Arlen Ness's response to posts
Mary Queen of Scoots
posting it here as he couldn't get it to the Preacher. Ness sent me this when I
forwarded to him the posts from the newsgroup.
<< Hello Preacher,
I do understand your frustration with problems you have had in the past
with our product as expressed when you visited our retail store. I am quite
surprised that you would express such negative thoughts in the manner above
after accepting our solution from us by your handshake at the end of our
conversation.
Unfortunately you left out the fact that we acknowledged that chromed
billet does carry a risk of periodic failure and that we have developed a
program to resolve problems as described above above. You also forgot to
mention that one of our main chromers is the same shop chroming H/D and S&S
products! We do reserve the right to resolve such matters by rechrome
and/or replacement of parts, especially when they are 2 weeks short of a
year!
We are committed to exhausting every avenue available to enhance the
quality of our product on a daily basis. EVERYONE who chromes billet has
similar problems, very few are willing to admit it as we do.
It is unfortunate that you find it necessary to carry on, in this manner,
against our company and Arlen after you agreed to a mutual fair solution.
It would have been nice if ALL details discussed would have been included.
However, there are thousands of enthusiast around that world that
appreciate our honesty, Arlen and his work. This continued acceptance and
support of our product line and designs is confirmation that we are on the
right track including how we view customer satisfaction.
Sincerely,
Paul Gomez
Director of Sales
pa...@arlenness.com (PAUL)
_
.-.-.=\-. Mary
(_)=='(_) Realriders.com
Larry Boyd aka Roofwalker
wrote:
> This is the response to the original post about Arlen Ness from Ness. I'm
> posting it here as he couldn't get it to the Preacher. Ness sent me this when I
> forwarded to him the posts from the newsgroup.
>
Just out of curiosity, did you ask Preacher before you forwarded his post
to Arlen Ness or did you just take it upon yourself to stick your nose
in?
Big D.
--
Asshole #38, DM #1, FHBE #4 and ROMSSL
'99 R1100RT
'99 VTR1000F (The X-Wing)
Visit the Snake Ranch at: http://www.mindspring.com/~larryboyd/
Mary Queen of Scoots
>wrote:
>> This is the response to the original post about Arlen Ness from Ness. I'm
>> posting it here as he couldn't get it to the Preacher. Ness sent me this
>when I
>> forwarded to him the posts from the newsgroup.
>>
>
>Just out of curiosity, did you ask Preacher before you forwarded his post
>to Arlen Ness or did you just take it upon yourself to stick your nose
>in?
>
>Big D.
It was posted that these posts should be forwarded to Ness to respond to. That
is what I did. Go back and read the posts. That was the intent of the original
poster. He wanted Ness to be notified of the posts. He wanted Ness to know that
he was trashing him in the newsgroup otherwise he never would have made the
posts. Ness also wanted to respond to the allegations. Everyone has a right to
speak here. Preacher also didn't leave a return email address.
Do a little research before you accuse.
Panhead
Mary Queen of Scoots wrote:
>
> This is the response to the original post about Arlen Ness from Ness. I'm
> posting it here as he couldn't get it to the Preacher. Ness sent me this when I
> forwarded to him the posts from the newsgroup.
That was NOT from Alen Ness, sweetheart.
It's from his "alleged" SALESMAN...unless Arlen changed his name
to Paul Gomez recently.
And if anybody cared (which we don't) those assholes would have
responded TO the newsgroup directly and not have the likes of YOU
relay it back.
Arlen Ness products SUCK. There's no if ands or buts about it.
YOU suck by trying to tell us that they "couldn't reply to
"Preacher", and by looking like you stick up for those moronic
feculaters by posting the drivel you did.
So again, you prove to be a pathetic bag(s) of silicone that you
are.
>
> << Hello Preacher,
Snip these dweebs PR BS.
ES
Mary Queen of Scoots <mmmar...@aol.comspam> wrote in message
news:20000118171738...@ng-ch1.aol.com...
> This is the response to the original post about Arlen Ness from Ness. I'm
> posting it here as he couldn't get it to the Preacher. Ness sent me this
when I
> forwarded to him the posts from the newsgroup.
>
Gee Mary, How long did it take for you to write it?
Hemipower
mmmar...@aol.comspam (Mary Queen of Scoots) writes:
>
>This is the response to the original post about Arlen Ness from Ness. I'm
>posting it here as he couldn't get it to the Preacher. Ness sent me this when
>I
>forwarded to him the posts from the newsgroup.
>
<snip the drivel>
> Sincerely,
> Paul Gomez
> Director of Sales
>pa...@arlenness.com (PAUL)
Hey Paul or mmmmmmmmary deliver this message also.
Hey Arlen yer shit sucks and it's way over priced.
I think had you satisfied Preacher
he would not have come in here complaining.
I'll take his word over yours anyday.
So blow it out you chrome plated billited ass.
--
Hemipower
55 FLH
Bored n Stroked "Failure Is Only The Opportunity To More
DTSS Intelligently begin again" Henry Ford
hawgeye
Panhead wrote...
>
>
> Mary Queen of Scoots wrote:
> >
> So again, you prove to be a pathetic bag(s) of silicone that you
> are.
Gawd dammit Pan, that's the third keyboard in as many months.
Yer killin me here!
FWIW, the only two Ness products that I ever bought had lousy chrome, and it
wasn't even billet.
--
hawgeye AH96 BS98
$tealer-dealer$ page: http://www.hawgeye.com/sd.htm
RMH FAQ: http://home.earthlink.net/~mildness/yo/frames/faqv2frm.html
Larry Boyd aka Roofwalker
wrote:
> >A long time ago in an article far, far away..... Mary Queen of Scoots
> >wrote:
> >> This is the response to the original post about Arlen Ness from Ness. I'm
> >> posting it here as he couldn't get it to the Preacher. Ness sent me this
> >when I
> >> forwarded to him the posts from the newsgroup.
> >>
> >
> >to Arlen Ness or did you just take it upon yourself to stick your nose
> >in?
> >
> >Big D.
>
> It was posted that these posts should be forwarded to Ness to respond to. That
> is what I did. Go back and read the posts. That was the intent of the original
> poster. He wanted Ness to be notified of the posts. He wanted Ness to know that
> he was trashing him in the newsgroup otherwise he never would have made the
> posts. Ness also wanted to respond to the allegations. Everyone has a right to
> speak here. Preacher also didn't leave a return email address.
Actually, If you reread my post I didn't "accuse" you of anything. I
asked you a question. I missed the original thread because I was busy for
three weeks vacationing my ass off. I was actually giving you the benefit
of the doubt by asking you what your motivation was. and based on your
past history here I feel justified questioning your motivation.
Preacher
>This is the response to the original post about Arlen Ness from Ness. I'm
>posting it here as he couldn't get it to the Preacher. Ness sent me this
when I
>forwarded to him the posts from the newsgroup.
The following article posted by "Mary Queen of Scoots" from Paul Gomez (Of
"Arlen's" in San Leandro CA) is about the biggest crock of shit I've ever
seen. Paul is flat out lying on a number of counts and I will explain them
below. Since Mary and Paul have decided to air this in public I feel my
response to Paul should be made public too. I have cc'd Paul Gomez with
this letter as well.
Paul Gomez also fails to mention that he promised me that my mirrors would
be shipped to "my front door" in *3* days and it has now been *13* days.
And still no mirrors. That in itself shows me the lack of customer service
that Paul so staunchly (but falsely) promotes. Paul and Mary also fail to
mention that Paul has my home phone number and said he would call me if
there was a problem. Then rather then call me personally, Paul decided it
would somehow be beneficial to him to post this publicly.
><< Hello Preacher,
> I do understand your frustration with problems you have had in the past
> with our product as expressed when you visited our retail store.
That's understandable, I believe I made my thoughts VERY clear on this issue
to everyone involved, including the counterman, Leo, You (Paul), and Arlen.
But I don't think you truly "understand my frustration" at all. Do you
understand how frustrating it is to have to pull my gas tanks off, my rocker
boxes off, my rocker arm assemblies off, and my pushrod out... just to
replace a set of pushrod tubes that *continually* go bad in a matter of
approximately 3 months? Do you REALLY understand that? Do you understand how
frustrating it is to have to take your bike apart to that degree due to a
bad part even though you paid top dollar for that part and expected it to be
superior to the Taiwanese crap that's out there... but it's NOT? Hell, my
*stock* pushrod tubes were fine when I replaced them with Arlen Ness Chrome
Billet pushrod tubes.
So Paul, do you REALLY understand? I don't think you do. You may realize how
infuriated I am, but I really don't think you know how frustrated I am.
> I am quite
> surprised that you would express such negative thoughts in the manner
above
> after accepting our solution from us by your handshake at the end of our
> conversation.
That's an outright lie Paul. All of it. Not only did I not "accept" *your*
solution (not *our* solution, as in yours and mine) but there was NO
handshake that I remember regarding your claimed acceptance of *your*
solution. In fact Paul, as our conversation was taking place I told you "you
do what *you* think is right and I'll do what *I* think is right." Well you
apparently thought *your* solution was right and I obviously think that
telling the world how I was treated by "Arlen's" is right. You made your
bed, now you lay in it. What I think is right might not be agreeable to you
but that's life my friend.
You see, I think I need to tell the world about the poor customer
satisfaction I received from Paul Gomez and Arlen Ness (and company) at
Arlen's in San Leandro Calif. Yes, it is my opinion that I received LOUSY
customer service and a total lack of satisfaction.
And as I stated in a prior article to this Newsgroup, I was going to wait
until I got my mirrors in hand before I told the full and complete story. I
have as of this writing only told bits and pieces of what happened and have
made that quite clear in my opinion.
Since I haven't received my mirrors within the 3 days that you promised
Paul, I feel I am being more then fair and subjective in this matter. I
could blast Paul, Leo, Arlen, and Cory for a heck of a lot more then I have
so far.
When I tell my side of the story from start to finish, it will be nothing
but factual truth and my opinion. I will let the people decide who did who
wrong.
> Unfortunately you left out the fact that we acknowledged that chromed
> billet does carry a risk of periodic failure
No sir, not true. I made it clear to this group that both you and Arlen made
the statement that "Billet is harder to chrome then most aluminum" and that
you made the statement "what do you expect, a lifetime guaranty?" You and I
both know that the statement that billet aluminum is pure fiction and you
can't deny that. You were trying to bullshit me and you bullshitted the
wrong person. Billet Aluminum is nothing more then a solid chunk of aluminum
and the part is machined out of, rather then poured into a mold forged.
There is nothing more complicated with plating billet then with any other
aluminum product. I'm sure you know that well and I'm not telling you
anything new. The fact is that the problems have almost entirely been with
the pushrod tubes and the mirrors. So if Billet is so difficult to plate,
why hasn't any of the other Arlen's accessories given me the same problems
the above items mentioned have? Because your contention is false and pure
fiction, that's why.
It's not true and it's my opinion that you are either using an inferior
quality alloy for the pushrod tubes/mirrors and/or your chrome plating
contractor isn't doing their job properly in prepping the item. It's very
possible that the items are not being cleaned adequately after dipping them
in one solution and starting the next process in the plating.
What this all falls back to is your companies policy, or lack thereof. The
fact is, if anyone but Steve had exchanged those items last time I exchanged
them I would have received the same satisfaction that I received in the past
5 situations regarding my pushrods.
It is my opinion that you (and Arlen) are trying to make me suffer the
consequences for Arlen's misfortune in hiring Steve who apparently was
stealing from Arlen. (by Arlen's own admission)
> and that we have developed a
> program to resolve problems as described above above.
A program which YOU admitted wasn't stated to me and should have been. Those
were your words son. The fact is, I was not told about it at the point of
sale and therefore is SHOULD NOT APPLY TO ME. Past policy has always been to
*replace* the items with no questions asked. At least Steve knew what
customer satisfaction was. Can you say the same of yourself?
> You also forgot to
> mention that one of our main chromers is the same shop chroming H/D and
S&S
> products!
