Beethoven piano concertos recommendations
Patrick Amory
Glen Jeh <Glen...@EOTRS.damar.com> wrote:
>
> What are some good recordings of the Beethoven piano concertos?
I'll draw some adverse remarks for this, particularly from Dan Koren, but
my favorite recordings are those by Serkin -- both the analogue and
digital cycles. Analogue with Bernstein and the New York Phil, early '60s
(CBS/Sony), digital with Ozawa and the BSO, '80s (Telarc). The sound is
superb on both (I rarely say this about digital recordings), and the
performances stunning. The '80s versions are rather more meditative,
lusher; the '60s versions are leaner, more dramatic, better articulated
(and have less idiosyncratic tempi)... I've never been able to hear the
pedalling and cut-off phrase-endings with which the Penguin Guide always
smears late Serkin, but perhaps you'd better listen to the Telarc
recordings before jumping in.
Patrick Amory
ph...@cus.cam.ac.uk
Glen Jeh
What are some good recordings of the Beethoven piano concertos? How is
Zimmerman with Berstein/VPO on DG? Oh, speaking of DG, what is this DG's "4D"
technology and how does it help? How does that set of "Karajan Gold" discs,
which supposedly uses this technology, sound compared to the cheap-metal
versions, whichever those may be?
... Don't get discouraged...No one is perfickt.
Carol McAlpine
What about Wilhem Backhaus' recordings? I can't lay my hands on it instantly
inthis mess, but I have two of the 5 - no wait, wait here it is -
on London, #4 and #5, VPO with Clemens Krauss, done in 1951 and 1953. I'm
a sensualist about piano rather than a logician & so often refer someone
other than Serkin Sr., as much as I admire his work and would not do
without it. I want the extra attention to touch and color that Backhaus
gives, and he does not slight hte intellectual element at all.
(The number is London 425 962.)
Gregory Germain
: What are some good recordings of the Beethoven piano concertos? How is
I too like the Telarc/Boston/Ozawa/Serkin recordings. If you are looking
for a cheap set, however, the Naxos recordings are quite good and very
cheap (I think I paid $13.50 for the 3 cd set on sale).
--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gregory Germain
350 Steuart Street
San Francisco, California 94105-1250
(415) 788-5000
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Yoshiyuki Mukudai
Glen...@EOTRS.damar.com writes:
>> What are some good recordings of the Beethoven piano concertos? How is
>> Zimmerman with Berstein/VPO on DG?
If you want to get a set, I recommend you these.
* Pollini & Abbado (DG 4D)
* Gould & Bernstein, Stokowski (Sony)
* Schnabel & Sargent (Arabesque)
(Sorry, I haven't heard the Zimmerman's and R.Serkin's versions.)
If you don't mind to get them separately, try to listen to Michelangeli's.
He is the greatest Beethoven interpreter I've ever heard.
* Michelangeli & Gullini #1,#3 (DG)
* Michelangeli & Celibidache #5 ('67 Stockholm live, AS disc)
* Gould #2 (coupled with superb Bach d-moll, Leningrad live, Sony)
* Arauu & Davis #4 (Philips)
I think that Michelangeli 5th with Gullini is not so good.
Mukudai Yoshiyuki
Mario Taboada
Well,there are so many that it's difficult to chooose "the
best". I admire the following (possibly among others which I am
forgetting):
*Gilels-Szell (very robust performances, not a lot of charm)
*Schnabel-Sargent (great performances, so-so sound)
*Rubinstein-Leinsdorf (beautiful playing from soloist and orchestra)
*Kempff-Leitner (outstanding performances and sound)
*Kempff-Kempen (" " ")
*Perahia-Haitink (gentle performances, great pianist)
As to individual performances, I like Gieseking-Galliera on #4 and #5,
Serkin's #5 (the old version), and Arrau-Davis #5. I am sure I'm forgetting
about many worthwhile performances. In fact, I don't listen to these
concertos too often anymore, so I put all the recordings away,
with the exception of Schnabel-Sargt.
