pronounce Lamonte Young and Steve Reich
Colin Broom
"Tom J" <t...@TheWorld.com> wrote in message news:GMyvy...@world.std.com...
> Hi. I thought "Steve Reich" was pronounced steve r-i[long]-sh. Is
> that right?
> Also, Isn't Lamonte Young just pronounced
> Lamont'?
> A freshman on local radio is pronouncing them funnily
> (Rike and Lamon't-uh), but
> kudos for playing the music in Boston in the first place.
Reich is indeed pronounced as you guessed, "Reish". The pronouncing of it
as in the German third "Reich" is incorrect, and given his Religious
background, I think he might object to such a pronounciation!
La Monte is just pronounced as in the word "lament" but obviously with "o"
rather than "e".
Colin.
Tech Support: "I need you to boot the computer."
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Colin Broom, composer
e-mail: colin.broom@Cb7#9strath.ac.uk
(To reply, omit the Cb7#9 chord from the e-mail address)
Invention Ensemble: www.inventionensemble.com
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John L
<colin.broom@Cb7#9strath.ac.uk> wrote:
>Reich is indeed pronounced as you guessed, "Reish". The pronouncing of it
>as in the German third "Reich" is incorrect, and given his Religious
>background, I think he might object to such a pronounciation!
I'm sure the BBC pronunciation at the time he first became known was
Rike, so that's how I always hear/read it now.
As in Wilhelm (the orgone box fellah). And Theodore also.
Maybe this was the approved counter-cultural pronunciation to avoid
the thousand year association?
"Reish" is a bit of a copout, softening the sound (velar fricative?)
we don't have in English rather than hardening it.
John L
marcel raman
John L <jo...@zahidjohn.plus.com> schreef in berichtnieuws
>
> >Reich is indeed pronounced as you guessed, "Reish". The
pronouncing of it
> >as in the German third "Reich" is incorrect, and given his
Religious
> >background, I think he might object to such a pronounciation!
Oh? Are the Hebrew (and Yiddish) "Chet" and "Khof" forbidden since
1945?
Changes the whole chazanout (pronounce: shazanout) isn't it?
Le-"sh"aïm!
--
marcel raman
http://surf.to/litweb
--
cp:Xenakis: S.709
Colin Broom
"John L" <jo...@zahidjohn.plus.com> wrote in message
news:3bf70a3...@usenet.plus.net...
> I'm sure the BBC pronunciation at the time he first became known was
> Rike, so that's how I always hear/read it now.
>
> As in Wilhelm (the orgone box fellah). And Theodore also.
>
> Maybe this was the approved counter-cultural pronunciation to avoid
> the thousand year association?
>
> "Reish" is a bit of a copout, softening the sound (velar fricative?)
> we don't have in English rather than hardening it.
"Reish" is how I have heard members of his ensemble pronounce it, so I'm
assuming that's right.
J. Simon van der Walt
> "Reish" is how I have heard members of his ensemble pronounce it, so I'm
> assuming that's right.
>
How much had they had to drink?
--
J. Simon van der Walt
Composer
<http://www.jsimonvanderwalt.com>
Colin Broom
"J. Simon van der Walt" <j.s...@jsvdw.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in message
news:1f339ky.y4nngy13whkowN%j.s...@jsvdw.freeserve.co.uk...
> Colin Broom <colin.broom@Cb7#9strath.ac.uk> wrote:
>
>
> > "Reish" is how I have heard members of his ensemble pronounce it, so I'm
> > assuming that's right.
> >
>
> How much had they had to drink?
I don't know, but their playing was all out of phase the whole way through!
And what about the drug use? I'm told they do eight lines at every concert!
;-)
M.E.A.
I've heard also some waiters in US restaurants serving pizza and
pronouncing it like "pee-sah". The fact they're working in a
restaurant doesn't guarantee they comply with correct pronounce....