I "forgot to mention that"? If you for one instant think that I know who
your plater has contracts for/with, you are sadly mistaken and flattering
yourself. And unnecessarily at that. In truth it doesn't matter *who* else
they plate parts for. I'm having a problem with *your* product, not S&S's or
H-D's product. Arlen Ness products, and to be more precise, the pushrod
tubes and the mirrors. I have counted 20 Ness products that are on my bike
at the present time. Out of those 20 items 12 of them have been *relatively*
problem free. At least in the first year that your warranty period covers. 8
of those 20 items have had to be exchanged for bad chrome for a total of 20
times. That's not to good if you ask my opinion.
If you are proud of that record I truly feel for you. Oddly enough I've
*never* had a problem with any of the Harley-Davidson Motor Company products
which you so proudly associate yourself with. (you say you use the same
chrome plater as H/D does)
>We do reserve the right to resolve such matters by rechrome
> and/or replacement of parts, especially when they are 2 weeks short of a
> year!
I realize what your policy states and you are within your written policy. I
have already said that to this group, I make no claim to the contrary.
However your statement of it being 2 weeks shy of a year is WEAK at best.
Here are some facts for you Paul. I tried to explain this to you at the
store but apparently you had no interest in what I had to say. The fact is
that I bought the products in question on Jan. 30, 1999. I went into the
hospital for back surgery on February 4, 1999, just 4 or 5 days later.
Between 1/30/99 and 2/4/99 I was getting my affairs in order and having
pre-op tests performed. There was no time to install the items during that
short period of time and since I was expected to be bed bound for a time
after surgery, it wasn't an issue. Due to complications during surgery I
ended up staying in the hospital for 10 days and was flat on my back for
another 2 months after being released from the hospital. That means the
*soonest* that those parts COULD have been installed on my bike was April
14th, 1999 which wasn't the case. I can assure you that I was in no
condition to work on my bike for at LEAST another month after that period
and they in fact were not installed on the bike until well after that month
and I was ambulatory. Which means they were installed after approximately
May 15th, some 4 months later. That cuts your year down to 8 months so far.
You also fail to mention in your letter that I explained to you that the
parts went bad after THREE short months of being installed on the bike. Your
"2 weeks shy of a year" just got cut down to three months pal. Now, if I
pulled all the bad parts I've bought from Arlen's off of my bike as soon as
they went bad I'd have my bike down more then up. No sir, I wait until my
year warranty period is just short of expiring and only *then* do I return
them. Otherwise I'd be pulling my pushrod tubes off of my bike every three
months (4 times per year!) as opposed to only once a year.
Which makes more sense to you Paul? The fact is, you have a stated implied
warranty for ONE YEAR. If I brought those pieces in ONE DAY before my year
had expired, it would matter NOT. One year is ONE YEAR.
You also attempted to make this same point in person as well and apparently
you don't understand the concept of ONE YEAR. One year is 365 days. NOT 350
days, not 364 days... but THREE HUNDRED AND SIXTY FIVE DAYS. Do you
understand what "one year" means yet Paul?
Get over it. It's *your* warranty, not mine. I didn't twist anyone's arm to
write that policy, I didn't force anyone to make that policy, it was a
business decision made by someone in your business. I am only trying to
enforce it, which you seem hesitant to honor. Because of two weeks? Or
because Steve wrote the tag? Isn't it odd how the first counter man threw up
his arms and said "it's out of my hands" as soon as I told him Steve wrote
the tag. And isn't it odd how Leo did *exactly* the same thing when *he*
found out who wrote the ticket?
It seem mighty odd to me.
> We are committed to exhausting every avenue available to enhance the
> quality of our product on a daily basis.
Horseshit. You yourself said you've been using the same chromer since day
one and that Steve was full of shit when he told me Arlen's change chrome
platers. It's obvious that I'm not the only person with this problem so what
have you done to "enhance the quality of your product" if you haven't
changed platers like Steve said.
> EVERYONE who chromes billet has
> similar problems, very few are willing to admit it as we do.
Oddly enough I get better quality chrome from vendors such as CCI, Drag
Specialties, and other such companies that have a reputation for having
inferior products. As to whether they admit to their return rate is beyond
my capability but I find it odd that I am constantly returning Ness products
but have NEVER had to return one of the other companies products. Even after
multiple years. How odd that a company as well known as Arlen's has a far
worse return rate then those companies that are deemed "inferior." You are
putting yourself in bad company my friend. Ask Brian Hannah what the return
rate is on the chrome where he's employed now.
> It is unfortunate that you find it necessary to carry on, in this manner,
Yes, I'm sure you feel it's unfortunate that the Internet exists and a
customer can now voice his/her opinion or anecdote of a situation and be
heard all the way around the world, to an audience of MILLIONS.
> against our company and Arlen after you agreed to a mutual fair solution.
Where do you get that idea from? That we "agreed to a mutual fair solution"?
The only thing I agreed to was that I wouldn't bitch about the shifter peg
that you said was to minor to replace. I conceded that it was minor enough
that if you didn't replace it I wouldn't complain about it. Why is it that I
was so accommodating but you are fighting my legal right to ask that you
honor your own stated warranty? There was never any agreement on *my* part
regarding the mirrors. You told me that you would send them to the chrome
shop and see what they said about them. It was left at that. I am satisfied
with the results of the exchange with the pushrod tubes, the oil pressure
gauge mounting bracket, and the oil pressure gauge cone. I'm NOT satisfied
at the attitude you people took, or at the anger level I had to achieve in
order to get those results. There should have been no questions asked. You
saw the pits and bad chrome, there was NO QUESTION that it was bad. But yet
you all copped a attitude as soon as "Steve" was mentioned. And that was
after I talked to Arlen at the International Motorcycle Show and told him of
my problem. He said then "bring them on down to the shop, we'll take care of
you NO PROBLEM". I'm sorry, but this sure does feel like a problem to me!
For you to stand there at the counter and tell me "this is as good as it
gets" with on *obvious* flaw in a mirror was totally preposterous. You and I
both know that those pits will only get WORSE with time and are just the
*start* of the problem.
Then you to tried to convince me that it was "road damage". That was pure
BULLSHIT and I called you on it. When I insisted that you look me straight
in the eye and tell me it was "road damage" you COULDN'T, could you?!
Because you know as well as I do that it is bubbling from within, caused
from outgassing. The fact is, the company you contract with to plate your
items didn't prep the alloy correctly and the results are what you see in my
mirrors, pushrod tubes, Oil Pressure Gauge mounting assembly, shifter pegs,
and all the other items I've had to exchange in the past.
Then you mentioned that it was a year already when you could plainly see
that it was less then a year. Now you continue to try and avoid your
responsibility by making the same claim. Again, ONE YEAR IS ONE YEAR!
> It would have been nice if ALL details discussed would have been included.
As I stated in the rec.motorcycles.harley news forum before "Mary Queen of
Scoots" stuck her big nose into this issue, I was going to give you the
benefit of the doubt and see what you sent me in regards to my mirrors. I
was going to wait until *after* my mirrors arrived before I made a full
statement but "Mary Queen of Scoots" took it upon herself to forward you a
post, or posts, (for reasons that baffle me) and I can't be sure if she sent
you all of them or not. Probably not knowing "Mary's" record. Apparently
"Mary Queen of Scoots" enjoys creating problems as is evidenced by her
continued attacks on Easyrider Magazine and some of it's former staff, of
which she is apparently a spurned girlfriend of one.
Once I get my mirrors in my possession I will definitely send you every
single post that I have mentioned your name in regarding *this* incident. I
have them archived and that was the plan from the beginning. "Mary" seems to
have jumped the gun prematurely.
> However, there are thousands of enthusiast around that world that
> appreciate our honesty, Arlen and his work.
And if the public replies I have seen generated by this exchange are any
indication, those people are either being nice and don't want to hurt
Arlen's feelings, or are liars. You might want to read Usenet and see for
yourself. There have been NO positive (pro-Ness) replies and many MANY
negative (anti-Ness) replies.
Where *are* those "thousands of enthusiasts" when you need them? Are they
*all* computer illiterate?
> This continued acceptance and
> support of our product line and designs is confirmation that we are on the
> right track including how we view customer satisfaction.
I disagree. I believe you *were* on the right track in the past but with
your "new" un-stated policy of examining a obviously inferior part with a
microscope you are headed down the path of ruin and despair.
Now, you need to understand something Paul. There have been MANY times that
I have stood up for Arlen Ness and "Arlen's" parts on this very Newsgroup. I
have stuck my neck out and given the man praise a number of times, more
times then I can remember. I have defended his honor, his work, his
merchandise. I have sent you MANY customers in the past, either directly or
via mail order. I have recommend you more times then I can count. I have
always praised your *past* staff for doing a GREAT job. In the past if I had
*any* problem with a Ness item the exchange policy has *ALWAYS* been to
replace them with off the shelf items with NO questions asked. Period. I
could not ask for better service and that is one of the reasons I continued
to purchase Arlen Ness products. And I have purchased many. Not so many by
number, but by dollars spent. I have directed many people to Arlen's Paul.
But after this last encounter it will be a LONNNNG time, if EVER before I
ever sent another person to "Arlen's".
I just bought a new second bike and had planned on purchasing some Ness
items for it. Not now I won't. You will never see another penny of my money.
Never. I will never wear my Arlen Ness shirt advertising your product again.
I will be sure to tell my story to anyone who listens. And you can believe
that people know I am a straight shooter and *will* listen to my story and
give it credibility.
> Sincerely,
You may have noticed that I've only stated the facts and/or my personal
opinion in this matter. I noticed you have "embellished" the story quite a
bit to fit your needs. I will simply tell the truth to the good folks around
the world and I'll let *them* be the best judge of your sincerity in regards
to your claim of customer satisfaction.
Once I receive my mirrors as promised (which are ten days late by the way),
I will make a final decision on the statement I will make in this forum. Not
just rec.motorcycles.harley but I'll also make that statement in the
alt.motorcycles.harley newsgroup (world wide), the Harley e-mail Digest
(world wide), ba.motorcycles(SF Bay area) three Harley subscription mailing
lists I am subscribed to (1 world wide, 2 local area), and the Virtual Tech
Board (world wide). Who knows, if you surprise me I may stand up and
apologize for anything I may have said and tell the world I was wrong. But I
have a feeling that the only surprise I will get will be a surprise I am not
satisfied with. Go ahead Paul, surprise me!
The surprise I fully expect is that you to send me back one of my mirrors in
the same condition that you received it in telling me "that's as good as it
gets". What will it be Paul? A good surprise or a bad surprise? It's your
choice. But of course there's always small claims court if you don't fulfill
your legal obligations. And gee, since I'm disabled and don't work I have
all the time in the world on my hands!
Just remember this Paul. The Internet makes the world a very small place.
They say the best advertising is "word of mouth".
That is also true of the worst advertising.
It works both ways.
The ball's in your court my man,
Preacher
cc: Paul Gomez
Preacher
>Bill,
>You really know how to be closed minded.
Speak for yourself you close minded idiot... I'd say it's pretty closed
minded to take Paul's word and run with it.
>Preacher shook hands with the guy
>saying that things had been resolved.
Mary, were you there when this supposed "handshake" took place? How about
when I said "that things were resolved"? No? Damn, how did I guess that one?
Preacher DID NOT shake hands with the guy and DID NOT say things were
resolved. I still haven't got my mirrors I left with those jerk offs, how
can it be resolved? Think before you open your piehole woman.
Paul's statement is an out and out LIE. Neither one happened. Paul is a
liar, which now makes you a liar. Paul is trying to cover his ass to the
public and I guess lying is the only way he can try to do it. He sure as
hell can't do it with facts. Did you read where he says "the parts were two
weeks shy of being a year old"??? Well guess what Mary. They guaranty their
parts for ONE YEAR. Looks like Paul shot himself right in the dick.
You really ought to check out both sides of a issue before you stick your
big nose in other peoples business.
>If they weren't, he should have told Paul at that time.
