Haydn Cello Concerto in C

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Lena

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Jan 27, 2003, 3:13:17 PM1/27/03
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Dear Haydn-mongers: I need help finding a performance of the C-major
Cello Concerto. I have Wispelwey, Mork/Iona Brown, du Pre/Barenboim,
and Emil Klein, and, of these, only Wispelwey's works for me
(his "cadenza" notwithstanding :) ).

But although Wispelwey's sense of line is often impeccable and his
Adagio has beauty, I don't hear him, and, even more so, his
slightly, ehm :) , raw-sounding orchestra, indulge quite enough in the
conspicuous warmth of the thematic material in i. I hear this more as
an uncomplicated feel-good piece with a beguiling combination of
energy and sensuousness, and I don't want very high dramatics here,
not even in the mildly dramatic Vivaldiesque Baroque gestures. To
emphasize the warmth, I prefer an on-pitch, round, uhm traditional
sound... (here, not necessarily at all elsewhere).

For some reason everybody seems to get the energy in this piece, but
few go for the sweetness. (That, even though parts of the theme
seem almost a lesson in how to use the scale to produce a melting
quality.) Only Iona Brown's orchestra, despite being a bit "light"
and "graceful," goes along with what's not all that untypical for
Haydn: several good thematic swoonings, but all of them tasteful. :)
Wispelwey also has an idea, but doesn't quite get there.

The other cellists I have are all too aggressive in i. And too
poignant (du Pre), too ridiculous (Klein), or too ambitious (Mork).

Whom should I try? Thanks for any suggestions.

Lena

Lena

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Jan 27, 2003, 3:49:33 PM1/27/03
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I wrote:

>I have Wispelwey, Mork/Iona Brown, du Pre/Barenboim,
>and Emil Klein, and, of these, only Wispelwey's works for me

>Only Iona Brown's orchestra, despite being a bit "light" and

>"graceful," [does some very specific bars of i well].

I should maybe add that I'm not looking for anything like Brown/Mork
overall (my endorsement of a detail doesn't mean I like them a lot
overall). For example, of my discards, Barenboim/du Pre has a *far*
better line in i (du Pre just happens to "fail" in other ways).

Well, hopefully there's some cello playing out there that fits the
prescription, no matter how confusedly stated.

Lena

Paul Goldstein

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Jan 27, 2003, 3:31:06 PM1/27/03
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In article <6b33de45.03012...@posting.google.com>, len...@yahoo.com
says...

Yo-Yo Ma's recording is beautiful and very sweet without being cloying.

Paul Goldstein

Simon Roberts

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Jan 27, 2003, 3:56:57 PM1/27/03
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On 27 Jan 2003 12:13:17 -0800, Lena <len...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>Dear Haydn-mongers: I need help finding a performance of the C-major
>Cello Concerto. I have Wispelwey, Mork/Iona Brown, du Pre/Barenboim,
>and Emil Klein, and, of these, only Wispelwey's works for me
>(his "cadenza" notwithstanding :) ).
>
>But although Wispelwey's sense of line is often impeccable and his
>Adagio has beauty, I don't hear him, and, even more so, his
>slightly, ehm :) , raw-sounding orchestra, indulge quite enough in the
>conspicuous warmth of the thematic material in i. I hear this more as
>an uncomplicated feel-good piece with a beguiling combination of
>energy and sensuousness, and I don't want very high dramatics here,
>not even in the mildly dramatic Vivaldiesque Baroque gestures. To
>emphasize the warmth, I prefer an on-pitch, round, uhm traditional
>sound... (here, not necessarily at all elsewhere).

Steer clear of Bylsma/Tafelmusik; he's not on good form, frequently out of
tune and takes a tempo for iii that's too fast for him (or surely anyone
else) to articulate and is tonally much more raw than Wispelwey. Among
HIP performances you might find Suzuki/Kuijken/DHM and Coin/Howgood more
suitable - at any rate, they're rather less energetic than Wispelwey
throughout.

