iPod for idiots question
Tony Vella
comments involving ipods so I thought I would ask for some advice.
My wife and I (we're in our 60s) are thinking of giving ourselves an ipod
and deck (if deck is what it's called - it charges and has speakers) for the
holidays. So we went to Futureshop and Wal-Mart to ask questions (we know
nothing about these machines) but all whom we spoke to kept talking about
songs, songs, songs. I tried to explain that we are interested in classical
music and that while it is easy to play a song "one title, one track ", with
classical music one would at times want to play any number of tracks in a
particular sequence (concerto, symphony, collected nocturnes, opera are good
examples). To which I invariably got a rather dismissive shoulder-shrug.
So I turn to this group: How do you enter classical MP3s into an ipod?
For example, do you have to title the tracks as beethoven6-1, beethoven6-2,
beethoven6-3, etc. and then create a playlist to play the complete symphony
in proper movement sequence? As you can see I have never held an ipod in my
hand so I have no idea what the "menu" looks like or how it works. Neither
FS nor W-M would allow me to actually hold one to try to get the feel for
it.
Would someone please explain to this old geezer in "for idiot" words how the
contraption works or at least point me to some site that would break the ice
for me. The Source wants $400 for an ipod (without deck) and we can't
afford to throw that much money on a mistake. Thanks in advance.
--
Tony Vella
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
O
<tony....@rogers.com> wrote:
To enter classical music into an iPod you need a computer that can run
iTunes. You can download iTunes free from Apple: www.apple.com You
can download it even if you don't have a iPod, and load music into it
for when you do. iTunes allows you to import music from the web, from
the iTunes store, and even by importing music directly from your CDs.
Then you plug a USB cable into your computer and into your iPod, and
tell it to sync.
You don't have to title most music yourself, it's already done. iTunes
uses a service called Gracenote to title your music at the point where
you enter it. That doesn't mean it's perfectly titled, sometimes it
has mistakes, and sometimes the title isn't quite what you'd like it to
be, but generally, most music is titled already. You can create
playlists simply by 1) creating a new playlist (click on a '+' sign
button), 2) give the playlist a title ("Beethoven 2nd Symph Abbado,
e.g.) and dragging the appropriate tracks into the newly created
playlist. You can use one computer, but set up your two iPhones
differently.
If you want a hands-on experience, visit a local Apple store, if you
have one - most hi-end malls do. If you want to save a bit of money on
refurbished models, go to apple's website, click store, then scroll
around and click on the price tag.
The website is www.apple.com. The "deck" is a third party item not
built by Apple. You might want to try to hear this first before you
buy, to insure it meets you listening needs (i.e. renders a suitable
sound quality)
-Owen
Jerry
> In article <AuGdnSXLTePFK7LWnZ2dnUVZ_o-dn...@giganews.com>, Tony Vella
> built by Apple. You might want to try to hear this first before you
> buy, to insure it meets you listening needs (i.e. renders a suitable
> sound quality)
>
>
> - Show quoted text -
Owen's introduction is a good one and I appreciate it.
I also have had the same questions, but would caution
not to expect too much from the Apple store. The fellows
at my Apple store are friendly and eager to help, but
don't have answers to my most urgent questions.
The things that have turned me off (or, failed to
turn me on, if I might frame it more positively)
are:
1 - It's never quite clear how much TIME any particular
model will hold. They're always, as you've noted,
talking about songs, songs, songs.
2 - The data that is entered from Gracenotes is
usually wrong (i.e. Composers are often listed
as First Name First; so both Beethoven and Mozart
would be listed under 'L' - doesn't make sense
to me.
Jerry
wagnerfan
"Jerry" <GPGe...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:22ee53bf-84b1-4b9d...@u20g2000vbq.googlegroups.com...
Jerry
They really can't tell you how much time an IPOD will hold since it depends
on the bit rate used for the uploads - the higher the bit rate the less the
time. I can tell you that I have an IPOD classic (160 GB) and it holds more
music and movies than I could ever imagine. Wagner fan
Lionel Tacchini
> 2 - The data that is entered from Gracenotes is
> usually wrong (i.e. Composers are often listed
> as First Name First; so both Beethoven and Mozart
> would be listed under 'L' - doesn't make sense
> to me.
That's Leopold.
Makes sense now ?
;-)
Allen
> 2 - The data that is entered from Gracenotes is
> usually wrong (i.e. Composers are often listed
> as First Name First; so both Beethoven and Mozart
> would be listed under 'L' - doesn't make sense
> to me.
>
> Jerry
high-capacity iPods or similar. I have learned this: Apple doesn't give
a damn about classical music. If they did they would set and maintain
standards for Gracenotes. Trying to correct GN or sometimes just bypass
it, has required much more time than the actual burning. I guess they
don't see an opportunity to make a fortune off of classical.
