Schubert Winterreise - favourites?

[Andy Evans]

Mid December as I write, seems the right time to think about Winterreise. Also no recent threads on this.

What are your favourite versions?

[Oscar]

On Tuesday, December 15, 2015 at 8:37:49 AM UTC-8, Andy Evans wrote:
> Mid December as I write, seems the right time to think about Winterreise. Also no recent threads on this.
>
> What are your favourite versions?

Don't buy Wolfgang Holzmair with Imogen Cooper on Philips. The velvety high baritone is too smooth and his identification with the text is not impactful. It's all surface. Nice voice, but... Cooper is better. Goerne's second recording with Eschenbach on harmonia mundi, from 2014, is more to my liking.

Also, buy Ian Bostridge's 2015 book, Anatomy of an Obsession, and read it: http://tinyurl.com/j4ctbxq


Philips 446 407-2 ℗ © 1996.
DDD.
Recorded in the Großer Saal, Mozarteum, Salzburg, November 1994.
Artist & repertoire production: Brigitte Stockmann.
Recording producer, balance engineer: Volker Straus.
Recording engineer: Cees Heijkoop.
Tape editor: Evert Manning.
Booklet note: Peter Branscombe.
Photo: Stefan Fiedler.
Art direction: George Cramer.
Total playing-time: 1.09'55".

[Frank Lekens]

Oscar schreef op 15-12-2015 17:47:

I like Holzmair more than Oscar does. Certainly when listening to one of
his Dichterliebes a while ago I was reminded how much I like his
singing: I really like his voice (maybe that's also personal, the
quality of a voice appealing more to some than to others?) *and* his
interpretations (which may sometimes sound fussy to some). I don't play
his recordings often enough.
But then there are so many. And it's true that in the Winterreise, he
wouldn't be my absolute top candidate. As wouldn't Souzay, for instance,
however much I like his singing.

Goerne is good; I haven't extensively compared his three versions, but I
suspect his last may be the most interesting. (But the first with
Johnson was good too.)

But my top recommendations would go to Pregardien/Staier, any of the
Quasthof recordings (with Spencer or with Barenboim, or the bootleg of
the live broadcast with Pires that is afloat on the internet, but
obviously has limited sound quality), and especially one I most recently
was totally bowled over by: the Boesch/Martineau recording. Boesch is
really terrific (also live, when I heard him in the Müllerin).
And I definitely wouldn't want to be without Christine Schäfer and
Brigitte Fassbaender either.

Werner Güra has a nice recording (beautiful voice), Roman Trekel's isn't
bad (the first one on Naxos; I haven't heard his remake on Oehms yet).

Dermota, Kurt Equiluz are recordings I definitely hold on to. Sometimes
I like to listen to Peter Anders, for a different, more operatic (it
sounds to me) approach. Von Elsacker and Beghin have an interesting new
recording. It seems Von Elsacker's singing isn't to everyone's taste,
but Beghin's playing is definitely remarkable. And Harvey/Cooper, probably.

A couple that are on my "yet to explore list" waiting beside the cd
player (next to Trekel's Oehms remake): Bauer & Mauser, and Zeger
Vandersteene & Levente Kende.

Oh, let's not act as though Fischer-Dieskau doesn't exist. I made my
acquaintance with the Winterreise through his DG recording with Moore,
which still has a special place for me. Although now I'd probably sooner
put the one with Demus in the cd player. And one of his early mono
efforts once in a while. I steer clear of any of his Winterreise's after
the one with Moore on DG (e.g. Barenboim, but especially the ones with
Brendel and Perahia).
--
Frank Lekens

http://fmlekens.home.xs4all.nl/

[cooper...@gmail.com]

On Tuesday, December 15, 2015 at 11:37:49 AM UTC-5, Andy Evans wrote:
> Mid December as I write, seems the right time to think about Winterreise. Also no recent threads on this.
>
> What are your favourite versions?

You'll have to wait for a response from Philip Peters, self-described as a "freakishly completist collector of Winterreise recordings." The last time I asked him to recommend recent performances by tenors (maybe 4/5 years ago), Philip came up with Mark Padmore/Paul Lewis (HM), Steve Davislim/Anthony Romaniuk, (Melba), and Werner Güra/Christopher Berner (HM). I enjoyed them very much, finding Davislim a bit lightweight but beautiful nevertheless. When I want to hear the songs in a lower register (in my own vocal range, iow) I still tend to go for Hüsch and Hynninen. Nothing surprising or unusual there.

AC

[cooper...@gmail.com]

On Tuesday, December 15, 2015 at 11:37:49 AM UTC-5, Andy Evans wrote:

> Mid December as I write, seems the right time to think about Winterreise. Also no recent threads on this.
>
> What are your favourite versions?

[Herman]

On Tuesday, December 15, 2015 at 5:37:49 PM UTC+1, Andy Evans wrote:
> Mid December as I write, seems the right time to think about Winterreise.

I'd say January, even February.

[Andy Evans]

At this moment I have a lot to hear - I think there are approaching 500 recordings of various kinds?