I did moron, but you weren't there so you don't know, do you.
>Then he goes to the newsgroup to trash him.
No mam, I went to the newsgroup to tell everyone the truth and let them make
their own decision. Everything I said was true. You can ask your butt buddy
Paul about our conversation and if it happened how I said it did. And while
you're at it, ask the little shitwad where my mirrors are!
>Then he wants Ness
>to know that he's trashing him
Now what the hell are you talking about? I "want Ness to know that he's
trashing him"? Hell, I trashed him to HIS FACE. How much more can he know?
I had planned to forward every single post in this thread to Arlen and Cory
Ness. But like I said in my response to Paul, I was going to wait until I
got the mirrors I was promised that are now TEN DAYS LATE. But some bitch
decided to take matters into her own hands and get the ball rolling
prematurely.
So about my mirrors being ten days late... Now *that's* great customer
service. Ain't it?
>yet you don't want Ness to have the chance to
>reply? That's very weak. What is this? Just a one way bitching parlor?
Oh, so now you're trying to brown nose with Arlen? I guess since you
outlived your presence at Easyriders you need to kiss ass to *someone* with
a name. Ness had his chance to reply IN PERSON. He choose to give me a bunch
of lame bullshit about how "hard" it is to chrome plate billet.
You have just proven yourself to be the Cunt that Panhead said you are.
I'm done with you bitch.
You can see my response to Paul Gomez attached to your first piece of
garbage.
Get a life,
Preacher-AH #89
Arie Bresser
> Some creep wrote...
>
> > Unfortunately you left out the fact that we acknowledged that chromed
> > billet does carry a risk of periodic failure
>
> No sir, not true. I made it clear to this group that both you and Arlen
made
> the statement that "Billet is harder to chrome then most aluminum" and
that
> you made the statement "what do you expect, a lifetime guaranty?" You and
I
> both know that the statement that billet aluminum is pure fiction and you
> can't deny that. You were trying to bullshit me and you bullshitted the
> wrong person. Billet Aluminum is nothing more then a solid chunk of
aluminum
> and the part is machined out of, rather then poured into a mold forged.
>
>
> Preacher
What amazes me is the fact that they (Ness) say that they know that billet
is too hard to chrome and is prone to failure... but they still sell it. I
do not own my own business, but I do know that I would not sell a product
that I _KNEW_ would most likely fail. Maybe I am wrong, but that just does
not seem to make sense.
--
Later,
Arie "Finally Sleeping" Bresser
Gimp#4-LFS#3-BS#70-SENS
Go Eddie! http://eddiekieger.comJMHO, YMMV.
Larry Boyd aka Roofwalker
> Mary Queen of Scoots wrote:
<snip>
> >Then he wants Ness
> >to know that he's trashing him
>
> Now what the hell are you talking about? I "want Ness to know that he's
> trashing him"? Hell, I trashed him to HIS FACE. How much more can he know?
>
> I had planned to forward every single post in this thread to Arlen and Cory
> Ness. But like I said in my response to Paul, I was going to wait until I
> got the mirrors I was promised that are now TEN DAYS LATE. But some bitch
> decided to take matters into her own hands and get the ball rolling
> prematurely.
Ah so my initial guess was right. She was just butting her ass in where
it didn't need to be. Seems to be a common theme with the stuttering
girl.
Larry Boyd aka Roofwalker
wrote:
> >Mary everyone in Scottsdale knows who "Stone" is around here. Paul Gomez
> >knows
> >who I am and so does Cory Ness. As a matter of fact, one look in their
> >computer
> >will list my phone number. I just figured that since you are the one
> >reporting
> >to Mr. Gomez. You'd like to pass this along as well. As for bitching and
> >moaning about it Mary. I have already let them know what I think (As well as
> >many others). I dont think that posting the truth is bitching. Did you not
> >read
> >the part of me contacting Cory Ness on this matter?
>
> I'm on AOL. I don't get every post in the thread even if it comes from AOL. I
> missed that one about you contacting them.I take back what I said about you
> doing nothing then.
In a earlier post to me you said and I quote:
"Go back and read the posts."
Explain this to me cause I missed it. Why exactly is it that it's ok for
you not to have read all the posts but it's not for me?
TeXdude
Moses/Ric Flair replied to Preacher:
<snip some>
>
>It sounds like you are almost blackmailing them telling them if you
>dont do this or that Im going to basterdize your name to as many
>people in the world as you can. If you arent happy with their product
>buy something else. I dont mean to talk out of line or anything since
>I enjoy your posts as much as anyones.
>"I want to be the man that killed Hulk Hogan"
>Ric Flair. 14 time Heavyweight wrestling champion of the world.
Mr. Flair......I seriously doubt that Preacher is trying to blackmail
anyone, it's quite obvious that he experienced the highest levels of
frustration in dealing with Ness and is posting his experience for everyone
else to make their own informed decisions. I can relate very well to what
Preacher is feeling about all of this, I've experienced that same
overwhelming frustration dealing with other entities (not Ness) and after
trying the diplomatic approach over and over and not getting any positive
results, there's nothing left but to let as many people as you can, know
YOUR experiences.......it's probably theraputic also in dealing with the
stress.
Good luck Preacher........I share your pain.
--
TeXdude........my .01 (sorry, inflation).
TeXdude
Moses/Ric Flair wrote in message
<388561fa....@news.atl.bellsouth.net>...
>
>>Mr. Flair......I seriously doubt that Preacher is trying to blackmail
>>anyone, it's quite obvious that he experienced the highest levels of
>>frustration in dealing with Ness and is posting his experience for
everyone
>>else to make their own informed decisions.
>
>there. I didnt see the mirrors. yada yada. Im not in his shoes either.
>Just throwing in a couple of cents I probably should have kept in my
>pocket.
Speakin bout "pressure".....if it wasn't so damn off topic in THIS ng, I'd
give anyone willing to listen a 20k report of my negative experience with
that POS Corp called MCI Communications.......but then, my blood "pressure"
would escalate accordingly......think I'll just go to bed.
--
Good night all........
TeXdude
Preacher
>Preacher ,
> It seems they took pretty good care of you replacing 20 different
>items.
Now think about what you're saying before you say any more.
I have 20 different Arlen Ness items on my bike.
Out of those 20 items, 8 items have had to be returned for bad chrome. Those
8 "items" actually represent about 38 items if you count 4 pushrod tubes to
a set, two mirrors to a set, two mirror stems, etc....
Out of those 8 items I've had to return them *20* times! (1 time for every
four PR tube set, 1 time for every mirror/stem PAIR, etc.)
6 of those returns were for Pushrod tubes.
5 of those returns were for Mirrors. (two mirrors and stems each time, only
counting for 1 return)
2 of those were the oil pressure gauge bracket.
~ 4-5 of those were shifter pegs.
So out of 8 items that I've had to return 20 times, *11* of them were just
two items. 7 of them were another two items. That's 16 times for 4 items!
That means 4 returns were single time returns. Now THAT'S a pretty sad
commentary on Arlen Ness products, don't you think?
And remember, it's *their* policy to replace peeling, pitted, or bad chrome,
it was THEIR decision to make that policy. *I* didn't tell *them* what the
policy was, *they* told *me* what the policy was. I'm only going by what
*they* offer, nothing more. I'm not asking for anything but what I *legally*
have coming to me.
And their policy is to exchange/re-chrome the item one year from the date of
purchase, or ONE YEAR FROM THE LAST EXCHANGE which is considered a purchase.
When you take back a bad piece of chrome, they give you a receipt showing a
return, then a purchase of the new part which makes it a NEW purchase and
the warranty starts all over again. That was THEIR decision, not mine. So if
I have a set of pushrod tubes that goes bad once a year, for the next 100
years, I can keep returning them as long as I live.
That's THEIR policy bud. I didn't make THEIR policy. They did. Now they
don't want to honor it. That my friend is BULLSHIT.
> I mean thats a lot of money they are out.
That's not my problem, that's his problem. If he doesn't like his own
policy, he shouldn't have written it. What about the money *I'm* out? How
many times do you think I should pull the tanks, rocker covers, rocker arms,
and pushrods for free before they start reimbursing me for my labor?
Do you think I got the parts originally for FREE?? I'm the one out the
money. And if I'm stuck with a piece of shit chrome that I paid TOP DOLLAR
for, is *that* right?
That may be a lot of money to you, but to Arlen Ness it's fucking drop in
the bucket. I know MANY people that have worked there and a few that don't
have a bone to pick with them. They ALL (a) say his stuff is pure JUNK and
(b) say that the mark-up he gets on his parts would make you sick to your
stomach. His mark-up is something close to jewelry from what I've been told.
And if you know jewelry, it has about the highest mark-up out of any retail
product on the free/open market.
Don't fool yourself guy, he's making money hand over fist on the parts he
sells.
>You are talking about
>almost punching a man in the face.
I am talking about him pissing me off so bad I'd *like* to put his lights
out. I'm afraid I'll kill the old prick.
>I know they kept asking where you
>live. They might have just wanted to get feedback or offer give advice
>on how to protect your gear.
WRONG! I've asked every single person that's ever worked there (including
Arlen) how I can keep the tubes from doing it again. I have yet to get an
answer. All I've *ever* heard is "it's a batch of bad chrome". I use MAAS on
his parts and that's what he recommends. I just got some Cartier protectant,
he says to go ahead and try that too. The "where do you live" question is to
divert attention from the fact that he is selling a piece of shit inferior
product IMO. What's it matter where I live. The fact is, my CHEAP CCI, DRAG
SPECIALTIES, HARLEY-DAVIDSON MOTOR ACCESSORIES, and the chrome I've had
personally done has NEVER failed on me. Explain THAT one. You know the rep
CCI and DS have. Cheap, bad chrome, etc. But it's still holding up where my
Arlen Ness crap isn't.
*Another* sad commentary on Ness products!
>I have a few ness things
>Rear turn signal bar 2 years old like new
>Chrome pressure gauge mounted on rear jug 2 years like new
>Shifter linkage 2 years like new
>Chrome mirrors The cheap $40.00 ones. 18 months Slight pitting I
>chalked up to 90 MPH bugs and only washing the scoot about once a
>month.
If you've been keeping up with this thread you'd know that I have some Ness
products that have gone untouched too. The transmission top NEVER sees a
rag, you can't get to it. But guess what? It's as good as it was the day I
put it on about 3 years ago! The tranny side cover. Same thing. The license
plate backing plate. You can't get a rag into the back of that either, but
guess what? It's not to a pit on it.
Same for the one piece dash, the shifter rod, the passenger pegs... and get
this. The Wedge shaped voltage regulator that sits RIGHT up front behind the
front wheel and takes more road abuse then any part on my bike. Not a pit on
it.
Strange, ain't it? The pushrod tubes and mirrors are the two *major*
problems. Oh yeah, I wipe my bike down EVER SINGLE TIME I ride it! So no one
can claim I abuse it either.
>It sounds like you are almost blackmailing them telling them if you
>dont do this or that Im going to basterdize your name to as many
>people in the world as you can. If you arent happy with their product
>buy something else. I dont mean to talk out of line or anything since
>I enjoy your posts as much as anyones.
Blackmail? Because I want him to honor the WRITTEN POLICY he wrote up and is
in the back of every single catalog he sells or gives away? Blackmail
because I want a part that I've paid TOP DOLLAR for to last more then the
warranty period?
I fail to see your reasoning. Blackmail is when you're trying to get
something for free by means of extortion.
I'm extorting no one. I'm simply telling the world my displeasure with Ness,
and exactly why I'm dissatisfied, and I'm letting the PEOPLE make up their
own mind.
Like I told Paul, you do what YOU think it right, I'll do what I think is
right.
Oh, and it's not like he didn't expect this Internet exposure of the
situation. I asked the counter guy right in front of Paul if they had a
e-mail address because I wanted to forward every single post I wrote about
them to them. I said I was going to tell my story everywhere I could find on
the Internet to tell it.
