International Motorcycle Show in Michigan
sleazy
of us are getting together for breakfast and then heading over to the
show to relieve the mid-winter stress. Packing both credit cards and
planning some serious powershopping for sport touring accessories on
the Daytona. Hopefully, they don't let me down and make me bring all
that cash home to be spent on the internet.
Pictures later today after the pub crawl following the show.
--
sleazy
2001 BMW R1150GS
1988 Honda XR600R
1996 Triumph Daytona 1200
Mark Olson
> It's nearly time to get outta here for the day's festivities. A bunch
> of us are getting together for breakfast and then heading over to the
> show to relieve the mid-winter stress. Packing both credit cards and
> planning some serious powershopping for sport touring accessories on the
> Daytona. Hopefully, they don't let me down and make me bring all that
> cash home to be spent on the internet.
>
> Pictures later today after the pub crawl following the show.
I keep wanting to ride my bike to the show but since it's in February and
I live 20+ miles from the Minneapolis Convention Center it hasn't yet worked
out. Maybe global warming will come through for me.
I rarely buy anything more substantial than a T-shirt at the show. I take
a lot of pictures and ogle the brolly girls at the Ducati stand. The last
couple of years one of them was a former high school classmate of my older
son. My wife knew her and stopped to chat. Which was nice.
sleazy
I left the Daytona in the garage on the offhand chance of a ride too.
Fail. The neighborhood roads are snow covered still, not to mention
the 18* temp and a 20 mile ride.
Mark Olson
> I left the Daytona in the garage on the offhand chance of a ride too.
> Fail. The neighborhood roads are snow covered still, not to mention the
> 18* temp and a 20 mile ride.
Is it that warm there? It's around -18F (-28C) here.
Many of our roads are covered with rock hard sheets of very slick ice.
Snowed like a bastard, a lot melted but there wasn't time for the
melt water to run off before it got cold again so the world's covered
in ice. And since it's below 0F now, the ice melting chemicals (OK,
salt) don't work and who knows when it's going to change.
The Older Gentleman
> I left the Daytona in the garage on the offhand chance of a ride too.
> Fail. The neighborhood roads are snow covered still, not to mention
> the 18* temp and a 20 mile ride.
Below freezing here, and patches of ice. Not as bad as chez you,
obviously. Just done 125 miles on the K and was parping myself most of
the way. Should have taken the car.
--
BMW K1100LT Ducati 750SS Honda CB400F Triumph Street Triple
Suzuki TS250ER GN250 Damn, back to six bikes!
Try Googling before asking a damn silly question.
chateau dot murray at idnet dot com
sleazy rider
> I rarely buy anything more substantial than a T-shirt at the show. I take
> a lot of pictures and ogle the brolly girls at the Ducati stand. The last
> couple of years one of them was a former high school classmate of my older
> son. My wife knew her and stopped to chat. Which was nice.
I got a t-shirt. :^| The brolly girls had, ummm, proportional
issues. The selection of gear and accessories was way down from years
previous. OTOH, breakfast with the crew was great. I probably will
pass next year and save the $50 spent for a road trip instead.
Mark Olson
> I got a t-shirt. :^| The brolly girls had, ummm, proportional
> issues. The selection of gear and accessories was way down from years
> previous. OTOH, breakfast with the crew was great. I probably will
> pass next year and save the $50 spent for a road trip instead.
Even when I am not in the market for a new bike I like to sit on a few
bikes, see the cutaway engine displays, and just soak up the bike-related
atmosphere. I guess it's a waste of money I could spend on bike trips
but there's a long empty stretch of winter between riding seasons and I
enjoy getting into a place that's all about bikes for a few hours. I
don't go every year, that's for sure.
don (Calgary)
Considering our long winters I look forward to the annual bike show.
If I keep my wallet in my pocket it is not expensive. $11 bucks for
the ticket and a similar amount for parking. More often than not I get
a free pass anyway.
I always find a few riding friends there and it is an opportunity to
catch up.
Besides I like looking at all that shiny new metal.
The Older Gentleman
They must be better shows than we get in Britain.
I've given up going to them. Nothing there that you can't see in your
local dealer, or that hasn't been unveiled elsewhere.
Continental shows, ah, that's different. Cologne is good, ditto Paris,
and Milan is amazing.
