Evgeny Kissin trashed -- truth or sensationalism?
Samir Golescu
I've been told by a couple of friends strategically placed (New York
Chicago etc.) that Kissin's performance in his recent American tour wasn't
bad, moreover, some have praised his MM "Pictures" a great deal.
However, Kissin's (more) recent British tour ended with an absolutely
rejective and demeaning press reception -- not to be confused with the
public's reaction, he had success with the audiences, it seems.
"Guardian" (forget it's a dipshit outlet of political garbage, its musical
critic seems pretty articulated) goes as far as writing:
___________________________________________
With the sound board of Symphony Hall lowered over the platform, and all
the doors to the resonating chambers around the auditorium firmly closed,
everything had been done to ensure that Evgeny Kissin's piano playing
would be projected as drily and aggressively as possible. Not that Kissin
needs any acoustic help in forcing his playing on the ears of his audience
- the dynamic level rarely dips below loud, the tone is strident and
unvaried, the whole effect profoundly unpleasant.
Kissin has been appearing in Britain for 14 years, since he was 17. His
platform appearance now is just as mechanical as it has ever been - one
suspects the back of his tailcoat hides the hole for a giant wind-up key -
and his fingers are as stunningly accurate as ever, but all traces of
spontaneity have been progressively obliterated.
On Thursday he rampaged through his programme in a totally repellent and
scarcely credible manner. Busoni's virtuoso transcription of Bach's C
major Toccata, Adagio and Fugue was turned into the most superficial
exercise in keyboard agility, entirely monochrome, its aggressive welter
of notes scarcely even suggesting the colours and perspectives that Busoni
was seeking when making the arrangement in the first place. The rhythms of
Schumann's F sharp minor Sonata were brusquely chopped, its scherzo
doggedly insistent, and the elements of fantasy and wit that constantly
chafe against the classical forms were simply ignored.
If Mussorgsky's Pictures at an Exhibition survived this pitiless onslaught
more convincingly, that is because the work itself is conceived more
boldly and resiliently. Some of it was heartlessly dazzling, but there was
no real communication; self-conscious hesitations before important
downbeats passed as rubato, and the paens of the final Great Gate of Kiev
carried no weight or majesty because all the sound and fury that preceded
them had generated no tension or excitement, except of the most primitive
kind.
The programme note for the Schumann had described the composer's
father-in-law as a "musician and pianist". It's a strange distinction, but
one all too relevant to Kissin these days, who started out on his career
as a musical talent of apparently limitless potential, and has turned into
the biggest pianistic circus act since David Helfgott; there's nothing
there but technique.
7 At the Royal Concert Hall, Glasgow (0141-353 8000), on Thursday and
Bridgewater Hall, Manchester (0161- 907 9000), on May 20.
--------------------------------------
Other newspapers have written on the same terms or worse. Even not being a
Kissin fan, I wonder to what extent these reactions are mean-spirited and
exaggerated. At the end of the day, Kissin, as mechanical as his playing
can be at times, is no Helfgott. I somewhat hope Kissin is kept far away
from these articles. A still developing musician -- as far as I am
concerned, Kissing might still surprise us, in a decade or two, in either
direction -- could be awfully affected by them. In extremis, I remember
Boleslaw Kon, the gifted Polish pianist who committed suicide because of a
nasty -- and undeserved, witnesses said -- demolishing critique.
regards,
SG
John Gavin
documentaries I've seen give me a sense that his personal life is
stifled by over-protective authority figures. Add to that the fact that
more than any other kind of musician, a concert-pianist often lives a
lonely life, by the very nature of preparing recital programs. Perhaps
the best thing for him would be to take a sabbatical for 5 years and
live a little - for goodness sake, he needs to get away from his mother
and his teacher, if in fact they still follow him around everywhere he
goes.
Josep M. Vilanova
After talking to people that met him, I don't have any doubt that this is his
main problem right now. It's going to be terribly difficult at his age.
Paul Kintzele
Samir Golescu wrote:
>
> I've been told by a couple of friends strategically placed (New York
> Chicago etc.) that Kissin's performance in his recent American tour wasn't
> bad, moreover, some have praised his MM "Pictures" a great deal.
I heard it the other day, and it deserves the praise; it is an excellent
performance, right up there with Richter's as far as I'm concerned (and
in much better sound, of course). The Bach and Glinka on the disc are
also very impressive.
My own theory about Kissin is that his technique is so formidable that
it finds its best outlet in nervous, edgy, quick-moving music; thus his
Beethoven concertos aren't nearly as impressive as his "Rage Over a Lost
Penny." And in the Mussorgsky, it's the same--while the slower, more
straightforward pieces are done with appropriate grandeur, it is with
the unhatched chicks or the bustling market of Limoges that he seems
more in his element--indeed, this last "picture" he attacks with
astonishing vigor and brilliance. I hope he records more Russian (and
perhaps French?) repetoire, which seems more suitable for his
temperament.