So this should come as NO surprise to Paul Gomez. Unless he's totally stupid
and didn't believe me. Ain't the power of the Internet wonderful? It used to
be when a business pissed off a customer he could tell the people
immediately around him. Now you can tell the whole damn world with a push of
the "send" button.
Have a good one,
Preacher-AH #89
Mary Queen of Scoots
>
>Hey Paul or mmmmmmmmary deliver this message also.
>Hey Arlen yer shit sucks and it's way over priced.
> I think had you satisfied Preacher
>he would not have come in here complaining.
>I'll take his word over yours anyday.
>So blow it out you chrome plated billited ass.
>
You've got the email address now. Do it yourself or are you too frightened to
email someone non-anonymously?
Hey, I've had problems with Ness chrome myself a few years back. They always
replaced it for me. I haven't had a problem with the new stuf. Ness could not
respond here as they don't have a news server. He also didn't have Preacher's
return email address.
So, it's okay for Preacher to continue to bash Ness after he shook hands with
guy on a resolution to the situation? It's okay for Preacher to speak his mind
here but not for Ness to have a chance to clear the air? Yeah, that's free
speech. Some bikers you are. I guess I would rather be friends with Ness than
you guys.
MANDKIM
> I do understand your frustration with problems you have had in the past
> after accepting our solution from us by your handshake at the end of our
> conversation.
> program to resolve problems as described above above. You also forgot to
> year!
> right track including how we view customer satisfaction.
> .-.-.=\-. Mary
> (_)=='(_) Realriders.com
Good old Paul Gomez. I haven't had to good of luck with Mr. Gomez. Ya see, I
had a problem with my tranny plate cracking on my "Arlen Ness" Spacer kit. It
cracked down the middle (not to mention the other damage from this fucker
letting go). When I called Ness, I was put into contact with Mr. Gomez. Mr.
Gomez and I met at a dinner party in Az. Nice guy, I thought. After talking to
me over the phone he advised me to take it down to a shop that he worked with
in the area. I dropped the part off at his shop of choice. After a few days. I
was told by the shop that it wasnt going to be warrantied. Because I..."Rode my
bike to hard" BWAAAAAAAAAAAAA! That I also street raced, therefore it was not
going to be warrantied. Thats funny? They never told me that the part was for
"Show only". Only after I talked to Cory Ness was I finally taken care of in
this manner. This is one of many problems that I have had with "Ness" products.
I have slowly replaced every one of the Ness products with something better.
Example- Ness petite switches and Hand controls ( Fred Flintstone had better
stopping power, The switches fell of constantly). Ness footcontrols (after two
pairs enough was enough). Ness Mirrors (7 mirrors at $100 to $125 a piece, can
kiss my ass). In reality I was a "Ness Chromosexual". I still have many Ness
parts on my bike today. I dont care about my warranty with these guys. Because
there is "NO" fucking warranty. I buy from people that stand up to the pump and
take care of their customers. I dont think a customer needs to beg to be taken
care of on some issues. I also think that if they are going to build a part
that "looks" like its going 200mph, it should stand up to a little street
racing. If not put a sticker on it stating "This is for show only, anybody
attempting to use this for real use should buy the real thing somewhere else".
Send that fucking post to Mr. Gomez MMMMMMMMMary.
Stone
Mary Queen of Scoots
Send it yourself with your real name. You've got the email address. Don't just
bitch and moan. Do something about it.
Bill
Mary Queen of Scoots wrote:
> This is the response to the original post about Arlen Ness from Ness. I'm
> posting it here as he couldn't get it to the Preacher. Ness sent me this when I
> forwarded to him the posts from the newsgroup.
>
> _
> .-.-.=\-. Mary
> (_)=='(_) Realriders.com
Mmmary you really know how to be an asshole. The customer is not happy and post
his opinion and you counter with a sales; "piece of shit."
Carry on you're good at what you do. Just keep what you do to yourself.
Bill75fxe
Mary Queen of Scoots
>post
>his opinion and you counter with a sales; "piece of shit."
>
>Carry on you're good at what you do. Just keep what you do to yourself.
>Bill75fxe
Bill,
You really know how to be closed minded. Preacher shook hands with the guy
saying that things had been resolved. If they weren't, he should have told Paul
at that time. Then he goes to the newsgroup to trash him. Then he wants Ness
to know that he's trashing him yet you don't want Ness to have the chance to
reply? That's very weak. What is this? Just a one way bitching parlor?
_
MANDKIM
>Send it yourself with your real name. You've got the email address. Don't
>just
>bitch and moan. Do something about it.
> .-.-.=\-. Mary
> (_)=='(_) Realriders.com
who I am and so does Cory Ness. As a matter of fact, one look in their computer
will list my phone number. I just figured that since you are the one reporting
to Mr. Gomez. You'd like to pass this along as well. As for bitching and
moaning about it Mary. I have already let them know what I think (As well as
many others). I dont think that posting the truth is bitching. Did you not read
sat around bitching? I was very choice in my words when writing this post. I
was very truthful in light of the fact of this being the world's stage. If you
can't get results, go to the people. If I can save one hard working guy the
bullshit that I went thru, It was all fucking worth it.
At this point, what did your post help? Have you helped or cause more shit for
the guy with the Ness problem? Did you solve his problem or try to make him
look like a dick? I have always seen people ride you like a cracked out hooker
on Sunset blvd giving 5 dollar blowjobs. I always stayed away from bad mouthing
people did to you. But as time goes by, I can see why.
Stone
MANDKIM
>respond here as they don't have a news server.
You mean to tell me that Ness, cannot afford a news server? Give me a break.
Arlens' has a Rolex that cost more than the most expensive, chromed dipped
Harley.
Stone
Mary Queen of Scoots
>knows
>who I am and so does Cory Ness. As a matter of fact, one look in their
>computer
>will list my phone number. I just figured that since you are the one
>reporting
>to Mr. Gomez. You'd like to pass this along as well. As for bitching and
>moaning about it Mary. I have already let them know what I think (As well as
>many others). I dont think that posting the truth is bitching. Did you not
>read
>the part of me contacting Cory Ness on this matter?
I'm on AOL. I don't get every post in the thread even if it comes from AOL. I
missed that one about you contacting them.I take back what I said about you
doing nothing then.
Does this mean that I
>Just
>sat around bitching? I was very choice in my words when writing this post.
>I
>was very truthful in light of the fact of this being the world's stage. If
>you
>can't get results, go to the people. If I can save one hard working guy the
>bullshit that I went thru, It was all fucking worth it.
>At this point, what did your post help? Have you helped or cause more shit
>for
>the guy with the Ness problem? Did you solve his problem or try to make him
>look like a dick?
I passed it on to Ness as the original poster wanted him to know what he was
saying in the newsgroup. They are now aware of what people are saying in here.
Maybe they will now do more about the situation.
I have always seen people ride you like a cracked out
>hooker
>on Sunset blvd giving 5 dollar blowjobs. I always stayed away from bad
>mouthing
>people did to you. But as time goes by, I can see why.
Thanks for the kind words, Stone.
MANDKIM
>Thanks for the kind words, Stone.
>
> _
> .-.-.=\-. Mary
> (_)=='(_) Realriders.com
to me. I hope all is forgiven.
Stone
Moses/Ric Flair
It seems they took pretty good care of you replacing 20 different
almost punching a man in the face. I know they kept asking where you
live. They might have just wanted to get feedback or offer give advice
on how to protect your gear.
Rear turn signal bar 2 years old like new
Chrome pressure gauge mounted on rear jug 2 years like new
Shifter linkage 2 years like new
Chrome mirrors The cheap $40.00 ones. 18 months Slight pitting I
chalked up to 90 MPH bugs and only washing the scoot about once a
month.
It sounds like you are almost blackmailing them telling them if you
dont do this or that Im going to basterdize your name to as many
people in the world as you can. If you arent happy with their product
buy something else. I dont mean to talk out of line or anything since
I enjoy your posts as much as anyones.
MRBHD
>bikes were a joke. Can you say "Butt-Ugly"?
Been following this thread and just want to add my two cents worth! I have
purchased a few Ness parts in the past (from the sale bin) because his "retail
prices" are a bad joke!! I found them to be of inferior quality and as such,
waaaayy over priced! However, I guess you cant expect much from a trailor
queen builder whom I saw unloading his as well as other HAMSTER trailer queen
bikes from an 18 wheeler at the airport in Rapid City during Sturgis '95. Come
on Arlen, You used to be a rider as well as a stand up guy! What happened???
Don Teal
<prea...@my.house.in.CA> wrote:
<snipped it all for an editorial reply>
<Judge Judy mode on>
Arlen Ness Inc: "yada yada blah blah"
Judge Judy: "Mr. Preacher, your story?"
Preacher: "yada yada shitty chrome yada yada bullshit excuses yada
yada meddling busybodies"
Judge Judy: "Thank you
Arlen Ness Inc: "But, but your honor!"
Judge Judy: "HUSH, HUSH!"
Arlen Ness Inc: "But, but your honor!"
Judge Judy: "What part of HUSH don't you understand? I find in favor
of the nice Mr. Preacher." [WHAP] <sound of gavel> "Now Mr. Preacher,
court is in recess, care to take me for a ride on your bike?"
<Judge Judy mode off>
--
Don
98 FXD
AH#87 BS#40 DM#4
http://web2.airmail.net/drt/index.html
Support Eddie Kieger III at http://eddiekieger.com
Don Teal
wrote:
>Don't give up. Keep hammering them until
>you get satisfaction.
Amen.
>AFA Ness is concerned...I always did think his
>bikes were a joke. Can you say "Butt-Ugly"?
Amen.
Don Teal
wrote:
> It seems they took pretty good care of you replacing 20 different
>items. I mean thats a lot of money they are out. You are talking about
>almost punching a man in the face. I know they kept asking where you
Seems to me like replacing those 20 items was what they were SUPPOSED
to do. They weren't doing him a favor, they were honoring
warranties. If they were doing him a favor they would've compensated
him for labor and downtime.
>live. They might have just wanted to get feedback or offer give advice
>on how to protect your gear.
I don't think so Moses. His problem didn't sound like road damage, it
sounded like shitty workmanship. If I took a piece of chrome back
because it was bubbling or peeling based on the time frames Preacher
had it on the bike and someone started edumacating me on "protection"
against road hazard I'd probably react like he did.
>I have a few ness things
I have none. I've tried THREE times to get them to send me a catalog
but have yet to see one in my mailbox. Others in a stack of parts
catalogs over a foot high promptly responded to my requests for their
literature with just ONE phone call. Many of them are currently
spending my money. Ness aint cause they cant seem to even handle
sending me a free cataloge.
>It sounds like you are almost blackmailing them telling them if you
Blackmail? Since when is valid warranty work considered blackmail?
Preacher gave them every opportunity in the world to make it right.
Some other bitch (non tm) got involved and escalated this to a full
blown public cluster fuck. He wasn't happy with a part that was under
WARRANTY! Buy something else? Why? He shouldn't have to if the vendor
was a stand up dealer. I'm pretty sure he'll be buying from someone
else now as will many.
I know there are probably a bunch of you out there happy with your
Ness parts and service. Keep on keeping on if you're happy. This
response is only in reference to Preachers experience which combined
with my own at just even getting a freakin catalog from them makes me
happy with my pile of "other vendors" parts catalogs.
Moses/Ric Flair
>Mr. Flair......I seriously doubt that Preacher is trying to blackmail
>anyone, it's quite obvious that he experienced the highest levels of
>frustration in dealing with Ness and is posting his experience for everyone
>else to make their own informed decisions.
Blackmail WAS too harsh a word. Pressure. Also let me say I wasnt
there. I didnt see the mirrors. yada yada. Im not in his shoes either.
Just throwing in a couple of cents I probably should have kept in my
pocket.
Dave U (Scot-on-a-Scoot)
>
> I'm on AOL. I don't get every post in the thread even if it comes from AOL. I
> missed that one about you contacting them.I take back what I said about you
> doing nothing then.