S'mee
Gentleman) wrote:
> Continental shows, ah, that's different. Cologne is good, ditto Paris,
> and Milan is amazing.
heh, what a dilllema Cologne or Milan. Cologne has the GOOD beir but
Milan has the better food...paris ain't even in the running for either
imho and to judge by what travelers I've known opinioned. ;^) I
certainly found the lunch I had in paris to be crap at best and likely
that'd be an insult to crap.
sleazy
I was wrong on the temp, guessing at it by the forecast. We never got
above 9* today by the actual thermometer. Wind chills well below zero
too. Our streets did the same as yours, but we had one day of sun that
evaporated a bunch of the water on the main drags. The secondaries are
still icy and snow covered. The dirt road leading out of our area is
heavily pocked with holes and slick to boot.
sleazy
> On Sat, 2 Jan 2010 11:25:05 -0800 (PST), sleazy rider
> <sleazyr...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On Jan 2, 8:28�am, Mark Olson <ols...@tiny.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>> I rarely buy anything more substantial than a T-shirt at the show. �I take
>>> a lot of pictures and ogle the brolly girls at the Ducati stand. �The last
>>> couple of years one of them was a former high school classmate of my older
>>> son. �My wife knew her and stopped to chat. �Which was nice.
>>
>> I got a t-shirt. :^| The brolly girls had, ummm, proportional
>> issues. The selection of gear and accessories was way down from years
>> previous. OTOH, breakfast with the crew was great. I probably will
>> pass next year and save the $50 spent for a road trip instead.
>
> Considering our long winters I look forward to the annual bike show.
> If I keep my wallet in my pocket it is not expensive. $11 bucks for
> the ticket and a similar amount for parking. More often than not I get
> a free pass anyway.
I broke down and dropped a twenty on a hilarious long sleeve tee.
Everything else spent was food, drink or admission charges and parking.
>
> I always find a few riding friends there and it is an opportunity to
> catch up.
We had roughly 20 folks show for breakfast from the sport-touring.net
Region 4 group. Most of us are regulars at the called gatherings.
>
> Besides I like looking at all that shiny new metal.
Shiny metal is nice, but the stuff they're passing as new, ain't. The
Honda DN-01 makes me miss the Rune. <g> BMW, Triumph, KTM and a few
others were not in attendance either. Ducati was the only Euro brand
there. This was the smallest show in recent memory and the crowds were
much smaller. A friend was working the Pediatric Brain Tumor
Foundation booth and commented on it. He said Friday night was a bust
and this Saturday was too. Then again, we're really hurting
financially in this area due to the auto industry and housing market
collapsing around us. There were a couple booths of nice used bikes
with pricing that tempted me to add another to the fleet.
Mark Olson
> They must be better shows than we get in Britain.
>
> I've given up going to them. Nothing there that you can't see in your
> local dealer, or that hasn't been unveiled elsewhere.
>
> Continental shows, ah, that's different. Cologne is good, ditto Paris,
> and Milan is amazing.
I suspect our shows are not even up to the British standard, but hey,
it's what we get. There isn't much you can't see at a local dealer,
but there's an occasional concept bike, that sort of thing. And of
course you can see lots of different brands in one place which you
can't do without going to multiple dealers. And even given all that,
they're not as big as they used to be, some of the makes don't even
have manufacturer support, e.g., I think Triumph and Aprilia have
bottled out, and even the Big Four have scaled back their displays.
don (Calgary)
>On 2010-01-02 15:10:07 -0500, "don (Calgary)" <hd....@telus.net> said:
>
>> On Sat, 2 Jan 2010 11:25:05 -0800 (PST), sleazy rider
>> <sleazyr...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On Jan 2, 8:28�am, Mark Olson <ols...@tiny.invalid> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I rarely buy anything more substantial than a T-shirt at the show. �I take
>>>> a lot of pictures and ogle the brolly girls at the Ducati stand. �The last
>>>> couple of years one of them was a former high school classmate of my older
>>>> son. �My wife knew her and stopped to chat. �Which was nice.
>>>
>>> I got a t-shirt. :^| The brolly girls had, ummm, proportional
>>> issues. The selection of gear and accessories was way down from years
>>> previous. OTOH, breakfast with the crew was great. I probably will
>>> pass next year and save the $50 spent for a road trip instead.
>>
>> Considering our long winters I look forward to the annual bike show.
>> If I keep my wallet in my pocket it is not expensive. $11 bucks for
>> the ticket and a similar amount for parking. More often than not I get
>> a free pass anyway.
>
>I broke down and dropped a twenty on a hilarious long sleeve tee.
>Everything else spent was food, drink or admission charges and parking.
Like you I always find something to spend money on. A t-shirt is as
good as any.
>
>>
>> I always find a few riding friends there and it is an opportunity to
>> catch up.
>
>We had roughly 20 folks show for breakfast from the sport-touring.net
>Region 4 group. Most of us are regulars at the called gatherings.
>
>>
>> Besides I like looking at all that shiny new metal.
