim?

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Chad Carlson

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Feb 26, 1994, 2:52:37 PM2/26/94
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Just wondering if anyone out there had some thoughts on the
idea/concept of musical realism (most commonly associated with
1850-1900, the late romantic eras). I'm preparing a thesis paper
dealing with musical realism and literary realism and would be
interested in hearing other people's ideas.

Vance Maverick

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Feb 26, 1994, 7:14:47 AM2/26/94
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In article <2ko9a5$i...@news.doit.wisc.edu> ccar...@students.wisc.edu (Chad Carlson) writes:
Just wondering if anyone out there had some thoughts on the
idea/concept of musical realism (most commonly associated with
1850-1900, the late romantic eras).

Are you thinking of verismo in opera? I don't think anyone ever
thought even program music was "realistic."

Vance

Frank Brickle

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Feb 27, 1994, 9:30:32 AM2/27/94
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From article <MAVERICK.94...@cork.CS.Berkeley.EDU>, by mave...@cork.CS.Berkeley.EDU (Vance Maverick):

>
> Are you thinking of verismo in opera? I don't think anyone ever
> thought even program music was "realistic."
>
No, but it might be an interesting conceit! Sort of like the mind-twist
engendered by thinking of Schoenberg's early music as "Victorian-era."
Not the most obvious categorization, but not necessarily less appropriate
than something like, say, "Romantic-era" applied to early 19th century
music.

Robert W. Fink

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Feb 28, 1994, 6:02:16 PM2/28/94
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Stop me if you've read this already, but I seem to remember
that it was Carl Dahlhaus who made a point of connecting
late-Romantic music with late-nineteenth century "bourgeois
realism" (ie the novel, etc.) See his book "Nineteenth-Century
Music" (pp. 276-283 are on "Drame lyrique and Operatic Realism";
pp. 351-59 on "Melodrama and Verismo") for starters.

An interesting topic--good luck and feel free to come back
for more...

robert fink
eastman school of music
(aka es...@troi.cc.rochester.edu)

Roger Lustig

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Mar 1, 1994, 10:30:30 AM3/1/94
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In article <1994Feb28....@galileo.cc.rochester.edu> es...@troi.cc.rochester.edu (Robert W. Fink) writes:
>In <2ko9a5$i...@news.doit.wisc.edu> ccar...@students.wisc.edu (Chad Carlson) writes:

>>Just wondering if anyone out there had some thoughts on the
>>idea/concept of musical realism (most commonly associated with
>>1850-1900, the late romantic eras). I'm preparing a thesis paper
>>dealing with musical realism and literary realism and would be
>>interested in hearing other people's ideas.

>Stop me if you've read this already, but I seem to remember
>that it was Carl Dahlhaus who made a point of connecting
>late-Romantic music with late-nineteenth century "bourgeois
>realism" (ie the novel, etc.) See his book "Nineteenth-Century
>Music" (pp. 276-283 are on "Drame lyrique and Operatic Realism";
>pp. 351-59 on "Melodrama and Verismo") for starters.

Dahlhaus also collected his ideas on this in a book called
_Musikalischer Realismus_ (Piper paperback, 1982: ISBN 3-492-00539-X)

He discusses operas and symphonic music.

Roger

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