Kick starting shovels
Spence
>Me and two other shovel riders would appreciate hearing some good
>ideas on why our shovels are hard to kick start.
When I kick started my 1978XLCH it would start on the first or second kick
using to following technique
1. Kill switch on.
2. Fuel on.
3. Key on.
4a. Cold opened the enrichener then gave it 5 twists of the throttle just
leaving it cracked on the last one.
4b. Hot don't touch the throttle at all.
If I screwed up and left the key or the kill switch off or didn't use the
throttle as indicated for even 1 kick the bike would take a dozen kicks to
start. One time my foot slipped and my foot hit the pavement full force
with my ankle twisted. For a minute I thought I would either cry or puke,
but that wouldn't be cool would it.
Spence
David A, Girod
when you push the button on the electric starter, but they are
a real bitch to kick start, hot or cold. Mine is a 78 fxe, 74ci,
flowed heads, s&s super b carb, andrews A grind cam, stock compression
ratio. It is in a good state of tune with fresh plugs, points,
condenser, good coil and wires. It runs fine with no flat spots
anywhere while accelerating and gets 45 mpg out on the interstate.
Barkeep; a fresh round or two for serious contributers.
thanks in advance for ideas
b c n u
pro...@ix.netcom.com
John Corliss
shovel and I have the same problem starting the fucker. We both need S&S
"E" carbs.
John Corliss
Panhead
>
> Me and two other shovel riders would appreciate hearing some good
> ideas on why our shovels are hard to kick start. They start fine
> when you push the button on the electric starter, but they are
> a real bitch to kick start, hot or cold. Mine is a 78 fxe, 74ci,
> flowed heads, s&s super b carb, andrews A grind cam, stock compression
> ratio. It is in a good state of tune with fresh plugs, points,
> condenser, good coil and wires. It runs fine with no flat spots
> anywhere while accelerating and gets 45 mpg out on the interstate.
> Barkeep; a fresh round or two for serious contributers.
> thanks in advance for ideas
It shouldn't be that tough unless ya ain't been eating yer
spinach.
When mine's cold, its three or fours twisties of the
throttle,three kicks with everything off,(to get the juices
going) then , enrichener, ignition on.. one kick and...
(sometimes two) VarrrOOOOM! Then I repeat the last step a
little later after I remember to turn the gas petcock on.
(sigh)
Panhead AH™#49 HSB®1219 KoB/CoT®235# O•14--EKIII Paints with me--
--remove my brain to reply--
Bob Knazik
>
> Me and two other shovel riders would appreciate hearing some good
> ideas on why our shovels are hard to kick start. They start fine
> when you push the button on the electric starter, but they are
> a real bitch to kick start, hot or cold. Mine is a 78 fxe, 74ci,
> flowed heads, s&s super b carb, andrews A grind cam, stock compression
> ratio. It is in a good state of tune with fresh plugs, points,
> condenser, good coil and wires. It runs fine with no flat spots
> anywhere while accelerating and gets 45 mpg out on the interstate.
> Barkeep; a fresh round or two for serious contributers.
> thanks in advance for ideas
There is almost always a sequence of stuff to do, particular to a given
bike, to get it to start on the first or second kick. On my '80, which
was a stock 80" bike with stock ignition, drag pipes, S&S E carb, I had
to turn the gas on, twist the throttle three times to dump three shots
of fuel into the engine from the accelerator pump, kick the bike over
once with ignition off, then kick it with ignition on. This worked 90%
of the time, with the other 10% requiring a repeat of the sequence due
to cold weather.
I had a '79 sporty that required me to turn the gas on, then kick the
bike. It would start on the first or second kick everytime. It was
stock.
This procedure, with absolute certainty, will _not_ work for you. :-)
You have to find your own sequence.
The good news is almost all bikes have some sort of sequence, otherwise
they wouldn't run at all.
Bob K
no # or nothing
Duncan Findlater
>
> Me and two other shovel riders would appreciate hearing some good
> ideas on why our shovels are hard to kick start. They start fine
> when you push the button on the electric starter, but they are
> a real bitch to kick start, hot or cold. Mine is a 78 fxe, 74ci,
> flowed heads, s&s super b carb, andrews A grind cam, stock compression
> ratio. It is in a good state of tune with fresh plugs, points,
> condenser, good coil and wires. It runs fine with no flat spots
> anywhere while accelerating and gets 45 mpg out on the interstate.