>
>Shiny metal is nice, but the stuff they're passing as new, ain't. The
>Honda DN-01 makes me miss the Rune. <g> BMW, Triumph, KTM and a few
>others were not in attendance either. Ducati was the only Euro brand
>there. This was the smallest show in recent memory and the crowds were
>much smaller. A friend was working the Pediatric Brain Tumor
>Foundation booth and commented on it. He said Friday night was a bust
>and this Saturday was too. Then again, we're really hurting
>financially in this area due to the auto industry and housing market
>collapsing around us. There were a couple booths of nice used bikes
>with pricing that tempted me to add another to the fleet.
I am not sure I will ever miss the Rune. Since Honda discontinued the
Valk, Nighthawk and Magna I haven't seen much in their line that
appealed to me.
At last year's Calgary bike show, all Honda had in their very large
area was a Honda pick up truck. The weather here was very bad and many
of the highways were closed. I suspect the Honda trailer got held up
somewhere en route to Cowtown.
Attendance has been strong at our show. Typically all of the major and
minor brands are represented. Over half of the floor is occupied by
after market suppliers, leather goods, novelties, displays, etc. By
the time I catch up with friends, check out the booths and have a cup
of coffee three hours or so pass by.
There is an outside possibility this could be a new bike year for me
so you never know what might catch my eye.
Speaking of the Calgary show, it is next weekend. Something bike
related to look forward too.
Mark Olson
> I am not sure I will ever miss the Rune. Since Honda discontinued the
> Valk, Nighthawk and Magna I haven't seen much in their line that
> appealed to me.
The Valk was a unique bike in the power cruiser genre with a devoted
following. I really cannot fathom how Honda's reasoning went, getting
rid of it and introducing the Rune as a putative replacement. The
Rune wasn't even in the same category as the Valkyrie. A new Valk
based on the GL1800 wouldn't have taken many sales away from GL1800
buyers, but if it did they still would have been buying a Honda.
> There is an outside possibility this could be a new bike year for me
> so you never know what might catch my eye.
Any hints? Sticking with a tourer would be a safe guess, I suppose.
sleazy
> Speaking of the Calgary show, it is next weekend. Something bike
> related to look forward too.
Have fun! And what might you be looking to add to the garage?
don (Calgary)
wrote:
>don (Calgary) wrote:
>
>> I am not sure I will ever miss the Rune. Since Honda discontinued the
>> Valk, Nighthawk and Magna I haven't seen much in their line that
>> appealed to me.
>
>The Valk was a unique bike in the power cruiser genre with a devoted
>following. I really cannot fathom how Honda's reasoning went, getting
>rid of it and introducing the Rune as a putative replacement. The
>Rune wasn't even in the same category as the Valkyrie. A new Valk
>based on the GL1800 wouldn't have taken many sales away from GL1800
>buyers, but if it did they still would have been buying a Honda.
Where I do not see myself buying a Wing, at least any of the newer
Wings [1], I could see me riding a Valk. In fact when I bought the
Venture I was also looking at a Valk. The touring model. The dealer
wouldn't budge a nickel on the price though. Had he thrown a Loonie on
the table I would be riding it today.
>
>> There is an outside possibility this could be a new bike year for me
>> so you never know what might catch my eye.
>
>Any hints? Sticking with a tourer would be a safe guess, I suppose.
Buying something new is an outside shot right now, but once I start
thinking about something like this, more often than not, it is only a
matter of time before I pull the trigger. Our dollar is strong right
now and I think it will be a buyers market this spring.
I would keep one of my bikes. Both serve the touring purpose very
well, but they serve the same purpose. On one hand I might look for
something quicker and a little more agile, yet still capable of
touring.
That doesn't narrow it down much but the FJR, or a V-Strom would be a
decent fit. I like the FJR and it would still allow me to keep my
Officer status in our Yamaha association, if it is the Venture I sell.
An older collectable bike is also something I have been thinking
about. The only Brit bike I have owned was an AJS, not that I would
want that bike back, but a classic Norton or a Triumph wouldn't be
bad. The Jaguar has helped dispell my fear of The Prince of Darkness.
Boy writing that will probably be the kiss of death when I take the XJ
out of storage in the spring. <g>
Lucas aside I am a bit of a better mechanic today than I was when I
had the AJS and might be able to do the tinkering on a Bonnie or a
Commando without losing my patience.
Of course if there are no buyers for one of my bikes I won't be adding
anything to the fleet. There is no way I can afford three bikes. I
wouldn't even have the time to maintain three bikes.
So right now it is all just a concept. Time will tell if anything
comes of it.
[1] I wouldn't mind finding one of the early naked Wings, if I could
find one in good shape.
don (Calgary)
>On 2010-01-02 17:15:55 -0500, "don (Calgary)" <hd....@telus.net> said:
>
>> Speaking of the Calgary show, it is next weekend. Something bike
>> related to look forward too.