Allen
Jerry
Sorry, my mistake.
L for Beethoven, W for Mozart.
I've just experimented with iTunes and fibd it extremely
frustrating. I chose, for a test, the Levine/Met
CD of Pictures at an Exhibition and Sacre du Printemps.
Using iTunes, I copied it my computer and it came over
as a single "album" with 28 tracks. So far,
so good.
At that point, however, I can't see how one can separate
the two works (into, for example) two "playlists," so
each can be triggered separately.
I was able to create new playlists, but can't populate
them with the appropriate tracks. Clicking and
dragging didn't work.
So, at the moment, my test has failed since all tracks are
in one place (Music Library).
Any suggestions?
O
<d09af6db-bd1a-4572...@t19g2000vbc.googlegroups.com>,
Jerry <GPGe...@aol.com> wrote:
You should have a playlist, named, for example, Pictures. This should
appear in the playlist listing on the lower left. Click at the top
under "music" which should reveal all the music in iTunes. Scroll to
the tracks for Pictures at an Exhibition. Click on the first track.
Hold shift and click on the last track. Click in the selected work and
drag the body so that the mouse pointer is over the word "Pictures" (or
whatever you titled your playlist) in the playlist listing. Drop.
Click on the playlist name. Play.
>
> So, at the moment, my test has failed since all tracks are
> in one place (Music Library).
Your tracks stay in the music library, but pointers to them are in
multiple playlists.
Click on the playlist name to reveal its contents.
-Owen
wkasimer
For another point of view, I've avoided iPods and iTunes and every
other iContraption. I'm a control fanatic, and have found a variety
of software for different needs - one to rip the tracks from the CD to
MP3 format, another to process the tracks if needed, and yet another
to "relabel" the files so that they show up where I want them on my
MP3 players.
So I can buy cheap MP3 players made by Sansa, and plug them into my
computer and use them just like any other removable drive. And if I
need to, I can plug them into my regular audio system.
The downside is that finding, and learning the various pieces of
software takes a little time and some "trial and error".
Bill
Mr. Mike
<tony....@rogers.com> wrote:
>I tried to explain that we are interested in classical
>music and that while it is easy to play a song "one title, one track ", with
>classical music one would at times want to play any number of tracks in a
>particular sequence (concerto, symphony, collected nocturnes, opera are good
>examples). To which I invariably got a rather dismissive shoulder-shrug.
>
>So I turn to this group: How do you enter classical MP3s into an ipod?
>For example, do you have to title the tracks as beethoven6-1, beethoven6-2,
>beethoven6-3, etc. and then create a playlist to play the complete symphony
>in proper movement sequence?
What is the source for this classical music that you want to enter
into the Ipod?
Are you going to be buying MP3 downloads from Itunes, or are you going
to transfer your CD collection to it, or are you going to be digitizng
your LP collection and transferring that?
If you are just transferring CDs, as someone else has mentioned, there
are "tags" associated with the pieces on the CD which give information
about the composer, name of the piece, orchestra, etc., which are
usually transferred to the device so you can see information
associated with what you are playing.
If the music is either in MP3 format or gets converted to that format,
because of the way MP3 files are structured, there is a small gap
between one MP3 file and the next when played back, which is very
audible if you are converting a CD of an opera or some symphonic work
which is broken up into multiple tracks where the music might be
continuous.
Most (all?) Ipods will attempt to merge these files together with
"gapless" playback -- which is not perfect, but pretty close.
>The Source wants $400 for an ipod (without deck) and we can't
>afford to throw that much money on a mistake.
Which Ipod is this? An Itouch? That sounds like the price for one
which has 32 gigabytes of storage ... which is probably far more than
you need, unless you have an extremely large CD collection you want to
convert.
wagnerfan
messagenews:211220091431451525%ow...@denofinequityx.com...
He can also split the album right in his Itunes library. Just highlight the
tracks that are in the Pictures, then right click, under Get Info - change
the the name of the album to lets say _ Levine Pictures - Itunes will then
make a new album with just the Levine Pictures. its easy once you get the
hang of it. Wagner fan
wagnerfan
news:q6jvi5h75o714bo82...@4ax.com...
>conversion - there are no gaps at all - it plays right through the tracks
>with no hiccups Wagner Fan
David Oberman
<wkas...@comcast.net> wrote:
>For another point of view, I've avoided iPods and iTunes and every
>other iContraption. I'm a control fanatic, and have found a variety
>of software for different needs - one to rip the tracks from the CD to
>MP3 format, another to process the tracks if needed, and yet another
>to "relabel" the files so that they show up where I want them on my
>MP3 players.