Paul
Sol L. Siegel
>I have a feeling that Kissin has emotional issues to deal with...
>Perhaps the best thing for him would be to take a sabbatical for
>5 years and live a little - for goodness sake, he needs to get away
>from his mother and his teacher, if in fact they still follow him
>around everywhere he goes.
Does anyone recall who it was who wrote a piece a few years
back comparing him with Grimaud, who dumped her last teacher
at 15 and moved out on her own - to another continent - as fast as
she could?
-Sol Siegel, Philadelphia, PA
--------------------
"I am sure of very little, and I shouldn't be surprised if those things were
wrong." - Clarence Darrow
--------------------
(Remove "dammspam" from the end of my e-mail address to respond.)
REG
has, from the beginning, been attached to him, as they say in the South,
"like white on rice". They are apparently a very neurotic lot, and very
possessive, and I fear that he is going to go the way of Michael Jackson.
"John Gavin" <jg...@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:10627-3CE...@storefull-2271.public.lawson.webtv.net...
Vadim Batitsky
> from these articles.
I'm sure his mother does that.
I don't claim to know the reason for so much vitriol from the
British press, but Kissin is a weird case, even by the
prodigy-to-virtuoso standards, and this may have contributed to the
rising irritation of journalists who hate a mystery that goes on for
too long. After all, Kissin is still under what seems to be his
mother's complete control, with no indpendent life and no sign of any
romantic (let alone sexual) relation, not even rumors of anything
worth closeting these days. There seem to be no friendships with
people (musicians or not) of his age, at least none that were deemed
safe to reveal to the public in interviews. Not that Richter or
Horowitz, say, were models of normality, but neither has been mothered
into their twenties (at least not by their mothers).
As for his playing, his is without doubt a technically most
accomplished pianist - a member of an elite, in that sense, although
his sound as such is far less seductive than that of many 'giants' of
the past. But I could never get much out of his interpretations,
always waiting for him to grow up and finally giving up all hope of
ever being confronted by a thought-provoking interpretation in his
playing.
Vadim.
bal...@australia.edu
I go back to his two Chopin recitals at Carnegie hall and also the
Chopin Cto performances made when he was 13 and wonder what happened
to the musician in him. He was certainly great to listen to then but
not now it seems. Also, I'll bring up the old 'live' vs 'studio'
argument because I firmly believe that this applies to Kissin. As for
the comments about his dynamic range on the stage - well, there is
also the piano itself to consider. Yes, this man has a poetic soul but
he just can't seem to let it speak out at the moment.
Cheers
Baldric
Simon Roberts
"Samir Golescu" <gol...@uiuc.edu> wrote in message
news:Pine.GSO.4.31.02051...@ux10.cso.uiuc.edu...
[snip]
> The rhythms of
> Schumann's F sharp minor Sonata were brusquely chopped, its scherzo
> doggedly insistent, and the elements of fantasy and wit that
constantly
> chafe against the classical forms were simply ignored.
>
> If Mussorgsky's Pictures at an Exhibition survived this pitiless
onslaught
> more convincingly, that is because the work itself is conceived more
> boldly and resiliently. Some of it was heartlessly dazzling, but there
was
> no real communication; self-conscious hesitations before important
> downbeats passed as rubato, and the paens of the final Great Gate of
Kiev
> carried no weight or majesty because all the sound and fury that
preceded
> them had generated no tension or excitement, except of the most
primitive
> kind.
[snip]
Not having heard the concert I can't, of course, know whether I would
agree with anything whoever it is wrote this. On the other hand, I've
read plenty of reviews like this by British critics (or the sort who
don't like interpreters who "interpose themselves between the music and
the listener," for whom not "playing to the gallery" and engaging in
"display" are the highest virtues) of performances I admire.... And
note how undescriptive of his playing, which he heard, but not of his
motivations, to which he was not privy, this is. The performance was
"heartlessly" dazzling, whatever that means, there was no "real
communication" (so was there "fake" communication, or no communication?
If the latter, what does "real" add? If the former, what's the
difference, exactly?), "self-conscious" hesitations passing as rubato
(really? Maybe they were rhetorical pauses passing as rhetorical pauses;
why "self-conscious"?). Can it really be that whether there was weight
or majesty at the Gate is dependent on "all the sound and fury" that
preceded it? And, dear oh dear, only excitement "of the most primitive
kind." An oblique reference to The Uncivilized Russian? To playing
technically superior to what a more civilized ltmsfi pianist might
conjure up? Who knows?
Simon
Neil Brennen
Simon Roberts wrote in message ...
It sounded like a Penguin Guide review. I was waiting for the "chromium
Hevan" phrase myself.