So, I never met members of Reich's ensemble personally, but having
seen the video of "City Life" with Reich's interview I can tell you
that many people are pronouncing "Reich" in the video as Simon told
you (e.g. like Wilhelm Reich)
Should we maybe ask Beryl how she call him? ;-)
Cheers,
M.E.A.
Robert Davidson
get cross if people say "Rike".
Pizza is pronounced "pisa" in some parts of Italy, such as Bologna for
example.
Robert Davidson
"M.E.A." <no...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:be51b4fa.01111...@posting.google.com...
Herb Levy
given language. There are frequent regional and family distinctions
that supercede the standard pronunciation.
Perhaps the most widely known (at least in the context of this
newsgroup) example of this would be Pierre Boulez' last name, which
does not conform to standard French pronunciation.
If Reich says his name is pronounced "Riesh," regardless what various
BBC announcers etc have previously said, they're simply wrong.
--
Herb Levy
< http://www.antennaradio.com/avant/mappings/ >
Mappings P O Box 9369 Forth Wort, TX 76147
Steve Layton
"Herb Levy" <he...@eskimau.invalid> wrote in message
news:191120012150282633%he...@eskimau.invalid...
> Names aren't always pronounced the way they're "supposed" to be in any
> given language. There are frequent regional and family distinctions
> that supercede the standard pronunciation.
>
> Perhaps the most widely known (at least in the context of this
> newsgroup) example of this would be Pierre Boulez' last name, which
> does not conform to standard French pronunciation.
>
> If Reich says his name is pronounced "Riesh," regardless what various
> BBC announcers etc have previously said, they're simply wrong.
Herb's right. If you hear somebody's own way of saying their name, make the
effort to use it. (You'd like the same treatment with your own name, right?)
Of course:
A loooooong time ago, when I was a kid & looking at Russian stuff, I became
convinced that it must be "Shos-TAK-o-vich"...ouch... In Spain, Levis
(LEE-vais) are "LAY-bis". Schönberg becomes "Shoahnburrgh" in the US, but
since I don't have problems with the umlaut, I'll keep giving him his
original vowel (and go for the "Bayerdg" at the end, as well). Northern
Germany's "ch" is the strong gutteral "chk" sound; Southern Germany has the
soft "sh" sound for the same. ...And just listen to a guy from Maine and a
guy from California pronounce "Bernstein"... And the composer who just got
the McArthur Grant, Bright Sheng; how many of you say "Shayng"? "Shuhng"?
"Jung"?...
Steve Layton
http://www.niwo.com/
http://artist.amazon.com/stevelayton
M.E.A.
> Reich is definitely "Reish" according to the man himself, though he doesn't
> get cross if people say "Rike".
>
I fully agree that we have to go with the pronounce >he< uses. I just
had no occasion to listen it.
> Pizza is pronounced "pisa" in some parts of Italy, such as Bologna for
> example.
>
Sorry Robert, but here I have to disagree since I'm italian (and I
live in Italy).
I can assure you that the >italian< correct pronounce is NOT "pisa".
You could hear some variations due to local >dialects<, of course, but
this has not to be considered "right pronounce".
By the way, I hardly heard any US guy able to correctly pronounce
"pizza" because it contains the sound of doubled consonant "zz" that
is not used in english. The more similar, but still wrong, pronounce
I've heard is like the one of an italian reading the word "piza", that
is the english reading of the word "peetza", if you prefer.
Cheers,
M.E.A.
Robert Davidson
consonant is pronounced as in Aix in Aix-en-Provence)?
Robert Davidson
"Herb Levy" <he...@eskimau.invalid> wrote in message
news:191120012150282633%he...@eskimau.invalid...
Samuel Vriezen
wrote:
>Names aren't always pronounced the way they're "supposed" to be in any
>given language. There are frequent regional and family distinctions
>that supercede the standard pronunciation.
>
>Perhaps the most widely known (at least in the context of this
>newsgroup) example of this would be Pierre Boulez' last name, which
>does not conform to standard French pronunciation.
