Re: "Waterworld" recording
Will Dockery
> Howdy,
>
> Wow, since I'm being pinged I'd better check in...
>
> Will Dockery wrote:
> > > That is just incredible - this is online? Link? URL?
> >
> > Joe didn't give a link the last time I looked . . .
>
> OK, here's a little more info... The review was in an old issue of
> "Factsheet Five" from 1989, so no link.
Too bad, but those were the 1980s, when snail mail was king.
I do remember Gunderloy writing about an online F5, but over two
decades ago and I guess befor things became routinely archived, as they
are now.
If only he'd used Usenet...
> I was actually scanning some
> Kerry Thornley (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kerry_Thornley) columns so
> they'd be available on the web (not for any particular reason, other
> than they aren't already on the web, and it's just something to do).
> While flipping through the rest of the magazine, capturing the
> zeitgeist of 1989, the "Waterworld" review caught my eye. Figured I'd
> see whether I could turn up anything about it on the Internet, 17 years
> later... (man I feel old now) So like I mentioned, a Google search
> brought me to rec.music.makers (Didn't occur to me to simply ask right
> here on the group, I'm quick that way)
Hmmm... perhaps you'd consider scanning the page "Waterworld" was
reviewed on, or even more selected pages? My F5 collection was
unfortunately ruined when the trunk of my car glooded back in 1995 or
so, it would be really interesting to see some of that stuck finally
become archived...
> That "Waterworld" review would have appeared right around the time I
> started to become interested in jazz (I was in college and had enrolled
> in a Jazz Appreciation course. I got a 107 average for the course, as
> the tests had bonus questions, while I got a C or C- in my other
> classes that semester). Factsheet Five didn't review many (if any)
> other jazz recordings -- though for all I know, their description of
> "Waterworld" wasn't accurate, or "jazz" was too narrow of a pigeonhole
> etc. But anyway, the word "jazz" there should have caught my eye at
> the time, since it was just an unusual context to find a jazz review.
> So with that in mind, seeing this review 17 years later, I'm just
> curious as to what caused the reviewer (I assume it was Mike Gunderloy)
> to take notice.
Glad you did, since the musician is thinking on putting it out on CD,
and even doing new work in that direction.
> > Looking for Joe Castleman...
> >
> > "Hey Joe... where ya goin' with that saxophone (or is it a windowscreen?) in
> > your hand..?"
>
> Was that a lucky guess or something? I do play the sax, or did anyway
> -- Nothing beyond woodshedding, though. Ah, one of these days I'll get
> serious about it again...
Actually, I cheated and Googled your name... heh...
--
Backyard Blues! October 28th, 103 6th Street, Shadowville USA:
Dillinghams
Eilieen Des'terno
Dockery-Conley Show
Patrick Hopkins
Harry Haden
Brent Lindley
Jason Ezell
Bring your own party favors and masks.
"Ozone Stigmata" by Will Dockery
http://www.myspace.com/willdockery
Will Dockery videos:
http://tinyurl.com/yfmzeq
gyro...@yahoo.com
> I do remember Gunderloy writing about an online F5, but over two
> decades ago and I guess befor things became routinely archived, as they
> are now.
>
> If only he'd used Usenet...
Jerod Poore (who also wrote for "Maximum Rock & Roll") started the
on-line version, and was involved with the magazine itself when R. Seth
Friedman took over the publishing. That would have been off my radar
until 1992 or so, I went through 4.5 years of college and barely used
computers at all, except for word processors, or to look up books in
the library. Finally when Gunderloy stopped publishing I had them send
me the online version on 5" floppy discs.
> Hmmm... perhaps you'd consider scanning the page "Waterworld" was
> reviewed on, or even more selected pages? My F5 collection was
> unfortunately ruined when the trunk of my car glooded back in 1995 or
> so, it would be really interesting to see some of that stuck finally
> become archived...
I've thought about scanning some more content from the magazine, just
that the Thornley really deserves to be on-line. If anyone's
interested I've uploaded them to Wikisource
(http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Author:Kerry_Wendell_Thornley) (Actually
I haven't worked on it for about a week or so.) But most of the
magazine is effectively in the public domain (Gunderloy used a very
lenient copyright notice) so it would be great to have it on-line.
I should come clean and say that the review said something to the
effect of "better than P.D. Wilson's comics so don't let those put you
off". I have no idea what he's talking about, of course, but I didn't
think it would be helpful to leave that in when I first came asking
around here about the tape...
> Glad you did, since the musician is thinking on putting it out on CD,
> and even doing new work in that direction.
I'd appreciate it if one of you would keep me posted in either case!
> Actually, I cheated and Googled your name... heh...
Hmm, what was the "windowscreen" about? The Google search mostly turns
up discussions about some novel in which the protagonist's husband is
an asshole and happens to share my name. Great.
I wrote some more to you and P.D. via email...
