Sucesses and Failures in Cuban Music Ed
Bonestud
that we usually do. I just want to point out some things I've noticed that
might not have anything to do with music ed. I know they'll end up in flame
throwing arguements, but I'll try to stay removed from that.
Anyway, you ever notice that no matter how bad the band is, in Cuba the rhythm
section is always smoking? Usually the weak members are the horn players and
singers (usually the horn players) but it's hardly ever the rhythm section that
strikes you as being weak. I can't think of one CD I've got from Cuba in the
past 5 years where it's the rhythm section that really bums me out. Usually
it's the horns.
"But Curtis, you're just saying that because you're a horn player and your ear
is drawn to those difficiencies quicker." Nope. I've been a horn player for
12 years and a pianist for 16 so it's not that (and a latin percussionist for
4). What it is is that Cuban horn players (while there's quite a few that are
great) are usually not on as high a level professionally as the rhtyhm secion
players (percussion, bass, and piano). Why might this be?
For a great example of what I'm talking about check out the first Eurotropical
live CD. Put on the first tune by Sabrosura Viva. It starts out as really
killin timba with the rhythm section really smokin it. Great time. Great
groove. Then check out all the breakdowns in the montuno sections. Smokin.
Now check out the horns. Lame. Lame. Lame. Especially on the second tune
that they do where there's an exposed trombone solo and alto solo. Green as
hell. So why are these kids who are similar in age sounding so amateur when
their friends of the same age on percussion, piano, and bass sound so great?
Another example is Carlos Manuel's group. The pianist and bassist really lay
it down and they're 17 or 18 or so. I don't get it. Any ideas?
Curtis
no...@wcl.on.ca
>For a great example of what I'm talking about check out the first Eurotropical
>live CD. Put on the first tune by Sabrosura Viva.
What's the name of the tune?
I don't have the Eurotropical CD, but I do have Sabrosura Viva ..
name that tune ...
ivanhe...@my-deja.com
bone...@aol.com (Bonestud) wrote:
>
> "But Curtis, you're just saying that because you're a horn player and your ear
> is drawn to those difficiencies quicker." Nope. I've been a horn player for
> 12 years and a pianist for 16 so it's not that (and a latin percussionist for
> 4). What it is is that Cuban horn players (while there's quite a few that are
> great) are usually not on as high a level professionally as the rhtyhm secion
> players (percussion, bass, and piano). Why might this be?
>
Just a guess, but it is nearly impossible to buy any musical instrument in
Cuba. Drums on the other hand, are easily made if you have some wood and a
goat skin.
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
Bonestud
>I don't have the Eurotropical CD, but I do have Sabrosura Viva ..
The first one is Proxima Victima and the second one I think is No Te Disimules
Tanto or something.
Curtis
Bonestud
>Cuba. Drums on the other hand, are easily made if you have some wood and a
>goat skin.
I don't think this holds up. Every musician I know in Cuba (which means
students or professional musicians, not neccessarily amateurs which is a large
group) has their own instrument and has had one since elementary school. Of
course it's not technically "theirs" but they don't have to like check it out
when they want to practice. So for our purposes it's theirs. Meanwhile I
don't know all too many percussion students who own their own congas or
timbales or marimbas blablabla. Drums aren't cheap in Cuba either. If they
were so easy to make everyone would have one. I tried making just a cajon
once. Not easy. There's a reason even the cheap drums aren't so cheap.
Curtis
ivanhe...@my-deja.com
bone...@aol.com (Bonestud) wrote:
>
> I don't think this holds up. Every musician I know in Cuba (which means
> students or professional musicians, not neccessarily amateurs which is a large
> group) has their own instrument and has had one since elementary school. Of
> course it's not technically "theirs" but they don't have to like check it out
> when they want to practice. So for our purposes it's theirs. Meanwhile I
> don't know all too many percussion students who own their own congas or
> timbales or marimbas blablabla. Drums aren't cheap in Cuba either. If they
> were so easy to make everyone would have one. I tried making just a cajon
> once. Not easy. There's a reason even the cheap drums aren't so cheap.
>
I think maybe you've answered your own question. Students and professional
musicians may have access to instruments, but I can't think of anyone else
who does. And I would venture to guess that these students and professionals
are residing in Habana or Santiago. I lived in a smaller town and we had no
music store, no music programs in school, no clubs, no music societies,
nothing.
If instruments and instruction are available only to a select and selected
group a large pool of potential musicians is automatically excluded. As to
the ease of making a drum, you don't need a good drum to make sounds, in fact
a box or a taburete will do just fine.
Bonestud
>group a large pool of potential musicians is automatically excluded.
That's very true. But it doesn't explain why it seems that the rhythm section
guys are on such a higher level than horn players in the same age bracket.
It's not that the revolution is treating horn players any differently.
Curtis
pjdiaz
Bonestud <bone...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:19991116161425...@ng-fw1.aol.com...
> >If instruments and instruction are available only to a select and
selected
> >group a large pool of potential musicians is automatically excluded.
>
> That's very true. But it doesn't explain why it seems that the rhythm
section
> guys are on such a higher level than horn players in the same age bracket.
I think Ivan's point remains valid.... it's a lot easier to get one's hand
on a drum than on a trumpet.
I know a number of individuals who make drums for resale to others, to
tourists (at least 3
less this year.....btw... they had their cuentapropista licenses lifted by
the government when it decided the economy was better and they'd best rein
in individual activities lest folks get out of hand.).
I don't know anyone making flugelhorns in a back room.
> It's not that the revolution is treating horn players any differently.
Well... I'm not sure, for example, I haven't ever heard them announce a 5
year plan to increase brass production ;-)
Nina
done very early and with nothing more than your hands and a hard surface. A
kid so inclined can develop a good sense of rhythm without ever seeing an
instrument. When I was little the boys used to bang out patterns on the
desks, using pencils when they couldnt get the sound they wanted with their
hands. Sometimes they would do it in groups. Drove the teachers NUTS. But it
gives ém a head start over those who have to wait till they have a Real
instrument to play.
N
--
There is an old saying that if a million monkeys typed on a million
keyboards for a million years, eventually all the works of Shakespeare would
be produced. Now, thanks to Usenet, we know this is not true.
pjdiaz <pjd...@xxx.xcom> wrote in message
news:80sqfo$7ad$1...@pale-rider.INS.CWRU.Edu...
Stan Ginn
Stan Ginn
There's just lots of amazing drumming that can be found in Cuba. What
would be the horn equivalent of a rumba or bembe?
The instrument availability thing is probably a factor, but that doesn't
explain the pianists and bassists, although an exposure to traditional
drumming might help with that too.
Maybe it's just that the better musicians are drawn to the rhythm
section there.
Stan
Bonestud wrote:
>
> OK I know we argue this a lot, but I don't want to take the normal approach
> that we usually do. I just want to point out some things I've noticed that
> might not have anything to do with music ed. I know they'll end up in flame
> throwing arguements, but I'll try to stay removed from that.
>
> Anyway, you ever notice that no matter how bad the band is, in Cuba the rhythm
> section is always smoking? Usually the weak members are the horn players and
> singers (usually the horn players) but it's hardly ever the rhythm section that
> strikes you as being weak. I can't think of one CD I've got from Cuba in the
> past 5 years where it's the rhythm section that really bums me out. Usually
> it's the horns.
>
> "But Curtis, you're just saying that because you're a horn player and your ear
> is drawn to those difficiencies quicker." Nope. I've been a horn player for
> 12 years and a pianist for 16 so it's not that (and a latin percussionist for
> 4). What it is is that Cuban horn players (while there's quite a few that are
> great) are usually not on as high a level professionally as the rhtyhm secion
> players (percussion, bass, and piano). Why might this be?
>
> For a great example of what I'm talking about check out the first Eurotropical
> live CD. Put on the first tune by Sabrosura Viva. It starts out as really
> killin timba with the rhythm section really smokin it. Great time. Great
> groove. Then check out all the breakdowns in the montuno sections. Smokin.
> Now check out the horns. Lame. Lame. Lame. Especially on the second tune
> that they do where there's an exposed trombone solo and alto solo. Green as
> hell. So why are these kids who are similar in age sounding so amateur when
> their friends of the same age on percussion, piano, and bass sound so great?
> Another example is Carlos Manuel's group. The pianist and bassist really lay
> it down and they're 17 or 18 or so. I don't get it. Any ideas?
>
> Curtis
--
http://www.jps.net/stanginn
D. & N. Harvey
>
> In article <19991116105011...@ng-fw1.aol.com>,
> bone...@aol.com (Bonestud) wrote:
> >
> > I don't think this holds up. Every musician I know in Cuba (which means
> > students or professional musicians, not neccessarily amateurs which is a large
> > group) has their own instrument and has had one since elementary school. Of
> > course it's not technically "theirs" but they don't have to like check it out
> > when they want to practice. So for our purposes it's theirs. Meanwhile I
> > don't know all too many percussion students who own their own congas or
> > timbales or marimbas blablabla. Drums aren't cheap in Cuba either. If they
> > were so easy to make everyone would have one. I tried making just a cajon
> > once. Not easy. There's a reason even the cheap drums aren't so cheap.
> >
>
> I think maybe you've answered your own question. Students and professional
> musicians may have access to instruments, but I can't think of anyone else
> who does. And I would venture to guess that these students and professionals
> are residing in Habana or Santiago. I lived in a smaller town and we had no
> music store, no music programs in school, no clubs, no music societies,
> nothing.
>
> the ease of making a drum, you don't need a good drum to make sounds, in fact
> a box or a taburete will do just fine.
>
> Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
> Before you buy.
D. & N. Harvey
>
> In article <19991115235109...@ng-fu1.aol.com>,
> bone...@aol.com (Bonestud) wrote:
> >
> > is drawn to those difficiencies quicker." Nope. I've been a horn player for
> > 12 years and a pianist for 16 so it's not that (and a latin percussionist for
> > 4). What it is is that Cuban horn players (while there's quite a few that are
> > great) are usually not on as high a level professionally as the rhtyhm secion
> > players (percussion, bass, and piano). Why might this be?
> >
>
> Cuba. Drums on the other hand, are easily made if you have some wood and a
> goat skin.
>
real drum ,and you would'nt know one if you saw one.check your shit at
the door.D.H.
D. & N. Harvey
>
> I was going to mention that developing rythmic and percussive skills can be
> done very early and with nothing more than your hands and a hard surface. A
> kid so inclined can develop a good sense of rhythm without ever seeing an
> instrument. When I was little the boys used to bang out patterns on the
> desks, using pencils when they couldnt get the sound they wanted with their
> hands. Sometimes they would do it in groups. Drove the teachers NUTS. But it
> gives ém a head start over those who have to wait till they have a Real
> instrument to play.
> N
kaysee
seem more a rhythm or "time" instrument in Afro-Latin music than in other
forms of music? To me they seem more intrinsically integral to the music
than the horns. Therefore they would have to be better than the horns for
the music to "sound right". The horns are the "frills" instruments; you
can still wear the dress without them, and if they don't suit, you can cut
them off.
kaysee
Stan Ginn wrote in message <383249FD...@jps.net>...
>> "But Curtis, you're just saying that because you're a horn player and
your ear
>> is drawn to those difficiencies quicker." Nope. I've been a horn player
for
>> 12 years and a pianist for 16 so it's not that (and a latin percussionist
for
>> 4). What it is is that Cuban horn players (while there's quite a few
that are
>> great) are usually not on as high a level professionally as the rhtyhm
secion
>> players (percussion, bass, and piano). Why might this be?
>>
ivanhe...@my-deja.com
har...@pacbell.net wrote:
> what the fuck do you know about drum building .you've never even seen a
> real drum ,and you would'nt know one if you saw one.check your shit at
> the door.D.H.
