classical blues
mac
im a semi-begginer on the classical guitar.
I have just started to enjoy listening to the blues.
I have done a few searches for blues tabs, but i cant find anything suitable
as they seem too hard, or are better played on an electric guitar.
can anyone reccomend some not too hard Blues tabs that sound good on a
classical guitar?
thanks for any help,
Mac
TroyDonaghueIII
No Mac, I'm afraid there aren't any. No one has ever tried Blues on a
guitar before as far as I know. There was a guy named Eric Clapton
that tried to play blues on a nylon string guitar but I don't know if
he succeeded or not.
Troy III
Mark Lybrand
> guitar before as far as I know. There was a guy named Eric Clapton
> that tried to play blues on a nylon string guitar but I don't know if
> he succeeded or not.
While Troy is definitely right and you need at the very least a steel string
acoustic, you could try some fingerstyle blues on your classical (since that
is what you have). I think country blues might work okay, but you are
likely going to have to invest in either a steel string acoustic or an
electric if you really start getting into the blues. But check out stuff on
"country blues" and see if you might be interested in trying it out. Good
Luck and above all Have Fun.
Greg M. Silverman
Or, try jazzy blues, ala "Straight No Chaser" or "Au Privave" or "Goodby
Porkpie Hat." Sounds great w/ nylon strings.
gms--
Chris Erwich
CHris
"mac" <s2...@OUTGUN.COM> schreef in bericht
news:tPONb.14569$Wa....@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
Edward Bridge
Eric Clapton for Classical Guitar arranged by John Zaradin Wise
publications dis. by Hal Leonard _not_ in tab so you learn the right way
but not to hard to play . I use this book with some of my rocking Strat.
students . .
Thank you.
Peace,
Ed Bridge
www.bridgekaldromusic.com
Steve Perry
<s2...@OUTGUN.COM> wrote:
Mac --
Go to http://www.guitartabs.cc/home.php
There are more than a few blues tabs here. Some of them sound pretty
good on a nylon string guitar.
>
>
--
Steve
Scott
> There are some Blues for the classic guitar by Charley Bird.
>
> CHris
>
I have a copy of Byrd's "Three Blues for Classical Guitar." I don't
know that I'd call it "blues" in the traditional sense, nor would I
put it in the beginner category, maybe intermediate. John Williams
recorded this set on his "Spirit of the Guitar" CD, so you can give it
a listen and decide.
Cheers,
Scott
Aryeh Eller
slu...@att.net (Scott) wrote:
They're blues in form, I -IV - V but they have jazzy chords so they're
jazz blues.The first blues is probably the most traditional.Charlie Byrd
played on a classical guitar and was an improviser in the jazz sense -
though he wasn't on the level of a Wes Montgomery or anything.I like the
last one, a G minor blues. Minor blues are great, think of B.B. King's
"The Thrill is Gone"
I love John Williams but his playing of those 3 Charlie Byrd Blues is a
bit too straight and not swinging enough - he should have recorded them
as a trio with bass and drums.
--
Aryeh Eller
John Wasak
news:bandoneon1800-538...@nyctyp02-ge0.rdc-nyc.rr.com...
> They're blues in form, I -IV - V but they have jazzy chords so they're
> jazz blues.The first blues is probably the most traditional.Charlie Byrd
> played on a classical guitar and was an improviser in the jazz sense -
> though he wasn't on the level of a Wes Montgomery or anything.I like the
> last one, a G minor blues. Minor blues are great, think of B.B. King's
> "The Thrill is Gone"
>
There's some great minor blues in the rural, acoustic tradition from Skip
James. (steel-string, of course) Things like 'Devil's Got My Woman',
'Illinois Blues', 'Hard Time Killing Floor Blues'. He had a very unique
(and I'll say great) voice and played his guitar in an open d minor
(DADfad), which was a style that could be found in the Bentonia County,
Mississippi area in the 1920s and '30s.
jw
Alan Wedin
a short sound byte if you want to check it out.
http://truefire.com/list.html?store=music_instruction&viewauthor=3706&item=5
172
Alan Wedin
http://home.earthlink.net/~awedinsprint
"mac" <s2...@OUTGUN.COM> wrote in message
news:tPONb.14569$Wa....@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
Aryeh Eller
"John Wasak" <mr...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> Aryeh Eller <bandon...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:bandoneon1800-538...@nyctyp02-ge0.rdc-nyc.rr.com...
> > They're blues in form, I -IV - V but they have jazzy chords so they're
> > jazz blues.The first blues is probably the most traditional.Charlie Byrd
> > played on a classical guitar and was an improviser in the jazz sense -
> > though he wasn't on the level of a Wes Montgomery or anything.I like the
> > last one, a G minor blues. Minor blues are great, think of B.B. King's
> > "The Thrill is Gone"
> >
>
> There's some great minor blues in the rural, acoustic tradition from Skip
> James. (steel-string, of course) Things like 'Devil's Got My Woman',
> 'Illinois Blues', 'Hard Time Killing Floor Blues'. He had a very unique
> (and I'll say great) voice and played his guitar in an open d minor
> (DADfad), which was a style that could be found in the Bentonia County,
> Mississippi area in the 1920s and '30s.
>
>
> jw
>
>
>
Hi John,
You're right about Skip James, some really great tunes there that stand
the test of time because of their strong, deep to the core of the soul
melodies and lyrics. The open d min. tuning is great.
Did you see the 7 films by various directors including Martin Scorsese
and Clint Eastwood on PBS at the end of September '03? There was one
film directed by Wim Wenders (Wings of Desire, Buena Vista Social Club)
called "The Soul of A Man" where he explores the music of Skip James,
Blind Willie Johnson and J.B. Lenoir. There's this wonderful effect in
the film that Wenders uses where he simulates the slow-frame of an old
time reel-movie in black and white but he's really using contemporary
actors so it looks like he has old footage of Skip James and others
singing various songs (lip-synchronized exactly to the music) but it's
not. There's also performances by various modern blues/pop/rock/country
groups and singers of old these old Skip James tunes. I recall various
critics being unenamored with the film especially a long intro involving
space (as in Lost in Space) but I thought the film was very original,
moving and fascinating. I have the corresponding music 5-CD set for
those "The Blues" films (courtesy of PBS for being a member and a
donation) so I'm going to definitely give them a closer listen.
Here's a link to info about the Wenders' film:
http://www.pbs.org/theblues/aboutfilms/wenders.html
And "The Blues" film series in general:
http://www.pbs.org/theblues/aboutfilms/aboutfilms.html
Matanya Ophee
>There's some great minor blues in the rural, acoustic tradition from Skip
>James. (steel-string, of course) Things like 'Devil's Got My Woman',
>'Illinois Blues', 'Hard Time Killing Floor Blues'. He had a very unique
>(and I'll say great) voice and played his guitar in an open d minor
>(DADfad), which was a style that could be found in the Bentonia County,
>Mississippi area in the 1920s and '30s.
Richard Pick, Interlude No. XIII in A-flat Major. Doesn't get any
bluer than that.
M.D. Pujol, Bluecesito de la Esquina. Suites del Plata. Blues with a
porteño touch.
