Tooth And Nail Fest Gone Sour
Peter G.
I just got home from the first ever Tooth And Nail Day Festival at Azusa Pacific
University. Unfortunatly, I am very upset and saddened by today's happenings. I looked
forward to this event all week and am sad to see how it ended.
There were about fourteen bands scheduled to play (some of which were 90 lb Wuss,
Joe Christmas, Upside Down Room, Unashamed's last ever appearance, Joy Electric,
Havalina, Driver Eight, Stavesacre, The Supertones, Plankeye, and MxPx) with a carnival
outside. Throughout most of the day, everything was great. As the day went on, the
more popular bands began taking the stage. There were only two rules set up by the
venue. Number one was NO STAGE DIVING and number two was NO FLOATING in the slam/mosh
pit. Not hard rules to follow, right? After all, these rules were set up for
everyone's safety. The bands were great and everybody was having a good time listening
to the music, dancing, slamming, and moshing.
Of course there had to be a few knuckleheads who didn't want to follow rules and were
floating and/or stage diving. Everytime this happened, the guy in charge of the event
from Davdon Artist Agency would stop the show and remind everybody of the two rules. Of
course people would seem to understand the rules, the music would start back up, and
they would be breaking the rules again.
During Stavesacre's set, lead vocalist Mark Soloman found it necessary to preach at the
microphone. What he said could not have been more true. He asked everybody to follow
these rules and to not do what they know not to. "The bible", he said, "states that we
are to lift each other up and NOT hurt one another... that we are accountable for our
actions and that we must RESPECT our brothers and sisters more than ourselves". He
continued to add, "I know what punk is all about so don't try to give me those old punk
rock excuses for what you are doing, I have heard them all! There is no excuse for
jumping off stage and breaking someone's head just because you do not want to follow
some rules".
The last three bands to play were, in order, The Supertones, Plankeye, and finally MxPx.
Well, just before The Supertones were going to play, my friend and I went outside the
building to get some water. As we came back in, the Supertones had just started playing
the second song of their set. While we were past the doors, we saw three guys carrying
a girl out as fast as the could walk. She was semi unconcious and was holding her head.
The Supertones played a couple more songs when the singer took a stage dive. Once he did
this, the plug got pulled on them. Again, the guy from Davdon took the microphone and,
for what seemed like the millionth time, told everyone to not stage dive or float. The
Supertones were then allowed to play one more song before finishing their set.
Halfway through their last song, the plugged was pulled once again. The guy from Davdon
took the microphone and said that someone had been injured and that the paramedics and
the police were there treating her. He was uncertain of her situation or whether the
show would continue. He then led the crowd in a prayer for her and for the what
happened at the show.
Well, the show got cancelled and a girl got her neck broken. The attitudes displayed
afterward were terrible. The concert hall got surrounded by police asking everyone to
leave, there was a police helicopter flying around shining lights on people. There were
people in the parking lot refusing to leave because they wanted their money back since
the last two bands did not play. GIVE ME A BREAK PEOPLE. Everyone knew the rules,
everyone was told the rules were for safety, most people followed the rules, some did
not follow the rules and this is what happened...it was a sinking mess! I also
understand that there were more tickets sold than the venue could accomidate. I don't
know if that is true or not.
I ask that you all pray for the girl who I understand suffered a broken neck. If she
does have a broken neck, keep in mind she could be paralyzed for life. I also ask you
pray that people, especially those who are and those who claim to be
Christians start acting like Christians... both at concerts and in all walks of life.
If everyone at this show honored the rules and honored the Lord, then nobody would have
gotten hurt and the concert would have continued. People are too busy trying to fit an
image or attitude and having fun, they forget what is important.
Also, if anybody knows the girl who was injured, please contact me and let me know her
situation. I will be praying for her.
I would like to thank Tooth And Nail Records, Davdon Artist Agency, and Azusa Pacific
University for having the event. I sincerely hope there will be more of these events,
but after today's incident, I doubt it. I also want to thank Mark Soloman from
Stavesacre for sharing the Truth!.
Peter
--
Coincidence is just God's way of remaining anonymous.
http://www.netcom.com/~ppgg/peelhere
#ToothAndNail IRC Undernet Channel
#Bighouse IRC Undernet Channel
Peter G.
I just got home from the first ever Tooth And Nail Day Festival at Azusa Pacific
University. Unfortunatly, I am very upset and saddened by today's happenings. I looked
There were about fourteen bands scheduled to play (some of which were 90 lb Wuss, Joe
Christmas, Upside Down Room, Unashamed's last ever appearance, Joy Electric, Havalina,
Driver Eight, Stavesacre, The Supertones, Plankeye, and MxPx) with a carnival outside.
Throughout most of the day, everything was great. There were only two rules set up by
the venue. Number one was NO STAGE DIVING and number two was NO FLOATING in the
slam/mosh pit. Not hard rules to follow, right? After all, these rules were set up for
everyone's safety. The bands were great and everybody was having a good time listening
to the music, dancing, slamming, and moshing.
Of course there had to be a few knuckleheads who did not want to follow rules and were
floating and/or stage diving. Everytime this happened, the guy in charge of the event
from Davdon Artist Agency would stop the show and remind everybody of the two rules. Of
course people would seem to understand the rules, the music would start back up, and
they would begin breaking the rules again.
During Stavesacre's set, lead vocalist Mark Soloman found it necessary to preach at the
microphone. What he said could not have been more true. He asked everybody to follow
these rules and to not do what they know not to. "The bible", he said, "states that we
are to lift each other up and NOT hurt one another... that we are accountable for our
actions and that we must RESPECT our brothers and sisters more than ourselves". He
continued to add, "I know what punk is all about so don't try to give me those old punk
rock excuses for what you are doing, I have heard them all! There is no excuse for
jumping off stage and breaking someone's head just because you do not want to follow
some rules".
The last three bands to play were, in order, The Supertones, Plankeye, and finally MxPx.
Well, just before The Supertones were going to play, my friend and I went outside the
building to get some water. As we came back in, the Supertones had just started playing
the second song of their set. While we walked past the doors, we saw three guys
carrying a girl out as fast as the could walk. She was semi unconcious and was holding
her head.
The Supertones played a couple more songs when the singer took a stage dive. Once he did
this, the plug got pulled on them. Again, the guy from Davdon took the microphone and,
for what seemed like the millionth time, told everyone to not stage dive or float. The
Supertones were then allowed to play one more song before finishing their set.
Halfway through their last song, the plugged was pulled once again. The guy from Davdon
took the microphone and said that someone had been injured and that the paramedics and
the police were there treating her. He was uncertain of her situation or whether the
show would continue. He then led the crowd in a prayer for her and for the the show.
Well, the show got cancelled and a girl got her neck broken. The attitudes displayed
afterward were terrible. The concert hall got surrounded by police asking everyone to
leave, there was a police helicopter flying around shining lights on people. There were
people in the parking lot refusing to leave because they wanted their money back since
the last two bands did not play. GIVE ME A BREAK PEOPLE. Everyone knew the rules,
everyone was told the rules were for safety, most people followed the rules, some did
not follow the rules and this is what happened...it was a stinking mess! I also
understand that there were more tickets sold than the venue could accomidate. I don't
know if that is true or not.
I ask that you all pray for the girl who I understand suffered a broken neck. If she
does have a broken neck, keep in mind she could be paralyzed for life. I also ask you
pray that people, especially those who are and those who claim to be
Christians start acting like Christians... both at concerts and in all walks of life.
If everyone at this show honored the rules and honored the Lord, then nobody would have
gotten hurt and the concert would have continued. People are too busy trying to fit an
image or attitude and having fun, they forget what is truly important.
Jason and Heather
Peter G. <pp...@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>
> I just got home from the first ever Tooth And Nail Day Festival at
> Azusa Pacific University. Unfortunatly, I am very upset and
> saddened by today's happenings. I looked forward to this event all
> week and am sad to see how it ended.
>
> STAGE DIVING and number two was NO FLOATING in the slam/mosh pit.
> Not hard rules to follow, right? After all, these rules were set
> up for everyone's safety. The bands were great and everybody was
> having a good time listening to the music, dancing, slamming, and
> moshing.
Que es "floating"? Sounds like what was called (In my day, lo these
many years ago) crowd surfing. Anyway, what the bloody hell is more
safe about getting tromped on by large guys with boots than diving?
It's up to the club to decide what kind of rules they want to enforce,
of course. (Unless the horse is *slap*) If they're gonna make rules
they should be ready to actually do something about them. Whining on
mic every 5 seconds won't do it. Didn't they have any security on staff?
jason "settle down, Beavis" steiner
--
Who is Wilson Blair? stei...@primenet.com
Chuck Pearson
i think i could go into editorial mode here, but i'll try to refrain.
Peter G. (pp...@ix.netcom.com) wrote:
: I just got home from the first ever Tooth And Nail Day Festival at
: Azusa Pacific University. Unfortunatly, I am very upset and saddened
: by today's happenings. I looked forward to this event all week and am
: sad to see how it ended.
: There were about fourteen bands scheduled to play (some of which were
: 90 lb Wuss, Joe Christmas, Upside Down Room, Unashamed's last ever
: appearance, Joy Electric, Havalina, Driver Eight, Stavesacre, The
: Supertones, Plankeye, and MxPx) with a carnival outside. Throughout
: most of the day, everything was great. As the day went on, the more
: popular bands began taking the stage. There were only two rules set up
: by the venue. Number one was NO STAGE DIVING and number two was NO
: FLOATING in the slam/mosh pit. Not hard rules to follow, right? After
: all, these rules were set up for everyone's safety. The bands were
: great and everybody was having a good time listening to the music,
: dancing, slamming, and moshing.
perhaps they aren't hard rules to follow, but the more i see this
slam/mosh culture, the more i become convinced that you're never going to
see these rules pulled off.
i've now been to four or five shows where i've seen moshers in action.
the first was at cornerstone '93, where i saw the prayer chain play, and
that was a pretty decent mosh pit...none of peter g's "knuckleheads" in
there. still, there was no getting close to the stage, and i had to be
content to see the band from the middle of the tent. i saw the choir in an
old methodist church in dayton, which isn't the type of show that will
cater to your traditional crowd of moshers. what wound up happening was
that those who wanted to slam did so in the back of the church and in the
aisles, and let those who wanted to be up front to see the band see the
band. they were just people being silly and having fun, which is nothing i
object to, and besides, i got to make eye contact with derri and steve,
which is the best reason to see the choir live, imho.
i posted after i saw mortal play a show in bowling green last year, and i
was depressed as all get-out after that show because of the pure MEANNESS
of those who were moshing. i am amazed nobody got hurt in that mess. it
was really neat to talk to jerome and actually see the band play, but
because of the moshers [and some not-so-clueful show planning] i didn't
make it through mortal's set. i wanted to get close to the stage to watch
mortal play and got beat up pretty bad getting bounced out of the pit. the
black-eye sceva/poor old lu show i saw last month was just as bad.
there is something about moshing that strikes me as unhealthy [besides the
obvious dangers of somebody running into you at full speed and knocking
heads with four or five different people around you]. if we are
Christians and we have experienced and understand the love of Christ, why
are we willfully engaging in behavior that might physically hurt people
around us? can we really say that we're dancing to the glory of God when
we're slamming bodies with people around us?
i'm doing my best to avoid placing this into the "slamming is evil" terms,
and i'm failing miserably. i guess i would like for somebody to explain
to me how moshing can be a glorifying dance. it seems to be that a God
who made laws to preserve the health and well-being of those who love Him
can't be pleased when we willingly put our own health at risk...
does that make any sense at all...?
[btw, jason steiner: i'm pretty sure that "floating" is the current lingo
for crowd-surfing.]
: Of course there had to be a few knuckleheads who didn't want to follow
: rules and were floating and/or stage diving. Everytime this happened,
: the guy in charge of the event from Davdon Artist Agency would stop the
: show and remind everybody of the two rules. Of course people would seem
: to understand the rules, the music would start back up, and they would
: be breaking the rules again.
so throw the people breaking the rules out. if you're going to have
rules, enforce them. if you're going to try to assert authority with
rules and you don't follow through on enforcing the rules, you're going to
lose all control of your crowd and things like what you relate are going
to happen. people at the show may have been stupid, but they shouldn't
have stayed at the show if they were putting others at risk - davdon
artist agency has to take some of the blame for that girl's broken neck,
and if i was a litigous man, i'd help that girl's parents sue the
promoters for all they were worth. we have a word in the states for that
kind of idiocy, and it's "negligence"...
: During Stavesacre's set, lead vocalist Mark Soloman found it necessary
: to preach at the microphone. What he said could not have been more true.
: He asked everybody to follow these rules and to not do what they know
: not to. "The bible", he said, "states that we are to lift each other up
: and NOT hurt one another... that we are accountable for our actions and
: that we must RESPECT our brothers and sisters more than ourselves". He
: continued to add, "I know what punk is all about so don't try to give me
: those old punk rock excuses for what you are doing, I have heard them
: all! There is no excuse for jumping off stage and breaking someone's
: head just because you do not want to follow some rules".
"oh, get a life. we came to this show to hear music and slam, not to hear
the singer preach to us. you can say the name "Jesus" and we'll get up
and we'll cheer because <beavis>Christ is cool, huh, huh</beavis>, but
don't you dare tell me to change the way i'm living, 'cause i'm not here
for that. and don't you DARE mess with my moshing. i live for moshing.
i live for punk. Christ loves punks, too..."
there is SO MUCH of this mindset at these kind of shows that it has almost
driven me to tears at times. yes, Jesus loves punks, but what are you
going to say to Him when you fall off the stage and break some girl's
neck? "why'd You let that happen to her, God? don't you love punks?"
maybe it isn't moshing that's evil, but the mindset that says "i can be a
punk if i want to be a punk and to heck with everybody else..."
of course, it's entirely possible that this is just my bitterness at
growing up, too...
chuck
--
andnoneofthisofcoursewillstandwhenistandbeforethemanonthatgreatdayofthegreat
dividewhenallthekingsandqueenswillhavetheirclosetsemptiedandtheboneswillallf
alloutdembonesdembonesdemdryboneswillnotfaildeadmenwilltelltalesandyoucanlau
ghandicanlaughandwecanlaughbutitsnotfunny....cpearson@freenet.columbus.oh.us
Scholar and Fool
Quite suddenly, Chuck Pearson <cpea...@freenet.columbus.oh.us> blurted out:
>perhaps they aren't hard rules to follow, but the more i see this
>slam/mosh culture, the more i become convinced that you're never going to
>see these rules pulled off.
for the most part I agree. I think if you're going to play music that has
traditionally been "moshable" then you have to expect it if you're going
to put on a show. Part of the problem arises now that the alternative
music culture has become "cool" and popular - people are bringing moshing
and slamming into shows that, frankly, just don't mesh with it.
[several moshing experiences deleted]
The pit is generally down in the front near the band, at least that is how
all my experience has been. If you want to see bands that are part of the
moshing/slamming culture, then that's just something you have to accept as
part of that culture as well. Well, you don't have to, but it's a part of
it. When moshing/slamming takes place at shows that don't go with it, then
all bets are off - it's probably people who are doing it because it's "new"
and "cool" and they are gonna do it, darn it. At shows where it's expected
and normal....well, it's expected and normal.
>there is something about moshing that strikes me as unhealthy [besides the
>obvious dangers of somebody running into you at full speed and knocking
>heads with four or five different people around you]. if we are
>Christians and we have experienced and understand the love of Christ, why
>are we willfully engaging in behavior that might physically hurt people
>around us? can we really say that we're dancing to the glory of God when
>we're slamming bodies with people around us?
Here's my reply: glory to God, shmlory to God. Some people may do it and
actually be thinking about glorifying God - most people are just doing it
because it's fun and a rush. I don't think there's any need to justify
it as being done to the glory of God. I'll expound on this later down.
>i'm doing my best to avoid placing this into the "slamming is evil" terms,
>and i'm failing miserably. i guess i would like for somebody to explain
>to me how moshing can be a glorifying dance. it seems to be that a God
>who made laws to preserve the health and well-being of those who love Him
>can't be pleased when we willingly put our own health at risk...
>
>does that make any sense at all...?
No, it really doesn't make much sense. Now, in the context of "everything
must be done to the glory of God. And we can't glorify God by possibly
injuring our bodies or someone else's." it makes sense. I don't think
that's a valid framework, though. It just don't wash. Yeah, the Bible
says "do everything to the glory of God." But you can't use that to
single out moshing. If we're going to use that logic, let's use it
consistently. What about rollerblading? What about boxing? What about
football? What about hockey? Eh? And as to the "willingly put our
own health at risk," what about eating unhealthy foods? overeating?
smoking? sky-diving? driving a car? The list goes *way* on. When you
figure out how *any* of those things can be done to the glory of God,
then you will have your answer for moshing as well.
>so throw the people breaking the rules out. if you're going to have
>rules, enforce them. if you're going to try to assert authority with
>rules and you don't follow through on enforcing the rules, you're going to
>lose all control of your crowd and things like what you relate are going
>to happen.
This I agree with. I think it's annoying to have "no moshing, no crowd-
surfing, no stagediving" rules at concerts by bands from those genres, but
if you are going to have them then enforce them.
