Real Post - The secret life of Glenn Gould
gho...@istar.ca
One night in 1956, the glamorous young Fosses - Lukas and Cornelia -
were driving to dinner near their Los Angeles home when Bach's
"Goldberg Variations" came on the car radio.
Nearly 25 years after the death of perhaps the greatest piano virtuoso
of the 20th century, the Star reveals a dramatically fresh portrait of
the Canadian icon
Aug 25, 2007 04:30 AM
Michael Clarkson
Special to the Toronto Star
BRIDGEHAMPTON, N.Y.-When Glenn Gould died young 25 years ago, friends
were stunned to find a love letter in his cluttered Toronto apartment,
among the empty pill pots and records.
"I am deeply in love with a certain beautiful girl. I asked her to
marry me, but she turned me down but I still love her more than
anything in the world and every minute I can spend with her is pure
heaven ..."
It was the curtain call of not so much a life as an opera for perhaps
the greatest piano virtuoso of the 20th century, who moved millions
with his spiritual renditions of Bach, but was so afraid of intimacy
and germs he was reluctant to let people touch him.
"No supreme pianist has ever given of his heart and mind so
overwhelmingly while showing himself so sparingly," said renowned
violinist Yehudi Menuhin.
History tells us that Gould, like so many geniuses, attained musical
nirvana by giving up earthly desires for his work and that he could
not love unless his Steinway was in the room.
And yet, for four-and-a-half years, Gould allowed a beautiful, married
artist to care for him, to caress him. In the words of his favourite
Barbra Streisand song, "He Touched Me" - "Suddenly ... nothing was the
same." To this day, Gould is remembered as a Canadian cultural giant,
yet his private life remains shrouded in mystery. For most of his
adult life, rumours abounded that he was asexual or gay.
Gould was so paranoid about exposing his private life, he would cut
off any colleagues or friends who discussed it and once fired a
cleaning lady for gossiping about him.
Now, for the first time, we know that the intensely private Gould
carried on an affair for five years, beginning in 1967, with a married
German-American painter named Cornelia Foss. She left her husband
Lukas, himself a prominent pianist and conductor, and moved her two
children to Toronto at the height of the affair. A year before her
move, Gould had asked her to marry him.
This bold attempt at domesticity may have marked the most intense
chapter in Gould's lifelong struggle with his demons. His phobias and
pill-popping for a number of maladies, many of them imaginary, likely
contributed to his early death on Oct. 4, 1982, nine days after his
50th birthday.
At her summer home in the Hamptons, Foss spoke to me recently - her
first published interview on the subject - about life with Glenn
Gould.
It is a story of obsession and heartbreak. Most of all, it is the
rarest of windows into the guarded inner life of one of the 20th
century's most compelling, and mystifying, artistic figures.
"I think there were a lot of misconceptions about Glenn and it was
partly because he was so very private," Foss said.
"But I assure you, he was an extremely heterosexual man. Our
relationship was, among other things, quite sexual."
One night in 1956, the glamorous young Fosses - Lukas and Cornelia -
were driving to dinner near their Los Angeles home when Bach's
"Goldberg Variations" came on the car radio. Lukas, a dynamic pianist,
composer and conductor, was so enraptured by the brilliantly
unorthodox interpretation - by an obscure young Canadian named Glenn
Gould - he stopped the car and pulled over to listen for so long they
were late for dinner.
A short time later, Lukas was rehearsing for a show with Leonard
Bernstein in balmy L.A. when a blond, baby-faced 24-year-old Gould
showed up unannounced in winter clothes. "My husband looked up and saw
a hat and scarf coming toward him," Cornelia recalled, chuckling.
"(Gould) said to Lukas, `Hello, I'm Glenn Gould. I came to hear the
greatest pianist in the world.'"
Lukas was 34 at the time and his wife 25. It was the beginning of a
long relationship for all of them.
"I was drawn to his handsome looks and his huge intelligence," Foss
said. "He had an original mind, was extraordinarily canny and had an
enormous sense of humour."