Matanya Ophee
Editions Orphe'e, Inc.,
1240 Clubview Blvd. N.
Columbus, OH 43235-1226
614-846-9517
fax: 614-846-9794
http://www.orphee.com
http://www.orphee.com/rmcg/album-rmcg/album.html
http://www.savageclassical.com/rmcg/album-rmcg/album.html
John Wasak
I certainly did. Wenders' 'The Soul of a Man' has to be the best
combination of cinema and music I've seen in a long time. That particular
segment was, for me, the very high point of that series. In fact, while I
enjoyed the series, the only one I'd really be inclined to view again would
be 'The Soul of a Man'.
> There's this wonderful effect in
> the film that Wenders uses where he simulates the slow-frame of an old
> time reel-movie in black and white but he's really using contemporary
> actors so it looks like he has old footage of Skip James and others
> singing various songs (lip-synchronized exactly to the music) but it's
> not.
I believe Wenders actually used an old hand-cranked camera to shoot the Skip
James footage. Ya' know, just thinkin' about it now, I have to think that
James segment of it was really too good to have been shown on TV! ;-)
>There's also performances by various modern blues/pop/rock/country
> groups and singers of old these old Skip James tunes. I recall various
> critics being unenamored with the film especially a long intro involving
> space (as in Lost in Space) but I thought the film was very original,
> moving and fascinating.
Ah, critics...whatta' they know? ;-) You're right, of course. It was
original and fascinating. The Johnson was at a high level too and the
actual footage of JB Lenoir playing all alone was too good to miss.
jw
John Wasak
news:cuah00dmaleb6k3jt...@4ax.com...
> "John Wasak" <mr...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>
> >There's some great minor blues in the rural, acoustic tradition from Skip
> >James. (steel-string, of course) Things like 'Devil's Got My Woman',
> >'Illinois Blues', 'Hard Time Killing Floor Blues'. He had a very unique
> >(and I'll say great) voice and played his guitar in an open d minor
> >(DADfad), which was a style that could be found in the Bentonia County,
> >Mississippi area in the 1920s and '30s.
>
> Richard Pick, Interlude No. XIII in A-flat Major. Doesn't get any
> bluer than that.
>
> M.D. Pujol, Bluecesito de la Esquina. Suites del Plata. Blues with a
> porteño touch.
>
Well, of course, it's all matters of taste, but I gotta' say, MO, there's
blues and then there's blues, and there ain't no blues like the rural blues
of the American South from around the 1920's and 30's. (steel-string, of
course.) That's to-the-bone blues.
"Say that is the serenade
Of a man that plays the blue guitar."
(--from 'Man with the Blue Guitar' - Wallace Stevens)
jw
Aryeh Eller
"John Wasak" <mr...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> "Say that is the serenade
> Of a man that plays the blue guitar."
> (--from 'Man with the Blue Guitar' - Wallace Stevens)
>
>
> jw
>
>
Speaking of the blue guitar, have you heard Michael Tippett's guitar
sonata "The Blue Guitar"? What do you think of it? I remember it being
played quite a bit when it first came out over 20 years ago but it never
really found a firm footing in the CG rep. Bream, its dedicatee never
recorded it but there's a BBC radio performance of it. Craig Ogden,
David Tanenbaum, Elephteria Kotzia and Norbert Kraft and others all came
out with good CD's of it. It's a fascinating if very austere piece of
music. The first movement is the most successful IMO, and there are
moments of sheer contrapuntal beauty. There's a section where you can
play a "blue" note by bending the 2nd string blues style - though the
piece is very blue in mood and not "the blues" or even bluesy. I was
recently reminded of its beauty when I heard Jorge Caballero playing it
at Luthier Music in Manhattan.
I love the Pikasso painting on the cover of the Tippett Sonata, a very
striking painting from Pikasso's Blue period - "The Old Man and the
Guitar" and of course the quote from the Wallace Stevens poem you posted
which Tippett was influenced by to write The Blue Guitar. Here's the
first verse which I'm sure has been quoted in the RMCG numerous times:
The Man With The Blue Guitar by Wallace Stevens
The man bent over his guitar,
A shearsman of sorts. The day was green.
They said, "You have a blue guitar,
You do not play things as they are."
The man replied, "Things as they are
Are changed upon the blue guitar."
And they said to him, "But play, you must,
A tune beyond us, yet ourselves,
A tune upon the blue guitar,
Of things exactly as they are."
Matanya Ophee
>> Richard Pick, Interlude No. XIII in A-flat Major. Doesn't get any
>> bluer than that.
>>
>> M.D. Pujol, Bluecesito de la Esquina. Suites del Plata. Blues with a
>> porteño touch.
>>
>
>Well, of course, it's all matters of taste, but I gotta' say, MO, there's
>blues and then there's blues, and there ain't no blues like the rural blues
>of the American South from around the 1920's and 30's. (steel-string, of
>course.) That's to-the-bone blues.
Yes, but the query was about blues for the classical guitar.
Specifically.
John Wasak
> In article <Wg2Ob.10735$q4....@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
> "John Wasak" <mr...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> > "Say that is the serenade
> > Of a man that plays the blue guitar."
> > (--from 'Man with the Blue Guitar' - Wallace Stevens)
> >
> >
> > jw
> >
>
> Speaking of the blue guitar, have you heard Michael Tippett's guitar
> sonata "The Blue Guitar"? What do you think of it?
I know I've heard it at some point along the way but I really don't recall
it well enough to make any comment on it.
> I remember it being
> played quite a bit when it first came out over 20 years ago but it never
> really found a firm footing in the CG rep. Bream, its dedicatee never
> recorded it but there's a BBC radio performance of it. Craig Ogden,
> David Tanenbaum, Elephteria Kotzia and Norbert Kraft and others all came
> out with good CD's of it. It's a fascinating if very austere piece of
> music. The first movement is the most successful IMO, and there are
> moments of sheer contrapuntal beauty. There's a section where you can
> play a "blue" note by bending the 2nd string blues style - though the
> piece is very blue in mood and not "the blues" or even bluesy. I was
> recently reminded of its beauty when I heard Jorge Caballero playing it
> at Luthier Music in Manhattan.
>
Well, Jorge Caballero can certainly make things sound good. Some time last
year when I was in the store he was kind enough to help me with some
question I had about a Scarlatti sonata and then I heard him play the
Prelude to the Bach E Major lute suite. I was definitely impressed by his
playing.
> I love the Pikasso painting on the cover of the Tippett Sonata, a very
> striking painting from Pikasso's Blue period - "The Old Man and the
> Guitar" and of course the quote from the Wallace Stevens poem you posted
> which Tippett was influenced by to write The Blue Guitar.
And Stevens' poem was inspired by that Picasso painting. In fact, Stevens
quotes Picasso in Stanza XV:
In this picture of Picasso's, this 'hoard
Of destructions," a picture of ourselves,
>Here's the
> first verse which I'm sure has been quoted in the RMCG numerous times:
>
>
> The Man With The Blue Guitar by Wallace Stevens
>
>
> The man bent over his guitar,
> A shearsman of sorts. The day was green.
>
> They said, "You have a blue guitar,
> You do not play things as they are."
>
> The man replied, "Things as they are
> Are changed upon the blue guitar."