>
>So I can buy cheap MP3 players made by Sansa, and plug them into my
>computer and use them just like any other removable drive. And if I
>need to, I can plug them into my regular audio system.
I second these views. I'm happier with my Sansa 2-GB MP3 player than I
was with my old iPod. (My Sansa also has an AM-FM radio tuner & a
digital recorder feature.)
>The downside is that finding, and learning the various pieces of
>software takes a little time and some "trial and error".
It takes a little time, but not much. I use CDex
(cdexos.sourceforge.net) to rip MP3s from audio CDs, & then just load
the MP3s onto the Sansa via Windows Explorer -- an easy drag-&-drop.
Freeware MP3 players (like Winamp) almost always allow you to rename a
file so that you can get files to play in alphabetical and/or
chronological order on your MP3 player. It's a simple matter of
numbering everything in the order you want it in: 01, 02, 03, etc.
O
<m...@spamcop.net> wrote:
> On Mon, 21 Dec 2009 12:54:43 -0500, "Tony Vella"
> <tony....@rogers.com> wrote:
>
> >I tried to explain that we are interested in classical
> >music and that while it is easy to play a song "one title, one track ", with
> >classical music one would at times want to play any number of tracks in a
> >particular sequence (concerto, symphony, collected nocturnes, opera are good
> >examples). To which I invariably got a rather dismissive shoulder-shrug.
> >
> >So I turn to this group: How do you enter classical MP3s into an ipod?
> >For example, do you have to title the tracks as beethoven6-1, beethoven6-2,
> >beethoven6-3, etc. and then create a playlist to play the complete symphony
> >in proper movement sequence?
>
> What is the source for this classical music that you want to enter
> into the Ipod?
>
> Are you going to be buying MP3 downloads from Itunes, or are you going
> to transfer your CD collection to it, or are you going to be digitizng
> your LP collection and transferring that?
iTunes does not have MP3 downloads. They are in AAC or Apple lossless
formats.
>
> If you are just transferring CDs, as someone else has mentioned, there
> are "tags" associated with the pieces on the CD which give information
> about the composer, name of the piece, orchestra, etc., which are
> usually transferred to the device so you can see information
> associated with what you are playing.
To be more precise, a CD is analyzed according to some parameters,
(such as timings) and matched in a database of such things to come up
with the track names. There are no "tags" on normal CD music.
>
> If the music is either in MP3 format or gets converted to that format,
> because of the way MP3 files are structured, there is a small gap
> between one MP3 file and the next when played back, which is very
> audible if you are converting a CD of an opera or some symphonic work
> which is broken up into multiple tracks where the music might be
> continuous.
This does not take place using the AAC on the ipod.
-Owen
>
Lionel Tacchini
> For another point of view, I've avoided iPods and iTunes and every
> other iContraption. I'm a control fanatic, and have found a variety
> of software for different needs - one to rip the tracks from the CD to
> MP3 format, another to process the tracks if needed, and yet another
> to "relabel" the files so that they show up where I want them on my
> MP3 players.
I suppose you can do most of this with Audiograbber (free) and as to
relabelling, this can be done on Windows by simply right clicking the
Properties of the files (one or several at once) then select the
Summary tab and click the Advanced button.
Once there it is possible to edit the usual mp3 attributes like artist,
album, track title, track number, genre...
The composer attribute, although most appropriate to classical music,
will not necessarily be handled by all players so it is probably better
to try and fit into the Artist / Album scheme.
> So I can buy cheap MP3 players made by Sansa, and plug them into my
> computer and use them just like any other removable drive. And if I
> need to, I can plug them into my regular audio system.
Or any decent mobile phone with a micro SD card reader. I have an 8GB
card in mine and could use 16GB if I wanted to.
Mobile phones nowadays also come with CD ripping, tag editing and data
transferring SW as well, so this should be a very viable alternative.
Lionel Tacchini
Taree Dawg
Wouldn't it be better (although i know NUTHINK much about iPods) to buy
oneself a card reader and a couple of SD cards, and buy a little
portable device that reads and plays from SD cards?
I have just bought a Laser card reader and a 4G card for about $35. It
works like a dream for portable storage.
I wouldn't pay $400 plus for an iPod. In addition, I let a neighbourhood
kid who had just arrived in this country, use of my pc for downloading
songs into his iPod. iTunes nearly wrecked my computer. I got rid of
iTunes quick smart when the kid got his computer back.
Ray Hall, Taree
Taree Dawg
Get rid of iTunes and look for alternatives.
Ray Hall, Taree
O
Dawg <raymon...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>
> Wouldn't it be better (although i know NUTHINK much about iPods) to buy
> oneself a card reader and a couple of SD cards, and buy a little
> portable device that reads and plays from SD cards?