Enjoying: Gerhaher, Bar (not Parsons, though), Quasthoff, Souzay, Anders, Hagegard, Patzak, Pregardien, Gura, Rothmuller...

I don't personally get as much out of Fischer-Dieskau, Pears, Schreier, Goerne, Hotter though others like them

So many recordings......

[howie...@btinternet.com]

Any good recordings with a fortepiano?

[Willem Orange]

The 1963 Hotter is shattering

[howie...@btinternet.com]

I mean recent recordings with a fortepiano. I know Staier's.

[howie...@btinternet.com]

Max von Egmond and Crawford perhaps? Or Mammel with Schoonderwoerd? Or Van Elsacker with Beghin?

[Frank Lekens]

Andy Evans schreef op 15-12-2015 21:52:

Thanks, some of these I don't know, will give them a try.
I do rather like Schreier -- I knew I'd forgotten someone.

Looking at these, I'd again strongly suggest you give Boesch a try. And
Schafer and/or Fassbaender, unless you just don't want to hear a woman's
voice in this cycle.

Ehm... is the Rothmuller only available in some pricey hard to find cd
version?

[Oscar]

On Tuesday, December 15, 2015 at 10:45:03 AM, Frank Lekens wrote:
>
> I like Holzmair more than Oscar does. Certainly when listening to one of
> his Dichterliebes a while ago I was reminded how much I like his
> singing: I really like his voice (maybe that's also personal, the
> quality of a voice appealing more to some than to others?) *and* his
> interpretations (which may sometimes sound fussy to some). I don't play
> his recordings often enough.

Holzmair recorded Winterreise again for Capriccio a few years ago, with Andreas Haefliger at the keyboard. I have not heard it, but was most impressed by Haefliger's contribution as accompanist to one of Goerne's Schubert recitals on harmonia mundi.

http://www.prestoclassical.co.uk/r/Capriccio/C5149


From BBC Music Magazine:

<< Performance: three stars Recording: four stars

Wolfgang Holzmair is one of the most sensitive of present-day Lieder singers, though he seems to have a smaller reputation than he deserves. In the 1990s, he made a series of recordings accompanied by Imogen Cooper, which are almost too beautiful. His voice is so soft-grained that to convey the anguish of unrequited love, the chief topic of German song, he has to resort to something close to yelping. His previous recording of Winterreise, the absolute pinnacle of Lieder, was made in 1994. It was exquisite, which isn't quite the point of this 70-minute journey into a self-awareness indistinguishable from madness. Surprisingly, 18 years later, his voice is still very much in the condition it was, but has rough edges and a tendency to distort vowels, which it didn't have back then.

If anything, however, Holzmair and his new accompanist, the great Andreas Haefliger, are even less 'interventionist' than he was with Cooper. If there were such a thing as a standard reading of Winterreise, this would be it. In a time when too many singers sound as if they wish they were Dietrich Fischer-Dieskau, that is welcome, but there is too little sense of a progression from the mere misery of rejection to the acceptance of utter solitude; it needs more edge, more explicit pain.

-Michael Tanner >>

[Jim Paul]

I agree with you about Goerne, Pregardien, Quasthoff, Schäfer and Fassbaender. Some of the others that you list I haven't heard. I like Holzmair ok. Definitely prefer DFD/Demus to DFD/Moore/DG. I would add Schreier/Richter which I think is special. And I quite like the video with Ian Bostridge and Julius Drake, directed by David Alden. The visual aspect might give some ultra-traditional types the heebie-jeebies, but I think it works well, and that the performance is much better than Bostridge's cd recording with Uchida.

[Oscar]

I always keep Schubert Lieder in my iTunes, which is comprised of 98% ALAC Lossless files ripped from CD's in my collection. Here are the versions of Winterreise currently in my iTunes, i.e. not stored on portable hard drive.

1. Brigitte Fassbaender (Mz) & Aribert Reimann (pf)
EMI CDC 7 49846 2 ℗ © 1990.
Stereo. DDD.
Recorded at No.1 Studio, Abbey Road, London, October 1988.
Producer: John Fraser.
Balance engineer: David Flower.
Recorded using B&W loudspeakers.
Front cover: Painting by Brigitte Fassbaender.
Booklet note © Alan Blyth, 1990.
TT.69'51".
Disc is Made in West Germany by Sonopress [1st pressing, no IFPI].
℗ 1990 The copyright in this sound recording is owned by EMI Records Ltd. © EMI Records Ltd., 1990. EMI Records Ltd. Hayes Middlesex England.

2. Hans Hotter (Bar) & Michael Raucheisen (pf)
DG 437 351-2 ℗ 1943 © 1992.
Mono. ADD.
Recorded in Berlin, November 1942 & 1943 [1-2, 5, 8].
Cover photo: Fayer, Wien.
Art direction: Hartmut Pfeiffer.
Booklet note © 1992 Prof. Dr. Karl Schumann.
Total time [76'20].
℗ 1943 Polydor International GmbH, Hamburg. Manufactured and Marketed by PolyGram Classics & Jazz, a Division of PolyGram Records Inc., New York, NY.