>
> And they said to him, "But play, you must,
> A tune beyond us, yet ourselves,
>
> A tune upon the blue guitar,
> Of things exactly as they are."
>
> --
> Aryeh Eller
>
> http://www.aryeheller.com
Indeed!
jw
John Wasak
> "John Wasak" <mr...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>
> >> Richard Pick, Interlude No. XIII in A-flat Major. Doesn't get any
> >> bluer than that.
> >>
> >> M.D. Pujol, Bluecesito de la Esquina. Suites del Plata. Blues with a
> >> porteño touch.
> >>
> >
> >Well, of course, it's all matters of taste, but I gotta' say, MO, there's
> >blues and then there's blues, and there ain't no blues like the rural
blues
> >of the American South from around the 1920's and 30's. (steel-string, of
> >course.) That's to-the-bone blues.
>
> Yes, but the query was about blues for the classical guitar.
> Specifically.
>
True. But I was responding to Aryeh's comments about minor blues and
mention of BB King.
jw
Jacques Moran
061A48.232...@nyctyp02-ge0.rdc-nyc.rr.com:
> Speaking of the blue guitar, have you heard Michael Tippett's guitar
> sonata "The Blue Guitar"? What do you think of it?
I played it 7 or 8 years ago. I think it's a good piece, not a great
piece. It's not easy and there are plenty of awkward passages, like you
get from a lot of non-guitarist composers. I agree that the first
movement is the most effective musically, it also has the most ideomatic
writing. I never felt like I could play the second movement fast enough.
Also, some of the percussive effects in that movement seem a little
square to me. Tippett's certainly no avant-guardist but he sometimes
throws in some weird stuff that sounds pretty clumsy to my ears (in one
of his otherwise conservative tonal symphonies, I forget which one, he
has a amplified voice making breathing sounds). The last movement (the
slow movement) has some really beautiful, etherial moments. There are a
lot of tempo/sustain problems in this one and some near impossible
shifts.
As far as the original poster is concerned these 3 are big hits with my
5th and 6th grade guitar students:
http://www.hochweber.ch/spark.htm
http://www.hochweber.ch/2002/thriller.htm
http://www.hochweber.ch/jazzy.htm
David Kotschessa
course for some of the slide stuff, which would be odd). His complete
recordings are available in a standard notation/tab book that's out
there. Only one of the takes of each, I believe.
To me it's more of an educational thing and a launching point for some
unique style of composition, or improvisation and of course vocal
accompanament, than an end in itself.
I play jazz almost strictly on my classical guitar these days and
spend a lot of time improvising blues chord solo type stuff.
Aryeh Eller
Jacques Moran <jacquesm...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Aryeh Eller <bandon...@hotmail.com> wrote in news:bandoneon1800-
> 061A48.232...@nyctyp02-ge0.rdc-nyc.rr.com:
>
> > Speaking of the blue guitar, have you heard Michael Tippett's guitar
> > sonata "The Blue Guitar"? What do you think of it?
>
> I played it 7 or 8 years ago. I think it's a good piece, not a great
> piece. It's not easy and there are plenty of awkward passages, like you
> get from a lot of non-guitarist composers. I agree that the first
> movement is the most effective musically, it also has the most ideomatic
> writing. I never felt like I could play the second movement fast enough.
> Also, some of the percussive effects in that movement seem a little
> square to me. Tippett's certainly no avant-guardist but he sometimes
> throws in some weird stuff that sounds pretty clumsy to my ears (in one
> of his otherwise conservative tonal symphonies, I forget which one, he
> has a amplified voice making breathing sounds). The last movement (the
> slow movement) has some really beautiful, etherial moments. There are a
> lot of tempo/sustain problems in this one and some near impossible
> shifts.
>
Jacques, My Schott score has the second movement II marked "Very slow"
with the Eb chord and the last mvmt. III is marked "fast", a toccata
-like piece.
I'm going to disagree with you, I think it's a great piece, you had to
hear Jorge Caballero play it - flawless technically, he created seamless
legato phrases and it was basically effortless playing (the guy has
magical hands) - he made it sing and the structure was clearly outlined.
There's nothing like it in the entire CG literature. One could say it
has that typical "modern English composer sound" but there's a
uniqueness to it that's hard to describe. I think the piece just doesn't
speak directly enough to the general CG audience, a shame since as you
mentioned there are a bunch of ethereal moments. I love that opening
chord and the first phrase, you really feel that the old man slumping on
his guitar in Pikasso's painting is playing for you! The last
progression in the first mvmt. that leads up to the F minor chord is
very striking and effective too, just some of the truly great moments in
this work.
Aryeh Eller
"John Wasak" <mr...@earthlink.net> wrote:
Yes indeed he makes everything sound great. I'm sorry you missed his
Sept. 03' performance of Henze's Royal Winter Music First Sonata at the
NYC CG Society (which was a great BBQ too - plenty of food). I've never
heard the piece played better, you could have taken precise dictation
from his performance, that was how clearly he laid out the structure of
the music. It reminded me of pianists like Pollini and Perahia who play
these long sonatas by Schubert and Beethoven and are able to hold the
entire piece together with their uncanny understanding of the form of a
piece of music.
> > I love the Picasso painting on the cover of the Tippett Sonata, a very
> > striking painting from Picasso's Blue period - "The Old Man and the
> > Guitar" and of course the quote from the Wallace Stevens poem you posted
> > which Tippett was influenced by to write The Blue Guitar.
>
> And Stevens' poem was inspired by that Picasso painting. In fact, Stevens
> quotes Picasso in Stanza XV:
>
> In this picture of Picasso's, this 'hoard
> Of destructions," a picture of ourselves,
>
Here's a bit of Tippett's own preface to his guitar sonata:
"Reading the poem acted for me roughly as the sight of Picasso's picture
did for the poet. But of course, all the words and concepts have
disappeared and this piece for guitar is essentially music. It could
properly be appreciated solely as a short sonata. All that remained from
the poem were three moods, or gestures, which suggested titles for the
movements:
Transforming/ Verwandeln
Being the lion in the lute
Before the lion locked in stone
Dreaming/Träumen
...Morning is not sun,
It is this posture of the nerves,
As if a blunted player clutched
The nuances of the blue guitar
Juggling/Jonglieren
...the old fantoche
Hanging his shawl upon the wind.
Michael Tippett
Anybody know the meaning of "fantoche'? I think it means a dreamer or
fantasizer.
Jacques Moran
r.com:
>
> Jacques, My Schott score has the second movement II marked "Very slow"
> with the Eb chord and the last mvmt. III is marked "fast", a toccata
> -like piece.
Tippett changed his mind once or twice as to whether the slow movement
should be second or third.
>
> you had to
> hear Jorge Caballero play it
I'd like to. I've never heard a recording that I thought did this piece
justice, and I've heard several.
> there's a uniqueness to it that's hard to describe. I think the piece
> just doesn't speak directly enough to the general CG audience,
Well, you know, the general CG audience is really only a tiny bit more
sophisticated than the audience that goes in for this kind of thing:
Tannembaum told me a funny story about playing this piece: after many hours
of preperation he had occasion to play it somewhere in the UK for an
audience that would include the composer. Somewhere into the performance,
came a loud disruptive grumpling in the first row, the kind characteristic
of elderly people unperceptive to quiet volume levels (no offense,
hopefully to some of the mature folks that frequent this NG). Not wanting
the performance marred or to be further distracted he decided to cast an
admonitory glare at the offending audience member. Lo and behold it was
Tippett.