>
>Have fun! And what might you be looking to add to the garage?
I always enjoy the show. Thanks.
As for what may be added to the garage check out my reply to Mark. I
am not sure I could type all that again. <g>
Mark Olson
> I would keep one of my bikes. Both serve the touring purpose very
> well, but they serve the same purpose. On one hand I might look for
> something quicker and a little more agile, yet still capable of
> touring.
>
> That doesn't narrow it down much but the FJR, or a V-Strom would be a
> decent fit. I like the FJR and it would still allow me to keep my
> Officer status in our Yamaha association, if it is the Venture I sell.
>
> An older collectable bike is also something I have been thinking
> about. The only Brit bike I have owned was an AJS, not that I would
> want that bike back, but a classic Norton or a Triumph wouldn't be
> bad. The Jaguar has helped dispell my fear of The Prince of Darkness.
> Boy writing that will probably be the kiss of death when I take the XJ
> out of storage in the spring. <g>
> [1] I wouldn't mind finding one of the early naked Wings, if I could
> find one in good shape.
You're casting a pretty wide net, type-wise, not that it's a bad thing.
Variety is the spice of life when it comes to bikes, I say. I like the
contrast between riding the FJR and the 250, 400 and 500cc bikes that
are its stablemates. More than four bikes isn't sustainable for me in
the long term, just too much maintenance and not enough opportunities
to properly ride them all.
The FJR is a great bike, and from my past SV ownership and short rides
on a DL650 and DL1000, I'm sure you can't go wrong with a V-Strom. The
FJR is basically a touring bike, albeit one that can be thrashed through
corners a bit quicker than a full dress floorboard-style tourer. But the
extra ponies are addictive.
There are a few gems in the GL1000 universe but probably most of them
are now "diamonds in the rough" given the quality of care that most
bikes get. I've bought enough used bikes to realize that most people's
idea of proper maintenance is so far off the mark that they'd be better
off doing nothing in many cases. I have a hankering to own an *old*
bike such as an Indian Scout. Realistically I can't own one at a
reasonable price, so maybe I'd settle for an old Sporty.
I think the obvious choice that you haven't mentioned is a dual-sport.
Problem for me is, if I buy one I have to buy two, if you see what I
mean.
Robert Bolton
Older Gentleman) wrote:
>Mark Olson <ols...@tiny.invalid> wrote:
>
>> sleazy rider wrote:
>>
>> > I got a t-shirt. :^| The brolly girls had, ummm, proportional
>> > issues. The selection of gear and accessories was way down from years
>> > previous. OTOH, breakfast with the crew was great. I probably will
>> > pass next year and save the $50 spent for a road trip instead.
>>
>> Even when I am not in the market for a new bike I like to sit on a few
>> bikes, see the cutaway engine displays, and just soak up the bike-related
>> atmosphere. I guess it's a waste of money I could spend on bike trips
>> but there's a long empty stretch of winter between riding seasons and I
>> enjoy getting into a place that's all about bikes for a few hours. I
>> don't go every year, that's for sure.
>
>They must be better shows than we get in Britain.
>
>I've given up going to them. Nothing there that you can't see in your
>local dealer, or that hasn't been unveiled elsewhere.
>
That our annual show is like that. The dealers bring some of their
bikes, Alaska Leather brings some clothing and bags, food and drink is
for sale, a band plays a little music, there are a few girls for old
farts to drool at, and a few raffles. No cutaway engine displays as I
recall. I go annually, in part to support the people who go to the
trouble of putting on the show. End of March here. I nearly forgot
the bike contest. Bike owners display their rides, with attendees
voting for their favorite bike.
Robert
The Older Gentleman
> No cutaway engine displays as I
> recall.
That reminds me. I once did some research on how they make those things,
especially the ones that 'run'. There's a company in the UK that
specialises in them, and the work is extraordinary.
The engines are (obviously) stripped and the key components have the
cutaways fashioned. The main bearings and big end bearings are replaced
with shells made of PTFE for ultra-low friction.
As much weight is removed as possible from reciprocating and rotating
components: holes are drilled in all sort of places where it doesn't
show. The idea is to make the whole drive train as light as possible,
because (generally, but not always), the starter motor is converted to
turn the whole engine over. Lights are added.
How long the engines 'last' for varies, but for exhibition engines the
brief is that it must be able to run continuously for the longest show
it's likely to be used at, which can mean anything up to three weeks,
though obviously most are much shorter than that.
The company I mentioned above had converted anything from small
motorcycle engines right up to (wait for it) a marine diesel engine from
an ocean-going trawler. Amazing stuff.