Best regards,
Mario Taboada
Los Angeles
Kimberly Anne Stinson
>Glen Jeh (Glen...@EOTRS.damar.com) wrote:
>
>: What are some good recordings of the Beethoven piano concertos? How is
>
>I too like the Telarc/Boston/Ozawa/Serkin recordings. If you are looking
>for a cheap set, however, the Naxos recordings are quite good and very
>cheap (I think I paid $13.50 for the 3 cd set on sale).
>--
Also very cheap and very good are the Sony Essential Classics set. Szell,
Cleveland, Leon Fleisher make an excellent combination. I haven't heard
their 1-2, but the others are excellent. 4 is probably the best, 5 is okay,
3 I simply don't like the music as much, but it's well-played. The 5 comes
with a nice account of the Triple Concerto, too.
--
Kimberly Anne Stinson | -+- You only *wish* you were crazy -+-
fl...@alpha1.csd.uwm.edu | University of Wisconsin -- Milwaukee
Yoshiyuki Mukudai
>> If you don't mind to get them separately, try to listen to Michelangeli's.
By the way, does anyone know why DG hasn't released Michelangeli/Gullini
Beethoven nos 2 & 4 yet?
Mukudai Yoshiyuki
Dan Koren
>In article <f3c_940...@damar.com>
>Glen...@EOTRS.damar.com writes:
>
>>> What are some good recordings of the Beethoven piano concertos? How is
>>> Zimmerman with Berstein/VPO on DG?
>
>If you want to get a set, I recommend you these.
>
> * Pollini & Abbado (DG 4D)
> * Gould & Bernstein, Stokowski (Sony)
> * Schnabel & Sargent (Arabesque)
While all the above are fine indeed, I still think the top choice for
anyone who only wants/needs one set should be Gilels/Szell.
>If you don't mind to get them separately, try to listen to Michelangeli's.
>He is the greatest Beethoven interpreter I've ever heard.
Hear, hear!
> * Michelangeli & Gullini #1,#3 (DG)
> * Michelangeli & Celibidache #5 ('67 Stockholm live, AS disc)
^^
1969. It's the Stockholm Radio Symphony Orchestra, but the actual event
recorded here was a live concert in Helsinki on May 20.
> * Gould #2 (coupled with superb Bach d-moll, Leningrad live, Sony)
The ultimate knock-out performance of #2 is by Martha Argerich, on
EMI/Angel CDM 7-63575-2.
> * Arauu & Davis #4 (Philips)
No, Michelangeli. Unfortunately, the sound is terrible. Next choice would
be Edwin Fischer. Next, Moravec.
>I think that Michelangeli 5th with Gullini is not so good.
You're right. It's not as good as earlier Michelangeli performances. It's
still a *hell* of a lot better than anybody else.
dk
LESIT
writes:
In fact, I don't listen to these
concertos too often anymore, so I put all the recordings away,
with the exception of Schnabel-Sargt.
I also listen to this set extensively, especially in the new Pearl
transfers. Yes, they are noisier than the Arabesques, but they posess far
more detail, frequency range and dynamic range.
-Al Lesitsky
James Kalemis
> What are some good recordings of the Beethoven piano concertos? How is
>Zimmerman with Berstein/VPO on DG?
I like Zimmerman very much. Great piano technique and piano sound, although the
orchestra is a little "weak".
Another favorite is London/Ashkenazy/Solti-CSO. The orchestra is beautiful (great
brass!) and the piano is very good also.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
James Kalemis, jka...@luc.edu , Loyola University
> opinions expressed not necessarily of Loyola University <
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Reader of Science Fiction/Horror/Fantasy * Computer Hobbyist
Tropical Fish Hobbyist * Star Trek Fan(atic) * Novice Pianist
Carol McAlpine
>the magisterial reading of #5 by Edwin Fischer and Wilhelm Furtwaengler (EMI).
>Murray Perahia and Bernard Haitink manage well with the first four concerti;
>Perahia is actually one of the only pianists that I've heard who makes musical
>sense out of the first two concerti in particular. But Perahia just doesn't
>have the pianistic wherewithal to withstand the "Emperor."
I agree wholeheartedly about Perahia in #1 and #2; haven;t heard him in the
others but I can imagine that he would not suit #5. Have you heard Backhaus
in #4 and #5?