Edward Bridge
"David Kotschessa" <dkots...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:4589696c.0401...@posting.google.com...
> I think the Robert Johnson stuff sounds great on nylon string,(of
> course for some of the slide stuff, which would be odd).
Yes David,and let's not forget Mississippi Fred McDowell and please don't
hang up on me but I play a _glass _slide ( only for wife ,friends and
students ) on a classical guitar and I've been playing slide for years and
years like this. One of the reasons why is many times I have to save my
left hand and I play silly folks songs for the kids at night on my glass.
The glass slide sounds better than metal/mental for my taste .
Again , not saying glass on nylon is THE sound but we can still have fun
while we play for our "evil" women
Peace
Ed Bridge
Brooklyn
www.bridgeclassicalguitars.com
Greg M. Silverman
Edward Bridge wrote:
> "David Kotschessa" <dkots...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:4589696c.0401...@posting.google.com...
> > I think the Robert Johnson stuff sounds great on nylon string,(of
> > course for some of the slide stuff, which would be odd).
>
> Yes David,and let's not forget Mississippi Fred McDowell and please don't
> hang up on me but I play a _glass _slide ( only for wife ,friends and
> students ) on a classical guitar and I've been playing slide for years and
> years like this. One of the reasons why is many times I have to save my
> left hand and I play silly folks songs for the kids at night on my glass.
> The glass slide sounds better than metal/mental for my taste .
Ed,
Is commonly called a bottle-neck slide.
I too play it occasionally on my nylon strings... sounds very smooth and
mellow.
>
>
> Again , not saying glass on nylon is THE sound but we can still have fun
> while we play for our "evil" women
>
which "evil" woman is that? not mine, she be my angel in all senses
<wink><wonk>
Dig!
gms--
Aryeh Eller
Jacques Moran <jacquesm...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Aryeh Eller <bandon...@hotmail.com> wrote in
> news:bandoneon1800-DCA...@nycmny-nntp-rdr-03-ge0.rdc-nyc.r
> r.com:
>
> >
> > Jacques, My Schott score has the second movement II marked "Very slow"
> > with the Eb chord and the last mvmt. III is marked "fast", a toccata
> > -like piece.
>
> Tippett changed his mind once or twice as to whether the slow movement
> should be second or third.
> >
> > you had to
> > hear Jorge Caballero play it
>
> I'd like to. I've never heard a recording that I thought did this piece
> justice, and I've heard several.
I think Jorge may record and play it in concert soon..
>
> > there's a uniqueness to it that's hard to describe. I think the piece
> > just doesn't speak directly enough to the general CG audience,
>
> Well, you know, the general CG audience is really only a tiny bit more
> sophisticated than the audience that goes in for this kind of thing:
>
> http://tinyurl.com/2bf75
Very funny!!
>
> Tannembaum told me a funny story about playing this piece: after many hours
> of preparation he had occasion to play it somewhere in the UK for an
> audience that would include the composer. Somewhere into the performance,
> came a loud disruptive grumpling in the first row, the kind characteristic
> of elderly people unperceptive to quiet volume levels (no offense,
> hopefully to some of the mature folks that frequent this NG). Not wanting
> the performance marred or to be further distracted he decided to cast an
> admonitory glare at the offending audience member. Lo and behold it was
> Tippett.
>
That's a great story Jacques, thanks so much - You're the man! (or as
the kids say here in the U.S. U da man!)
Edward Bridge
> Ed,
> Is commonly called a bottle-neck slide.
I just remember being ask if I use glass or metal.. I know in retail stores
they use the word bottle-neck slide but not in the bars I use to work in
bottle -neck was a shape of a beer bottle :>)
>
> I too play it occasionally on my nylon strings... sounds very smooth and
> mellow.
real real mellooooowwww !
>
>
> which "evil" woman is that? not mine, she be my angel in all senses
> <wink><wonk>
the one that gets between us and our wives. . .that's why I work with my
wife !:>)
In the words of R.J.
I've got a kind hearted woman, she studies evil all the time.
I've got a kind hearted woman, she studies evil all the time.
You would do to quit me just to have it on your mind.
Ed "evil knows evil" Bridge
www.bridgeclassicalguitars.com
Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS
John Wasak wrote:
>
> Well, of course, it's all matters of taste, but I gotta' say, MO, there's
> blues and then there's blues, and there ain't no blues like the rural blues
> of the American South from around the 1920's and 30's. (steel-string, of
> course.) That's to-the-bone blues.
"Beauty is only skin deep...
...but ugly is to the bone!
Nipsy Russel
>
>
> "Say that is the serenade
> Of a man that plays the blue guitar."
> (--from 'Man with the Blue Guitar' - Wallace Stevens)
>
> jw
>
> >
> >
> > Matanya Ophee
> > Editions Orphe'e, Inc.,
> > 1240 Clubview Blvd. N.
> > Columbus, OH 43235-1226
> > 614-846-9517
> > fax: 614-846-9794
> > http://www.orphee.com
> > http://www.orphee.com/rmcg/album-rmcg/album.html
> > http://www.savageclassical.com/rmcg/album-rmcg/album.html
--
Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS
Brooklyn, NY
718-258-5001
http://www.dentaltwins.com
Robert Crim
<bornfe...@dentaltwins.com> wrote:
> "Beauty is only skin deep...
>...but ugly is to the bone!
Does that mean that the "blues" is ugly to the bone?
R.
Robert Crim
<edbr...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>I just remember being ask if I use glass or metal.. I know in retail stores
>they use the word bottle-neck slide but not in the bars I use to work in
>bottle -neck was a shape of a beer bottle :>)
>>
In *some* bars a lipstick tube top is the easiest to find.
R.
Richard F. Sayage
"Robert Crim" <ses...@erols.com> wrote in message
news:m41j00tclh9it1d53...@4ax.com...
Nope, just bad...
Rich
Richard F. Sayage
"Richard F. Sayage" <rsay...@ZEROSPAMoptonline.net> wrote in message
news:RJfOb.106080$G04.24...@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net...
bad to the bone, that is.... :-)
Robert Crim
Elitist snob.....
R.
Richard F. Sayage
Much thanks for noticing. :-)
Rich
Robert Crim
<rsay...@ZEROSPAMoptonline.net> wrote:
>
>"Robert Crim" <ses...@erols.com> wrote in message
>news:c73j00l96c9vbun07...@4ax.com...
>> On Sat, 17 Jan 2004 19:07:29 GMT, "Richard F. Sayage"
>> <rsay...@ZEROSPAMoptonline.net> wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >"Robert Crim" <ses...@erols.com> wrote in message
>> >news:m41j00tclh9it1d53...@4ax.com...
>> >> On Sat, 17 Jan 2004 13:25:45 -0500, Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS
>> >> <bornfe...@dentaltwins.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> > "Beauty is only skin deep...
>> >> >...but ugly is to the bone!
>> >>
>> >> Does that mean that the "blues" is ugly to the bone?
