"Who is the best active Mahler conductor?" (CBC, Jan. 10)
JohnK54250
repertoire. The 9th he gave with the Phillies in NY a few years ago was
stupefying, and only a day or so after Abbado had done with the impeccable
Berliners. The BPO played better (slightly) but Rattle is an infinitely
more penetrative Mahlerian than Abbado, who observes the music from
without as opposed to, Bernstein/Tennstedt/Rattle who exude it from inside
themselves.
Kang Howson-Jan
discussed this topic, with participants Tim Page, Norman Lebrecht, and
host Peter Tieffenbach (I'm likely mangling the names). The recordings
of the various symphonies they excerpted during the show were:
Tennstedt (VI)
Boulez (VI)
Rattle (I)
Chailly (VII)
Abbado (VIII)
I may have forgotten one or two, but the show was only 90 min. The
discussion was interesting in that Mr. Page seemed to have a hard time
completely disliking any of the recordings, except the Rattle. Mr.
Lebrecht appeared to like none of them wholeheartedly, except the
Chailly. He villified Boulez, and thought Tennstedt has done better in
live performances. Peter liked Abbado, which the other 2 agreed with
without any raves. Overall the Chailly got the most enthusiastic
response from all of them--a bit ironic since he has made only a couple
of other Mahler recordings.
I was impressed enough by the Abbado VIII to have my eyes open for
it--the choral singing was really something else, at least in the last
5-10 mins of the piece. Unlike his recording of II (which I like in all
other respects), this finale really built to the climax.
--Kang Howson-Jan
Rosario Gennaro
>My vote is for Rattle actually, since all the symphonies are in his
>repertoire.
Even the 8th? I thought he had major reservations about this piece.
But in general I would agree. I am so upset I am going to miss his 10th
here in Boston ...
What do people think of Gary Bertini? I own his Das Lied von der Erde
(Heppner/Lipovsek) which is by far my favourite. I also have his 2nd.
I saw him live in Paris performing the 9th and I was blown away
(I saw the 9th by Abbado and Haitink and it was nothing in comparison)
--
Rosario Gennaro Laboratory for Computer Science
ros...@theory.lcs.mit.edu Massachusetts Institute of Technology
http://theory.lcs.mit.edu/~rosario Cambridge MA 02139
"... la tua loquela ti fa manifesto di quella nobil patria natio ..."
Inf. X
Kathy Edgar
>My vote is for Rattle actually, since all the symphonies are in his
>stupefying, and only a day or so after Abbado had done with the impeccable
>Berliners. The BPO played better (slightly) but Rattle is an infinitely
>more penetrative Mahlerian than Abbado, who observes the music from
>without as opposed to, Bernstein/Tennstedt/Rattle who exude it from inside
>themselves.
The main criticism of Rattle was that the CBSO is simply not in the
league of the orchs you mention above, or the recorded competition. The
movement they played on the radio was the 3rd movement from I, and I must
say I agreed that it is one of the most leaden performances I have heard.
It isn't the tempo, but the lift of the landler I missed (I have seen it
referred to as "schwung" in some reviews--neat word). I guess it is
accentuation--it didn't dance.
I don't agree that Rattle is "infinitely more penetrating" perhaps
because I seldom say always or never. Maybe he needs the PolyGram PR
apparatus. Not many of his recordings have made me want to go out and
get them for myself.
The other point you touch on that also poses a dilemma to shows like this
is that sometimes you end up comparing live performances that weren't
recorded and distributed. It's no good to most of us if you say that
conductor X gave an once-in-a-lifetime performance with orch Y at such
and such a city, and that makes him/her the best, because we didn't hear
it and we'll never get the chance.
I agree that there are at least 2 interpretive stances with Mahler
(Florestan and Eusebius, no?). I happen to enjoy both.
--Kang Howson-Jan
(oops, sending this from someone else's terminal :>) )
Kathy Edgar
>I'm somewhat surprised at the omission of Sinopoli. His Mahler recordings,
>especially #5 are quite good.
Yes, and Inbal, Levine, Inoue, Wit, etc. I guess you have to be
selective when you've got 90 mins, and in the CBC's defence, they did not
claim being all-inclusive and exhaustive.
--Kang Howson-Jan
Alain Dagher
|> Last night, the Arts Tonight program on the Can. Broad. Corp. radio
|> discussed this topic, with participants Tim Page, Norman Lebrecht, and
|> host Peter Tieffenbach (I'm likely mangling the names). The recordings
|> of the various symphonies they excerpted during the show were:
|> Tennstedt (VI)
|> Boulez (VI)
|> Rattle (I)
|> Chailly (VII)
|> Abbado (VIII)
|> I may have forgotten one or two, but the show was only 90 min. The
|> discussion was interesting in that Mr. Page seemed to have a hard time
|> completely disliking any of the recordings, except the Rattle.