Among the non-HIP, I very much like Heinrich Schiff/Marriner, who are
certainly refined but may not offer quite the warmth you're looking for -
Schiff is technically superlative, tonally pure and light (very little
vibrato) and has a jaunty, almost impish air about his playing here, which
alternates as appropriate with delicacy and intimacy; in short,
distinctively characterful and worth seeking out (may be hard to find,
unless it's been reissued). Even so, he may be more clever and inventive
than the sort of performance you may want. Marriner's accompaniment is
unobtrusively first rate.

Another non-HIP performance I rather like is
Perenyi/Rolla on Hungaroton (also Laserlight, but that may not sound as
good), but heard next to Schiff he seems rather plain (though this may
amount to simple lyricism, I suppose) and I don't like his tone or use of
vibrato nearly as much as Schiff's - nor is Rolla's accompaniment as good
as Marriner's.

I'm not sure whether to recommend Rostropovich/Britten/Decca if only
because although there's a fair amount of delicate, lyrical playing, they
bring out the energy in the louder passages more than most (I like it
quite a bit).

I would have expected Vogler's recent recording to fit the bill -
few cellists make a lovelier sound as such than he does - but
unlike any previous recording of his I've encountered this is very
disappointing, the whole enterprise undermined by Guettler's lethally dull
accompaniments.

Stay away from Harrell unless you have a fondness for relentless,
intrusive vibrato (I think it probably has other flaws too, but that one
sticks in my memory the most stubbornly).


>
>For some reason everybody seems to get the energy in this piece,

If only!

Simon (who doesn't think he's heard Mork and who should warn you that he
likes Wispelwey the most)

Samir Golescu

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Jan 27, 2003, 4:48:39 PM1/27/03
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Lena, have you tried Gendron's?

regards,
SG


Lena

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Jan 27, 2003, 6:10:02 PM1/27/03
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>Among the non-HIP, I very much like Heinrich Schiff/Marriner, who are
>certainly refined but may not offer quite the warmth you're looking for -
>Schiff is technically superlative, tonally pure and light (very little
>vibrato) and has a jaunty, almost impish air about his playing here, which
>alternates as appropriate with delicacy and intimacy; in short,
>distinctively characterful and worth seeking out (may be hard to find,
>unless it's been reissued). Even so, he may be more clever and inventive
>than the sort of performance you may want. Marriner's accompaniment is
>unobtrusively first rate.

[... and other excellent remarks...]

Both the Schiff and the Rostropovich sound interesting (from your
remarks). I think "impish" will be good. :) I probably was a bit
misleading in my descriptions - I like energy in this piece, I was
just looking for sweetness *added* to energy... (I doubt I have
anything against cleverness and inventiveness either. :) As such. :) )

> Simon (who doesn't think he's heard Mork and who should warn you
> that he likes Wispelwey the most)

I also like Wispelwey, and don't find it unsatisfactory (au contraire,
it works well and I'm certainly not getting rid of it). I just wanted
another version with more emphasis on warmth and a softer instrument
sound.

Excellent suggestions. Thank you!

Lena

Lena

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Jan 27, 2003, 6:11:29 PM1/27/03
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Paul Goldstein wrote:

> Yo-Yo Ma's recording is beautiful and very sweet without being cloying.

This is the one with the ECO and, I think, Garcia?

Lena

Lena

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Jan 27, 2003, 6:14:33 PM1/27/03
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Samir wrote:

> Lena, have you tried Gendron's?

No... is it a patisserie? :) I've never even heard of Gendron but
since this is coming from you, I'll have to go look for it. Him. Her.

Lena

Samir Golescu

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Jan 27, 2003, 6:29:19 PM1/27/03
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On 27 Jan 2003, Lena wrote:

> Samir wrote:
>
> > Lena, have you tried Gendron's?
>
> No... is it a patisserie? :)

Pas du tout. . .

> I've never even heard of Gendron but since this is coming from you, I'll
> have to go look for it. Him. Her.