Will Dockery
gyrofrog wrote:
> Will Dockery wrote:
>
> > I do remember Gunderloy writing about an online F5, but over two
> > decades ago and I guess befor things became routinely archived, as they
> > are now.
> >
> > If only he'd used Usenet...
>
> Jerod Poore (who also wrote for "Maximum Rock & Roll") started the
> on-line version, and was involved with the magazine itself when R. Seth
> Friedman took over the publishing. That would have been off my radar
> until 1992 or so, I went through 4.5 years of college and barely used
> computers at all, except for word processors, or to look up books in
> the library. Finally when Gunderloy stopped publishing I had them send
> me the online version on 5" floppy discs.
Same here, I used a computer as a "glorified typewriter" for some
years, but didn't break into the internet until 1998... of course I'm
hopelessly addicted now.
> > Hmmm... perhaps you'd consider scanning the page "Waterworld" was
> > reviewed on, or even more selected pages? My F5 collection was
> > unfortunately ruined when the trunk of my car glooded back in 1995 or
> > so, it would be really interesting to see some of that stuck finally
> > become archived...
>
> I've thought about scanning some more content from the magazine, just
> that the Thornley really deserves to be on-line. If anyone's
> interested I've uploaded them to Wikisource
> (http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Author:Kerry_Wendell_Thornley) (Actually
> I haven't worked on it for about a week or so.) But most of the
> magazine is effectively in the public domain (Gunderloy used a very
> lenient copyright notice) so it would be great to have it on-line.
True, which is one of the reasons I've crossposted this to alt.zines,
the main reason being that hopefully there will be an old timer or two
that might have some input or comment on this idea of archiving
Gunderloy's F5, which would be a great resource to scholars of the
history of small press... and a better chance that long forgotten works
like Waterworld get another go-around.
Since it was the one-time mention of /pdw/'s name by Robbie Wright that
brought all this up, I'm posting the credits for the musicians on
"Waterworld" on the chance that some of these characters or someone who
knows them might come across this on a search engine and step forward:
Bey - synthesizers and audio engineering and production
Jay Fennimore - guitar, flute, & alto sax
Tito Walls- acoustic and electric guitars
pd wilson - alto & tenor sax, tambour, flute, production
> I should come clean and say that the review said something to the
> effect of "better than P.D. Wilson's comics so don't let those put you
> off". I have no idea what he's talking about, of course, but I didn't
> think it would be helpful to leave that in when I first came asking
> around here about the tape...
Yeah, and the other review of "Waterworld" (or "Waterworlds" I think
the review calls it) archived online from the 1980s reviewzine Comic
Update I mentioned earlier is pretty much nothing but a series of
personal insults to various artists working in small press at the time,
the kind of stuff that passes for critique here on Usenet most of the
time, revealing a complete cluelessness from the "critic":
http://www.asstr.org/files/Authors/Roller/update6
/pdw/'s comix and poetry and comix chapbooks from the era are some
fascinating and sometimes brilliant works, dozens of titles came out
during that era. most duly noted in F5: Gamma Pink, Sawtooth Pulse,
Ebolg, Pale Blue Land Of Cannan, Karpet King and on and on... I've
stacks of these out in the shed, and if I had a scanner handy, and
/pdw/'s permission, they'd be online... we'll see what he has to say,
perhaps just samples of the art, which has to be seen to be believed.
Some of the poetry/lyrics are online at the Burger God site, already,
as well as the newer stuff in the /Hell-Thunk/ genre:
http://burgergod.earthside.org/
> > Glad you did, since the musician is thinking on putting it out on CD,
> > and even doing new work in that direction.
>
> I'd appreciate it if one of you would keep me posted in either case!
Absolutely.
> > Actually, I cheated and Googled your name... heh...
>
> Hmm, what was the "windowscreen" about? The Google search mostly turns
> up discussions about some novel in which the protagonist's husband is
> an asshole and happens to share my name. Great.
Urm... the "windowscreen" remark was a very obscure joke for /pdw/,
which even /he/ may not remember... glad we've connected, though, only
in these Modern Times could such an event be possible!
--
Backyard Blues! October 28th, 103 6th Street, Shadowville USA:
Dillinghams
Eileen D'esterno
Dockery-Conley Show
Patrick Hopkins
Harry Harden
Brent Lindley
Jason Ezell
Bring your own party favors and masks.
"Ozone Stigmata" by Will Dockery
http://www.myspace.com/willdockery
Will Dockery videos:
http://tinyurl.com/yfmzeq
pdw...@gmail.com
> the main reason being that hopefully there will be an old timer or two
> that might have some input or comment on this idea of archiving
> Gunderloy's F5, which would be a great resource to scholars of the
> history of small press... and a better chance that long forgotten works
> like Waterworld get another go-around.
Fwiw, I distinctly remember seeing FF5 online - I was using Gopher at
the time, I believe, so that would date it to the early or mid-1990s -
the dates are a bit hazy, but I do recall seeing it - it could, i
suppose - have been the post-Gunderloy online version Joe mentioned
above... regrettably, I didn't look at it very closely.