Bless him.
|> Lebrecht appeared to like none of them wholeheartedly, except the
|> Chailly. He villified Boulez, and thought Tennstedt has done better in
|> live performances. Peter liked Abbado, which the other 2 agreed with
|> without any raves. Overall the Chailly got the most enthusiastic
|> response from all of them--a bit ironic since he has made only a couple
|> of other Mahler recordings.
Well, Chailly conducts THE Mahler orchestra. I saw him do number 1 at the proms last
summer and it was truly great (despite my being in a different layer of the stratosphere).
Incidentally, one of the best living Mahler conductors is Bernard Haitink.
I don't agree with the oft-expressed platitude that conductors like Haitink or Abbado are
unemotional, or don't get to the
depths of this music. Mahler's music is incredibly profound and allows for many different
interpretations. (Just compare Klemperer and Walter, both of whom supposedly learned
this music at tthe Master's feet.)
Alain.
Doc Alan
especially #5 are quite good.
doc...@aol.com
Fontaine
And what about Eliahu Inbal???
NJDGLS
Gene Gaudette
conductor?" (CBC, Jan. 10)>, 'njd...@aol.com (NJDGLS)' wrote:
>Klaus Tennstedt is excellent, also.
...alas, he has retired for health reasons.
I'm consistently impressed (for many different reasons) by Haitink,
Segerstam, Eschenbach and Slatkin. The few times I saw Bernstein conduct
Mahler, it seemed rather forced, and grotesqueries were too prettified and
refined. I've also seen Abbado conduct Mahler on a couple occasions with
Berlin, but came away disappointed. Ozawa's BSO was beautifully balanced
in the 3rd, but dull, dull, dull. I've only seen Maazel, Rattle and Tilson
Thomas do Mahler on one occasion each, and all three were quite good!
Gene
AVIKG
occasion individuakls told me that they did NOT particularly care for his
recordings, but once they saw him in person they became fans,
regards, avik
GUSTAV MAHLER SOCIETY-USA (1963)
Salim Butt
>rosario: nice to see that people are discovering bertini. on a couple of
>occasion individuakls told me that they did NOT particularly care for his
>recordings, but once they saw him in person they became fans,
I am from Cologne, Germany, so I have seen Bertini there
quiet frequently, when he was with the RSO. In fact, I think he is much
better than most the orchestras he usually appears with.
Greetings,
Salim
Alexander Phoon
The best Mahler conductor alive?
Well.... Lenny is dead so that leaves Charles Mackerras & Klaus
Tennstedt. Pity that Klaus has had to retire.
Clement Jim Chow
Nowadays, I am making a strong case for Abbado. He's fast becoming one of the
conducting giants now and his Mahler is astounding. Of course he has the help
of Berlin and Vienna Phil which few conductors an conduct these days and he
pulls a really great sound from both of those orchestras. I think that he can
be the Bernstein in a Mahlerian way.
AVIKG
IN TERMS OF THEIR CONDUCTING. (THIS SENTENCE DOES NOT READ RIGHT)
AVIK
GUSTAV MAHLER SOCIETY-USA (1963)
RDavis800
interpretor of his music. Last season I heard him conduct No. 7 in
Cleveland. (That recording on DG should be released soon.) It was a
revelation. He brought great clarity to the score, especially in the
final movement. His recording of No. 6 with Vienna could be the finest
one of that symphony. Lastly, I heard him conduct No. 9 in Chicago last
December. The first 2 movements were a bit flat, but the last two
movements were great. He is recording the entire cycle with Vienna,
Cleveland, and Chicago on DG.
Fontaine
: PIERRE BOULEZ, while not usually associated with Mahler, is a tremendous
Is this realy true? From where do you have this information? A complete
Mahler cycle with Boulez... a dream becomes reality!
MF
Fok Yun Gap
<Cleveland, and Chicago on DG.
Isn't that a scary thought !
Fok Yun Gap
<Mahler cycle with Boulez... a dream becomes reality!
Do you mean a nightmare becoming reality ?
Fontaine
: <Is this realy true? From where do you have this information? A complete
: <Mahler cycle with Boulez... a dream becomes reality!
: Do you mean a nightmare becoming reality ?
oh, you are so bright. To find this joke! What sense of humour! What subtility!
alan stone
is Zuby by amile. Oh, come to think of it,Ozawa.
Alan
alan stone
LAMBSETOTS
Abbado has his moments, as does Haitink. Solti-forget it. He never was a
contender. Mehta-belongs in circus w/Maazel.
Roger Lopez
: Mehta-belongs in circus w/Maazel.
Look, Maazel's Mahler recordings don't thrill or appall me, but
have you heard him play it live? His performance of the "Titan" symphony
with the Pittsburgh Symphony stands out as one of the greatest concerts
I've ever been privileged to attend.
And for the record, I think Mehta's recording of the fifth with
the NYPO isn't bad.
Alexander Phoon
>< He [Boulez]is recording the entire cycle with Vienna,
><Cleveland, and Chicago on DG.
Boulez is a great conductor. His sixth with the VPO was very good! He
may not be a la Lenny or Tennstedt but I find him much better then
Haitink, Rattle or any number of pretenders.