Him. Him. Not so esoteric a name. Maurice Gendron, superb French cellist.
(A fateful "prenom", Maurice, insofar another great French cellist was
Maurice Marechal -- hear his Lalo Cto recording). I remember having heard
Gendron's playing both Haydn cello concertos -- one of them, the D Major
conducted by Pablo Casals no less, in a superb recording and, I believe,
the only time Casals was recorded while conducting another cellist, "your"
C Major in a later -- Philips?? -- recording, slightly drier but still
very beautiful -- and liking them both very much (possibly they
corresponded somewhat to what you were looking for. . . ). I've always
found the French cello school underrated and "underknown". My memories are
vague enough though as for you to want to get some substantial
corroboration from fresher sources before deciding on any major, as in
wallet-paining, acquisition. . . (-:

Also, alongside Simon R's suggestions, hope "REG" is reading you -- he
knows tones of cello recordings.

regards,
SG

Simon Roberts

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Jan 27, 2003, 6:29:49 PM1/27/03
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"Lena" <len...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:6b33de45.03012...@posting.google.com...

Maurice. Probably not a pastry.

All of which made me think, having arrived home and stared at a shelf or
two, that Fournier might do the trick, but on listening I'm not so
sure - his may be the most consistently extrovert in i I have (which
isn't to say it's not lyrical; but it's hardly intimate either).

Simon


Paul Goldstein

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Jan 27, 2003, 6:48:20 PM1/27/03
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>Paul Goldstein wrote:
>
>> Yo-Yo Ma's recording is beautiful and very sweet without being cloying.
>
>This is the one with the ECO and, I think, Garcia?

Yes.

Paul Goldstein

wkas...@attbi.com

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Jan 27, 2003, 7:26:43 PM1/27/03
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"Simon Roberts" <sd...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:G62dnXHuzMt...@comcast.com...

> All of which made me think, having arrived home and stared at a shelf or
> two, that Fournier might do the trick, but on listening I'm not so
> sure - his may be the most consistently extrovert in i I have (which
> isn't to say it's not lyrical; but it's hardly intimate either).

Did Fournier record the C major concerto? I thought that he only did the
other one...

Bill
--

====================
William D. Kasimer
wkas...@attbi.com
wkas...@quincymc.org


REG

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Jan 27, 2003, 8:15:29 PM1/27/03
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That or Fournier would do in, imho
"Samir Golescu" <gol...@uiuc.edu> wrote in message
news:Pine.GSO.4.31.030127...@ux5.cso.uiuc.edu...

Matthew B. Tepper (if there are backslashes in this address, it is forged)

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Jan 27, 2003, 7:59:18 PM1/27/03
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<wkas...@attbi.com> appears to have caused the following letters to be
typed in news:77kZ9.65310$6G4.11821@sccrnsc02:

> "Simon Roberts" <sd...@comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:G62dnXHuzMt...@comcast.com...
>
>> All of which made me think, having arrived home and stared at a shelf
>> or two, that Fournier might do the trick, but on listening I'm not so
>> sure - his may be the most consistently extrovert in i I have (which
>> isn't to say it's not lyrical; but it's hardly intimate either).
>
> Did Fournier record the C major concerto? I thought that he only did
> the other one...

The C Major was discovered only in the 1960s, if memory serves. I can't
recall just when he died (early 1970s?), but maybe he didn't feel like
learning a "new" work by then.

--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
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Matthew B. Tepper (if there are backslashes in this address, it is forged)

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Jan 27, 2003, 7:59:17 PM1/27/03
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Ever hear Laszlo Varga with Antal Dorati, on Vox? I'm prejudiced because
Varga was my conducting teacher. I recall seeing him after a summer break,
when he had just returned from recording these.

MBT: "Who was the conductor?"

LV: "Antal Dorati."

MBT: "Wow! How did that go?"

LV: "Antal Dorati is a son of a bitch."

REG

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Jan 27, 2003, 8:19:25 PM1/27/03
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Unless I don't recall properly, Rost did it twice, and I don't think you are
going to be very happy with the one where he is conducting as well - the
sound can be pretty raw.

"Lena" <len...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:6b33de45.03012...@posting.google.com...

LastRedLeafFalls

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Jan 27, 2003, 8:33:53 PM1/27/03
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Matthew B. Tepper wrote:

[Fournier]


>I can't
>recall just when he died (early 1970s?), but maybe he didn't feel like
>learning a "new" work by then.