>> >>
>> >> R.
>> >
>> >Nope, just bad...
>> >
>> >Rich
>> >
>> Elitist snob.....
>>
>> R.
>
>Much thanks for noticing. :-)
>
>Rich
>
Good taste is always obvious when one knows what to look for.
R.
Edward Bridge
>
> R.
Ed
Robert Crim
Her? Or maybe..................?
R.
Edward Bridge
I think you know what I'm going for . .he he . hey where's Sam ?
Ed
Robert Crim
<edbr...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>
>"Robert Crim" <ses...@erols.com> wrote in message
>news:sobj001ap78baouj6...@4ax.com...
>> On Sat, 17 Jan 2004 21:16:20 GMT, "Edward Bridge"
>> <edbr...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >"Robert Crim" <ses...@erols.com> wrote in message
>> >>
>> >> In *some* bars a lipstick tube top is the easiest to find.
>> >>
>> >> R.
>> >yea, but the hard part is letting her put your finger in it
>> >Ed
>> >
>>
>> Her? Or maybe..................?
>>
>> R.
>
>I think you know what I'm going for . .he he . hey where's Sam ?
>Ed
>
Sam is in the back of a dark theater watching the latest
"Butt Masters" flick and hoping the butter on his popcorn is
non-allergenic.
Robert
David Kotschessa
> Yes David,and let's not forget Mississippi Fred McDowell and please don't
> hang up on me but I play a _glass _slide ( only for wife ,friends and
> students ) on a classical guitar and I've been playing slide for years and
> years like this. One of the reasons why is many times I have to save my
> left hand and I play silly folks songs for the kids at night on my glass.
> The glass slide sounds better than metal/mental for my taste .
>
> Again , not saying glass on nylon is THE sound but we can still have fun
> while we play for our "evil" women
I didn't say it was bad, I just thought it'd would be odd. There is
of course nothing wrong with odd! Come to think of it, I guess that's
a bad call. It wouldn't be all that odd. I imagine it's a lot less
noisy than on the steel string. If nothing else, it's great ear
training.
Some composer will be odd enough, if it hasn't happened already, to
come up with some sort of classical composition that uses a slide.
It's not a question of if, but of who and when. (and will it be any
good?)
Steven Bornfeld
Who're you--Charlie the Tuna?
Steve
Robert Crim
Yes.
R.
Edward Bridge
> come up with some sort of classical composition that uses a slide.
> It's not a question of if, but of who and when. (and will it be any
> good?)
I remember back maybe 5 years ago , Kirsti and I went to a small concert of
a few good guitars somewhere on the west side of New York City. The
concerts was called "Friends and Enemies of New Music" and some player was
playing a piece of "new" music where he used a pencil and spoon as a slide
and I was thinking "shit , you dingbat , here's my slide , put the penile
(he he ) and spoon away" but the player didn't need any help, He did a
really great job!
For the record , We really enjoyed that concert that the Ben Yarmolinsky
put together. We like new Music ,we just wish they use old tools like a
slide :>) or bottle-neck slide (for gm)
When I about it, I wish I still had the program , I think that player was
playing a classcial blue song.
Peace
Ed Bridge
www.bridgeclassicalguitars.com
John Wasak
> In article <2Z3Ob.10943$q4....@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
> "John Wasak" <mr...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> > Aryeh Eller <bandon...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > > recently reminded of its beauty when I heard Jorge Caballero playing
it
> > > at Luthier Music in Manhattan.
> > >
> >
> > Well, Jorge Caballero can certainly make things sound good. Some time
last
> > year when I was in the store he was kind enough to help me with some
> > question I had about a Scarlatti sonata and then I heard him play the
> > Prelude to the Bach E Major lute suite. I was definitely impressed by
his
> > playing.
> >
>
> Yes indeed he makes everything sound great. I'm sorry you missed his
> Sept. 03' performance of Henze's Royal Winter Music First Sonata at the
> NYC CG Society (which was a great BBQ too - plenty of food).
Well, I'm sorry I missed it too. One of the few pieces of CG music I've
been listening to in about the past month has been Henze's RWM - i this case
a recording by Dietmar Kres on the Wergo label recorded in 1984.
>I've never
> heard the piece played better, you could have taken precise dictation
> from his performance, that was how clearly he laid out the structure of
> the music. It reminded me of pianists like Pollini and Perahia who play
> these long sonatas by Schubert and Beethoven and are able to hold the
> entire piece together with their uncanny understanding of the form of a
> piece of music.
>
Well, one of my favorite recording of the late Beethoven sonatas - Op. 109,
110, 111 - is by Pollini.... So now I'm doubly sorry I missed it.
jw
David Kotschessa
[crumbles up a piece of manuscript and throws it away]
-D
Brian G.
Contemporary Guitar" has a piece entitled Blues Suite composed by Roger
Hudson.
Brian
"mac" <s2...@OUTGUN.COM> wrote in message
news:tPONb.14569$Wa....@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> hi,
>
> im a semi-begginer on the classical guitar.
> I have just started to enjoy listening to the blues.
> I have done a few searches for blues tabs, but i cant find anything
suitable
> as they seem too hard, or are better played on an electric guitar.
>
> can anyone reccomend some not too hard Blues tabs that sound good on a
> classical guitar?
>
> thanks for any help,
> Mac
>
>
Stanley Yates
"Brian G." <DOcgui...@SPAMrogers.comME> wrote in message
news:n3xOb.19663$nl2....@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...
> It is not in tab, and it's not for beginners but Stanley Yates book "The
> Contemporary Guitar" has a piece entitled Blues Suite composed by Roger
> Hudson.
Roger's piece is a bit tought, but audiences usually go nuts fot it. Derk
van der Veen's "Blues and Ballads" is also published in my Mel Bay series. A
Classical Guitar Magazine reviewer called this the best music of its type
he'd seen (something along those lines). Still, never heard of anyone ever
performing any of them.
I'm thinking about recording one of them for Fingestyle Magazine.
Stanley Yates
http://www.StanleyYates.com
-----
Dr. Stanley Yates
Professor of Music
Austin Peay State University
Department of Music
PO Box 4625
Clarksville TN 37043
(001) 931 221-7351
(001) 931 221-7529 (fax)
APSU Guitar Program:
http://www.apsu.edu/yatess/academic/apsuguitar/index.html
Brian G.
"Stanley Yates" <sya...@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:y3AOb.21774$2L6....@bignews6.bellsouth.net...
>
> "Brian G." <DOcgui...@SPAMrogers.comME> wrote in message
> news:n3xOb.19663$nl2....@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...
>
> > It is not in tab, and it's not for beginners but Stanley Yates book "The
> > Contemporary Guitar" has a piece entitled Blues Suite composed by Roger
> > Hudson.
>
> Roger's piece is a bit tough
Agreed! I diddle with it once in a while and enjoy it very much, but I'm not
sure I could get it up to any kind of performance level. Like I said, not
for beginners, but worthy of mention I thought.
>
> I'm thinking about recording one of them for Fingestyle Magazine.
>
Please let us know when and if this happens; I would love to hear it.
Brian Gardiner
David Kotschessa
> > Well so it's been done.