>: During Stavesacre's set, lead vocalist Mark Soloman found it necessary
>: to preach at the microphone. What he said could not have been more true.
>: He asked everybody to follow these rules and to not do what they know
>: not to. "The bible", he said, "states that we are to lift each other up
>: and NOT hurt one another... that we are accountable for our actions and
>: that we must RESPECT our brothers and sisters more than ourselves". He
>: continued to add, "I know what punk is all about so don't try to give me
>: those old punk rock excuses for what you are doing, I have heard them
>: all! There is no excuse for jumping off stage and breaking someone's
>: head just because you do not want to follow some rules".
Mark Saloman is the man.
>maybe it isn't moshing that's evil, but the mindset that says "i can be a
>punk if i want to be a punk and to heck with everybody else..."
>
>of course, it's entirely possible that this is just my bitterness at
>growing up, too...
I think part of it is just the lack of respect that people doing this
sometimes have for others. And, no, I'm not referring to letting people
get at the front of the stage - that's the mosh-area and if you go there
you are giving up your right to not get bumped. For bands that are not
of those genres, though, it's a different story. The attitude of a lot
of the moshers these days sucks, frankly. They get pissed when they get
bumped back, they blindside people, etc. Yeah, it's an agressive game,
but as Christians we're supposed to have some respect for others. And
if you play with fire, expect to get burned now and then.
I myself am only a marginal mosher, and I've never floated or stage-
dived. A lot of times, though, I will go to the edge ring of a pit.
Yeah, I get bumped, knocked into, pushed, shoved, my toes get stepped
on (next time I'm getting steel-toed if possible) - but I know what
I'm getting into. I get a good view of the band, too. And I get to
watch the pit and help people up and let people in and out.
Just one view.
--
will the slamming ever slow?
no.
(the crucified)
@#$% Terry Leifeste, Scholar and Fool / hatf...@phoenix.net %*&$@#%&$%*#$#@
Mattias G. Hembruch
In article <4pf0np$n...@acme.freenet.columbus.oh.us>,
Chuck Pearson <cpea...@freenet.columbus.oh.us> wrote:
>i think i could go into editorial mode here, but i'll try to refrain.
>
>Peter G. (pp...@ix.netcom.com) wrote:
>: I just got home from the first ever Tooth And Nail Day Festival at
>: Azusa Pacific University. Unfortunatly, I am very upset and saddened
>: by today's happenings. I looked forward to this event all week and am
>: sad to see how it ended.
>
>: There were about fourteen bands scheduled to play (some of which were
>: 90 lb Wuss, Joe Christmas, Upside Down Room, Unashamed's last ever
>: appearance, Joy Electric, Havalina, Driver Eight, Stavesacre, The
>: Supertones, Plankeye, and MxPx) with a carnival outside. Throughout
>: most of the day, everything was great. As the day went on, the more
>: popular bands began taking the stage. There were only two rules set up
>: by the venue. Number one was NO STAGE DIVING and number two was NO
>: FLOATING in the slam/mosh pit. Not hard rules to follow, right? After
>: all, these rules were set up for everyone's safety. The bands were
>: great and everybody was having a good time listening to the music,
>: dancing, slamming, and moshing.
>
>perhaps they aren't hard rules to follow, but the more i see this
>slam/mosh culture, the more i become convinced that you're never going to
>see these rules pulled off.
Just as a counterpoint: Last year in July I think, we had a show in Kitchener,
Ontario featuring Phoebe Jean (local band, I believe), Soulfood 76 and Poor
Old Lu. During the Soulfood 76 concert, people were stage diving & surfing,
etc..
The organizers came on and asked everyone to stop diving. I can't remember if
they asked us to stop surfing too, but you know what? IT HAPPENED! The mosh
pit was still going, but no more diving, even after Poor Old Lu came on.
Of course, we're just "friendly, polite Canuckleheads" :-)
Mattias
--
Mattias Hembruch, University of Waterloo, Ontario, Canada.
BASc Computer Engineering
MASc Candidate in Parallel & Distributed Systems Group
mghe...@dictator.uwaterloo.ca http://www.pads.uwaterloo.ca/~mghembru
the ANTEATER
In article <4pf0np$n...@acme.freenet.columbus.oh.us>,
cpea...@freenet.columbus.oh.us (Chuck Pearson) wrote:
@ perhaps they aren't hard rules to follow, but the more i see this
@ slam/mosh culture, the more i become convinced that you're never going to
@ see these rules pulled off.
I've been to shows where it's been pulled off actually. I saw Mortal and
they didn't have a pit. The EDL show didn't have a pit either. It's just
a matter of people's mindset and to be honest, the size of the crowd
becomes really important. If there's gangs of people they'll be less
likely to follow rules, kinda following the "mob mentality."
@ i wanted to get close to the stage to watch
@ mortal play and got beat up pretty bad getting bounced out of the pit. the
@ black-eye sceva/poor old lu show i saw last month was just as bad.
All I gotta say is you gotta put on some weight =). I can't speak for
other people but I've *never* had a problem getting up toward the front,
even at huge shows like Zoom and stuff. You just go through. Here's a
hint: USE THE PIT TO YOUR ADVANTAGE TO GET CLOSER!! Get to the pit, go
in, take about half a ride, and then get out on the other side =) Saves
time.
@ can we really say that we're dancing to the glory of God when
@ we're slamming bodies with people around us?
Probably not, but I don't think that was ever the point behind it. It's
just a means by which one can express/"get out" frustrations and anger
which can't be done in an "acceptable" manner. And it *can* be fun too,
but I think a lot of the new Christian kids coming up to the shows are
just doing it cuz it's kewl and they've never done it before. So they'll
be like the "big kids" and go into the pit. It's so dumb.
@ so throw the people breaking the rules out. if you're going to have
@ rules, enforce them. if you're going to try to assert authority with
@ rules and you don't follow through on enforcing the rules, you're going to
@ lose all control of your crowd and things like what you relate are going
@ to happen.
Excellent point. If you're not enforcing rules they're just ideals.
@ "oh, get a life. we came to this show to hear music and slam, not to hear
@ the singer preach to us. you can say the name "Jesus" and we'll get up
@ and we'll cheer because <beavis>Christ is cool, huh, huh</beavis>, but
@ don't you dare tell me to change the way i'm living, 'cause i'm not here
@ for that. and don't you DARE mess with my moshing. i live for moshing.
@ i live for punk. Christ loves punks, too..."
*the ANTEATER laughs out loud much to the dismay of his studying
roommate* That was perfect!
@ maybe it isn't moshing that's evil, but the mindset that says "i can be a
@ punk if i want to be a punk and to heck with everybody else..."
Exactly, that's the biggest problem with the punk scene today. The punks
no longer are punks, they're just antisocial (except w/ other punks). Oh,
and don't forget you're only punk if you have 20 piercings and you're
tatted (yeah, as if).
@ of course, it's entirely possible that this is just my bitterness at
@ growing up, too...
You brought it up =)
How old are ya anyway?
Peace, I'm out -- *poof*
the ANTEATER
aka Michael Simison
http://members.tripod.com/~anteater/index.html
mailto:mdsi...@uci.edu
What else did you want to know?
Chuck Pearson
the ANTEATER (mdsi...@uci.edu) wrote in response to me:
: I've been to shows where it's been pulled off actually. I saw Mortal and
: they didn't have a pit. The EDL show didn't have a pit either. It's just
: a matter of people's mindset and to be honest, the size of the crowd
: becomes really important. If there's gangs of people they'll be less
: likely to follow rules, kinda following the "mob mentality."
yeah. i'm spooked enough by a hundred or two. i don't even want to get in
a cornerstone pit now...
: All I gotta say is you gotta put on some weight =).
140 and 6'2, buddy. and metabolism like you wouldn't believe. it simply
don't work that way...
: @ of course, it's entirely possible that this is just my bitterness at
: @ growing up, too...
: You brought it up =)
: How old are ya anyway?
what? 23? 24? i can never remember these days. 24, i think.
and getting close to general exams time for PhD candidacy. i think that's
where most of this is coming from...
beverley
In article <4pip20$c...@acme.freenet.columbus.oh.us>,
Chuck Pearson <cpea...@freenet.columbus.oh.us> wrote:
>140 and 6'2, buddy. and metabolism like you wouldn't believe. it simply
>don't work that way...
Hey, chuck? Can I have your genetics for a little while?
Just long enough to become 6'2" and 140lbs plus gazongas. You'd be doing
humanity a great service....
-- bev. legs of steel, back of steel, height of 5'6", getting very tired of
popcorn, popcorn, popcorn, high kicks, crunches, gazillion-mile walks
and hefting the week's groceries across two or three miles only to find
that she's NOT LOSING WEIGHT.
--
http://www.hallucinet.com/wednesday ===== http://www.tezcat.com/~wednsday
Yet another person had no interest in sex at all unless he was in love, &
had just about given up meeting another with the same fetish. -P. Califia
the ANTEATER
In article <4pip20$c...@acme.freenet.columbus.oh.us>,
cpea...@freenet.columbus.oh.us (Chuck Pearson) wrote:
@ : All I gotta say is you gotta put on some weight =).
@
@ 140 and 6'2, buddy. and metabolism like you wouldn't believe. it simply
@ don't work that way...
Geez, are you SERIOUS? Holy cow! 6'2, 140, I think that makes you a
candidate for the official rmc twig =)
I'm 6'2 also, but 200. *the ANT can't wait for church football next year!*
@ and getting close to general exams time for PhD candidacy. i think that's
@ where most of this is coming from...
Serious? PHD? As in a doctorate? Dang, gotta give props
*THIS IS THE ANTEATER GIVIN PROPS TO CHUCK CUZ HE'S THE **MAN***
What's it in?
The collected wisdom of rmc ... is astounding
-- The aNtEaTEr, who has 7 more years before he'll be an MD --
Jerry B. Ray
In article <4pipsd$o...@huitzilo.tezcat.com>,
beverley <wedn...@tezcat.com> wrote:
>-- bev. legs of steel, back of steel, height of 5'6", getting very tired of
>popcorn, popcorn, popcorn, high kicks, crunches, gazillion-mile walks
>and hefting the week's groceries across two or three miles only to find
>that she's NOT LOSING WEIGHT.
Stop drinking cokes and such. Worked for me. (Not that I need to lose
weight, at 6'3" 165, but when I got up to 180 over the course of a year
or less I decided that growing a gut was not for me and cut way back on
my soft drink intake. Just that change made a difference, it seems.)
JRjr
--
%%%%% vap...@prism.gatech.edu %%%%%%%% Jerry B. Ray, Jr. %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
"I am so amazingly cool you could keep a side of meat in me for a month.
I am so hip I have difficulty seeing over my pelvis."
-- Zaphod Beeblebrox
Chuck Pearson
beverley (wedn...@tezcat.com) wrote in response to me:
: >140 and 6'2, buddy. and metabolism like you wouldn't believe. it simply
: >don't work that way...
: Hey, chuck? Can I have your genetics for a little while?
: Just long enough to become 6'2" and 140lbs plus gazongas. You'd be doing
: humanity a great service....
as long as i can have your genetics in return and put on a little bulk
wherever [i don't even care if it looks like beer gut at this point] that
i've heard i was supposed to pick up as a grad student, and all my
junk-food eating and such hasn't done it. 8-P 8-P 8-P
or, we could just all learn to appreciate how God has made us and quit
worrying about how we look...
nah.
Chuck Pearson
[sorry, i don't have post-and-mail capability...]
the ANTEATER (mdsi...@uci.edu) wrote in response to me:
: @ 140 and 6'2, buddy. and metabolism like you wouldn't believe. it simply
: @ don't work that way...
: Geez, are you SERIOUS? Holy cow! 6'2, 140, I think that makes you a
: candidate for the official rmc twig =)
a title i accept if you want to give it. 8-)
: I'm 6'2 also, but 200. *the ANT can't wait for church football next year!*
as long as i get to quarter. being 6'2 140, i have experience in getting
rid of the football quickly and accurately...8-)
: @ and getting close to general exams time for PhD candidacy. i think that's
: @ where most of this is coming from...
: Serious? PHD? As in a doctorate? Dang, gotta give props
: *THIS IS THE ANTEATER GIVIN PROPS TO CHUCK CUZ HE'S THE **MAN***
i'll accept said props after i pass generals. *sigh*
: What's it in?
biological physics. yes, i am a mad scientist. send all bad scientist
jokes to this address...please do not post. thank you very much.
: -- The aNtEaTEr, who has 7 more years before he'll be an MD --
and i'll refrain from my MD jokes.
ob-r.m.c: radio-u started playing a holy soldier song called "my world"
yesterday. i like it. this is not allowed. holy soldier is a sorry
band, and they are simply not allowed to write good songs. what is this
world coming to?
Layne Petersen
Chuck Pearson wrote:
>:There were only two rules set up
>: by the venue. Number one was NO STAGE DIVING and number two was NO
>: FLOATING in the slam/mosh pit. Not hard rules to follow, right?
>perhaps they aren't
>hard rules to follow, but the more i see this
>slam/mosh culture, the more i become convinced that you're never going to
>see these rules pulled off.
I've been to approximately 7 million shows that had pits. And every single
one of them had some bozo that felt they needed to float and kick everyone
around them in the head at least once. I mean, at, say, MxPx or the
Crucified, I can see it. But at a PFR/Jars of Clay show? At a Sixpence show?
Heck I think the Prayer Chain and Starflyer are pretty borderline as far as
whether or not it's "music to mosh to".
>i've now been to four or five shows where i've seen moshers in action.
>the first was at cornerstone '93, where i saw the prayer chain play, and
>that was a pretty decent mosh pit...none of peter g's "knuckleheads" in
>there. still, there was no getting close to the stage, and i had to be
>content to see the band from the middle of the tent.
I've stated before that the Chain's set in the 7-Ball tent last year was
probably my favorite set of music I've ever seen. But it may have been even
better if the bozos hadn't been stagediving all over the place.
>i posted after i saw mortal play a show in bowling green last year, and i
>was depressed as all get-out after that show because of the pure MEANNESS
>of those who were moshing.
Yeah, I went to a Mortal show in '93 that was the same way. It was like
football players attacking each other. They knocked over the first row of
chairs in the place where the show was.
>if we are Christians and we have experienced and understand the love of
Christ, why
>are we willfully engaging in behavior that might physically hurt people
>around us? can we really say that we're dancing to the glory of God when
>we're slamming bodies with people around us?
Last year about this time I would have totally disagreed with you, Chuck. But
now I may have to go along with you. Maybe I'm just getting old, but moshing
has pretty much worn out its welcome in my happy little world. And a lot of
the time, that's why. It bums me out to hear people's attitudes about how
they're gonna "kill" in the pit. It's funny, but at an MxPx show last summer,
about 6 or 7 of us were just happily slamdancing (since that's what you're
_really_ supposed to do to punk), and a bunch of testosterone-crazed moshers
kept making fun of us saying we were wimps for not getting into the pit. I,
of course, countered with a "Well, this _isn't_ a Mortification show, you
know"...
>does that make any sense at all...?
Chuck, once again, speaks the truth...
>so throw the people breaking the rules out. if you're going to have
>rules, enforce them. if you're going to try to assert authority with
>rules and you don't follow through on enforcing the rules, you're going to
>lose all control of your crowd and things like what you relate are going
>to happen.
See my above statement. It just seems pointless to me to even have the rules
for safety if people aren't gonna follow them. And if they're _rules_ per se,
then if you break 'em, out you go.
>"oh, get a life. we came to this show to hear music and slam, not to hear
>the singer preach to us. you can say the name "Jesus" and we'll get up
>and we'll cheer because <beavis>Christ is cool, huh, huh</beavis>, but
>don't you dare tell me to change the way i'm living, 'cause i'm not here
>for that. and don't you DARE mess with my moshing. i live for moshing.
>i live for punk. Christ loves punks, too..."
Yeah, at the the MxPx show in Denver in Feb., a kid got hurt, and the guy
running the show (hey Fred!) tried to get everyone to mellow out. Some
bonehead from the side of the stage kept hollering back that "it's a punk
show! People are gonna get hurt!" And that, as far as I'm concerned is a
bunch of crap.
===========================================================
Peace, hope, love, Jesus Christ - Layner
===========================================================
Layne_P...@MinistryNet.usa.net
===========================================================
Faded, this I feel. Behind the blue clouds, I remain concealed.
Lord, lift me out of the night. Come on, look down
and see the mess I'm in tonight..." - Afghan Whigs
===========================================================
beverley
In article <4pjves$5...@acmex.gatech.edu>,
Jerry B. Ray <vap...@prism.gatech.edu> wrote:
>In article <4pipsd$o...@huitzilo.tezcat.com>,
>beverley <wedn...@tezcat.com> wrote:
>>-- bev. legs of steel, back of steel, height of 5'6", getting very tired of
>>popcorn, popcorn, popcorn, high kicks, crunches, gazillion-mile walks
>>and hefting the week's groceries across two or three miles only to find
>>that she's NOT LOSING WEIGHT.
>
>Stop drinking cokes and such. Worked for me. (Not that I need to lose
>weight, at 6'3" 165, but when I got up to 180 over the course of a year
>or less I decided that growing a gut was not for me and cut way back on
>my soft drink intake. Just that change made a difference, it seems.)