Gould was attracted by Cornelia's striking looks, intelligence and
independent streak. The daughter of an art-historian father and a
mother who was also an expert in classical art, she had studied
sculpture at the American Academy in Rome, where she was introduced to
Lukas by the famous American composer Aaron Copland.
(The Fosses had both fled the Nazis in their native Germany and were
educated in Europe and California.)
In Los Angeles, the couple lived in actor John Barrymore's old house
and held parties for the heavyweights of the American music scene.
"They were very social and we had fascinating evenings," said
Cornelia's close friend, Edith Wyle. "Cornelia was always charming."
The Fosses first saw Gould perform live in 1956 in L.A. The Gould
experience was a true novelty, both for the couple and the classical
music world - he sat sidesaddle at the piano in a trance, swooning and
swaying, humming while conducting himself with his free hand as his
hair flew about.
"He was the James Dean of classical music," said Tim Page, Pulitzer
Prize-winning music critic of the Washington Post and a friend of
Gould's. "He made Bach swing."
And yet, prior to his concerts, fans were given cards, asking not to
shake Gould's hand because he said he was afraid of hurting his
fingers. Many people felt he was more afraid of intimacy and catching
germs. "He almost certainly desired more physical contact than his
anxiety permitted him to enjoy," wrote Kevin Bazzana, editor of
GlennGould Magazine in his book Wondrous Strange: The Life and Art of
Glenn Gould.
Much of Gould's intimate contact came in the act of musical
collaboration, and he and Lukas worked together on some scores and on
Gould's radio documentaries. He and the Fosses grew close. In 1962,
when the couple's L.A. home burned down, destroying 27 of Cornelia's
paintings, Gould consoled her and "was very kind to me."
The following year, in 1963, Lukas found work as conductor of the
Buffalo Philharmonic Orchestra and the Fosses couldn't have been
happier. Gould lived just 90 minutes away in Toronto.
"Glenn phoned my home a lot. It started out as a friendship with Lukas
and Glenn and me, but slowly Glenn and I began a love affair,"
Cornelia said. "Our life together moved slowly forward and was
carefully planned."
Suddenly, she found herself swept away by a second blue-eyed pianist
with a strong face who looked deeply into life. But Gould's
personality couldn't have been more different than Lukas's. Gould
bordered on reclusive, whereas Lukas did not meet a person he did not
want to embrace.
They were both highly driven though. "They were very passionate, had
enormous ability and had great love for what they were doing," she
said. "I think Lukas was even more passionate and driven than Glenn."
Lukas became suspicious of the pair when Gould began phoning their
home, pretending to be someone else, as he often did for fun,
introducing himself as one of his many fictional alter egos: Sir Nigel
Twitt-Thornwaite, the dean of British conductors; Theodore Slutz, a
New York cabbie; or Herbert von Hochmeister, sage of the Arctic. Gould
would sometimes have his calls answered by the Fosses's Chinese maid,
but he didn't realize that the maid was Lukas, returning the strange
joke. Cornelia says in 1966 Gould asked her to marry him. And she
considered it.
Then, in 1967, she left Lukas. "There were a few problems in our
marriage, but that's not why I left - I fell in love with someone
else," she said. Cornelia put her two young children, 9-year-old
Christopher and 5-year-old Eliza, into their station wagon and left
Buffalo.
"I'll never forget Lukas standing by the station wagon and smiling,"
she recalled. "I said, `Why are you smiling - I'm leaving you for
Glenn.' He said, `Don't be ridiculous, you'll be back.'"
Cornelia bought a house in Toronto near Gould's penthouse apartment at
110 St. Clair Ave. W. and Avenue Rd.
In some ways, Gould and Foss made an odd couple. She, socialite artist
in pearls; he, forever wearing a battleship grey expression, British
driving cap and winter gloves - even in summer. Yet both were intense
intellectuals into mind games.