3. Hermann Prey (Bar) & Irwin Gage (pf)
Aura AUR 185-2 ℗ © 1999.
ADD.
Recorded by Radiotelevisione della Svizzera Italiana (RSI)/Rete 2, Locarno (Chiesa di San Francesco), October 2, 1978.
Piano technician: Guido Vicàri.
Sound engineer and digital remastering: Friedrich Schumacher.
RSI production coordinator: Carlo Piccardi.
Artistic director: Alberto Spano.
Executive staff: Paola Soffià, Stefania Moruzzi.
Graphics: Chiara Marchi.
Booklet note: Piero Rattalino.
Total playing time: 77'59.
℗ © 1999 Edimedia s.r.l. - Made in Italy.

4. Wolfgang Holzmair (Bar) & Imogen Cooper (pf)

Philips 446 407-2 ℗ © 1996.
DDD.
Recorded in the Großer Saal, Mozarteum, Salzburg, November 1994.
Artist & repertoire production: Brigitte Stockmann.
Recording producer, balance engineer: Volker Straus.
Recording engineer: Cees Heijkoop.
Tape editor: Evert Manning.
Booklet note: Peter Branscombe.
Photo: Stefan Fiedler.
Art direction: George Cramer.
Total playing-time: 1.09'55".

© 1996 Philips Classics Productions. Manufactured and marketed by PolyGram Classics & Jazz, A Division of PolyGram Records, Inc., New York, New York. Printed in U.S.A.

[Andy Evans]

I quite like the video with Ian Bostridge and Julius Drake, directed by David Alden. The visual aspect might give some ultra-traditional types the heebie-jeebies, but I think it works well, and that the performance is much better than Bostridge's cd recording with Uchida.>>

There's a kind of video version with Hagegard. I like his voice and the pianist is interesting. Sounds good in Swedish as well.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BPt7yO-jjes

[operafan]

Kurt Moll's recording on Orfeo, or Jonas Kaufmann's for a higher voice.

I really don't like Gerhaher's voice.

[Terry]

On Wednesday, 16 December 2015 03:37:49 UTC+11, Andy Evans wrote:
> Mid December as I write, seems the right time to think about Winterreise. Also no recent threads on this.
>
> What are your favourite versions?

Schreier and Schiff.
Pears and Britten.
Schäfer and Schneider (Once you get over the initial shock of the soprano voice, it's a sensational performance.)
Fassbaender and Reimann.

[O]

In article <0abf7681-1b02-4ee3...@googlegroups.com>,

Especially with Global Warming. It's 60 degrees here in Boston in
mid-December.

Might have to travel up to Nova Scotia to hear a good Winterreise this
year.

-Owen

[Herman]

On Wednesday, December 16, 2015 at 5:15:06 PM UTC+1, O wrote:

> >
>
> Especially with Global Warming. It's 60 degrees here in Boston in
> mid-December.
>
> Might have to travel up to Nova Scotia to hear a good Winterreise this
> year.
>
> -Owen

in the meantime you may want to listen to that wonderful, haunting song cycle "Polar Vortex."

[Ricardo Jimenez]

Among the recent versions it is hard to beat the Jonas Kaufmann-Helmut
Deutsch on Sony. However, when I want a Winterreise with a difference
I go for Scot Weir's, accompanied by a guitar duo, on Signum or
Christoph Prégardien's, accompanied by wind quintet and accordion, on
Atma Classique. Are there other non-standard versions that can be
recommended? I could barely get through Hans Zender's orchestral
version. I wouldn't mind one which just orchestrated the piano part
but left the music unadulterated.

[Jim Paul]

On Wednesday, December 16, 2015 at 8:56:30 AM UTC-8, Ricardo Jimenez wrote:

>
> >
Are there other non-standard versions that can be
> recommended? I could barely get through Hans Zender's orchestral
> version. I wouldn't mind one which just orchestrated the piano part
> but left the music unadulterated.

I think it's a mistake to think of Zender's composed interpretation as a "version" of the original work. That's bound to lead to disappointment, frustration, rage... It's a piece that looks at Winterreise, refracted through musical developments that came after Schubert. I think it's fascinating and, at times, beautiful, but I would never recommend it to someone who just wants to hear what Schubert wrote.

[Frank Lekens]

Ricardo Jimenez schreef op 16-12-2015 17:56:

The soprano Mirkovic-De Ro with Matthia Loibner on an actual hurdy gurdy.

The funny thing is, the song where this works least of all (for me) is
the last one. I find a piano accompiment *suggesting* the sound of a
hurdy gurdy more effective than an actual hurdy gurdy.
And otherwise too, it's a more limited instrument, of course. But it has
its charms.

http://www.classicstoday.com/review/review-15863/

[howie...@btinternet.com]

I just didn't find it particularly illuminating -- his adaptation of Schumann's Fantasie is fabulous for the way it separates all the voices with instruments with different timbres, so you can hear ideas returning like leitmotifs. But so far I haven't heard anything so interesting in his Winterreise.