Actually, the rule I set for myself a little over a year ago was that the
carbonated beverages were only to be imbibed in the case of a) deadline
design situations where I needed Jolt to stay awake [read: one or two
Jolts a month; I can usually push] b) being out at restaurants [while not
rare, definitely infrequent] c) special occasions. Where I went through 2L
of soda a day at one point it's getting closer to maybe a large coke
a week.
I'll tell ya, my weight gain can be pinned pretty much down to the month --
February of last year, when my sex life stopped pretty much cold, excepting
last year's Disclave, and it started being significant [from about a 14
to an 18 in the space of a couple of months] later that year when I became
a Christian .....
It's like Jesus washed my sins away and took the metabolism with Him.
beverley
In article <4pk0rk$8...@acme.freenet.columbus.oh.us>,
Chuck Pearson <cpea...@freenet.columbus.oh.us> wrote:
>beverley (wedn...@tezcat.com) wrote in response to me:
>: >140 and 6'2, buddy. and metabolism like you wouldn't believe. it simply
>: >don't work that way...
>
>: Hey, chuck? Can I have your genetics for a little while?
>: Just long enough to become 6'2" and 140lbs plus gazongas. You'd be doing
>: humanity a great service....
>
>as long as i can have your genetics in return and put on a little bulk
>wherever [i don't even care if it looks like beer gut at this point] that
Are you insinuating that I look like I have a beer gut?!
This gut is PURE RED WINE, I'll have you know.... :)
>or, we could just all learn to appreciate how God has made us and quit
>worrying about how we look...
>
>nah.
Yeah, really. God made me me, but I made me plump. :)
Chuck Pearson
arrgh. i HATE tin. one keystroke and a post disappears into the cosmos.
let me just make the statement i had to make and be done with it.
in response to me, beverley (wedn...@tezcat.com) wrote:
: >as long as i can have your genetics in return and put on a little bulk
: >wherever [i don't even care if it looks like beer gut at this point] that
: Are you insinuating that I look like I have a beer gut?!
nononononononononononononono. i am NOT insinuating that you have a beer
gut. i am insinuating that i'd do ANYTHING for more bulk at this point.
: This gut is PURE RED WINE, I'll have you know.... :)
ah. see.
Lisa Reid
In <4pjves$5...@acmex.gatech.edu>, vap...@prism.gatech.edu (Jerry B. Ray) writes:
>In article <4pipsd$o...@huitzilo.tezcat.com>,
>beverley <wedn...@tezcat.com> wrote:
>
>>-- bev. legs of steel, back of steel, height of 5'6", getting very tired of
>>popcorn, popcorn, popcorn, high kicks, crunches, gazillion-mile walks
>>and hefting the week's groceries across two or three miles only to find
>>that she's NOT LOSING WEIGHT.
>
>Stop drinking cokes and such. Worked for me. (Not that I need to lose
>weight, at 6'3" 165, but when I got up to 180 over the course of a year
>or less I decided that growing a gut was not for me and cut way back on
>my soft drink intake. Just that change made a difference, it seems.)
>
much more easily than women. They have a larger muscle mass, thereby
burning more calories. So it is *much* simpler for a male to lose weight
than it is for a female.
There, there, Bev. It's all right. I feel your pain. And now your pain and
I must be off to Jazzercise. *sigh*
Lisa lr...@mail.utexas.edu
"Naked is not naughty."
-- Ed Rock
beverley
In article <4pkrnt$1g...@ausnews.austin.ibm.com>,
Lisa Reid <lr...@mail.utexas.edu> wrote:
>Aha, but what you fail to realize, my dear Buddy, is that men lose weight
>much more easily than women. They have a larger muscle mass, thereby
>burning more calories. So it is *much* simpler for a male to lose weight
>than it is for a female.
What I need is a metabolism. You know what the best way to never lose weight
again is? Don't eat for two months. *aaauuuugggghhhh*
You heard it here, girls....
ANOREXIA: It makes you Bev.
>There, there, Bev. It's all right. I feel your pain. And now your pain and
>I must be off to Jazzercise. *sigh*
I'd Jazzercise if it didn't give me migraines....
>Lisa lr...@mail.utexas.edu
>"Naked is not naughty."
> -- Ed Rock
Not going there. NOT GOING THERE. Neither is the halloween costume I started
planning. NOT GOING THERE.
==== Why don't you call me? I feel like flying into a razor of love. ====
Not Ashamed!
beverley (wedn...@tezcat.com) wrote:
: Hey, chuck? Can I have your genetics for a little while?
: Just long enough to become 6'2" and 140lbs plus gazongas. You'd be doing
: humanity a great service....
Funny, I don't remember Chuck saying he had gazongas.
--
"If God wanted you to be happy every day,
He would have made you a game show host." -- Heathers
Not Ashamed!
beverley (wedn...@tezcat.com) wrote:
: It's like Jesus washed my sins away and took the metabolism with Him.
I'd guess the endorphins (or whatever the appropriate chemical is) which
bring a feeling of contentment and/or happiness from sex were no longer
created. The right food can make them brain chemicals perc again.
beverley
In article <4pmo2h$n...@netaxs.com>, Not Ashamed! <chee...@netaxs.com> wrote:
>beverley (wedn...@tezcat.com) wrote:
>
>: It's like Jesus washed my sins away and took the metabolism with Him.
>
>I'd guess the endorphins (or whatever the appropriate chemical is) which
>bring a feeling of contentment and/or happiness from sex were no longer
>created. The right food can make them brain chemicals perc again.
What would you suggest? Chocolate doesn't seem to help, despite all rumours
to the contrary, and while the abundance of garlic in my diet might be healthy
and everything, it will definitely kill my chances of marrying anytime soon.
I wish I could fly from this building, from this wall -- and, if I should
try, would you catch me if I fall? -- Barenaked Ladies ==================
beverley
In article <4pmnov$n...@netaxs.com>, Not Ashamed! <chee...@netaxs.com> wrote:
>beverley (wedn...@tezcat.com) wrote:
>
>: Just long enough to become 6'2" and 140lbs plus gazongas. You'd be doing
>: humanity a great service....
>
>Funny, I don't remember Chuck saying he had gazongas.
No, no; I have gazongas. It's that I want to be thin except for the gazongas.
I mean, they're not the BEST gazongas, but they're MY gazongas, and I'd like
to continue having my gazongas.
Jerry B. Ray
[re: men]
>They have a larger muscle mass, thereby burning more calories.
Heh. You obviously haven't _seen_ me. :-) (Actually, I'm stronger
than I look, but that's not hard...)
Chuck Pearson
Jerry B. Ray (vap...@prism.gatech.edu) wrote in response to Lisa Reid
<lr...@mail.utexas.edu>:
: [re: men]
: >They have a larger muscle mass, thereby burning more calories.
: Heh. You obviously haven't _seen_ me. :-) (Actually, I'm stronger
: than I look, but that's not hard...)
nor me. jerry and i could team up. the 98-pound-weakling-brothers. 8-)
[if we exceed 98 pounds, trust us, it's only our height.]
Mattias G. Hembruch
In article <4pk13i$9...@acme.freenet.columbus.oh.us>,
Chuck Pearson <cpea...@freenet.columbus.oh.us> wrote:
<SNIP>
>: @ 140 and 6'2, buddy. and metabolism like you wouldn't believe. it simply
>: @ don't work that way...
<SNIP>
>biological physics. yes, i am a mad scientist. send all bad scientist
>jokes to this address...please do not post. thank you very much.
So, let me get this straight. You're going to TRY to get a PhD in biological
physics, and you can't figure out how to gain a few pounds??? Man, that's
a case of actions speaking louder than words if I ever heard one..
"Honest professor, I know lots o' stuff 'bout biology. Just because I'm unable
to eat enough to gain some weight doesn't make me a bad person.. Really."
"What they been teaching you at that sissy school of yours? You ain't fat.
You ain't fat. You ain't nothin'!" [(c) Al Yankovic] :-)
Chuck Pearson
Mattias G. Hembruch (mghe...@dictator.uwaterloo.ca) wrote in response to me:
: <SNIP>
: >: @ 140 and 6'2, buddy. and metabolism like you wouldn't believe. it simply
: >: @ don't work that way...
: <SNIP>
: >biological physics. yes, i am a mad scientist. send all bad scientist
: >jokes to this address...please do not post. thank you very much.
: So, let me get this straight. You're going to TRY to get a PhD in biological
: physics, and you can't figure out how to gain a few pounds??? Man, that's
: a case of actions speaking louder than words if I ever heard one..
i told you not to post, mattias! *sigh*
and modern medical science still doesn't know how to handle freaks of
nature like me. *sigh*sigh*
: "What they been teaching you at that sissy school of yours? You ain't fat.
: You ain't fat. You ain't nothin'!" [(c) Al Yankovic] :-)
[wa-POW]
[sounds of instant cellulite]
"your butt is wide, well mine is too
just watch your mouth or i'll sit on you..."
Lisa Reid
In <4pmkd1$l...@acme.freenet.columbus.oh.us>, cpea...@freenet.columbus.oh.us (Chuck Pearson) writes:
>Jerry B. Ray (vap...@prism.gatech.edu) wrote in response to Lisa Reid
><lr...@mail.utexas.edu>:
>
>: [re: men]
>: >They have a larger muscle mass, thereby burning more calories.
>
>: Heh. You obviously haven't _seen_ me. :-) (Actually, I'm stronger
>: than I look, but that's not hard...)
>
>nor me. jerry and i could team up. the 98-pound-weakling-brothers. 8-)
>
>[if we exceed 98 pounds, trust us, it's only our height.]
>
I, like Bev, have been working out (Jazzercise and NordicTrack) and
watching what I eat (I usually keep it under 25 g of fat a day), and
still no luck. My husband keeps the fat out somewhat and doesn't
exercise and has dropped 15 pounds. It just ain't right. *sigh*
I still love him, but sometimes I have to say it through gritted teeth. ;-)
Lisa, who is convinced she'll be skin 'n bones in heaven if God is
Who He says He is! lr...@mail.utexas.edu
"Naked is not naughty." -- Ed Rock
(However, in my case, it's scary to think about!)
Jason and Heather
beverley <wedn...@tezcat.com> wrote:
> Not Ashamed! <chee...@netaxs.com> wrote:
> > beverley (wedn...@tezcat.com) wrote:
> > >
> > > with Him.
> >
> > I'd guess the endorphins (or whatever the appropriate chemical
> > is) which bring a feeling of contentment and/or happiness from
> > sex were no longer created. The right food can make them brain
> > chemicals perc again.
>
> What would you suggest? Chocolate doesn't seem to help, despite all
> rumours to the contrary,
Chocolate's a mild aphrodesiac. Makes it *worse*.
> and while the abundance of garlic in my diet might be healthy and
> everything, it will definitely kill my chances of marrying anytime
> soon.
I don't think the answer is food. What you need is something that
will satisfy your need for a chemical satisfaction without the
kilocalories. Aerobic exercise is good for an endorphin rush,
running especially. The main problem is finding something that you
can do a lot of without getting bored, or blowing out your knees, or
spending a ton of money that you don't have. (Guess what fits *that*
description perfectly?)
Check your local library for books on non-weight muscle training,
like the kind a lot of gymnasts use. You have to do a lot of reps
to get anywhere with those routines, so they end up being pretty
decent aerobic workouts as well. I did a lot of that before I
could afford equipment, and liked the results.
Now I do HIT training, which is really good for strength, not as good
for aerobics, but takes only 15 minutes per day (long enough to work
one muscle group to exhaustion with the heaviest weights you can use
and still do 5-12 reps). The idea is to literally *damage* the muscle
(you're supposed to be sore for 2 days following) then allow it a
week to heal. Along with the pain you get a short term, very intense
rush. If you rotate working different muscle groups from day to day
basis, you can get a regular fix for your jones.
On the downside, you will need a spotter, and a basic weight set with
enough mass to really challenge you will run $100 new, possibly less
if you can find it used, or get the cheap plastic instead of cast
iron stuff. Oh, and you may end up looking like the She-Hulk (this
stuff *works*), but I don't think that's a bad thing, as long as you
dye your skin green to match your new physique.
jason "Feel the burn" steiner
--
Who is Wilson Blair? stei...@primenet.com
Lynn Kerby
Now I see why the most prolific posters on RMC are the most prolific
posters on RMC (yes that is redundant and I wanted to say that). They
must think RMC is their personal forum and think they are free to post
on any subject they please. About 6 or 7 years ago I used to enjoy
most of what happened in this newsgroup. Now it has degenerated into
a personal forum for a handful of "regulars".
Now I ask, Just what does....
Chuck's amazing metabolism
Bev's lack of metabolism and body parts
Lisa's exercise regimen
Jerry's mass to muscle ratio
etc...etc...etc...ad naseum
have to do with Christian Music??????
Flame away if you must - maybe a few of the posts will actually have
the word music in them.
BTW - I thought we had a nice discussion going on the PUNK mentality
and had hoped to read a few more insightful posts on moshing. As a
developing fan of "moshable" music (but maybe a bit old for moshing) I
am trying to come to some understanding of why christians feel the
need to get up near the stage and slam each other around.
--
Lynn Kerby - l...@veritas.com VERITAS Software, Mountain View, CA
I don't care about silly disclaimers. They're my opinions and worth every
penny you paid for them! However, my employer is often less satisfied! ;-)
beverley
In article <4pndj4$2g...@ausnews.austin.ibm.com>,
Lisa Reid <lr...@mail.utexas.edu> wrote:
>I, like Bev, have been working out (Jazzercise and NordicTrack) and
>watching what I eat (I usually keep it under 25 g of fat a day), and
>still no luck. My husband keeps the fat out somewhat and doesn't
>exercise and has dropped 15 pounds. It just ain't right. *sigh*
I want a metabolism....I want a metabolism NOW....
>"Naked is not naughty." -- Ed Rock
>(However, in my case, it's scary to think about!)
:) I hear ya -- between scars and plumpness it's an ordeal to even take
off my shirt sometimes.
Jerry B. Ray
In article <DswGG...@novice.uwaterloo.ca>,
Mattias G. Hembruch <mghe...@dictator.uwaterloo.ca> wrote:
>"What they been teaching you at that sissy school of yours? You ain't fat.
>You ain't fat. You ain't nothin'!" [(c) Al Yankovic] :-)
"Yo. Ding dong, man. Ding dong." (Just saw that video the other night...)
Speaking of Fat, _The Nutty Professor_ looks amusing.
Speaking of movies, I saw _The Rock_ tonight. It, well, it ROCKED.
Peter G.
Lynn Kerby wrote:
>
[snipped]
>
> Now I ask, Just what does....
>
> Chuck's amazing metabolism
> Bev's lack of metabolism and body parts
> Lisa's exercise regimen
> Jerry's mass to muscle ratio
> etc...etc...etc...ad naseum
>
> have to do with Christian Music??????
>
> Flame away if you must - maybe a few of the posts will actually have
> the word music in them.
>
Maybe they are just demonstrating the lawless, disregard for rules, punk rock attitude
the original post was in regards to. I think this is like an exercise in acting out the
scenario.
> BTW - I thought we had a nice discussion going on the PUNK mentality
> and had hoped to read a few more insightful posts on moshing. As a
> developing fan of "moshable" music (but maybe a bit old for moshing) I
> am trying to come to some understanding of why christians feel the
> need to get up near the stage and slam each other around.
Me too.
Peter
--
Coincidence is just God's way of remaining anonymous.
http://www.netcom.com/~ppgg/peelhere
Peter G.
beverley wrote:
>
> In article <4pmnov$n...@netaxs.com>, Not Ashamed! <chee...@netaxs.com> wrote:
> >beverley (wedn...@tezcat.com) wrote:
> >
> >: Just long enough to become 6'2" and 140lbs plus gazongas. You'd be doing
> >: humanity a great service....
> >
> >Funny, I don't remember Chuck saying he had gazongas.
>
> No, no; I have gazongas. It's that I want to be thin except for the gazongas.
> I mean, they're not the BEST gazongas, but they're MY gazongas, and I'd like
> to continue having my gazongas.
>
Who was the host of the Gozonga Show? I keep trying to remember his name but can't seem
to recall.
beverley
In article <j2wx1cx...@igor.veritas.com>,
Lynn Kerby <l...@veritas.com> wrote:
>Now I see why the most prolific posters on RMC are the most prolific
>posters on RMC (yes that is redundant and I wanted to say that). They
>must think RMC is their personal forum and think they are free to post
>on any subject they please. About 6 or 7 years ago I used to enjoy
>most of what happened in this newsgroup. Now it has degenerated into
>a personal forum for a handful of "regulars".
(6 or 7 years? Hm, it's been around longer than I thought. *looks confused*)
>Now I ask, Just what does....
> Chuck's amazing metabolism
> Bev's lack of metabolism and body parts
[I have a lack of body parts? Hmmm, that's interesting. I have *scarred*
body parts, most notably my chest and torso but you can find scarring under
the left elbow if you look, but I thought everything was there. Hmm.]
> Lisa's exercise regimen
> Jerry's mass to muscle ratio
> etc...etc...etc...ad naseum
>have to do with Christian Music??????
>Flame away if you must - maybe a few of the posts will actually have
>the word music in them.