Carol McAlpine
James C Liu
I punted my copy of the late Serkin concerto recordings; I thought the
solo playing was adequate, but Ozawa's conducting just didn't cut the
mustard. My first pick these days would be Leon Fleisher's marvelous
set with the Cleveland Orchestra under George Szell (CBS), which is one
of the cheapest, as well as one of the finest. dk tells us that there is
no recording of #4 or #5 after Michelangeli. I'll need to hear one to
confirm this; in the meantime, I'll retain a special place in my heart for
the magisterial reading of #5 by Edwin Fischer and Wilhelm Furtwaengler (EMI).
Murray Perahia and Bernard Haitink manage well with the first four concerti;
Perahia is actually one of the only pianists that I've heard who makes musical
sense out of the first two concerti in particular. But Perahia just doesn't
have the pianistic wherewithal to withstand the "Emperor."
--
/James C.S. Liu, MD "I put instant coffee in a microwave and
jl...@world.std.com almost went back in time."
Department of Medicine -- Steve Wright
New England Med Ctr, Boston MA
James C Liu
>> * Arauu & Davis #4 (Philips)
>No, Michelangeli. Unfortunately, the sound is terrible. Next choice would
>be Edwin Fischer. Next, Moravec.
Fischer? Could you provide details? I've always been fond of Conrad Hansen's
live recording from Berlin in 1943 with Furtwaengler.
Dan Koren
>James C Liu <jl...@world.std.com> writes:
>
>>the magisterial reading of #5 by Edwin Fischer and Wilhelm Furtwaengler (EMI).
>>Murray Perahia and Bernard Haitink manage well with the first four concerti;
>>Perahia is actually one of the only pianists that I've heard who makes musical
>>sense out of the first two concerti in particular. But Perahia just doesn't
Then you probably have not heard too many performances of the above. Richter,
Schnabel, Argerich and Michelangeli have turned outstanding performances of
#1, and please don't tell us they make less sense of the music than Perrahia,
'cause it simply does not make sense (you seem to have a weak spot in your
heart for Serkin pupils, don't you?).
#1 and #3 are also somewhat of a house specialty for Radu Lupu, who has
repeatedly turned magnificent live performances, though the recorded ones
aren't nearly as compelling.
And Martha Argerich has turned an absolute knock-out performance of #2, which
is simply unmatched by any other on records.
>>have the pianistic wherewithal to withstand the "Emperor."
Perrahia live (I heard him a few times) makes one worry he would die on the
next beat. I simply can't take the torture of his performances. Whatever he
does, he definitely belongs to the category of studio artists (together with
Alfred Brendel, Clara Haskil and Guglielmo Kempff).
>I agree wholeheartedly about Perahia in #1 and #2; haven;t heard him in the
>others but I can imagine that he would not suit #5. Have you heard Backhaus
>in #4 and #5?
Indeed. Wooden.
Michelangeli's Emperor should be required listening for anyone interested in
the Emperor. It makes everybody else (Fischer and Schnabel included) sound as
if they did not understand the music.
>Carol McAlpine
dk
Patrick Amory
Sorry, James, I have *never* liked the Fleisher/Szell Beethoven recordings.
There's something fuzzy and unarticulated about them -- perhaps,
uncharacteristically for Columbia in the early '60s, the recorded sound.
I want a lean, passionate Beethoven in the concerti (particularly 4 & 5);
Fleisher just sounds like a fun romp. :-)
(same goes in spades for their terrible version of the Triple Concerto!
and normally I love almost everything that Szell did... this and his
monotonous _Pictures at an Exhibition_ must be his nadir.)
Patrick Amory
ph...@cus.cam.ac.uk
James C Liu
>>>Perahia is actually one of the only pianists that I've heard who makes musical
>>>sense out of the first two concerti in particular. But Perahia just doesn't
>Then you probably have not heard too many performances of the above. Richter,
>Schnabel, Argerich and Michelangeli have turned outstanding performances of
>#1, and please don't tell us they make less sense of the music than Perrahia,
>'cause it simply does not make sense (you seem to have a weak spot in your
>heart for Serkin pupils, don't you?).
Yup. What can I tell you. I of course, adore my Richter recording (the
first, not the new RCA remake, which has better conducting from Eschenbach
but a solo line which is not as compelling), but figured that went without
saying.