She also fell for his sense of humour. One day he rolled on the floor
laughing because the University of Toronto had started a course: "The
Mind of Glenn Gould." "`Imagine how ridiculous!' he said. He wanted to
go to a class, disguised in a wig, but he never did."
The couple took her kids on trips to hotels in Muskoka and spent a lot
of time at Cornelia's house because Gould guarded his messy penthouse.
Those close to Gould say that, even before Cornelia, there were many
groupies and a number of relationships with women, including an
English piano student who tattooed the main theme from Gould's String
Quartet on her back; a woman from Texas who said she was going to
start shooting people at the corner of Yonge and Bloor Sts. if Gould
didn't marry her; and the wife of a magazine editor who Gould said
"gave me bad reviews because he was jealous."
But Marilyn Kecskes, the superintendent of Gould's building, said he
brought precious few women to his apartment, which at the time was his
studio for practising and writing.
"I don't know any woman who could have lived in that apartment with
Mr. Gould - he was so terribly messy," Kecskes said.
Gould and Cornelia made a rare appearance together in 1967 at a
private screening in New York for one of the television programs he
had begun producing. "It was a different Glenn Gould that I saw during
that day," Andrew Kazdin, Gould's record producer for 15 years, wrote
in his book Glenn Gould at Work. "Instead of the self-absorbed centre
of attention, I witnessed an attentive escort to Cornelia. `Was she
comfortable?' `Could he get her anything?' There was no doubt that
Cornelia Foss held a special place in his life."
Although she holds back some intimate details of their affair, Foss
says Gould was very romantic.
Gould never talked about having children. "I was in my 30s by then and
in those days it was considered too old to have children," Foss said.
"Anyway, he had Christopher and Eliza and he was wonderful with them,
playing puzzles and helping Chris with his math."
But Cornelia saw disturbing signs in Gould as early as 1967, just two
weeks after she had left her husband.
Gould, she said, had a serious paranoid episode. "It lasted several
hours and then I knew he was not just neurotic - there was more to it.
I thought to myself, `Good grief, am I going to bring up my children
in this environment?' But I stayed four and a-half years."
Foss did not discuss details, but others close to Gould said he was
convinced someone was trying to poison him and that others were spying
on him. There was no evidence of that, although other women sought him
romantically and people tried to break into his mailbox (the
screwdriver marks are still there).
The late psychiatrist Peter Ostwald, a violinist and friend of Gould,
founded a health program for musicians and wrote the book Glenn Gould:
The Ecstasy and Tragedy of Genius. Ostwald believed that Gould's
personality, lifestyle and narcissism made it "unendurable" for any
woman to live with him. According to the psychiatrist, who briefly
treated Gould, he could be a control freak, inflexible and
manipulative (although Gould could also at times be giving and
sympathetic, friends said).
Cornelia was one of Gould's obsessions. "He'd tell me she did this,
and she said that. He couldn't seem to get her out of his mind," said
Dr. Joseph Stephens, a fellow pianist and professor of psychiatry at
Johns Hopkins University. Perhaps she filled a void for Gould after he
quit a hectic schedule of public performances in 1964 because he
considered audiences "evil" and distracting.
"He didn't like being showcased on stage," Cornelia said.
Gould once said during an interview, "All love relationships are
addictive - just as much so as alcohol and tobacco." Indeed, Gould had
a lot of addictions and obsessions - he often worked seven days a
week, worried constantly about his body and his health, and ate just
one meal a day - scrambled eggs at neighbouring Fran's Restaurant,
usually in the middle of the night.
But he continued to play piano in recording and television studios and
was a successful producer of radio and television documentaries. Away
from the keyboard, Gould was as strange as ever, wearing winter
clothes in summer and hankies over his face to shield himself from
germs, as his overprotective mother had advised.
(During his years with Cornelia, Gould was estranged from both his
parents, she said.)
Cornelia got so involved with nurturing him, her name was found on his
pharmacy bills. Her care seemed to have a positive effect because at
about that time, Gould told an interviewer that, as far as his health
was concerned, those years were "the best of my life."