> Barkeep; a fresh round or two for serious contributers.
> thanks in advance for ideas
> pro...@ix.netcom.com
You've had some good answers on this one from people who have
accelerator pumps on their Super B's. On my 1981 80" Shovel I have the
same carb with no accelerator pump, the following usually does the trick
for me:
1 Fuel on
2 Enrichner on
3 Kick through twice to prime the carb
4 Bring up to compression
5 Ignition on
6 Jump all over the kicker
I also have a thermal insulator between the carb and manifold to help
keep the carb cool for better hot starting (does move the air cleaner
out even more though).
At the end of the day each bike has it's own technique, my friend's
shovel with a similar setup starts best with a completly different
method.
Duncan Findlater
Thanks to Scott 'Genghis@ Wong of Iron Horse for this one - it does
work.
JJLOWRY
ideas on why our shovels are hard to kick start. They start fine
when you push the button on the electric starter, but they are
a real bitch to kick start, hot or cold. Mine is a 78 fxe, 74ci,
flowed heads, s&s super b carb, andrews A grind cam, stock compression
ratio. It is in a good state of tune with fresh plugs, points,
condenser, good coil and wires. It runs fine with no flat spots
anywhere while accelerating and gets 45 mpg out on the interstate.
Barkeep; a fresh round or two for serious contributers.
thanks in advance for ideas<<
When I had an SU Eliminator II carb on my 90" shovel it would start
on one prime kick, then one real kick with the ignition on. I switched
to a super G, and boy did it get hard to kickstart! It would require
putting the enrichener on 3/4, about 2-4 pumps of the throttle
(depending on temperature out), 2 full prime kicks, then 2 or 3 good kicks
with the ignition on. I gained some top end power though.
The SU is an awesome carb for a stock displacement or small
stroker engine. The easiest kick starting, great mileage, and
crisp response.
Gareth
>
> Me and two other shovel riders would appreciate hearing some good
> ideas on why our shovels are hard to kick start.
When cold.
1. Fuel On.
2. Enrichener on.
3. Two kicks through.
4. Ignition On.
5. Kick.
When warm.
1. Ignition On.
2. Kick.
Pretty much starts first prod every time. I have an S&S Super E fitted.
When I had the Super B on, it was a whole different ball game. It was
way more finnicky to start then. You can get an accelerator pump for the
B that might save you some effort, but I would be inclined to go with
the E if you're ever considering a change.
Mine starts so well that I just about never use the electric start.
--
----------------------------------------------------------------
Gareth - 94 XL - 77 FXE - 83 FXSB - DM#2
----------------------------------------------------------------
Slowhand
John Corliss wrote in message <369C8D71...@ccountry.net>...
>Here's your answer: that fucking "B" S&S. You have the same setup as my
>shovel and I have the same problem starting the fucker. We both need S&S
>"E" carbs.
Does that mean you won't buy my super B John? Damn, what am I gonna do for
booze money?
SH
>
>John Corliss
>
>"David A, Girod" wrote:
>
>> Me and two other shovel riders would appreciate hearing some good
>> ideas on why our shovels are hard to kick start. They start fine
>> when you push the button on the electric starter, but they are
>> a real bitch to kick start, hot or cold. Mine is a 78 fxe, 74ci,
>> flowed heads, s&s super b carb, andrews A grind cam, stock compression
>> ratio. It is in a good state of tune with fresh plugs, points,
>> condenser, good coil and wires. It runs fine with no flat spots
>> anywhere while accelerating and gets 45 mpg out on the interstate.
>> Barkeep; a fresh round or two for serious contributers.
>> thanks in advance for ideas
John Corliss
Gotta go. There's someone pounding at my do
John Corliss
first installed the "B". He's retired now and the carb is worn out, so
sometimes it works, other times it don't. I'm going to check my float level
again, since that caused problems before.
John Corliss
Duncan Findlater wrote:
> (clipppppppped)
John Corliss
and it'll do no good: no accelerator pump, unless added later.