[gggg...@gmail.com]

Check Feb. 2015 and Feb. 2014 for radio programs which included WINTERREISE selections:

http://lottelehmannleague.org/singing-sins-archive/

[wkasimer]

My favorites haven't changed much - I just keep adding. Two superb recent recordings are by tenor Daniel Behle and bass-baritone Matthew Rose. I think that I've previously praised Gerald Finley's Hyperion recording.

In addition, I've heard fine recent broadcasts by tenor Mauro Peter and bass Gunther Groissbock. Best of all was a 2015 Schwarzenberg performance by baritone Manuel Walser with Wolfgang Rieger. Definitely a singer to watch, as he's only 25 or so.

[wkasimer]

Not terribly recent, but there's a good one with Arthur Schoonderwoerd on Alpha. Mammei's tenor voice is rather too light for my taste, though.

I still prefer Staier (with Pregardien) to any other.

[Frank Lekens]

howie...@btinternet.com schreef op 15-12-2015 22:25:

> Any good recordings with a fortepiano?
>

Elszacker/Beghin is especially noteworthy because of Beghin's
contribution, and that's on a fortepiano.

And Pregadrien/Staier is really terrific.

And there's Equiluz/Fussi. And the ones you mentioned yourself.

[Frank Lekens]

Oscar schreef op 15-12-2015 23:19:

> On Tuesday, December 15, 2015 at 10:45:03 AM, Frank Lekens wrote:
>> >
>> >I like Holzmair more than Oscar does. Certainly when listening to one of
>> >his Dichterliebes a while ago I was reminded how much I like his
>> >singing: I really like his voice (maybe that's also personal, the

>> >quality of a voice appealing more to some than to others?)*and* his

>> >interpretations (which may sometimes sound fussy to some). I don't play
>> >his recordings often enough.
> Holzmair recorded Winterreise again for Capriccio a few years ago, with Andreas Haefliger at the keyboard. I have not heard it, but was most impressed by Haefliger's contribution as accompanist to one of Goerne's Schubert recitals on harmonia mundi.

Thanks for pointing this out. I'm listening to it on Spotify, and it's
quite a valuable addition to the catalogue, IMHO. Some might find it
precious or a little introvert maybe, but so far I really like what I'm
hearing.

[Frank Lekens]

Frank Lekens schreef op 17-12-2015 20:40:

Wow. I kept liking it, very much. This definitely goes to the top of my
favourite versions (of which there are many :-)

[Oscar]

On Thursday, December 17, 2015 at 12:57:36 PM, Frank Lekens wrote:
>
> > Thanks for pointing this out. I'm listening to it on Spotify, and it's
> > quite a valuable addition to the catalogue, IMHO. Some might find it
> > precious or a little introvert maybe, but so far I really like what I'm
> > hearing.
>
> Wow. I kept liking it, very much. This definitely goes to the top of my
> favourite versions (of which there are many :-)

Interesting. I will have to check this one out.

http://www.prestoclassical.co.uk/r/Capriccio/C5149

[Andy Evans]

I'm having a battle within myself as to how "interesting" I want the singing and piano playing to be. I'm reminded of the frustration of film director Sternberg with Marlene Dietrich when she was overacting, and his reportedly saying "Don't just do something.......stand there!".

Yesterday I listened to Hagegard/Schuback for instance. I am amazed and fascinated by Schuback to the point that I was mainly listening to the piano. He's endlessly creative - really original. Hagegard is also quite an emotional singer. But while the combination kept my interest right through, I somehow didn't feel satisfied at the end of it. I have the same problems with other partnerships that make the music "interesting" - like FiDi and Moore in 1955.

Does anybody echo this? I'd like some views on how "interesting" you want this to be?

I previously listened to Julius Patzak and found myself more "satisfied" at the end of the cycle. More emotionally engaged. Maybe there was more Schubert and less 'performing' of it.......

[Frank Lekens]

Andy Evans schreef op 18-12-2015 09:24:

I can't think of Schubert separate from how he's performed. Maybe that's
partly because I can't read music and make up an imaginary performance
of how I would *like* the music to sound, in my head, separate from any
actual performances that I hear. But in any case I can't think of a
performance that has "more Schubert" in it as opposed to "less
performing". If a particular version by FiDi leaves you unsatisfied, I'd
suggest that's because he hasn't made it interesting *enough* rather
than too interesting. But instead of interesting better use the word
convincing: his performance wasn't convincing enough.

It's hard not to use "interesting" as a euphemism for "wayward and
idiosyncratic". Usually, when I call something interesting it's just
because at first hearing it sounds different to what I'm used to, but I
haven't heard it often enough to make up my mind whether I actually like it.

What I found "interesting" when I heard Holzmair & Haefliger yesterday
was that at first they sounded rather introvert and withdrawn, and I was
afraid it was going to be a rather bland version. But then later on that
turned out not to be the case and Holzmair was quite willing to stress
some emotional points -- but in a very chamber music (non-operatic) kind
of way.
That was just a first impression. I'd love to hear him live in this.