Max Erlandsson
wrote:
IMHO you've gone a little bit too far. Why speculate on a failing
sexual life just because you don't respond to his musicmaking? At
least a really good firsthand source like Kissin himself is needed if
your're going to talk about his personal life like this.
Its very neat to be able to explain why Kissins music sound this way
or that way by analysing his personal life but even if you're right, I
think we should refrain from it and focus on the music instead.
bb
Blah. The reason they travel everywhere with him is because they've
spent the best part of a lifetime living in the fomer SU. Imagine
being able to travel freely after 30-40 years. That's it. The case is
closed.
bb
Heh. I see what you mean. The first time I heard Kissin play, quite a
few years ago now, I was overwhelmed by the quality. The next day I
was shocked to read a review entitled "Banging out the tune is a hit
with the crowd." :(
It was an extraordinary recital, and I'm talking about the sound he
produced, not the audience reaction. I spent some time wondering what
kind of person would write a review like this. I still don't know :o)
bb
> it finds its best outlet in nervous, edgy, quick-moving music; thus his
> Beethoven concertos aren't nearly as impressive as his "Rage Over a Lost
> Penny." And in the Mussorgsky, it's the same--while the slower, more
> straightforward pieces are done with appropriate grandeur, it is with
> the unhatched chicks or the bustling market of Limoges that he seems
> more in his element--indeed, this last "picture" he attacks with
> astonishing vigor and brilliance. I hope he records more Russian (and
> perhaps French?) repetoire, which seems more suitable for his
> temperament.
>
> Paul
Agree with you absolutely. I have very similar feelings when comparing
Kissin's Brahms Paganini Variations with the 1948 recording by
Michelangeli. Kissin comfortably matches ABM in the more kinetic
music, but, in my opinion, ABM is streets ahead in the slower
variations.
bb
> Samir Golescu <gol...@uiuc.edu> wrote
> > I somewhat hope Kissin is kept far away
> > from these articles.
>
> I'm sure his mother does that.
> I don't claim to know the reason for so much vitriol from the
> British press, but Kissin is a weird case, even by the
> prodigy-to-virtuoso standards, and this may have contributed to the
> rising irritation of journalists who hate a mystery that goes on for
> too long. After all, Kissin is still under what seems to be his
> mother's complete control, with no indpendent life and no sign of any
> romantic (let alone sexual) relation, not even rumors of anything
> worth closeting these days. There seem to be no friendships with
> people (musicians or not) of his age, at least none that were deemed
> safe to reveal to the public in interviews. Not that Richter or
> Horowitz, say, were models of normality, but neither has been mothered
> into their twenties (at least not by their mothers).
People want a story. They want things to fall apart, they want
something sensational. As far as I'm aware Kissin's private life just
isn't like this, so reviewers get annoyed and exact revenge. That's
all there is to it really.
Terrymelin
>Chicago etc.) that Kissin's performance in his recent American tour wasn't
>bad,
I attended his recital in Chicago last year. It was relevatory -- not just
good. His performance of Pictures was the finest I've heard in 35 years of
concert-going. And his 8 encores were stunning.
Terry Ellsworth
HenryFogel
>From: terry...@aol.com (Terrymelin)
>
>I attended his recital in Chicago last year. It was relevatory -- not just
>good. His performance of Pictures was the finest I've heard in 35 years of
>concert-going. And his 8 encores were stunning.
>
>Terry Ellsworth
I didn't see his Chicago concert, so I can't comment -- but one thing that this
thread has brought up is the whole issue of music critics who smugly put down
the general classical music public (in a way, showing how smart they, the
critics, are). If an artist has a huge, obvious public success and you, as a
critic, don't respond to his art - that's fine. But there are ways to indicate
why your taste might be different from (notice, I didn't say "superior to") the
masses of people who react positively.
The classical public, over time, does show good taste. Note that David Helfgott
was unable to sustain a career; note that while Charlotte Church and Andrea
Bocelli may well find an audience, a very large contingent of it is not the
serious classical or operatic audience.
The public who attends a solo piano recital by someone like Kissin surely knows
something about music and about what they are hearing. It is fine to disagree
with their enthusiasm, and perhaps even educative to explain why one disagrees.
But doing it in a smug tone that dismisses the public success is just adding
another brick to the wall that some in the classical music establishment are
building between that art's public and themselves. Critics do not have a
responsibility to lie in their reactions, nor to pander to popular taste. But
critics do, I believe, have a responsibity not to intimidate and demean people
for their reactions to an artist. There is no more effective way to shrink the
classical music public than to make people feel like morons for their taste.
Then those same critics will write Sunday "think pieces" about the shrinking
audience!