>
> I have just bought a Laser card reader and a 4G card for about $35. It
> works like a dream for portable storage.
>
> I wouldn't pay $400 plus for an iPod. In addition, I let a neighbourhood
> kid who had just arrived in this country, use of my pc for downloading
> songs into his iPod. iTunes nearly wrecked my computer. I got rid of
> iTunes quick smart when the kid got his computer back.
I don't know where Tony lives, but if in the US, he can pick up a
refurb iPod 120GB for $189 with full Apple 1 year warranty, from Apple
at:
<http://store.apple.com/us/product/FB565LL/A?mco=MTEyNzg3NTU>
or, if you have more music, a 160 GB for $199.00 at:
<http://store.apple.com/us/product/FB150LL/A?mco=MTM3MTYyMjY>
Both of these direct from Apple, free shipping include the same
warranty, manuals and accessories as the new versions. The 160GB is a
previous model, the 120GB the latest model.
-Owen
Doug McDonald
> I lurk here more than I contribute, I'm afraid. I have seen quite a few
> comments involving ipods so I thought I would ask for some advice.
>
I want an MP3 player and after trying several non-Apple ones, which
all broke in less than two weeks, I went with an iPod nano II, which
lasted 17 months and was replaced uder Best Buy's extended warranty
by an iPod Nano III.
The answer to the questions are, iTunes will do what you need,
though sometimes painfully. As others state, downloaded MP3 and
the things from the Apple store are usually annotated painfully wrong.
You just have to edit the annotations. iTunes will do this. So will
other freeware things, such as Mp3Tag which will "batch"
edit them.
You will eventually find a "style" that works well for you.
iTunes is free. Try it and some downloads from Amazon and
other sources. Various famous orchestras offer quite
a few free ones.
Doug McDonald
O
Dawg <raymon...@bigpond.com> wrote:
> I wouldn't pay $400 plus for an iPod. In addition, I let a neighbourhood
> kid who had just arrived in this country, use of my pc for downloading
> songs into his iPod. iTunes nearly wrecked my computer. I got rid of
> iTunes quick smart when the kid got his computer back.
I would suspect that the sites your neighbor visited to get his songs
were more the source of your problem then iTunes. Sites like Kazaa
seem to wreak havoc on any machine. ITunes in and of itself, though
far from a perfect program, is probably not what wrecked your computer.
-Owen
Dave Cook
> So I turn to this group: How do you enter classical MP3s into an ipod?
You don't need to worry about track sequence, as this should be
automatic. If you use iTunes for ripping and downloading (which uses
the Gracenotes database), the files will at least have a COMPOSER
field. This is slightly better than the other online databases, which
have no consistent way to store the composer name. But you do need to
check the ARTIST and TITLE fields to make sure that the information is
consistent and complete enough so that you can find things later by
searching.
Dave Cook
Dave Cook
> a damn about classical music. If they did they would set and maintain
> standards for Gracenotes. Trying to correct GN or sometimes just bypass
> it, has required much more time than the actual burning. I guess they
> don't see an opportunity to make a fortune off of classical.
Gracenotes seems to be doing something about it:
http://www.gracenote.com/business_solutions/cmi/
I haven't noticed much practical effect on consistency, though.
However, they have by far the most complete database of classical CDs.
I have many dozens of CDs that were not in freedb but were in
Gracenotes.
The main problem is the legacy tag system. This would not be an issue
if Apple used one of the formats that can take any Vorbis comment.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vorbis_comment
This allows me to give my FLAC files a custom WORK tag, as well as
standard Vorbis tags like COMPOSER, CONDUCTOR, and BAND.
Dave Cook
Steve Spartan
Exact Audio Copy to rip cds
Media Monkey to organize and sync with the player[In my case: Sansa Fuze]
MP3tag to edit mp3 tag info
Mr. Mike
<wagn...@comcast.net> wrote:
>>As for gapless playback - when uploading a CD to Itunes using their default
>>conversion - there are no gaps at all - it plays right through the tracks
>>with no hiccups Wagner Fan
This is not true.
As a test, using my Itouch (8 GB) I copied the Reiner Pictures at an
Exhibition from the hybrid RCA SACD to the Itunes library, then
created a playlist on the Itouch with the selections.
I started listening to each section of the Moussourgsky, and when it
advanced to the next one, moved ahead in time so that there were only
a few seconds left in that section, so I could advance to the next
one.
At at least three places where the music is supposed to be continuous,
there was a very audible gap.
When I went back several seconds into the previous track and let the
music play through where the gap was just heard, there was no gap.