[Andy Evans]

>If a particular version by FiDi leaves you unsatisfied, I'd
> suggest that's because he hasn't made it interesting *enough* rather
> than too interesting. But instead of interesting better use the word
> convincing: his performance wasn't convincing enough.
>
> It's hard not to use "interesting" as a euphemism for "wayward and
> idiosyncratic". Usually, when I call something interesting it's just
> because at first hearing it sounds different to what I'm used to, but I
> haven't heard it often enough to make up my mind whether I actually like it.

Yes, agree with you Frank, "convincing" is a much better word. Idiosyncratic can mean "interesting at first but ultimately not convincing". Or it could mean "remains an original point of view that I return to from time to time". Or I suppose in the best of cases it's like creativity itself - something novel that initially is unexpected, but later becomes accepted into a culture.

I'm presuming that the degree of emotionality shown by singer and pianist is a separate issue. This could relate to the personality of the listener - whether you like cool or you like emotional. Not exactly the same as "convincing", but related to it. Personal taste always comes into it - in a few versions you might say "beautiful voice but doesn't convince me". There still remains a voice that you like listening to for itself. Some singers just have intrinsically beautiful or otherwise attractive voices irrespective of what they do with that.

[Al Eisner]

I honestly am not sure how one can listen to multiple versions of
Winterreise in even moderately-close succession. Are you becoming
immunized to its effects?
--
Al Eisner

[Willem Orange]

Patzak was like that - less is more,. His Siegfried Mime in the 1953 Furtwangler is sung relatively straight and makes a much more lasting impression than Gerhard Stolze's caterwauling.

[Charles H. Sampson]

Frank Lekens <frankhaaldit...@xs4all.invalid> wrote:

> ...

> Oh, let's not act as though Fischer-Dieskau doesn't exist. I made my
> acquaintance with the Winterreise through his DG recording with Moore,
> which still has a special place for me. Although now I'd probably sooner
> put the one with Demus in the cd player. And one of his early mono
> efforts once in a while. I steer clear of any of his Winterreise's after
> the one with Moore on DG (e.g. Barenboim, but especially the ones with
> Brendel and Perahia).

Thank you. I was beginning to think that the revisionism that started as
soon as DFD died had relegated him to the dustbin.

While there are many recordings of this astounding work worthy of
listening to, for me they are always measured against DFD's
interpretations. For me, he always comes out on top, but I can see that
others might not agree. (I don't understand why many don't like his high
baritone, yet will like performances by tenors.)

Charli
--
Nobody in this country got rich on his own. You built a factory--good.
But you moved your goods on roads we all paid for. You hired workers we
all paid to educate. So keep a big hunk of the money from your factory.
But take a hunk and pay it forward. Elizabeth Warren (paraphrased)

[Charles H. Sampson]

My CD player is a 5-disk changer. It can be set up to play all five
track 1s, then all five track 2s, etc. I just about drove my wife crazy
doing that with five different Winterreises.

Charlie

[Johnno]

> That was just a first impression. I'd love to hear him live in this.
>
> --
> Frank Lekens
>

It would have to be a live recording. His recent performances at the Huntington Music Festival in Australia were his final ones before retirement.

J

[Andy Evans]

Trawling through Youtube I came across another good Winterreise several pages in.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a-rlLL268UA&index=6&list=PL226FDA3D2176F3F1

Joseph Greindl and Herthe Kust. Good pianist and an engrossing performance. I was just going to sample it but was totally drawn in. Any other fans of this one?

[Frank Lekens]

Andy Evans schreef op 20-12-2015 10:20:

> Trawling through Youtube I came across another good Winterreise several pages in.
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a-rlLL268UA&index=6&list=PL226FDA3D2176F3F1
>
> Joseph Greindl and Herthe Kust. Good pianist and an engrossing performance. I was just going to sample it but was totally drawn in. Any other fans of this one?
>

I've heard it but I'm not really a fan. He has a voice that stands out,
but it was a little too slow to my taste and maybe... not interesting
enough.

I realized later that within lieder there's also the two axes of
"singing" (simply sticking to the singing line of the melody) and
"acting" (emphasizing some interpretative twist by whispering, growling,
shouting, hesitating or pausing, slurring, &c), and that maybe when you
said you lately tend to prefer performances that are "less interesting",
that referred to performances that contained less acting. In any case,
that's something I hear don't quite enough of (for *my* taste) in
Greindl's version. And I'm not captivated by the mere sound of his voice
enough (as I would be with Quasthof's, for instance, even if he didn't
put any "acting" at all in his rendition) to be drawn in as much as you
are.

But it's certainly a unique addition to the catalogue. There aren't many
voices as deep as this, are there? (Hotter maybe -- also a version I've
never really warmed to.)

[Norman Schwartz]

Can anyone kindly tell me if there's a recording, other than that of Shura
Gehrman/Nina Walker on Nimbus, in which Winter Journey is sung in English?
(I'm aware of the value of its being performed in its intended original
language.) I enjoy Pears/Britten.

I not so very sure I have 'favourites' of anything, including ice cream
flavours.

Happy and healthy holiday season to all.

