Segovia's guitars: How big?
JCBENFIELD
into their musical instruments collection (not up there with the Smithsonian's,
by the way).
But there sat Segovia's early Ramierz and Hauser guitars!! What surprised me
is that they looked smaller than the concert sized guitars made by Ramierz that
I have seen serious guitarists play.
Did Segovia play on a large Ramierz later in his career.
Obviously, I coudn't get my hands on the two guitars at the Met, but they
really appeared rather small in size.
Comments?
Jim Benfield
Jim Benfield
http://www.coincoalition.org
GuitarsWeB
>
I saw Segovia on April 2 play at Pasadena, California.. I think it was his
second to last concert. Who out there knows? He was playing a cedar top
Ramirez..I'm sure it was a 665mm scale. Who out there knows? Who out there
cares?
Paul
John Saldivar
Miguel of Cordoba) guitar which was 650 string length and he can be seen
playing in the book "Segovia Technique" by Vladimir Bobri. He also had 2
Fletas that were 650mm. I am not sure what scale the Hauser's were. I think
650 for both the 37' Hauser and the later model that Hauser II made for him
as well. The 1912 (Manuel Ramirez (Santos Hernandez) he played was also
650mm. The Jose Ramirez was larger and in my opinion louder but not
necessarily better in sound. Like Julian Bream, David Russell, Yamashita,
Barrueco and Angel Romero, No matter what guitar they play, they will always
have their own distinct sound. John Williams on the other hand, lost
something when he stopped playing Fleta and Hernandez y Aguado guitars.
Smallman does not have the same separation and Bass power that the Fleat had
even with today's recording technology. Just my 2 cents.
"GuitarsWeB" <guita...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20001112224814...@ng-fe1.aol.com...
David Schramm
modified to a 6 string. You can read all about it in R.E.Brune's article in
American Lutherie #40, plan #38. Mr. Brune has extensive photos and structural
measurements in the article. You can even order a copy of the guitar plans. Chances
are very good that the scale is 650mm, although I do not believe it is mentioned in
the plans.
You can also read about Segovia's 1937 Hauser and order a copy of the plans from
GAL.Issue#31, plan #33. This one is a 650 scale.Body size and depth of both
instruments are pretty much normal. Nothing out of the ordinary.
See my links page to the "Guild of American Luthiers" off my web page
http://schrammguitars.com/links.html
GuitarsWeB
Paul McGuffin
Barry
I was in New York recently and viewed the same guitars...and took some
photos. If you want me to send them to you, let me know. However, it's
tough to tell the size of the guitars from the photos. I didn't think they
were small when I viewed them....but I'm not sure which Ramirez you're
comparing them to. By the way, is it one of these guitars that Chris
Parkening used on one of his CD's (Tribute to Segovia). If I recall, he
used one of Segovia's guitars on at least one CD...and I believe it was
loaned to him by a museum.
Barry
"JCBENFIELD" <jcben...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20001112223354...@ng-fm1.aol.com...
Sharon
<flyf...@humboldt1.com> wrote:
|>comparing them to. By the way, is it one of these guitars that Chris
|>Parkening used on one of his CD's (Tribute to Segovia). If I recall, he
|>used one of Segovia's guitars on at least one CD...and I believe it was
|>loaned to him by a museum.
That's correct, it was used on the EMI/Angel recording, "A
Tribute to Segovia'" The guitar was one of Segovia's
concert instruments, and was loaned to him by Amalia
Ramirez.
Sharon
Secretary to Christopher Parkening
http://www.parkening.com
Mark Westling
from the letter in the case from Segovia. It reads:
==============
November 24, 1986
The Metropolitan Museum of Art
Fifth Avenue
New York, New York
Gentlemen:
The two guitars that my wife is glad to donate to The Metropolitan Museum of
Art in New York were built, the first, in Madrid, by the "Luthier" attached
to the City conservatory, Manual Ramirez, in the year 1912, and the second,
in Munich, Germany, by Hermann Hauser, in 1937.
