William Steinberg Beethoven

[Randy Lane]

Saw this on Amazon.co.uk today.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Beethoven-Pittsburgh-Symphony-Orchestra-Steinberg/dp/B084WPJWBC/

Could these be Connoisseur Society recordings?
That label is part of the UMG empire I believe.

[ways]

original release as far as i know
https://img.discogs.com/5Y5-i0PloK-Sh4whD2ZoVM01GeM=/fit-in/600x595/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-3426520-1422078398-3007.jpeg.jpg

[markm...@gmail.com]

They first appeared on LP on the Command label. I have a couple of the original LPs.

Mark M

[Kerrison]

According to John L. Holmes' "Conductors on Record," Steinberg recorded two Beethoven cycles, one for Capitol and the other for Command, both with the Pittsburgh SO. Holmes doesn't give the respective dates so I wonder how far apart the two cycles were recorded. If memory serves, a coupling of the 'Capitol' 8th & 9th Symphonies appeared on the UK 'Music for Pleasure' label and was reviewed in the Gramophone. A reader then wrote in to ask why the expert who reviewed the LPs failed to notice that the 9th was in Mahler's re-orchestration. I think the reply was that the changes weren't all that noticeable, which makes one wonder why a reader can spot them but a critic cannot. I wonder if Steinberg used the Mahler edition in his Command re-recording.

[chriskh...@gmail.com]

The critic in the EMG Monthly Letter trashed the Steinberg 9th because of its appalling reorchestrations, so he (almost certainly Basil Lam) noticed all right, but assumed they changes were Steinberg's own

[John Fowler]

I've been looking forward to this for a long time.
For once, there is a reliable discography on Wikipedia:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Steinberg#Recording_Chronology

Steinberg/Pittsburgh recorded Symphonies 3,5,6,7 and 8 for EMI/Capitol Records in the 1950s (all but 7 were mono).
Between 1961 and 1968 they recorded all nine for Command Classics, an independent audiophile label founded by Enoch Light.
Recorded on 35mm film (their LP pressings were the only disappointment).
Command is now owned by DG/Universal.
I remember in 1967 when the Ninth Symphony was was released there was a lot of publicity about Steinberg using the Mahler re-orchestration.

[John Fowler]

Pre-order price on Amazon UK is £20 ($26).

[Alan Dawes]

In article <73e7faf5-884d-4f79...@googlegroups.com>,

Richard Osborne wrote an article last year for Gramophone about "Beethoven
arr Mahler Symphony No 9, Choral" and its recordings:

https://www.gramophone.co.uk/review/beethoven-arr-mahler-symphony-no-9-choral

Alan

--
alan....@argonet.co.uk
alan....@riscos.org
Using an ARMX6

[Frank Berger]

On 2/23/2020 2:15 AM, chriskh...@gmail.com wrote:
> The critic in the EMG Monthly Letter trashed the Steinberg 9th because of its appalling reorchestrations, so he (almost certainly Basil Lam) noticed all right, but assumed they changes were Steinberg's own
>
> If memory serves, a coupling of the 'Capitol' 8th & 9th Symphonies appeared on the UK 'Music for Pleasure' label and was reviewed in the Gramophone. A reader then wrote in to ask why the expert who reviewed the LPs failed to notice that the 9th was in Mahler's re-orchestration. I think the reply was that the changes weren't all that noticeable, which makes one wonder why a reader can spot them but a critic cannot. I wonder if Steinberg used the Mahler edition in his Command re-recording.
>

Such a release did exist, but they were the Command recordings, not Capitol.

[Frank Berger]

I'm sure you meant Command Classics and not CS. Seems like it would
have to be since Steinberg did not record a complete cycle for Capitol.
I wonder if the 35mm master tapes exist and are in good shape. The
Command cycle was successfully transfered (from LP, I guess) by St.
Laurent.

[Kerrison]

Yes, you're right. The links below show the 'Music for Pleasure' LP covers (two different designs) with "Stereo / Mono" top right, so that indeed makes their release as having been taken from the Command LPs.

