Interesting Brunno Walter box set from Sony

[nichol...@gmail.com]

http://klassik.sonymusic.de/Bruno-Walter/Bruno-Walter-The-Edition/P/2787736

This looks like the same sort of packaging/idea as the Bernstein symphony box.

It is available for pre-order on amazon.co.uk, but I can not find it on amazon.com.

[wade]

I wish sony would issue the mono beethovens with both Ninth Finales

[hiker_rs]

On May 15, 9:56 am, nicholasg1...@gmail.com wrote:
> http://klassik.sonymusic.de/Bruno-Walter/Bruno-Walter-The-Edition/P/2...

>
> This looks like the same sort of packaging/idea as the Bernstein symphony box.
>
> It is available for pre-order on amazon.co.uk, but I can not find it on amazon.com.

I haven't checked disc-for-disc but this appears to be a straight
reissue of the BW Edition issued previously but this time all in one
box this and presumably cheaper.

I guess it's interesting if you didn't buy it the 1st time. But as far
as I can tell there's not even any of the "never published" items used
to make other box sets more enticing.

A pass for me.

Rich

[Ray Hall]

In individual CDs I've got nearly 3/4 of this box. I'm wondering
whether, as in the case of the Bernstein Sony Mahler box, there is much
improvement in the sound that would make me even consider buying this box.

Ray Hall, Taree

[Randy Lane]

No change from the original CD issues of Bruno Walter: The Edition. I bought the Korean Edition a few months ago, as I only had a few of the recordings (Mahler, Brahms, Mozart). I far prefer Walter's NYPO recordings, and avoided getting most of the CSO recordings unless very cheap, which this set is.

[wkasimer]

On May 15, 1:36 pm, hiker_rs <schie...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

> A pass for me.

Same here. I have most of the contents, and the box is a space hog.

Bill

[wagnerfan]

I'm more interested in this big Szell box

http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B00BANCWSO/ref=dp_olp_0?ie=UTF8&condition=all

I was really impressed with the sound of the Szell Beethoven
Symphonies in the original jacket Collectionfrom a few years ago and
wonder if this new set includes those remasterings. Wagner fan

[td]

On May 15, 1:36 pm, hiker_rs <schie...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

I didn't buy these sets the first time around, so I am very
interested.

As far as the "never published" items, I would await a complete
tracklisting rather than the summary here before making a judgment
that they are not included, or won't be.

TD

[td]

On May 15, 2:21 pm, wagnerfan <ivanmax...@gmail.com> wrote:

>  I'm more interested in this big Szell box
>

> http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B00BANCWSO/ref=dp_olp_0?ie=UTF...

Of course you are. You couldn't possibly tell the difference between a
musician and a martinet.

TD

[Randy Lane]

The set is sort of "Original Jacket" in concept. Instead of original LP jackets and contents that match the original LP the cardboard jackets in the box have artwork and contents that match the CDs in the Bruno Walter: The Edition series.

[Bob Harper]

You overstate the case, Tom. Yes, Szell could be inflexible, but there
are plenty of exceptions. The Tokyo Sibelius 2nd, the Mendelssohn
Italian, the Mozart Concerto 25 with Fleisher, and (for me) the Haydn 97
come immediately to mind. And the Eroica is still one of the great ones.

Bob Harper

[Bob Harper]

And I could not forget to add the wonderful Orfeo disc of Beethoven:
Egmont, 3rd Concerto (Gilels), and Symphony 5 (all VPO). Wow!

Bob Harper

[J.Martin]

On May 15, 8:39 am, wade <wadewo...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On Wednesday, May 15, 2013 7:56:26 AM UTC-7, Nicholas G wrote:

> >http://klassik.sonymusic.de/Bruno-Walter/Bruno-Walter-The-Edition/P/2...

>
> > This looks like the same sort of packaging/idea as the Bernstein symphony box.
>
> > It is available for pre-order on amazon.co.uk, but I can not find it on amazon.com.
>
> I wish sony would issue the mono beethovens with both Ninth Finales

I imagine you know that M&A did just that? They don't sell that set in
the states, but it can be purchased here with a little ingenuity.
Also, United Archives put out the mono cycle, albeit with only one of
the finales, and it is occasionally avaible from Berkshire for very
cheap. Indispensible stuff, IMO.

[maready]

Yes! The United Archives Bruno Walter Beethoven set is a treasure. And
often available from Berkshire Record Outlet. It doesn't include both
finales of the 9th, but it does include the earlier recordings of the
3rd and 5th on a 'bonus disc' (i.e. in addition to, not in place of,
the 3rd and 5th from the Columbia mono cycle.)

[David Fox]

The M&A set has only one finale (the retake). Perhaps the original
Finale is on another M&A reissue, but the box of the NYPO Beethoven
cycle (plus the early 1940's Nos. 3 & 5) doesn't have it.

DF

[J.Martin]

>
> The M&A set has only one finale (the retake).  Perhaps the original
> Finale is on another M&A reissue, but the box of the NYPO Beethoven
> cycle (plus the early 1940's Nos. 3 & 5) doesn't have it.
>

> DF- Hide quoted text -
>

Ah, sorry, now that I think about it I realize you're right. The
original finale is indeed on another M&A issue, a stand alone CD.