At Cornelia's house, the couple would sometimes invite friends and
colleagues for dinner and corny games such as Twenty Questions. "It
was a trial at domesticity," Ostwald said.
Certainly it was the longest relationship of its kind for the pianist,
who usually balked at romance, according to the late Greta Krause, a
pianist and harpsichordist, a friend of Gould and confidante to some
of his female friends. "He could not accept love," she said. "I had
the feeling that any expression of affection would cause him to
panic."
Cornelia had her own distractions. A talented artist, she had to put
her career on hold and she never painted Gould's portrait. "In those
days, I didn't have the peace of mind to be able to paint. I was
taking care of Glenn and Lukas and my two children," she said. "I went
back to Buffalo for Lukas every weekend."
In Toronto, Gould and Foss looked at real estate and planned to buy a
house if they married, but he refused to get treatment for his
emotional problems, she said, "or even admit that he had them."
Many biographers claim that Gould never married because his mistress
was music, but Foss calls that nonsense. "Apart from the paranoia, he
would have been a good husband and father...but his phobias got worse.
He was just too ill."
Cornelia ended their affair in 1972, rejoining Lukas in New York,
where he was appointed conductor of the Brooklyn Philharmonic.
But Gould didn't give up so easily, driving 950 kilometres to the
couple's summer home in the ritzy Hamptons to convince her to return.
That was out of character for Gould, who usually cut women off when
they rejected him.
They were still in love, but Foss could not expose her children to
Gould's phobias and paranoia any longer. "We talked in a bungalow on
the beach and it was very painful for both of us," she recalled. "We
still had strong feelings for one another and it was sad to see him in
so much pain, and that I was part of that pain."
Even when she sent him home, Gould refused to give up hope and phoned
Cornelia practically every night for two years, she said, until she
finally convinced him to stop.
Gould became even more reclusive into his 40s. "People are as
important to me as food," he grumbled. "As I grow older, I find I can
do more and more without them ... monastic seclusion works for me."
Gould died of a stroke on Oct. 4, 1982, with anxiety and high blood
pressure as possible contributing factors. About 3,000 people attended
his funeral, but not Cornelia "because I didn't think it would be
appropriate."
After his death, friends found a note by Gould, yearning for a woman
he code-named Dell, which puzzled Gould's many biographers, some of
whom believed it was fictitious. But they overlooked Cornelia's maiden
name - Brendel. To this day, she seems uneasy with the note and doubts
it is about her.
Now an art instructor known for her sea and landscape oils, Cornelia,
76, turned down an offer to have the note read to her."He was so
private, he'd roll over in his grave, worrying that someone might find
writings with his emotions on them," she said. Cornelia's daughter
grew up to be an actress, her son a corporate strategist. And she
takes care of Lukas, who has Parkinson's.
"Most of my life has been lucky," she told an art reviewer recently.
"There's nothing sadder than to do something you don't want to do, or
not knowing how to go about getting what you want."
Michael Clarkson, a former Toronto Star reporter, has written five
psychology books, four on fears and phobias. He is now writing a
screenplay involving Glenn Gould and can be reached
at feard...@rogers.com
bruckner_1
Matthew B. Tepper
letters to be typed in
news:1188065200.0...@i13g2000prf.googlegroups.com:
> Wow- what a fascinating story! Thanks for posting this.
>
> Jeff from WI
And thanks for re-posting 350+ lines just to add nine words and your name.
--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
To write to me, do for my address what Androcles did for the lion
Tom Deacon is a liar and a scoundrel who cannot hold on to a job.
Michael Lehrman
news:1188063966....@q5g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
> The secret life of Glenn Gould
>
> One night in 1956, the glamorous young Fosses - Lukas and Cornelia -
> were driving to dinner near their Los Angeles home when Bach's
> "Goldberg Variations" came on the car radio.