Probably has some technical reason to do with synchronization, but
this demonstrated that the "gapless playback" is not perfect.
O
<m...@spamcop.net> wrote:
According to wikipedia:
"Apple iTunes 7.0 and later versions support as default gapless
playback on Macintosh and Windows without having to combine tracks
during encoding (a limitation of previous releases). Some users in
unusual situations have complained that the one-time analysis is a
system-intensive process that can stall or crash computers. "
If you are encoding to mp3: "This issue is technical but also
standards-related. The popular MP3 standard, for example, defines no
way to record the amount of delay or padding for later removal.[notes
1] Also, the encoder delay may vary from encoder to encoder, making
automatic removal difficult.[2] Even if two tracks are decompressed and
merged into a single track, a gap will usually remain between them.
More recent compressed audio formats (such as Ogg Vorbis) have been
designed to address this problem, and can therefore produce gapless
audio if played back correctly."
You might want to encode in AAC or Apple Lossless, which might fix your
problem.
-Owen
wagnerfan
<ow...@denofinequityx.com> wrote in message
news:211220091757402803%ow...@denofinequityx.com...
As I said, using the Ipod DEFAULT conversion when uploading a CD (AAC and
also with Apple lossless) - there are no gaps. None. Never in the hundreds
of CDs I have uploaded. Wagner fan
Kip Williams
It seems in my experience that whatever order you put the list into when
you look at iTunes last is the order it will play in on your iPod the
next time, so if you have them in reverse order (or some such) for any
reason, be sure and leave them the way you want before you update your iPod.
Kip W
Bob Lombard
>
>
> As I said, using the Ipod DEFAULT conversion when uploading a CD (AAC
> and also with Apple lossless) - there are no gaps. None. Never in the
> hundreds of CDs I have uploaded. Wagner fan
>
I am not convinced that anything transferred from CD to Ipod is an
'upload'.
bl
Mr. Mike
What do you mean by "DEFAULT" conversion?
I stuck the CD in the drive while Itunes was running, and the musical
selections on the CD appeared on the screen. Some message then
appeared about "do you want to copy these files to the Itunes library"
or whatever, which is what I did.
Mr. Mike
wrote:
>According to wikipedia:
>
[various technical gibberish]
>
>You might want to encode in AAC or Apple Lossless, which might fix your
>problem.
This is "too much information" (in addition to much already posted by
others) ... the "old geezer" who posted originally is probably already
running away in horror... ":-/
wagnerfan
To be sure I wasn't going gaga- I uploaded that same SACD Reiner Pictures
(with other material) to Itunes using Apple Lossless rather than my usual
AAC - plays with no gaps. Wagner Fan
wagnerfan
news:CATXm.421446$Jp1.3...@en-nntp-02.dc1.easynews.com...
Good for you. Wagner fan
wagnerfan
"Mr. Mike" <m...@spamcop.net> wrote in message
news:si10j55uqo2dvtokj...@4ax.com...
Yes I agree TMI for sure!!!!- when you upload your CD to Itunes you can set
the way it is uploaded from the Edit-Preferences-Import setting. The default
Apple setting is AAC 128 stereo - however you can switch to Apple Lossless
for better sound or any others listed. of course you can also import many
file types directly to Itunes as MP3s or whatever. Wagner fan
Steve de Mena
> On Dec 21, 1:19 pm, O <ow...@denofinequityx.com> wrote:
>> In article <AuGdnSXLTePFK7LWnZ2dnUVZ_o-dn...@giganews.com>, Tony Vella
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> <tony.ve...@rogers.com> wrote:
>>> I lurk here more than I contribute, I'm afraid. I have seen quite a few
>>> comments involving ipods so I thought I would ask for some advice.
>>> and deck (if deck is what it's called - it charges and has speakers) for the
>>> holidays. So we went to Futureshop and Wal-Mart to ask questions (we know
>>> nothing about these machines) but all whom we spoke to kept talking about
>>> songs, songs, songs. I tried to explain that we are interested in classical
>>> music and that while it is easy to play a song "one title, one track ", with
>>> classical music one would at times want to play any number of tracks in a
>>> particular sequence (concerto, symphony, collected nocturnes, opera are good
>>> examples). To which I invariably got a rather dismissive shoulder-shrug.
>> built by Apple. You might want to try to hear this first before you
>> buy, to insure it meets you listening needs (i.e. renders a suitable
>> sound quality)
>>
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
> Owen's introduction is a good one and I appreciate it.
>
> I also have had the same questions, but would caution
> not to expect too much from the Apple store. The fellows
> at my Apple store are friendly and eager to help, but
> don't have answers to my most urgent questions.