Uh, OK; have you been here for the discussions of community and small
group formation at all? Are you familiar with the "newbie guide," and
should I send you a copy?
Erk; guys, I'm gonna go off, and I don't wanna do that. Argh.
>BTW - I thought we had a nice discussion going on the PUNK mentality
>and had hoped to read a few more insightful posts on moshing. As a
>developing fan of "moshable" music (but maybe a bit old for moshing) I
>am trying to come to some understanding of why christians feel the
>need to get up near the stage and slam each other around.
"We?" I've been watching that thread (as a woman who has touch issues the
size of Kentucky, I don't mosh, but it's interesting to watch) and I don't
recall seeing your name. The old axiom applies; if there's a discussion
you want to see furthered, please contribute, or else please don't complain.
Thanks.
beverley
In article <4pnvj6$j...@acmex.gatech.edu>,
Iiiiii wanna. I wanna seeeeee.
Tonight, I saw Dragonheart. Um.
It was interesting. I mean, Sean Connery was exquisite, and, yeah, that's a
dragon, all right, but what was that cowboy doing in 942 AD......oh, wait,
that's a knight. Oh! I get it. The Quaid character is *grizzled!*
Sure.
So, dig:
Dan: "He's the biggest thing in the sky and the knight can't even SEE him?"
Bev: "Course not. He's an American."
Dan: "Ah. Unlike *some* knights, *I* can speak with an English accent."
And that star thing. um. No!
But last night, I saw The Craft again, and I want all of you to go see it now.
Jerry B. Ray
>Now I see why the most prolific posters on RMC are the most prolific
>posters on RMC (yes that is redundant and I wanted to say that). They
>must think RMC is their personal forum and think they are free to post
>on any subject they please.
r.m.c. is what it is purely because of what the people in it _make_ it.
I try to talk about music every chance I get, but discussions often tend
to veer around a bit. Try it-you might like it. If not, try talking about
stuff that you do like instead of bitching about what you don't like. You
catch more flies with honey and all that.
>About 6 or 7 years ago I used to enjoy
>most of what happened in this newsgroup.
Odd, since this group hasn't been around that long. Odd, since I don't
recall seeing your name until today and I've been here since the start.
>Now it has degenerated into
>a personal forum for a handful of "regulars".
Well, all you've gotta do to become one of the "regulars" is have a big mouth.
Talk about music if you wanna increase the amount of music traffic. There
isn't much going on in Christian music worth talking about right now, from
what I can tell.
>Now I ask, Just what does....
> Chuck's amazing metabolism
> Bev's lack of metabolism and body parts
> Lisa's exercise regimen
> Jerry's mass to muscle ratio
> etc...etc...etc...ad naseum
>have to do with Christian Music??????
chuck, bev, Lisa, and Jerry all listen to Christian music-a common interest
that brought us all together here.
what.m...@forever.com
In article <4pmo2h$n...@netaxs.com>
chee...@netaxs.com (Not Ashamed!) writes:
>
>beverley (wedn...@tezcat.com) wrote:
>
>: It's like Jesus washed my sins away and took the metabolism with Him.
>
>I'd guess the endorphins (or whatever the appropriate chemical is) which
>bring a feeling of contentment and/or happiness from sex were no longer
>created. The right food can make them brain chemicals perc again.
>
your metabolism 8-{
Matthew C. Laswell
In article <4pk13i$9...@acme.freenet.columbus.oh.us>,
cpea...@freenet.columbus.oh.us (Chuck Pearson) writes:
>[sorry, i don't have post-and-mail capability...]
>ob-r.m.c: radio-u started playing a holy soldier song called "my world"
>yesterday. i like it. this is not allowed. holy soldier is a sorry
>band, and they are simply not allowed to write good songs. what is this
>world coming to?
Well, this is just further proof of the genius of Steve Taylor - he
can even make chuck like Holy Soldier...
--
- matt laswell mat...@comm.mot.com
Absolutely not the opinion of Motorola. I speak only for myself.
"These are the days you might fill with laughter until you break.
These days, you might feel a shaft of light make its way across
your face..." - 10,000 Maniacs
Chris Kalmbacher
>Mattias G. Hembruch <mghe...@dictator.uwaterloo.ca> wrote:
>
>>"What they been teaching you at that sissy school of yours? You ain't fat.
>>You ain't fat. You ain't nothin'!" [(c) Al Yankovic] :-)
>
>"Yo. Ding dong, man. Ding dong." (Just saw that video the other night...)
>
>Speaking of Fat, _The Nutty Professor_ looks amusing.
>
Went last night to see _The Rock_, and it was great! Well...what I saw
was great. We only got to the part where Sean Connery gets caught with
his daughter (hope that doesn't give too much away - sorry if it did)...
You know, only about 1/2 to 3/4 of the way through (I think), when....
KA-BLEWIE !!!!
The theater lost all power! The whole shopping center was down! One
minute SC is on the screen, then about 30 seconds of darkness, and then
emergency lights. Big thunder and lightning storms!
The backup generators were not able to be started, and after about 30
minutes of sitting in the theater (could you believe it, the
fire-marshall wouldn't let anyone use the bathroom in the dark!), we all
got "Emergency Passes" we can use another time.
Kind of exciting....kind of frustrating (cause the movie was great! - I
still don't know how it ends! - And please don't tell me!)
Hmmmm...not much about Christian music in this post...sorry :)
Can't wait for Cstone!
--
:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
Chris Kalmbacher Psychology/Neuroscience University of Delaware
Email: Chr...@strauss.udel.edu
:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
Matthew C. Laswell
In article <4pkvkp$1...@acme.freenet.columbus.oh.us>,
cpea...@freenet.columbus.oh.us (Chuck Pearson) writes:
>arrgh. i HATE tin. one keystroke and a post disappears into the cosmos.
>let me just make the statement i had to make and be done with it.
>
>in response to me, beverley (wedn...@tezcat.com) wrote:
>: >as long as i can have your genetics in return and put on a little bulk
>: >wherever [i don't even care if it looks like beer gut at this point] that
>
>: Are you insinuating that I look like I have a beer gut?!
>
>nononononononononononononono. i am NOT insinuating that you have a beer
>gut. i am insinuating that i'd do ANYTHING for more bulk at this point.
You can have some of mine if you'd like it. Perhaps some weird
combination of liposuction/lipoblowage. The world's first lipotransfusion?
Of course, I could lose every ounce of fat in my body and still outweigh
chuck by 25 pounds or so...
Scholar and Fool
Quite suddenly, beverley <wedn...@tezcat.com> blurted out:
>>Now I see why the most prolific posters on RMC are the most prolific
>>posters on RMC (yes that is redundant and I wanted to say that). They
>>must think RMC is their personal forum and think they are free to post
>>most of what happened in this newsgroup. Now it has degenerated into
>>a personal forum for a handful of "regulars".
Hey, I take offense at this! I've been using r.m.c as my personal forum
since the time it began and I didn't see my name anywhere on the list!
>(6 or 7 years? Hm, it's been around longer than I thought. *looks confused*)
Time is relative, ya know. r.m.c started for me in around early '91, which
was when it began. Aaaahhhh....maybe Lynn is cleverly implying that the
group has never been enjoyable to him/her, since the only time it was
"enjoyable" was before it was created.
--
will the slamming ever slow?
no.
(the crucified)
@#$% Terry Leifeste, Scholar and Fool / hatf...@phoenix.net %*&$@#%&$%*#$#@
Chuck Pearson
Lynn Kerby (l...@igor.veritas.com) wrote:
: Now I see why the most prolific posters on RMC are the most prolific
: posters on RMC (yes that is redundant and I wanted to say that). They
: must think RMC is their personal forum and think they are free to post
: on any subject they please. About 6 or 7 years ago I used to enjoy
: most of what happened in this newsgroup. Now it has degenerated into
: a personal forum for a handful of "regulars".
: Now I ask, Just what does....
: Chuck's amazing metabolism
: Bev's lack of metabolism and body parts
: Lisa's exercise regimen
: Jerry's mass to muscle ratio
: etc...etc...etc...ad naseum
: have to do with Christian Music??????
: Flame away if you must - maybe a few of the posts will actually have
: the word music in them.
*sigh*
well, this is the reason i've been playing devil's advocate for the
proposed moderated group. i see this happen a lot, and i'm dealing with a
bit of guilt over this newsgroup becoming the regulars' playground.
but, in defense of the regulars, over the past three or four years a
distinct r.m.c community has developed. and it has really been neat to be
a part of this community and its development. it started with the lot of
us, terry [there, rev. phool, i mentioned you! are you happy?] and jerry
and andy whitman and rob davis and jason steiner and i and too many others too
numerous for me to remember, blabbing about Christian music, amazed that
there were other people in this world who had HEARD of the choir and daniel
amos and lifesavers underground and all these early Christian alt. bands,
much less LIKED them. and we got to discussing this stuff, and we found
that there were other things we held in common - usually it's things like
disdain for the american evangelical culture, a certain academic slant
towards things, such as that.
and this has by no means been a static group of regulars. ed rock,
beverley, matt laswell, will mcdonald, layne petersen, lisa reid...all these
people have joined the ol' discussion over the past couple of years. the past
accusations of "elitism" have no merit because we've never kept anybody
from joining our discussion. i, for one, have gone out of my way to swap
e-mail and be civil to anybody coming down the r.m.c pike who crosses my
path. [somebody ask bob weigel for a radical example of this...]
the newsgroup is what the people who post to it make it. the fact is
that, over the last year especially, the "regulars" have come to dominate
the discussion, for whatever reason, and tangents have started to fly
because the community has become so close-knit. i've looked for a
solution to draw as many different kinds of people from as many different
viewpoints as possible into the discussion. quite frankly, i'm starting
to think that there isn't one.
: BTW - I thought we had a nice discussion going on the PUNK mentality
: and had hoped to read a few more insightful posts on moshing. As a
: developing fan of "moshable" music (but maybe a bit old for moshing) I
: am trying to come to some understanding of why christians feel the
: need to get up near the stage and slam each other around.
so what have you drawn out of that discussion, lynn? quite frankly, i
still have no read on the thing. i know that there's the punk culture
that feels the right to do whatever however, and slamming around is just
fun and i should look at it as just fun, but i simply can't see it.
especially when a guy like me, with my metabolism, would get KILLED in a
mosh pit. what that culture telling me is because of my physique, i have
no right to be close to the stage to see the band. this does not compute
in my brain...
Chuck Pearson
Matthew C. Laswell (mat...@tr749.tr.comm.mot.com) wrote:
: >ob-r.m.c: radio-u started playing a holy soldier song called "my world"
: >yesterday. i like it. this is not allowed. holy soldier is a sorry
: >band, and they are simply not allowed to write good songs. what is this
: >world coming to?
: Well, this is just further proof of the genius of Steve Taylor - he
: can even make chuck like Holy Soldier...
ah...has steve been mucking around with this band?
if so, he's making progress, but all the other songs i've heard off this
album still suck.
Andrew D. Taylor
In article <4ppn3c$9...@acme.freenet.columbus.oh.us>,
Chuck Pearson <cpea...@freenet.columbus.oh.us> wrote:
>Matthew C. Laswell (mat...@tr749.tr.comm.mot.com) wrote:
>
>: Well, this is just further proof of the genius of Steve Taylor - he
>: can even make chuck like Holy Soldier...
>
>ah...has steve been mucking around with this band?
Steve Taylor?? The album was produced by David Zaffiro as have all Holy
Soldier albums. Steve Taylor?? Let's get this clarified, my copy of
Promise Man didn't come with complete liner notes so if someone else could
clue me in. Did Steve write the song in question?
>if so, he's making progress, but all the other songs i've heard off this
>album still suck.
That might help the hypothesis that Steve only wrote that one song. Hmmm.
--
Andrew D. Taylor |\/\/| Song For You - CKCU-FM 93.1
<af...@freenet.carleton.ca> _|\| |/|_CHRI - Christian Hit Radio Inc.
> OTTAWA <
http://chat.carleton.ca/~adtaylor/ >_./||\._< Carleton Engineering
Scholar and Fool
Quite suddenly, Chuck Pearson <cpea...@freenet.columbus.oh.us> blurted out:
>it started with the lot of
>us, terry [there, rev. phool, i mentioned you! are you happy?]
You should know me better than that...am I ever happy? Part of my existance
is not being happy...if I'm happy, I'm unhappy. Just a sec...that could
mean that I'm happy when I'm unhappy. But then that would...aw, forget it.
>the fact is
>that, over the last year especially, the "regulars" have come to dominate
>the discussion, for whatever reason, and tangents have started to fly
>because the community has become so close-knit.
While I consider myself a regular, I'm not sure I'd consider myself a
"regular." Most of the time I stay outside of the closeness of the more
sociable crowd - however, I have little problem just posting whatever
comment I feel like making whenever the urge arises, whether it is asked
for or wanted or not. :) And, in addition, I've been around long enough
and read often enough that I for the most part know what's going on in
the group. I feel more like an observer being active than an actual
part of a community. But then, I'm geared to think like that, and tend
to conciously and/or unconciously do things to bring such circumstances
about.
>so what have you drawn out of that discussion, lynn? quite frankly, i
>still have no read on the thing. i know that there's the punk culture
>that feels the right to do whatever however, and slamming around is just
>fun and i should look at it as just fun, but i simply can't see it.
Well, it *is* just fun, although sometimes it can turn sour. (The same as
most other things, many not involving physical issues at all.) And it's
not *all* about the right to do whatever however, although there are
certainly those people in the group.
>especially when a guy like me, with my metabolism, would get KILLED in a
>mosh pit. what that culture telling me is because of my physique, i have
>no right to be close to the stage to see the band. this does not compute
>in my brain...
The culture is "telling" you no such thing. This isn't an issue of rights.
That polarizes the issue and makes it look much more dramatic than it really
is. If you enter a culture, you play by their rules or you are looked down
on (or at least treated as an outsider for sure). That should be expected.
And it shouldn't seem that odd. You may not think the culture is fair, or
you may not like the way it is, but this isn't about a "right." If a coach
cuts you from the team because you're too small and not dexterious enough,
does that mean he's telling you that you have no right to be on the team?
You may think so, but I don't. It means you didn't make the cut, that you
don't have what it takes to adequately participate in that event. Calling
it a "right" that is being denied you makes it sound like there should be
some enforced change to give you back your "right." Maybe my analogy isn't
perfect (I know it isn't), but I think it is fairly accurate. The player
didn't have a "right" to be on the team - because it's not about "rights" -
the event and team is defined by being a certain size, dexterious, etc.
There was no "right" there to be lost.
Maybe this doesn't make sense to you. I dunno. Don't think that because
I'm saying this that I haven't been denied from stuff and cut from teams
and picked last and such - because I have. And, yeah, it sorta sucks.
But beyond the emotion, it still isn't a matter of rights.
Jerry B. Ray
In article <4pq0b3$r...@uhura.phoenix.net>,
Scholar and Fool <hatf...@alpha1.phoenix.net> wrote:
>You should know me better than that...am I ever happy? Part of my existance
>is not being happy...if I'm happy, I'm unhappy. Just a sec...that could
>mean that I'm happy when I'm unhappy. But then that would...aw, forget it.
I'm only happy when it rains.
Shari Lloyd
On 13 Jun 1996 19:19:02 GMT, af...@freenet3.carleton.ca (Andrew D.
Taylor) wrote:
>
>In article <4ppn3c$9...@acme.freenet.columbus.oh.us>,
>Chuck Pearson <cpea...@freenet.columbus.oh.us> wrote:
>>Matthew C. Laswell (mat...@tr749.tr.comm.mot.com) wrote:
>>
>>: Well, this is just further proof of the genius of Steve Taylor - he
>>: can even make chuck like Holy Soldier...
>>
>>ah...has steve been mucking around with this band?
>
>Steve Taylor?? The album was produced by David Zaffiro as have all Holy
>Soldier albums. Steve Taylor?? Let's get this clarified, my copy of
>Promise Man didn't come with complete liner notes so if someone else could
>clue me in. Did Steve write the song in question?
>
>>if so, he's making progress, but all the other songs i've heard off this
>>album still suck.
>
>That might help the hypothesis that Steve only wrote that one song. Hmmm.
>
According to the liner notes it was written by the band.
Shari Lloyd sll...@suba.com
(Cornerstone 96 Homepage) http://www.suba.com/~slloyd/cstone.html
(Chicago Area CCM Concerts) http://www.suba.com/~slloyd/
(Wisconsin CCM Concerts) http://www.suba.com/~slloyd/wis.html
"I woke up in Escher's world today ...up's down, down is out,
out is in, stairways circle back to where you're been - time
falls, water crawls, are you listening." Chagall Guevara
Chuck Pearson
Scholar and Fool (hatf...@alpha1.phoenix.net) blurted in response to me:
: You should know me better than that...am I ever happy? Part of my existance
: is not being happy...if I'm happy, I'm unhappy. Just a sec...that could
: mean that I'm happy when I'm unhappy. But then that would...aw, forget it.
ROTFL. 8-)
[...]
: >so what have you drawn out of that discussion, lynn? quite frankly, i
: >still have no read on the thing. i know that there's the punk culture
: >that feels the right to do whatever however, and slamming around is just
: >fun and i should look at it as just fun, but i simply can't see it.