Panhead wrote:
> "David A, Girod" wrote:
> >
> > Me and two other shovel riders would appreciate hearing some good
> > ideas on why our shovels are hard to kick start. They start fine
> > when you push the button on the electric starter, but they are
> > a real bitch to kick start, hot or cold. Mine is a 78 fxe, 74ci,
> > flowed heads, s&s super b carb, andrews A grind cam, stock compression
> > ratio. It is in a good state of tune with fresh plugs, points,
> > condenser, good coil and wires. It runs fine with no flat spots
> > anywhere while accelerating and gets 45 mpg out on the interstate.
> > Barkeep; a fresh round or two for serious contributers.
> > thanks in advance for ideas
>
Snarl67
In message-id: <369C8D71...@ccountry.net>
John Corliss <jcor...@ccountry.net>, sez:
>"David A, Girod" wrote:
>
>> Me and two other shovel riders would appreciate hearing some good
>> ideas on why our shovels are hard to kick start. They start fine
>> when you push the button on the electric starter, but they are
>> a real bitch to kick start, hot or cold. Mine is a 78 fxe, 74ci,
>> flowed heads, s&s super b carb, andrews A grind cam, stock compression
>> ratio. It is in a good state of tune with fresh plugs, points,
>> condenser, good coil and wires. It runs fine with no flat spots
>> anywhere while accelerating and gets 45 mpg out on the interstate.
>> Barkeep; a fresh round or two for serious contributers.
>> thanks in advance for ideas
>> b c n u
>> pro...@ix.netcom.com
>Here's your answer: that fucking "B" S&S. You have the same setup as my
>shovel and I have the same problem starting the fucker. We both need S&S
>"E" carbs.
>
>John Corliss
<psst, I moved yer reply *below* the question, hint, hint>
Granted, the E would prolly be the ticket *if* he wants to change carbs, but I
had a B on my Pan and she was a 1-2 kicker every fuckin' time.
It had the accelerator pump. On a cold start:
Petcock on
Three squirts on the throtttle
Enrichener on
Ignition off
Get her on the compression stroke
One prime kick
Get her on compression stroke again
Enrichener on 1/2
Ignition on
Throttle open about 1/8 turn
Kick her like ya mean it
Potato, potato, potato,...
Warm:
Petcock on
Get her on compression stroke
Ignition on
Throttle open about 1/8 turn
Kick her like ya mean it
Potato, potato, potato,...
As others in here have said, it seems every damn bike has it's nuances, and ya
just have to fuck around 'till ya find the right combination.
Snarl...the "primin' the pump" Asshole(tm)
Snarl AH#67, BS#37
1937 EL
EKIII Rides with me ...Go Eddie!
RMH FAQ: http://www.execpc.com/~jschwarz/rmhFAQmenu.html
Panhead
>
> Of course, you know that you can pump the throttle all you want with a "B"
> and it'll do no good: no accelerator pump, unless added later.
Oops. (heh heh) Forgot that part.
>
> Panhead wrote:
>
> > "David A, Girod" wrote:
> > >
> > > Me and two other shovel riders would appreciate hearing some good
> > > ideas on why our shovels are hard to kick start. They start fine
> > > when you push the button on the electric starter, but they are
> > > a real bitch to kick start, hot or cold. Mine is a 78 fxe, 74ci,
> > > flowed heads, s&s super b carb, andrews A grind cam, stock compression
> > > ratio. It is in a good state of tune with fresh plugs, points,
> > > condenser, good coil and wires. It runs fine with no flat spots
> > > anywhere while accelerating and gets 45 mpg out on the interstate.
> > > Barkeep; a fresh round or two for serious contributers.
> > > thanks in advance for ideas
> >
> > It shouldn't be that tough unless ya ain't been eating yer
> > spinach.
> > When mine's cold, its three or fours twisties of the
> > throttle,three kicks with everything off,(to get the juices
> > going) then , enrichener, ignition on.. one kick and...
> > (sometimes two) VarrrOOOOM! Then I repeat the last step a
> > little later after I remember to turn the gas petcock on.