He was alive as late as April 1974, when he recorded the Schubert Opus 99 and
100 trios with Rubinstein and Szeryng, the last efforts of that aggregate.
(Funny; I'd misremembered those Schuberts as being ca. 1971 or so...)

- Todd K

Steve Emerson

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Jan 27, 2003, 9:25:15 PM1/27/03
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In article <Xns9310AE15298...@129.250.170.99>,
"Matthew B. Tepper (if there are backslashes in this address, it is forged)"
<oy兀earthlink.net> wrote:

> <wkas...@attbi.com> appears to have caused the following letters to be
> typed in news:77kZ9.65310$6G4.11821@sccrnsc02:

> > Did Fournier record the C major concerto? I thought that he only did


> > the other one...
>
> The C Major was discovered only in the 1960s, if memory serves. I can't

> recall just when he died (early 1970s?)...

1986, per DG Bach cello suites liner notes.

SE.

Ray Hall

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Jan 27, 2003, 10:50:13 PM1/27/03
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"Lena" <len...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:6b33de45.03012...@posting.google.com...

Why not try Maria Kliegel on Naxos. The CD contains the C major Hob. VIIb:1,
along with the two D majors Hob. VIIb:2 and VIIb:4.

Maria Kliegel is a wonderful cellist, (I am also smitten by her so am
completely biased), but her tone is very generously full, even to the point
of being perhaps a tad too full.

With the Cologne CO/Müller-Brühl. There are two numbers in the catalogue.
The one for distribution in Germany has a full frontal (face) on the front
cover, whilst the one I have (8.555041) shows her off in a beautiful black
gown.

Regards,

# http://www.users.bigpond.com/hallraylily/index.html
< NEW Doris Day TV series news >
VIVE LA KAREN, and "Never look at the brass - it only encourages them"

Ray, Taree, NSW

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Simon Roberts

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Jan 27, 2003, 10:57:57 PM1/27/03
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"REG" <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:xUkZ9.53851$Oj7.11...@twister.nyc.rr.com...

> Unless I don't recall properly, Rost did it twice, and I don't think
you are
> going to be very happy with the one where he is conducting as well -
the
> sound can be pretty raw.

Correct - the earlier one with Britten is far preferable, partly for
Britten's excellent contribution.

Simon


Simon Roberts

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Jan 27, 2003, 11:02:24 PM1/27/03
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<wkas...@attbi.com> wrote in message
news:77kZ9.65310$6G4.11821@sccrnsc02...

>
> "Simon Roberts" <sd...@comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:G62dnXHuzMt...@comcast.com...
>
> > All of which made me think, having arrived home and stared at a
shelf or
> > two, that Fournier might do the trick, but on listening I'm not so
> > sure - his may be the most consistently extrovert in i I have (which
> > isn't to say it's not lyrical; but it's hardly intimate either).
>
> Did Fournier record the C major concerto? I thought that he only did
the
> other one...

No, I listened to an imaginary recording..... (Sorry.) It's on DG
Galleria 457 904. The just-tolerable accompaniment is Lucerne Festival
Strings/Baumgartner. Recorded in 1967. The other concertos on the disc
are Piano cto in D with Demus/Berlin Radio S.O./Decker (not to be
confused with his HIP recording of the piece), Violin cto in C
LAPO/Zukerman (hideous), Trumpet cto Thibaud/Bamberg S.O./Gerdes.
Perhaps not released in the U.S. (though I bought mine at Academy in
NY)?

Simon


William Satterthwaite

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Jan 28, 2003, 11:32:24 AM1/28/03
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Simon Roberts <sd...@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> Stay away from Harrell unless you have a fondness for relentless,
> intrusive vibrato (I think it probably has other flaws too, but that one
> sticks in my memory the most stubbornly).

Hideous cadenzas, which Harrell wrote himself.

Bill in Seattle

Mark K. Ehlert

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Jan 28, 2003, 12:16:52 PM1/28/03
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Samir Golescu <gol...@uiuc.edu> wrote in
news:Pine.GSO.4.31.03012...@ux10.cso.uiuc.edu:

> Also, alongside Simon R's suggestions, hope "REG" is reading you
> -- he knows tones of cello recordings.