: Well, it *is* just fun, although sometimes it can turn sour. (The same as
: most other things, many not involving physical issues at all.) And it's
: not *all* about the right to do whatever however, although there are
: certainly those people in the group.
well, then, what is it about, terry? you're probably more connected with
this scene than i am...
: >especially when a guy like me, with my metabolism, would get KILLED in a
: >mosh pit. what that culture telling me is because of my physique, i have
: >no right to be close to the stage to see the band. this does not compute
: >in my brain...
: The culture is "telling" you no such thing. This isn't an issue of rights.
: That polarizes the issue and makes it look much more dramatic than it really
: is.
hey, that's not me. the evangelical culture tells me to polarize issues
every chance i get...
*ducks*
: If you enter a culture, you play by their rules or you are looked down
: on (or at least treated as an outsider for sure). That should be expected.
: And it shouldn't seem that odd. You may not think the culture is fair, or
: you may not like the way it is, but this isn't about a "right." If a coach
: cuts you from the team because you're too small and not dexterious enough,
: does that mean he's telling you that you have no right to be on the team?
: You may think so, but I don't. It means you didn't make the cut, that you
: don't have what it takes to adequately participate in that event. Calling
: it a "right" that is being denied you makes it sound like there should be
: some enforced change to give you back your "right." Maybe my analogy isn't
: perfect (I know it isn't), but I think it is fairly accurate. The player
: didn't have a "right" to be on the team - because it's not about "rights" -
: the event and team is defined by being a certain size, dexterious, etc.
: There was no "right" there to be lost.
yeah, but that's about being on a sports side, with a specific goal in
mind - winning football games. what goal does the punk culture have in
mind when all the big and strong people hog the area close to the stage?
: Maybe this doesn't make sense to you. I dunno. Don't think that because
: I'm saying this that I haven't been denied from stuff and cut from teams
: and picked last and such - because I have. And, yeah, it sorta sucks.
: But beyond the emotion, it still isn't a matter of rights.
i think i can see this, acutally. [i certainly agree that it sorta
sucks.] but it still doesn't make clear what it IS a matter of. and it
still doesn't make clear what a Christ-like response to that culture
should be.
i wish i had more to add in response, but dang it, it's so tough to
respond to you intelligently, terry. i always look dumb in response. 8-)
Andrew S. Gurk Damick
This wisdom in alt.fan.wednesday did beverley impart:
: Tonight, I saw Dragonheart. Um.
:
: It was interesting. I mean, Sean Connery was exquisite, and, yeah, that's a
: dragon, all right, but what was that cowboy doing in 942 AD......oh, wait,
: that's a knight. Oh! I get it. The Quaid character is *grizzled!*
:
: Sure.
:
: So, dig:
:
: Dan: "He's the biggest thing in the sky and the knight can't even SEE him?"
: Bev: "Course not. He's an American."
: Dan: "Ah. Unlike *some* knights, *I* can speak with an English accent."
:
: And that star thing. um. No!
Oif...it was a cute and entertaining fairy tale. It didn't pretend to be
anything more. Treating it as if it were doing so is being unfair to both
the film and those who read your misdirected bile.
: But last night, I saw The Craft again, and I want all of you to go see
: it now.
After your recommendation, I thought about it for a while and asked
myself, "Hmmm....is this a film that the deity whose behavior I'm trying
to emulate would go see?" The answer was resoundingly good for both my
Saturday night and my wallet.
This, of course, is even apart from the question, "Is this a film I would
-like- to go see?"
The Rock was quite Spiffo, though, everything it promised to be, and a
great deal more. It was much better than Cats. Additionally, it gave me
extra material with which to practice my sexy fake Sean Connery accent.
--Gurk
--
Me, Gurk. You, you. Gurk say "Herfh!" to you.
http://www4.ncsu.edu/~asdamick/www/ Andrew S.
"Gurk" Damick, now a city in southern Austria.
beverley
In article <4pnd9u$c...@nnrp1.news.primenet.com>,
Jason and Heather <stei...@primenet.com> wrote:
>beverley <wedn...@tezcat.com> wrote:
>> What would you suggest? Chocolate doesn't seem to help, despite all
>> rumours to the contrary,
>
>Chocolate's a mild aphrodesiac. Makes it *worse*.
Gah.
That's just what I need. To be horny. Oh boy. Yeah, that's just what I need.
Oh yeah. Uh huh. Sure. JUST what the woman with the canonical cleavage needs.
YEAH!
>> and while the abundance of garlic in my diet might be healthy and
>> everything, it will definitely kill my chances of marrying anytime
>> soon.
>
>I don't think the answer is food. What you need is something that
>will satisfy your need for a chemical satisfaction without the
>kilocalories. Aerobic exercise is good for an endorphin rush,
>running especially. The main problem is finding something that you
>can do a lot of without getting bored, or blowing out your knees, or
>spending a ton of money that you don't have. (Guess what fits *that*
>description perfectly?)
Additionally, I have to not kill my lungs, dehydrate, overheat, or
aggravate the minor inner ear problem which kills some part of my
formerly exquisite balance.
>Check your local library for books on non-weight muscle training,
>like the kind a lot of gymnasts use. You have to do a lot of reps
>to get anywhere with those routines, so they end up being pretty
>decent aerobic workouts as well. I did a lot of that before I
>could afford equipment, and liked the results.
*nod*
Thing is, will this tone/build the abdomen at all? I'm mostly fine, if
a little flabbed, on everything but there [and, in all honesty, if I
get any more muscle on my thighs I'm never going to be proportional in
pants again].
>Now I do HIT training, which is really good for strength, not as good
>for aerobics, but takes only 15 minutes per day (long enough to work
>one muscle group to exhaustion with the heaviest weights you can use
>and still do 5-12 reps). The idea is to literally *damage* the muscle
>(you're supposed to be sore for 2 days following) then allow it a
>week to heal. Along with the pain you get a short term, very intense
>rush. If you rotate working different muscle groups from day to day
>basis, you can get a regular fix for your jones.
Ack. Um, I guess that would work -- given exactly WHAT kind of sex I
was involved with, I think my pain/endorphin tolerance could probably
deal with that, but it sounds *incredibly* risky -- I almost wonder if
I'm better off just investing in a small sting flogger and being
done with it at that point. How safe/dangerous is it if you mess up?
>On the downside, you will need a spotter, and a basic weight set with
>enough mass to really challenge you will run $100 new, possibly less
>if you can find it used, or get the cheap plastic instead of cast
>iron stuff. Oh, and you may end up looking like the She-Hulk (this
>stuff *works*), but I don't think that's a bad thing, as long as you
>dye your skin green to match your new physique.
I could live with looking like that; I really could. :)
>jason "Feel the burn" steiner
Where is Marcia, anyways? Sheesh.
"I'd rather not use sendmail. It's a security risk and has too much over-
head. I think I'll run Netscape Enterprise on NT." -- some luserboss ====
Jason and Heather
Chuck Pearson <cpea...@freenet.columbus.oh.us> wrote:
>
> i know that there's the punk culture that feels the right to do
> whatever however, and slamming around is just fun and i should look
> that culture telling me is because of my physique, i have no right
> to be close to the stage to see the band. this does not compute in
> my brain...
Ok, back on topic. I just got back from the Crash Worship ADRV
show. There were a lot of notable things about it, but one thing
really, REALLY impressed me, and actually had to do with the topic
of this thread.
Nobody got hurt. Nobody. Mind you, this is a band that makes 99%
of punk acts looks softcore. Imagine Japanese Taiko drumming with
distortion. But the pit was the nicest, most pleasant one I have ever
been in. It was too jam packed for anyone to get up enough running
speed to batter other people. I saw three or four people go down, and
get immediately hoisted back onto their feet. There were teensy
little riot girrls in the *front row*, and all through the audience.
No problem. For a while, there was even a *camera man* surfing.
(Floating, for you youngsters.)
You would have been just fine. What you need to do is stay away
from punk shows with no security, and come to industrial shows where
there are guys with kevlar gloves and handcuffs who'll toss
troublemakers on the street so the rest of us can have a good time.
jason "I was miraculously healed by Captain America" steiner
Scholar and Fool
>: >that feels the right to do whatever however, and slamming around is just
>: >fun and i should look at it as just fun, but i simply can't see it.
>
>: most other things, many not involving physical issues at all.) And it's
>: not *all* about the right to do whatever however, although there are
>: certainly those people in the group.
>
>well, then, what is it about, terry? you're probably more connected with
>this scene than i am...
Hhmmm...well, if I were to make a comment on the scene it would be mostly
as an observer and outsider - because while I try to live in the somewhat
alternative/non-mainstream arena, I did not grow up in or live inside the
punk scene. I liked and like some aspects of it and not others. But ask
several punks what it's "about" and you're going to get different answers
(and possibly start a fistfight in the process). Some will say it's about
thumbing your nose at the system, some will say it's doing what you feel
like, some will say it's fitting into a cool group, being different, etc.
Whatever it may or may not be "about" though, does not change the way the
culture has evolved - this has already happened. I personally think one
of the biggest motivating factors of the punk scene is thumbing your nose
at a culture that you don't like or that at some point in time put you
down for not being good enough or whatever. So you create a group going
out of the way to turn the system upside down - in their own life for
sure (since the system marginally rejected them in the first place), and
perhaps in the lives of those around them. All groups need some amount
of order and stability in order to stay a group, though. So I think there
is still some order, some social expectations, in the punk scene - they
just put the importance of things in a different order. I myself am not
a punk, but I know I have a different order of importance on some social
issues than the mainstream - this is part of what marginalizes me to parts
of the traditional mainstream, and also what draws me to various alternative
cultures and mindsets...their major issues are closer to mine, or the
mainstream ones they are against I am also against. Don't get me wrong,
there are punks out there who's major ideal is "F*ck you. F*ck the system.
I'll do whatever I f*cking want." But there are these sort of people in
every culture, mainstream included. The punk culture, because of the order
of things it places importance in imo, just brings this out and makes it
more blatent.
>: >especially when a guy like me, with my metabolism, would get KILLED in a
>: >mosh pit. what that culture telling me is because of my physique, i have
>: >no right to be close to the stage to see the band. this does not compute
>: >in my brain...
>
>: The culture is "telling" you no such thing. This isn't an issue of rights.
>: That polarizes the issue and makes it look much more dramatic than it really
>: is.
>
>hey, that's not me. the evangelical culture tells me to polarize issues
>every chance i get...
>
>*ducks*
You forgot to run. Now you're in trouble. :) (btw, I totally agree with
your statement. So much so, that many times I am shamed or afraid to be
tied to the evangelical culture that has devol...er...evolved in the US.)
>: If you enter a culture, you play by their rules or you are looked down
>: on (or at least treated as an outsider for sure). That should be expected.
>: And it shouldn't seem that odd. You may not think the culture is fair, or
>: you may not like the way it is, but this isn't about a "right." If a coach
>: cuts you from the team because you're too small and not dexterious enough,
>: does that mean he's telling you that you have no right to be on the team?
>: You may think so, but I don't. It means you didn't make the cut, that you
>: don't have what it takes to adequately participate in that event. Calling
>: it a "right" that is being denied you makes it sound like there should be
>: some enforced change to give you back your "right." Maybe my analogy isn't
>: perfect (I know it isn't), but I think it is fairly accurate. The player
>: didn't have a "right" to be on the team - because it's not about "rights" -
>: the event and team is defined by being a certain size, dexterious, etc.
>: There was no "right" there to be lost.
>
>yeah, but that's about being on a sports side, with a specific goal in
>mind - winning football games. what goal does the punk culture have in
>mind when all the big and strong people hog the area close to the stage?
Well, you're really picking a point of my analogy that I wasn't trying to
make a part of the relation. There isn't so much a "goal" with having the
pit in the front. It's just the place where it is - it is where the
culture has put it. I'm not sure how it came about being there...at
least I don't remember reading about it or talking about it...that's just
where it is. It's the culture. If you go into the culture, if you go to
their shows, you play by their rules. Or if you don't, you should expect
to be treated badly, or as an outsider, or both. Let me see if I can think
of a different analogy. Let's say graduation. And they put the top 10
graduates on the front row. Now, let's say you have to sit further back
because you're a mediocre student, but you really want to see the ceremony
(because, after all, you made it to graduation...). So you want to go down
front, but they won't let you because you weren't a top 10 graduate. What
I see you as saying in this situation is "What they're saying, is because
I'm not a brainiac, that I have no right to see the ceremony from the
front." Why do the top 10 get to sit up front? Some kind of right or
what? Just because they're smart? What's the significance between being
smart and sitting close to the speakers? Shouldn't the people with bad
eyesight sit up front? My answer is: it's not really right or wrong, it's
just the culture...that's the way it is. Even moreso in the punk show
than my analogy, though, you are entering into their culture. You don't
*have* to go to punk shows, you don't *have* to go down front, etc.
>: Maybe this doesn't make sense to you. I dunno. Don't think that because
>: I'm saying this that I haven't been denied from stuff and cut from teams
>: and picked last and such - because I have. And, yeah, it sorta sucks.
>: But beyond the emotion, it still isn't a matter of rights.
>
>i think i can see this, acutally. [i certainly agree that it sorta
>sucks.] but it still doesn't make clear what it IS a matter of. and it
>still doesn't make clear what a Christ-like response to that culture
>should be.
Well, I'm not sure it's necessarily a matter of any particular thing.
Maybe my further ramblings above helped explain my viewpoint a bit more.
As for the Christ-like response to the culture - I dunno. There are
plenty of aspects of the mainstream culture and the evangelical culture
that I don't really know how to respond to in a Christ-like way. If the
punks go outside of their culture (which with the popularity of today's
alternative scene is making happen...or the mainstream is invading their's)
then there is going to be some oil and water of ideas and social graces.
>i wish i had more to add in response, but dang it, it's so tough to
>respond to you intelligently, terry. i always look dumb in response. 8-)
Now that's just plain silly...I'm supposed to be the one talking about
how I look like an idiot and don't know what's going on, not the other
person. So cut that out right now! :)
Layne Petersen
Well, _Heavy Metal_ just came out on video. That'd be my recentest movie. And
it was just the same as it ever was. Lotsa sex, violence, good animation, and
bad animation all wrapped up in a bunch of 1981 music ("Radar Rider",
anyone?).
===========================================================
Peace, hope, love, Jesus Christ - Layner
===========================================================
If I die before I learn to speak, will money pay for all the days I
lived awake but half asleep? - Primitive Radio Gods
===========================================================
Layne Petersen
Peter G. wrote:
>> I am trying to come to some understanding of why christians feel the
>> need to get up near the stage and slam each other around.
>
>Me too.
Sometimes it can be cool and add to the show's experience. I can't imagine
seeing the Crucified last summer without a pit. But when it starts at a
Sixpence show or a PFR show, come on...
I just saw MxPx again the other night and it was so bad you could hardly get
to the front half of the room without getting smacked around by wayward
moshers.
===========================================================
Peace, hope, love, Jesus Christ - Layner
===========================================================
... And I'm craving to lift you up, and I'm craving to take the fall.
On the deeper side, I'm just a ride. You're mine, you're it all...
- Starflyer 59
===========================================================
Peter G.
Layne Petersen wrote:
>
> Peter G. wrote:
>
> >> I am trying to come to some understanding of why christians feel the
> >> need to get up near the stage and slam each other around.
> >
Peter G. wrote none of the above. Please be more accurate when snipping original
messages.
Peter G.
--
Coincidence is just God's way of remaining anonymous.
http://www.netcom.com/~ppgg/peelhere
#ToothAndNail IRC Undernet Channel
#Bighouse IRC Undernet Channel
Ed Rock
On 13 Jun 1996, Chuck Pearson wrote:
> Lynn Kerby (l...@igor.veritas.com) wrote:
> : They
> : must think RMC is their personal forum and think they are free to post
> : on any subject they please.
[snip]
> well, this is the reason i've been playing devil's advocate for the
> proposed moderated group. i see this happen a lot, and i'm dealing with a
> bit of guilt over this newsgroup becoming the regulars' playground.
Well, you just need to get over it.
Who the hell is Lynn Kerby? Who the hell is keeping Lynn Kerby from
posting whatever in the living heck he, she, it wants to post? Who the
hell is keeping Lynn Kerby from being a regular? Get over this crap.
No matter where you, people who frequent the place will be regulars and
those who do drive by bombings or hit and run posts will be irregulars.
It will appear the regulars control, and in fact they do, but only
because they are frequent flyers.
I've spent an awful lot of time here on rmc and also using CU See Me.
CUSM has a reflector where most people start their CUSM experience. It's
hosted by Cornell University, the .edu setting for development of CUSM.
Anyway, Cornell's reflector always has its group of regulars. Well, last
year, I was a part of their regulars. In fact, we got to the point where
we planned parties all over the US, (and OZ and CA, I think), and the
regulars would (and still do) get together from time to time. Anyway,
Cornell became so popular that the regulars felt their playgroud was
being taken over. Fine, we got us a couple of new ones. One at TCU in
Fort Worth and another at Ann Arbor, MI. Did that remedy the use of
Cornell as a playground for the regulars? No, there are now (and have
probably been a few sets of) new regulars who use it as their
playground. The biggest reason the regulars leave there is because it is
so hard to get an open spot. The reflector has a very limited number of
users it can support. RMC knows no such limits as far as I am aware. A
down side of the new clique reflectors that have sprung up--and there are
hundreds besides the ones I frequent--is that we don't meet new people
on the private ones like we did at Cornell. Sure, we know where we can
find eachother as regulars, but I haven't gotten anywhere near my
lifetime friend quota and would just as soon grab for all the friends I
can get. Anyway, I've rambled a bit, but the point is that regulars
leaving and/or feeling guilty does no good, at all. More regulars will
take their place--unless the place dies completely.