>
Are you the appointed receiver of shit? It seems to fit your skill set and
level.
ivanhernandez
<har...@pacbell.net> wrote:
>
> you are wrong...D.H.
>
And who can argue with such an eloquent and well thought out response.
Try ginko dh, I hear it improves brain function and in your case
there's nowhere to go but up.
--
Free audio & video emails, greeting cards and forums
Talkway - http://www.talkway.com - Talk more ways (sm)
ivanhernandez
>
> That's very true. But it doesn't explain why it seems that the rhythm section
> guys are on such a higher level than horn players in the same age bracket.
>
Hey I never used the "r" word or made any comparisons to Cuba before
the revolution. I'm merely giving you my opinion, based on my own
experience of living in Cuba, on possible reasons as to why there are
better drummers than brass players.
Oportunities to play may be another factor, some santeria rituals
require drums, and not brass instruments AFAIK. In fact Tata Guines,
who hails from my home town and my own neighborhood of Leguina, started
playing drums at Chango rituals at the local Santa Barbara shrine. And
for a time, maybe now too, his entire drum section was made up of
people who lived in the neighborhood.
Songo Man
> real drum ,and you would'nt know one if you saw one.check your shit at
> the door.D.H.
>
Are you the appointed receiver of shit? It seems to fit your skill set and
level.>>
Well, here's proof positive that ANY discussion on this newsgroup will
degenerate into name calling. And Eddie wasn't even anywhere in sight!! OK,
guys, it's experiment time: Let's see you turn THIS one into an insult-fest:
"Nice day, innit?"
Go ahead, flame away. First Eddie will pop up and tell me that it's not THAT
nice a day, Cracker, when you're oppressed by the Man in the ghetto. And that
"People of Colouour" NEVER have nice days because they are afflicted with the
"disease" (guffaw) of alcoholism and drug abuse. Next, Ivan will tell me that
people oppressed by the Maniac in Cuba don't have many nice days, either.
Curtis will retort that the day can only be so nice when the horns are out of
tune. Wallice will email me on the sly and tell me "Connnno, don't get Eddie
started". Pablo will start out by calling everyone a comemierda, then go on to
eloquently state his incorrect point. This will, of course, incense Mike, who
will join in the fray. All the while, Steve will be egging everyone on...
Ahhhh. Shit.
songoman
Bonestud
>on a drum than on a trumpet.
That point is true. If you're a music student, however, it isn't true. Music
students have instruments. Period. I don't know where this myth that they
don't have instruments started, but it is definitely no more than a myth.
>I don't know anyone making flugelhorns in a back room.
Well even if they were they'd be selling them to tourists right?
>
>Well... I'm not sure, for example, I haven't ever heard them announce a 5
>year plan to increase brass production ;-)
Haha, I bet if you dig through granma long enough you would! They had a goal
or producing 6 million trombones not too long ago.
Curtis.
Bonestud
Not at all. A good sound is still a good sound (I don't care if it is a synth,
your touch still affects the sound, obviously not as much). Drums, congas,
timbales, and bass all can sound like shit in the hands of an amateur. I would
say it's even more apparent to suck on a rhythm section instrument because
you're playing all the time. No rest. No cracks to hide in. It's all you
from beginning to end.
Curtis
Bonestud
>require drums, and not brass instruments AFAIK.
This definitely explains at least part of why the percussionists are so killin.
Plus it seems like parents who are percussionists seem a little more likely to
want to pass it on. But it doesn't explain the piano and bass part of it. I
still don't know why there's so many damn killin bass players down there. . . .
.
Curtis
kaysee
I have really missed you lately, Songo. You gotta stop that WORKing gig,
doode. . . .
kaysee
Songo Man wrote in message <19991117161834...@ng-cn1.aol.com>...
Stan Ginn
Yep, it's a common belief among musicians that a terrible soloist
playing with a great rhythm section will sound better than a great
soloist playing with a terrible rhythm section. If there's no
foundation, then nothing works.
Stan
--
http://www.jps.net/stanginn
Stan Ginn
kaysee wrote:
>
> Isn't the piano technically a percussion instrument?
Technically, yes. But in reality that's a trivial point. But you're on
the right track in saying that bass and piano have to have rhythm,
that's why we refer to them as being in the rhythm section.
> And doesn't the bass
> seem more a rhythm or "time" instrument in Afro-Latin music than in other
> forms of music?
Exactly, except that this goes for almost all forms of music.
> To me they seem more intrinsically integral to the music
> than the horns. Therefore they would have to be better than the horns for
> the music to "sound right". The horns are the "frills" instruments; you
> can still wear the dress without them, and if they don't suit, you can cut
> them off.
Last hired, first fired as they say, that is, other than the bongocero.
You should be a contractor.
Stan
--
http://www.jps.net/stanginn
Edward-Yemíl Rosario
Besides, Anal shat any shred of brains his consanguinuity imparted him...
On 17 Nov 1999 21:18:34 GMT, song...@aol.com (Songo Man) wrote:
>what the fuck do you know about drum building .you've never even seen a
>> real drum ,and you would'nt know one if you saw one.check your shit at
>> the door.D.H.
>>
>
>Are you the appointed receiver of shit? It seems to fit your skill set and
>level.>>
>
>Well, here's proof positive that ANY discussion on this newsgroup will
>degenerate into name calling. And Eddie wasn't even anywhere in sight!! OK,
>guys, it's experiment time: Let's see you turn THIS one into an insult-fest:
>
>"Nice day, innit?"
>
>Go ahead, flame away. First Eddie will pop up and tell me that it's not THAT
>nice a day, Cracker, when you're oppressed by the Man in the ghetto. And that
>"People of Colouour" NEVER have nice days because they are afflicted with the
>"disease" (guffaw) of alcoholism and drug abuse. Next, Ivan will tell me that
>people oppressed by the Maniac in Cuba don't have many nice days, either.
>Curtis will retort that the day can only be so nice when the horns are out of
>tune. Wallice will email me on the sly and tell me "Connnno, don't get Eddie
>started". Pablo will start out by calling everyone a comemierda, then go on to
>eloquently state his incorrect point. This will, of course, incense Mike, who
>will join in the fray. All the while, Steve will be egging everyone on...
>
>Ahhhh. Shit.
>
>songoman
>
>
>
>
Edward-Yemíl Rosario (Eddie)
"To be truly radical, one must make hope
possible, rather than despair convincing."
- Raymond Williams
Songo Man
Oddly, this works as a lyric in a tune I'm writing.
Seriously. Who, I Axe you, who but Eddie could compose a sentence like this?
C'mon. A round of applause is in order, here.
songoman
Nina
with you guys here??
Nina
--
There is an old saying that if a million monkeys typed on a million
keyboards for a million years, eventually all the works of Shakespeare would
be produced. Now, thanks to Usenet, we know this is not true.
Songo Man <song...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:19991117185231...@ng-cm1.aol.com...
kaysee
on or about Dec 15th, 1998 . . . .
kaysee
Nina wrote in message <80vimq$410g$1...@newssvr04-int.news.prodigy.com>...
Dennis M. Reed "Califa"
ivanhe...@my-deja.com wrote:
>
> In article <383258...@pacbell.net>,
> har...@pacbell.net wrote:
> > what the fuck do you know about drum building .you've never even seen a
> > real drum ,and you would'nt know one if you saw one.check your shit at
> > the door.D.H.
> >
>
> Are you the appointed receiver of shit? It seems to fit your skill set and
> level.
>
> Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
> Before you buy.
--
"it ain't where you're from, it's where you're at" - Eric B. & Rakim ,
1980s or 1990s (but stolen from someone in New Orleans in the 70s or
before!)
"If the music grooves, it does not matter who is playing!" - Califa 1999
Dennis M. Reed "Califa"
My Home Page is located at http://www.geocities.com/dmreed1940/index.htm
or http://www.dmreed.com/index.htm and includes my musical autobiography
(containing audio files and photos of groups I have worked with from the
late 50s to the present). There are also rare 60s recordings by pianist
Carlos Federico and 70s photos of Celia Cruz and Pete Escovedo, and
selected LP and CD recordings. My Latin collection of CDs, LPs, tapes,
books, and instructional materials is cataloged here and includes
selected recordings and images of rare printed materials. Also included
is information about the US-International Keyboard (WINDOWS 95/98) with
a large printable keyboard image.
ivanhe...@my-deja.com
luc...@ix.netcom.com (Edward-Yemíl Rosario) wrote:
>
> Besides, Anal shat any shred of brains his consanguinuity imparted him...
>
Careful eduardito, given your anal fixation and your expertise on shit I
know this thread was hard to resist, but if you want another spanking I'd
more than happy to oblige.
BTW, two sentences and no spelling errors! I guess "hooked on phonics" does
work.
Wallice
> Steve will be egging everyone on...
...and by then you'll be kicking back, getting your second cup of
Bustelo and laughing your ass off at us, right?
--
Saludos,
Wallice
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
What's happening in Dallas, you asked?
http://www.arsnova1.com
The Texas Afro-latin Music Connection
Wallice
> Seriously. Who, I Axe you, who but Eddie could compose a sentence like this?
Oh, yeah, it's a beautiful thing... but can you tell me what it means? I
was lost by the time I got to "anal shat."
Wallice
> Man, this is the best f*ckin show I have ever seen!!
You are a good candidate to use that "coño" thing... try it sometime.
Nina
Coñooooooooo, this group is F*ckin kewllllllll.
Guess it defeats the purpose it I keep addin the f work,eh?
Niñaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
--
There is an old saying that if a million monkeys typed on a million
keyboards for a million years, eventually all the works of Shakespeare would
be produced. Now, thanks to Usenet, we know this is not true.
Wallice <wall...@home.com> wrote in message
news:3834116C...@home.com...
Songo Man
>> Steve will be egging everyone on...
>
>...and by then you'll be kicking back, getting your second cup of
>Bustelo and laughing your ass off at us, right?
>
Damn. I've been figured out.
songoman
Edward-Yemíl Rosario
>In article <3833357...@nntp.ix.netcom.com>,
> luc...@ix.netcom.com (Edward-Yemíl Rosario) wrote:
>>
>> Besides, Anal shat any shred of brains his consanguinuity imparted him...
>>
>
>Careful eduardito, given your anal fixation and your expertise on shit I
>know this thread was hard to resist, but if you want another spanking I'd
>more than happy to oblige.
<snip>
Anal, you NEVER, nor will EVER be able to spank me. However, I beleive you might
find S & M sites. Perchance you may meet some of your relatives there, no?
This is what happens when a pompous, intellectually challenged come mierda
attempts to assume a pretense of knowledge he hasd no business (or capacity)
for. Good work, Anal, I hardly have to press my case for your own cathexis
toward stell-tight shpincter muscles. Go on, Anal, squeeze tight on your arse
muscles and then claim it thought...
Tu eres un Tremendo come mierda, Anal...
>BTW, two sentences and no spelling errors! I guess "hooked on phonics" does
>work.
<snip>
The hallmark of the FIXATED anal character is an abnormal preoccupation with
tiddiness and order.
Guys and Dolls: LOok up anal character types and yoyu'll find a pic of Mr. anal
mimself.
>
>Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
>Before you buy.
Edward-Yemíl Rosario (Eddie)
ivanhe...@my-deja.com
luc...@ix.netcom.com (Edward-Yemíl Rosario) wrote:
> On Thu, 18 Nov 1999 13:57:22 GMT, ivanhe...@my-deja.com wrote:
>
> Anal, you NEVER, nor will EVER be able to spank me. However, I beleive you might
> find S & M sites. Perchance you may meet some of your relatives there, no?