> > (sigh)
> >
> > Panhead AH™#49 HSB®1219 KoB/CoT®235# O•14--EKIII Paints with me--
> > --remove my brain to reply--
--
Hugh Jass (__!__)
wrote:
>Me and two other shovel riders would appreciate hearing some good
>ideas on why our shovels are hard to kick start. They start fine
>when you push the button on the electric starter, but they are
>a real bitch to kick start, hot or cold. Mine is a 78 fxe, 74ci,
>flowed heads, s&s super b carb, andrews A grind cam, stock compression
>ratio. It is in a good state of tune with fresh plugs, points,
>condenser, good coil and wires. It runs fine with no flat spots
>anywhere while accelerating and gets 45 mpg out on the interstate.
>Barkeep; a fresh round or two for serious contributers.
>thanks in advance for ideas
>b c n u
>pro...@ix.netcom.com
>
>
In case you haven't figured it out yet by reading the posts above,
each bike has it's own "recipe" for kick starting depending on the
carb, timing, etc.. Try different combinations until you find the
right one. Make sure your timing is right.
Hugh Jass (__!__)
Change .com to .net in my e-mail address to reply direct
http://www.terraworld.net/tiny
http://www.hogger.com
fd
install scr eagle ignition
David A, Girod <pro...@ix.netcom.com> wrote in article
<77hag5$4...@sjx-ixn4.ix.netcom.com>...
John Corliss
Later on as I kicked and kicked and kicked, Joe Coleman told me, "Gee John, we're
only going to Jacksonville. I think you got it wound up tight enough."
Both of you guys are pricks. :O)>
Roguehawg wrote:
> (snip)
> Uh- let me see now- would that be the procedure you were using at Lithia Park
> Sat , December 5? You know when we were trying to get everybody going for the
> Toy Run. snicker snicker snicker I thought we were going to have to change
> your name from Lawn boy to kick kick kick kick
> Work to Ride
> Ride to Work
> Roguehawg said that
> 1967 FLH
> 1998 FLSTS
> http://members.aol.com/Roguehawg/hawgpen.html
--
John Corliss
'71 BSA Lightning (dead)
'69 FLH (for a long time)
'81 Husky 352C (will climb a wall)
*******
What's the word? Thunderbird. Drink it, fly it or drive it....
-or-
There's enough good in the worst of us and enough bad in the best of us that it
ill behooves any of us to speak poorly of the rest of us.
Roguehawg
>
>
>This is exactly the procedure I use. My mechanic told me to do this when I
>first installed the "B". He's retired now and the carb is worn out, so
>sometimes it works, other times it don't. I'm going to check my float level
>again, since that caused problems before.
>
>John Corliss
Uh- let me see now- would that be the procedure you were using at Lithia Park
Roguehawg
>
>Bite me Gene. Then have a drink on my tab.
>Later on as I kicked and kicked and kicked, Joe Coleman told me, "Gee John,
>we're
>only going to Jacksonville. I think you got it wound up tight enough."
>Both of you guys are pricks. :O)>
All in the name of fun-Lawnboy. Could not resist the chance to be a smart ass.
You had better watch out , the Quote Police will get you for lack of
quotation.
Lee Petersen
>
> Me and two other shovel riders would appreciate hearing some good
> ideas on why our shovels are hard to kick start. They start fine
> when you push the button on the electric starter, but they are
> a real bitch to kick start, hot or cold. Mine is a 78 fxe, 74ci,
> flowed heads, s&s super b carb, andrews A grind cam, stock compression
> ratio. It is in a good state of tune with fresh plugs, points,
> condenser, good coil and wires. It runs fine with no flat spots
> anywhere while accelerating and gets 45 mpg out on the interstate.
> Barkeep; a fresh round or two for serious contributers.
> thanks in advance for ideas
> b c n u
> pro...@ix.netcom.com
Sorry to respond so late, been out of town, hadda go back to
CO for the funeral of a friend. The weather was pretty fine,
should have ridden, but who knew that January in CO could be
that nice.
Anyway, the Super B should make your shovel a real easy starter.
It is one of my favorite carbs ever.
In my experience, easy-starting hemi-head harleys need three
things, in this order of importance:
1. A good carb - you've already got one. Make sure it is set
up right. Inexperienced tuners tend to want to set the
intermediate jet too big; use the smallest one that give the
best acceleration w/o backfiring through the carb at any speed
or rpm. A properly set-up "B" will like to have the enrichener
used to start the bike almost every time, even when warm. If
your idle bleed and your intermediate jet is not too rich, it
is almost impossible to flood a Super "B" bike.