The Older Gentleman
> More than four bikes isn't sustainable for me in
> the long term,
<Considers sig>
You may have a point.
Mark Olson
> Robert Bolton <robertbo...@gci.net> wrote:
>
>> No cutaway engine displays as I
>> recall.
>
> That reminds me. I once did some research on how they make those things,
> especially the ones that 'run'. There's a company in the UK that
> specialises in them, and the work is extraordinary.
>
> The engines are (obviously) stripped and the key components have the
> cutaways fashioned. The main bearings and big end bearings are replaced
> with shells made of PTFE for ultra-low friction.
>
> As much weight is removed as possible from reciprocating and rotating
> components: holes are drilled in all sort of places where it doesn't
> show. The idea is to make the whole drive train as light as possible,
> because (generally, but not always), the starter motor is converted to
> turn the whole engine over. Lights are added.
>
> How long the engines 'last' for varies, but for exhibition engines the
> brief is that it must be able to run continuously for the longest show
> it's likely to be used at, which can mean anything up to three weeks,
> though obviously most are much shorter than that.
>
> The company I mentioned above had converted anything from small
> motorcycle engines right up to (wait for it) a marine diesel engine from
> an ocean-going trawler. Amazing stuff.
I can't remember when I've last seen anything other than a static
display of an engine cutaway. Obviously the ones that spin are at
least an order of magnitude more sophisticated than the stationary
units, although those are still impressive to me for how artfully
they are set up. I wouldn't have thought they would bother to do
the weight reduction bit, most of the power consumed by spinning an
engine is friction which is unaffected by mass, and pumping loss,
which should be reduced considerably in a cutaway... Reducing the
strength of the valve springs would be an obvious place to start.
The Older Gentleman
> Reducing the
> strength of the valve springs would be an obvious place to start.
Yes, you've reminded me. They replace them with very weak springs.
BrianNZ
> Robert Bolton <robertbo...@gci.net> wrote:
>
>> No cutaway engine displays as I
>> recall.
>
> That reminds me. I once did some research on how they make those things,
> especially the ones that 'run'. There's a company in the UK that
> specialises in them, and the work is extraordinary.
>
> The engines are (obviously) stripped and the key components have the
> cutaways fashioned. The main bearings and big end bearings are replaced
> with shells made of PTFE for ultra-low friction.
>
> As much weight is removed as possible from reciprocating and rotating
> components: holes are drilled in all sort of places where it doesn't
> show. The idea is to make the whole drive train as light as possible,
> because (generally, but not always), the starter motor is converted to
> turn the whole engine over. Lights are added.
>
> How long the engines 'last' for varies, but for exhibition engines the
> brief is that it must be able to run continuously for the longest show
> it's likely to be used at, which can mean anything up to three weeks,
> though obviously most are much shorter than that.
>
> The company I mentioned above had converted anything from small
> motorcycle engines right up to (wait for it) a marine diesel engine from
> an ocean-going trawler. Amazing stuff.
>
>
The Auckland museum has a cutaway Spitfire engine that can be turned
over by hand. very impressive!
The Older Gentleman
> The Auckland museum has a cutaway Spitfire engine that can be turned
> over by hand. very impressive!
Id almost make the journey just to do that one thing.
In the Imperial War Museum in London, there are DB601 and Merlin engines
on display (note for the non-aircraftisti: powerplants of the
Messerschmidt Bf109 and the Spitfire, respectively) and a few years ago
I must have spent half an hour just examining them both, especially the
Merlin.
Both were fabulous engines, but the Merlin pips the Daimler-Benz 601,
for me, simply because it powered so many fantasic aircraft. Spitfire,
Hurricane, Lancaster, Mosquito, Mustang, even a few Halifaxes, Hornet,
probably a few others I've forgotten.
<thinks>
Avro Tudor - though that was a disastrous aircraft. Avro York (freighter
fuselage with Lancaster wings and tail bolted on). Defiant (not too
successful).
BrianNZ
> BrianNZ <br...@itnz.co.nz> wrote:
>
>> The Auckland museum has a cutaway Spitfire engine that can be turned
>> over by hand. very impressive!
>
> Id almost make the journey just to do that one thing.
>
> In the Imperial War Museum in London, there are DB601 and Merlin engines
> on display (note for the non-aircraftisti: powerplants of the
> Messerschmidt Bf109 and the Spitfire, respectively) and a few years ago
> I must have spent half an hour just examining them both, especially the
> Merlin.
>
> Both were fabulous engines, but the Merlin pips the Daimler-Benz 601,
> for me, simply because it powered so many fantasic aircraft. Spitfire,
> Hurricane, Lancaster, Mosquito, Mustang, even a few Halifaxes, Hornet,
> probably a few others I've forgotten.