> >
> > [crumbles up a piece of manuscript and throws it away]
>
>
> John Sloan
I'll have to hear the other ideas first though, in order to have any
assurance that I can create one that is superior. ;)
Or for something to frighten any crowd, perhaps an arrangement of
"Recuerdos". A slide/tremelo combination sure to scare away even the
least discriminating audience.
Aryeh Eller
Please record the Roger Hudson Blues Suite, I love it, especially the
last movement which is in 7, very cool! I heard you play it on a radio
broadcast last year but the station never kept it in their web archives
to listen to again.
Thanks and best to you.
In article <y3AOb.21774$2L6....@bignews6.bellsouth.net>,
"Stanley Yates" <sya...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
--
Aryeh Eller
David Kotschessa
days. Eric Johnson has a very cool tune called "Song for George."
(Look at that, I called it a TUNE!)
Anyway, at least I thought it was cool back then. I can only remember
the first four measures, as back then that's all I could play. It's
kind of a country/blues thing. It uses a drop D (both E's dropped)
tuning.
I wish I could find it again, because these days I could actually play
the whole thing. I consider it to be a fairly cross-genre piece and
thing it would sound great on a classical guitar. Would love to hear
it performed by somebody with really good classical tone/technique.
John Wasak
> "David Kotschessa" <dkots...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:4589696c.04011...@posting.google.com...
> >
> > come up with some sort of classical composition that uses a slide.
> > It's not a question of if, but of who and when. (and will it be any
> > good?)
>
on
> the bass strings in the 1st movement. I heard Rachel Gauk perform it.
She
> may just have been having a bad night, but the sound of the steel slide
> grating/rasping over the wound bass strings was not to my taste.
>
> John Sloan
>
I'm a bit late to the party on this particular angle but I'm sure you all
will be glad to know I brought (finally!) the Dom Perignon !!!..... that's
right! ..... in the form of Stepan Rak.
In Rak's 'Voces de Profundis - a piece inspired by the Hitchcock film
'Psyhco'' - there is, among other odd musical sounds, at one point,
judicious use of a spoon to make weird sliding noises on (of course) a
nylon-string guitar.
If anyone's interested in hearing this piece they can find it on "The Guitar
of Stepan Rak" played by the composer, Stepan Rak himself, on Nimbus
Records, 1989. Though, my understanding is that Nimbus has ceased to
exist - so....good luck in finding it!
jw
Aryeh Eller
"John Wasak" <mr...@earthlink.net> wrote:
I was at Vladimir Mikulka's NY debut at Carnegie Recital Hall where he
played this piece, very cool!! He also played Koshkin's The Prince's
Toys and a bluesy, jazzy piece called Three Stops on the Road which I
bought the score for. It was a great concert (forget how many years ago)
but his encore was a musical joke understandable only to the guitarists
in the audience: He played the (in)famous Spanish Romance but started to
slowly detune his E string until by the end of the piece he snapped it
right off! A very strange encore to an otherwise superb recital of
(then) new music. I wonder if anybody else here in the RMCG was at that
concert - I clearly remember seeing the late great Narciso Yepes at the
reception afterward. The Prince's Toys had all sorts of effects too.
Say anybody know how Mikulka is doing and whether he's still playing and
giving concerts? A fascinating player.
Larry Deack
> Say anybody know how Mikulka is doing and whether he's still playing and
> giving concerts? A fascinating player.
Not sure what he is doing now but I saw virtually the same program at Cal
State Northridge many years ago except he didn't play the encore piece...
I'm sure I'd remember that but we all remembered that spoon. Nice guy too. I
thought he said he was living in NYC at that time.
dave payne
> It is not in tab, and it's not for beginners but Stanley Yates book "The
> Contemporary Guitar" has a piece entitled Blues Suite composed by Roger
> Hudson.
Another not in tab and probably not easy to play contemporary classical
guitar blues number (that I'm liking more the more I listen to Eliot
Fisk's recording of it) is Notre Dame Blues, the last movement of George
Rochberg's American Bouquet.
Dave Payne,
the...@interlog.com
William D Clinger
> classical guitar?
>
> thanks for any help,
> Mac
Davey Graham's "Anji" is a kind of English folk-blues instrumental
that Graham played on a classical guitar. Paul Simon also used a
classical guitar to record Anji for the first Simon and Garfunkel
LP, "Wednesday Morning 3am". Bert Jansch, John Renbourn, and many
others have recorded Anji on steel-string guitars, so you can use
this tune to compare the sound of classical and steel-string.
You can find tab for it (as well as the standard notation, which I
recommend you learn to read) in Renbourn's "Folk, Blues, and Beyond"
book/CD, which may be recently out of print but is still advertised
at http://www.avalonguitar.com/artist/John_Renbourn. That page lists
several other books and videos that might interest you.
Will
David Kilpatrick
William D Clinger wrote:
I've got Davey Graham's 'Folk, Blues and Beyond' album (the book of the
same name is by John Renbourn - named because JR included DG's material)
which includes what I believed to be the original recording of Anji and
that's on a steel string. It's actually based on a Charlie Mingus jazz
solo rather than being English folk-blues but there is a distinctive
bent blue-ish note in there - a bent FOURTH though, D over an Am, which
is not officially blues. A few 7ths are thrown in.
Davey Graham is a bit enigmatic because he initially studied classical
guitar, turned to Moroccan oud and steel-string guitar, and then for
many years has devoted himself to classical guitar (with hardly any
public appearances).
John Renbourn has classical guitars but never plays them in public. A
couple of months ago I handed him one of the 1/2 scale classicals I have
bought from Romania, tuned up to GDgcdg', and he sat playing it for
about ten minutes after we had sorted out sound for a local concert. He
enjoyed it and said that he had a terz scale German made classical which
he had never tried tuning that way, but he'd probably get it out and
play around it with again.
I've played Anji since around 1967 and it was the first piece I learned
thoroughly (from Jansch's recordings rather than Graham, and certainly
not from Simon & Garfunkel, which was very slick but sanitised to remove
any hint of expression!). I find it fairly difficult to make 'work' well
on nylon string guitar whether classical or gypsy jazz.
David
Mike Walton
his unique blend of yelling and screaming. I understand that Howard
has already managed to net a multi-million dollar record deal with All
Nations Music Publishing LMT, and this is no joke !
Clearly, Howard's concession/victory speach has all the makings of a
'Baghdad Bob' music video and the words speak for themselves:
"And we're going to win in Massachusetts! And North Carolina!
And Missouri! And Arkansas! And Connecticut! And New York!
And Ohio! "YAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!"
William D Clinger
> I've got Davey Graham's 'Folk, Blues and Beyond' album (the book of the
> same name is by John Renbourn - named because JR included DG's material)
> which includes what I believed to be the original recording of Anji and
> that's on a steel string.
Thanks for correcting me. I have "The Compleat Guitarist", where Graham
plays Anji on a steel-string guitar, possibly the same recording as the
one you're talking about. I thought I remembered someone saying that
Graham's original recording was on a classical, but clearly I was wrong.
> It's actually based on a Charlie Mingus jazz
> solo rather than being English folk-blues but there is a distinctive
> bent blue-ish note in there - a bent FOURTH though, D over an Am, which
> is not officially blues. A few 7ths are thrown in.