>
Like I said before eduardito, just because your family tree swings in that
direction you can't assume the rest of us do.
> This is what happens when a pompous, intellectually challenged come mierda
> attempts to assume a pretense of knowledge he hasd no business (or capacity)
> for. Good work, Anal, I hardly have to press my case for your own cathexis
> toward stell-tight shpincter muscles. Go on, Anal, squeeze tight on your arse
> muscles and then claim it thought...
>
Dang you're going to have to return your "hooked on phonics" kit, seems like
it did not work after all.
> Tu eres un Tremendo come mierda, Anal...
>
It takes on to know one eduardito. You still haven't posted the source for
your claims about education in Cuba, have you? Oh wait, yes you did when you
said that "Cuba is not your forte". Talk about pompous and self important.
>
> The hallmark of the FIXATED anal character is an abnormal preoccupation with
> tiddiness and order.
>
This fixation with things anal is really a hallmark of your posts, isn't
eduardito?
> Guys and Dolls: LOok up anal character types and yoyu'll find a pic of Mr. anal
> mimself.
I think "hooked on phonics" is on the web eduardito, send them an email
asking for a refund, they might be able to decipher your ramblings. Or try
selling the kit in ebay, who knows it might not be a total loss after all.
Edward-Yemíl Rosario
>In article <3835918...@nntp.ix.netcom.com>,
> luc...@ix.netcom.com (Edward-Yemíl Rosario) wrote:
>> On Thu, 18 Nov 1999 13:57:22 GMT, ivanhe...@my-deja.com wrote:
>>
>> Anal, you NEVER, nor will EVER be able to spank me. However, I beleive you might
>> find S & M sites. Perchance you may meet some of your relatives there, no?
>>
>
>Like I said before eduardito, just because your family tree swings in that
>direction you can't assume the rest of us do.
<snip>
You mean to tell me your stupidity is not due to a limited gene pool? Sheeesh,
bendito!!!
>> This is what happens when a pompous, intellectually challenged come mierda
>> attempts to assume a pretense of knowledge he hasd no business (or capacity)
>> for. Good work, Anal, I hardly have to press my case for your own cathexis
>> toward stell-tight shpincter muscles. Go on, Anal, squeeze tight on your arse
>> muscles and then claim it thought...
>>
>
>Dang you're going to have to return your "hooked on phonics" kit, seems like
>it did not work after all.
<snip>
Your attempts at humor remind of the guy from the movie "Good Morning Vietnam."
You know the guy who tried to take over Robin Williams' part? another hallmark
of the anal character type is a poor grasp of humor.
>> Tu eres un Tremendo come mierda, Anal...
>>
>
>It takes on to know one eduardito. You still haven't posted the source for
>your claims about education in Cuba, have you? Oh wait, yes you did when you
>said that "Cuba is not your forte". Talk about pompous and self important.
<snip>
Estupido!!! Look at YOUR own source, pendejo!! You know the Un sttudies? Well,
they happen to cite the very same issues I brought up and they also claim a 20%
rise in literacy. Whatt happened, your poppi didn't tell you about this. You're
so full of yourself it's comical. You're your own best caricaturist.
>>
>> The hallmark of the FIXATED anal character is an abnormal preoccupation with
>> tiddiness and order.
>>
>
>This fixation with things anal is really a hallmark of your posts, isn't
>eduardito?
<snip>
Correction: the hallmark of my posts DIRECTED at you are fixated on youe paltry
attempts to squeeze your shpincter muscles and claim it to be reason.
>> Guys and Dolls: LOok up anal character types and yoyu'll find a pic of Mr. anal
>> mimself.
>
>I think "hooked on phonics" is on the web eduardito, send them an email
>asking for a refund, they might be able to decipher your ramblings. Or try
>selling the kit in ebay, who knows it might not be a total loss after all.
<snip>
This is your best shot? WOW!!! You really blew me away. On second thought, let
me rephrase that. what with your CLAIMED preference for spanking boys, I should
watch my back.
You're too easy Anal, I'm only toying with you...
Always,
Edward-Yemíl Rosario (Eddie)
<sig line temporarily suspended....GO METS!!!!!!!!! GO YANKEES!!!!!>
ivanhe...@my-deja.com
luc...@ix.netcom.com (Edward-Yemíl Rosario) wrote:
>
> You mean to tell me your stupidity is not due to a limited gene pool? Sheeesh,
> bendito!!!
>
Like I said before eduardito, don't project your own problems and limitations
it only makes you look desperate.
>
> Your attempts at humor remind of the guy from the movie "Good Morning Vietnam."
> You know the guy who tried to take over Robin Williams' part? another hallmark
> of the anal character type is a poor grasp of humor.
>
That's interesting your attempts at analysis remind me of no one. You're an
idiot of unmatched caliber.
>
> Estupido!!! Look at YOUR own source, pendejo!! You know the Un sttudies? Well,
> they happen to cite the very same issues I brought up and they also claim a 20%
> rise in literacy. Whatt happened, your poppi didn't tell you about this. You're
> so full of yourself it's comical. You're your own best caricaturist.
>
Say, is this the same UN study that you claimed used flawed methodology and
outdated techniques and could not be relied upon? Now you're citing it as a
source? Imagine that!
>
> Correction: the hallmark of my posts DIRECTED at you are fixated on youe paltry
> attempts to squeeze your shpincter muscles and claim it to be reason.
>
What can I say little man, it seems that you associate thinking with bowel
movements, that alone speaks volumes about your ability to reason.
>
> This is your best shot? WOW!!! You really blew me away. On second thought, let
> me rephrase that. what with your CLAIMED preference for spanking boys, I should
> watch my back.
>
You're the only boy, and I do mean boy little man, that I enjoy spanking -and
only intellectually so don't get all excited eduardito.
> You're too easy Anal, I'm only toying with you...
>
Said the mouse to cat. Really eduardito, in a battle of wits you seem to
have very little armament.
Edward-Yemíl Rosario
The studies I'll cite will include methodological analyses, something your
warped thinking can't comprehend...Recent studies show a fuckin 20% increase in
litercay pendejo. That means studies incorporating better methodology reaching a
wider set of the populations involved, pendejo.
BTW, how's that pencil sharpener you call an anus?
Your claims to intelligence reminds me of the uneducable reaching for the
incomprehensible.
Always,
ivanhe...@my-deja.com
luc...@ix.netcom.com (Edward-Yemíl Rosario) wrote:
> This man has delusions of adequacy...
>
> The studies I'll cite will include methodological analyses, something your
> warped thinking can't comprehend...Recent studies show a fuckin 20% increase in
> litercay pendejo. That means studies incorporating better methodology reaching a
> wider set of the populations involved, pendejo.
>
Oh you're talking about your planned citations, not anything you've actually
posted, I get it. I'm waiting breathlessly.
A whole 20% increase? Wow, and that would bring the current literacy rate to
what? Careful now, I'm laying a mathematical trap for you.
> BTW, how's that pencil sharpener you call an anus?
>
Say eduardito, why the fixation with anuses? Use some of your high school
psych books and see if you can find an answer.
> Your claims to intelligence reminds me of the uneducable reaching for the
> incomprehensible.
>
Now this last sentence reminds *me* of something, what is it..., why it's you
eduardito!
ze...@metro.net
Maybe there is a particular motivation stemming from pride in the unique
contributions and inventions Cuban music has made regarding these
instruments. That and the fact that there would be a tradition of unique
teachers who knew the ins and outs of tumbaos and montunos. Also that
shit is so much fun to do why wouldn't they get great at it.
Aren't really good quality horns and woods way more expensive also?
Zeno (back from a brief hiatus woodshedding on my taburete)
Edward-Yemíl Rosario
As anyone in education would tell you: A 20% INCREASE IN LITERACY RATES IS
TREMENDOUS!!! But since you are stupid beyond your wildest dreams, I'll let your
little "misunderstanding" of the field go the wayside. In any case, you don't
want citations, you only want to "prove" you and your side is right.
Fortunately, your parents were able to generate only one of you. I find it hard
to beleive that more than one freakish homunculus germinated outside lawful
procreation could exist within one unit.
You are funny in that you are really unaware how stupid you come off. You point
out my suppossed fascination with your anus: what is else is there to discuss
with a pompous asshole?
You attempt to "spank me" (and I wonder the genesis of this fetish -- maybe
"poppi"?) by pointing out my mental or physical stature (unless of course you're
refering to my penis -- not a long shot by one who has already admitted to a
preference to spanking boys) with juvenile and pathetic attempts at humor.
If i were to comment on your own lack of mental stature I would have come up
with something somewhat more creative -- something along the lines of...
"ANAL IS A LITTLE MAN, THAT'S HIS TROUBLE. NEVER TRUST A MAN WITH SHORT LEGS --
BRAINS TOO NEAR THEIR ARSES." (there's another scatalogical reference for you
droll over, Anal).
Better yet, a little creativity would have been in order if you really wanted to
demonstrate a cutting wit, since I gather your claim to greatness in spanking --
and I take it that by spanking you mean demonstrations of superior intellect as
well as a deviant family sexual practice.
Try this on for size:
"ANAL'S MIND IS LIKE A SOUP DISH, WIDE AND SHALLOW"
But you could only resort to petty little bullshit attacks that are neither
funny nor insulting (except to the intelectual heritage of the people you
represent).
I would call you a gusano but I think that would be an insult to the
much-maligned slug community. In any case, my conjectures on your genetic
heritance (or lack thereof) will cease since this little discussion has shown me
that your dullness, alhtough a natural byproduct of that limited resource, must
have taken you a great deal of pain. such excess of stupidity, Anal, is not in
nature.
BTW, I notice that you STILL have yet to answer my questiuons re the very study
you cited (and half-century old study to boot). Could it be you NEVER even read
it? Could it be that you wouldn't even know how to interpret the results even if
you were to take your sloping forehad to task on it?
Could it be, Anal, thatt the very same problems I posted previously are
addressed at the very beginning of international studies conducted by
international organizations such as the WHO and the UN?
You stupid, stupid, creature. a waste of evolution: rarely have I witnessed so
much machinery get readied for so little thought. Your mind is like one of those
Goldberg contraptions elaborately mounted with scaffolds, pullies, tackles --
all to ste one or two bricks.
pjdiaz
"Edward-Yemíl Rosario" <luc...@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:383bea1c...@nntp.ix.netcom.com...
> Anal,
> As anyone in education would tell you: A 20% INCREASE IN LITERACY RATES IS
> TREMENDOUS!!!
Say... would "anyone in education" care to "tell" us which countries that
have achieved this 20% increase in literacy rates in the past, say, 40
years?
Just, you know, so one can assign some value to the "TREMENDOSITY" and, of
course, take a gander at the different costs these countries have paid to
achieve this.
Curioso na' ma'....
ivanhe...@my-deja.com
luc...@ix.netcom.com (Edward-Yemíl Rosario) wrote:
> Anal,
> As anyone in education would tell you: A 20% INCREASE IN LITERACY RATES IS
> little "misunderstanding" of the field go the wayside. In any case, you don't
My, my, such bile and all I asked was one little question--"a 20% increase
brings the current literacy rate to what?". Seems to me that you're a sad
and bitter little man eduardito, I won't even try to guess at the causes for
that some things are better left in the dark.
We're back to where we started eduardito, you asked a question about Cuba's
literacy rate before castro, I answered it and gave you a source, you're
response was an immediate attack on my answer without one single source to
back up your claims. You have recently claimed that you would soon be citing
studies galore, I'm still waiting eduardito.