>
I hate to be pedantic (no you don't) but unless I'm totally wrong you did see the
post because you responded to it but then I quite often read something and fail to
take it all in, must be something to do with the alcohol.
--
Dave (Scot-on-a-Scoot)
99FXDWG
BS#58
Take my ?malt? away to get my personal attention.
Dave U (Scot-on-a-Scoot)
<snip for brevity but I enjoyed it all)
By my count I make the score Straight Talking 1 - Marketing Bullshit 0
>
> The ball's in your court my man,
It certainly is, it looks a little battered and deflated but the ball is
definitely in his court.
I must make a mental note not to stop by Arlen's shop on the way home.....but
then that was never a problem for me.
Hemipower
mmmar...@aol.comspam (Mary Queen of Scoots) writes:
>>>pa...@arlenness.com (PAUL)
>>
>>Hey Paul or mmmmmmmmary deliver this message also.
>>Hey Arlen yer shit sucks and it's way over priced.
>> I think had you satisfied Preacher
>>he would not have come in here complaining.
>>I'll take his word over yours anyday.
>>So blow it out you chrome plated billited ass.
>>
>> Hemipower
>
>You've got the email address now.
I do? Oh yeah yer right. There it is
in the bit bucket.
Do it yourself or are you too frightened to
>email someone non-anonymously?
Yes, I'm scared. I frighten easily.
>Hey, I've had problems with Ness chrome myself a few years back. They always
>replaced it for me. I haven't had a problem with the new stuf.
Ness could not
>respond here as they don't have a news server.
Your going to sit there and tell me with all his money
he can't access a news server. <excuse me a moment>
BAAAWAAAAAHAAAAAHAAAAAHAAAAAA.
He also didn't have Preacher's
>return email address.
I don't think it's Preachers Email address that is the issue here
MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMary. It's his damn
mailing address he's concerned about. Listen up.
HE WANTS HIS MIRRORS REPLACED/RETURNED.
Do you think Preacher just wants to CHAT about it?
I don't theeeenk soooo.
>So, it's okay for Preacher to continue to bash Ness after he shook hands with
>guy on a resolution to the situation?
Yes, It appears a solution has not occurred.
It's okay for Preacher to speak his
>mind
>here but not for Ness to have a chance to clear the air?
BAAAWAAAHAAAHAAAA Sorry mmmmmmmmary I hate to
laugh in yer face but I aint seen hide nor hair of Arleen in here.
If he wants to clear the air tell him to quit shitting in boxes
and calling it a quality product.
Yeah, that's free
>speech. Some bikers you are. I guess I would rather be friends with Ness than
>you guys.
Feel free. See ya. Go SUCK UP. it seems to be what you do best. Panheads
assessment of you is right on target.
--
Hemipower
55 FLH
Bored n Stroked "Failure Is Only The Opportunity To More
DTSS Intelligently begin again" Henry Ford
Moses/AKA Ric Flair
Dont take me wrong. All I am saying is they have a (or had ) a good
warranty. They make good product IMHO. Yes they are pricey (I bought
some of mine via ebay used due to price). I guess I just factor in a
little wear and tear on my stuff. My only complaint has been vibration
on the mirrors. I would think for what they charge they could reduce
it. Even on my el cheapo ness mirrors. Im just playing a little devils
advocate. Like I said one would have to be there in your shoes. But a
person that spends as much coin with their company should get a x-mas
card from Ness personally every year. Keep us posted.
Thanks
"I been run down, I been lied to,
I don't know why I let that mean woman make me a fool.
She took all my money, wrecked my new car.
Now she's with one of my goodtime buddies,
They're drinkin' in some crosstown bar."
G. Allman
Moses
Dees's Fine Cigars
1-888-299-0222
http://www.c-gar.com
Par Willen
<snips the whole sorry chrome story>
Hehehe, I never had that kind of problems with Ness products. Or any
other Chrome Accessory Vendors products for that matter.
Ah, the merits of a RatBike comes shining through in astounding
clarity...
Regards
PiPPi
#66, BS#13
Steve Reyer
>A long time ago in an article far, far away..... Mary Queen of Scoots
>wrote:
whittled a little...
>> I'm on AOL. I don't get every post in the thread even if it comes from AOL. I
>> missed that one about you contacting them.I take back what I said about you
>> doing nothing then.
>In a earlier post to me you said and I quote:
>"Go back and read the posts."
>Explain this to me cause I missed it. Why exactly is it that it's ok for
>you not to have read all the posts but it's not for me?
Cuz Mary is on AOL, there's been a thread about missing Usenet stuff
on AOL server, specially in RMH. It's kinda like the "the dog ate my
homework" excuse of our youth...
>Big D.
>--
Steve in Gautier, Mizz-sippi "That which hits the fan will
2000 XLH 1200 Bianca not be uniformly distributed"
SENS/LFS#42 Law of Probable Dispersal
http://home.earthlink.net/~mildness/yo/frames/faqv2frm.html
Panhead
Hemipower wrote:
>
> In article <20000118193021...@ng-ch1.aol.com>,
> mmmar...@aol.comspam (Mary Queen of Scoots) whined:
> Yeah, that's free
> >speech. Some bikers you are. I guess I would rather be friends with Ness than
> >you guys.
>
> Feel free. See ya. Go SUCK UP. it seems to be what you do best. Panheads
> assessment of you is right on target.
I'm rarely wrong. :>
Panhead
Mary Queen of Scoots wrote:
>
> >>Ness could not
> >>respond here as they don't have a news server.
> >
> >You mean to tell me that Ness, cannot afford a news server? Give me a break.
> >Arlens' has a Rolex that cost more than the most expensive, chromed dipped
> >Harley.
> >
> >Stone
>
> News servers don't cost a cent.
No shit. But his ISP provides one for his use, just like it does
his e-mail.
Have you seen their website? They're not the
> most computer literate people around. They haven't set it up.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
No shit again. They probably use it to design their parts as
well.
Bruce Bryner
Mary Queen of Scoots wrote:
> This is the response to the original post about Arlen Ness from Ness.
> << Hello Preacher,
> I am quite
> surprised that you would express such negative thoughts in the manner above
> after accepting our solution ...
> Unfortunately you left out the fact that...
> You also forgot to mention that one of our main chromers is the same shop
> chroming H/D and S&S
> products! We do reserve the right to resolve such matters by rechrome
> and/or replacement of parts, especially when they are 2 weeks short of a
> year!
> ..
> It would have been nice if ALL details discussed would have been included.
>
> pa...@arlenness.com (PAUL)
> _
> .-.-.=\-. Mary
>
Unbelievable.
It is unbelievable that I was actually ready to give you, Mary, a second chance,
thinking that maybe my original opinion of you was wrong. Obviously, it was not.
One of the prescribed uses of newsgroups is to share information about concerns
over products, which Preacher did fairly. I find it unbelievable that you actually
believed he was beckoning the services of a "company"-oriented-Hollywood-Hore to
mediate.
I also find it unbelievable that Ness would have a person doing PR for them, who
would write a letter meant for an individual, to be posted on a public forum which,
rather than apologizing for faulty product and customer services, would critisize
that customer for their use of freedom of speech, and then proceed to politely call
Preacher a liar.
A triple "wammmy" for Arlen Ness.
1) Bad PR for their company.
2) Bad decision to let you anywhere near the subject.
3) Bad product and service reviews which has come to light even more here.
Mary, I have my own reservations about how appropriate it was for you to butt in
like you did, and then making a bad situation many times worse by posting such an
inappropriate letter. I simply don't see anything good coming from it, (other than
possibly some folks saving some money in _not_ buying Ness product.)
If Paul = Ness like you say, then Arlen Ness has just admitted in a public forum
that their product is of equal quality to anyone else's.
A consumer with monetary concerns should now question why they should pay the extra
price.
Well Mary, I don't think you will ever have to worry about suffering from low
self-esteem.
Unbelievable.
--
Bruce - BS#96
The Journey IS the Reward.
RMH Dyno Shootout: http://www.iusb.edu/~bbryner/dyno.html
HD tidbits: http://www.iusb.edu/~bbryner/hrlypage.html
Hemipower
writes:
>>Mary Queen of Scoots wrote:
>> Have you seen their website? They're not the
>> most computer literate people around. They haven't set it up.
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> No shit again. They probably use it to design their parts as
>well.
Ohh,that's gonna leave a mark.
Hemipower
writes:
I wondered why you were being so hard on the
California twit. Now I see. : )
Do ya have any more words of wisdom
for the group? As Ross Perot<sp> said " I'm all ears".
Jinks
sales should be paying attention to these kinds of threads. Companies
like Ness have been taking advantage of poor communications between
consumers forever. The internet is ending that.
It's easy to print a warrantee policy on the back of a package
you have to provide for your product. It's also easy to print the
same policy in the back (or front) of your catalog. That *easy*
distribution carries the *impression* of good intentions to your
entire customer base. Backing out of that policy is handled one on
one. No company prints on all their packaging, or in their catalog,
that they refused to warrantee inferior parts to "you", or "me", or
"Preacher".
In the past we either grumbled to ourselves, or told as many
people as we could. What's that, 10, 25, 50? Not too effective
against advertising that reaches tens of thousands, or millions. Now
*our* comments reach millions.
In the current squabble, Preacher's anger & frustration is
obvious not only in his words, but in the errors caused by his rush to
get his thoughts on the screen. His keyboard is taking quite a
pounding. He tells us of the *multiple* failures, & the *multiple*
times he's taken a wrench to his bike because of poorly produced
products from Arlen Ness. He doesn't ask for money. He doesn't ask
for compensation for the time he spent installing/removing/installing
poorly made parts. He doesn't ask for compensation for gaskets, oil,
etc. used in those installations. All he asks for is compliance with
a warrantee freely given by Arlen Ness.
According to Mary, who should probably not be involved at all,
Ness, supposedly represented by Paul Gomez, claims several exceptions
to quality work & a reliable warrantee. They even go so far as to
claim they have no access to this medium.
All of that is either a choice made by Arlen Ness, or a lie
from Mary. Either way, the *only* excuse for failing to honor a
freely given warrantee, after accepting payment for the product, is
greed.
Arlen Ness did some very good custom work several years ago, &
turned that work into a profitable business. As he became more famous
his work became more artistic, & less functional. I still appreciate
some of his work for the art involved, but financing art fantasies
with poor quality products & a warrantee he won't honor will cost him
in the long run. I'm sure this one thread has cost him a lot in
future sales.
Good internet access is *not* expensive. (most of us can
afford it at home) Building in quality, in an expensive part, &
honoring the warrantee will cut into that *substantial* profit margin,
but it will generate better sales.
I'm glad Preacher took the time & effort to voice his problem
here. I hope other companies learn from this. It's too late for
Ness.
Jinks ('86fxrs,'93fxrs-c)
#64
Remember, "No good deed goes unpunished"
Ken Schofield
>
> In article <3885B233...@intac.com>, Panhead <panmy...@intac.com>
> writes:
>
> >Hemipower wrote:
> >>
> >> In article <20000118193021...@ng-ch1.aol.com>,
> >> mmmar...@aol.comspam (Mary Queen of Scoots) whined:
> >
> >> Yeah, that's free
> >> >speech. Some bikers you are. I guess I would rather be friends with Ness
> >than
> >> >you guys.
> >>
> >> Feel free. See ya. Go SUCK UP. it seems to be what you do best. Panheads
> >> assessment of you is right on target.
> >
> >I'm rarely wrong. :>
> >
> >
>
> I wondered why you were being so hard on the
> California twit. Now I see. : )
Jeezuz, what's next? Someone has a beef with the FBI and MQofS is gonna
forward messages off to them just 'cuz she likes to hang around with em
and wants to earn "suck-up" points?
WTF Mary?
How you thought it was OK to forward anything to anyone without their
prior approval is beyond me, and then to lie about it in this forum
where you knew you'd be found out eventually is just, well, plain ol'
stoopid. It was Preacher's beef - plain and simple. It was up to him
to pursue it with Ness as he saw fit. How the fug did you decide to
take it upon yourself to act as Preacher's secretary?