Henry Fogel
Larry Rinkel
I attended this same program in Carnegie Hall last year, and though I wasn't
as bowled over as Terry Ellsworth, it was certainly fine playing for the
most part. I liked the Bach, didn't like the Schumann (maybe because I don't
much like the piece), and liked parts of the Mussorgsky. (The Ballet of the
Chicks was sensational; on the other hand I found the tempo for the Vecchio
Castello deadly to the point the piece lost all shape and momentum.) He
didn't play eight encores in New York that I recall, but one of them, the
Mendelssohn-Rachmaninoff MND scherzo, may well have been his best playing of
the evening.
He hasn't thoroughly elated me in any of the recitals I've heard, but I keep
going to hear him in hopes that he will.
"Terrymelin" <terry...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20020519093745...@mb-fy.aol.com...
Matthew B. Tepper
news:jloeeu4cqjht5rrf9...@4ax.com:
> IMHO you've gone a little bit too far. Why speculate on a failing
> sexual life just because you don't respond to his musicmaking? At
> least a really good firsthand source like Kissin himself is needed if
> your're going to talk about his personal life like this.
>
> Its very neat to be able to explain why Kissins music sound this way
> or that way by analysing his personal life but even if you're right, I
> think we should refrain from it and focus on the music instead.
Other famous musicians with domineering mothers: Edward MacDowell, Percy
Grainger, Van Cliburn.
--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
To write to me, do for my address what Androcles did for the lion
Top 3 worst UK exports: Mad-cow; Foot-and-mouth; Charlotte Church
Josep M. Vilanova
>Grainger, Van Cliburn.
>
And Claudio Arrau! At least he went into analysis to sort that out. The book
"Conversations with Arrau" can give some surprising insights about the mind of
a young child prodigy.
Vadim Batitsky
> IMHO you've gone a little bit too far. Why speculate on a failing
> sexual life just because you don't respond to his musicmaking?
I really don't require a musician or composer being a 'likable' person
to appreciate their music (music making). With Kissin, I simply stated
the obvious - that he is a weird case. I surely haven't speculated
about his life (sexual or otherwise), but only noted that nothing
seems to be known about his life except for him holding his mother's
hand all the time. In the end, we should remember that he makes his
leaving by being a PUBLIC PERSONA - he is a "poet of the keyboard", a
"virtuouso", what have you. Why then the public interested in him as a
performer should not be interested in (and even judgmental about) the
aspects of his life beyond the keyboard? We read biographies of past
musical "giants" precisely for that reason, the only difference being
that they are long dead. But we digest all sorts of "unusual" aspects
of their lives just as voratiously.
Vadim.
Lucifer
Hmmm....to make things clear; As I have understood the Kissin
chatacteristica are the following:
1) Kissin has super technique
2) Kissin is a Barrington-Pheloung in musicality.
OK, then, it is horrifying that such a robot is allowed to sit at the
pianoforte at all. On the other hand, when this newsgroup shows that
the world is full of people with exactly the opposite characteristica
of Kissin's, I really have confidence in the future!!
On the other hand, again, Kissin is a GOD. You people are just worms.
You can't expect him to play in a way that satisfies you.
Lucifer
Max Erlandsson
wrote:
>Max Erlandsson <erlan...@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:
>> IMHO you've gone a little bit too far. Why speculate on a failing
>> sexual life just because you don't respond to his musicmaking?
>
>I really don't require a musician or composer being a 'likable' person
>to appreciate their music (music making). With Kissin, I simply stated
>the obvious - that he is a weird case. I surely haven't speculated
>about his life (sexual or otherwise)
Yes you have.
> but only noted that nothing
>seems to be known about his life except for him holding his mother's
>hand all the time. In the end, we should remember that he makes his
>leaving by being a PUBLIC PERSONA - he is a "poet of the keyboard", a
>"virtuouso", what have you. Why then the public interested in him as a
>performer should not be interested in (and even judgmental about) the
>aspects of his life beyond the keyboard? We read biographies of past
>musical "giants" precisely for that reason, the only difference being
>that they are long dead. But we digest all sorts of "unusual" aspects
>of their lives just as voratiously.
>Vadim.
I don't read biographies of composers, conductors or performers
because I think it "clouds the judgement", but I know that many
people, in rmcr and outside do. In respect of Kissin and other living
or dead musicians we can chose not to speculate on things in his
private life, but of course I can't stop you and others from doing
so..
John Gavin
want to find fault with someone like Kissin - questioning his personal
life is done because people sense that it profoundly affects his
unfoldment as a musician. A musician can only project as far as the
length and breadth of his own consciousness. I'm sure that the majority
of decent people would like to see Kissin living a happy and healthy
life.
My strong impression from filmed documentaries is one of a
claustrophobic life away from the keyboard - and to the poster who
dismisses this I would ask - please let us know any hard facts you have
to the contrary - or perhaps you simply don't like this line of
questioning - which is it?
alsilvers
There's something about these two posts taken together that seems sort
of poetic: "Rage over a Lost Penny," having established one's artistic
identity through recordings of Chopin as a 10 year old. The essential
question is the difference between what it is to be a prodigy, and
what is a mature artist. Note how it is commented above that Kissin's
technique lends itself to certain kinds (e.g., frenetic etc.) of
pieces.