>
> <thinks>
>
> Avro Tudor - though that was a disastrous aircraft. Avro York (freighter
> fuselage with Lancaster wings and tail bolted on). Defiant (not too
> successful).
>
Next time I'm up there I'll get some pics. They have a 'Spitfire' room
with an elevated walkway around the walls so you can see the Spitfire
from all angles. The engine is in one corner. Auckland also has MOTAT
(Museum of Trasnport and Technology) which has an 'aviation'
section......check out the list of planes on the link....'Explore
MOTAT'...'aviation'.
http://www.motat.org.nz/entrycosts.htm
There is also he annual 'Warbirds over Wanaka' air show.....
http://www.uniquelynz.com/nzwarbirds08.htm
A few weeks back I went to Hamilton for a tank day. APC's, a Centurian,
German and American half tracks from WW2, ferret scout car, landies and
Jeeps, Russian tanks etc. an amazing array of privately owed armour. The
Military re-enactment guys all dressed up in WW2 uniforms.....of course
the German dugout with MG42,panzerfaust and grenades with the uniforms
being mainly cammo paratrooper with MP40's....very stylie. :)
Anyway, at lunchtime they had the flyover with a Russian Yak (Like a
harvard trainer?), an Me109 replica and a 'microlight' Foke Wulf (sp?)
which due to it's size just looked 'further away' (father Ted explaining
the 'small' cows to Dougal?). The planes were fitted with bright lights
in the wings that flashed as mock machine guns and speakers that were
loud enough to here the rat.tat.tat.tat. machine gun soundtrack. They
came in nice and low so the re-enactment chappies on the ground got to
shoot blanks at them.....from the 'German' troops with their MP40's
through to the 'Yanks' with .50 & .30 cals mounted on the Jeeps. great
entertainment!
Stephen Cowell
"BrianNZ" <br...@itnz.co.nz> wrote
> The Older Gentleman wrote:
...
>> The company I mentioned above had converted anything from small
>> motorcycle engines right up to (wait for it) a marine diesel engine from
>> an ocean-going trawler. Amazing stuff.
I'd have busted a love-nut on that!
> The Auckland museum has a cutaway Spitfire engine that can be turned over
> by hand. very impressive!
Best one I've seen in person... at the old Spruce Goose/QM
park at Long Beach they had a cutaway slo-mo Wasp... something
else! What, 27 cylinders? I watched it for at least 15min.
Hopefully it followed the Goose up nawth.
__
Steve
.
The Older Gentleman
> http://www.uniquelynz.com/nzwarbirds08.htm
Oh, yes, I enjoyed that. No idea there were so many classic aircraft
down under.
don (Calgary)
Older Gentleman) wrote:
>Both were fabulous engines, but the Merlin pips the Daimler-Benz 601,
>for me, simply because it powered so many fantasic aircraft. Spitfire,
>Hurricane, Lancaster, Mosquito, Mustang, even a few Halifaxes, Hornet,
>probably a few others I've forgotten.
Add to the list:
Slo-mo-shun V (from 1954 on, 1954 Gold Cup winner, first for Merlin
power)
Miss Thriftway (converted in 1957, 1957 Gold Cup winner)
Hawaii Kai III (1958 Gold Cup and National Champion, first Merlin
powered National Championship)
Miss Thriftway/Miss Century 21 (Gold Cup 1961-1962, National Champion
1960-1962)
Miss Bardahl (Gold Cup and National Champion 1963-1965, 1967-1968)
Miss Budweiser (Gold Cup 1969-1970 and 1973, National Champion
1969-1972, 1977)
Atlas Van Lines (Gold Cup 1972, 1977-1979, 1982-1984, National
Champion 1972, 1976, 1978- 1979, 1982-1983
Pay 'n Pak (Gold Cup 1974-1975, National Champion 1973-1975).
The Older Gentleman
don (Calgary)
Older Gentleman) wrote:
>don (Calgary) <hd....@telus.net> wrote:
>
>> On Sun, 3 Jan 2010 17:35:21 +0000, totallyde...@yahoo.co.uk (The
>> Older Gentleman) wrote:
>>
>> >Both were fabulous engines, but the Merlin pips the Daimler-Benz 601,
>> >for me, simply because it powered so many fantasic aircraft. Spitfire,
>> >Hurricane, Lancaster, Mosquito, Mustang, even a few Halifaxes, Hornet,
>> >probably a few others I've forgotten.