>
>If Reich says his name is pronounced "Riesh," regardless what various
>BBC announcers etc have previously said, they're simply wrong.
However, I find it patently ugly, this American approximation of one
of the most beautiful sounds in the German language. I'd far prefer
'Rike' to 'Reish'. I think I generally try to be as close to the
German as possible, when I invoke this entity.
--
Samuel
*** Shameless self-promotion tag ***
'Toccata III': fast music for two Glockenspiele; and works by Ruediger Meyer, D. Ricketson, L. Andriessen
and others by Claire Edwardes and Niels Meliefste, percussion at 'Concerten XXVII: Percussion Party'
Dec 2, 20:30 Posthoornkerk Amsterdam, Haarlemmer Houttuinen 47, entrance on back (railroad) side of church
Joseph Henry
>Perhaps the most widely known (at least in the context of this
>newsgroup) example of this would be Pierre Boulez' last name, which
>does not conform to standard French pronunciation.
Thank God I can't pronounce French correctly. I've always gotten his name
right.
There was once a time, however, that I pronounced "György Ligeti" as if the
first name were Russian ("Giorgi") and the last name Italian ("Lighetti")!
Joseph Henry
John L
<dal...@speakeasy.org> wrote:
>Herb's right. If you hear somebody's own way of saying their name, make the
>effort to use it. (You'd like the same treatment with your own name, right?)
Indeed I would, but I fear people sometimes give up ever hearing their
name pronounced as they would wish and go with the flow.
Another example: I understand that David del Tredici accepts and uses
the Americanised prononciation of his name with stress on the second
syllable (Tray-DEE-chee) but quite likes it when someone pronounces it
like the Italian for 13.
John L
Samuel Vriezen
<dal...@speakeasy.org> wrote:
>Herb's right. If you hear somebody's own way of saying their name, make the
>effort to use it. (You'd like the same treatment with your own name, right?)
Depends. If my name would have been Geurt de Bruin, I think at most
ten percent of you guys would have been even remotely capable of
getting it right. I don't care. My Turkish friends used to call me
something like 'Shahmu-ale'. You probably would refer to me as
'Sehm-ewel' or something like that - not quite the Dutch pronunciation
I use. In fact, I tend to Americanize Dutch names (where possible) in
regular conversation with Americans - I wouldn't try to make a point
of pronouncing my friend Rozalie's name with all-too-Dutch Rs and As,
for example.
J. Simon van der Walt
say van (as in lorry) de(r) (not rolled) Walt (as in Disney). If people
ask me how it should be pronounced I tell them that it's Afrikaans
(originally Netherlands, Frisian), and it should be something like fun
der (rolled r) fult, but that the Anglicised version is fine.
--
J. Simon van der Walt
Composer
<http://www.jsimonvanderwalt.com>
Colin Broom
LIgeti (emphasis on the first syllable), while others have pronounced it
liGETi (emphasis on the second syllable). I myself have on different
occasions used each, but does anyone know which one is correct?
Colin.
Tech Support: "I need you to boot the computer."
Customer: (THUMP! Pause.) "No, that didn't help."
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Colin Broom, composer
e-mail: colin.broom@Cb7#9strath.ac.uk
(To reply, omit the Cb7#9 chord from the e-mail address)
Invention Ensemble: www.inventionensemble.com
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----------------------------
> Herb's right. If you hear somebody's own way of saying their name, make
Nacho Rodríguez
Hungary this summer...). But if you want to be very careful, you should
notice also that the "e" is really very open sounding...
Nacho
Nacho Rodríguez
last "y". Gy it's a digraph, a two letters combination for one sound,
something near the "j" in John, more or less. And so, there is only one
syllabus, with this "ö" like the German one (and short!).
Nacho
Myron Stackpool
Back in college I had a Hungarian room mate. I asked him how to pronounce György
Ligeti: for the first name, just use the English George; the last name rhymes
with spaghetti (American pronunciation). I suspect he was being somewhat curt
with me (I'm 100% geek, and he held classical music, particularly contemporary
stuff, in imperfect esteem), and the pronunciation my profs used was something
like LIH-gitty (which I guess is more accurate).
