Haydn and His Hornsignals
Neil Brennen
am referring to his early symphonies with prominent horn parts, such as
numbers 31 (The Hornsignal) and 72. What are the best recordings of these
symphonies, and what other Haydn symphonies have virtuosic horn writing? I
currently own two recordings of 31, both on Naxos - Toscanini and the NBC
Symphony, and Drahos. My one recording of 72 is by The Hanover Band directed
by Roy Goodman.
Lenya Ryzhik
I find Harnoncourt marvelous in 31 (as in essentially all of his Haydn
recordings) but have nothing to compare it to.
Lenya
Paul Goldstein
says...
Mackerras does an excellent 31 on Telarc.
Paul Goldstein
Bill McCutcheon
"Neil Brennen" <chessno...@mindnospamspring.com> wrote in message
news:_CMIb.3384$6B....@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net...
(#22) are very lovely. According to the notes with the Dorati set,
this was the first appearance for either instrument in Haydn's
symphonies ... quite a premier!
-- Bill McC.
Thomas Wood
Neil Brennen <chessno...@mindnospamspring.com> wrote in message
news:_CMIb.3384$6B....@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net...
Hogwood and the Academy of Ancient Music did a (surprisingly) good job with
the "Hornsignal" Symphony -- but you have to buy a 3-CD box to get it -- if
you can buy it at all anymore.
The version done by Goodman and the Hanover Band on Nimbus is quite good
too.
For 72 I have Fischer and the Austro-Hungarian Orchestra on Nimbus. A fine
performance, but I can imagine better. I used to have a Naxos recording of
it that seemed to be determined to make it sound as dull as humanly
possible.
Another symphony with notable high horn parts is #48 ("Maria Theresia.") The
recording done by L'Estro Armonico on Sony is raw and exciting.
Tom Wood
Thomas Wood
Bill McCutcheon <wjm...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:XmOIb.17700$IM3....@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net...
>
> The horns (French and English) in the opening of "The Philosopher"
> (#22) are very lovely. According to the notes with the Dorati set,
> this was the first appearance for either instrument in Haydn's
> symphonies ... quite a premier!
#22 may have been the first (and only?) appearance of English Horns in
Haydn's symphonies -- but even the earliest ones had a pair of horns in the
orchestra. #5 (1759-60) in particular has notable horn parts.
Tom Wood
Bill McCutcheon
"Thomas Wood" <woo...@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:yGOIb.265282$Ec1.9...@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
ambiguously worded passage: "... with the phrase moving from horns to
cors anglais, the first time these instruments appear in a Haydn
symphony." Sorry!
-- Bill McC.
Johannes Roehl
>
> Neil Brennen <chessno...@mindnospamspring.com> wrote in message
> news:_CMIb.3384$6B....@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net...
> > Does anyone have any recommendations for Haydn's "Hornsignal" symphonies?
> I
> > am referring to his early symphonies with prominent horn parts, such as
> > numbers 31 (The Hornsignal) and 72. What are the best recordings of these
> > symphonies, and what other Haydn symphonies have virtuosic horn writing? I
> > currently own two recordings of 31, both on Naxos - Toscanini and the NBC
> > Symphony, and Drahos. My one recording of 72 is by The Hanover Band
> directed
> > by Roy Goodman.
>
> Hogwood and the Academy of Ancient Music did a (surprisingly) good job with
> the "Hornsignal" Symphony -- but you have to buy a 3-CD box to get it -- if
> you can buy it at all anymore.
> Another symphony with notable high horn parts is #48 ("Maria Theresia.") The
> recording done by L'Estro Armonico on Sony is raw and exciting.
I'll second the L'estro Armonico rec of #48 (Pinnock is also quite good
here, better IMO than in some of the 'darker' Sturm&Drang pieces).
I believe that Naxos did a second recording of some of the
'quasi-concertante' symphonies with Mueller-Bruehl and a Cologne
orchestra which isn't bad, but I do not remember which pieces are
included.