>
> The things that have turned me off (or, failed to
> turn me on, if I might frame it more positively)
> are:
>
> 1 - It's never quite clear how much TIME any particular
> model will hold. They're always, as you've noted,
> talking about songs, songs, songs.
Figure 10 songs equals 1 hour. Estimate from there. (Cut estimates
in 1/2 if using Lossless format). Your mileage may vary.
> 2 - The data that is entered from Gracenotes is
> usually wrong (i.e. Composers are often listed
> as First Name First; so both Beethoven and Mozart
> would be listed under 'L' - doesn't make sense
> to me.
Maybe not, but there is no "wrong" or "right" when it comes to
personal preferences. But COmposer names can be changed en mass with
iTunes (i.e. Select all "Beethoven" and change them with a single
operation)
Steve
Steve de Mena
> Jerry wrote:
>> 2 - The data that is entered from Gracenotes is
>> usually wrong (i.e. Composers are often listed
>> as First Name First; so both Beethoven and Mozart
>> would be listed under 'L' - doesn't make sense
>> to me.
>>
> I have burned 207 gigabytes to disk in hopes of getting one of the
> high-capacity iPods or similar. I have learned this: Apple doesn't give
> standards for Gracenotes.
Gracenotes [sic] is owned by Sony, not Apple.
> Trying to correct GN or sometimes just bypass
> it, has required much more time than the actual burning. I guess they
> don't see an opportunity to make a fortune off of classical.
You are joking, right?
> Allen
Steve
Steve de Mena
> On Dec 21, 2:09 pm, Lionel Tacchini <lionel.tacch...@arcor.de> wrote:
>> Jerry formulated the question :
>>
>>> usually wrong (i.e. Composers are often listed
>>> as First Name First; so both Beethoven and Mozart
>>> would be listed under 'L' - doesn't make sense
>>> to me.
>>
>> Makes sense now ?
>>
>> ;-)
>
> Sorry, my mistake.
>
> L for Beethoven, W for Mozart.
>
> I've just experimented with iTunes and fibd it extremely
> frustrating. I chose, for a test, the Levine/Met
> CD of Pictures at an Exhibition and Sacre du Printemps.
> Using iTunes, I copied it my computer and it came over
> as a single "album" with 28 tracks. So far,
> so good.
>
> At that point, however, I can't see how one can separate
> the two works (into, for example) two "playlists," so
> each can be triggered separately.
>
> I was able to create new playlists, but can't populate
> them with the appropriate tracks. Clicking and
> dragging didn't work.
>
> So, at the moment, my test has failed since all tracks are
> in one place (Music Library).
>
> Any suggestions?
Yes, learn how Playlists work. (Clicking & dragging do work)
Sorry, but this is off topic here.
Steve
Steve de Mena
> For another point of view, I've avoided iPods and iTunes and every
> other iContraption. I'm a control fanatic, and have found a variety
> of software for different needs - one to rip the tracks from the CD to
> MP3 format, another to process the tracks if needed, and yet another
> to "relabel" the files so that they show up where I want them on my
> MP3 players.
>
> So I can buy cheap MP3 players made by Sansa, and plug them into my
> computer and use them just like any other removable drive. And if I
> need to, I can plug them into my regular audio system.
>
> The downside is that finding, and learning the various pieces of
> software takes a little time and some "trial and error".
>
> Bill
>
You might be a "control freak" but I don't think you are getting as
much control and features in populating and maintaining the contents
of your player as you could with iTunes. (BTW I rip and tag with
different applications too). I think your motivation is at least in
part based on some sort of Apple bigotry.
Steve
Steve de Mena
>> The Source wants $400 for an ipod (without deck) and we can't
>> afford to throw that much money on a mistake.
>
> Which Ipod is this? An Itouch? That sounds like the price for one
> which has 32 gigabytes of storage ... which is probably far more than
> you need, unless you have an extremely large CD collection you want to
> convert.
He's in Canada. Prices higher.
Steve
Steve de Mena
> I let a neighbourhood
> kid who had just arrived in this country, use of my pc for downloading
> songs into his iPod. iTunes nearly wrecked my computer. I got rid of
> iTunes quick smart when the kid got his computer back.
>
> Ray Hall, Taree
" iTunes nearly wrecked my computer. "
What utter nonsense. LOL.
Steve
Steve de Mena
You did something wrong or had something set wrong. It works.
I don't think advancing a track until there just a few seconds left is
a good test. It needs a little more time to pre-fetch the upcoming
information (next track) into cache.
Steve
Doug McDonald
But try what I did once: loading 3000 files into iTunes all at once.
Talk about Apple taking control! Yep, that's ehat happened!
Doug McDonald
Dave Cook
> You might be a "control freak" but I don't think you are getting as
> much control and features in populating and maintaining the contents
> of your player as you could with iTunes.