Sleeve Design No. 1 ...

https://www.cdandlp.com/en/william-steinberg-pittsburgh-symphony-orchestra/beethoven-:-symphonies-9-and-8/double-lp-gatefold/r117968210/

Sleeve Design No. 2 ...

https://www.discogs.com/Beethoven-Steinberg-Pittsburgh-Symphony-Ninth-Symphony-Also-The-Eighth-Symphony/release/1661550

[John Fowler]

http://www.rediscovery.us/conductors2.html

look up Steinberg Beethoven Symphony 9

[John Fowler]

Uh Oh,
The track description is William Steinberg, Pitsburgh Symphony, but the cover photo reads Peter Tiboris, Brno Philharmonic (1992)
Tiboris also recorded the Mahler orchestration.

[John Fowler]

The cover photo on my Groove Music playback.

[Frank Berger]

That's not what I see.

[Ricardo Jimenez]

The accompanying discussion discs to Benjamin Zander's recording of
the 9th with the Philharmonia (available on Spotify) gets into this
issue also. He uses a grand piano to reinforce the bass in the
recapitulation of the first movement. I never would have known. I
think Mahler may have used a tuba or two for the same purpose.

[Steve Emerson]

David Gideon (reDiscovery) transferred a good bit of Command material, and some of the Steinberg Beethoven can now be downloaded free in his MP3 files: No's 1, 5, 6, 7, 8, and 9 ("Mahler Edition").

http://www.rediscovery.us/conductors2.html

SE.

[Russ (not Martha)]

I'm very happy to see Steinberg's great Beethoven cycle available at last in
a commercial issue from the original source tapes, but I am quite satisfied with the Rediscovery CD restorations, the adequate MCA reissues of 2, 4, & 7, and my own open-reel sourced Eroica.

Russ (not Martha)

[Kerrison]

If you google "William Steinberg EMI Classics Icons Set" you should with any luck find details of a 20-CD set which states is "The Complete EMI Recordings" but is incomplete! ... The orchestras shown on the box track listings are the Philharmonia and the Pittsburgh Symphony. There's a mixture of mono and stereo and CDs 1, 2 and 3 feature Beethoven 3 & 8, 5 & 6, and No. 7 with the Emperor Concerto (Firkusny). According to this Classics Today article, the missing items include the Tchaikovsky 5th and William Schuman's Symphony for Strings ...

https://www.classicstoday.com/review/review-16260/

[gggg...@gmail.com]

On Friday, February 21, 2020 at 10:25:49 PM UTC-8, Randy Lane wrote:

Concerning the Pastoral:

William Steinberg, Pittsburgh Symphony Orchestra (1967, Command LP, 40½’)

– And so could a small independent label. Fine, enthusiastic playing from a regional ensemble, enhanced by demonstration-quality fidelity. (Note: the more readily available Steinberg/Pittsburgh 44-minute 1952 mono Capitol LP/EMI CD documents that the consummate playing was no fluke, but is less stirring.)

http://classicalnotes.net/classics4/pastoral.html

[msw design]

On Sunday, February 23, 2020 at 12:08:52 PM UTC-6, Steve Emerson wrote:

> David Gideon (reDiscovery) transferred a good bit of Command material, and some of the Steinberg Beethoven can now be downloaded free in his MP3 files: No's 1, 5, 6, 7, 8, and 9 ("Mahler Edition").
>
> http://www.rediscovery.us/conductors2.html
>
> SE.

There's no 7, though the companion Stokie recording is welcome.

[Not a Dentist]

NOTE that the headline is misleading in the extreme: of these three recordings, ONLY the Kristjan Järvi uses the Mahler edition.

[Steve Emerson]

Right you are. Who knows why he omitted the symphonies he did. I was about to suggest that maybe they hadn't been released on reel-to-reel, but I have the reel of the No. 4/ Leonore 3 staring me in the face.

SE.