[wade]

what's the CD number?

[hiker_rs]

On May 16, 12:39 pm, David Fox <davidfox2...@yahoo.com> wrote:


> The M&A set has only one finale (the retake).  Perhaps the original
> Finale is on another M&A reissue, but the box of the NYPO Beethoven
> cycle (plus the early 1940's Nos. 3 & 5) doesn't have it.

You reversed them.

The M&A set (the box of all symphonies, CD-1137(6) ) has only the
original finale from 1949.

A separate CD (CD-1155(1)) contains the commonly issued retake from
1953.

See here:

http://www.musicandarts.com/HistoricalClassical.html#WAlTER

Rich

[wkasimer]

On May 16, 1:27 pm, "J.Martin" <sixthg...@gmail.com> wrote:

> I imagine you know that M&A did just that? They don't sell that set in
> the states, but it can be purchased here with a little ingenuity.

No ingenuity required, just a Visa or Mastercard (they don't take
Amex):

http://www.mdt.co.uk/walter-bruno-beethoven-symphonies-new-orchestras-music-and-arts-6cds.html

> Also, United Archives put out the mono cycle, albeit with only one of
> the finales, and it is occasionally avaible from Berkshire for very
> cheap.

No need to wait for a BRO reappearance; MDT has this one, too:

http://www.mdt.co.uk/beethoven-the-complete-symphonies-1941-52-bruno-walter-united-archives-6cds.html

Bill

[wade]

M&A says its box has the ORIGINAL finale with Irma Gonzalez, Raoul Jobim, etc. I have the United Arts box which has the REMAKE finale.

[markm...@gmail.com]

Apologies if I missed this, but why was the finale re-done? Are there significant problems, artistic or technical, with the earlier version?

Mark

[wagnerfan]

I have the UA boxed set and its wonderful though I'm not sure I
prefer it as a whole over the stereo remakes- Even if I don't agree
with Dr. Walter in a certain piece I alwasys admire the affection,
care and beauty of the readings. It must have been a joy to play
under him Wagner fan

[hiker_rs]

> M&A says its box has the ORIGINAL finale with Irma Gonzalez, Raoul Jobim, etc.  I have the United Arts box which has the REMAKE finale.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Exactly, you have to buy the big M&A set to get the earlier 1949
recording of 9.IV.

[wade]

and buy it from somebody in Europe. Rather pricey alternative. 6 discs for 1 finale. :-(

[hiker_rs]

On May 16, 4:12 pm, markmls...@gmail.com wrote:

> Apologies if I missed this, but why was the finale re-done? Are there significant problems, artistic or technical, with the earlier version?

Walter didn't like how the voices were recorded, claiming (among other
things) that the recording favored the male chorus voices over the
female.

Rich

[Dontait...@aol.com]

Those were factors. So were the soloists. Walter had wanted his favored soprano, Eleanor Steber, for the 1949 recording, but due to advice she received she backed out. Walter made his anger and unhappiness very clear to her (Ryding & Penchovsky Walter biography, Steber memoirs). So he had to settle for Gonzalez at the last minute in 1949. Also, there was the overall sound: the 1949 finale, like the entire recording, was made in Columbia's 30th Street Studio with its flawed acoustics for large forces (such as any large orchestra and the Beethoven 9th finale). So in 1953 the finale was re-made in Carnegie Hall, a sonically better place for Beethoven 9 finale, and with vocal soloists some of whom were more to Walter's liking. (They recorded Bruckner's Te Deum the same day.)

As a long-time Walter fan and collector, I've always felt that the 1949 finale is a discographic curiosity that's good to know and hear -- once. 1953 is better. Walter knew best. As always. And the entire 1949 9th gives one the dreadful sound of the Philharmonic in Columbia's 30th Street studio with lots of phony reverb. Hollow-sounding. Crummy.

Don Tait

[markm...@gmail.com]

Thanks for clearing that up, Don. Good to know. Now I'll have to find the Walter biography to learn how he made known his displeasure with Steber.

Mark

[wade]

wish she HAD done that recording. early Prime Steber time then. Wish she had been able to be loaned to RCA for the Munch Damnation too, as she did the live performances.

[wagnerfan]

On Sun, 19 May 2013 08:12:01 -0700 (PDT), wade <wade...@hotmail.com>

I'll have to check but I think I downloaded from somewhere one of
those live performances with Steber. Yes those years were really
vocally prime for her = although little discussed for some reason her
Elsa at Bayreuth in 1953 is well nigh perfect. Wagner fan

[Nicholas G]

It's now on Amazon.com: -

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00BNZN27E/ref=ox_sc_act_title_3?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER

[David Fox]

FYI - the United Archives Bruno Walter NYPO set with the 1953 Finale is
available once again at Berkshire for $24.

I borrowed the UA set over the weekend and listened to the 1953 finale.
It is much better than the 1949 version. Thanks for the
recommendation and the background, Don!

DF