As Kempff an Schnabel demonstrate; technique is important, but
ultimately much less important than other things; the pianist is not a
jock. What does it say about any artist if technique dictates
artistic choice and expression? For a child: OK; for an adult,
pathetic.
Although I've not followed Kissin's playing and career, the
impression, especially from the posts in this thread, is of someone
hiding behind blizzards of notes and walls of sound, as if out of
uncertainty over who his behind these if anyone at all. ROLP and the
Chopin concertos thing suggest tenacity toward or greater comfort with
the child's relationship to music than the adult's in which
profundity, depth and insight distinguish one rather than mere
precocity and technique.
IN the recording of Schumann's Op. 17, I don't here music being
thought and felt (and recreated/rewritten), but executed.
Al
Lucifer
> Other newspapers have written on the same terms or worse. Even not being a
> Kissin fan, I wonder to what extent these reactions are mean-spirited and
> exaggerated. At the end of the day, Kissin, as mechanical as his playing
> can be at times, is no Helfgott. I somewhat hope Kissin is kept far away
> from these articles. A still developing musician -- as far as I am
> concerned, Kissing might still surprise us, in a decade or two, in either
> direction -- could be awfully affected by them. In extremis, I remember
> Boleslaw Kon, the gifted Polish pianist who committed suicide because of a
> nasty -- and undeserved, witnesses said -- demolishing critique.
I think investigating how much critizism an artist can bear is a very
interesting and important thing to figure out. I remember Richard
Wagner wrote something about that an artist must find his own way, and
go against any critizism. And if he falls dead from the campaign,
Wagner writes; "so war es dieser untergang wert".
By making such an investigation one could figure out exactly where the
limit for how much critic an artist can take, and then we will know
exactly how much one can possibly be shoot in order to have him
produce absolute optimal quantity and quality. It is critical of
course to look for that it is done very scientific, to ensuren a
correct result.
L
Peter Breiner
news:<20020519094843...@mb-ca.aol.com>...
> critic, don't respond to his art - that's fine. But there are ways to indicate
> why your taste might be different from (notice, I didn't say "superior to") the
> masses of people who react positively.
>There is no more effective way to shrink the
> classical music public than to make people feel like morons for their taste.
> Then those same critics will write Sunday "think pieces" about the shrinking
> audience!
>
> Henry Fogel
Some of these critics are amazingly above anything. I am still trying
to digest an article from few days ago (not quoted here because of the
obscurity of the language it's written in) stating that Mozart is
hugely overrated by concert audience for no apparent reason as he is -
as opposed to very talented, responsible, punctual and hard-working
Salieri - only an irresponsible and infantile writer of empty melodies
which infested the entire world for centuries....
pb
Alain Dagher
John Gavin wrote:
> In response to some of the postings - No, I don't believe most people
> want to find fault with someone like Kissin - questioning his personal
> life is done because people sense that it profoundly affects his
> unfoldment as a musician.
The problem is that we have no information really on his private life
and his emotional state. Even if it were relevant, which it may well be,
I don't think it would be on the simplistic level some posters have
previously implied (i.e "he needs to get laid", etc ...). The idea that
his music reflects an impoverished emotional life is also somewhat
insulting to him as a musician. I would give him and any artist the
benefit of the doubt and assume that he plays the way he does because he
wants to, and likes it that way. People who happen to have musical
ability are also capable of thinking about the music and playing it the
way they want it to sound.
> A musician can only project as far as the
> length and breadth of his own consciousness.
I'm afraid I don't understand what that means. (I also don't get the
Lebrechtian notion that the problem with musicians today is they don't
have enough time to reflect, read poetry and philosophy, etc ... )
> I'm sure that the majority
> of decent people would like to see Kissin living a happy and healthy
> life.
>
> My strong impression from filmed documentaries is one of a
> claustrophobic life away from the keyboard - and to the poster who
> dismisses this I would ask - please let us know any hard facts you have
> to the contrary - or perhaps you simply don't like this line of
> questioning - which is it?
Shouldn't the hard facts come from the other camp?
Alain
Simon Roberts
"HenryFogel" <henry...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20020519094843...@mb-ca.aol.com...
> I didn't see his Chicago concert, so I can't comment -- but one thing
that this
> thread has brought up is the whole issue of music critics who smugly
put down
> the general classical music public (in a way, showing how smart they,
the
> critics, are).
Not to mention being superior to a certain segment of the public, "the
gallery," the ultimate insult in some quarters being that "Pianist A
played to the gallery."