[cooper...@gmail.com]

Have you heard this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xTi2pQiUphI

Wishing you and all the denizens of RMCR all the joys of the seasn,

Alan

[Norman Schwartz]

cooper...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Friday, December 25, 2015 at 11:17:22 AM UTC-5, Norman Schwartz
> wrote:
>> Can anyone kindly tell me if there's a recording, other than that of
>> Shura Gehrman/Nina Walker on Nimbus, in which Winter Journey is sung
>> in English? (I'm aware of the value of its being performed in its
>> intended original language.) I enjoy Pears/Britten.
>>
>> I not so very sure I have 'favourites' of anything, including ice
>> cream flavours.
>>
>> Happy and healthy holiday season to all.
>
> Have you heard this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xTi2pQiUphI
>

Thanks, I already heard that and found it quite enjoyable, but wished for
more than just 5 songs and a CD (as can seen among the comments).

[wkasimer]

Daniel Behle's Sony version actually includes two recordings, one with piano and one with piano trio.

[gggg...@gmail.com]

On Tuesday, December 15, 2015 at 6:37:49 AM UTC-10, Andy Evans wrote:
> Mid December as I write, seems the right time to think about Winterreise. Also no recent threads on this.
>
> What are your favourite versions?

The following recent review asks:

- The sixty-four-thousand-dollar question is: does the English version work?

http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2018/Apr/Schubert_winter_SIGCD531.htm

[Andy Evans]

It sounds very nice in Swedish - forgotten who exactly, but it's on YT

[Frank Lekens]

Andy Evans schreef op 23-4-2018 20:10:

Hagegard maybe (who's also recorded it in the original)?

There's a Dutch version, but the translator of that is a bit of a
jokester. The result is entertaining (although many will probably deride
or even loathe it), and the only recorded version of it tends to sound a
bit more like music hall than the German Lied tradition one is used to.

I like having such outlier versions, I think it's a good thing people
try to engage with it that way, even if in the end I'll always prefer
the great recordings (or live performances, preferrably!) of the
original version. (Looking very much forward to hearing Florian Boesch
in it in November. I've heard him in the Müllerin and the Schwanengesang
and he's terrifically impressive both live and in his recordings, to my
mind.)

I once heard part of an English translation by David Colmer that was
very good as well (as a translation).

As to this new English version (which is on Spotify in case anyone wants
to sample it): sounds like a worthy effort to me, from the bits of it
I've sampled.

The reviewer writes: "One detail that caught my ear was that at the
start of ‘The Hurdy-gurdy man’ Glynn achieves the drone effect in the
piano part as well as anyone I’ve heard."
This is indeed rather striking. Does anybody know what he does to creat
that effect? Is that something like a broken chord?
And do others like it, or find it in bad taste? (No doubt there's a
school saying the pianist should draw as little attention to the
accompaniment as possible.)

--
Frank Lekens

http://fmlekens.home.xs4all.nl/

https://franklekens.blogspot.nl/

[Frank Lekens]

Frank Lekens schreef op 23-4-2018 22:44:

Talking about "deviant versions":
Christoph Keller & Christoph Homberger seem to have re-arranged the
order of the songs.
https://www.amazon.de/Winterreise-Christoph-Keller-Homberger/dp/B000AS1JAM
Or actually, as I read on Wikipedia, they're using the final order
Müller used in a later book publication.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winterreise

[wkasimer]

On Monday, April 23, 2018 at 2:10:22 PM UTC-4, Andy Evans wrote:

> It sounds very nice in Swedish - forgotten who exactly, but it's on YT

Probably Sven Kristersson:

https://www.classicalarchives.com/album/7393787131559.html

A superb "wrong language" Winterreise is Boris Gmyrya's, sung in Russian.

[Andy Evans]

Here's my old notes - may be out of date. In something like rank order of my own tastes. Gives some YT references

Winterreise
Greindl/Klust https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=- Intense
Patzak/Demus https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O7BIcVzPXOQ Fine voice
Boesch/Martineau https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S1Ukldq_C8c Very good
Bar/Parsons https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0vHQnx_GFoY
Gura/Berner https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tLMd4Tyig1Q Good, dramatic
Quasthoff/Pires https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kHs6VyjPd5k
Anders/Weissenborn https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rDsjX8a8n1o Marvellous
Holzmaier Good, intense
Hagegard/Schuback: Fine voice and pianism
Gerhaher/Huber https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIwo6cxcWDE
Aksel Schiotz/Burge https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQpLUxiW5hE Lovely
http://www.mp3suara.net/download/mp3/yt_FQpLUxiW5hE
Souzay/Baldwin 1959 EMI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FKVLN_A6dVs Good
Souzay/Baldwin 1961 Philips
Hampson/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a7gVz2Q69C0 Good
Pregardien/Pressler https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FGX51x_PAW0 Fine voice
Pears/Britten https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nbq7ZAOcCrc
Fischer-Dieskau/Klust Early and nice
Fischer-Dieskau
Fischer-Dieskau/Demus
Fischer-Dieskau/Moore
Padmore/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2j9SoCS3goI&list=PLr1GVnqCQWGXPwW4D7St-CXUyrNx2zbSA Too febrile
Schreier/Schiff: Over-emphasised
Goerne: Not appealing
Hotter/Moore: Hotter has quite a heavy voice, not everyone’s taste https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H_X6WBVR1mU&list=RDO7BIcVzPXOQ&index=2