Get a life Mary - preferably your OWN.
One without pictures might be a refreshing change.
Ken
HSB#07 WOLF#13 BS#92 AH#70
Hemipower
<glj...@bellsouth.net> writes:
<snip>
> I'm sure this one thread has cost him a lot in
>future sales.
Yep, I was looking at his Stealth I mirrors for my bike.
With possibly upgrading to the Stealth brake and clutch
levers at a later date when I up-dated my controls.
Now I guess I will be just"looking".
I kinda liked the "drag" pegs as well. They were only
$17.00ea and I need two, but I certainly don't need the hassle.
I guess the standard $3.00 rubber jobs can stay.
> Good internet access is *not* expensive. (most of us can
>afford it at home) Building in quality, in an expensive part, &
>honoring the warrantee will cut into that *substantial* profit margin,
>but it will generate better sales.
> I'm glad Preacher took the time & effort to voice his problem
>here.
Indeed. He just saved me at least $100.00 right off the bat. Unfortunately I
don't live close enough to a Ness outlet should a warranty need arise. I
certainly wouldn't want to have to deal
with it long distance.
I hope other companies learn from this. It's too late for
>Ness.
But a mini windfall for Custom Chrome.
Mary Queen of Scoots
>>Ness.
>
>But a mini windfall for Custom Chrome.
>
Ness makes Custom Chromes stuff. You can find Ness stuff under many labels.
Check closely first if you really don't want it.
Ironhorse
Scoots) wrote:
>>I hope other companies learn from this. It's too late for
>>>Ness.
>>
>>But a mini windfall for Custom Chrome.
>>
>
>Ness makes Custom Chromes stuff. You can find Ness stuff under many labels.
>Check closely first if you really don't want it.
Mmmmmmmmmary are you actually sucking Ness's dick or do you just want
to? You still never answered my question, Who made you queen of
scoots?
Ironhorse
HSB #96
Original Keeper of the Redheads
Custom 96" something or other built by myself
Servicar Trike(s) My wife's the Pepperlady
Ron Christian
Steve Reyer <stev...@datasync.com> wrote:
>Cuz Mary is on AOL, there's been a thread about missing Usenet stuff
>on AOL server, specially in RMH. It's kinda like the "the dog ate my
>homework" excuse of our youth...
...yeah, except anyone with web access can get the stuff they missed
on dejanews. And, the interface is superior to AOL's horrible news reader.
"The dog ate my homework", indeed.
Ron
--
[www.europa.com/~ronc]
"CBS News could make a simple change and save the network millions of
dollars. Turn Dan Rather's teleprompter around." -- Oliver
Mary Queen of Scoots
>concerns
>over products, which Preacher did fairly.
What's wrong with having two sides of the story out there? If you're at a bar
and hear someone totally trashing someone you know, are you just going to say
"yeah, he's an asshole." No, you'll call him up, tell him what you heard and
ask him his side. Hell, I've got to buy parts from his too and wanted to know
what was up for my own sake. Then next time you're in the bar you'll try to
present his side, whatever it may be. Hey, I didn't write the letter. Everyone
else can then come to their own conclusions. This is sharing information over
concerns.
>
>I also find it unbelievable that Ness would have a person doing PR for them,
>who
>would write a letter meant for an individual, to be posted on a public forum
>which,
>rather than apologizing for faulty product and customer services, would
>critisize
>that customer for their use of freedom of speech, and then proceed to
>politely call
>Preacher a liar.
I don't know the truth of the situation here. All I do know is that there are
at least two sides to every story. Why not hear them both and make your own
decision. This is a public forum. They wanted to present their side. I don't
necessarily agree with their side. I just forwarded it for them.
Also, if you don't want the public to see your posts, don't make them. There
are people here who forward me posts from other people. You can put anyone's
address in the "send via email" line. That's what it's for. I like to be kept
informed about what others are saying about me. If they're just misinformed or
only partially right, I like being able to tell them my side of the story. I'm
sure others would also like the chance.
BTW here's the return and warranty information at Ness. Just FYI.
http://www.arlenness.com/company.htm
Manfun9512
pretty major turnaround in company policy.
This internet shit is great!
Ken Schofield
>
> >I hope other companies learn from this. It's too late for
> >>Ness.
> >
> >But a mini windfall for Custom Chrome.
> >
>
> Ness makes Custom Chromes stuff. You can find Ness stuff under many labels.
> Check closely first if you really don't want it.
I may be mistaken, but...
Ness does NOT manufacture parts for CCI, Drag Specialties, Kury Akyn,
etc...
Nor does CCI etc., repackage Ness components under the generic CCI
brand or any other label for that matter.
Ness DOES sell his own line of products which are manufactured
exclusively from his own designs/toolings through the major
distributors/retailers of motorcycle accessories (CCI included) and
through AN affiliated parts and custom shops. AN products are clearly
labeled as such, as are Drag Specialties, etc...
This assertion you're making is very misleading. One would believe from
your post that if you were buying a generic CCI part, it may be an Arlen
Ness product. This is not the case.
Rick
No parts, just cash please.
Mary Queen of Scoots <mmmar...@aol.comspam> wrote in message
news:20000118214751...@ng-ch1.aol.com...
> >>Ness could not
> >>respond here as they don't have a news server.
> >
> >You mean to tell me that Ness, cannot afford a news server? Give me a
break.
> >Arlens' has a Rolex that cost more than the most expensive, chromed
dipped
> >Harley.
> >
> >Stone
>
> News servers don't cost a cent. Have you seen their website? They're not
the
> most computer literate people around. They haven't set it up.
>
> I see you guys have really missed bitching at someone, namely me. I was
just
> passing the posts on so Ness could respond to the allegations. This is a
bikers
> forum. When I say "Ness," I mean the company not Arlen personally. I am
not
> siding with him INRE the chrome issue. I just don't see him bashing the
> Preacher in his email.
Hemipower
mmmar...@aol.comspam (Mary Queen of Scoots) writes:
>>I hope other companies learn from this. It's too late for
>>>Ness.
>>
>>But a mini windfall for Custom Chrome.
>>
>
>Ness makes Custom Chromes stuff.
Well that sucks. I did however notice that his name
seems to be afiliated with Drag Specialties too.
You can find Ness stuff under many labels.
>Check closely first
Does anyone know what company/s I can purchase
brake and clutch controls and other assorted goodies
where that ness guy won't see a PENNY of?
if you really don't want it.
After what Preacher just went through I Really,Really don't
want it.
Hemipower
mmmar...@aol.comspam (Mary Queen of Scoots) writes:
>All I do know is that there are
>at least two sides to every story.
I guess we're still waiting for ness's response.
How long should we wait?
Preacher
to have disappeared in Cyber Space. I cc'd it to Paul but that letter may
not have made it either. If *MARY* want's to forward *this* one to Paul, she
has my permission to do so. THIS TIME. Hell, she might as well. She's stuck
her big nose in my business *without* my permission already, and pretty well
destroyed my "master plan" too. And while you're at it MARY, why don't you
ask Paul where my mirrors are.... that he promised to me in 3 days.... and
it's been *14* days now... and counting. I have added a few small edits to
this letter over my first draft. If this letter has actually made it to RMH,
I apologize for the duplicate. My bad. And thanks for everyone's support on
this one. It's pretty obvious who is right and who is wrong in this issue.
And Mary just put herself in some BAD company IMO.
Preacher)
Mary Queen of Scoots wrote:
>This is the response to the original post about Arlen Ness from Ness. I'm
>posting it here as he couldn't get it to the Preacher. Ness sent me this
>when I forwarded to him the posts from the newsgroup.
Preacher's Response:
The following article posted by "Mary Queen of Scoots" from Paul Gomez (Of
"Arlen's" in San Leandro CA) is about the biggest crock of shit I've ever
seen. Paul is flat out lying on a number of counts and I will explain them
below. Since Mary and Paul have decided to air this in public I feel my
response to Paul should be made public as well. I have carbon copied (cc:)
Paul Gomez with this letter as well.
Paul Gomez also fails to mention that he promised me that my mirrors would
be shipped to "my front door" in *3* days. It has as of this writing been
*13* days. And still no mirrors. That in itself shows me, and should show
you, the *lack* of customer service and satisfaction that Paul so staunchly
and proudly (but falsely) promotes. Paul *and* Mary also fail to mention or
take note that Paul has my HOME PHONE NUMBER and said he would call me if
there was a problem. It appears that there is indeed A PROBLEM! Then,
rather then call me personally, Paul decides it would somehow be beneficial
to him to post this publicly. He's trying to save his ass and it just bit
him squarely in that location. The squeaky wheel gets the grease. Squeak
squeak squeak squeak squeak.
Paul starts:
> Hello Preacher,
> I do understand your frustration with problems you have had in the past
> with our product as expressed when you visited our retail store.
That's understandable Paul, I believe I made my thoughts VERY clear on this
issue to everyone involved, including the counterman, Leo, You (Paul), and
Arlen. But I don't think you truly "understand my frustration" at all. Do
you understand how frustrating it is to have to pull my gas tanks off, my
rocker boxes off, my rocker arm assemblies off, and my pushrod out... just
to replace a set of pushrod tubes that *continually* go bad in a matter of
approximately 3 months? Do you REALLY understand that? Do you understand how
frustrating it is to have to take your bike apart to that degree due to a
bad part even though you paid top dollar for that part and expected it to be
superior to the Taiwanese crap that's out there... but it's NOT? Hell, my
*stock* pushrod tubes were fine when I replaced them with Arlen Ness Chrome
Billet pushrod tubes.
So Paul, do you REALLY understand? I don't think you do. You may realize how
infuriated I am, but I really don't think you know how frustrated I am.
> I am quite
> surprised that you would express such negative thoughts in the manner
above
> after accepting our solution from us by your handshake at the end of our
> conversation.
That's an outright lie Paul. All of it. Not only did I not "accept" *your*
solution (not *our* solution, as in yours and mine) but there was NO
handshake that I remember regards to MY claimed "acceptance" of *your*
solution. In fact Paul, as our conversation was taking place I told you "you
do what *you* think is right and I'll do what *I* think is right." Well you
apparently thought *your* solution was right and I obviously think that
telling the world how I was treated by "Arlen's" is right. You made your
bed, now you lay in it. What I think is right might not be agreeable to you
but that's life my friend.
IF there was a handshake, and I still don't remember one, it was purely due
to any good manners I had left in my soul (if you extended your hand, I
WOULD NOT disrespect you and refuse to shake your hand) and the fact that I
was sorry for *having*to yell and carry one over this issue, NOT because I
"accepted" your so called "solution". I say I was sorry for *having* to get
mad, not for getting mad. I would like to make that clear. Had the situation
been resolved as it has always been resolved in the past I would not have
HAD to get angry. That's how I see it.
You see, *I* think I need to tell the whole world about the poor customer
satisfaction and service I received from Paul Gomez and Arlen Ness (and
company) at "Arlen's" in San Leandro Calif. Yes, it is my opinion that I
received LOUSY, TERRIBLE, customer service and a TOTAL lack of satisfaction.
And as I stated in a prior article to this Newsgroup, I was going to wait
until I got my mirrors in hand before I told the full and complete story.
As of this writing, I have only told bits and pieces of what happened and
have
made that quite clear in stating my opinion.
Well Paul, since I haven't received my mirrors within the 3 days that you
*promised*, I feel I am being more then fair and subjective in this matter.
I could blast Paul, Leo, Arlen, and Cory for a heck of a lot more then I
have so far. When I tell my side of the story from start to finish, it will
be nothing but factual truth and my opinion. I will let the *people* decide
"who did who" wrong. That shouldn't bother or frighten you Paul, not if you
didn't do anything wrong.