^^^^^

So he has a good ear for this sort of thing?

--
Mark K. Ehlert

To respond via e-mail, X = 3

william d. kasimer

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Jan 28, 2003, 12:39:50 PM1/28/03
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"Simon Roberts" <sd...@comcast.net> wrote in message news:<5YmcnXLnxqx...@comcast.com>...

> > Did Fournier record the C major concerto? I thought that he only did
> > the other one...
>
> No, I listened to an imaginary recording.....

I've done that on several occasions. They're often better than the real thing.

Bill

Simon Roberts

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Jan 28, 2003, 12:45:22 PM1/28/03
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"william d. kasimer" <wkas...@quincymc.org> wrote in message
news:f69b4194.0301...@posting.google.com...

You could get a job with Penguin...

Simon


Lena

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Jan 28, 2003, 3:59:44 PM1/28/03
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Paul Goldstein <pgol...@newsguy.com> wrote in message news:<b14gg...@drn.newsguy.com>...

OK.

Since I'm very fond of tersely cogent one-word replies, I'm going to
try it!

Thank you,
Lena

Matthew B. Tepper (if there are backslashes in this address, it is forged)

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Jan 28, 2003, 3:46:54 PM1/28/03
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"Simon Roberts" <sd...@comcast.net> appears to have caused the following
letters to be typed in news:FMadnfMS_PM...@comcast.com:

Or the Wall Street Journal.

Lena

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Jan 28, 2003, 4:10:57 PM1/28/03
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Samir Golescu <gol...@uiuc.edu> wrote

> Him. Him. Not so esoteric a name. Maurice Gendron, superb French cellist.
> (A fateful "prenom", Maurice, insofar another great French cellist was
> Maurice Marechal -- hear his Lalo Cto recording). I remember having heard
> Gendron's playing both Haydn cello concertos -- one of them, the D Major
> conducted by Pablo Casals no less, in a superb recording and, I believe,
> the only time Casals was recorded while conducting another cellist, "your"
> C Major in a later -- Philips?? -- recording, slightly drier but still
> very beautiful -- and liking them both very much (possibly they
> corresponded somewhat to what you were looking for. . . ).

Thank you!

This sounds promising. So far I've found very few CDs with Gendron (any
composer) and no Haydn. (Though it's hardly relevant here, I'll try to
investigate his playing in Bach...)

Lena

Lena

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Jan 28, 2003, 4:13:51 PM1/28/03
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"REG" <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<xUkZ9.53851$Oj7.11...@twister.nyc.rr.com>...

> Unless I don't recall properly, Rost did it twice, and I don't think you are


> going to be very happy with the one where he is conducting as well - the
> sound can be pretty raw.

Thanks very much. Warning duly noted.

Do you happen to have more identifying information about the Gendron Haydn?
(Any Haydn concerto.) I can't really find anything so far.

Are there more Fournier performances than the one Simon mentions?

Lena

Lena

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Jan 28, 2003, 4:15:44 PM1/28/03
to
"Matthew B. Tepper (if there are backslashes in this address, it is
forged)" <oy @earthlink.net> wrote

> Ever hear Laszlo Varga with Antal Dorati, on Vox?

I haven't...

> I'm prejudiced because
> Varga was my conducting teacher. I recall seeing him after a summer break,
> when he had just returned from recording these.
>
> MBT: "Who was the conductor?"
>
> LV: "Antal Dorati."
>
> MBT: "Wow! How did that go?"
>
> LV: "Antal Dorati is a son of a bitch."

I can see how this could result in a particularly "warm and intimate"
performance... :)

Lena

Lena

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Jan 28, 2003, 4:29:25 PM1/28/03
to
"Ray Hall" <hallr...@bigpond.com> wrote

> Maria Kliegel is a wonderful cellist, (I am also smitten by her so am
> completely biased), but her tone is very generously full, even to the point
> of being perhaps a tad too full.
>
> With the Cologne CO/Müller-Brühl. There are two numbers in the catalogue.
> The one for distribution in Germany has a full frontal (face) on the front
> cover, whilst the one I have (8.555041) shows her off in a beautiful black
> gown.