> > I should come clean and say that the review said something to the
> > effect of "better than P.D. Wilson's comics so don't let those put you
> > off". I have no idea what he's talking about, of course, but I didn't
> > think it would be helpful to leave that in when I first came asking
> > around here about the tape...
Heh. Yeah, I don't think the comix or poetry were very popular -
oddly, though, I considered some of them quite good - I was a bit
surprised that the reviewer like the audio better... I suspect this
preference had to do with production values...
> http://www.asstr.org/files/Authors/Roller/update6
Roller stooped to some pretty personal attacks on me - not sure what
his problem was - at one point, I believe, he claimed to have fucked my
wife. On Usenet - I fucked his mother, though, so I guess we're even.
> if I had a scanner handy, and
> /pdw/'s permission, they'd be online... we'll see what he has to say,
You have my permission - we can work out the details in email.
> Some of the poetry/lyrics are online at the Burger God site, already,
> as well as the newer stuff in the /Hell-Thunk/ genre:
>
> http://burgergod.earthside.org/
well, I supposed my "plausible deniability" is shot to hell at this
point, anyway -
Will Dockery
>
> > True, which is one of the reasons I've crossposted this to alt.zines,
> > the main reason being that hopefully there will be an old timer or two
> > that might have some input or comment on this idea of archiving
> > Gunderloy's F5, which would be a great resource to scholars of the
> > history of small press... and a better chance that long forgotten works
> > like Waterworld get another go-around.
>
> Fwiw, I distinctly remember seeing FF5 online - I was using Gopher at
> the time, I believe, so that would date it to the early or mid-1990s -
> the dates are a bit hazy, but I do recall seeing it - it could, i
> suppose - have been the post-Gunderloy online version Joe mentioned
> above... regrettably, I didn't look at it very closely.
Seems like you might have pulled it up on the old, Tandy, was it? The
one with the brown screen... as you know, I was quite anti-computer at
the time, intending to go to my grave defending /snail mail/ and
hardcopy.
I'm hopelessly addicted to this stuff now, and haven't even printed up
a chapbook since 2000. I pasted a new one with the recent poetry
together last Summer, and it still remains on the shelf... by X-mas I
hope to have the strength to make it to the copydhop, then dtaple,
fold, trim... urm.
Maybe by Easter... heh.
> > > I should come clean and say that the review said something to the
> > > effect of "better than P.D. Wilson's comics so don't let those put you
> > > off". I have no idea what he's talking about, of course, but I didn't
> > > think it would be helpful to leave that in when I first came asking
> > > around here about the tape...
>
> Heh. Yeah, I don't think the comix or poetry were very popular -
> oddly, though, I considered some of them quite good - I was a bit
> surprised that the reviewer like the audio better... I suspect this
> preference had to do with production values...
Most of the art is outstanding and cheerfully demented... I'll get to
working on having someone scan a batch of it. as you mention below. The
work from the spiral sketchbook, the fine-line pen and ink stuff that
was scattered in dozens of minis would be a good start, or scan
indivdual minis "as is", combined with the poetry and stuff.
> > http://www.asstr.org/files/Authors/Roller/update6
>
> Roller stooped to some pretty personal attacks on me - not sure what
> his problem was - at one point, I believe, he claimed to have fucked my
> wife. On Usenet - I fucked his mother, though, so I guess we're even.
Google "andrew roller" in the groups area and it appears he was driven
away in a mass uprising... after posting dozens of my and others'
poetry, as well as vicious (though very average for Usenet) personal
attacks on me, you, Rick Howe and other Shadowville celebrities.
>From what we know of Roller he may be either in prison, dead, or both.
Last I saw of Howe, btw, was this comix-poem thing:
Cold December Mist [a comix-poem] by Rick Howe:
page one:
<http://tinyurl.com/8gm8e>
page two:
<http://tinyurl.com/dy7xf>
page three:
<http://tinyurl.com/d8go7>
page four:
<http://tinyurl.com/ark38>
Remember Vinson Watson, of the Menace To The Megaverse concept album? I
came across some old Usenet posts from him about some superhero
characters he'd created, but he seems to have faded, as well...
> > if I had a scanner handy, and
> > /pdw/'s permission, they'd be online... we'll see what he has to say,
>
> You have my permission - we can work out the details in email.
Excellent, let's work something out...
> > Some of the poetry/lyrics are online at the Burger God site, already,
> > as well as the newer stuff in the /Hell-Thunk/ genre:
> >
> > http://burgergod.earthside.org/
>
> well, I supposed my "plausible deniability" is shot to hell at this
> point, anyway -
Probably should have stuck with the "Elliot Mallory" et al plan... the
rerelease under the 0x0000 would probably be good, "uniform cannon" or
whatever they call it... more later, I have to get some smokes...
--
Will Dockery
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***