> Unfortunately you left out the fact that we acknowledged that chromed
> billet does carry a risk of periodic failure
No sir, not true. I made it clear to this group that both you and Arlen made
the statement that "Billet is harder to chrome then most aluminum" and that
you made the statement "what do you expect, a lifetime guaranty?" You and I
both know that the statement that billet aluminum is pure fiction and you
can't deny that. You were trying to bullshit me and you bullshitted the
wrong person. Billet Aluminum is nothing more then a solid chunk of aluminum
and the part is machined out of, rather then poured into a mold forged.
There is nothing more complicated with plating billet then with any other
aluminum product. I'm sure you know that well and I'm not telling you
anything new. The fact is that the problems have almost entirely been with
the pushrod tubes and the mirrors. So if Billet is so difficult to plate,
why hasn't any of the other Arlen's accessories given me the same problems
the above items mentioned have? Because your contention is false and purely
fiction, that's why.
It's not true and it's my opinion that you are either using an inferior
quality alloy for the pushrod tubes/mirrors and/or your chrome plating
contractor isn't doing their job properly in prepping the item. It's very
possible that the items are not being cleaned adequately after dipping them
in one solution and starting the next process in the plating.
What this all falls back to is your companies policy, or lack thereof. The
fact is, if anyone but Steve had exchanged those items last time I exchanged
them I would have received the same satisfaction that I received in the past
5-6 situations regarding my pushrods.
It is my opinion that you (and Arlen) are trying to make me suffer the
consequences for Arlen's misfortune in hiring "Steve" who apparently was
stealing from Arlen (by Arlen's own admission). Steve *may* have been a
crook, but he knew how to take care of a dissatisfied customer. I've never
felt like I had better service on a returned part then when Steve helped me
out. The fact that Arlen accuses him of stealing is NOT my problem. It's
yours. (yours as in "Arlen's retail outlet')
> and that we have developed a
> program to resolve problems as described above above.
A program which YOU admitted wasn't stated to me and should have been. Those
were your words son. The fact is, I was not told about it at the point of
sale and therefore is SHOULD NOT APPLY TO ME. Past policy has always been to
*replace* the items with no questions asked. At least Steve knew what
customer satisfaction was. Can you say the same for yourself? I don't think
so. You were combative right from the start of our initial contact. I
attribute that to the fact that "Steve" wrote up the tag I brought in and
you had been advised of that by Leo before you came out from the back room.
> You also forgot to
> mention that one of our main chromers is the same shop chroming H/D and
S&S
> products!
I "forgot to mention that"? If you for one instant think that I know who
your plater has contracts for/with, you are sadly mistaken and flattering
yourself. And unnecessarily at that. In truth it doesn't matter *who* else
they plate parts for. I'm having a problem with *your* product, not S&S's or
H-D's product. Arlen Ness products, and to be more precise, the pushrod
tubes and the mirrors. I have counted 20 Ness products that are on my bike
at the present time. Out of those 20 items 12 of them have been *relatively*
problem free. At least in the first year that your warranty period covers. 8
of those 20 items have had to be exchanged for bad chrome for a total of 20
times. That's not to good if you ask my opinion.
If you are proud of that record I truly feel for you. Oddly enough I've
*never* had a problem with any of the Harley-Davidson Motor Company products
which you so proudly associate yourself with. (you say you use the same
chrome plater as H/D does)
>We do reserve the right to resolve such matters by rechrome
> and/or replacement of parts, especially when they are 2 weeks short of a
> year!
I realize what your policy states and you are FULLY within the rights of
your written policy. I have never debated that issue. I have already said
that to this group, I make no claim to the contrary. However your statement
of it being 2 weeks shy of a year is WEAK at best. Here are some facts for
you Paul. I tried to explain this to you at the store but apparently you had
no interest in what I had to say. The fact is that I bought the products in
question on Jan. 30, 1999. I went into the hospital for back surgery on
February 4, 1999, just 4 or 5 days later. Between 1/30/99 and 2/4/99 I was
getting my affairs in order and having pre-op tests performed. There was no
time to install the items during that short period of time and since I was
expected to be bed bound for a time after surgery, it wasn't an issue. Due
to complications during surgery I ended up staying in the hospital for 10
days and was flat on my back for another 2 months after being released from
the hospital. That means the *soonest* that those parts COULD have been
installed on my bike was April 14th, 1999 which wasn't the case. I can
assure you that I was in no condition to work on my bike for at LEAST
another month after that period and they in fact were not installed on the
bike until well after that month and I was ambulatory. Which means they were
installed after approximately May 15th, some 4 months later. That cuts your
year down to 8 months so far. You also fail to mention in your letter that
I explained to you that the
parts went bad after THREE short months of being installed on the bike. Your
"2 weeks shy of a year" just got cut down to three months pal. Now, if I
pulled all the bad parts I've bought from Arlen's off of my bike as soon as
they went bad I'd have my bike down more then up. No sir, I wait until my
year warranty period is just short of expiring and only *then* do I return
them. Otherwise I'd be pulling my pushrod tubes off of my bike every three
months (4 times per year!) as opposed to only once a year.
Which makes more sense to you Paul? The fact is, you have a stated implied
warranty of ONE YEAR. If I brought those pieces in ONE DAY before my year
had expired, it would matter NOT. One year is ONE YEAR.
You also attempted to make this same point in person as well and apparently
you don't understand the concept of ONE YEAR. One year is 365 days. NOT 350
days, not 364 days... but THREE HUNDRED AND SIXTY FIVE DAYS. Do you
understand what "one year" means yet Paul?
Get over it. It's *your* warranty, not mine. I didn't twist anyone's arm to
write that policy, I didn't force anyone to make that policy, it was a
business decision made by someone in your business. I am only trying to
enforce it, which you seem hesitant to honor. Because of two weeks? Or
because Steve wrote the tag? Isn't it odd how the first counter man threw up
his arms and said "it's out of my hands" as soon as I told him Steve wrote
the tag. And isn't it odd how Leo did *exactly* the same thing when *he*
found out who wrote the ticket?
It seems mighty odd to me. Strange indeed.
> We are committed to exhausting every avenue available to enhance the
> quality of our product on a daily basis.
Horseshit. You yourself said you've been using the same chromer since day
one and that Steve was full of shit when he told me Arlen's change chrome
platers. It's obvious that I'm not the only person with this problem so what
have you done to "enhance the quality of your product" if you haven't
changed platers like Steve said.
> EVERYONE who chromes billet has
> similar problems, very few are willing to admit it as we do.
Oddly enough I get better quality chrome from vendors such as CCI, Drag
Specialties, and other such companies that have a reputation for having
inferior products. As to whether they admit to their return rate is beyond
my capability but I find it odd that I am constantly returning Ness products
but have NEVER had to return one of the other companies products. Even after
multiple years. How odd that a company as well known as Arlen's has a far
worse return rate then those companies that are deemed "inferior." You are
putting yourself in bad company my friend. Ask Brian Hannah what the return
rate is on the chrome where he's employed now.
> It is unfortunate that you find it necessary to carry on, in this manner,
Yes, I'm sure you do feel that it's "unfortunate" that the Internet exists
and a customer can now voice his/her opinion or anecdote of a situation and
be heard all the way around the world, to an audience of MILLIONS. Times
have change Paul. No longer does a dissatisfied customer only have a
listening audience of a few, it's now a FEW MILLION. Isn't the Internet a
wonderful thing? I think so.
> against our company and Arlen after you agreed to a mutual fair solution.
Where do you get that idea from? That we "agreed to a mutual fair solution"?
The only thing I agreed to was that I wouldn't bitch about the shifter peg
that you said was to minor to replace. I conceded that it was minor enough
that if you didn't replace it I wouldn't complain about it. Why is it that I
was so accommodating but you are fighting my legal right to ask that you
honor your own stated warranty? There was never any agreement on *my* part
regarding the mirrors. You told me that you would send them to the chrome
shop and see what they said about them. It was left at that. I am satisfied
with the results of the exchange with the pushrod tubes, the oil pressure
gauge mounting bracket, and the oil pressure gauge cone. I'm NOT satisfied
at the attitude you people took, or at the anger level I had to achieve in
order to get those results. There should have been no questions asked. You
saw the pits and bad chrome, there was NO QUESTION that it was bad. But yet
you all copped a attitude as soon as "Steve" was mentioned. And that was
after I talked to Arlen at the International Motorcycle Show and told him of
my problem. He said then "bring them on down to the shop, we'll take care of
you NO PROBLEM". I'm sorry, but this sure does feel like a problem to me!
Oh, and yeah, he "took care of me", that's for sure!
For you to stand there at the counter and tell me "this is as good as it
gets" with on *obvious* flaw in a mirror was totally preposterous. You and I
both know that those pits will only get WORSE with time and are just the
*start* of the problem.
Then you to tried to convince me that it was "road damage". That was pure
BULLSHIT and I called you on it. When I insisted that you look me straight
in the eye and tell me it was "road damage" you COULDN'T, could you?!
Because you know as well as I do that it is bubbling from within, caused
from outgassing. The fact is, the company you contract with to plate your
items didn't prep the alloy correctly and the results are what you see in my
mirrors, pushrod tubes, Oil Pressure Gauge mounting assembly, shifter pegs,
and all the other items I've had to exchange in the past.
Then you mentioned that it was a year already when you could plainly see
that it was less then a year. Now you continue to try and avoid your
responsibility by making the same claim that it was "just shy of a year".
Again Paul, ONE YEAR IS ONE YEAR! 365 DAYS!
> It would have been nice if ALL details discussed would have been included.
As I stated in the rec.motorcycles.harley news forum before "Mary Queen of
Scoots" stuck her big nose into this issue, I was going to give you the
benefit of the doubt and see what you sent me in regards to my mirrors. I
was going to wait until *after* my mirrors arrived before I made a full
statement on this issue but "Mary Queen of Scoots" took it upon herself to
forward you a post, or posts, (for reasons that baffle me) and I can't be
sure if she sent them ALL to you or not. She seems to be VERY selective in
editing posts by viewing her past history on Usenet. So probably not knowing
"Mary's" record. Apparently "Mary Queen of Scoots" enjoys creating problems
and Chaos as is evidenced by her continued attacks on Easyrider Magazine and
some of it's former staff, one of which she is apparently a spurned
girlfriend. Check her record via Dejanews.com, I"m sure you'll be
"impressed" with her. She talks more trash then a Chinese radio station in
Russia. That's some fine company you've put yourself in Paul.
Once I get my mirrors back in my possession I will definitely send you every
single post that I have mentioned your name in regarding *this* incident. I
have them archived on disk and that was my plan from the beginning. "Mary"
seems to have jumped the gun prematurely and circumvented that plan. Why?
My guess is to suck up to another big name since she has totally alienated
herself from Paisano Publications and Easyriders Magazine. She "needs" to
feel important and I suppose this is her way of trying to accomplish that.
Poor poor Mary.
> However, there are thousands of enthusiast around that world that
> appreciate our honesty, Arlen and his work.
If the public responses that I have seen generated on rec.motorcycles.harley
by this exchange are any indication of your supporters, those alleged people
are either (a) being nice (b) and/or don't want to hurt Arlen's feelings, or
(c) are liars. You might want to read Usenet and see for yourself. There
have been NO positive (pro-Ness) replies and many MANY negative (anti-Ness)
replies. Your allegation that you don't have access to Usenet is ludicrous.
Go to Dejanews.com via the WWW and you can view every single article posted
in usenet except the ones that wish to remain unarchived by using the "X-no
archive=yes" option.
So where *are* those "thousands of enthusiasts" when you need them? Are
they *all* computer illiterate? I would think not since in my opinion most
of them are in a socioeconomic demographic group of middle to upper class
white males. Is that a pretty good guess Paul? My guess is that they all
own computers too. Better rally the troops Paul.
> This continued acceptance and
> support of our product line and designs is confirmation that we are on the
> right track including how we view customer satisfaction.
I disagree. I believe you *were* on the right track in the past but with
your "new" un-stated policy of examining a obviously inferior part with a
microscope you are headed down the path of ruin and despair.