2. A good valve job - kick start bikes are much fussier here
than an electric bike. Use the best new valves you can afford,
and lap them real good. Newer valves are made out of much better
steel alloys than were available when most shovels were made.
3. Timing - someone else already mentioned this, and checking
your mechanical advance - lube the pivot points and make sure
that POS advance isn't broken altogether.
After these three biggies, it could be a host of other things
giving you fits, like a weak battery or a loose/cracked battery
cable, but if everything else is in good shape and the bike
runs good after starting, then I would bet it is one of the
three things I mention above.
Good luck -
Lee Petersen
#sixty
brainiacATflashDOTnet
John Corliss
encouraged in some cases.
Marblebutt Roguehawg wrote needlessly apologetically:
--
John Corliss
'71 BSA Lightning (dead)
'69 FLH (for a long time)
'81 Husky 352C (will climb a wall)
*******
"Once in a while, everybody likes a little ass. But nobody ever likes a smart ass.
:O)>"
moses
>>"David A, Girod" wrote:
>>
>>> Me and two other shovel riders would appreciate hearing some good
>>> ideas on why our shovels are hard to kick start.
I always gave my Shovel with a Super B a few good primer kicks without the
ignition on. Then the trick is to get the engine as near to the compression
stroke (TDC) as possible, turn on the switch and drop the hammer. With the
bike tuned right and the right technique you can teach yer ole lady to start
it while you finish the last of that "one more beer".
Moses, "kicking with my thumb nowdays"
Joe Bloggs
moses <mo...@webwizzards.com> wrote in article
<77vdu2$s7m$1...@news.iag.net>...
>
>
> >>"David A, Girod" wrote:
> >>
> >>> Me and two other shovel riders would appreciate hearing some good
> >>> ideas on why our shovels are hard to kick start.
>
>Joe Sez:
Every real Harley rider knows that the number of kicks it takes to
kick start any Harly Davidson motorcycle is directly proportional to the
number of people standing around watching you kick it. With no one around
you can kick it once with the key off to oil the cylinders and load the
chambers. Turn the key on and kick it one more time and that baby will fire
up ever time.
Now if you have two or three strangers standing around just to watch
you fire it up, look out. It will take one to 3 kicks for eack person
watching. If one of the watchers has an uncle with a Jap bike and mentions
it, count on as many as five kicks per person watching. If there are a
couple of especially pretty ladies smiling and watching count on 7 to 10
kicks extra per smile.
As crowds get larger the number, of kicks is also affected by the
ambient temperature. Thus if it's in the nineties and you have 20 people
or more watching, if it doesn't start in two kicks, pretend you forgot
something in the bar and go back in and have another drink and let the
crowd dissipate.
Tuning will have little or no effect on these kick numbers.
Practically any Harley will start up and getcha home as long as no one is
watching you kick it.
Dyno Leg
Joe Bloggs
John Corliss
Joe Bloggs wrote:
--
John Corliss
'71 BSA Lightning (dead)
'69 FLH (for a long time)
'81 Husky 352C (will climb a wall)
*******
heekster
Except for XLCHs. Those mofo's don't care if anyone is watching or
not. They will foul the plugs so that you gotta pull'em and clean'em,
before it will start. And you kick and kick and kick and kick.
--
the heekster... American by birth. Southern by the grace of God.
the gentleman from Charleston, who is "not received"
replace "nomospam" with my name, to respond
'55FLE
Shaun M Shea
just to watch
> you fire it up, look out. It will take one to 3 kicks for
eack person
> watching. If one of the watchers has an uncle with a Jap bike
and mentions
> it, count on as many as five kicks per person watching. If
there are a
> couple of especially pretty ladies smiling and watching count
on 7 to 10
> kicks extra per smile.
So So True, man I think the people in the next office must have
heard me laughing. It sounds really crazy but this happens
to me every time. Maybe it has something to do with the bike
not being totally cold or totally warm?
58 Pan"knee"man
--
Shaun M. Shea
real...@compuserve.com
LHCT 96 Survivor -barely.