Edward-Yemíl Rosario
Niether you nor you're other pendejo, PJ have been able to discuss for any
lenght of time the ORIGINAL issuesI pointed out. Seeing you rdemonstration of
iutter stupity, I take it YIU HAVE NOT EVEN READ the study YOU cited.
Talk about a stupid asshole...
I wouyldn't even waste cites on a pompous asshole such as yourself. Unless, of
course, if you can even begin to discuss research in education.
Allow me to reiterate:
YOU HAVE NOT DISCUSSED NOT EVEN AN IOTA OF THR STUDY YOU CITED
I'll ask you again:
HAVE YOU EVEN READ THE STUDY YOU CITED?
You stupid, stupid motherfucker...
I only engage you because you make me laugh with your pretentions to
intellectual heft....
When I call you an inbred motherfucker I'm not using profanity, but am referring
to the circumstances of your miserable birth, illegal as it undoubtably is.
So far, the only vestige of intellect that you have contributed to this
discussion aint worth a pitcher of warm spit.
Edward-Yemíl Rosario (Eddie)
pjdiaz
> Anal:
> Niether you nor you're other pendejo, PJ have been able to discuss for any
> lenght of time the ORIGINAL issuesI pointed out.
Say.... Eddie.... have you had a chance to look up how many countries have
done that "TREMENDOUS" 20% increase in literacy in the past 40 years?
Now don't get riled up at my suggestion you do some homework, after all....
you did tell Roitstein, in one of your rare lucid moments, that well, issues
related to Cuba weren't your forte, and we don't want anyone thinking they
can be a "discussion" leader w/o having a knowledge base wide enough to say
one has perspective, do we?
Pendejamente yours,
PJ
ivanhe...@my-deja.com
luc...@ix.netcom.com (Edward-Yemíl Rosario) wrote:
>
> I only engage you because you make me laugh with your pretentions to
> intellectual heft....
>
Speaking of intellectual heft, did you ever hear of a spell checker? Or
maybe a dictionary? Didn't think so eduardito. Your inability to discuss
any issue without resorting to a barrage of insults continues to paint you as
the sad little man that you are. I would say that it's a shame how you can't
rise above these depths, but it's very clear that this level of discussion
*is* a step up from the small and dark wasteland that is your mind. Sad.
Fabulana
>
> In article <3845a0af...@nntp.ix.netcom.com>,
> luc...@ix.netcom.com (Edward-Yemíl Rosario) wrote:
> >
> > I only engage you because you make me laugh with your pretentions to
> > intellectual heft....
> >
>
> Speaking of intellectual heft, did you ever hear of a spell checker?
Pedantry is not intellect.
> Or
> maybe a dictionary?
You can't find intellect in a dictionary (unless you look under "i").
> Didn't think so eduardito. Your inability to discuss
> any issue without resorting to a barrage of insults continues to paint you as
> the sad little man that you are.
No, a Valkyrie. Can't you hear the music when he flies?
> I would say that it's a shame how you can't
> rise above these depths, but it's very clear that this level of discussion
> *is* a step up from the small and dark wasteland that is your mind.
At least Eddie is trying to better himself and the lives of others
through his studies.
Can he be pompous? Yeah. Pretentious? You bet.
Now, it took YOU how long to figure that out?
Some genius you are.
-Fabulana
ivanhernandez
<sal...@picadillo.nospam.com> wrote:
> > Speaking of intellectual heft, did you ever hear of a spell checker?
>
> Pedantry is not intellect.
>
Case in point.
> > Or
> > maybe a dictionary?
>
> You can't find intellect in a dictionary (unless you look under "i").
>
Yet another brilliant piece of logic. You should've quit with last
sentence.
> > Didn't think so eduardito. Your inability to discuss
> > any issue without resorting to a barrage of insults continues to paint you as
> > the sad little man that you are.
>
> No, a Valkyrie. Can't you hear the music when he flies?
>
I'm sure this sounded coherent in your own mind, it isn't.
>
> At least Eddie is trying to better himself and the lives of others
> through his studies.
>
No, at *most* eduardito is *saying* that he's *trying* to better
himself. Then again, in his case taking a dump in the morning is about
as far as he gets in *bettering himself*.
> Can he be pompous? Yeah. Pretentious? You bet.
> Now, it took YOU how long to figure that out?
> Some genius you are.
>
Pompous, pretentious, you left out small minded, assinine, and
ignorant, and I had eduardito figured the first time I saw his slimy
blatherings in the newsgroup. Apparently it took you a little longer.
--
Free audio & video emails, greeting cards and forums
Talkway - http://www.talkway.com - Talk more ways (sm)
Edward-Yemíl Rosario
How ya doin?!?! I'm bored so I'll hurk another insult or two at ya, chump:
But first:
HAVE YOU EVEN READ THE STUDY YOU CITED ON CUBAN LITERACY RATES?
You stupid motherfucker...
If you did, you pompous fool, you would've observed, in its methodological
section, that the very same issues and problems I raised at the start of this
"discussion" were deemed pertinent to the team of researchers.
But I don't believe you read this study, right pendejo?
What does that make you, Anal?
BTW, did your mother tkae my suggestion and start braiding her underarms?
Always,
Edward-Yemíl Rosario
You remind of the sidekick in Pinky and the Brain..
Anyway, I DO know that no other developing country has matched Cuba's growth inn
literacy rates which outpace some states (like Texas) here. The only other
Latino/a country to come close to Cuba in the same time span is Argentina, I
believe.
Now go away and get humped by Anal.
BTW, fuck you and the CANF member you rode in on...
Always,
Edward-Yemíl Rosario
wrote:
>ivanhe...@my-deja.com wrote:
>>
>> In article <3845a0af...@nntp.ix.netcom.com>,
>> luc...@ix.netcom.com (Edward-Yemíl Rosario) wrote:
>> >
>> > I only engage you because you make me laugh with your pretentions to
>> > intellectual heft....
>> >
>>
>> Speaking of intellectual heft, did you ever hear of a spell checker?
>
>Pedantry is not intellect.
<snip>
FAB, the guy is so pathetic he's comical -- in a tragi-comedic sort of way...
>
>> Or
>> maybe a dictionary?
>
>You can't find intellect in a dictionary (unless you look under "i").
>
>> Didn't think so eduardito. Your inability to discuss
>> any issue without resorting to a barrage of insults continues to paint you as
>> the sad little man that you are.
<snip>
Anal!!
Look up contempt. That's what I feel for you, contempt. It's the reason I don't
even bother posting substantial responses to your posts --which have done
nothing to confrim to demonstrate that you have any grasp of critical thinking.
You have yet to even BEGIN to address the issues at hand in any way whatsoever.
Maybe it was that Cuban education. Or is it that you're so indoctrinated by your
father's delusions that you can't think straight?
>No, a Valkyrie. Can't you hear the music when he flies?
>
>> I would say that it's a shame how you can't
>> rise above these depths, but it's very clear that this level of discussion
>> *is* a step up from the small and dark wasteland that is your mind.
>
>At least Eddie is trying to better himself and the lives of others
>through his studies.
>
>Can he be pompous? Yeah. Pretentious? You bet.
>Now, it took YOU how long to figure that out?
>Some genius you are.
<snip>
Gee thanks, FAB -- I think <grin>
pjdiaz
> >
> Now go away and get humped by Anal.
>
> BTW, fuck you and the CANF member you rode in on...
I'd be careful Eddie, there's a group here 'round RMAL that's rooting out
bad mouthed posters.... and if they ever find an ethical bone in their body,
you might be in a head o' trouble.
BTW... CANF??? May I ask when was it that you first read "El Manual del
Perfecto Idiota Latinoamericano"?
pjdiaz
"Edward-Yemíl Rosario" <luc...@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:384bc86a...@nntp.ix.netcom.com...
>
growth inn
> literacy rates which outpace some states (like Texas) here. The only other
> Latino/a country to come close to Cuba in the same time span is Argentina,
I
> believe.
Ooops.. sorry... I forgot... I was too busy laughing at you somewhat
predicable behaviour to get a laugh at your response... so... let's see...
you believe it was Argentina, eh? Good guess.... albeit somewhat indicative
of a certain eurocentricity...couldn't be one of them there
indian/brown/black countries, eh, Eddie... cuz...well... w/o marxism the
masses are hopelessly lost... let's play it safe and bet on Argentina.
Hmmm... well... gee... Eddie.... let's start working our way through the
list south from the tropic of Cancer... how 'bout the TREMENDOUS country of
Panama, Eddie?
ivanhe...@my-deja.com
luc...@ix.netcom.com (Edward-Yemíl Rosario) wrote:
>
> Anal!!
> Look up contempt. That's what I feel for you, contempt. It's the reason I don't
> even bother posting substantial responses to your posts --which have done
> nothing to confrim to demonstrate that you have any grasp of critical thinking.
>
Funny, all I feel for you is pity.
> You have yet to even BEGIN to address the issues at hand in any way whatsoever.
> Maybe it was that Cuban education. Or is it that you're so indoctrinated by your
> father's delusions that you can't think straight?
>
Issues at hand? Do you even remember, if you ever knew, what the issue at
hand was? I've tried any number of times to get you back on track and yet
you continue to shower me with insults--not that I mind, it just continues to
expose you for the weak minded little man that you are.
ivanhe...@my-deja.com
luc...@ix.netcom.com (Edward-Yemíl Rosario) wrote:
> ANAL!!!!
> How ya doin?!?! I'm bored so I'll hurk another insult or two at ya, chump:
>
> But first:
>
> HAVE YOU EVEN READ THE STUDY YOU CITED ON CUBAN LITERACY RATES?
>
> You stupid motherfucker...
>
> If you did, you pompous fool, you would've observed, in its methodological
> section, that the very same issues and problems I raised at the start of this
> "discussion" were deemed pertinent to the team of researchers.
>
> But I don't believe you read this study, right pendejo?
>
> What does that make you, Anal?
>
> BTW, did your mother tkae my suggestion and start braiding her underarms?
>
My, my, such hatred in your posts eduardito. My pity for you grows with
every post of yours. You're a sad spectacle.
BTW, would you mind posting the methodological section of this report you
supposedly read? Thanks!
Edward-Yemíl Rosario
On Mon, 6 Dec 1999 14:57:31 -0500, "pjdiaz" <pjd...@xxx.xcom> wrote:
>
>"Edward-Yemíl Rosario" <luc...@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
>news:384bc86a...@nntp.ix.netcom.com...
>> >
>> Now go away and get humped by Anal.
>>
>> BTW, fuck you and the CANF member you rode in on...
>
>
>I'd be careful Eddie, there's a group here 'round RMAL that's rooting out
>bad mouthed posters.... and if they ever find an ethical bone in their body,
>you might be in a head o' trouble.
>
>BTW... CANF??? May I ask when was it that you first read "El Manual del
>Perfecto Idiota Latinoamericano"?
>
>
Always,
Edward-Yemíl Rosario
matches Cuba's educational growth, period. I KNOW that's hard for you to swallow
--what with your thin neck and bottomless stomach. I KNOW its painful for you to
even begin to attempt to stay focused, but just try.
Take a deep breath, Pinky...
now...
SWALLOW
On Mon, 6 Dec 1999 15:04:57 -0500, "pjdiaz" <pjd...@xxx.xcom> wrote:
>
>"Edward-Yemíl Rosario" <luc...@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
>news:384bc86a...@nntp.ix.netcom.com...
>>
>> Anyway, I DO know that no other developing country has matched Cuba's
>growth inn
>> literacy rates which outpace some states (like Texas) here. The only other
>> Latino/a country to come close to Cuba in the same time span is Argentina,
>I
>> believe.