>#1 and #3 are also somewhat of a house specialty for Radu Lupu, who has
>repeatedly turned magnificent live performances, though the recorded ones
>aren't nearly as compelling.
Sadly, he's not come up with a Beethoven conductor worthy of his stature.
Zubin Mehta? C'mon.
>And Martha Argerich has turned an absolute knock-out performance of #2, which
>is simply unmatched by any other on records.
Time for another trip to the CD store.
>Perrahia live (I heard him a few times) makes one worry he would die on the
>next beat. I simply can't take the torture of his performances. Whatever he
>does, he definitely belongs to the category of studio artists (together with
>Alfred Brendel, Clara Haskil and Guglielmo Kempff).
Still, there are a few recordings where he manages to make something
interesting out of the music. A rollicking Beethoven Op. 31/3 and the fiery
Brahms Piano Quartet #1 recording with the Amadeus Quartet jump into mind.
--
/James C.S. Liu, MD "The best cure for insomnia is to get
jl...@world.std.com a lot of sleep."
Department of Medicine -- W. C. Fields
David M. Cook
>d...@netcom.com (Dan Koren) writes:
>>And Martha Argerich has turned an absolute knock-out performance of #2, which
>>is simply unmatched by any other on records.
> Time for another trip to the CD store.
It's coupled with a wonderful Haydn #11.
Might as well get her Schumann Fantasie, too.
Dave Cook
Sue Shapiro
have wonderful recordings.
Sue
James C Liu
$%^@#^&!!!!! I just bought a Richter recording of the latter ...
Dan Koren
>dc...@linux5.ph.utexas.edu (David M. Cook) writes:
>
>>In article <Ctyzq...@world.std.com>, James C Liu <jl...@world.std.com> wrote:
>>>d...@netcom.com (Dan Koren) writes:
>
>>>>And Martha Argerich has turned an absolute knock-out performance of #2, which
>>>>is simply unmatched by any other on records.
>
>>> Time for another trip to the CD store.
>
>>It's coupled with a wonderful Haydn #11.
>>Might as well get her Schumann Fantasie, too.
>
>$%^@#^&!!!!! I just bought a Richter recording of the latter ...
Great! *Each* and *every* performance of the Schumann Fantasy by *either*
Martha or Richter is a must!
Now go buy the other one!
;-))
dk
Daniel Reich
when he was the soloist, and his rendition of the first movement, despite the
myriad missed notes, almost blew me out of my seat. My violin nearly fell
out of my hands...
--Danny Reich
rei...@reid-pc.rockefeller.edu
Stan Szpakowicz
by Schnabel A.D. 1942, #1 and #3 (plus Grieg and Schumann) by Solomon
A.D. 1958 (?). Does anyone have an opinion on those recordings? They
haven't been mentioned in this thread.
Thanks,
--
Dr. Stan Szpakowicz :: Univ. of Ottawa :: Dept. of Computer Science
sz...@csi.uottawa.ca :: tel. +613 564 2450 :: fax +613 564 9486
Deryk Barker
: Today I found two boxes with Beethoven's Piano Concerti: # 4 and #5
: by Schnabel A.D. 1942, #1 and #3 (plus Grieg and Schumann) by Solomon
: A.D. 1958 (?). Does anyone have an opinion on those recordings? They
: haven't been mentioned in this thread.
Schnabel recorded 4 & 5 (plus the sonatas Op.109 & 111) in 1942. The
concertos were recorded in July with the Chicago SO under frederick
Stock and the sonatas in June in NY. None of them replaces or is
superior to the earlier 1930s versions. Which is not to say that they
are not worth having - they most certainly are.
DK will vehemently disagree, but the Solomon recordings are superb. He
actually did all 5 Beethovens - there is a German EMI box which is
excellent. The dates are earlier than 1958, as he had his stroke in
1956 which finished his career (although he lived until 1988). If the
price is right.....
--
Deryk.
=================================================================
|Deryk Barker, Computer Science Dept. | Without music, life |
|Camosun College, Victoria, BC, Canada | would be a mistake |
|email: dba...@camosun.bc.ca | |
|phone: +1 604 370 4452 | (Friedrich Nietzsche).|
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