Another symphony with extremely virtuosic horn parts is #51 (incl. in te
Pinnock Box)
Johannes
Simon Roberts
For 31 Hogwood (exciting portamento on the leaps in the first movement) and
Harnoncourt. Other symphonies to consider: 48, with its horns-as-trumpets
brilliance (Solomons/Sony), and 51 with its virtuosic writing for one very high
and one very low horn, which go in opposite directions in the slow movement (and
elsewhere) (Bruggen/Philips).
Other symphonies have prominent horn parts, if not to the extent of the above,
either alone or joined with trumpets (to thrilling effect in 56 and 90, for
example), but its hard to find recordings where they are afforded the requisite
prominence - e.g., it's frustrating to read Landon going on about the screaming
high horns in the finale of 52 and then listen to recordings where, if you can
hear them at all, they sound more like slightly overweight clarinets (Pinnock
comes closest in 52/iv but unfortunately omits the repeat).
Simon
Neil Brennen
"Simon Roberts" <sd...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:bt1c1...@drn.newsguy.com...
Thanks, I will look for Hogwood. The horns on the Drahos recording are very
well-mannered - which is perhaps the last thing horns should be.
Matthew燘. Tepper
caused the following letters to be typed in
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Well, there's the partial recording (first and, I think, last movements)
conducted by Jack Westrup. Horns led by Dennis Brain.
--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
To write to me, do for my address what Androcles did for the lion
War is Peace. ** Freedom is Slavery. ** It's all Napster's fault!
James Ringland
chessno...@mindnospamspring.com says...
you have to buy into Harnoncourt's very rough period instrument sound
(especially the sometimes raucous, overblown horns) and his occasional
quirks. Once you do, this offers some marvelously subtle effects next
to the blatant ones. The sheer craft is amazing: phrasing,
articulation, and volume vary widely and effectively. A safer choice
might be Mackerras on modern instruments. Big, full, and mostly
smooth, but carrying plenty of energy. Mackerras can be accused of
being a little to unvarying on the beat, but the sheer loveliness of the
instrumental timbres -- especially in the final variations -- offers
compensation. Fischer is good too: just a little lighter and less full
than Mackerras. Fischer is maybe a little better in the inner movements
but not as good in outer ones. I do not second the recommendation of
Goodman on Nimbus. Smooth but squarer, less clean, and duller than the
others, even to the point of being lifeless in ii. Thin sound. Iffy
intonation. Goodman and the Hanover Band were considerably better in
their Hyperion/Helios recordings.
I have fewer 72's. Fischer's big and fairly grand reading is fine. I
very much like his concluding variations movement. To calibrate, I find
Goodman on Hyperion/Helios, which you note you have, as OK but no more.
The horn work is fine, but Goodman's choice not to include tympani and
to include a very strong harpsichord continuo hurt. He can't match
Fischer's fine final movement. There Goodman seems a little stiff, a
little choppy, and a little dull in comparison.
Others have recommended a variety of other wonderful horn-laden Haydn
symphonies, but I've not seen a recommendation for number 13. Like 31
and 72, this uses four horns instead of the usual two (plus concertante
writing for cello and flute!) 13 isn't as bold as 31 and 72 but you
might find it fun to hear how Haydn started experimenting in his writing
for four horns. Goodman on Hyperion/Helios is pretty good (excellent on
the horns) if sometimes a bit light in weight over all. Again, no
tympani. (In fairness here, the tympani part here was probably not
written by Haydn although it likely was included with his approval. It
is in the manuscript, in a different hand.) For the tympani part and a
bigger overall conception, try Goberman (available from Pierre Paquin at
http://www.haydnhouse.com/home.htm).
And for "horn signals" you of course have symphony 73, "La Chasse".
Goodman is my favorite, but Blum (with an amazing 70), Harnoncourt (on
the same disk as 31 -- plus a superb 59), and Fischer are all good.