Chuck, you really need to chill out on all this guilt crap.
[deletia: history, etc.]
> and this has by no means been a static group of regulars. ed rock,
> beverley, matt laswell, will mcdonald, layne petersen, lisa reid...all these
> people have joined the ol' discussion over the past couple of years. the past
> accusations of "elitism" have no merit because we've never kept anybody
> from joining our discussion. i, for one, have gone out of my way to swap
> e-mail and be civil to anybody coming down the r.m.c pike who crosses my
> path. [somebody ask bob weigel for a radical example of this...]
>
> the newsgroup is what the people who post to it make it. the fact is
> that, over the last year especially, the "regulars" have come to dominate
> the discussion,
But it's not really even true. Regulars have always dominated the
conversation. Take a laxative, get regular, dominate, dang it.
> for whatever reason, and tangents have started to fly
> because the community has become so close-knit. i've looked for a
> solution to draw as many different kinds of people from as many different
> viewpoints as possible into the discussion. quite frankly, i'm starting
> to think that there isn't one.
Exactly.
[deletia: moshing sctuff]
Ed Rock Ed Rocks the Web http://ias.ga.unc.edu Ed Crabtree
"Convenience is the law you keep and your compassion's ankle deep."
--Steve Taylor
Gary Abersek
stei...@primenet.com (Jason and Heather) informed:
>Ok, back on topic. I just got back from the Crash Worship ADRV
>show.
Who the h-e-double-hockey-sticks is Crash Worship ADRV??
I think of myself as info-musically savvy and no band name like this
has come before my eyes before this (closest would be "KLF" or "NRBQ").
I must find more cool music and buy it! Gimme, gimme, gimme!
>Nobody got hurt. Nobody. Mind you, this is a band that makes 99%
>of punk acts looks softcore. Imagine Japanese Taiko drumming with
>distortion.
"Japanese Taiko drumming": define and explain...
>For a while, there was even a *camera man* surfing.
>(Floating, for you youngsters.)
Hey, don't ask me (relative youngster at 27) where "floating" came
from--my guess is newspaper writers who couldn't reconcile "surfing" with
the fact that it's usually done on one's back (feet if you're really
lucky--but I've only heard "floating" used in the last two months.
>... come to industrial shows where
>there are guys with kevlar gloves and handcuffs who'll toss
>troublemakers on the street so the rest of us can have a good time.
Cool. Where can we get these kevlar gloves and where could we rent
these guys so as to employ them in crowds of "young Brian Mulroneys"
("selfish crowd goons" as defined by Peter Garrett, lately of Oz).
>jason "I was miraculously healed by Captain America" steiner
I'll ask, as well...where is this Heather? Is she a member of the
clique? Does she have a life, unlike many here, thus enabling her to get
most of her illumination from Mr. Sun, not Mr. Electron-Gun CRT?
Gary Abersek
Victoria, BC
Chuck Pearson
Ed Rock (ec...@ias.ga.unc.edu) wrote in response to me:
: > well, this is the reason i've been playing devil's advocate for the
: > proposed moderated group. i see this happen a lot, and i'm dealing with a
: > bit of guilt over this newsgroup becoming the regulars' playground.
: Well, you just need to get over it.
: Who the hell is Lynn Kerby? Who the hell is keeping Lynn Kerby from
: posting whatever in the living heck he, she, it wants to post? Who the
: hell is keeping Lynn Kerby from being a regular? Get over this crap.
: No matter where you, people who frequent the place will be regulars and
: those who do drive by bombings or hit and run posts will be irregulars.
: It will appear the regulars control, and in fact they do, but only
: because they are frequent flyers.
[examples deleted]
: Anyway, I've rambled a bit, but the point is that regulars leaving and/or
: feeling guilty does no good, at all. More regulars will take their place--
: unless the place dies completely.
: Chuck, you really need to chill out on all this guilt crap.
ed, you know i'm only taking this 'cause it's you telling it to me. 8-)
look, i don't need anybody to tell me i take this newsgroup too seriously.
i *KNOW* i take this newsgroup too seriously. and i know i let things
that happen on this newsgroup affect me too much.
that aside, i still can't help but think that our domination of things
around here drives some people away. i am well acquainted with the fear
of feeling stupid and out-of-place in a new environment, and i know that
if the shoe were on the other foot, and it was a bunch of your garden-
variety evangelicals talking on here about sandi patti and 4Him and that
ilk of singer, i would feel awful sheepish about mentioning adam again in
a post. fear of catcalls like "they sound so worldly. why do you listen
to them? why don't you check out the new wes king album? you'd like
them, i bet..." why should i expect others to feel any different about
mentioning 4Him around here? especially when i'm so likely to do "4Him?
what a bunch of creampuffs. what do they do, process their music in a
factory? why don't you check out the choir?"
in other words, i find it far easier to forgive the arrogance of a
hit-n-run poster when i see the arrogance reflected in myself.
[...]
: > the newsgroup is what the people who post to it make it. the fact is
: > that, over the last year especially, the "regulars" have come to dominate
: > the discussion,
: But it's not really even true. Regulars have always dominated the
: conversation. Take a laxative, get regular, dominate, dang it.
"regulars" in quotes, ed, because i think the group that is percieved as
the regulars is of a single ilk. there was a time on r.m.c that there
were regulars in two or three different running discussions, one along
"alternative"/anti-evangelical lines, one along ccm/worship/traditional
evangelical lines. [you might divide that last into two different
discussions.] and part of what made r.m.c so neat in the past was that
you could bounce among groups and discuss worship music one moment and the
swirling eddies the next. for whatever reason, though, the more
traditional folk have been disappearing, or in much more constant flux, of
late.
[this is where matt laswell comes in and complains about my definition of
evangelical.]
anyway, this is what has been going through my brain of late.
Jerry B. Ray
In article <4pundk$b...@wumpus.its.uow.edu.au>, snail <sv...@uow.edu.au> wrote:
>Speaking of _The Rock_ it was supposed to come out here a few days
>ago, but the censors gave it an "R" rating (I thiunk that's equivalent
>to the US "X" - anyway it's the same rating that _Leaving Las Vegas_
>and _Showgirls_ got) but the distributor wanted a less restrictive
>category so it's being cut and is now due for release sometime in
>July.
?! What the heck? There was no nudity, one minor sex scene, standard
action movie language, and very little graphic violence (lots of violence,
just not particularly graphic). What was the problem?
Jerry B. Ray
In article <4puqnk$k...@acme.freenet.columbus.oh.us>,
Chuck Pearson <cpea...@freenet.columbus.oh.us> wrote:
>that aside, i still can't help but think that our domination of things
>around here drives some people away.
chuck, our "domination" of the newsgroup stems only from the fact that
we talk the most. You know there's no grand plot at work here.
>why should i expect others to feel any different about
>mentioning 4Him around here? especially when i'm so likely to do "4Him?
>what a bunch of creampuffs. what do they do, process their music in a
>factory? why don't you check out the choir?"
Nevermind the fact that such a thing is seldom if ever said around
here.
Chuck Pearson
Jerry B. Ray (vap...@prism.gatech.edu) wrote in response to me:
: >that aside, i still can't help but think that our domination of things
: >around here drives some people away.
: chuck, our "domination" of the newsgroup stems only from the fact that
: we talk the most. You know there's no grand plot at work here.
never said that there was.
: >why should i expect others to feel any different about
: >mentioning 4Him around here? especially when i'm so likely to do "4Him?
: >what a bunch of creampuffs. what do they do, process their music in a
: >factory? why don't you check out the choir?"
: Nevermind the fact that such a thing is seldom if ever said around
: here.
so i'm reaching, OK? cut me some slack here...
jerry and ed, you may feel free to come to columbus at any time and slap
me around.
8-)'s applied liberally all around.
Joshua Mast
As Josh was cloning Jerry said in warning:
JBR> [re: men]
>They have a larger muscle mass, thereby burning more calories.
JBR>
JBR> Heh. You obviously haven't _seen_ me. :-) (Actually, I'm stronger
JBR> than I look, but that's not hard...)
Heh heh.. i'm 14, 6'1", & 230 pounds. i scare a good amount of people
in my youth group.. ^_^
---
[ J o s h u a M a s t ] ==== jm...@freedomnet.com == joshu...@sotl.com
[ p l e e t o ][cement!] ========================= josh...@firstsaga.com
... "...we're Star Fleet officers. Weird is part of the job." - Janeway
___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.20 [NR]
snail
>Jerry B. Ray <vap...@prism.gatech.edu> wrote:
>>Speaking of movies, I saw _The Rock_ tonight. It, well, it ROCKED.
Speaking of _The Rock_ it was supposed to come out here a few days
ago, but the censors gave it an "R" rating (I thiunk that's equivalent
to the US "X" - anyway it's the same rating that _Leaving Las Vegas_
and _Showgirls_ got) but the distributor wanted a less restrictive
category so it's being cut and is now due for release sometime in
July.
tata
snail
--
___ |I'm a man of my word. In the end, that's all there is.
/ _ \ S L| // - Avon
/_ \\ \ N I | \X/sv...@uow.edu.au
-_\_\_/_/_-_-A-_|GAT -d+ H++* w+++ C++ N+++ !W Y+ b+++ e+++ r--->+++ u-
Jason and Heather
snail <sv...@uow.edu.au> wrote:
>
> Don't know yet, it may might only be one or two scenes. But we've
> just recently had a gunman go wild in Tasmania killing 35 people,
> and people have been really touchy for a while now about violence
> in films. The whole censorship thing is just getting bigger and
> bigger, it's more than just the net, although it all ties in. We
> used to be much more tolerant than US audiences...I don't know what
> happened.
I can tell you exactly what happened.
Y'all were ready to trade your liberties for safety a long time ago.
You just didn't feel the need. Now that the illusion of safety has
been shattered, your freedoms and "tolerance" are going out the door
at fire sale prices, sold to the person who promises you the most
protection from the evil world outside.
It's sad, really, 'cause I can see the U.S. getting set up for
exactly the same thing.
> Actually come to think of it I'm not being entirely fair. I just
> remembered a case a few years back when _Hardware_ came out, the
> mainstream cinemas screened a cut M-rated version (15+) whilst a
> couple of the arthouse cinemas screened the uncut R-rated version.
Horrible movie. The killer robot is worth the price of rental on cheap
video night though. I knew the american flag painted on it's skull
was only so much cheap symbolism, but it had me rolling on the floor
all the same.
jason "It's a madhouse! A MADHOUSE!" steiner
Jason and Heather
Gary Abersek <big7...@islandnet.com> wrote:
> stei...@primenet.com (Jason and Heather) informed:
> >
> > Ok, back on topic. I just got back from the Crash Worship ADRV
> > show.
>
> Who the h-e-double-hockey-sticks is Crash Worship ADRV?? I think of
> myself as info-musically savvy and no band name like this has come
> before my eyes before this (closest would be "KLF" or "NRBQ"). I
> must find more cool music and buy it! Gimme, gimme, gimme!
Their home page is at
http://www.meer.net/~charnel/crashwor/crashpg.htm
I highly recommend you check out the tour schedule and try to
attend a show. (They'll be in the Chicago/Michigan/Ohio area in
early July.) Listening to a CD or 7" is but a pale auditory shadow
of the Crash Worship experience.
> "Japanese Taiko drumming": define and explain...
That's about as well as I can define it. One of the best Taiko
ensembles has a home page at:
http://www1.sony.co.jp/InfoPlaza/SME/Music/Info/KODO/
> Where can we get these kevlar gloves and where could we rent
> these guys so as to employ them in crowds of "young Brian Mulroneys"
> ("selfish crowd goons" as defined by Peter Garrett, lately of Oz).
Do Canadians have private security companies? If you do, they
should be listed in your local telephone directory. They generally
provide their own equipment.
> > jason "I was miraculously healed by Captain America" steiner
>
> I'll ask, as well...where is this Heather? Is she a member of the
> clique? Does she have a life, unlike many here, thus enabling her
> to get most of her illumination from Mr. Sun, not Mr. Electron-Gun
> CRT?
She's at work right now. She has a life, but it doesn't involve sun.
Heather mostly uses the internet to email friends. She's more of a
misanthrope than I, and if she had the patience for USENET, her
replies would be even less diplomatic than mine. :)
jason "1/2 of a match made in hell" steiner
beverley
Chuck Pearson <cpea...@freenet.columbus.oh.us> wrote:
>jerry and ed, you may feel free to come to columbus at any time and slap
>me around.
I'm telling Kristin.
--
http://www.hallucinet.com/wednesday * http://www.tezcat.com/~wednsday
======Ya gotta hate it when reality intrudes on your well-constructed
==========================================world view. -- Matt Laswell
beverley
Andrew S. "Gurk" Damick <gu...@ncsu.edu> wrote:
>This wisdom in alt.fan.wednesday did beverley impart:
>: Tonight, I saw Dragonheart. Um.
>
>Oif...it was a cute and entertaining fairy tale. It didn't pretend to be
>anything more.
Thing is, a) it wasn't cute, b) it wasn't overly entertaining, and c) it
couldn't decided if it was going to be pretentious or not. One minute you
have light and fluffy, and then the next we're dealing with questions of
cruelty and the afterlife. Even Sean Connery's vocal performance felt
halfhearted. And then, to top it all off, the ending was a ripoff of
_Sesame Street Goes To The Metropolitan Museum Of Art_. I went in expecting
something much more faithful to the spirit of the dragon, and was deeply
disappointed; better fairytales were had years ago in Jim Henson's peak...
>Treating it as if it were doing so is being unfair to both
>the film and those who read your misdirected bile.
I'm not sure where you get "bile" from the post. The "recent movies" thread
had been going on in RMC, I contributed and was laughing so hard remembering
the exchange between Dan and I at the theatre that I thought others in a.f.w.
might find it amusing. *shrug* I boggle at things that boggle me.
>: But last night, I saw The Craft again, and I want all of you to go see
>: it now.
>
>After your recommendation, I thought about it for a while and asked
>myself, "Hmmm....is this a film that the deity whose behavior I'm trying
>to emulate would go see?" The answer was resoundingly good for both my
>Saturday night and my wallet.
I'm also not sure how you came to the conclusion that Christ wouldn't go see
_The Craft_. I tend to think that He was behind my being presented with the
opportunity to see it, actually, as I'd not been planning on going anywhere
near it, and that He'd probably go with a few friends and sit with them
over coffee fairly late, talking about it and using it as a springboard
for discussion of other things. [Of course, strange woman that I am, I see
this all happening in the Denny's out about ten minutes from Willow Creek
*grin*]...
Consider, if you will, Acts 17 -- a dead horse of a chapter, but a relevant
one nonetheless -- and Paul springing off of Athenian poetry and altars
to bring the gospel closer to the people he was with. You never know when
better familiarity with something that seems alien to you, and may not
even directly touch your life (though there's really few people not affected
by Wicca and similar paths of late, especially if they're in an urban setting)
will prove helpful to you in the long run.
I suppose one might counter with I Corinthians 6:12 -- "Everything is
permissible for me--but not everything is beneficial," on the off chance
that you're tripping on the "it's about witchcraft" dealie. If you're not
interested in the subject matter, or are overly concerned with the effect
exposure to it might have on you [and I can see where some might stumble
from seeing the film, though less from the actual occultism and more from
the worldview presented -- If _Heathers_ messed with you, _The Craft_ will
too, I expect...], then seeing the film might not be a beneficial experience.
That being said, I can't see it not being worth the time of anyone willing
to invest ninety minutes in the experience and a few hours of thought
afterwards, and I certainly don't see where it would be godly to avoid
the knowledge or experience.
>The Rock was quite Spiffo, though, everything it promised to be, and a
>great deal more. It was much better than Cats.
I'm planning to see this next, and hope to enjoy it. :)
--
http://www.hallucinet.com/wednesday *** http://www.tezcat.com/~wednsday
My ladies, they all fear, but I am bold. I don't ask why. =============
I'm going higher without you. -- Aleixa ===============================
beverley
snail
vap...@prism.gatech.edu (Jerry B. Ray) writes:
>In article <4pundk$b...@wumpus.its.uow.edu.au>, snail <sv...@uow.edu.au> wrote:
>?! What the heck? There was no nudity, one minor sex scene, standard
>action movie language, and very little graphic violence (lots of violence,
>just not particularly graphic). What was the problem?