Do I have things almost correct?
Also, for another Hungarian name, how about Kurtag?
The Head of the family, so to speak.
Varga Gyorgy
> Nacho Rodríguez says...
> >
> >And about the name, György, it's a common mistake to try to pronounce the
> >last "y". Gy it's a digraph, a two letters combination for one sound,
> >something near the "j" in John, more or less. And so, there is only one
> >syllabus, with this "ö" like the German one (and short!).
>
> Back in college I had a Hungarian room mate. I asked him how to pronounce György
> Ligeti: for the first name, just use the English George; the last name rhymes
> with spaghetti (American pronunciation). I suspect he was being somewhat curt
> with me (I'm 100% geek, and he held classical music, particularly contemporary
> stuff, in imperfect esteem), and the pronunciation my profs used was something
> like LIH-gitty (which I guess is more accurate).
>
> Do I have things almost correct?
If you can read IPA, György is [JYrJ], and Ligeti is ['ligEti].
If you can't, <ö> is as it is in German, <r> is always pronounced, <gy> is palatal
stop, not found in either English or German or Italian. Hungarian stress is always
on the first syllable.
> Also, for another Hungarian name, how about Kurtag?
It's ['kurta:g]. In Italian it would be written as Curtag. In English it'd be
something like Coortahg, <r> pronounced.
Hope this helps.
vgy
Robert Davidson
news:3bfaa64...@news.xs4all.nl...
> In fact, I tend to Americanize Dutch names (where possible) in
> regular conversation with Americans - I wouldn't try to make a point
> of pronouncing my friend Rozalie's name with all-too-Dutch Rs and As,
> for example.
Ah, but you Dutch are so accommodating, completely removing our necessity to
learn Dutch when we travel (except in out of the way country towns perhaps).
Louis Andriessen puts it down to Canada and the US' role in liberating
Holland during WW2.
Robert Davidson
Myron Stackpool
>> Back in college I had a Hungarian room mate. I asked him how to pronounce György
>> Ligeti: for the first name, just use the English George; the last name rhymes
>> with spaghetti (American pronunciation). I suspect he was being somewhat curt
>> with me (I'm 100% geek, and he held classical music, particularly contemporary
>> stuff, in imperfect esteem), and the pronunciation my profs used was something
>> like LIH-gitty (which I guess is more accurate).
>>
>> Do I have things almost correct?
>
>If you can read IPA, György is [JYrJ], and Ligeti is ['ligEti].
>
>If you can't, <ö> is as it is in German, <r> is always pronounced, <gy> is palatal
>stop, not found in either English or German or Italian. Hungarian stress is always
>on the first syllable.
>
>> Also, for another Hungarian name, how about Kurtag?
>
>It's ['kurta:g]. In Italian it would be written as Curtag. In English it'd be
>something like Coortahg, <r> pronounced.
>
>Hope this helps.
Yes it does! Thankyou very much.
>vgy
Peter E. Schmidt
> given language. There are frequent regional and family distinctions
> that supercede the standard pronunciation.
>
> Perhaps the most widely known (at least in the context of this
> newsgroup) example of this would be Pierre Boulez' last name, which
> does not conform to standard French pronunciation.
>
> If Reich says his name is pronounced "Riesh," regardless what various
> BBC announcers etc have previously said, they're simply wrong.
On the general subject of pronunciation of composer names, are there
perhaps some reference materials (books, internet sites, etc.)? One
tends to read composer names, as in program or CD notes, rather than
hearing them spoken. And radio announcers are no help; I've heard
some egregious errors where I knew better.
Thanks,
Peter
J. Simon van der Walt
>
> On the general subject of pronunciation of composer names, are there
> perhaps some reference materials (books, internet sites, etc.)? One
> tends to read composer names, as in program or CD notes, rather than
> hearing them spoken. And radio announcers are no help; I've heard
> some egregious errors where I knew better.