Soprano:
Schaffer – very good

[AB]

On Tuesday, April 24, 2018 at 4:25:23 PM UTC-4, dk wrote:

> On Tuesday, April 24, 2018 at 8:20:19 AM UTC-7, Andy Evans wrote:
> > Here's my old notes - may be out of date. In something like rank order of my own tastes. Gives some YT references
> >

> > Hotter/Moore: Hotter has quite a heavy voice,
> > not everyone’s taste https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H_X6WBVR1mU&list=RDO7BIcVzPXOQ&index=2
> >
>

> Hotter/Raucheisen (1942) is better.
> The voice is/sounds a little lighter.
>
> dk

Moore-beautiful Hotter-unacceptable.. intonation very shaky.

AB

[Lawrence Kart]

Patzak/Demus
Hagegard/Schuback
Hüsch/Müller

Larry Kart

[Frank Lekens]

Andy Evans schreef op 24-4-2018 17:20:

In the female department, don't overlook Fassbaender/Reimannn. Terrific.

[Ricardo Jimenez]

On Mon, 23 Apr 2018 15:57:00 -0700 (PDT), dk <dan....@gmail.com>
wrote:

>On Tuesday, December 15, 2015 at 8:37:49 AM UTC-8, Andy Evans wrote:
>> Mid December as I write, seems the right time to think about Winterreise. Also no recent threads on this.
>>
>> What are your favourite versions?
>

>Gerhard Hüsch with Hans Udo Müller.
>Hans Hotter with Michael Raucheisen.
>
>dk

I don't really like jazz but I thought this version of the Winterriese
maintained the original mood in the jazz idiom.
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLI6lO8NWdpqwATK4GPHsWIVO9o9gvV8yN

[Andy Evans]

> I don't really like jazz but I thought this version of the Winterriese
> maintained the original mood in the jazz idiom.
> https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLI6lO8NWdpqwATK4GPHsWIVO9o9gvV8yN

Couldn't get that video up. Found another which doesn't work for me - neither fish nor fowl.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1zvJNo0uYe4

[nmsz...@gmail.com]

On Tuesday, December 15, 2015 at 11:37:49 AM UTC-5, Andy Evans wrote:
> Mid December as I write, seems the right time to think about Winterreise. Also no recent threads on this.
>
> What are your favourite versions?

The two star customer review (a verified purchase) of the old DG recording by DFD/Demus makes for a good laugh, s**t h*****s.
ASIN: B000001GQE

A Winterreise with fortepiano accompaniment perhaps worth considering (if fp sound means anything at all) is the Saydisc Partridge/Burnett release: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XtT82N2DHI8&list=OLAK5uy_mgafqaLOwlTWjrPze9XakOFGIB2YBwJp8

[gggg...@gmail.com]

On Tuesday, December 15, 2015 at 6:37:49 AM UTC-10, Andy Evans wrote:
> Mid December as I write, seems the right time to think about Winterreise. Also no recent threads on this.
>
> What are your favourite versions?

(2016 article):

http://www.classical-music.com/article/best-recording-winterreise

[meyers...@gmail.com]

Bored????

[Andy Evans]

The Terkel recommendation didn't suit me at all, though the piano playing was good.

My go-to is still Josef Greindl. A blast from the past.

[wkasimer]

On Tuesday, December 15, 2015 at 11:37:49 AM UTC-5, Andy Evans wrote:

> What are your favourite versions?

I've only listened to the first few songs, but I suspect that this (issued last week) one will end up at or near the top of my list:

https://www.amazon.com/Winterreise-Peter-Mattei-David-Nilsson/dp/B07VBH68SZ

Bill

[Chango]

On Tuesday, December 15, 2015 at 11:37:49 AM UTC-5, Andy Evans wrote:

> Mid December as I write, seems the right time to think about Winterreise. Also no recent threads on this.
>

> What are your favourite versions?

I have wayyy too many on disc.

For those of you in NYC, Mark Padmore will be singing it in the VERY affordable chamber music series at Peoples' Symphony Concerts this season. https://www.pscny.org/padmore-iverson, pscny.org

Other artists include Hamelin, Feltsman, Juilliard SQ, Varjon, Dover SQ, et al.
I always subscribe to all three series bur you can almost always get individual tickets as well.

Yours,
Steve K.

[golden...@gmail.com]

Fischer-Dieskau/Moore, and (current fave) Pears/Britten, both from ~1963.