>
>Ooops.. sorry... I forgot... I was too busy laughing at you somewhat
>predicable behaviour to get a laugh at your response... so... let's see...
>you believe it was Argentina, eh? Good guess.... albeit somewhat indicative
>of a certain eurocentricity...couldn't be one of them there
>indian/brown/black countries, eh, Eddie... cuz...well... w/o marxism the
>masses are hopelessly lost... let's play it safe and bet on Argentina.
>
>Hmmm... well... gee... Eddie.... let's start working our way through the
>list south from the tropic of Cancer... how 'bout the TREMENDOUS country of
>Panama, Eddie?
>
>
>
>
Always,
pjdiaz
> The FACT remains, Pinky, that you're hard-pressed to find ANY country that
> matches Cuba's educational growth, period. I KNOW that's hard for you to
swallow
> --what with your thin neck and bottomless stomach. I KNOW its painful for
you to
> even begin to attempt to stay focused, but just try.
>
Let me try again....... how 'bout the ANY and TREMENDOUS country of Panama,
Eddie?
That's P-a-n-a-m-a..... as in the hat, you KNOW?
Edward-Yemíl Rosario
HAVE YOU EVEN READ THE STUDY YOU CITED?
IF SO, WOULD YOU RECAP THE METHODOLOGICAL SECTION?
If in your next post you fail to answer these questions then you're either a
congenital liar or a pompous asshole.
Period....
In either case, you have failed miserably at staying with the issues I
originally posted, pendejo.
BTW, how's the ole lady?
On Tue, 07 Dec 1999 13:46:57 GMT, ivanhe...@my-deja.com wrote:
>In article <384bc92f...@nntp.ix.netcom.com>,
> luc...@ix.netcom.com (Edward-Yemíl Rosario) wrote:
>>
>> Anal!!
>> Look up contempt. That's what I feel for you, contempt. It's the reason I don't
>> even bother posting substantial responses to your posts --which have done
>> nothing to confrim to demonstrate that you have any grasp of critical thinking.
>>
>
>Funny, all I feel for you is pity.
>
>> You have yet to even BEGIN to address the issues at hand in any way whatsoever.
>> Maybe it was that Cuban education. Or is it that you're so indoctrinated by your
>> father's delusions that you can't think straight?
>>
>
>Issues at hand? Do you even remember, if you ever knew, what the issue at
>hand was? I've tried any number of times to get you back on track and yet
>you continue to shower me with insults--not that I mind, it just continues to
>expose you for the weak minded little man that you are.
>
>
>
>Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
>Before you buy.
Edward-Yemíl Rosario (Eddie)
Edward-Yemíl Rosario
<snip>
Hatred? You think too highly of yourself, Anal. Contempt, Anal, is a total lack
of affect. You're beneath my hatred, which I rarely use. Contempt is usually
reserved for pendejos like you who sprout mental cockroaches every where they
go.
>My, my, such hatred in your posts eduardito. My pity for you grows with
>every post of yours. You're a sad spectacle.
<snip>
Well coming from you it really doesn't mean squat to me. Your a flaming
asshole!! Who cares what the fuck you think?
>BTW, would you mind posting the methodological section of this report you
>supposedly read? Thanks!
<snip>
I see, you HAVEN'T read the aformentioned study. If you would have, you would
have noticed the qualifiers attached to international studies.
I KNOW you don't know what you're talking about because you have FAILED to even
come up with RUDIMENTARY questions pertaining to research in general and ed
research in particular.
Your childishly transparent attempts to put the onus on me after I labelled
several of the issues involved in international research (or for that matter,
ANY study) only serve to demonstrate your total lack of critical thinking.
I've even posted mistakes which you and that other asshole, Pinky, have totally
missed! You guys are a study in the total refusal to reason. I don't hate you,
Anal. As a matter of fact, if you were to ask me what I think or FEEL for you I
would answer...
NOTHING
In the grand scheme of things in my life, you're
beneath my contempt. I see you and folks such as yourself just willing dupes who
gleefully roast their own people in the name of some worthless ideological rant.
Edward-Yemíl Rosario
Wanna talk about Torrillo's reforms? You stupid fuck, you pick Panama to
demonstrate what? In any case, Panama doesn't even MATCH Cuba's ed growth. It
comes close but still no cigar (pun intended).
Go blow Anal or something.
Edward-Yemíl Rosario (Eddie)
pjdiaz
> Pinky:
> Wanna talk about Torrillo's reforms? You stupid fuck, you pick Panama to
> demonstrate what? In any case, Panama doesn't even MATCH Cuba's ed growth.
It
> comes close but still no cigar (pun intended).
Damn... Eddie... I guess when you told Roitstein it wasn't your area of
expertise, you were right?
Let's see... Literacy Rates
1955 Panama 70% Cuba 76%
1995 Panama 91% Cuba 96%
Mentioned Panama, cuz, well, their levels were fairly evenly matched, made
for a good comparison.... I guess you'll have to explain where they don't
MATCH.
In any event... lets move on, let you take another swing at demonstrating
that knowledge which has to be behind your highly opinionated blather... how
'bout say... the Dominican Republic, Eddie? You think they managed to do
that TREMENDOUS 20% gain that Cuba's accomplished in 40 years?
Care to display your expertise and guess at a few others?
Argentina? Colombia? Paraguay? Brazil? El Salvador? Costa Rica? Guatemala?
Haiti?
Which did that 20% increase which didn't... some are ringers... some
aren't... try your luck...make us laugh.
Cheers,
Pinky
ivanhernandez
Rosario) wrote:
> ANAL:
> HAVE YOU EVEN READ THE STUDY YOU CITED?
>
> IF SO, WOULD YOU RECAP THE METHODOLOGICAL SECTION?
>
Whoops! Looks like another evasion eduardito. Nice try but I asked
you first.
> If in your next post you fail to answer these questions then you're either a
> congenital liar or a pompous asshole.
>
> Period....
>
Coming from you and your avowed and obvious expertise on pompousness
and being an asshole I might have to take this insult under
consideration.
> In either case, you have failed miserably at staying with the issues I
> originally posted, pendejo.
>
> BTW, how's the ole lady?
>
You posted issues? In what universe? Certainly not in one innhabited
by rational people, must be in that dark little place you call a mind.
BTW, my old lady is just fine, thanks for your kind concern.
ivanhernandez
Rosario) wrote:
>
> Hatred? You think too highly of yourself, Anal. Contempt, Anal, is a total lack
> of affect. You're beneath my hatred, which I rarely use. Contempt is usually
> reserved for pendejos like you who sprout mental cockroaches every where they
> go.
>
Ehem, that should have been "effect" eduardito not "affect", unless you
meant "affect" in which case your post makes as much sense as anything
you write--namely none.
>
> Well coming from you it really doesn't mean squat to me. Your a flaming
> asshole!! Who cares what the fuck you think?
>
For someone who doesn't care what I think you certainly seem to
dedicate an awful lot of time and typing to me. BTW, that should've
been "you're" not "your", unless you meant "your" in which case your
post makes as much sense as anything you write--namely none.
>
> I see, you HAVEN'T read the aformentioned study. If you would have, you would
> have noticed the qualifiers attached to international studies.
>
> I KNOW you don't know what you're talking about because you have FAILED to even
> come up with RUDIMENTARY questions pertaining to research in general and ed
> research in particular.
>
Please eduardito after flaunting your ignorance of Cuban education
issues, of Latin American education issues, and of the english language
in general your admonitions have a rather "pot calling the kettle
black" feel to them.
> Your childishly transparent attempts to put the onus on me after I labelled
> several of the issues involved in international research (or for that matter,
> ANY study) only serve to demonstrate your total lack of critical thinking.
>
> I've even posted mistakes which you and that other asshole, Pinky, have totally
> missed! You guys are a study in the total refusal to reason. I don't hate you,
> Anal. As a matter of fact, if you were to ask me what I think or FEEL for you I
> would answer...
>
>
> NOTHING
>
Whoa! Whatever happened to your contempt eduardito? Have you lost
that too? Too bad, I still feel pity for you.
> In the grand scheme of things in my life, you're
> beneath my contempt. I see you and folks such as yourself just willing dupes who
> gleefully roast their own people in the name of some worthless ideological rant.
>
>
How do I roast my own people eduardito? This one should be fun!
Edward-Yemíl Rosario
Just try, try to think about this:
Was Cuba's (or anyone eles's) litercay rate increase REALLY "20%"? You stupid
fuck. and you call yourself a fuckin "capitalist"?
I reiterate: If Cuba's literacy rate went from 76% to 96%, is that a 25 PER CENT
increase?
You stupid, stupid fuck...it seems that I'm the one that's laughing...
Some freakin "capitalist" you are. I would love to see you how your ststistical
expertise would play out in the real world. No wonder you spend your days
posting drivel instead of overseeing your financial assets..
Que pendejo...
Always,
Edward-Yemíl Rosario
>On Thu, 09 Dec 1999 13:22:23 GMT luc...@ix.netcom.com (Edward-Yemíl
>Rosario) wrote:
>>
>> Hatred? You think too highly of yourself, Anal. Contempt, Anal, is a total lack
>> of affect. You're beneath my hatred, which I rarely use. Contempt is usually
>> reserved for pendejos like you who sprout mental cockroaches every where they
>> go.
>>
>
>Ehem, that should have been "effect" eduardito not "affect", unless you
>meant "affect" in which case your post makes as much sense as anything
>you write--namely none.
<snip>
Yeah, yeah, yeah...
>>
>> Well coming from you it really doesn't mean squat to me. Your a flaming
>> asshole!! Who cares what the fuck you think?
>>
>
>For someone who doesn't care what I think you certainly seem to
>dedicate an awful lot of time and typing to me.
<snip>
Anal, I know your narcissitic vulnerabilities make it hard for you to grasp, but
I REALLY don't give a fuck about you. Beleive it or not, people don't go around
waiting with bated breath for **your're** next post. It's called "rec" Anal,
I'm having fun at your expense and you take that for attention. What was the
word you used? Pathetic?
You mistake my attention for something other than what it is: complete
disregard for you. I don't give a shit about you, anal. Other than inciting you
to act like the ashole you really are, I have no other interest. Eventually,
I'll even tire of that...
> BTW, that should've
>been "you're" not "your", unless you meant "your" in which case your
>post makes as much sense as anything you write--namely none.
<snip>
Just what I expect from an anal character type, Anal. Go on preoccupy yourself
with your obsession with the orderly. **YOU'RE** attempts at wit are sorry
indeed. I would respect you if you could even come up with something funny, or
"biting," but you lack the talent or mental wherewithall to demonstrate even a
shred of humor.
Here's an example, anal: If I wanted to skewer **YOU'RE** theologically
fundamentalist perspective on Castro and Cuba, I would say something like so:
Anal enjoys prophseying the imminent fall of Castro and is prepared to play a
part, any part, in his burial -- except that of a mute.
Now, isn't that little better than **YOU'RE** embarrassing attempts to correct
my syntax and grammar? BTW, correcting my language is not a substitute for
presenting a cogent argument. So far, all you have provided throughout this
whole farce is an obscure reference to a '59 study and some anecdotal bullshit.
That's why I don't even take you or the other oubic hair, Pinky, seriously. It
would be waste of mental energy.
What's funny are your attempts to puff yourself up. NOW if you weren't so
earnest -- if you didn't take yourself so seriously -- THAT caricature would be
funny. Unfortunately, it's evident you take yourself seriously.
>>
>> I see, you HAVEN'T read the aformentioned study. If you would have, you would
>> have noticed the qualifiers attached to international studies.
>>
>> I KNOW you don't know what you're talking about because you have FAILED to even
>> come up with RUDIMENTARY questions pertaining to research in general and ed
>> research in particular.