Don't know yet, it may might only be one or two scenes. But we've just
recently had a gunman go wild in Tasmania killing 35 people, and people
have been really touchy for a while now about violence in films. The
whole censorship thing is just getting bigger and bigger, it's more
than just the net, although it all ties in. We used to be much more
tolerant than US audiences...I don't know what happened. Actually
come to think of it I'm not being entirely fair. I just remembered
a case a few years back when _Hardware_ came out, the mainstream
cinemas screened a cut M-rated version (15+) whilst a couple of the
arthouse cinemas screened the uncut R-rated version.
tata
Christopher C Parks
In article <4puqnk$k...@acme.freenet.columbus.oh.us> cpearson@freenet.
columbus.oh.us (Chuck Pearson) writes:
>Ed Rock (ec...@ias.ga.unc.edu) wrote in response to me:
>that aside, i still can't help but think that our domination of things
>of feeling stupid and out-of-place in a new environment, and i know that
>if the shoe were on the other foot, and it was a bunch of your garden-
>variety evangelicals talking on here about sandi patti and 4Him and that
>ilk of singer, i would feel awful sheepish about mentioning adam again in
>a post. fear of catcalls like "they sound so worldly. why do you listen
>to them? why don't you check out the new wes king album? you'd like
>mentioning 4Him around here? especially when i'm so likely to do "4Him?
>what a bunch of creampuffs. what do they do, process their music in a
>factory? why don't you check out the choir?"
Sensitivity to others in this regard is praiseworthy. Where i agree with
Ed on this (at least i think i am reading Ed right) is that you need to
balance your sensitivity with an awareness of the realities of Usenet and
other public forums.
Open forums are free to whomever wishes to say anything. If some people
have more to say than others, they will do so, and will, consequently,
tend to "dominate" discussion in the sense that readers will see and hear
what the regulars have to say more frequently.
Here's where i agree with Ed: this ain't inherently a bad thing.
One aspect of Usenet seems to have been pretty much ignored in all the
recent discussion of moderation and crossposting: one very good way of
improving the signal-noise ratio is to increase the signal. If people
don't like the directions that one or several threads in this group are
taking, they are free to start and maintain their own discussions on topics
they want to see discussed. Unfortunately, it is easier (and apparently
more deeply ingrained in human nature) to simply complain than it is to
start posting the kinds of articles that will create the kinds of
discussion such people want to see and participate in.
Judging by this group's charter, there is no reason why there shouldn't be
ongoing discussions on all kinds of musical styles. To a certain extent,
this happens. There are discussions on a wide variety of musical styles
going on in this newsgroup at any one time. I choose to participate in
certain of those threads, because i know something about the music being
discussed, and/or have opinions about this artist or that artist. I
ignore other theads, because they are about musical styles i know little
or nothing about and/or have no interest in.
Where sensitivity should come in, IMO, is in allowing threads that we are
not personally interested in to continue with little or no interference.
The kind of condescending attempts to influence other people's musical
tastes that chuck is concerned about constitutes the kind of intereference
i mean.
Punk music does nothing for me. That is an example of my taste (or lack
thereof, depending upon whom you ask :> ). When i see an article or
series of articles about punk music, i don't post disparaging articles
telling folks that they really ought to listen to my favorite styles.
To do so would only create a potential for loudly voiced disagreement,
which tends to degenerate into the kinds of postings that increase the
noise in the group.
Personally, i wouldn't worry about the frequency of postings from this
groups regulars driving people away. If people complain that no one is
talking about a particular artist or a particular style of music, the
regular posters should respond as they often do: by inviting the
newcomers to begin their own discussions. I have no doubt that if the
invitation is accepted, a new group of regulars will establish itself
within r.m.c. But all anyone can do is invite participation. It is up
to the others to choose to participate, or not.
>in other words, i find it far easier to forgive the arrogance of a
>hit-n-run poster when i see the arrogance reflected in myself.
Sounds reminiscent of some words i have heard about splinters and planks.
Peace,
chris
Ed Rock
On 17 Jun 1996, Christopher C Parks wrote:
[good stuff deleted]
> Personally, i wouldn't worry about the frequency of postings from this
> groups regulars driving people away. If people complain that no one is
> talking about a particular artist or a particular style of music, the
> regular posters should respond as they often do: by inviting the
> newcomers to begin their own discussions. I have no doubt that if the
> invitation is accepted, a new group of regulars will establish itself
> within r.m.c. But all anyone can do is invite participation. It is up
> to the others to choose to participate, or not.
And I think it is made clear time and again, by the "controllers," that
all are welcome to participate in the threads that are ongoing and tha
further all are welcome to start their own threads. Heck, if it
interests me, chances are I'll join in. ;-)
Ed Rock
On 16 Jun 1996, beverley wrote:
> Chuck Pearson <cpea...@freenet.columbus.oh.us> wrote:
> >jerry and ed, you may feel free to come to columbus at any time and slap
> >me around.
>
> I'm telling Kristin.
She'll be glad to put the ABBA on as background music.
beverley
In article <4q1sq7$o...@nnrp1.news.primenet.com>,
>
> http://www.meer.net/~charnel/crashwor/crashpg.htm
>
>I highly recommend you check out the tour schedule and try to
>attend a show. (They'll be in the Chicago/Michigan/Ohio area in
>early July.) Listening to a CD or 7" is but a pale auditory shadow
>of the Crash Worship experience.
RMCinterested/AFW: Crash Worship comes to town July 12th -- the Empty
Bottle in Chicago. Methinks this is a Brain Show.... and Cathy, you
might be interested.... :)
--
http://www.hallucinet.com/wednesday ** http://www.tezcat.com/~wednsday
Ugly dressed up in a pretty face is the echo which whirls within. - Aleixa
cya...@students.uiuc.edu
wedn...@tezcat.com (beverley) writes:
>In article <4q1sq7$o...@nnrp1.news.primenet.com>,
>Jason and Heather <stei...@primenet.com> wrote:
>>I highly recommend you check out the tour schedule and try to
>>attend a show. (They'll be in the Chicago/Michigan/Ohio area in
>>early July.) Listening to a CD or 7" is but a pale auditory shadow
>>of the Crash Worship experience.
>RMCinterested/AFW: Crash Worship comes to town July 12th -- the Empty
>Bottle in Chicago. Methinks this is a Brain Show.... and Cathy, you
>might be interested.... :)
Of course. But first, I'm more interested in obtaining some $$$. :)
cathy
O O O *
O O O * I cuss, you cuss
O O O * we all cuss
O Yes, they'llO know we are Christians * for asparagus.
O O O by the fish on our cars. * -- Gary Larson
O O O *
O O O <cya...@uiuc.edu http://www.students.uiuc.edu/~cyanide>
Layne Petersen
Jerry B. Ray wrote:
>In article <4pq0b3$r...@uhura.phoenix.net>,
>Scholar and Fool <hatf...@alpha1.phoenix.net> wrote:
>
>>You should know me better than that...am I ever happy? Part of my existance
>>is not being happy...if I'm happy, I'm unhappy. Just a sec...that could
>>mean that I'm happy when I'm unhappy. But then that would...aw, forget it.
>
>I'm only happy when it rains.
Pour your misery down on me...
Matthew C. Laswell
In article <4ps5sm$3...@uhura.phoenix.net>,
hatf...@alpha1.phoenix.net (Scholar and Fool) writes:
<big ol' snip>
>My answer is: it's not really right or wrong, it's
>just the culture...that's the way it is. Even moreso in the punk show
>than my analogy, though, you are entering into their culture. You don't
>*have* to go to punk shows, you don't *have* to go down front, etc.
This is all well and good for punk shows, but what about the extent
to which moshing, slamming and such have become the nifty thing
to do at concerts where they are sadly out of place? For example,
I would have really liked to get closer to Hoi Polloi or the 77s
at Cornerstone last summer, but didn't want to get whacked. In those
circumstances, I wasn't entering into any punk culture, I was
entering into nifty-keen-aren't-we-alternative mainstream culture...
This is really neither here nor there, I suppose, but it irks me.
--
- matt laswell mat...@comm.mot.com
Absolutely not the opinion of Motorola. I speak only for myself.
"These are the days you might fill with laughter until you break.
These days, you might feel a shaft of light make its way across
your face..." - 10,000 Maniacs
hazelnut
Layne_P...@Ministrynet.usa.net (Layne Petersen) wrote:
>Jerry B. Ray wrote:
>
>>
>>I'm only happy when it rains.
>
>Pour your misery down on me...
what about, "you're my sunny-day rain ... "?
"only happy when it rains" by the jesus and mary chain.
i still don't like no doubt, without a doubt! she sings like she's
only five years old!
-hazelnut -- hasn't rained for a long time ... *sigh*
Jerry B. Ray
>>>I'm only happy when it rains.
>>Pour your misery down on me...
>what about, "you're my sunny-day rain ... "?
>"only happy when it rains" by the jesus and mary chain.
Nah, Garbage is cool.
>i still don't like no doubt, without a doubt! she sings like she's
>only five years old!
I like "Spiderwebs" a WHOLE lot.
Jason and Heather
hazelnut <peg...@scf.usc.edu> wrote:
>
> i still don't like no doubt, without a doubt! she sings like she's
> only five years old!
Uh, are you hearing the same pair of lungs I am? Yeah, Gwen's got
the kittenish moan down, but there's *nothing* five years old
about that. She's a living piece of B-29 nose art.
jason "1940's man" steiner
beverley
In article <4q4hka$7...@brokaw.comm.mot.com>,
Matthew C. Laswell <mat...@comm.mot.com> wrote:
>This is all well and good for punk shows, but what about the extent
>to which moshing, slamming and such have become the nifty thing
>to do at concerts where they are sadly out of place? For example,
>I would have really liked to get closer to Hoi Polloi or the 77s
>at Cornerstone last summer, but didn't want to get whacked. In those
>circumstances, I wasn't entering into any punk culture, I was
>entering into nifty-keen-aren't-we-alternative mainstream culture...
*awakens from Aleixa trance*
The only solution I've been able to find is developing the ability
to create a radius of about two feet's worth of "Don't touch me."
I seem to have lost this skill, sadly....
>This is really neither here nor there, I suppose, but it irks me.
Crowds. blech.
Lynn Kerby
[ This is going to be a little on the long side - hope you stay to the end ]
In article <4pohu4$3...@huitzilo.tezcat.com> wedn...@tezcat.com (beverley) writes:
>In article <j2wx1cx...@igor.veritas.com>,
>Lynn Kerby <l...@veritas.com> wrote:
>>Now I see why the most prolific posters on RMC are the most prolific
>>posters on RMC (yes that is redundant and I wanted to say that). They
>>must think RMC is their personal forum and think they are free to post
>>on any subject they please. About 6 or 7 years ago I used to enjoy
>>most of what happened in this newsgroup. Now it has degenerated into
>>a personal forum for a handful of "regulars".
>
>(6 or 7 years? Hm, it's been around longer than I thought. *looks confused*)
I thought the group has been around since 89 or so, but I have
certainly lost track of when it first appeared at my site; I do know I
was l...@amdahl.com at the time. I have been told by others that it
started in about 91 - could be. I have been primarily an observer
from the beginning and am generally content to do so though in the
very early days I probably posted about once a week (now I post once
in a very great while - though I do send out the occasional email
message in response to something here. This group has been a real eye
opener for me and I have learned a lot over the years, but for the
past few years it seems that most threads that go beyond a few
responses have degenerated into personal discussions.
>>Now I ask, Just what does....
>> Chuck's amazing metabolism
>> Bev's lack of metabolism and body parts
>
>[I have a lack of body parts? Hmmm, that's interesting. I have *scarred*
>body parts, most notably my chest and torso but you can find scarring under
>the left elbow if you look, but I thought everything was there. Hmm.]
I'm sorry, I didn't mean to imply that you do not have body parts -
having never seen you. That was an editorial mistake, originally it
was something about your gazongas (or however you spell that), but I
thought other's that were mentioned might be jealous if you got 2
lines (and now you have gotten a bunch more!).
>> Lisa's exercise regimen
>> Jerry's mass to muscle ratio
>> etc...etc...etc...ad naseum
>>have to do with Christian Music??????
>>Flame away if you must - maybe a few of the posts will actually have
>>the word music in them.
>
>Uh, OK; have you been here for the discussions of community and small
>group formation at all? Are you familiar with the "newbie guide," and
>should I send you a copy?
>
>Erk; guys, I'm gonna go off, and I don't wanna do that. Argh.
I appreciate your restraint. I am hardly a newbie, but I have thrown
away a significant number of posts in this group without even glancing
at subjects. I do know about some of the small groups that exist and
saw some of the community discussions but I fade in and out due to the
nature of my work and life and my (un)willingness to wade through the
1000 or so postings a week to find the few that are actually about
christian music. If you think I need to read that stuff, then I will
welcome it.
>>BTW - I thought we had a nice discussion going on the PUNK mentality
>>and had hoped to read a few more insightful posts on moshing. As a
>>developing fan of "moshable" music (but maybe a bit old for moshing) I
>>am trying to come to some understanding of why christians feel the
>>need to get up near the stage and slam each other around.
>
>"We?" I've been watching that thread (as a woman who has touch issues the
>size of Kentucky, I don't mosh, but it's interesting to watch) and I don't
>recall seeing your name. The old axiom applies; if there's a discussion
>you want to see furthered, please contribute, or else please don't complain.
>Thanks.
Yes, WE - consider RMC as a group gathered in a large conference hall,
a few podiums exist up front and people stand up to pontificate
periodically. Even if you do not get up to talk often you are still a
participant. I have not yet contributed because I was exercising some
restraint. I am well aware that everyone has an opinion and I have
the opinion that not everyone should voice theirs ;-). [I obviously
didn't listen to myself before I posted my reply, but it has generated
some discussion that is less off-topic than before]. Several of the
posters on the thread don't get the idea of moshing and have posted
views that do not differ much from mine. I have nothing to add, so I
wait and watch and maybe learn - then along comes this silly little
tangent so I speak out (something that I do very rarely and will
either do more or less of in the future). Ok, enough about that back
to what I may have posted before the thread took off on its
tangent(s).
I never got into the punk scene and until recently never listened to
much music outside of the AC world. It's not something I'm really
proud of, but from 1981-1991 I listened to no-one but John Michael
Talbot, Terry Talbot, Kieth Green, Don Francisco, Michael W Smith, and
a handful of other Christian artists (maybe that will answer some of
the questions about why nobody has heard of me). In the past couple
of years I have been getting into more diverse music and just recently
I had my first exposure to a (probably tame) mosh pit. It was the
Spring Celebration Concert at Great America and I saw bands like Black
Eyed Sceva, Christafari, and PlankEye for the first time (missed Poor
Old Lu due to scheduling conflicts with JoC - and I now know I made
the wrong choice!). During the PlankEye concert I was a bit upset by
the attitude of the people that were pushing their way into pit (I was
well away from it) and was upset when a girl was dragged out with an
injury (I think it was just a sprained ankle). At the time I thought
"she is getting what she deserves, all the pushing and shoving and
floating... - someone is bound to get hurt", but later I realised that
was a callous attitude, triggered in part by the number of people that
would come out of the pit and see a foot or so of space between me and
the group in front of me and take up residence. I really liked the
music, but I think the live concert scene is a little more than I can
handle. Next concert was in a church and I saw Dime Store Prophets
(well sometimes I could see them between all the people crowding
around the stage). Again, I really like the music, but was distracted
by the activities of the "younger crowd" in front of the stage. I'll
have to admit that it looked like fun but not something that I would
be comfortable doing and the kids probably wouldn't be comfortable
with me doing either.
As a "thirty-something" year old father of 4 with a soon to be teenage
daughter, I really want to understand what is going on in the minds of
the young people at these concerts. As christians we are exorted to
do all things to the glory of God, so what gives? How is God
glorified by the guy (or gal) floating over the pit or stage diving or
even just slamming someone (how many slam complete strangers)?
--
Lynn Kerby - l...@veritas.com VERITAS Software, Mountain View, CA
I don't care about silly disclaimers. They're my opinions and worth every
penny you paid for them! However, my employer is often less satisfied! ;-)
jes
What is Crash Worship like? I've been told I'd like them, but never been
given a good description.
Lynn Kerby
In article <4ppo8n$e...@acme.freenet.columbus.oh.us> cpea...@freenet.columbus.oh.us (Chuck Pearson) writes:
>well, this is the reason i've been playing devil's advocate for the
>proposed moderated group. i see this happen a lot, and i'm dealing with a
>bit of guilt over this newsgroup becoming the regulars' playground.
>
>distinct r.m.c community has developed. and it has really been neat to be
>a part of this community and its development. it started with the lot of
>us, terry [there, rev. phool, i mentioned you! are you happy?] and jerry
>and andy whitman and rob davis and jason steiner and i and too many others too
>numerous for me to remember, blabbing about Christian music, amazed that
>there were other people in this world who had HEARD of the choir and daniel
>amos and lifesavers underground and all these early Christian alt. bands,
>much less LIKED them. and we got to discussing this stuff, and we found
>that there were other things we held in common - usually it's things like
>disdain for the american evangelical culture, a certain academic slant
>towards things, such as that.
I remember it starting up too. And saw the groups beginning to form.
Prior to that time I was an occasional poster, but as the discussions
moved to alternative groups and happenings at CStone concerts and such
I began to drop out. I was still very deeply rooted in my AC world
and wasn't looking for fresh views (I think I am now). I really miss
Andy Whitman these days. Now I want to go back (the story of my life)
and revisit those days when the regulars were blabbing about christian
music and the new bands.