> Nearly 25 years after the death of perhaps the greatest piano virtuoso
> of the 20th century,
>
who the real "greatest piano virtuoso of the 20th cebtury" was. :-)
>
> Aug 25, 2007 04:30 AM
> Michael Clarkson
> Special to the Toronto Star
>
> BRIDGEHAMPTON, N.Y.-When Glenn Gould died young 25 years ago, friends
> were stunned to find a love letter in his cluttered Toronto apartment,
> among the empty pill pots and records.
>
> "I am deeply in love with a certain beautiful girl. I asked her to
> marry me, but she turned me down but I still love her more than
> anything in the world and every minute I can spend with her is pure
> heaven ..."
>
ML
bruckner_1
> bruckner_1 <bruckne...@yahoo.com> appears to have caused the following
> letters to be typed innews:1188065200.0...@i13g2000prf.googlegroups.com:
>
> > Wow- what a fascinating story! Thanks for posting this.
>
> > Jeff from WI
>
> And thanks for re-posting 350+ lines just to add nine words and your name.
>
> --
> Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
> My main music page ---http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
> To write to me, do for my address what Androcles did for the lion
> Tom Deacon is a liar and a scoundrel who cannot hold on to a job.
Matthew - I didn't realize I had done this. I am very sorry. I
thought you were one of the polite ones.
I am now definitely done with this group. Good-bye!
Jeff from WI
td
Don't let the grinch of the group drive you away, Jeff, as he has
countless others over time.
Just stick it out and stick it to him. He deserves everything he gets
and much, much, much more.
A duck on a spit.
Peter Gelb as his father in law.
Not to speak of a meeting with the Los Angeles Police Department
Morality Squad.
TD
david...@aol.com
Published in a Canadian paper, this innocent bit of chauvinism may be
forgiven:
> Gould [....] perhaps the greatest piano virtuoso
> of the 20th century
This hyperbole, on the other hand, is stomach-turning:
> History tells us that Gould, like so many geniuses, attained musical
> nirvana by giving up earthly desires for his work and that he could
> not love unless his Steinway was in the room.
. . . not least for referring to Gould as a genius. Bach was a
genius. Gould may have had a certain genius for playing some music:
that's not quite the same thing. As for the love story itself, it's
fascinating in the same sense that gossip always is. Then again,
something can be fascinating without shedding any light.
-david gable
John Wiser
news:1188082393....@y42g2000hsy.googlegroups.com...
On Aug 25, 2:07 pm, "Matthew B. Tepper" <o...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> bruckner_1 <bruckne...@yahoo.com> appears
yadda yadda:
>
> > Wow- what a fascinating story! Thanks for posting this.
>
> > Jeff from WI
>
> And thanks for re-posting 350+ lines just to add nine words and your name.
>
> --
Matthew - I didn't realize I had done this. I am very sorry. I
thought you were one of the polite ones.
I am now definitely done with this group. Good-bye!
Jeff,
How you figured Tepper for perlite is one for the books. But then, you come
from a state where one of the senators could stand in for an African
Barking Frog.
I think you should hang in there. Take note that Tepper closely resembles
our current fed. admin. Friends (or perceived betters) can do just about
anything without risking reproof. Try ignoring him, he hates that.
cordially
--
John Wiser
cee...@gmail.com
Matthew B. Tepper
If you should ever decide to overcome your shortcomings, instead of trying to
blame them on others, then by all means come back.
--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
TareeDawg
Shame that we have to lose a good poster on account of a complete jerk
and ignoramus like tepper. Absolute shame.
Obviously you haven't been in this group long enough if you think tepper
is one "polite" ones. Polite isn't in his vocabulary.
Ray (Dawg) Hall, Taree
John Thomas
> As for the love story itself, it's
> fascinating in the same sense that gossip always is. Then again,
> something can be fascinating without shedding any light.
>
> -david gable
If only the story had been about a clandestine affair involving Elliot
Carter and Charles Rosen...