Simon
Samir Golescu
On Sun, 19 May 2002, Simon Roberts wrote:
> > I didn't see his Chicago concert, so I can't comment -- but one thing
> that this
> > thread has brought up is the whole issue of music critics who smugly
> put down
> > the general classical music public (in a way, showing how smart they,
> the
> > critics, are).
>
> Not to mention being superior to a certain segment of the public, "the
> gallery," the ultimate insult in some quarters being that "Pianist A
> played to the gallery."
Which reminds me of the great Liszt himself: he used to tell pianists that
they have to project the sonority having in mind those far away gallery
people who paid only few pennies. . . . . but we all know Liszt was
tasteless and vulgar, besides being the greatest pianist of all times,
don't we?
regards,
SG
____________
<<There comes a time in the affairs of a man when he has to take the bull
by the tail and face the situation.>> -- W. C. Fields
vladimir
<362fe239.02051...@posting.google.com>...
>
>Some of these critics are amazingly above anything. I am still trying
>to digest an article from few days ago (not quoted here because of the
>obscurity of the language it's written in) stating that Mozart is
>hugely overrated by concert audience for no apparent reason as he is -
>as opposed to very talented, responsible, punctual and hard-working
>Salieri - only an irresponsible and infantile writer of empty melodies
>which infested the entire world for centuries....
>
- p.
Paul Kintzele
As the author of one of the posts you cite, I'd like to "revise and
extend" my remarks and disagree somewhat with your conclusions. First,
although I think Kissin seems more at home in certain kinds of music
than others, I wouldn't characterize that in the least as "pathetic."
It seems to me that many or even most pianists (and performing artists
in general) can do some things well, other things not so well. Some
actors are great comedians, for example, but turn to wood when they try
serious drama. And given his recent superb Mussorgsky/Glinka/Bach disc
and some of his other fine recordings, I wouldn't want to denigrate his
playing at all--I'm quite glad he has given to us what he has and wish
him more success in the future. If some of his projects have come off
better than others, that's no cause for sweeping condemnations.
But I still hope that he does some more Russian-themed solo discs in the
future. And his Bach shows me that at least this part of the
Austro-German repetoire he can do quite engagingly.
Paul
MIFrost
Josep M. Vilanova <josepmv...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20020519111858...@mb-fj.aol.com...
And Yehudi Menuhin. Yes?
MIFrost
Terrymelin
>as bowled over as Terry Ellsworth, it was certainly fine playing for the
>most part.
And, of course, you must admit that his performance -- even of the same program
-- could be completely different in Chicago than in Carnegie Hall.
Terry Ellsworth
Roberto Poli
> I somewhat hope Kissin is kept far away
> from these articles.
Hi Samir,
As Radu Lupu put it in an interview, he said he doesn't read reviews
of his concerts anymore. He feel that, invariably, when he plays well
he gets negative reviews and when he doesn't play well, he gets
accolades by the critics. I trust Kissin won't commit suicide... At
the most, he'll send the Russian mob... :)
Best,
RP
HenryFogel
>As Radu Lupu put it in an interview, he said he doesn't read reviews
>of his concerts anymore. He feel that, invariably, when he plays well
>he gets negative reviews and when he doesn't play well, he gets
>accolades by the critics. I trust Kissin won't commit suicide... At
>the most, he'll send the Russian mob... :)
>
>Best,
>RP
>
Of course, one could ask the question of an artist who says he doesn't read the
critics how he then knows that he gets negative reviews when he plays well and
accolades when he does!
Henry Fogel
Bob Lombard
>Of course, one could ask the question of an artist who says he doesn't read the
>critics how he then knows that he gets negative reviews when he plays well and
>accolades when he does!
>
Past experience, Henry. S'why he doesn't read them now. Of course, one
still could ask the question...
bl
Larry Rinkel
could have had drastically different reactions had we heard his program in
the same hall.
"Terrymelin" <terry...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20020519212145...@mb-fz.aol.com...
Terrymelin
>could have had drastically different reactions had we heard his program in
>the same hall.
That too!
Terry Ellsworth
Norman Schwartz
read the
> >critics how he then knows that he gets negative reviews when he plays
well and
> >accolades when he does!
> >
> Past experience, Henry. S'why he doesn't read them now. Of course, one
> still could ask the question...
??? People who read reviews inform him of the content.
Bob Lombard
???? If RP's description of his attitude is correct, it seems likely
that he doesn't want to know about this 'content'.
bl
Jeffrey Friedman
hill...@vermontel.net (Bob Lombard) wrote:
Well, people often tell me things I don't particularly want to
hear. They may be rude, but they're not sycophants.
Jeff
Jeffrey F. Friedman
je...@friedman.com
j...@ix.netcom.com
Ward Hardman
: I hope he records more Russian (and perhaps French?) repetoire,
: which seems more suitable for his temperament.