Jeremy

[gggg...@gmail.com]

On Tuesday, December 15, 2015 at 10:45:03 AM UTC-8, Frank Lekens wrote:
> Oscar schreef op 15-12-2015 17:47:

> > On Tuesday, December 15, 2015 at 8:37:49 AM UTC-8, Andy Evans wrote:
> >> Mid December as I write, seems the right time to think about Winterreise. Also no recent threads on this.
> >>
> >> What are your favourite versions?
> >

> > Don't buy Wolfgang Holzmair with Imogen Cooper on Philips. The velvety high baritone is too smooth and his identification with the text is not impactful. It's all surface. Nice voice, but... Cooper is better. Goerne's second recording with Eschenbach on harmonia mundi, from 2014, is more to my liking.
> >
> > Also, buy Ian Bostridge's 2015 book, Anatomy of an Obsession, and read it: http://tinyurl.com/j4ctbxq
> >
> >
> > Philips 446 407-2 ℗ © 1996.
> > DDD.
> > Recorded in the Großer Saal, Mozarteum, Salzburg, November 1994.
> > Artist & repertoire production: Brigitte Stockmann.
> > Recording producer, balance engineer: Volker Straus.
> > Recording engineer: Cees Heijkoop.
> > Tape editor: Evert Manning.
> > Booklet note: Peter Branscombe.
> > Photo: Stefan Fiedler.
> > Art direction: George Cramer.
> > Total playing-time: 1.09'55".
> >
> I like Holzmair more than Oscar does. Certainly when listening to one of
> his Dichterliebes a while ago I was reminded how much I like his
> singing: I really like his voice (maybe that's also personal, the
> quality of a voice appealing more to some than to others?) *and* his
> interpretations (which may sometimes sound fussy to some). I don't play
> his recordings often enough.
> But then there are so many. And it's true that in the Winterreise, he
> wouldn't be my absolute top candidate. As wouldn't Souzay, for instance,
> however much I like his singing.
>
> Goerne is good; I haven't extensively compared his three versions, but I
> suspect his last may be the most interesting. (But the first with
> Johnson was good too.)...

Radio program of Goerne's recording:

https://lottelehmannleague.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/05/GoerneWintAudio.mp3

[Andy Evans]

Does anyone apart from me like Josef Greindl? I think he brings something special to the work. It's a lower voice, and a darker mood isn't inappropriate given the subject. I've always admired Greindl in his opera career.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ds838Jppnio

[wkasimer]

On Tuesday, July 21, 2020 at 4:49:18 AM UTC-4, Andy Evans wrote:

> Does anyone apart from me like Josef Greindl?

I certainly do. And although he's best known for his Wagnerian villains, I think that he was much better as a Lieder singer - his Loewe is top drawer stuff.

[MELMOTH13]

Le 10/09/2019 à 20:34, wkasimer a écrit :
> What are your favourite versions?

*Hotter* / *Rachausen*...

[Rebuild Queens Hall London]

On Tuesday, December 15, 2015 at 4:37:49 PM UTC, Andy Evans wrote:
> Mid December as I write, seems the right time to think about Winterreise. Also no recent threads on this.
>

> What are your favourite versions?

Ernst Haefliger / Jorg Dahler & Peter Pears / Ben Britten

[Andy Evans]

> > What are your favourite versions?
>
> Ernst Haefliger / Jorg Dahler

Thanks for that - I hadn't heard it. It's unusual in many ways - the pianist uses staccato more than I expected. Well, it's a fortepiano apparently, and a nice sounding instrument too. The duo align closely in quite an original way. Quite a large dynamic range and accents where you don't expect them. It draws you in to its particular vision.

[Juan I. Cahis]

Dear friends:

Nobody says Kurt Moll / (I don’t remember the pianist of the BIS recording
now) ?

His dark voice fits outstandingly the music.

--
Enviado desde mi iPad usando NewsTap, Juan I. Cahis, Santiago de Chile.

[MELMOTH13]

Le 21/07/2020 à 14:35, MELMOTH13 a écrit :
> *Hotter* / *Rachausen*...

*Raucheisen*, of course...

[Ricardo Jimenez]

On Sat, 25 Jul 2020 09:25:58 -0400, Juan I. Cahis
<jicahis....@gmail.com> wrote:

>Nobody says Kurt Moll / (I don’t remember the pianist of the BIS recording
>now) ?
>
>His dark voice fits outstandingly the music.

Is this the same performance as the one on Orfeo with Cord Garben the
pianist? It is on Spotify.

[wkasimer]

On Saturday, July 25, 2020 at 9:26:05 AM UTC-4, Juan I. Cahis wrote:

> Nobody says Kurt Moll / (I don’t remember the pianist of the BIS recording
> now) ?

Very well sung, but not very interesting interpretively. Among bass versions, I much prefer Greindl, van Dam, Hotter with Werba, as well as more recent versions by Matthew Rose and Günther Groissböck.

> His dark voice fits outstandingly the music.

Except that the downward transpositions make the cycle even darker than it already is, which is why, all things being equal, I like a tenor or high baritone better.

[gggg gggg]

On Tuesday, December 15, 2015 at 6:37:49 AM UTC-10, Andy Evans wrote:
> Mid December as I write, seems the right time to think about Winterreise. Also no recent threads on this.
>

> What are your favourite versions?

(Recent Y. upload):

Schubert - Winterreise - Ludwig C.,Werba E. - Oct.15th,1985 - Milano (rec.L.Chierici)