Lute woods

[JPD]

I know I could find a lute group somewhere and ask these questions,
but RMCG can always use more grist.

I've been researching beginner (cheap) lutes. I see used lutes online
for a few hundred dollars, usually from an outfit called Roosebeck,
These have spruce tops and rosewood bowls, necks, and bridges.
Sometimes the bowls are chinar (never heard of it) or lacewood.
Sometimes they are rosewood combined with lacewood or chinar.

My question is about the wood for the bowl. I've seen lists of the
bowl woods that are often used -- maple, yew, cherry, ash, pear -- but
there's little discussion of how these woods affect the sound. I get
the impression that as long as the wood is fairly hard they'll all
sound about the same, and the rest is just visuals.

Does that sound right?

[thomas]

With an instrument that cheap, getting a good sounding one involves luck more important than wood.

[Dick Cheney]

I was thinking of getting a lute a few years back, and did a lot of
reading, but no buying.... if I remember those lutes are made in India
by Indians. Kind of like the Paracho guitars, but not as fine tuned-
good luck. I think Daniel Larson makes pretty good affordable lutes
(relatively speaking). http://www.gamutstrings.com/catalog.html

[JPD]

No doubt. All the cheap ones are rosewood, it seems. But there are
expensive ones made with rosewood, too, as well as some historical
ones.

I'm still curious about the aural effects to be expected from
different bowl woods. In guitars, for example, I enjoy the subtler,
warmer effect of Indian rosewood over the harder ring of Brazilian. So
what does a pearwood bowl sound like compared with, say, maple? Or yew
versus ash? I wonder if there are some well-known generalizations
about these woods when they are used for lute bowls.

[JPD]

Intriguing instruments on the Larson site. I could pay $4k, but not
without cuddling up with it first. But I could pay a few hundred for a
blind date.

[Dick Cheney]

Even if she's 80 years old?

[JPD]

I think that's about 19 in lute years.

[Tom Gwilt]

On 11/29/2012 1:15 AM, JPD wrote:

>>>> I was thinking of getting a lute a few years back, and did a lot of
>>>> reading, but no buying.... if I remember those lutes are made in India
>>>> by Indians. Kind of like the Paracho guitars, but not as fine tuned-
>>>> good luck. I think Daniel Larson makes pretty good affordable lutes
>>>> (relatively speaking).http://www.gamutstrings.com/catalog.html
>>
>>> Intriguing instruments on the Larson site. I could pay $4k, but not
>>> without cuddling up with it first. But I could pay a few hundred for a
>>> blind date.

Do yourself a favor and avoid the $300 - $600 lutes. I actually
purchased one on ebay a few years ago. It was very poorly made. The neck
was warped to the point that any string played below the 2nd fret just
buzzed. The poor craftsmanship - no, that word is not fit to be in the
same sentence as the so called 'luthiers' who polished this turd.

I have an 8 course Frie lute on order with Mr. Larson. Looking forward
to its arrival soon. I met Dan at the Lute Society of America's summer
symposium in Cleveland. He is a very nice person and his lutes are very
much worth the money. I think they are a bargain.

I eventually gave the POS lute away while on a blind date with an 80
year old. She used it as kindling.

[wollybird]

And they're made in Duluth (or as Delcamp says Dudluth), so they must be good. My old teacher had him make a baroque guitar for him. Simple and unadorned, but it cost only $1,0000 or so. He was very pleased with it.

[thomas]

On Thursday, November 29, 2012 8:12:48 AM UTC-5, wollybird wrote:
>
> And they're made in Duluth (or as Delcamp says Dudluth),

Dude, you are so banned.

[Alan Turing]

this made me chuckle.


indian Sitars often use Burma Teak, a very expensive wood that has
been seasoned and then resonates incredibly.


--
-AlanTuring

[Dick Cheney]

but it's right here- http://www.delcamp.net/liens/luthiers.htm
"Daniel Larson Lutes, vihuelas and historic guitars, Dudluth MN"

[thomas]

Nobody likes someone who's right. Banned!

[Dick Cheney]

On Nov 29, 5:01 pm, thomas <drthomasfbr...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Thursday, November 29, 2012 5:59:14 PM UTC-5, Dick Cheney wrote:
> > On Nov 29, 10:11 am, thomas <drthomasfbr...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Thursday, November 29, 2012 8:12:48 AM UTC-5, wollybird wrote:
>
> > > > And they're made in Duluth (or as Delcamp says Dudluth),
>
> > > Dude, you are so banned.
>

> > but it's right here-http://www.delcamp.net/liens/luthiers.htm

>
> > "Daniel Larson Lutes, vihuelas and historic guitars, Dudluth MN"
>
> Nobody likes someone who's right. Banned!

what ever. I always fell asleep trying to read those mundane posts
anyway.

[dewach...@gmail.com]

When was that...... 20 years ago?

[dewach...@gmail.com]

Yes, they banned me for that very reason!

[dewach...@gmail.com]

Why don't you sign yer self up on the lute list and inquire there? They can help you out mo better than here. There are probably a wealth of lutes for sale privately over there, from guitarists who were bitten by the lute bug, then got disillusioned and frustrated with pegs and double courses, and dealing with tone production with no nails............. Just remember one thing...... you get what you pay for.

One thing I would suggest is if you want a ren lute avoid the rosewoods, as rosewood is not a traditional wood used to make ren lutes. However, if you want a baroque lute, which I think you don't, rosewood was used occasionally for those. The cheaper lutes won't feature rosewood anyway. If you have a big budget you can get one made from Ivory, they made quite a few of these back in the day.

For a ren lute rosewood tends to make them a bit brighter sounding which at least to my ears is undesirable, unless of course you like the old Bream lute recordings and want to sound like that, but I think you want to sound like Nigel North.

Perhaps email Nigel and ask if any of his students have lutes for sale.

[JPD]

You're right, I don't want the Bream sound. Lately, I'm liking David
Tayler's sound. It's a single-string course arch lute, of course, so
that rules out "cheap." Oh well.

Here's Tayler playing Tarleton. (I know, too much echo, but even
so....) He loves the sound of his instrument. I wish more guitarists
would understand what this means.

http://www.guitarist.com/blog/?p=1254

[dewach...@gmail.com]

Hum..... a lot of strings but you only need six. I find myself wanting to light a match under his butt, to get him to speed it up a little.

Here is my idea of the ultimate 6 course lute sound, a very delicate plucked sound. The music of that time is so simple, yet profound.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8P5CTlGadE

[JPD]

I like Zakai's playing and choice of music a lot. I put this very
video of her on the blog last Spring, in fact.

[dewach...@gmail.com]

She is wonderful! Even makes me want to play lute again.