Please discuss.
<http://www.delcamp.net/forum/en/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=46141>
Rob
My bridge is domed, but it's not domed at the highest point of the dome, the
actual high point lays 1.5 inches or less below the bridge. I presume the
doming of the bridge is built into it in as much as it is quite noticeable.
In fact, I don't believe that the bridge would dome as much as it does
unless it was built into it.
That said, I'm not sure Pinkham planned this in copying Romanillos or not.
I read your post and remembered realizing at some point that this instrument
is domed. Like I mentioned, I've no idea if this helps you or not but ,
well, maybe it does.
I can tell you that this guitar has a very balanced tone with a crisp treble
side and a non percussive base. It has fan bracing.
Charlie
Charlie
"Tashi" <dewach...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:eb8ea8dc-1732-4708...@d9g2000prh.googlegroups.com...
Regards,
John J van Gool, luthier
http://www.lutherie-van-gool.nl
Romanillos' book on torres is here
On page 113 he discusses doming in detail. According to Romanillos in
summary, Torres used a scooped solera and shaped the struts, harmonic
bars and solid lining to produce a fully domed top, not just an arched
bridge.
RNJ
John,
In order to get the best coupling, is there a good technique for
getting the base of the bridge to perfectly match the domed top?
Thanks in advance, Olegario
Viewed from the end of the guitar, the soundboard bridge is arched
about 3mm at the at the level of the bridge.
The workboard rises from the area just in front of the bridge ....
toward the butt and the hips just below the waist.
Here is a picture of a such a workboard.
http://ganzguitars.com/workboard/ljrboard2.jpg
The sides are built around the top, which is cut to exact size and
shape before it goes onto the workboard.
And after the guitar comes out of the rig, it looks like this....
http://ganzguitars.com/JK/jimK/P5280383.JPG
You can see how much the top is domed from the protruding sides....
Did Torres do it that way?
No jigs remain. However, that is Jose's conception of the top....
which I think gets to your question.
I hope that's clear enough. Let me know if you have followups.
Steve Ganz(anillos)
Thanks Rob, I took a look at that , but it seemed more to do with the
Tornovoz than doming the soundboard.
John, I make only domed tops, and use a dished out form as well. I
was just doing some reading up on Torres, and while I was familiar
with what Romanilios writes about how Torres domed his tops I came
across another book that stated Torres achieved the dome by simply
gluing an arched bridge to a flat top. I thought to myself this is
not what I call domed, so I was wondering more about the terminology
of "domed" tops, versus simply an arched top.
Steve thanks! Very interesting! I haven't built guitars in the
Spanish style for 30 years, unless one conceders Fleta building in the
Spanish style. Romanillios classifies Fleta, and Freidrich as French
in style.
I to use a dished out form, which is domed only in the lower bout as
you describe, however, I've never see this method that you use before,
very interesting and it makes a lot of sense, if you build in the
Spanish style.
I've never examined a Torres before, but I have made detailed plans
of a 37 Santos. Santos also domed his tops. It always mystified me
as to how Santos ( who used continuous solid linings) was able to pre
shape the sides with the linings already glued in to fit the domed
top, very difficult and time consuming.
It seems that your method only works if you use the
"tetelonies" (sp?) , but Torres used this method only on a handful of
his guitars, the vast majority had continuous kerfed linings, or am I
missing something?
Thanks Richard, I have that book. Yesterday I went to "La Chozas" for
lunch had enchiladas with red chile, and read through Romanlios book
on Torres, to get a refresher on this.
To bad there isn't a better book written on this genius we call
Torres.
This method works with kerfed linings, gluing in sections between the
harmonic bars and at the deflection point in the lower bout. (Done
that 1 time.) I'm not sure about the dentelones being rare. There
are pictures of both in the "the book". The separate little teeth add
two to three hours to a guitar. Might they be worth it?
I also don't always build in the spanish style. I often build the
body separately from the neck. I only started with the spanish style
with Jose, and while I love it, I still build more with the neck
separate method.
I don't think that there is any one individual who has seen more
Torres guitars than Jose. . I'd guess that there are a few who might
come close in the number of Torres guitars inspected, but being able
(and willing) to write about it....another thing entirely! His books
are a team effort between him and his wife Marian.
Here is an interesting idea.
Let's buy a single Torres guitar, deconstruct it, write about it.
Sell that guitar. Repeat.
Publish after several guitars.
SG
Without looking it up, I believe out of all Torres guitars, maybe
five or six had Tentelones, as I remember from reading yesterday
Romanillos's Torres book.
> I also don't always build in the spanish style. I often build the
> body separately from the neck. I only started with the spanish style
> with Jose, and while I love it, I still build more with the neck
> separate method.
Ha Ha , now I want to try the Spanish method for a change. Just on
the Torres style guitars though. I still have reservations about the
Spanish method.
> I don't think that there is any one individual who has seen more
> Torres guitars than Jose. . I'd guess that there are a few who might
> come close in the number of Torres guitars inspected, but being able
> (and willing) to write about it....another thing entirely! His books
> are a team effort between him and his wife Marian.
Defiantly a good thing, but compared to the quality of books written
on Stradvari, Rominillios falls short of a scholarly work, someone
needs to pick up where he left off.
>
> Here is an interesting idea.
> Let's buy a single Torres guitar, deconstruct it, write about it.
> Sell that guitar. Repeat.
> Publish after several guitars.
>
> SG
I don't think you will find anyone willing to do that.
John L.
What do you think you gain by continuing the dome into the upper bout?
Two things. Slight elevation under the FB extension makes the higher
frets more accessible (not as much as a raised FB, though), and
Aesthetically I like the look. It always struck me with Al's guitars
how elegant they look, and I think the domed top is definitely a
factor.
SG,
If a CG is not built in the Spanish style, does that mean it is built
similar to a streel string guitar with a neck block that uses either a
dovetail or a mortise & tenon joint?
Yes.
Thanks.
Ed,
Essentially yes. (Although many steel string luthiers also build in
the spanish style, that is less common than separate body and neck in
steel string guitars.)
SG