[Russ (not Martha)]

The Mozart "Haffner" and "Jupiter" Symphonies are also missing from the set.
I remastered these along with the Tchaikovsky 5 some time before the EMI set was issued.

Russ (not Martha)

[vih...@protonmail.com]

The Command recordings were stereo, weren't they? Looking forward to hearing these.. I have the Capitol 3 and 8, and other than a couple of oddly-characterized moments in the Eroica, I think they're just great.

[John Fowler]

On Friday, February 28, 2020 at 5:25:43 PM UTC-6, vih...@protonmail.com wrote:
> The Command recordings were stereo, weren't they? Looking forward to hearing these.. I have the Capitol 3 and 8, and other than a couple of oddly-characterized moments in the Eroica, I think they're just great.

Yes stereo

[vih...@protonmail.com]

Cool.

[John Fowler]

Amazon UK has the cover photo of the Steinberg Beethoven box:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Beethoven-Pittsburgh-Symphony-Orchestra-Steinberg/dp/B084WPJWBC/ref=pd_sbs_15_4/258-3041713-7885509?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B084WPJWBC&pd_rd_r=e917dbaa-3389-4a3e-a6af-ccb34e134e73&pd_rd_w=LAlQP&pd_rd_wg=FDzIC&pf_rd_p=96cae456-8d7a-4bc1-91c7-9b20b4dfd7c9&pf_rd_r=BYJB1BE47TWAT708N93Q&psc=1&refRID=BYJB1BE47TWAT708N93Q

[vih...@protonmail.com]

On Thursday, March 5, 2020 at 1:31:58 PM UTC, John Fowler wrote:
> Amazon UK has the cover photo of the Steinberg Beethoven box:

Excellent- thanks!

[Steve Emerson]

On Thursday, March 5, 2020 at 5:31:58 AM UTC-8, John Fowler wrote:
> Amazon UK has the cover photo of the Steinberg Beethoven box:
> https://www.amazon.co.uk/Beethoven-Pittsburgh-Symphony-Orchestra-Steinberg/dp/B084WPJWBC/ref=pd_sbs_15_4/258-3041713-7885509?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B084WPJWBC&pd_rd_r=e917dbaa-3389-4a3e-a6af-ccb34e134e73&pd_rd_w=LAlQP&pd_rd_wg=FDzIC&pf_rd_p=96cae456-8d7a-4bc1-91c7-9b20b4dfd7c9&pf_rd_r=BYJB1BE47TWAT708N93Q&psc=1&refRID=BYJB1BE47TWAT708N93Q

Interesting! And reassuring. Did you look at the second image? (Entirely Japanese.)

SE.

[Frank Berger]

Yes. So I looked for it at hmv.co.jp and they didn't have it. They do
list the Yves St. Laurent set.

[Frank Berger]

On 3/5/2020 1:15 PM, Steve Emerson wrote:

Amazon show a set of the Steinberg Command Beethoven symphonies I never
noticed before on a label called "XXI." The interesting thing is the
Universal logo on the back suggesting they were licensed and perhaps not
LP transfers like the St. Laurent. All obsolete, I suppose with the DG
set coming out, unless DG botches the mastering. I have the St. Laurent
set and it sounds very good.

[fomalhaut]

The St Laurent set and the XXI-21 set should by the same transfers.
On the back page of the XXI-21 set, it is specified :

QUOTE

THIS RELEASE
Artistic Directoe & Recording Producer: Martin Duchesne
Direct LP Trasfer and Mastering: Yves St-Laurent/St-Laurent Studio
www.78.experience.com
Many thanks to:
Dr. Jonn Nemaric: PHD/Osher Institute at Carnegie Mellon University
INITIAL RELEASE
Sound Engineers : C. Robert Fine & Wilma Cozart
All recordings done on 35mm film using only 3 mics : 2 Telefunken and on Stanley Church
Recorded at the Pittsburg's Soldiers Memorial Hall: 1961-1965

UNQUOTE

The publicayion date is 2011. I baught the XXI-21 set from Amazon France in 2012.

fomalhaut