I have played on both, simultaneously, during the most important period of
my career. Both have helped me to convince musicians, critics, and the
general public that the guitar, for the deep poetry of its sound and its
polyphonic capabilities, deserved to ascend to the high level of the violin,
piano, etc.
Up to the middle of the nineteenth century, with Sor, Giuliani, and other
lesser virtuosos, the guitar had won a good musical reputation, but later on
it had sadly fallen into oblivion. I had to rescue it from its mundane
folkloric captivity.
Now, with hearts full of gratitude, and in consideration of the affection
that this wonderful country has demonstrated to us, I am extremely happy
that my wife, by her own initiative, is offering these two guitars to this
wonderful institution.
It is her wish that these two instruments remain secluded in their own
permanent display case in The Andre Mertens Galleries for Musical
Instruments, to avoid that awkward hands willingly or unwillingly may damage
them.
I will finish by giving our most sincere thanks to Mr. Lawrence Libin, the
learned Curator of the museum instrument collection, and to the honorable
Director of the Museum, Mr. Philippe de Montebello for his kind acceptance
of this modest gift.
Sincerely,
(signature)
Andres Segovia
Marquis de Salobrena
(signature)
Emilita Segovia
Marquesa de Salobrena
CLASSICAL GUITARS
Whether made in Spain, or inspired by Spanish models, classical guitars have
become familiar worldwide thanks to the late Andres Segovia, one of this
century's foremost performing artists. Segovia built his career with the
help of these two cherished guitars, which were given to the Museum by his
wife the year before his death. Heard by millions of listeners in live
concerts and recordings, these guitars profoundly affected the course of
music appreciation.
1. (Left) This rosewood, spruce, and mahogany guitar was played by Andres
Segovia when he launched his career; he concertized and recorded with it
from 1912 to 1937, and he played it in his United States debut at New York's
Town Hall in 1929. Its renowned maker was employed at Spain's National
Conservatory of Music. Manual Ramirez, Madrid, 1912.
Gift of Emilita Segovia, Marquesa of Salobrena, 1986
2. (Right) Based on the model of Ramirez, this rosewood, spruce and mahogany
guitar was played by Segovia from 1937 to 1962. Segovia's patronage helped
establish the reputation of the maker, who also repaired Segovia's Ramirez
guitar. Hermann Hauser, Munich, 1937.
Gift of Emilita Segovia, Marquesa of Salobrena, 1986
============
"Barry" <flyf...@humboldt1.com> wrote in message
news:t0va3q8...@corp.supernews.com...
> Jim..
> I was in New York recently and viewed the same guitars...and took some
> photos. If you want me to send them to you, let me know. However, it's
> tough to tell the size of the guitars from the photos. I didn't think
they
> were small when I viewed them....but I'm not sure which Ramirez you're
> comparing them to. By the way, is it one of these guitars that Chris
> Parkening used on one of his CD's (Tribute to Segovia). If I recall, he
> used one of Segovia's guitars on at least one CD...and I believe it was
> loaned to him by a museum.
>
> Barry
>
> "JCBENFIELD" <jcben...@aol.com> wrote in message
> news:20001112223354...@ng-fm1.aol.com...
John Wasak
From these planks of wood,
these boxes built for sound,
Segovian notes
flow no more,
encased
in this
glass
like
sentinel reliquaries.
genuflectors pass,
the unknowing pass unknowingly,
all in the deep, deep silence
of the Muscial Instrument room.
In this Sundays New York Times there was an article about the Boston MFA
"Dangerous Curves" guitar exhibit. It was noted that only one of the Met's
guitars found it's way into that show. Also noted was that neither of
Segovia's two guitars that the Met has went up to Boston. It seems that
Segovia's widow has stipulated that Segovia's guitars never leave the Met or
get played.
JW
Mark Westling <mwes...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:TPUP5.14155$U4.7...@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
Barry
I'm glad you did the transcription as the photo I took of the
writing/description did not turn out well enough to read.
Barry
"Mark Westling" <mwes...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:TPUP5.14155$U4.7...@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
Barry
"John Wasak" <mr...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:D5WP5.14202$Gd7.7...@newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
>
> From these planks of wood,
> these boxes built for sound,
> Segovian notes
> flow no more,
> encased
> in this
> glass
> like
> sentinel reliquaries.