>and this has by no means been a static group of regulars. ed rock,
>beverley, matt laswell, will mcdonald, layne petersen, lisa reid...all these
>people have joined the ol' discussion over the past couple of years. the past
>accusations of "elitism" have no merit because we've never kept anybody
>from joining our discussion. i, for one, have gone out of my way to swap
>e-mail and be civil to anybody coming down the r.m.c pike who crosses my
>path. [somebody ask bob weigel for a radical example of this...]
>
>the newsgroup is what the people who post to it make it. the fact is
>that, over the last year especially, the "regulars" have come to dominate
>the discussion, for whatever reason, and tangents have started to fly
>because the community has become so close-knit. i've looked for a
>solution to draw as many different kinds of people from as many different
>viewpoints as possible into the discussion. quite frankly, i'm starting
>to think that there isn't one.
I have seen enough of the postings since the inception of the group
to know that the regulars change periodically. I would agree that
the current group of regulars are so close knit that they don't really
see their postings as tangents or off-topic (it's their group after
all). I hope I didn't just put words in your mouth chuck, but that is
what I think you were saying - it is certainly what I am saying.
There isn't one what? A solution? No, there probably isn't much you
can do, or I can do, or another individual can do. As a group I would
like to see an effort to remain on topic. I just hate coming back
from a few weeks away and to see all these great subjects only to find
out that the discussion has degenerated nothing more than seemingly
pointless stream of posts like the ones in the "Joan Osbourne doesn't
get it" thread currently. I guess that is what I object to - the
silly, sometimes flippant replies that the world at large probably
doesn't care about, but the "close-knit community" gets into on a
regular basis.
>: BTW - I thought we had a nice discussion going on the PUNK mentality
>: and had hoped to read a few more insightful posts on moshing. As a
>: developing fan of "moshable" music (but maybe a bit old for moshing) I
>: am trying to come to some understanding of why christians feel the
>: need to get up near the stage and slam each other around.
>
>so what have you drawn out of that discussion, lynn? quite frankly, i
>still have no read on the thing. i know that there's the punk culture
>that feels the right to do whatever however, and slamming around is just
>fun and i should look at it as just fun, but i simply can't see it.
>especially when a guy like me, with my metabolism, would get KILLED in a
>mosh pit. what that culture telling me is because of my physique, i have
>no right to be close to the stage to see the band. this does not compute
>in my brain...
I haven't been able draw any conclusions on it either. For those who
were converted after their punk experience I can see that they may not
know anything else. I might contend that as new creatures in Christ
we might consider leaving some of our past behind, but that is not my
job - the Spirit is more than capable of convicting us when change is
necessary. At a couple of recent concerts, there were a number of
church youth groups present and many kids in their early teens flocked
to the pits. I believe (based on youth groups I know of) that some of
these kids were raised in Christian homes, by concerned parents and
have never been part of the punk scene. Their only exposure would
have been in Christian settings. Why do they do it?
[ WOW - 3 posts on RMC in less than a week! Probably approaching a
personal record. ]
Peter G.
In article <4q4hka$7...@brokaw.comm.mot.com>,
Matthew C. Laswell <mat...@comm.mot.com> wrote:
>This is all well and good for punk shows, but what about the extent
>to which moshing, slamming and such have become the nifty thing
>to do at concerts where they are sadly out of place? For example,
>I would have really liked to get closer to Hoi Polloi or the 77s
>at Cornerstone last summer, but didn't want to get whacked. In those
>circumstances, I wasn't entering into any punk culture, I was
>entering into nifty-keen-aren't-we-alternative mainstream culture...
What really boggled my mind is when I overheard a conversation a few weeks ago where one
guy asked another to describe Audio Adrenaline's musical style. The reply I heard is
"Audio Adrenaline is mosh music". Give me a break. I grew up in the L.A. thrash, punk,
hardcore scene of the mid-eighties to early nineties and I have to laugh when I hear
about kids slamming or moshing at DC Talk or Audio Adrenaline shows. Don't get me
wrong, I dig these bands and they have their place, but to slam to their music???
I remember seeing bands like D.R.I., M.O.D., Bad Religion, and Slayer, just to name a
few of the more popular ones, where the entire building they played at was one giant
slam/mosh pit.
"What is it? Caught in a mosh!" - Anthrax
Peter
--
Coincidence is just God's way of remaining anonymous.
Just Say No To Corporate Christianity!
http://www.netcom.com/~ppgg/peelhere
#ToothAndNail and #Bighouse IRC Undernet Channels
Andrew S. Gurk Damick
This wisdom in alt.fan.the-bob did beverley impart:
[re: Dragonheart]
: Thing is, a) it wasn't cute, b) it wasn't overly entertaining, and c) it
: couldn't decided if it was going to be pretentious or not.
a) Opinion
b) Opinion
c) Uh....opinion.
[re: The Craft (cheese and macaroni)]
: That being said, I can't see it not being worth the time of anyone willing
: to invest ninety minutes in the experience and a few hours of thought
: afterwards, and I certainly don't see where it would be godly to avoid
: the knowledge or experience.
There is a significant difference between doing research to gain knowledge
and experience and choosing the subject matter of the entertainment one
feeds into one's brain. If I truly believe that I need to know more of
Wicca to further my mission, then I can do so without seeing it glorified
by Hollywood.
"Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are
honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever
things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any
virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things."
I can't see how this film fits in there, and it'll take a rather
significant amount to convince me otherwise. If you believe that
it is worth it, though, feel free to try.
--Gurk
--
a s d a m i c k : n c s u . e d u ' s c h a r i s m a m a c h i n e
EUPTS:28.8 http://www4.ncsu.edu/~asdamick/www/ Andrew S. "Gurk" Damick
ay-ess-day-mick-at-yoo-nih-tee-dot-nicksu-eedu Humble Prophet of Smerp
Ed Rock
On 17 Jun 1996, beverley wrote:
> Crowds. blech.
You got that right.
Ed Rock Ed Rocks the Web http://ias.ga.unc.edu Ed Crabtree
"Everybody needs one good escape."
--The Hazies--
Ed Rock
On 17 Jun 1996, Lynn Kerby wrote:
> I would agree that the current group of regulars are so close knit that
> they don't really see their postings as tangents or off-topic (it's
> their group after all).
Are you trying to sweet talk us?
Scholar and Fool
For some reason, Lynn Kerby <l...@veritas.com> put forth:
>I remember it starting up too. And saw the groups beginning to form.
>Prior to that time I was an occasional poster, but as the discussions
>moved to alternative groups and happenings at CStone concerts and such
>I began to drop out. I was still very deeply rooted in my AC world
>and wasn't looking for fresh views (I think I am now).
I've been around here for...well...a long time, and I was certainly excited
to see more discussion on alternative groups and happenings at c-stone
concerts. It got boring sometimes talking mostly to myself about the
alternative side of Christian music. Although at various points I would
tune out for a little while because the AC noise was just too much. Now
I just do it because I don't know what else to do. :)
>I really miss Andy Whitman these days.
Yup.
>I have seen enough of the postings since the inception of the group
>to know that the regulars change periodically.
I really think earlier on there were "regulars," but there really wasn't
a close-knit community of people in existance like there is now. Or if
there was, they didn't tell me about it. :) It was more just people
throwing ideas around - with sometimes a few people who knew each other.
At least that's the way I remember it.
>As a group I would like to see an effort to remain on topic.
This has always been a problem. Not in the same way as now, realy, but
there has always been a tendency of topics to shift midstream based on
one comment in a post. That's just sorta the way a public open forum is.
>I guess that is what I object to - the
>silly, sometimes flippant replies that the world at large probably
>doesn't care about, but the "close-knit community" gets into on a
>regular basis.
Although I think sometimes it can go a little overboard, for the most part
the world-at-large should learn to figure them out or learn to ignore them.
Unless of course this gets changed from an open forum discussion-based group.
>I haven't been able draw any conclusions on it either.
Well, I've felt like I've given a couple of fairly decent posts trying to
explain moshing, but I haven't seen any questions or rebuttals directed
my way on the matter (except of course by Chuck). If I don't explain
things well enough, or you think I'm wrong about something, reply and
give me a chance to explain my side so hopefully you can have a better
perspective to draw your conclusions.
>For those who
>were converted after their punk experience I can see that they may not
>know anything else. I might contend that as new creatures in Christ
>we might consider leaving some of our past behind, but that is not my
>job - the Spirit is more than capable of convicting us when change is
>necessary. At a couple of recent concerts, there were a number of
>church youth groups present and many kids in their early teens flocked
>to the pits. I believe (based on youth groups I know of) that some of
>these kids were raised in Christian homes, by concerned parents and
>have never been part of the punk scene. Their only exposure would
>have been in Christian settings. Why do they do it?
The underlying assumption in the above comments is that the pits are wrong.
I don't think anyone has proven that to any degree. I know there are a LOT
of kids these days moshing, crowd surfing (or "floating" as the hip new
younger generation of these days calls it evidently), slamming, dressing
in grunge or punk or alternative or hardcore or whatever clothing styles -
kids that grew up totally out of the environments that originally spawned
these sorts of cultures. Why do they do it? Various reasons - they like
it, it's fun, it's popular, and so on. They're at an age where they are
"finding themselves," living under peer pressure, being forced to do things,
and so on. Believe it or not, running around in circles bumping into
people, floating on a crowd, jumping all over the place acting crazy - these
things are fun. Bursts of energy going until you exhaust yourself can
be fun. It doesn't matter how you grew up, kids want to try new things,
to fit in, to be different than their parents, to have their own identity,
etc. It's not a new phenomenon, and it's not odd - this stuff has been
going on since before kids could ask to borrow the keys to the car.
--
will the slamming ever slow?
no.
(the crucified)
@#$% Terry Leifeste, Scholar and Fool / hatf...@phoenix.net %*&$@#%&$%*#$#@
Layne Petersen
Matt Laswell wrote:
>I would have really liked to get closer to Hoi Polloi or the 77s
>at Cornerstone last summer, but didn't want to get whacked.
Yeah. A friend of mine got a pretty lovely black eye at the Hoi Polloi set.
But it was worth it to be down front for the Prayer Chain set that followed
said Hoi Polloi set.
===========================================================
Peace, hope, love, Jesus Christ - Layner
===========================================================
"Mercy, where'd You go," I cried when I thought You'd left my side.
On this constant wave of grace, I often need to seek Your face.
- My Brothers Mother
===========================================================
Chuck Pearson
Ed Rock (ec...@ias.ga.unc.edu) wrote in response to Lynn Kerby:
: > I would agree that the current group of regulars are so close knit that
: > they don't really see their postings as tangents or off-topic (it's
: > their group after all).
: Are you trying to sweet talk us?
the "it's their group after all" comment was probably a bit harsh, but i
really don't see the rest of that comment as all that unfair.
we do banter back and forth quite a bit, and is this necessarily a good thing?
of course, this is where the masses come forth with the great word o'
deliverance: "killfile."
chuck
--
andnoneofthisofcoursewillstandwhenistandbeforethemanonthatgreatdayofthegreat
dividewhenallthekingsandqueenswillhavetheirclosetsemptiedandtheboneswillallf
alloutdembonesdembonesdemdryboneswillnotfaildeadmenwilltelltalesandyoucanlau
ghandicanlaughandwecanlaughbutitsnotfunny....cpearson@freenet.columbus.oh.us
Jerry B. Ray
In article <4q9p8g$s...@acme.freenet.columbus.oh.us>,
Chuck Pearson <cpea...@freenet.columbus.oh.us> wrote:
>we do banter back and forth quite a bit, and is this necessarily a good thing?
Yes. The banter is the only thing I write that people respond to. When
I post on-topic, nobody responds. That's no fun.
>of course, this is where the masses come forth with the great word o'
>deliverance: "killfile."
True. I'm trying out Gravity, that new Win95 newsreader, but I've yet
to successfully get the "rules" to work to kill stuff. Anybody know
how to properly set it up to, say, kill all articles posted to
alt.christnet?
Chuck Pearson
Jerry B. Ray (vap...@prism.gatech.edu) wrote in response to me:
: >we do banter back and forth quite a bit, and is this necessarily a good
: >thing?
: Yes. The banter is the only thing I write that people respond to. When
: I post on-topic, nobody responds. That's no fun.
this is a HUGE point. jerry posted this big long thing about the petra
cover album [PETRA, mind you] [that's PETRA, only the most popular
Christian rock band on the planet] [we're talking PETRA here, in case
you've forgotten] and it's gotten exactly zero follow-ups. [i would
follow-up if i cared about petra. which i don't, these days.]
if signal/noise was such a big deal, then why aren't people creating signal?
or following up to said signal when it is created?
and why hasn't anybody surfaced to take jeremy kane's place as an active
proponent of moderation?
methinks i'm about to be won over to rampant cynicism again.
Bryce Utting
Bev sez that Matt <mat...@comm.mot.com> sez:
>>This is all well and good for punk shows, but what about the extent
>>to which moshing, slamming and such have become the nifty thing
>>to do at concerts where they are sadly out of place? For example,
>>circumstances, I wasn't entering into any punk culture, I was
>>entering into nifty-keen-aren't-we-alternative mainstream culture...
blink.
Hoi Polloi? *OUR* Hoi Polloi?
No wonder we never know what they're up to (that, or that thing about
prophets and their own towns...).
Sigh.
FWIW, the almost-mosh-non-mosh-pit in Guru's here at Waikato (um, shall
we say the bare floor in front of the 12" high boxes bands play on here)
at their "last" (so they told us) concert (which about seventy three and
a half of us attended thankyouverymuch) was a great place to fling
hair/heads/arms up and down and whatever without any risk of getting
injured. That was a -great- concert. Feel free to come visit next time
they break up!
(mind you, this was back in the days I *could* fling etc etc without etc;
on the other hand the only person out there older than me was partying
away with his 14 year old son...)
butting (slinking away for old age surgery)
--
Bryce Utting
http://www.cs.waikato.ac.nz/~butting
Jerry B. Ray
In article <4qaheu$p...@acme.freenet.columbus.oh.us>,
Chuck Pearson <cpea...@freenet.columbus.oh.us> wrote:
>and why hasn't anybody surfaced to take jeremy kane's place as an active
>proponent of moderation?
Oh, which reminds me... I just got e-mail from Jeremy, and he said that
right after he quit this group, a couple of new News Xpress betas came out
that supposedly (I haven't downloaded 'em-it's early...) support all sorts
of killfiling, like on newsgroups and on the NUMBER of newsgroups and stuff
like that. Sounds real promising. (But I don't like the window layout
in NX-maybe they've fixed that, too...)
Christopher C Parks
In article <4qa32r$f...@acmez.gatech.edu> vap...@prism.gatech.edu (Jerry B. Ray) writes:
>In article <4q9p8g$s...@acme.freenet.columbus.oh.us>,
>Chuck Pearson <cpea...@freenet.columbus.oh.us> wrote:
>
>>we do banter back and forth quite a bit, and is this necessarily a good thing?
obOBSCURErmc: "That's not particularly a good thing, but not necessarily
a bad thing..." --riki michele(1)
>Yes. The banter is the only thing I write that people respond to. When
>I post on-topic, nobody responds. That's no fun.
This is the frustrating part. If people would complain less about the
lack of on-topic discussion and participate more in on-topic discussion,
they'd be far to busy to complain about the bantering.
>>of course, this is where the masses come forth with the great word o'
>>deliverance: "killfile."
>
>True. I'm trying out Gravity, that new Win95 newsreader, but I've yet
>to successfully get the "rules" to work to kill stuff. Anybody know
>how to properly set it up to, say, kill all articles posted to
>alt.christnet?
Sorry, Jerry. Can't help you. I refuse, as a matter of principle, to
have anything to do with Windoze 95 :)
Peace,
chris
(1) from the song "A Little Grace" off her album "Big, Big Town" (words
by Steve Hindalong). Good stuff, Maynard...
treev
Layne_P...@Ministrynet.usa.net (Layne Petersen) wrote:
>Matt Laswell wrote:
>
>>I would have really liked to get closer to Hoi Polloi or the 77s
>>at Cornerstone last summer, but didn't want to get whacked.
>
>But it was worth it to be down front for the Prayer Chain set that followed
>said Hoi Polloi set.
Yeah, I wish everybody could see the look on Nathan's face when people
would come up & asked him, "Hey, cool! Did you get that at the Crucified
show?" One of my fondest memories at the 'Chain show was moving out of
the way when a would-be crowd surfer jumped off the stage, hoping that I
would be his "landing wave". Sorry, buddy. Tough love, I guess. It's for
the best.(nudge, wink)
hazelnut
would that would-be, red-faced crowd surfer be the layners?
Ed Rock
On 19 Jun 1996, Chuck Pearson wrote:
> Ed Rock (ec...@ias.ga.unc.edu) wrote in response to Lynn Kerby:
>
> : > I would agree that the current group of regulars are so close knit that
> : > they don't really see their postings as tangents or off-topic (it's
> : > their group after all).
>
> : Are you trying to sweet talk us?
>
> the "it's their group after all" comment was probably a bit harsh, but i
> really don't see the rest of that comment as all that unfair.
Course you don't. Let's see if I can remember the exact line. You're
just too nice for your own good or something?
> we do banter back and forth quite a bit, and is this necessarily a good thing?
Welcome to Usenet.