Matthew B. Tepper
> On Aug 25, 4:23 pm, "david7ga...@aol.com" <david7ga...@aol.com> wrote:
>> As for the love story itself, it's fascinating in the same sense that
>> gossip always is. Then again, something can be fascinating without
>> shedding any light.
>
> If only the story had been about a clandestine affair involving Elliot
> Carter and Charles Rosen...
Or between Sir Arnold Bax and Harriet Cohen.
--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
To write to me, do for my address what Androcles did for the lion
Tom Deacon is a liar and a scoundrel who cannot hold on to a job.
MrT
shameless exploitation, like Schumann's hemorrhoids... These writers
should find themselves some productive job: they're parasites. I am
sorry but I have had it with these biographical writers who,
infallibly, come to us with the latest about the private life of
musicians (not just musicians: painters and writers are also popular).
Parasitic literature.
Best,
mrt
Charles Milton Ling
<snipped>
> Nearly 25 years after the death of perhaps the greatest piano virtuoso
> of the 20th century...
<snipped>
Not even perhaps. A giant, of course.
--
Charles Milton Ling
Vienna, Austria
Matthew B. Tepper
letters to be typed in news:d1148$46d1ce5a$d52f8ebb$70...@news.chello.at:
> gho...@istar.ca wrote:
>
> <snipped>
>
>> Nearly 25 years after the death of perhaps the greatest piano virtuoso
>> of the 20th century...
> <snipped>
>
> Not even perhaps. A giant, of course.
Sony paid to have that superlative inserted, and they want to get what
they've paid for, dammit!
--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
To write to me, do for my address what Androcles did for the lion
Tom Deacon is a liar and a scoundrel who cannot hold on to a job.
david...@aol.com
> If only the story had been about a clandestine affair involving Elliot
> Carter and Charles Rosen...
That would have been especially fascinating!
-david gable
sechumlib
> Shame that we have to lose a good poster on account of a complete jerk
> and ignoramus like tepper. Absolute shame.
I come back for long enough to say that Matthew is not the "jerk and
ignoramus" in this group. Others are.
Bye.
TareeDawg
Make sure the door hits you on the way back out again then.
Ray (Dawg) Hall, Taree
Matthew B. Tepper
letters to be typed in news:46d1f401$0$23501$4c36...@roadrunner.com:
> I come back for long enough to say that Matthew is not the "jerk and
> ignoramus" in this group. Others are.
>
> Bye.
This "Bruckner/Jeff" character, for one. He embarrassed himself with his
"I'm a factory worker, and I can't be bothered with all this" crap, and was
further embarrassed with his own mistake of quoting a huge post just to add
a "Gosh, I agree!" type of remark, so he chose to blame somebody else for
what he did. That's the mark of a coward, and so we are well rid of him.
As for Ray -- well, all I can say is that the person in this world whom I
most pity is his wife Lily, because if he's turned on her even a fraction of
the way he turned on me, her life has been a living hell the last few years.
--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
Bob Harper
(snip)
>
> This "Bruckner/Jeff" character, for one. He embarrassed himself with his
> "I'm a factory worker, and I can't be bothered with all this" crap, and was
> further embarrassed with his own mistake of quoting a huge post just to add
> a "Gosh, I agree!" type of remark, so he chose to blame somebody else for
> what he did. That's the mark of a coward, and so we are well rid of him.
>
> As for Ray -- well, all I can say is that the person in this world whom I
> most pity is his wife Lily, because if he's turned on her even a fraction of
> the way he turned on me, her life has been a living hell the last few years.
>
Bob Harper
boombox
Except that this particular guy is one of history's great mystery
men. When that letter surfaced years ago many people believed the
"beautiful girl" was fiction, and that perhaps Gould had never had any
kind of serious interpersonal relationship. The fact that she's real
and we even now know who she is, not to mention that she was a well-
known composer's wife, is very interesting.
Matthew B. Tepper
letters to be typed in news:D5-dncMFr8L6z0_b...@comcast.com:
Get a life, Bob.