>>
>
>Please eduardito after flaunting your ignorance of Cuban education
>issues, of Latin American education issues, and of the english language
>in general your admonitions have a rather "pot calling the kettle
>black" feel to them.
<snip>
Tha't funny because you've yet to answer my question: HAVE YOU READ THE STUDY
YOU CITED?
>> Your childishly transparent attempts to put the onus on me after I labelled
>> several of the issues involved in international research (or for that matter,
>> ANY study) only serve to demonstrate your total lack of critical thinking.
>>
>> I've even posted mistakes which you and that other asshole, Pinky, have totally
>> missed! You guys are a study in the total refusal to reason. I don't hate you,
>> Anal. As a matter of fact, if you were to ask me what I think or FEEL for you I
>> would answer...
>>
>>
>> NOTHING
>>
>
>Whoa! Whatever happened to your contempt eduardito? Have you lost
>that too? Too bad, I still feel pity for you.
<snip>
Is this supossed to make me feel inferiro, anal? LOL!!!
You see! You take yourself WAAAAY too seriously...
>> In the grand scheme of things in my life, you're
>> beneath my contempt. I see you and folks such as yourself just willing dupes who
>> gleefully roast their own people in the name of some worthless ideological rant.
>>
>>
>
>How do I roast my own people eduardito? This one should be fun!
<snip>
Put a CANF member to roast, there will always be another to turn the spit...
Puhllleeeeze, analito, you would wage war on your own kind at the drop of a hat
(or with the help with the CIA).
Edward-Yemíl Rosario
>On Thu, 09 Dec 1999 13:10:38 GMT luc...@ix.netcom.com (Edward-Yemíl
>Rosario) wrote:
>> ANAL:
>> HAVE YOU EVEN READ THE STUDY YOU CITED?
>>
>> IF SO, WOULD YOU RECAP THE METHODOLOGICAL SECTION?
>>
>
>Whoops! Looks like another evasion eduardito. Nice try but I asked
>you first.
<snip>
Actually, I ALREADY posted some of the issues mentioned in any international
study involving social inidcators, anal. A LONG time ago...
Do you have anything to add?
Please don't be deterred in the fanatic application of your sterile logic...
>> If in your next post you fail to answer these questions then you're either a
>> congenital liar or a pompous asshole.
>>
>> Period....
>>
>
>Coming from you and your avowed and obvious expertise on pompousness
>and being an asshole I might have to take this insult under
>consideration.
>
>> In either case, you have failed miserably at staying with the issues I
>> originally posted, pendejo.
>>
>> BTW, how's the ole lady?
>>
>
>You posted issues? In what universe? Certainly not in one innhabited
>by rational people, must be in that dark little place you call a mind.
>BTW, my old lady is just fine, thanks for your kind concern.
<snip>
No thanks needed, it was my pleasure <VBG>...
ivanhernandez
Really eduardito? Please expand on this thought of yours. How did you
make this determination. Certainly not from anything I've said or
written, so it must've come from somewhere else. Where was that
eduardito?
pjdiaz
> Pinky:
> Just try, try to think about this:
> Was Cuba's (or anyone eles's) litercay rate increase REALLY "20%"? You
stupid
> fuck. and you call yourself a fuckin "capitalist"?
>
> I reiterate: If Cuba's literacy rate went from 76% to 96%, is that a 25
PER CENT
> increase?
>
Gee.. Eddie... resorting to semantics????
Sad.
Or is it desperate???
Does this mean that, well, you really don't know if Panama's increase was
TREMENDOUS? Or is it "as TREMENDOUS" (You skirted the issue...what's the
matter, can't bring yourself to even suggest that some other country did the
mythical thing Cuba did, Eddie?) ?
And how 'bout them other countries, Eddie... you wanna give them a shot?
I'll even let you apply whatever definition you want....define, what I said
was increase of 20% or increased 20% any which way you want.... define it
as 25% even and tell us...
Which of these is as TREMENDOUS as Cuba?
Haiti????
Argentina???
Columbia???
Costa Rica???
El Salvador???
Dominican Republic???
Brazil???
Guatemala???
Ecuador???
Which of these are as TREMENDOUS in their increased literacy as Cuba????
Give it a shot.
> You stupid, stupid fuck...it seems that I'm the one that's laughing...
Somehow... I don't think so.
And, be careful, lest some of the "we" see the "f_uck" and decide to enforce
the "rules of the "we"" universally instead of selectively.... you'll wind
up ivanized.
> Some freakin "capitalist" you are. I would love to see you how your
ststistical
> expertise would play out in the real world. No wonder you spend your days
> posting drivel instead of overseeing your financial assets..
> Que pendejo...
Gee... I was hoping you'd call me a TREMENDOUS pendejo.
But I guess it doesn't matter until, well, we see just what that TREMENDOUS
really means..
So... give the list a shot, Eddie.... cuz...well... you know... I think
you're just proving that what you confessed to Roitstein was an
understatement.
Cheers,
"Pinky".
BTW... have you ever been to the TREMENDOUS county of Panama or any of the
to-be-determined others?
Edward-Yemíl Rosario
>
>"Edward-Yemíl Rosario" <luc...@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
>news:385104c1...@nntp.ix.netcom.com...
>> Pinky:
>> Just try, try to think about this:
>> Was Cuba's (or anyone eles's) litercay rate increase REALLY "20%"? You
>stupid
>> fuck. and you call yourself a fuckin "capitalist"?
>>
>> I reiterate: If Cuba's literacy rate went from 76% to 96%, is that a 25
>PER CENT
>> increase?
>>
>
>Gee.. Eddie... resorting to semantics????
<snip>
Semantics?!?! If a stock you owned went from 20 to $30 would that be a "10%"
increase you bloody fool?
You can't even begin to understand stats, why should I even bother with your
stupidity?
>Sad.
>
>Or is it desperate???
<snip>
Don't you wish...
>Does this mean that, well, you really don't know if Panama's increase was
>TREMENDOUS? Or is it "as TREMENDOUS" (You skirted the issue...what's the
>matter, can't bring yourself to even suggest that some other country did the
>mythical thing Cuba did, Eddie?) ?
<snip>
Sure asshole, Panama comes closest to Cuba in literacy acheivement. But you show
your ignorance by not addressing important issues:
What does Panama consider literate as oppossed to Cuba? What do international
orgs such as UNESCO, WHO, UN consider literacy? How are litercay rates
distrubited amoing the poulations being considered? What is the infrastructure
of each country involved and how has that affected the compilation of the stats
leading to the reported literacy rates.
But even more important, what types of reforms ENABLED these literacy rates to
rise? Was it the "free" market and wholesale privatization of the educational
system that produced these rates? Or was it some socialist form of government
reform?
These are all rhetorical questions, Mr. Pinky Pendencio. I'm privy to meost of
these questions as well as the methods involved in calculating literacy across
countries. You and your sodomizer have yet to think about approaching these
issues (and others) in any logical manner. In fact, both you and analito have
failed to even demonstrate that you're even aware of such issues.
NO ONE, at least no self respecting researcher argues cuba's educational
advances. What is debated is what they MEAN.
Always,
pjdiaz
> Semantics?!?! If a stock you owned went from 20 to $30 would that be a
"10%"
> increase you bloody fool?
>
You know... I wasn't going to get into it...but... well... since you seem to
like to insult others while refusing to look in the mirror...may I point out
to you that we are not talking about the price of a stock, but a rate?
When the Fed (that's the Federal Reserve Board, Eddie, not some agency with
black helicopters) announces a 2% increase in the interest rate, which was
at, say, 8%, do folks with a variable mortgage, because instead of it going
to 10%, it, according to Eddie, the financial whiz, only goes to 8.16%?
> You can't even begin to understand stats, why should I even bother with
your
> stupidity?
Because...the issue is not statistics, but the fact that your admission to
Roitstein, that Cuba was not your forte, is turning out to be quite the
understanding, even if it didn't prevent you from making sweeping statements
and conclusions?
> Sure asshole, Panama comes closest to Cuba in literacy acheivement. But
you show
> your ignorance by not addressing important issues:
No... Eddie... Panama didn't come close, Panama equaled. Panama is, then, by
your definition a TREMENDOUS country.
> What does Panama consider literate as oppossed to Cuba? What do
international
> orgs such as UNESCO, WHO, UN consider literacy?
The reported literacy rates cited came from the same sources... WHO for
those for the 50s, the UN for today. If you'd known anything on the subject,
you'd have recognized this.
In other words Eddie, the standards for literacy reposted for all those
countries are the *same*.
You're grasping at straws.
>?How are litercay rates
> distrubited amoing the poulations being considered? What is the
infrastructure
> of each country involved and how has that affected the compilation of the
stats
> leading to the reported literacy rates.
> But even more important, what types of reforms ENABLED these literacy
rates to
> rise? Was it the "free" market and wholesale privatization of the
educational
> system that produced these rates? Or was it some socialist form of
government
> reform?
>
> These are all rhetorical questions,
No... they are questions which attempt to evade realities. That well Panama
is as TREMENDOUS as Cuba in achieveng similar increases in the literacy
rate. Which brings to mind the troublesome (to uninformed/propagandized
people like you)... just how tremendous is Cuba's achievement (and we
haven't even begun to discuss what the achievement cost, cumulative and
long-term) the cost of those "reforms").
>Mr. Pinky Pendencio. I'm privy to meost of
> these questions as well as the methods involved in calculating literacy
across
> countries.
The only thing you seem to be privy to, is how to make a fool out of
yourself.
> You and your sodomizer have yet to think about approaching these
> issues (and others) in any logical manner. In fact, both you and analito
have
> failed to even demonstrate that you're even aware of such issues.
Not to mention, your continued inability to argue w/o resorting to personal
insult instead of facts.
> NO ONE, at least no self resecting researcher argues cuba's educational
> advances. What is debated is what they MEAN.
What is being argued is whether your definition of it as something
TREMENDOUS, which infers something outstanding or unique, holds any water.
Heck..we're not even discussing costs.
So we now have Panama and Cuba as TREMENDOUS. Shall we continue to see how
commonplace TREMENDOUS can be, Eddie?
I'll leave the prior question uncut and snip out the rest of your insults..
you being a "statistical" expert and all, knowing the methodologies applied
should have no problem coming up with the answers....
> >And how 'bout them other countries, Eddie... you wanna give them a shot?
> >I'll even let you apply whatever definition you want....define, what I
said
> >was increase of 20% or increased 20% any which way you want.... define
it
> >as 25% even and tell us...
> >
> >Which of these is as TREMENDOUS as Cuba?
> >
> >Haiti????
> >Argentina???
> >Columbia???
> >Costa Rica???
> >El Salvador???
> >Dominican Republic???
> >Brazil???
> >Guatemala???
> >Ecuador???
> >
> >Which of these are as TREMENDOUS in their increased literacy as Cuba????
> >
> >Give it a shot
(insults snipped... cuz... well... the "we" may wake up with one small
ethical bone in their body and, gosh, eddie would be relegated to
ivanlimbo).
Cheers,
Pedro
Edward-Yemíl Rosario
>
>"Edward-Yemíl Rosario" <luc...@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
>news:38526e0c...@nntp.ix.netcom.com...
>> Semantics?!?! If a stock you owned went from 20 to $30 would that be a
>"10%"
>> increase you bloody fool?
>>
>
>You know... I wasn't going to get into it...but... well... since you seem to
>like to insult others while refusing to look in the mirror...may I point out
>to you that we are not talking about the price of a stock, but a rate?