It sure ain't your basic to-the-bone Southern blues. Graham does *sing*
some blues on "The Compleat Guitarist", and I think some are accompanied
on his classical guitar, but I wasn't going to recommend those. I didn't
know of the Mingus connection for Anji.
> I find it fairly difficult to make 'work' well
> on nylon string guitar whether classical or gypsy jazz.
Bending notes on a nylon-string guitar is hard work, but it can be done.
I'm pretty happy with how well Anji works on my nylon-string guitars,
but I'm sure my standards are lower than yours.
Will
Richard Jernigan
I saw/heard Eliot play this piece at the last of the Cuernavaca
Festivals. I believe it contributed significantly to global warming.
RNJ
David Kilpatrick
fb74251e.04012...@posting.google.com, "William D Clinger"
<cesur...@verizon.net> wrote:
> David Kilpatrick <icon...@btconnect.com> wrote:
>> I've got Davey Graham's 'Folk, Blues and Beyond' album (the book of the
>> same name is by John Renbourn - named because JR included DG's material)
>> which includes what I believed to be the original recording of Anji and
>> that's on a steel string.
>
> Thanks for correcting me. I have "The Compleat Guitarist", where Graham
> plays Anji on a steel-string guitar, possibly the same recording as the
> one you're talking about. I thought I remembered someone saying that
> Graham's original recording was on a classical, but clearly I was wrong.
Unfortunately my copy is a tape from a friend's vinyl with his copy of some
notes - as far as I know the original is not available, but I haven't tried
to find a remastered CD and maybe it's around. So I have no DEFINITE proof
that this track is the right one... It is possible that Jim could have
substituted the recording he preferred himself when making me me the tape
many years ago.
>
>> It's actually based on a Charlie Mingus jazz
>> solo rather than being English folk-blues but there is a distinctive
>> bent blue-ish note in there - a bent FOURTH though, D over an Am, which
>> is not officially blues. A few 7ths are thrown in.
That's info from the Bert Jansch biography Dazzling Stranger - the Mingus
bit. Worth reading mainly for the stuff about all Jansch's connections and
the London scene in the 60s.
>
> It sure ain't your basic to-the-bone Southern blues. Graham does *sing*
> some blues on "The Compleat Guitarist", and I think some are accompanied
> on his classical guitar, but I wasn't going to recommend those. I didn't
> know of the Mingus connection for Anji.
>
>> I find it fairly difficult to make 'work' well
>> on nylon string guitar whether classical or gypsy jazz.
>
> Bending notes on a nylon-string guitar is hard work, but it can be done.
> I'm pretty happy with how well Anji works on my nylon-string guitars,
> but I'm sure my standards are lower than yours.
>
I doubt that. Different possibly but not lower! For what it's worth if I
bother to practice a bit and have the right guitar I can do Anji about as
well as anyone else I know on steel string - well enough to do the
occasional duet with someone else who has it sorted. But actually, it's not
that difficult, which is the beauty of it. To the beginner it sounds
impossible, but there must be a two dozen Jansch instrumentals which are
almost impossible by comparison - and I have never managed to get those
right (ANY of them!) despite having music and tab and albums. My timing and
rhythm just ain't there...
David
John Wasak
> >> It's actually based on a Charlie Mingus jazz
> >> solo rather than being English folk-blues but there is a distinctive
> >> bent blue-ish note in there - a bent FOURTH though, D over an Am, which
> >> is not officially blues. A few 7ths are thrown in.
>
> That's info from the Bert Jansch biography Dazzling Stranger - the Mingus
> bit. Worth reading mainly for the stuff about all Jansch's connections and
> the London scene in the 60s.
> >
I'm curious, David, about this. Does Jansch say exactly what solo it is
based on? If not, is the solo you refer to a particular Mingus bass solo
that he himself (being a bassist) played in one of his own compositions or
is the solo by another instrument?
It's been so long since I've heard 'Anji' that I really can't recall the
tune to try and place it with a particular Mingus solo. But way back in the
1970's I was an avid listener of English "Folk" and I do recall Mingus often
being well-considered by many in that 'group'. Often, the two Mingus
compostions that seemed to be recorded and spoken of the most were "Haitian
Fight Song' and 'Goodbye Pork-Pie Hat'. In fact, I recall that Pentangle
(with Bert Jansch & John Renbourn) on one of their early recordings ('Sweet
Child'?) had both of those Mingus tunes (HFS , GP-PH) on it.
I also remember that I sold off my big pile of English folk LP's by about
1980, but there's still one, which I now have on CD, that I would definitely
take to that proverbial 'Desert Isle' with me - Bert Jansch's 'Rosemary
Lane'.
jw
David Kilpatrick
J3VPb.19687$q4....@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net, "John Wasak"
<mr...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> David Kilpatrick <icon...@btconnect.com> wrote
>>>> It's actually based on a Charlie Mingus jazz
>>>> solo rather than being English folk-blues but there is a distinctive
>>>> bent blue-ish note in there - a bent FOURTH though, D over an Am, which
>>>> is not officially blues. A few 7ths are thrown in.
>>
>> That's info from the Bert Jansch biography Dazzling Stranger - the Mingus
>> bit. Worth reading mainly for the stuff about all Jansch's connections and
>> the London scene in the 60s.
>>>
>
> I'm curious, David, about this. Does Jansch say exactly what solo it is
> based on? If not, is the solo you refer to a particular Mingus bass solo
> that he himself (being a bassist) played in one of his own compositions or
> is the solo by another instrument?
Racking brain, but the name was something like 'Veronica' - another name. I
don't know if was a composition or a performance. I can't find my Jansch
book, and hunting through a bign book I have just bought (Guitar, a Complete
Guide for the Player, Balafon, 2002) yields nothing though Davey Graham gets
due coverage. I thought Mingus composed beyond his instrument anyway?
> It's been so long since I've heard 'Anji' that I really can't recall the
> tune to try and place it with a particular Mingus solo. But way back in the
> 1970's I was an avid listener of English "Folk" and I do recall Mingus often
> being well-considered by many in that 'group'. Often, the two Mingus
> compostions that seemed to be recorded and spoken of the most were "Haitian
> Fight Song' and 'Goodbye Pork-Pie Hat'. In fact, I recall that Pentangle
> (with Bert Jansch & John Renbourn) on one of their early recordings ('Sweet
> Child'?) had both of those Mingus tunes (HFS , GP-PH) on it.
John still plays Goodbye PPH at almost every concert. He's a neighbour of
ours, at least in Scottish Border terms, and I see him two or three times a
year. I was talking about the jazz influences with Jacqui McShee last time
they were playing together - I did the sound and lighting for the evening. I
was never into jazz, always hated it, being the youngest son with two older
brothers deeply into jazz just as British pop was emerging, and of course
allying myself with that instead. I said I never heard Pentangle as jazz, to
me it was something entirely new, and not like jazz. Jacqui and John both
said it was ALL JAZZ, that was where they came from! Of course I've changed
in 40 years and can both appreciate jazz and see why Pentangle was more a
jazz-influenced group than a folk-influenced one (and had nothing at all to
do with rock or pop).