>
I imagine the announcers on BBC Radio 3 probably get pretty close. The
BBC has, or certainly used to have, a special unit dedicated to making
sure that their newsreaders pronounced the names of foreign dignities
and place names acceptably, and I'm sure they take as much care with
composers.
--
J. Simon van der Walt
Composer
<http://www.jsimonvanderwalt.com>
John L
Simon van der Walt) wrote:
>I imagine the announcers on BBC Radio 3 probably get pretty close. The
>BBC has, or certainly used to have, a special unit dedicated to making
>sure that their newsreaders pronounced the names of foreign dignities
>and place names acceptably, and I'm sure they take as much care with
>composers.
Used to have. Cut ages ago. Which is why when I mentioned Radio 3, I
wasn't trying to to imply (as soem have assumed) that because R3 says
it, it must be right.
They certainly say "Reish" now, for what that's worth.
I was really asking if anyone else remembered the BBC using the
different prononuciation ("Rke") ages ago. Possibly I imagined it or
maybe no-one else is old enough...
John L
BenHeneghan
writes:
>They certainly say "Reish" now, for what that's worth.
>
>I was really asking if anyone else remembered the BBC using the
>different prononuciation ("Rke") ages ago. Possibly I imagined it or
>maybe no-one else is old enough...
>
Isn't the real pronunciation somewhere in between? That's how such words sound
to me when Germans or Austrians say them.
best wishes
Ben Heneghan
See some of my scores at http://www.sibeliusmusic.com/
Remove poser to email
Larry Shackley
of the TExaco opera broadcasts, does a pronunciation guide to classical names.
Of course, I doubt that Young and REich were out of their cradles when it was
made!
-LArry
Steven CRANFIELD
"John L" <jo...@zahidjohn.plus.com> wrote in message
news:3c08dc5...@usenet.plus.net...
> John L
I first heard 'Drumming' as a teenager when it was first broadcast by the
BBC in a performance in London at the South Bank. Cornelius Cardew was among
the musicians, I'm pretty sure. So that must make me old, or young, enough.
The announcer pronounced his name as in 'Rike'.
Incidentally, and in relation to the other thread discussion on Ligeti's
name, the Beeb has always pronounced this with accent on the first syllable,
short 'i' and hard 'g'. That's also how Ligeti himself pronounces it when
I've heard him speak. The name is not, apparently, a common Hungarian one.
Ligeti has explained that his father 'naturalised' the family surname -
presumably originally German or Rumanian - before his children were born, as
a gesture of solidarity with nationalist Hungarian aspirations. He chose to
base it on the Hungarian word 'liget' which means (I think) 'small wood'. So
the name 'Ligeti' is a constructed one, and it's possible that the surname
might not look completely 'natural' even to fluent speakers of Hungarian. It
would depend on how many Ligetis there are! But I suppose speakers might see
is as akin to the surname 'Szigeti'. Still, there might be some variation in
how it's spoken by others even in Hungary. I should have asked when I was
there in the 90s!
Steve C.
Small-Mountain
>
> I first heard 'Drumming' as a teenager when it was first broadcast by the
> BBC in a performance in London at the South Bank. Cornelius Cardew was among
> the musicians, I'm pretty sure. So that must make me old, or young, enough.
> The announcer pronounced his name as in 'Rike'.
>
job (Maida Vale, I seem to remember) made around the same time as the
Haward Gallery performance. The Concert itself was quite an event,
loads of us lying scattered around surrounded by Rothkos.
Cardew actually got everybody at the Experimental Music group he led
at Morley College to practice the the rythmic cell of drumming with
the aim of improving the skill level amoung us.
As to the pronunciation of Reich - I first met up with him at a
friend's room in Maida Vale to hear tapes he had brought with him of
Four Organs and Phase Patterns. As I remember, all present used the ch
as in loch and he never indicated to the contrary. There again, that
may just have been good manners on his part.
Pip, pip,
Bryn Harris.