<snip>
Hey "capitalist," dfon't you think rates matter in a financial decision? Would
you invest in a stock that went from 76 to 96 (and that no. is outdated with
even CANF academic whores admitting to universal literacy), or one that went
from 70 to 90? If the percentages (both relative and absolute) are measing units
in millions, isn't this more than a semantical ploy? Sure, Panama comes close in
RELATIVE terms, but you've failed miserably in analizing the data. You post some
numbers and think that's all that's needed?
Why hasn't Panama achieved a higher literacy rate, pendencio? What atre the
factors involved that allowed Cuba to maintain and improve upon its literacy
rates and have left Panama at its current rate?
In any case, NO ONE, at least no one who has some modicum of reading
comprehension or an inkling of how to understand research data, can argue that
in any way you spin it, Cuba has excelled in education. You mentioned all these
other countries? What about them? What are their teacher to population rates,
how much was invested in educational infrastructure? What has these various
educational reforms resulted in?
I CAN tell you this, Pendencio. Cuba has demonstrated excellence in all the
above areas. You Know what this means? It could very possibly mean that the
level of literacy is of a good quality -- surpassing even UNESCO's definition of
literacy (do YOU know what that standard is? Hint: you can find it in ANY
international study. You HAVE read these studies haven't you?).
these factors, educational access across SES, relative educational gains across
gender and age groups, standards used to quantify literacy, infrastructur, etc.
allows one (assuming that person HAS a brain) to conduct an anlysis allowing for
a better understanding of the data. I see none of this in your writing.
BTW, just because I say "Cuba is not my FORTE," doesn't mean I don't KNOW what
I'm talking about.
I'm waiting for you "expert" analysis of educational outcome studies...
And waiting
and waiting....
This is why I insult idiots such as yourself and your buddy:
YOU DON"T KNOW WHAT THE FUCK YOU"RE TALKING ABOUT!!!!
>When the Fed (that's the Federal Reserve Board, Eddie, not some agency with
>black helicopters) announces a 2% increase in the interest rate, which was
>at, say, 8%, do folks with a variable mortgage, because instead of it going
>to 10%, it, according to Eddie, the financial whiz, only goes to 8.16%?
>
>
>> You can't even begin to understand stats, why should I even bother with
>your
>> stupidity?
>
>Because...the issue is not statistics, but the fact that your admission to
>Roitstein, that Cuba was not your forte, is turning out to be quite the
>understanding, even if it didn't prevent you from making sweeping statements
>and conclusions?
>
>> Sure asshole, Panama comes closest to Cuba in literacy acheivement. But
>you show
>> your ignorance by not addressing important issues:
>
>No... Eddie... Panama didn't come close, Panama equaled. Panama is, then, by
>your definition a TREMENDOUS country.
>
>
>
>> What does Panama consider literate as oppossed to Cuba? What do
>international
>> orgs such as UNESCO, WHO, UN consider literacy?
>
>The reported literacy rates cited came from the same sources... WHO for
>those for the 50s, the UN for today. If you'd known anything on the subject,
>you'd have recognized this.
<snip>
BULLSHIT!!!!
Go to their freakin website and READ, yoyu fool -- just read what they say about
literacy standards and how they fluctuate across nations. Who do you think take
these surveys, Pinky?!?! ALL the int'l. organizations do is COMPILE what
countries themselves collect you stupid, stupid man.
UNESCO, Pinky, itself explains this little qualifier.
These studies often don't post HOW literacy rates are distributed across SES. An
example for you pendencio: In Brazil 70% of the illieracy rate is concentrated
in the NE, the most troublesome area of Brazil. In fact, there's a clearly
defined demarcation between whites and prwetos and pardos. In absolute and
relative terms, the greatest number of Brazilians who will become illiterate
will reside in the NE.
For the most part these studies don't show teacher to population ratios or
number of schools built within a given time frame. You and your asshole frend
like to harp -- like little pendejos -- about Cuba's pre Castro literacy rates
but fail to mention that the in rural areas the number of illierates reached
epidemic proportions!!!
Within 10 years, Cuba achieved the bulk of its educational gains, with schools
multiplying by scores. You post soem half baked statistic w/o a shred of
analysis and you call that intelligent?
give me the stats and I tear them up and shove them up your sorrry arse, you
fool.
Edward-Yemíl Rosario (Eddie)
pjdiaz
Eddie... you are again, relying on semantics to try and avoid reality.
Let's recap, you labeled the 20% increase in literacy that Cuba has achieved
over the last 40 years as something TREMENDOUS. Indeed, Cuba went from 76%
to 96%, no one disputed that, no one even mentioned what it cost.
Now... Panama went from, 72% to 92%, another 20% increase... or if you want
to use your only acceptable definition of how one should use the term
increase, then panama increased it's literacy by 27%, or more so than Cuba.
So... does this mean by both your definitions that Panama also did something
TREMENDOUS.
Or does TREMENDOUS only apply to states which imposed a, in order a 1)
Fidelista 2) Totalitarian 3) Marxist-Leninist 4) socialist system in order
to achieve this type of increase?
> Why hasn't Panama achieved a higher literacy rate, pendencio? What atre
the
> factors involved that allowed Cuba to maintain and improve upon its
literacy
> rates and have left Panama at its current rate?
Gee, Eddie... do you want to quibble over a 4% difference in literacy
between Panama and Cuba? Cuz, if you do, we'll have to look at well, the
costs.
> In any case, NO ONE, at least no one who has some modicum of reading
> comprehension or an inkling of how to understand research data, can argue
that
> in any way you spin it, Cuba has excelled in education.
Gee, Eddie... no one who has a modicum of reading comprehension will find
where I denied Cuba's literacy rate or spun anything regarding education. Or
should I say no one who isn't a prejudiced, biased, reactionary to anything
but what he, a propagandized tonto util, chooses to read?
> You mentioned all these
> other countries? What about them? What are their teacher to population
rates,
> how much was invested in educational infrastructure? What has these
various
> educational reforms resulted in?
Hey... Eddie... which countries are those? You still haven't said which did
or didn't match Cuba's "TREMENDOUS" increase in literacy rate of 20% over
the last 40 years.
> I CAN tell you this, Pendencio. Cuba has demonstrated excellence in all
the
> above areas. You Know what this means? It could very possibly mean that
the
> level of literacy is of a good quality -- surpassing even UNESCO's
definition of
> literacy (do YOU know what that standard is? Hint: you can find it in ANY
> international study. You HAVE read these studies haven't you?).
Gee... Eddie... it's the same standard by which all countries are measured,
isn't it? So again, Eddie, let's see which countries did that TREMENDOUS 20%
increase... want the list of candidates again???
> these factors, educational access across SES, relative educational gains
across
> gender and age groups, standards used to quantify literacy, infrastructur,
etc.
> allows one (assuming that person HAS a brain) to conduct an anlysis
allowing for
> a better understanding of the data. I see none of this in your writing.
Maybe you might want to call UNESCO and the UN and tell them that, because
you don't have any other argument, you are accusing them of applying
different methodologies to measure the rate of any other country which might
have experienced that TREMENDOUS 20% increase in literacy over the past 40
years.
> BTW, just because I say "Cuba is not my FORTE," doesn't mean I don't KNOW
what
> I'm talking about.
Well, gee, Eddie... which was the only country you said matched Cuba's
tremendous achievement of again, a 20% increase in literacy... wasn't it
Argentina? Well... Panama seems to have done it, too. So, it indeed does
look like you really don't know much... and there's all those other
countries I asked you to guess at their "TREMENDOUSITY"... you think any of
those matched Cuba's increase?
> I'm waiting for you "expert" analysis of educational outcome studies...
>
Not from me. I rely on the experts at WHO and the UN who establish the
standards and publish the figures for all the countries.
Let me remind you that the topic is that definition by you of Cuba's 20%
increase in the literacy rate (that measured by experts at the above
agencies) as TREMENDOUS, and not "expert analysis" of "educational outcome
studies".
So let's establish how many TREMENDOUS countries there are, according to
*your* definition using literacy rates measured and published by the experts
at WHO and the UN.
Or, could it be that, maybe you are somewhat afraid that your TREMENDOUS,
isn't even tremendous, but, well, something that others have managed to do
with little fanfare, and )(gasp!) without having to impose fidelismo, or
totalitarianismo, or marxismo-leninismo, or even socialismo?
I think that's it, Eddie.
Your own prejudiced propagandized blustering TREMENDOUS Cuba has been
exposed as being just what it is.
And, well, there's really nothing you can do, no matter how many semantic
arguments, or alternative definitions/side arguments, or even gratuitous
insults about me or exiles you present, to change the facts.
But, I'll give you one more chance... wanna guess at which of those
countries are TREMENDOUS (by your definition), have increased (by what ever
definition of increase you wish to apply to that 20% in question) their
literacy rate (by the definition of literacy rate utilized by the experts
who measure and publish such data)?
Just for laughs, Eddie, give it a shot.
Then, to use your own term again, those who haven't figured it out by now
will figure just who is the "pendejo".
Cheers,
PJD
as much or more so than Cuba's
Nina
Duh, I am so stupid. Ijust figgered this out. Its like those old dance
marathons. Nothing matters but being the last poster standing. Anyone know
the total count here? Are there records for longest running thread? Hmm, we
may beat those Seattle Ski idiots after all.
N
--
Just when the caterpillar thought the world had ended it became a butterfly-
Anonymous
pjdiaz <pjd...@xxx.xcom> wrote in message
news:8319nd$9ls$1...@pale-rider.INS.CWRU.Edu...
Yambu1
>the total count here? Are there records for longest running thread?
>
go to beat 350, which was a thread in the summer of '98 between a guy named
JAQO and - you guessed it - Eddie. But that one was no dumber than this one.
>
>- Mike Doran
Ricardo Portal
What happened to him????????
"El toro mata compa're, el toro mata"
Eoghan
with 1000 keyboards (read: Usenet) cannot reproduce the works of William
Shakespeare. ;-) On the other hand, do we have any evidence about the
primate population of western England prior to the 17th century?
Eoghan
Eoghan Ballard
Center for Folklore & Ethnology
University of Pennsylvania
Edward-Yemíl Rosario
<snip>
If I recall correctly JAQO and I were not the only ones involved in the above
mentioned thread. Furthermore, while there was much in the way of invective,
there were also many interesting topics/issues disucussed/broached in that
thread:
"Objectivity" in history
What cultural factors determine which questions are asked in scientific inquiry
Purported usage of "facts"
Methods of census taking in colonial caribbean
Indigenous influences (or absence of) in Afro Latin music
Slavery in Africa
There was good and bad and EVERYBODY (many lurkers too) was reading until the
discussion totally devolved.
In the process, I was able to get a group of teens to go to the library and help
with some research involving some of theissues mentioned above. THAT in itself
was a pleasure for me. I used the whole discussion as fodder to stimulate
discussion among my little group and it was fun watching the kids themselves
deconstruct the whole shmear.
One of the things I find most interesting is the amount of personal Email I get
from people who normally don't acrtively participate in this forum. Many times,
I get validation for airing issues that are both unpopular AND controversial.
some are messages that range from condescending to...whatever. In any case, I
ALWAYS get a response and that is my purpose in life to roil the waters, to make
the comfortable uncomfortable and the uncomfortable comfortable. If I must pay
so,e price to my cyber rep, then so be it. I just hope that I've pissed you off
in some way recently <grin>
Nina
Eddie sez:
> ALWAYS get a response and that is my purpose in life to roil the waters,
dance a lot. Preferably pissing off a whole lotta women in the process. Nice
to know that everyone isnt trying to end world hunger and bring about peace.
:-)
to make
> the comfortable uncomfortable
Are u sure I wasnt once married to you?
pjdiaz
>
>If I must pay
> so,e price to my cyber rep, then so be it.