Interesting advice. Based on this, I think I'll have to try it
immediately after I have my first "attitude adjustment" operation.

Unfortunately, in my current unadjusted state, my interest in female
cellists and their wardrobes rises above the level of nonexistence
only if they come dressed as dachshunds... Though on those
(regrettably few) occasions I'm all attention.

Lena

Paul Goldstein

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Jan 28, 2003, 4:46:56 PM1/28/03
to

I had Gendron's Bach Suites on Philips World Series LPs. He is a fabulous
player, something like a Grumiaux of cellists.

Paul Goldstein

Samuel Broda

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Jan 28, 2003, 6:04:26 PM1/28/03
to Lena
Female cellists dressed as dachshunds? And performing Haydn? Is there
a newsgroup for this yet?

Sorry, I just couldn't resist,
Sam

Samuel Broda
Alexandria, VA
"Dumping trash along the Information Superhighway since 1983."

Lena

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Jan 28, 2003, 7:14:56 PM1/28/03
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"Simon Roberts" <sd...@comcast.net> wrote

> No, I listened to an imaginary recording.....

Suddenly, the previously bewildering size of your CD collection has become
much more understandable... :)

Lena

Matthew B. Tepper (if there are backslashes in this address, it is forged)

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Jan 28, 2003, 8:00:07 PM1/28/03
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len...@yahoo.com (Lena) appears to have caused the following letters to
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Kind of like those Rubinstein and Reiner collaborations. ;--)

John Holubiak

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Jan 28, 2003, 10:50:29 PM1/28/03
to
Two more performances you might try are Steven Isserlis (with Norrington and
the Cchamber Orchestra of Europe on RCA Red Seal) and Julian Lloyd Webber on
Philips (412 793-2PH, although this one may be out of print). I enjoy both
of these performances very much.

Isserlis isn't HIP, but he isn't traditional either. Like Yo-Yo Ma he has
incredible ease of tone production and is technically a strong player. The
Andante is quite lovely, and the rich bass of his instrument adds a nice
touch of humor to the Finale. The orchestra is in fine form. Isserlis also
wrote the cadenzas.

The Lloyd Webber is a more traditional performance. He doesn't posess the
razor sharp virtuosity of Isserlis, but he does produce a rich, sweet tone
and this performance has character.

The Gendron performance may have once been on a Philips Concert Classics CD,
possibly coupled with a different recording of the D Major Concerto than the
one conducted by Casals. I'm going from memory on this. Going back to 1996
via Schwann catalogs, I don't see a listing for it so it's probably long
out-of-print. Another poster compared Gendron to Grumiaux, but in his
beautiful tone production and elegance, I'd probably say he reminds me of
Milstein (and also Fournier).

John

> Lena


Simon Roberts

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Jan 29, 2003, 12:36:20 AM1/29/03
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"John Holubiak" <Charm...@attbi.com> wrote in message
news:9cIZ9.75236$VU6....@rwcrnsc52.ops.asp.att.net...

> Two more performances you might try are Steven Isserlis (with
Norrington and
> the Cchamber Orchestra of Europe on RCA Red Seal) and Julian Lloyd
Webber on
> Philips (412 793-2PH, although this one may be out of print). I enjoy
both
> of these performances very much.
>
> Isserlis isn't HIP, but he isn't traditional either. Like Yo-Yo Ma he
has
> incredible ease of tone production and is technically a strong player.
The
> Andante is quite lovely, and the rich bass of his instrument adds a
nice
> touch of humor to the Finale. The orchestra is in fine form. Isserlis
also
> wrote the cadenzas.

I hope you don't mind a dissenting comment, but I found that disc
impossibly overrefined, not so much for what Isserlis does (though it's
hard to tell who's to blame - or, I suppose, praise, since you like it)
as Norrington's timid contribution (even worse in the sinfonia
concertante that fills out the disc). It sounds to me as though they're
all tip-toeing around the music, afraid to wake it up.

Simon


Rodger Whitlock

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Jan 29, 2003, 1:41:16 AM1/29/03
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On Tue, 28 Jan 2003 18:04:26 -0500, Samuel Broda
<sbr...@ix.netcom.com> wrote:

> Female cellists dressed as dachshunds? And performing Haydn? Is there
> a newsgroup for this yet?