For PC users, iTunes seems like a very strange application, since it
doesn't follow the usual operating paradigms of typcial PC apps. Even
among OS X apps, it tends to stand alone.
Dave Cook
Mr. Mike
No, this would seem to be the 64GB Itouch, which costs $399 in both
the US and Canada.
Mr. Mike
<st...@stevedemena.com> wrote:
>I don't think advancing a track until there just a few seconds left is
>a good test. It needs a little more time to pre-fetch the upcoming
>information (next track) into cache.
This is called "a bug."
A pretty obscure one, but still "a bug."
O
Mena <st...@stevedemena.com> wrote:
>
> Yes, learn how Playlists work. (Clicking & dragging do work)
>
> Sorry, but this is off topic here.
Strictly speaking, it isn't, as it is a discussion of recordings of
classical music. The original charter was pretty wide. A lot closer
to the original charter than most OT forays.
-Owen
Mr. Mike
>For PC users, iTunes seems like a very strange application, since it
>doesn't follow the usual operating paradigms of typcial PC apps.
It is not particularly strange if you use it often (which I do not,
requiring me to reinvent the wheel every time I want to load some
music into my Itouch); it could be better described as "bloatware."
O
<m...@spamcop.net> wrote:
IMO, iTunes doesn't suffer from too many features ("bloatware") but not
enough. I'd like for it to have a better hierarchy for classical music
works that are multiple "tracks" but essentially one work, and have it
play it like that. (i.e. "shuffle" should, on encountering a
multi-movement work, start at the first movement and play till the
last, then move to the next work.)
-Owen
Steve de Mena
I loaded 250,000 files into iTunes at once. It took 2-3 days, but it
didn't wreck my computer nor hamper my ability to run other programs
and do other things during that time.
Steve
Steve de Mena
Actually Apple charges $429 CAD for it versus $399 in the U.S. The
Source charges $399.
Steve
Steve de Mena
No it's how to make an iTunes playlist. There is nothing special in
that process for classical music.
Steve
Steve de Mena
How do you define "bloatware"?
Steve
Steve de Mena
> IMO, iTunes doesn't suffer from too many features ("bloatware") but not
> enough. I'd like for it to have a better hierarchy for classical music
> works that are multiple "tracks" but essentially one work, and have it
> play it like that. (i.e. "shuffle" should, on encountering a
> multi-movement work, start at the first movement and play till the
> last, then move to the next work.)
>
> -Owen
I use the "Grouping" field to indicate all of the tracks of a work.
If you use that and then in iTunes set "Controls...Shuffle....by
Groupings" it will do as you desire *in iTunes*. I don't think the
iPods support this yet. In fact the iPods don't even expose the
Grouping field. (I usually play my music from iTunes itself, versus
a player)
Steve
Mr. Mike
wrote:
>IMO, iTunes doesn't suffer from too many features ("bloatware")...
I am using the term "bloatware" in the sense of having a larger
installation footprint or using more system resources than necessary.
Mr. Mike
According to xe.com, $429 CAD is currently $405.458 USD which is
really not a significant difference... ":-/
Doug McDonald
>>
>> I've just experimented with iTunes and fibd it extremely
>> frustrating. I chose, for a test, the Levine/Met
>> CD of Pictures at an Exhibition and Sacre du Printemps.
>> Using iTunes, I copied it my computer and it came over
>> as a single "album" with 28 tracks. So far,
>> so good.
>>
>> At that point, however, I can't see how one can separate
>> the two works (into, for example) two "playlists," so
>> each can be triggered separately.
>>
>> I was able to create new playlists, but can't populate
>> them with the appropriate tracks. Clicking and
>> dragging didn't work.
>>
Click and drag works for me.
But what I do for situations like this is to edit the
album name. I would rename the Pictures at an Exhibition
tracks as that, or actually "Mussorgsky-Ravel Pictures at an
Exhibition (Levine-Met)" and the Rite equivalently. That is,
rename all the tracks of each piece. Then, if say Pictures
has 15 tracks, I would relabel the tracks as 1/15 through
15/15, and the same for Rite (1/13 through 13/13).
This woks for me ... when put on my iPod, the individual
works play individually.
You just need a system.
It is not going to happen automatically ... the online databases are
just too stupidly organized.
Even if you wanted the exact same set of music on your computer
as I did, and I gave you all my stuff, you would probably not
be fully happy. It would work just fine, but it almost certainly
would not work as YOU want it to.
Cataloging is never really easy.
If you have physical CDs, one thing you can do is get a CD ripper program that allows ripping a
whole piece as a single track, even if more than one on the CD. I use
Audiograbber (not exactly fully user friendly, however; I use it because
it allows me to use a custom MP3 encoder written by me using the LAME dll.)