Bob Harper
> Bob Harper <bob.h...@comcast.net> appears to have caused the following
> letters to be typed in news:D5-dncMFr8L6z0_b...@comcast.com:
>
>> Matthew B. Tepper wrote:
>> (snip)
>>> This "Bruckner/Jeff" character, for one. He embarrassed himself with
>>> his "I'm a factory worker, and I can't be bothered with all this" crap,
>>> and was further embarrassed with his own mistake of quoting a huge post
>>> just to add a "Gosh, I agree!" type of remark, so he chose to blame
>>> somebody else for what he did. That's the mark of a coward, and so we
>>> are well rid of him.
>>>
>>> As for Ray -- well, all I can say is that the person in this world whom
>>> I most pity is his wife Lily, because if he's turned on her even a
>>> fraction of the way he turned on me, her life has been a living hell
>>> the last few years.
>>>
>> Grow up, Matthew.
>>
>> Bob Harper
>
> Get a life, Bob.
>
Bob Harper
Gerard
> sechumlib <sech...@liberal.net> appears to have caused the following
> letters to be typed in news:46d1f401$0$23501$4c36...@roadrunner.com:
>
> > I come back for long enough to say that Matthew is not the "jerk and
> > ignoramus" in this group. Others are.
> >
> > Bye.
>
> This "Bruckner/Jeff" character, for one. He embarrassed himself with
> his "I'm a factory worker, and I can't be bothered with all this"
> crap, and was further embarrassed with his own mistake of quoting a
> huge post just to add a "Gosh, I agree!" type of remark, so he chose
> to blame somebody else for what he did. That's the mark of a coward,
> and so we are well rid of him.
Some people have other criteria for 'coward'.
>
> As for Ray -- well, all I can say is that the person in this world
> whom I most pity is his wife Lily, because if he's turned on her even
> a fraction of the way he turned on me, her life has been a living
> hell the last few years.
You've written this before, and it shows what a coward you are.
Do you _know_ *anything* about her life?
You should pity the people who are confronted with your crap.
TareeDawg
Indeed. He knows nothing of her other than her name. His cowardice was
shown several months ago, whilst I did a change from OE to Thunderbird,
and I had hoped to operate without killfiles. Sadly, I was confronted by
an assault, yet again, by tepper, weighing in with boots and all. I
didn't bother to reply. What is the point?
One good serve will always deserve another, and more afaiac.
Indeed, tepper is not only a coward but a hypocrite to boot.
The last I will say on the matter. The moose is a mere puddykat compared
to tepper, has balls, and is 10 times more knowledgeable into the bargain.
Ray (Dawg) Hall, Taree
MrT
> Gerard wrote:
> > Matthew B. Tepper wrote:
> >> letters to be typed innews:46d1f401$0$23501$4c36...@roadrunner.com:
Bringing in somebody's family into a discussion is very, very low, as
is attacking somebody for being poor. How about we get away from the
personal and stick to commenting on music and recordings? Many a good
discussion has gotten derailed by posturing, plonking or the threat
thereof, etc.
Best,
mrt
TareeDawg
Indeed. Let us hope that your advice goes heeded to those that attack
other people's families, or attack someone who might be less well off.
Good idea. Having no idea why you are replying to moi, other than to
point out the obvious and good advice of 'how to be respectful of
others' that 'certain' others might take on board. They are fortunately
few, but as you well know, they do exist, and to a large extent are
allowed to exist by a diffident majority. And like td, and others, I
will spare tepper no favours whatsoever, unless he changes for the better.
Ray (Dawg) Hall, Taree
Matthew B. Tepper
be typed in news:1188212447.4...@50g2000hsm.googlegroups.com:
> Bringing in somebody's family into a discussion is very, very low, as
> is attacking somebody for being poor. How about we get away from the
> personal and stick to commenting on music and recordings? Many a good
> discussion has gotten derailed by posturing, plonking or the threat
> thereof, etc.
I'm happy to continue to comment on music and recordings. How about you?