--
Jim Ringland
Henry Krinkle
[snip]
> For 72 I have Fischer and the Austro-Hungarian Orchestra on Nimbus. A fine
> performance, but I can imagine better. I used to have a Naxos recording of
> it that seemed to be determined to make it sound as dull as humanly
> possible.
I completely agree about the Naxos. Drahos also ruins #93 and #95 on that one.
Fischer sounds great to me.
Regards,
Henry
Heck51
"Does anyone have any recommendations for Haydn's "Hornsignal"
symphonies?"
my favorite "hornsignal" performance never made it to CD, I don't
think - that is Rilling/Stuttgart on Turnabout LP, coupled with a
marvelous #59 'Fire".
beautiful horn work - sounds like modern instruments - beautiful tone,
good intonation..excellent playing.
The EMI recording of mvt I with Dennis Brain et al is good also
I do have Harnoncourt's early 90s Vienna CD, which is entertaining,
and fun[ny]. the horns are very raw and raucous. I horn-playing friend
of mine laughed uproariously on hearing it - he wants to rename the
#31 "Hornsignal" the "Kazoo" Symphony!! :)
still, Harnoncourt's gets high marks for gusto and enthusiasm, tho the
bassoon solo in the trio of #73 "LaChasse" is embarassingly wimpy and
diffuse...
I also have Drahos recording - it's OK, but pretty tame, same with his
"LaChasse". OrpheusCO is alot better..
Neil Brennen
"Heck51" <dgall...@mediaone.net> wrote in message
news:e87e1a2e.04010...@posting.google.com...
While I have the attention of a bassoonist, do any Haydn symphonies feature
the bassoon? Aside from the slow movement of #93, of course.
Heck51
"While I have the attention of a bassoonist, do any Haydn symphonies
feature
the bassoon?"
too many to name - but a few notables:
#88, #90, 91, 63, 64, 68, 98, 81,54, 55, 56 74, - some of the early
ones too - #6 I think...
the late Londons 100-, are very good for Bassoon - #104 esp
Aside from the slow movement of #93, of course."
#93 = Szell/Cleveland, of course - apparently Szell kept telling
Goslee to play louder, and louder, and blattier - until finally George
just slapped on an unfinished blank, and blasted out that incredible
explosion of bovine flatulence, recorded so sensitively and
"delicately" for posterity. LOL!!
-definitely worthy of Toscanini/NBC Finlandia[1952]
ansermetniac
dgall...@mediaone.net says...
Abbedd
Heck51
"Isn't the basson fart in 93 in the second Bassoon?"
a2, FORTISSIMO, LOW C
Another wonderful spot occurs in the "Creation" - the great dinosaur
fart [I forget which #]
"..and the grear beasts trod the earth..."BLLLAAATTT!!
low Bb flat - 2 bassoons and contra. fabulous orchestration!! LOL!!
I always try to get away with having both bassoons play low Bb, and
the contra play its low Bb - all FFF, of course - gawd - what a
hilarious racket!!
if you don't get everyone - orch, chorus, soloists, Laughing Their
Asses Off - it doesn't count!! :)
arri bachrach
> > "While I have the attention of a bassoonist, do any Haydn symphonies
> > feature
> > the bassoon?"
> >
> > too many to name - but a few notables:
> >
>
> >
> Isn't the basson fart in 93 in the second Bassoon?
>
> Abbedd
FYI, the bassoon does not "fart", it just shits ( at least that is
what mine does):-)))
however the horn DOES fart
Ab
Sgolescu
Herr Bachrach Maharsho-kop:
>
>FYI, the bassoon does not "fart", it just shits ( at least that is
>what mine does):-)))
>
>however the horn DOES fart
>
Only when and if the hornist had one kartofl-kukhn too many. . .
regards,
SG
Sgolescu
>recordings) but have nothing to compare it to.
That goes a long way toward explaining it.
regards,
SG
(sorry, I couldn't help it (-:)
davyd
Haydn wrote for contrababboon, eh? Didn't know that.