> genuflectors pass,
> the unknowing pass unknowingly,
> all in the deep, deep silence
> of the Muscial Instrument room.
Very nice....
Barry
JCBENFIELD
> I was in New York recently and viewed the same guitars...and took some
>photos. If you want me to send them to you, let me know.
Thanks for your offer, but I was curious when they appeared to be smaller than
the "concert" sized Ramirez I have seen the Romeros play. My hands are not
that large; I have an old Conde Hermanos.
I know Segovia had huge chops, so I was surprised to see guitars that
resembled my relatively small Conde rather than the larger conert versions.
Jim Benfield
JCBENFIELD
>Segovia's widow has stipulated that Segovia's guitars never leave the Met or
>get played.
The sure death of a fine instrument -- which is why the Library of Congress has
the Juilliard String Quartet regularly play their museum Strads at concerts.
Jim Benfield
Mark Westling
guitars never leave the Met or get played." ???
Apparently, one of the guitars was checked out of the museum by Chris
Parkening for his "Tribute to Segovia" CD...
Mark
"JCBENFIELD" <jcben...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20001115220707...@ng-me1.aol.com...
Sharon
<mwes...@earthlink.net> wrote:
|>How is this known, i.e. that Emilita Segovia "has stipulated that Segovia's
|>guitars never leave the Met or get played." ???
|>
|>Apparently, one of the guitars was checked out of the museum by Chris
|>Parkening for his "Tribute to Segovia" CD...
Th guitar Mr. Parkening used did not come from this Met
collection. It came from the Ramirez family.
And yes, Emilita will not let most of Segovia's guitars out
on loan. A shame, isn't it?
John Wasak
> How is this known, i.e. that Emilita Segovia "has stipulated that
Segovia's
> guitars never leave the Met or get played." ???
>
> Apparently, one of the guitars was checked out of the museum by Chris
> Parkening for his "Tribute to Segovia" CD...
>
In an article about the current guitar exhibition at the Museum of Fine Arts
in Boston, David D'Arcy wrote in The New York Times on Sunday, November 12,
2000:
"The Metropolitan Museum of Art in New York, which lent one guitar, owns
more than 50, including two donated by Segovia that are not part of the
Boston show, in accordance with his widow's wishes that they never be played
again or shown outside the Met."
CP's tribute to Segovia didn't use the Met's Ramirez.
JW
Sharon
<mr...@earthlink.net> wrote:
|>"The Metropolitan Museum of Art in New York, which lent one guitar, owns
|>more than 50, including two donated by Segovia that are not part of the
|>Boston show, in accordance with his widow's wishes that they never be played
|>again or shown outside the Met."
|>
|>CP's tribute to Segovia didn't use the Met's Ramirez.
That is correct. He used one loaned to him by Amalia
Ramirez, which Maestro Segovia played at a few competitions.
Patrick Read
she was over-protective of the Maestro. Wouldn't let anyone in to see him. One
day Emilia left the house in Madrid and Segovia called Ernesto on the phone to
come on over. Ernesto went and they spent the day talking. When Emilia came
back Ernesto had to sneak out.
Sharon wrote:
> On Thu, 16 Nov 2000 04:42:56 GMT, "Mark Westling"
> <mwes...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>
> |>How is this known, i.e. that Emilita Segovia "has stipulated that Segovia's
> |>guitars never leave the Met or get played." ???
> |>
> |>Apparently, one of the guitars was checked out of the museum by Chris
> |>Parkening for his "Tribute to Segovia" CD...
>
> Th guitar Mr. Parkening used did not come from this Met
> collection. It came from the Ramirez family.
>
> And yes, Emilita will not let most of Segovia's guitars out
> on loan. A shame, isn't it?
>
Patrick Read
sort narrowed down at the tip. Once he let me look closely at both hands (he
thought it was funny that I would ask to see them--as if they were the secret of
his playing!) and it seemed to me that they would fit nicely on a full-sized
fingerboard.
Patrick Read