>
Would you mind telling us which market and under what symbol this "cyber
rep" of yours is traded so I can short it?
Capitalistically yours,
Pinky
kaysee
. .
Songo Man wrote in message <19991214191054...@ng-fr1.aol.com>...
>
>
>Mike, this has to go into the ten-best list.
>
>
>songoman
>
>
>
>
pjdiaz
"Songo Man" <song...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:19991214211844...@ng-fa1.aol.com...
> I don't even get it. I guess I don't know what "short it" means.>>
>
> Short selling a stock is a tactic that causes a premature panic and
usually
> makes the value of the stock plummet.
>
> songoman
>
Not really... when one shorts a stock, one is betting that the stock price
will go down, and uses one of several different market devices (for example
a short sell or an out-of-the-money put) to (hopefully) capitalize on his
hunch that the stock will go down (panic plummet would be great... and
probably an apt description for the behaviour of shares in ECR (Eddie Cyber
Rep)).
Musically, it would be akin to betting that, a couple of years from now,
folks will be asking themselves Ricky Who?
;-)
Clay Leander
> JAQO??????
> What happened to him????????
We captured him in an off-line email chat, talking about 'just like old
times!'. No denying: he'd missed it here.
-c
* Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network *
The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free!
Clay Leander
I missed your warrior self late this summer when the ng became invaded,
and was glad you jumped back in to take on the bullies. But... NUFF,
dammit! Save your wit and words for better fights.
And if you don't, I hope you get fuckin' carpal for 3 fuckin weeks
starting tonight....
Songo Man
rep" of yours is traded so I can short it?
Capitalistically yours,
Pinky>>
Mike, this has to go into the ten-best list.
songoman
Yambu1
BTW, where's your over-domineering presence been lately? Too fucking busy and
vice versa, eh? (All credit to Dorothy Parker for that one).
Regarding the Dogshit Topping Awards, I can only say this will be the second
year in a row for Eddie, unless he pisses off the Judges Committee (ie, me).
As for you, prepare to be turned away yet again, though you ARE mentioned once
or twice.You still have about two weeks, though I don't hold out much hope for
you; the Committee's rigged.
>
>- Mike Doran
Yambu1
>From: "kaysee"
>
Twelve is the number this year. Last year there were eleven. The original 1999
field for consideraton had over thirty.
>
>- Mike Doran
Songo Man
Short selling a stock is a tactic that causes a premature panic and usually
Songo Man
will go down, and uses one of several different market devices (for example
a short sell or an out-of-the-money put) to (hopefully) capitalize on his
hunch that the stock will go down (panic plummet would be great... and
probably an apt description for the behaviour of shares in ECR (Eddie Cyber
Rep)).>>
Gotcha. Thanks for the clarification. Either way, it was a funny response.
songoman
Edward-Yemíl Rosario
<cjleande...@hotmail.com.invalid> wrote:
>Eddie;
>
>I missed your warrior self late this summer when the ng became invaded,
>and was glad you jumped back in to take on the bullies. But... NUFF,
>dammit! Save your wit and words for better fights.
<snip>
I'm through with the gsanos for now. Not only are they "short" on logic, they
aren't even funny. At least Paul gave me a run for my money. In any case, it's
hard to resist the temptation to deflate the inflated...
Edward-Yemíl Rosario
>Not really... when one shorts a stock, one is betting that the stock price
>will go down, and uses one of several different market devices (for example
>a short sell or an out-of-the-money put) to (hopefully) capitalize on his
>hunch that the stock will go down (panic plummet would be great... and
>probably an apt description for the behaviour of shares in ECR (Eddie Cyber
>Rep)).>>
<snip>
WOW!!! Does this guy know funny?!?!
Sheeesh, whatta a maroon...
>Gotcha. Thanks for the clarification. Either way, it was a funny response.
<snip>
Paul, I took my cue from Voltaire and my only prayer has been that the Lord make
my enemies ridiculous. Apparrently God has granted it.
Edward-Yemíl Rosario
20 PERCENTAGE POINTS (some capitalist wannabe you turned out to be) in ed gains
by cuba wasn't all that hot becuase Cuba already started out with a 70% literacy
rate. Asshole: you, in your infinite wisdom failed to mention that literacy
rates were extremely unevenly distributed. What were the literacy rates when
your father wasa fucking his mother's chickens out in the campos, bruto? How
many of your barefooted anscestors were attendding schools out there in the
hills, genius?
You don't mention those rates because like the rest of you neocons, you're an
inbred liar. You don't want discussion, you want to further a political agenda
that has cost YOUR OWN countrymen.
Not Castro, but your fellow Cubans have suffered in what has amounted to a war
against an island nation. This can be measured in ,ives, food, and isloation. An
isloation that most of the civilized world rightly percieves as the bullshit
that it is.
No matter how you spin it, what cuba has now IS A LOT BETTER than what they had
when your cousins were prostituting themselves for a plate of rice and beans.
Furthermore, you and your kind RAN from the island, abandoning it for greener
pastures to a gov't. that embraced with open arms the mutlitude of gangsters and
political hacks that made up a large portion of that first wave. While that
first wave fed off generous gov't. policies (which remembled socialism) they
prospered and immediately were enlisted in a a war against their own country.
Now, these very same people and their children sit back and with criticize their
country. Having contributed nothing you sit back and criticize(and please don't
me the crap about how much money Cuban americans send back to Cuba because it
pales from what the embargo takes away).
Gusano is apt description for people like this.
In any case, I have no further use for you and the rest of the come mierdas like
you. From now on, I'll just ignore mental midgets such as yourself. You don't me
me to risdicule you: you do a good job of that yourself.
Take from you your arrogance, ignorance, and self importance and all you have
left is that foggy mind.
Adios Pinky Pendencio!
You hold up Panama and yes, it ALMOST mathces Cuba. But when you're talking
about millions, several percentage points is a lot more than you would make it
out to seem.
But you claim to be a capitalist, one that claims that rates have nothing to do
with the market. What a sorry stupid fuck you are.
Always,
pablo
no...@wcl.on.ca wrote:
> ..
> Hmmm... that's not what friends of my parents in Cuba say .. (men and
> women in their 60's ...)
> Nor their kids ..
You have plenty of Spanish folks that weep after Franco's regime.
Chilenos that think Pinochet was great. Argentinos that still salute the
accomplishments of their military regime. And no doubt Nicos that miss
Somoza.
Don't mean they're right.
The cruetly and human rights record of Batista's last stay in power is
well known. It is an indusputable fact for anyone that has an ounce of
respect for facts. It is incredibly ignorant to claim people were happy
then. They wouldn't have Castro's guerrilla in hordes then, would they?
You can criticize Castro's regime all you want, there is plenty to
criticize. But to do so by glorifying what was there before is
reactionary, wrong and stomach-turning.
...pablo
pjdiaz
>
> Paul, I took my cue from Voltaire and my only prayer has been that the
Lord make
> my enemies ridiculous. Apparrently God has granted it.
>
Say, Paul, wasn't it that other reactionary, Nixon, that also had/kept an
enemies list (although, in all fairness to Dick (or is it the other Dick?),
he being a rightist reactionary and hence being less prone to wishful
fantasy, never prayed to the Lord, instead he turned earthly agents loose on
them)?
pjdiaz
> One last shot, you ignorant inbred cur. Not too long ago, you mentioned
that the
> 20 PERCENTAGE POINTS (some capitalist wannabe you turned out to be) in ed
gains
> by cuba wasn't all that hot becuase Cuba already started out with a 70%
literacy
> rate.
Tell you what, Eddie...
If you find where I said this, I'll concede.
If you don't, well continue to laugh.
Okay.
Asshole: you, in your infinite wisdom failed to mention that literacy
> rates were extremely unevenly distributed. What were the literacy rates
when
> your father wasa fucking his mother's chickens out in the campos, bruto?
Actually, it was never brought up by anyone, including yourself, until, of
course, you found that, well, other countries have accomplished that same
overall 20% increase in literacy, all measured in the same fashion, all
including the "campo", the city, etc. etc. in their measurement.
But... if you want to belabor the point... you might want to check out the
improvements made in those other countries that you, apparently since you
don't want to look more ridiculous or, well, lacking the knowledge this kind
of thing apparently not being your forte, haven't yet told us whether they
had that TREMENDOUS increase.
> How
> many of your barefooted anscestors were attendding schools out there in
the
> hills, genius?
Actually, Eddie, my ancestors in the hills always managed to have a pair of
shoes. At least until they were rationed, in 1965.
> You don't mention those rates because like the rest of you neocons, you're
an
> inbred liar.
I dunno, Eddie. So far, you haven't managed to show where I've lied about
anything. But, well, like I said, do so, and I'll concede AND stop laughing.
>You don't want discussion, you want to further a political agenda
> that has cost YOUR OWN countrymen.
All this because, well, I happen to have some data, from the WHO and the UN,
which indicate that other countries have managed to increase their literacy
rate by 20%, something which you choose to believe is TREMENDOUS?
I gotta wonder, Eddie, why don't you get specific, and simply go down the
list of those countries I presented and, well, tell us that they aren't
TREMENDOUS?
That's all you need to do, you know... you'll crush my "political agenda",
if you do, you know.
Go for it, "pendejo".
{rest of unoriginal diatribe deleted, cuz, well, all us folks with that
apparently unrefutable "political agenda" that seems to bother Eddie so much
have seen it too many times to react (other than to chuckle at the
consistent unoriginality), usually from curiously, the same type of
progagandized beyond hope reactionary}
Cheers,
Pinky
pjdiaz
"pablo" <pa...@samerica.com> wrote in message
news:3859659A...@samerica.com...
>
> You can criticize Castro's regime all you want, there is plenty to
> criticize. But to do so by glorifying what was there before is
> reactionary, wrong and stomach-turning.
>
Yeah... so, listen up folks, don't even think of mentioning any past
statistics published by those reactionary, wrong, and stomach-turning
agencies like the WHO, the UN, UNESCO, or (gasp) the World Bank, and
comparing them to those of today published by by those reactionary, wrong,
and stomach-turning agencies like the WHO, the UN, UNESCO, or (gasp) the
World Bank, lest you be... let see... well... what I mean is... just accept
that, well, today is always better than yesterday, and remain in your homes,
do not rebel, do not protest, do not dream of what was (it leads to what
could be), mind your newspeak, listen to BB, and keep your ovens set to 451
degrees F. in case one of those books with data published by those
reactionary, wrong, and stomach-turning agencies like the WHO, the UN,
UNESCO, or (gasp) the World Bank shows up in your neighborhood.
Cutandpastedly yours,
A reader of published by those reactionary, wrong, and stomach-turning
agencies like the WHO, the UN, UNESCO, or (gasp) the World Bank, and (double
gasp) Arenas, Orwell, Cabrera Infante, Zoe Valdes, Benigno, Hugh Thomas,
Quirk, Suchlicki, Louis Alvarez, Castan~eda, Jorge Gonzales, Perez-Stable,
Jatar-Hausman, Irv Horowitz.........
pablo
no...@wcl.on.ca wrote:
>
> I wouldn't say glorifying .. they said their lives were better ..
> economically ...
> They said it, not me...
> I'm just a tourist, remember.
I wonder how the "younger ones" you talk about could possibly
realistically remember. Anyone that was working for a living under
Batista -unless they were working as 5 year old, which was not that
unusual- is at least well into their 40s these days.
I just must question the accuracy of your observation.
I have heard a lot of criticism in Cuba when it comes to Castro. Of
course, it figures. There is a lot to criticize. But I ain't never heard
anyone saying "we were better off before". Not once.
...pablo