Matthew B. Tepper
A far more satisfying one than "Bruckner/Jeff," apparently.
MrT
> MrT <symbiotr...@yahoo.com> appears to have caused the following letters to
> be typed innews:1188212447.4...@50g2000hsm.googlegroups.com:
>
> > Bringing in somebody's family into a discussion is very, very low, as
> > is attacking somebody for being poor. How about we get away from the
> > personal and stick to commenting on music and recordings? Many a good
> > discussion has gotten derailed by posturing, plonking or the threat
> > thereof, etc.
>
> I'm happy to continue to comment on music and recordings. How about you?
>
Fine, but if you take private your personal battles with people you
don't even know, I think threads flow more smoothly, no? It's one
thing to tell off spammers and stalkers and quite another to act like
a street fighter with other posters who simply happen to be on your
shit list because of disagreements. Sorry, I don't understand the
mentality. What the hell do you gain?
Best,
mrt
Matthew B. Tepper
be typed in news:1188226312.9...@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com:
I'll defend myself as I please.
Gerard
> MrT <symbi...@yahoo.com> appears to have caused the following
> letters to be typed in
> news:1188226312.9...@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com:
>
> > > MrT <symbiotr...@yahoo.com> appears to have caused the following
> > > letters to be typed
> > > innews:1188212447.4...@50g2000hsm.googlegroups.com:
> > >
> > > > Bringing in somebody's family into a discussion is very, very
> > > > low, as is attacking somebody for being poor. How about we get
> > > > away from the personal and stick to commenting on music and
> > > > recordings? Many a good discussion has gotten derailed by
> > > > posturing, plonking or the threat thereof, etc.
> > >
> > > I'm happy to continue to comment on music and recordings. How
> > > about you?
> >
> > Fine, but if you take private your personal battles with people you
> > don't even know, I think threads flow more smoothly, no? It's one
> > thing to tell off spammers and stalkers and quite another to act
> > like a street fighter with other posters who simply happen to be on
> > your shit list because of disagreements. Sorry, I don't understand
> > the mentality. What the hell do you gain?
>
> I'll defend myself as I please.
Writing about family members of other posters has nothing to do with
"defending".
You are a insultor.
Bob Harper
> Bob Harper <bob.h...@comcast.net> appears to have caused the following
> letters to be typed in news:w_ydnQMgc4GS7k_b...@comcast.com:
>
>> Matthew B. Tepper wrote:
>>> Bob Harper <bob.h...@comcast.net> appears to have caused the following
>>> letters to be typed in news:D5-dncMFr8L6z0_b...@comcast.com:
>>>
>>>> Matthew B. Tepper wrote:
>>>> (snip)
>>>>> This "Bruckner/Jeff" character, for one. He embarrassed himself with
>>>>> his "I'm a factory worker, and I can't be bothered with all this" crap,
>>>>> and was further embarrassed with his own mistake of quoting a huge post
>>>>> just to add a "Gosh, I agree!" type of remark, so he chose to blame
>>>>> somebody else for what he did. That's the mark of a coward, and so we
>>>>> are well rid of him.
>>>>>
>>>>> As for Ray -- well, all I can say is that the person in this world whom
>>>>> I most pity is his wife Lily, because if he's turned on her even a
>>>>> fraction of the way he turned on me, her life has been a living hell
>>>>> the last few years.
>>>>>
>>>> Grow up, Matthew.
>>>>
>>>> Bob Harper
>>> Get a life, Bob.
>>>
>> Got one, thanks. Do you?
>>
>> Bob Harper
>
> A far more satisfying one than "Bruckner/Jeff," apparently.
>
Bob Harper
def...@default.org
(in article <Xns99977B5C6B9...@216.168.3.70>):
>[..]
>
> And thanks for re-posting 350+ lines just to add nine words and your name.
>
Usenet is such a mess and so much gets dropped in iffy peering deals nowadays
a repost really helps, especially with something this interesting.