So while we might consider Renbourn and Jansch etc to be 'folk', from what
John and Jacqui said, that is not how they saw themselves. A venerable
friend of mine here used to play moothie (blues harp) in the Soho clubs of
that era, with a lot of 'greats', and he says it wasn't folk either - these
were jazz and blues clubs, which got invaded by the folk movement.
I am fairly sure the tune Anji comes from was played on sax, I've heard this
once on a radio program. It was not a jazz guitar piece and the translation
by Graham was quite clever.
David
John Wasak
news:BC35EF85.B385%icon...@btconnect.com...
> On 22/1/04 6:58 pm, in article
> J3VPb.19687$q4....@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net, "John Wasak"
> <mr...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>
> > David Kilpatrick <icon...@btconnect.com> wrote
> >>>> It's actually based on a Charlie Mingus jazz
> >>>> solo rather than being English folk-blues but there is a distinctive
> >>>> bent blue-ish note in there - a bent FOURTH though, D over an Am,
which
> >>>> is not officially blues. A few 7ths are thrown in.
> >>
> >> That's info from the Bert Jansch biography Dazzling Stranger - the
Mingus
> >> bit. Worth reading mainly for the stuff about all Jansch's connections
and
> >> the London scene in the 60s.
> >>>
> >
> > I'm curious, David, about this. Does Jansch say exactly what solo it is
> > based on? If not, is the solo you refer to a particular Mingus bass
solo
> > that he himself (being a bassist) played in one of his own compositions
or
> > is the solo by another instrument?
>
> Racking brain, but the name was something like 'Veronica' - another name.
I
> don't know if was a composition or a performance.
Hmmm..... The only thing I can immediately think of that might be likely to
sound something like "Veronica" (which title, btw, I'm quite certain is not
a Mingus composition) would be "Pannonica" but that is one of those
exquisitely beautiful ballads composed by Thelonious Monk, named for his
great benefactor the Baroness Pannonica de Koenigswarter, but to say more
would be to give too much information - and I've already said I wouldn't do
that.
> I thought Mingus composed beyond his instrument anyway?
>
Well, of course. I meant that Mingus, being the bassist in his group,
would've played the bass solo (if there was one).
Well, of course, they're both absolutely right! ha-ha! (and are we
surprised!)
But indeed, that was actually what drew me most to Pentangle in those
ays - that they were an interesting amalgam of Jazz and rural American
blues filtered through a English ear. There were also the folk elements a
bit later but even they had a titlt towards American folk. (I liked that
blend far more than, what in those days, bands like Fairport Convention or
Steeleye Span were putting out which was a more rock-oriented approach - in
fact, I recall reading that Richard Thompson said that Fairport's first
recording was an attempt to imitate the Jefferson Airplane!)
I picked up, quite a few years ago now, a recording titled 'John Renbourn -
the Soho Years' on Transatlantic records for an unbelievably cheap price of
around 50 cents at a used CD shop. His American country blues influences
stand out in high relief here. Also has a number of tracks from the McShee,
Jansch , Renbourn early Pentangle days. If anyone (most likely AG
Fingerstyle types! ha-ha!) is only familiar with the later John Renbourne,
the tracks on this CD will be a bit of revelation. (It probably doesn't
even exist anymore).
Well, I've said too much. I'll probably be labeled as an informant and shot
by a dutiful rmcg firing-squad at dawn.
"What?.... ...No, I don't want a final cigarette, thank you. I don't
smoke!..."
(bang-bang!)
jw
David Kilpatrick
posted a request for help on uk.music.folk -
"At that time he played an old Gibson J45, the front of which had been
stripped of varnish. He strung it with Framus Black Rose strings,
which were wound with flat copper tape, and played without fingernails.
The result is a very soft sound, which you might well take for nylon,
especially if you don't have a good copy of the record.
I have heard that Anji was actually originated by Bert Jansch, who
played it in a session with Davy and Archie Fisher. Davy subsequently
recorded the tune first, and therefore got the credit for it, but all
three continued to play it. I've not heard any previous tune which
Anji might be descended from, but I wouldn't be surprised.
Phil Taylor"
I know that Graham now plays classical and lute, so maybe this would lead to
thoughts that he might have been playing classical then. Tape-wound Framus
strings...
Archie Fisher is another of our locals but I have never spoken to him,
despite running a folk club and Archie doing the main folk programme on
Radio Scotland and living in the next town up the Tweed. He might know.
DK
>>
>
>
Weed42
> David Kilpatrick <icon...@btconnect.com> wrote in message
> news:BC35EF85.B385%icon...@btconnect.com...
> > On 22/1/04 6:58 pm, in article
> > J3VPb.19687$q4....@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net, "John Wasak"
> > <mr...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> >
> > > David Kilpatrick <icon...@btconnect.com> wrote
> > >>>> It's actually based on a Charlie Mingus jazz
> > >>>> solo rather than being English folk-blues
> > > Mingus... compostions "Haitian Fight Song' and 'Goodbye Pork-Pie Hat'
other jazz compositions played by the mid-60s UK "folk-baroque"
guitarists included Davy Graham's versions of Bobby Timmons "Moanin'"
and Mingus' "Better Git It In Your Soul", and Bert Jansch's "Smokey
River" (based on Jimmy Giuffre's "The Train and the River") -
according to contemporary album covers, DG's influences included
Charlie Parker, Theolonius Monk, & Miles Davis, and Bert Jansch was
influenced by Chico Hamilton, Gil Evans and John Lewis
but returning to an earlier part of the thread...
>>>>>> Mark Lybrand <mary...@shore.net> wrote:
>> [blues] you need at the very least a steel string acoustic
true if you're talking about hard electric Blues (Howling Wolf, Buddy
Guy, BB King etc) but certainly not true for acoustic blues
slides bends 'twangs' and damping are all available on a standard
classical, together with much greater effective control over variation
in tone - and it's in the contrasts that are possible, such as moving
from a stinging sharpness to a mellow softness within the phrase, that
it really comes into its own
it takes practice to get it to 'howl' and 'growl' and 'whine' and
'snap' effectively, but it can be done - same with "Anji"... i've been
playing it on nylon strings for over 30 years, and it's always the
piece which draws the "ooh!"s and "ahh!"s (some of them from me, as i
break yet another nail)
PS Bert was rumoured to substitute a banjo string for one of nylon
ones
incidently i saw Bert Jansch, John Renbourn and Davy Graham all
playing at the Cambridge (UK) folk festival in 1994 (tho not together)
- Davy Graham gave a wonderfully relaxing performance on a lazy summer
afternoon, charming the audience with a wide range of pieces including
classical, jazz, blues and folk music from around the world
Weed
William D Clinger
> John still plays Goodbye PPH at almost every concert.
When Renbourn played it at Club Passim a couple of years back, he
told a fairly long, funny, and self-deprecating story about how he
and Bert Jansch learned it by ear off a record, with a "that'll be
close enough" attitude. The story ended with his introduction to
Mingus years later, when Mingus said some things he'd been saving
for the occasion.
:)
In the workshop earlier that day, Renbourn played a little from
one of Bach's cello suites, on a guitar tuned CGDGAD or some such
so four of the guitar's strings would duplicate the cello's tuning.
Will