Doug McDonald
Doug McDonald
>
>
> IMO, iTunes doesn't suffer from too many features ("bloatware") but not
> enough. I'd like for it to have a better hierarchy for classical music
> works that are multiple "tracks" but essentially one work, and have it
> play it like that. (i.e. "shuffle" should, on encountering a
> multi-movement work, start at the first movement and play till the
> last, then move to the next work.)
>
>
I explain in a post I just made how to do that. Look for my previous post.
It does require work on your part. But it works beautifully.
I run shuffle EXCLUSIVELY on my 8 GB iPod. I have made up playlists
for various genres, typical 4-8 each for "chanber music" "piano"
"romantic symphonic" "late symphonic" "pre 1800" etc. I then place
one of each on my iPod at a time, run through all, and then
repopulate the iPod. Works perfectly.
Doug
Doug McDonald
>
> I loaded 250,000 files into iTunes at once. It took 2-3 days, but it
> didn't wreck my computer nor hamper my ability to run other programs and
> do other things during that time.
>
But are you running diagonalizations of gigabyte matrices routinely
as I do?
It didn't wreck the computer. The part of the disk used as swap space
even survived.
Doug McDonald
Wortley Clutterbuk
> In article <95f0j59gjp3p9l6sltp1ha90r1b4ohs...@4ax.com>, Mr. Mike
>
> <m...@spamcop.net> wrote:
> > On 22 Dec 2009 01:52:01 GMT, Dave Cook <davec...@nowhere.net> wrote:
>
> > >For PC users, iTunes seems like a very strange application, since it
> > >doesn't follow the usual operating paradigms of typcial PC apps.
>
> > It is not particularly strange if you use it often (which I do not,
> > requiring me to reinvent the wheel every time I want to load some
> > music into my Itouch); it could be better described as "bloatware."
>
> IMO, iTunes doesn't suffer from too many features ("bloatware") but not
> enough. I'd like for it to have a better hierarchy for classical music
> works that are multiple "tracks" but essentially one work, and have it
> play it like that. (i.e. "shuffle" should, on encountering a
> multi-movement work, start at the first movement and play till the
> last, then move to the next work.)
>
> -Owen
That's easy. When you shuffle, shuffle by album (Controls>Shuffle>By
Albums). Someone else suggests making the album a single track. If
you're importing from a cd, you can do this in iTunes by highlighting
any or all of the tracks on an album and joining them (Advanced>Join
CD Tracks).
Steve de Mena
It's not easy because "album" doesn't usually equal "work"
I don't think any sort of joining is acceptable as you then lose the
ability to hear those tracks individually.
Steve
Doug McDonald
>>
>> That's easy. When you shuffle, shuffle by album (Controls>Shuffle>By
>> Albums). Someone else suggests making the album a single track. If
>> you're importing from a cd, you can do this in iTunes by highlighting
>> any or all of the tracks on an album and joining them (Advanced>Join
>> CD Tracks).
>
> It's not easy because "album" doesn't usually equal "work"
>
> I don't think any sort of joining is acceptable as you then lose the
> ability to hear those tracks individually.
>
It takes work when adding to a library, but I fix
the problem by editing tags so that a single work IS an "album",
perhaps with multiple tracks.
Doug McDonald
Kip Williams
> Wortley Clutterbuk wrote:
>> That's easy. When you shuffle, shuffle by album (Controls>Shuffle>By
>> Albums). Someone else suggests making the album a single track. If
>> you're importing from a cd, you can do this in iTunes by highlighting
>> any or all of the tracks on an album and joining them (Advanced>Join
>> CD Tracks).
>
> It's not easy because "album" doesn't usually equal "work"
>
> I don't think any sort of joining is acceptable as you then lose the
> ability to hear those tracks individually.
It also drains the battery of an iPod faster. Shorter tracks can be read
into memory whole, and fewer calls have to be made to the hard drive.
Kip W
phlogiston
> > I don't think any sort of joining is acceptable as you then lose the
> > ability to hear those tracks individually.
>
a larger whole (except perhaps in the car). If the track is a portion
of larger continuous whole (e.g. Zarathustra or In the South) I get
annoyed by the tracks.
Steve de Mena
I do that with the "Group" tag. I prefer to have the Album field be
consistent (completely) across all disc(s) in a set.
Steve
Wortley Clutterbuk
Touche!
However, I don't believe the answer is more features (since it's not
likely iTunes would be able to recognize separate works).
If you don't want to join, tracks, don't. My point was that you don't
necessarily need to use Audiograbber if you're already using iTunes.
Some of the features are hard to find. Just trying to be helpful!