Not really, but if you are Highly Desirous of same, I'm sure we
can convince some depraved sysadmin to newgroup
"alt.fan.music.classical.artists.female.in-disguise.as-dachshunds.
playing-Haydn" for you.

--
Rodger Whitlock
Victoria, British Columbia, Canada

Rodger Whitlock

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Jan 29, 2003, 1:40:36 AM1/29/03
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I am reminded of one of the Immortal Poetess's[*] aphorisms: if
you're squeamish, don't prod the beach rubble.


* Sappho.

John Holubiak

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Jan 29, 2003, 2:30:22 AM1/29/03
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No, I find you to be a perceptive and articulate writer and enjoy reading
your comments.

This is the lightest sounding recording of the concerto I've heard, and
transparency of this approach has grown on me over time. Isserlis plays a
wonderful instrument. Sometimes one reads of players' struggles to get their
instruments to sound, but his cello sounds exceptionally beautiful and
clean.

John


"Simon Roberts" <sd...@comcast.net> wrote in message

news:hyGdnTCJU9v...@comcast.com...

REG

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Jan 29, 2003, 6:15:13 AM1/29/03
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rec.music.opera

"Samuel Broda" <sbr...@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:3E370C7A...@ix.netcom.com...

Ray Rackham

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Jan 30, 2003, 6:20:22 AM1/30/03
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I have a recording of both the C Major and D Major concertos dating from
1982 with Cristophe Coin and the Academy of ancient Music under Hogwood.
Although I'm no authority on Haydn, I've always found both recordings very
satisfying. It was available on L'Oiseau Lyre 414615-2 but I don't know if
it's still in circulation.


Lena wrote in message <6b33de45.03012...@posting.google.com>...

Lena

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Jan 30, 2003, 2:56:57 PM1/30/03
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[Isserlis and Lloyd Webber]

>The Lloyd Webber is a more traditional performance. He doesn't posess the
>razor sharp virtuosity of Isserlis, but he does produce a rich, sweet tone
>and this performance has character.

Thanks very much for these recommendations. On the face of it, the Lloyd
Webber sounds a bit more like what I'm looking for.

[you write of Isserlis, in another post:]

>This is the lightest sounding recording of the concerto I've heard, and
>transparency of this approach has grown on me over time. Isserlis plays a
>wonderful instrument. Sometimes one reads of players' struggles to get their
>instruments to sound, but his cello sounds exceptionally beautiful and
>clean.

This is an interesting comment. I sympathize with the idea that a
'light' performance can grow on you, though I almost never seem to go
for those at first. I've never figured out if this is because one's
imagination puts in the required extra touches or whether something
about the lightness itself becomes appealing after several decadent
chocolate cakes. (Patisseries may never be too far from any subject.)

Usually, these are performances which inflect exactly "right" but do
it extremely subtly (some pianists come to mind, Gulda is one). There
have been a couple of times I've eventually ended up preferring such
light performances by a margin to much more pointedly characterized
or overtly dramatic versions, although in those cases the music itself
probably suggests a large smack of lightness to me. (I think I've
never yet liked a featherweight, fluffy, and puffy little merengue of a
St. Matthew's Passion or Fidelio Act II... :) )

The Haydn cello cto is not an unlikely candidate for lightness even if
I'm looking for "warmth"... Thanks. I'm noting this for the future
in case the first batch of candidates doesn't come through.

>The Gendron performance may have once been on a Philips Concert
>Classics CD, possibly coupled with a different recording of the D
>Major Concerto than the one conducted by Casals. I'm going from
>memory on this. Going back to 1996 via Schwann catalogs, I don't see
>a listing for it so it's probably long out-of-print.

Yes, it looks like it. Thanks!

[Gendron]


>compared Gendron to Grumiaux, but in his beautiful tone production
>and elegance, I'd probably say he reminds me of Milstein (and also
>Fournier).

Well, all of this sounds very promising. Though I suppose not for
the Haydn, since it's OOP.