>>
>> Add to the list:
>> Slo-mo-shun V (from 1954 on, 1954 Gold Cup winner, first for Merlin
>> power)
>>
>> Miss Thriftway (converted in 1957, 1957 Gold Cup winner)
>>
>> Hawaii Kai III (1958 Gold Cup and National Champion, first Merlin
>> powered National Championship)
>>
>> Miss Thriftway/Miss Century 21 (Gold Cup 1961-1962, National Champion
>> 1960-1962)
>>
>> Miss Bardahl (Gold Cup and National Champion 1963-1965, 1967-1968)
>>
>> Miss Budweiser (Gold Cup 1969-1970 and 1973, National Champion
>> 1969-1972, 1977)
>>
>> Atlas Van Lines (Gold Cup 1972, 1977-1979, 1982-1984, National
>> Champion 1972, 1976, 1978- 1979, 1982-1983
>>
>> Pay 'n Pak (Gold Cup 1974-1975, National Champion 1973-1975).
>
>Never heard of any of 'em. Racing planes, I assume?
Thunder Boats. Unlimited Hydroplanes that skimmed just above the water
and sometimes several meters above the water, if you did it wrong.
During the 50's and 60's the unlimited boats used old WWII airplane
engines such as the RR Merlin and the V12 Allison. Back then there was
a tremendous surplus of these engines and it wasn't unusual for one of
the top boats to detonate one or two of the beasts every race.
When I was a child my uncle owned an apple orchard on Lake Chelan.
Every summer we would travel there to watch the big boats race. You
could hear the thunderous roar of these old engines for miles around.
The sound, the speed and the rooster tails made for an incredible
bombardment of the senses.
When the available supply of the Allison and Merlin engines began to
dry up the Thunder Boats switched to turbine engines and in my opinion
the races have not been the same since. Whisper quiet those things
are, well at least in comparison to what preceeded them.
BrianNZ
You got me there!! I assumed they were racing planes as well. Good to
see those spare engines didn't go to waste.
J. Clarke
> don (Calgary) <hd....@telus.net> wrote:
>
>> On Sun, 3 Jan 2010 17:35:21 +0000, totallyde...@yahoo.co.uk
>> (The Older Gentleman) wrote:
>>
>>> Both were fabulous engines, but the Merlin pips the Daimler-Benz
>>> 601, for me, simply because it powered so many fantasic aircraft.
>>> Spitfire, Hurricane, Lancaster, Mosquito, Mustang, even a few
>>> Halifaxes, Hornet, probably a few others I've forgotten.
>>
>> Add to the list:
>> Slo-mo-shun V (from 1954 on, 1954 Gold Cup winner, first for Merlin
>> power)
>>
>> Miss Thriftway (converted in 1957, 1957 Gold Cup winner)
>>
>> Hawaii Kai III (1958 Gold Cup and National Champion, first Merlin
>> powered National Championship)
>>
>> Miss Thriftway/Miss Century 21 (Gold Cup 1961-1962, National Champion
>> 1960-1962)
>>
>> Miss Bardahl (Gold Cup and National Champion 1963-1965, 1967-1968)
>>
>> Miss Budweiser (Gold Cup 1969-1970 and 1973, National Champion
>> 1969-1972, 1977)
>>
>> Atlas Van Lines (Gold Cup 1972, 1977-1979, 1982-1984, National
>> Champion 1972, 1976, 1978- 1979, 1982-1983
>>
>> Pay 'n Pak (Gold Cup 1974-1975, National Champion 1973-1975).
>
> Never heard of any of 'em. Racing planes, I assume?
Boats. Three point hydroplanes most of 'em.
Bill Shatzer
> In the Imperial War Museum in London, there are DB601 and Merlin engines
> on display (note for the non-aircraftisti: powerplants of the
> Messerschmidt Bf109 and the Spitfire, respectively) and a few years ago
> I must have spent half an hour just examining them both, especially the
> Merlin.
> Both were fabulous engines, but the Merlin pips the Daimler-Benz 601,
> for me, simply because it powered so many fantasic aircraft. Spitfire,
> Hurricane, Lancaster, Mosquito, Mustang, even a few Halifaxes, Hornet,
> probably a few others I've forgotten.
> <thinks>
> Avro Tudor - though that was a disastrous aircraft. Avro York (freighter
> fuselage with Lancaster wings and tail bolted on). Defiant (not too
> successful).
And...
Bristol Beaufighter II,
Boultan Paul Balliol,
Fairey Fulmar, Barracuda, and Battle - the latter being quite as
unsuccessful as the Defiant.
And the 2,000 or so Merlin Packard-engined P-40F and P-40L Warhawks
Jeff
The Ontario Science Museum in Toronto has static cutaways of whole
vehicles. I recall there was a motorcycle, airplane and small steam
locomotive. They are "normal" on one side and exposed on the other.