The ideal thing would be for him to develop a temperament more suitable
for music. ;-)
--Ward Hardman
"The older I get, the more I admire and crave competence, just simple
competence, in any field from adultery to zoology."
- H.L. Mencken
Ward Hardman
: I don't claim to know the reason for so much vitriol from the
: British press, but Kissin is a weird case, even by the
: prodigy-to-virtuoso standards, and this may have contributed to the
: rising irritation of journalists who hate a mystery that goes on for
: too long. After all, Kissin is still under what seems to be his
: mother's complete control, with no indpendent life and no sign of any
: romantic (let alone sexual) relation, not even rumors of anything
: worth closeting these days. There seem to be no friendships with
: people (musicians or not) of his age, at least none that were deemed
: safe to reveal to the public in interviews.
It sounds like Kissin needs more kissin'. ;-)
HenryFogel
Henry Fogel
HenryFogel
>
>--Ward Hardman
>
I wonder whose Kissin him now?!?
Henry Fogel
Wayne Reimer
<....>
> The public who attends a solo piano recital by someone like Kissin surely knows
> something about music and about what they are hearing. It is fine to disagree
> with their enthusiasm, and perhaps even educative to explain why one disagrees.
> But doing it in a smug tone that dismisses the public success is just adding
> another brick to the wall that some in the classical music establishment are
> building between that art's public and themselves. Critics do not have a
> responsibility to lie in their reactions, nor to pander to popular taste. But
> critics do, I believe, have a responsibity not to intimidate and demean people
> for their reactions to an artist. There is no more effective way to shrink the
> classical music public than to make people feel like morons for their taste.
> Then those same critics will write Sunday "think pieces" about the shrinking
> audience!
>
> Henry Fogel
>
There's something rather sweetly old-fashioned (or delusional) about the
idea that critics are responsible for anything other than selling the
medium in which they are appearing.
wr
HenryFogel
>From: Wayne Reimer wr...@pacbell.net
>Date: 5/25/2002 1:09 AM Central Daylight Time
>Message-id: <MPG.1758ca968...@news.sf.sbcglobal.net>
Actually, I doubt that any newspaper publisher is counting on the classical
music critic to boost sales. Perhaps the sportswriters, Dear Abby, the comics,
and maybe even the hard news coverage. But not the music critic, i would think.
Henry Fogel
Wayne Reimer
> >Subject: Re: Evgeny Kissin trashed -- truth or sensationalism?
> >From: Wayne Reimer wr...@pacbell.net
> >Date: 5/25/2002 1:09 AM Central Daylight Time
> >Message-id: <MPG.1758ca968...@news.sf.sbcglobal.net>
> >
> >> In article <20020519094843...@mb-ca.aol.com>,
> >henry...@aol.com says...
> ><....>
> >
> >
> >There's something rather sweetly old-fashioned (or delusional) about the
> >idea that critics are responsible for anything other than selling the
> >medium in which they are appearing.
> >
> >wr
>
> Actually, I doubt that any newspaper publisher is counting on the classical
> music critic to boost sales. Perhaps the sportswriters, Dear Abby, the comics,
> and maybe even the hard news coverage. But not the music critic, i would think.
> Henry Fogel
>
I think its about a different part of the revenue...if they didn't have
the arts section with a few classical music reviews, they would lose a
certain amount of advertising moola from the arts orgs, plus from some of
the snootier stores. And also there's a tiny but influential part of the
reader demographic that has a relationship to the arts AND to the snooty
stores. I don't believe most newspapers are generally altruistic or in
service to the community anymore, if ever.
wr
Alain Dagher
Wayne Reimer wrote:
I disagree. I think they are by and large in service to the community of
readers. The original review was from the Guardian, a fine paper,
perhaps one of the best in the world. Their arts section is not just
there for their advertisers. London has a very active music scene, and I
can't conceive of any serious paper not having classical music reviews.
The so-called high-brow papers in Britain are certainly infuriating at
times, but they don't fit the stereotype put forward in this thread.
Despite the incredible competition for readers in Britain, or perhaps
because of it, they are certainly not aiming for the lowest common
denominator.
cheers
Alain
Ray Hall
news:3CF0D30D...@bic.mni.mcgill.ca...
.
|
|
| The so-called high-brow papers in Britain are certainly infuriating at
| times, but they don't fit the stereotype put forward in this thread.
| Despite the incredible competition for readers in Britain, or perhaps
| because of it, they are certainly not aiming for the lowest common
| denominator.
In fact it may be true to say, that they have the best, and yet at the same
time, the worst newspapers ever devised. Is page 3 still going strong in the
tabloid I'm thinking about? Not that I am complaining, mind you <g>
Regards,
# RMCR Contributor Links/Main Page :
# http://www.users.bigpond.com/hallraylily/index.html
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Ray, Sydney
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Samir Golescu
On Sun, 26 May 2002, Alain Dagher wrote:
> The original review was from the Guardian, a fine paper,
> perhaps one of the best in the world.