Lena

Lena

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Jan 30, 2003, 3:01:56 PM1/30/03
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Paul Goldstein <pgol...@newsguy.com> wrote in message

>I had Gendron's Bach Suites on Philips World Series LPs. He is a fabulous


>player, something like a Grumiaux of cellists.

Had?? :) (Though I'm intrigued and will try Gendron anyway.)

(I actually don't know enough about Grumiaux (know Milstein better, for
example). I've only heard some Bach, which is inconclusive - some OK, some
(keyboard+violin sonatas on Philips) strangely uninteresting...)

Lena

Lena

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Jan 30, 2003, 3:05:35 PM1/30/03
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satt...@eskimo.com (William Satterthwaite) wrote in message news:<b16bao$h1c$1...@eskinews.eskimo.com>...

In the hideous cadenzas class, there are several guys who can compete. :)

I like Wispelwey a lot, but hiccups are raised by at least one of his
compositional efforts... :) - Though actually, I sort of enjoy bad
cadenzas. (I always wish somebody had thought of starting the practice
of putting one into selected spots in Wagner operas. :) )

Lena

Paul Goldstein

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Jan 30, 2003, 3:37:13 PM1/30/03
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In article <6b33de45.03013...@posting.google.com>, len...@yahoo.com
says...

>
>Paul Goldstein <pgol...@newsguy.com> wrote in message
>
>>I had Gendron's Bach Suites on Philips World Series LPs. He is a fabulous
>>player, something like a Grumiaux of cellists.
>
>Had?? :) (Though I'm intrigued and will try Gendron anyway.)

I recently liquidated 98% of my classical LPs, primarily because of lack of use.
By now, they should be in the hands of people more likely to listen to them.

>(I actually don't know enough about Grumiaux (know Milstein better, for
>example). I've only heard some Bach, which is inconclusive - some OK, some
>(keyboard+violin sonatas on Philips) strangely uninteresting...)

I'm especially fond of Grumiaux's Beethoven and Mozart concerti with Colin
Davis, his quintet's performances of the Mozart string quintets, his Stravinsky
concerto with Bour, and his performance of any French music, either concerto or
chamber in form. (His Lalo with Manuel Rosenthal and his Lekeu and Faure
sonatas are particularly noteworthy, but he never went wrong in French
repertoire as far as I know.) Also, the Philips Duo set of his encores is
unbelievable; he is the master of everything there, from Kreisler to Schubert to
Sarasate.

Paul Goldstein

Lena

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Jan 31, 2003, 7:50:39 PM1/31/03
to
Paul Goldstein <pgol...@newsguy.com> wrote

> I'm especially fond of Grumiaux's Beethoven and Mozart concerti with Colin
> Davis, his quintet's performances of the Mozart string quintets, his Stravinsky
> concerto with Bour, and his performance of any French music, either concerto or
> chamber in form. (His Lalo with Manuel Rosenthal and his Lekeu and Faure
> sonatas are particularly noteworthy, but he never went wrong in French
> repertoire as far as I know.) Also, the Philips Duo set of his encores is
> unbelievable; he is the master of everything there, from Kreisler to Schubert to
> Sarasate.

Thank you. I'll try some of this (I don't really like the Lalo a lot,
as a work, but the rest...).

Lena

Lena

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Feb 3, 2003, 6:10:00 PM2/3/03
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len...@yahoo.com (Lena) wrote in message news:<6b33de45.03012...@posting.google.com>...

> Dear Haydn-mongers: I need help finding a performance of the C-major
> Cello Concerto.

Thank you to all. I've heard several new ones, and Fournier is turning
up a winner (though many of the others are good too). Yo-Yo Ma hasn't
yet deigned to arrive, but will be heard as soon as it does.

Lena

Matthew B. Tepper (posts from uswest.net are forged)

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Feb 3, 2003, 7:49:17 PM2/3/03
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len...@yahoo.com (Lena) appears to have caused the following letters to
be typed in news:6b33de45.0302...@posting.google.com:

I forgot to mention -- I heard Jacqueline du Pré's recording (with hubby)
on the radio a few days ago, and it sounded fine, although the finale at
times seemed a mad rush.

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