Chuck Rhode
> When I was a child my uncle owned an apple orchard on Lake Chelan.
Why that's in the United States. In third grade, I had a pen pal
named Parsley from Chelan, WA.
--
.. Be Seeing You,
.. Chuck Rhode, Sheboygan, WI, USA
.. Weather: http://LacusVeris.com/WX
.. 12° — Wind NNW 13 mph
don (Calgary)
<CRh...@LacusVeris.com> wrote:
>On Sun, 03 Jan 2010 18:58:50 +0000, don (Calgary) wrote:
>
>> When I was a child my uncle owned an apple orchard on Lake Chelan.
>
>Why that's in the United States. In third grade, I had a pen pal
>named Parsley from Chelan, WA.
That's the place, but I don't know Parsley.
The Chelan, Wenatchee area is kind of an extension of the Okanogan
Valley. Beautiful country. We used to take Stevens Pass through the
mountains to get there. Of course we lived in Vancouver at the time.
I haven't been to the area in 45 years.
Hmmmm, I feel a little route planning coming on.
S'mee
Gentleman) wrote:
> Both were fabulous engines, but the Merlin pips the Daimler-Benz 601,
> for me, simply because it powered so many fantasic aircraft. Spitfire,
> Hurricane, Lancaster, Mosquito, Mustang, even a few Halifaxes, Hornet,
> probably a few others I've forgotten.
yebbut the Daimler was aruably the better motor for many reasons not
the least of which was fuel injection, whilst the merlin was
carburatted iirc and VERY prone to fuel starvation in neg g situations
and signifigant handicap. 8^) It was also in the HE100D1 which in
combat trim was faster than the Me109 until messerschmidt was allowed
to put a DB601R in a purose built ME109 (no armour, no guns and
stripped to the bones) did the 109 exceed the HE100D1. Not that I've
researched the subject.
8^) I do love the mosquito OVER the spitfire.
The Older Gentleman
> whilst the merlin was
> carburatted iirc and VERY prone to fuel starvation in neg g situations
> and signifigant handicap.
Only very early versions. Google for Mrs Shilling's Orifice.
And later ones were FI anyway.
The Older Gentleman
> The Ontario Science Museum in Toronto has static cutaways of whole
> vehicles. I recall there was a motorcycle, airplane and small steam
> locomotive. They are "normal" on one side and exposed on the other.
I'd love to see the hacksaw.....
The Older Gentleman
> Bristol Beaufighter II,
That one I didn't know. Thought they were all radial-engined.
J. Clarke
> S'mee <steven...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>> whilst the merlin was
>> carburatted iirc and VERY prone to fuel starvation in neg g
>> situations and signifigant handicap.
>
> Only very early versions. Google for Mrs Shilling's Orifice.
>
> And later ones were FI anyway.
"Miss Shillings Orifice" gets more useful hits. But the first one on "Mrs.
Shilling's Orifice" is a real heartbreaker.
J. Clarke
> S'mee <steven...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>> whilst the merlin was
>> carburatted iirc and VERY prone to fuel starvation in neg g
>> situations and signifigant handicap.
>
> Only very early versions. Google for Mrs Shilling's Orifice.
>
> And later ones were FI anyway.
Incidentally there's a nice photo of Miss Shilling at
http://southsiders-mc.blogspot.com/2009/04/beatrice-tilly-shilling.html.
S'mee
She must have been a hell of a cook or liked his cooking...
TOG@Toil
>
> Incidentally there's a nice photo of Miss Shilling athttp://southsiders-mc.blogspot.com/2009/04/beatrice-tilly-shilling.html.
Well, I'm damned. She rode bikes, too. Attagirl.
Bill Shatzer
> S'mee <steven...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>>whilst the merlin was
>>carburatted iirc and VERY prone to fuel starvation in neg g situations
>>and signifigant handicap.
>
>
> Only very early versions. Google for Mrs Shilling's Orifice.
>
> And later ones were FI anyway.
The Merlins used carbs right up 'til the end.
Fuel injection wasn't introduced until the Griffons and that was mid-way
through the Griffon series - the Griffon 72 IIRC.
The Older Gentleman
> The Older Gentleman wrote:
>
> > S'mee <steven...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> >>whilst the merlin was
> >>carburatted iirc and VERY prone to fuel starvation in neg g situations
> >>and signifigant handicap.
> >
> >
> > Only very early versions. Google for Mrs Shilling's Orifice.
> >
> > And later ones were FI anyway.
>
> The Merlins used carbs right up 'til the end.
Yes, my bad.
>
> Fuel injection wasn't introduced until the Griffons and that was mid-way
> through the Griffon series - the Griffon 72 IIRC.
Yes, again.