>
> The so-called high-brow papers in Britain are certainly infuriating at
> times, but they don't fit the stereotype put forward in this thread.
This is not really on-topic, so I'll be short. I strongly disagree with
your estimation, for the little that's worth. I occasionally read the
Guardian since I had access to it (cca 1990), and I find it worse than it
used to be, while, happily, not much to begin with. I do agree though that
there is a British quality press too. The Guardian ain't there, IMHO.
best regards,
SG
Alain Dagher
Samir Golescu wrote:
There's a surprise! I had you pegged as a Guardian reader.
Alain
Samir Golescu
M. Dagher, we had our gentlemanly disagreements in the past, but I didn't
know in your estimation I was *that* low. . .
saddened regards,
SG
The Lindbergh Baby
Don't forget the Sunday coupons!
John
--
Normative ["pop"] music, defined above all by its melodic and tonal
materials, has simply bypassed musical modernism as if it had never
happened. Since our culture is saturated by the normative, to encounter
music whose processes and materials are genuinely modern can be
disorienting. This is one reason modern music continues to bewilder if
not shock: it lays bare a historical disjunction that we normally evade.
That evasion is embodied in dominant culture by a music whose surface
of technological complexity stands in an odd, contradictory relation to
the simplicity of its basic musical materials. The underlying materials
and formal patterns of much music made today are not just simple but
archaically so. -Julian Johnson, Who Needs Classical Music?
Wayne Reimer
press, without saying so. The U.S. press doesn't resemble that of
enlightened Brits much, it seems.
wr
MrT
>
> Of course, one could ask the question of an artist who says he doesn't read the
> critics how he then knows that he gets negative reviews when he plays well and
> accolades when he does!
Isn't that what Friends are for? Kissin has got to have some of those.
If not, some Relative will oblige, I'm sure.
Ontopically: I am amazed at the negative comments about Kissin. He
strikes me as an evolving artist who is enlarging his repertoire, who
does not play fluff, and who has a lot of passion (as well as force,
but he's not all force either). No longer a prodigy, he has to be
judged as a mature artist with a 20 year career. I would not remotely
consider his career so far an artistic failure. He remains more
interesting than most of his contemporaries.
On the other hand, it's worrisome (but only in the abstract: I do not
have any pesonal interest in his well being, his getting laid, etc.)
if he's not developing as a person. In fact, I don't know what he's
doing with his life, nor whether a change would affect him positively
in his pianism. I suggest we concentrate on his actual playing and
leave the rest to the tabloids, who of course haven't heard of
Kissin...
Regards,
MrT
vladimir
>Ontopically: I am amazed at the negative comments about Kissin. He
>strikes me as an evolving artist who is enlarging his repertoire, who
>does not play fluff, and who has a lot of passion (as well as force,
>but he's not all force either). No longer a prodigy, he has to be
>judged as a mature artist with a 20 year career. I would not remotely
>consider his career so far an artistic failure. He remains more
>interesting than most of his contemporaries.
>
>On the other hand, it's worrisome (but only in the abstract: I do not
>have any pesonal interest in his well being, his getting laid, etc.)
>if he's not developing as a person. In fact, I don't know what he's
>doing with his life, nor whether a change would affect him positively
>in his pianism. I suggest we concentrate on his actual playing and
>leave the rest to the tabloids, who of course haven't heard of
>Kissin...
>
get to me. I've never heard it's like, and wonder at the selection process
that guides his intepretations. Take his recent Pictures at an Exhibition.
It sounds all the world as though the pianist is resolutely avoiding
"getting into the music", as far as expressing himself goes. It sounds like
a steel ball, all hard surface, with emotional contents to be sure, but no
hint at what they are. Much of the time the piano sound is ugly - I'd call
it piano banging if it didn't seem to be exactly what the pianist intended.
It almost makes me cringe.
Kissen's playing is amazing - he has fantastic control - but I've never
heard an interpretation fashion such a inpregnable surface on a work of
depth before. So, just based on how the playing sounds to me, I have to
start guessing about the pianist. (I do that for all pianists, not by
design, it's just how I listen.) The guesses in this case are pretty dark.
- Phil Caron
Charles Haxthausen
find it astonishing that Kissin gets such PR and plays in the major venues
while a brilliant young pianist like Konstantin Lifschitz is still
relatively unknown, despite glowing reviews of his few recordings. He has
fabulous technique and a distinctive musical personality. Check out the
2-Cd set of his Schubert Impromptus, Moments Musicaux, and Drei
Klavierstuecke from a live concert in Williamstown, Mass. in 2000.
Mark Haxthausen
"vladimir" <vlad...@vermontel.net> wrote in message
news:ftWI8.216$Ky5....@bin2.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com...