Now, you need to understand something Paul. There have been MANY times that
I have stood up for Arlen Ness and "Arlen's" parts on this very Newsgroup. I
have stuck my neck out and given the man praise a number of times, more
times then I can remember. I have defended his honor, his work, his
merchandise. I have sent you MANY customers in the past, either directly or
via mail order. I have recommend you more times then I can count. I have
always praised your *past* staff for doing a GREAT job. In the past if I had
*any* problem with a Ness item the exchange policy has *ALWAYS* been to
replace them with off the shelf items with NO questions asked. Period. I
could not ask for better service and that is one of the reasons I continued
to purchase Arlen Ness products. And I have purchased many. Not so many by
number, but by dollars spent. I have directed many people to Arlen's Paul.
But after this last encounter it will be a LONNNNG time, if EVER before I
ever sent another person to "Arlen's".
I just bought a new second bike and had planned on purchasing some Ness
items for it. Not now I won't. You will never see another penny of my money.
Never. I will never wear my Arlen Ness shirt advertising your product again.
I will be sure to tell my story to anyone who listens. And you can believe
that people know I am a straight shooter and *will* listen to my story and
give it credibility.
> Sincerely,
You may have noticed that I've only stated the facts and/or my personal
opinion in this matter. I noticed you have "embellished" the story quite a
bit to fit your needs. I will simply tell the truth to the good folks around
the world and I'll let *them* be the best judge of your sincerity in regards
to your claim of customer satisfaction.
Once I receive my mirrors as promised (which are ten days late by the way),
I will make a final decision on the statement I will make in this forum.
Not just rec.motorcycles.harley but I'll also make that statement in the
alt.motorcycles.harley newsgroup (world wide), the Harley e-mail Digest
(world wide), ba.motorcycles(SF Bay area) three Harley subscription mailing
lists I am subscribed to (1 world wide, 2 local area), and the Virtual Tech
Board (world wide). Who knows, if you surprise me I may stand up and
apologize for anything I may have said and tell the world I was wrong. But
I have a feeling that the only surprise I will get will be a surprise I am
not satisfied with. Go ahead Paul, surprise me!
The surprise I fully expect is that you to send me back one of my mirrors in
the same condition that you received it in telling me "that's as good as it
gets". What will it be Paul? A good surprise or a bad surprise? It's your
choice. But of course there's always small claims court if you don't fulfill
your legal obligations. And gee, since I'm disabled and don't work I have
all the time in the world on my hands!
Just remember this Paul. The Internet makes the world a very small place.
They say the best advertising is "word of mouth". That is also true of the
worst advertising. It works both ways.
The ball's in your court my man,
Preacher
cc: Paul Gomez
Director of Sales
pa...@arlenness.com (PAUL)
Mary Queen of Scoots
>> >>Ness.
>> >
>> >But a mini windfall for Custom Chrome.
>> >
>>
>> Check closely first if you really don't want it.
>
<snip>
>This assertion you're making is very misleading. One would believe from
>your post that if you were buying a generic CCI part, it may be an Arlen
>Ness product. This is not the case.
>
>Ken
>HSB#07 WOLF#13 BS#92 AH#70
Check closely. Last month I helped a friend pack up their entire store. It was
mainly Custom Chrome, Drag Specialties, Ness and their own brand name parts. I
had to do inventory when I placed the parts back in the box. Some Ness stuff
was repackaged. I do know that CC and DS do sell Ness parts and generally keep
the label on the parts. CC does contract out for other parts, which are made by
Ness and even my friend. You wouldn't know where it was coming from.
Also, if Ness is using the same chromer as CC, it looks like you'll be getting
the same chroming anyway. The chroming is the problem, right?
Gareth
Preacher wrote:
> Mary Queen of Scoots wrote:
(Well she's a fucking idiot, so we won't be requoting any of her nonsense
here...)
> > I have sent you MANY customers in the past, either directly or
> >via mail order.
I'll vouch for this, I'm one of 'em. I went there only because Preacher spoke up
for them and convinced me to go there. I dropped close on $500 in that visit. It
wouldn't have happened without his reccomendation. Part of that $500 was guess
what ? That's right, chrome pushrod tubes. And guess what ? One of them fucking
leaked because of a bad machined edge.
I took 'em back. Did they replace them ? Did they fuck. I was told that I'd have
to live with it. I ended up getting a machinist to fix the bad one.
As for Preacher. Only known the guy for two years, but he ain't afraid to call
bullshit when he sees it. I'd take his word sight unseen. He's been a loyal
booster for Arlen as long as I've known him, and they must have pissed him off
*real* bad to get him this fired up. It would have cost them fuck all to just
stand by their warantee and just give him a replacement set of mirrors.
That's why I shop at Frisco Cycles. If it's bad, it gets replaced. No bullshit,
just good business.
----------------------------------------------------------------
Gareth - 94 XL - 77 FXE - 83 FXSB - DM#2 - AH#102
----------------------------------------------------------------
Curly Larry and
wrote:
>Preacher ,
> It seems they took pretty good care of you replacing 20 different
>items. I mean thats a lot of money they are out. <snip>
Your logic eludes me. Taking pretty good care by replacing 20 items?
20? TWENTY???? INHO that's not care, that's abuse. They wouldn't be
out anything if they produced a quality product to begin with.
I was thinking about a couple of Ness clean-up items for the frame on
my dresser, but now I don't know. Why give myself the grief?
--
Curly LaJolla
93 FLHS Bark-O-Glide - "As modern as a spaceship"
Lose Larry and Moe to email
Hemipower
mmmar...@aol.comspam (Mary Queen of Scoots) writes:
>if Ness is using the same chromer as CC, it looks like you'll be getting
>the same chroming anyway.
The chroming is the problem, right?
> _
NO MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMary.
Can't you get it through your thick skull. I believe the problem
stems from Ness trying to B.S the situation telling him
it was how he rides but mainly the fact that he would not
warranty the parts because the warranty was only good for
two more weeks.
Don't you read what is said or is it a comprehension problem????
No wonder you can't keep a BF. You can't operate on looks alone
forever.
BTW If you going to spew this shit can't you at least buy a drink
once in awhile to help wash it down?
Mary Queen of Scoots
>>the same chroming anyway.
>
>The chroming is the problem, right?
>> _
>
>NO MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMary.
>Can't you get it through your thick skull. I believe the problem
>stems from Ness trying to B.S the situation
> Hemipower
The chrome plating is the problem with the actual Ness parts. If Ness is using
the same chromer as CC, you will have the same problems with the parts though
maybe not with the service. Ness is actually easier when it comes to returns
than CC and especially Drag Specialities. Check out their policies. I know this
because Ness accepted all returns from one shop for cash, CC only gave credits
and DS charged a repackaging, reshelving fee and then only gave the credit.
A few chrome notes. Mind you I'm no pro: The chrome plater polishes the metal
first which can damage the part if he overpolishes/grinds or the part goes
flying from the wheel. I just had to return 50% of the parts which I had
chromed that I bought from a shop because the chrome guy dropped one,
overground another and pinched the holes in another.
Then they chrome the part. Sometimes they accidentally add too much chrome or
chrome the part that's not supposed to be chromed, such as the part that's
supposed be line up to another part. I had two more pieces that had to be
returned for these reasons as they wouldn't fit. One guy added thicker chrome I
think to cover up the big gash from where it flew off the polishing wheel. The
thing chipped and peeled while trying to put it on. These parts were new and in
perfect condition when they were dropped off. Chrome is really an art form.
Phil Boutros
>
>Does anyone know what company/s I can purchase
>brake and clutch controls and other assorted goodies
>where that ness guy won't see a PENNY of?
Hum...how about Harley-Davidson <g>?
Phil
--
AH#61 Wolf#14 bs#89 bus#1 KoB/CoT#75 ph...@total.net
http://www.total.net/~philb http://eddiekieger.com
"Power To The People" - BPP EKIII will ride with me again.
Larry Boyd aka Roofwalker
wrote:
> Also, if you don't want the public to see your posts, don't make them. There
> are people here who forward me posts from other people. You can put anyone's
> address in the "send via email" line. That's what it's for. I like to be kept
> informed about what others are saying about me. If they're just misinformed or
> only partially right, I like being able to tell them my side of the story. I'm
> sure others would also like the chance.
But you still haven't answered my question.
Did ask Preacher before you forwarded his comments to AN?
Yeh I know his words are in public but it's just common courtesy to ASK
BEFORE YOU BUTT YOUR ASS IN WHERE IT MAY NOT BE WANTED.
Based on Preacher's subsequent posts the answer seems obvious.
Big D.
--
Asshole #38, DM #1, FHBE #4 and ROMSSL
'99 R1100RT
'99 VTR1000F (The X-Wing)
Visit the Snake Ranch at: http://www.mindspring.com/~larryboyd/
Preacher
>Preacher, ping me with a good email addy. Remove the xspam from mine.
It's on the way... but you've written me before so you *might* have it and
not know it!
Preacher
Preacher
>Preacher wrote:
>
>> Mary Queen of Scoots wrote:
>
I highly recommend Frisco Cycles. They will treat you right.
Hey guys, I wonder if "MMMary Queen of Scunts" is forwarding all of *these*
posts to Arlen's too?
If not, WHY NOT? How very odd. Only *my* post "trashing" Arlen's??? Very
strange if you ask me.
Come on MMMary, I'd like an answer to that question. It's not just a
rhetorical question. It *deserves* an answer.
Preacher - AH #89
Preacher
>.Phil B. wrote:
>><Hemipower wrote:
>>>Does anyone know what company/s I can purchase
>>>brake and clutch controls and other assorted goodies
>>>where that ness guy won't see a PENNY of?
>>
>> Hum...how about Harley-Davidson <g>?
>>
>>Phil
>
>You still may have the same chrome problem. The same people that actually
make
>Custom Chrome and Ness parts also supply Harley.
Mary, you are so full of shit your eyes are brown. Did you actually read
Paul's letter?? He said the same company chrome plates items for Drag
Specialties and Harley-Davidson, he didn't say that the MAKE them.
You're a total idiot and you are just getting yourself in deeper and deeper
with each lie you tell. You haven't got the slightest idea what you're
talking about and you are trying to dig your way out of deep a hole by
bullshitting everyone.
And all you do is just keep throwing the dirt on top of your head and
burying yourself deeper.
>Harley just charges you more
>for the same Custom Chrome part with even the same part number.
WRONG Buckwheat! I've directly compared H-D merchandise and CCI merchandise,
and there ARE differences. They are NOT the same product. They are also
plated by different companies, just read Paul's letter again. Notice he
makes no mention of their plater (Arlen's and CCI) being one and the same?
Can you actually read or are you just ultra selective at what you WANT to
read?
>There was even
>a thread in here about that. There is no escape from the globalized
motorcycle
>part market. Yeah, the parts aren't even made in the US.
According to Arlen his parts are all made in the USA. But CCI is primarily
made in Taiwan. BUT...... how can that be? You just said that they're made
by the same company!
Deeper and deeper you go....
Preacher - AH #89
Preacher
>>>if Ness is using the same chromer as CC, it looks like you'll be getting
>>>the same chroming anyway.
>>
>>The chroming is the problem, right?
>>> _
>>
>>NO MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMary.
>>Can't you get it through your thick skull. I believe the problem
>>stems from Ness trying to B.S the situation
>
>> Hemipower
>
>The chrome plating is the problem with the actual Ness parts.
True, the chrome plating is the problem with the actual Ness *parts*. But
that's not *my* problem. *My* problem is that I'm getting a shitload of
grief from the Management at Arlen's because (a) the parts are "two weeks
shy of a year old" or (b) because a former employee that is accused of theft
is the person that wrote my last receipt.
Neither of which is *my* fault, therefore not *my* problem. But Arlen/Paul
are trying to make it *my* problem. And you are aiding them.
>If Ness is using the same chromer as CC,
He IS NOT. Get it through your thick fucking skull lady. Read Paul's letter
AGAIN. There is NO mention of them having the same plater.
Read woman, READ.
>you will have the same problems with the parts though
>maybe not with the service. Ness is actually easier when it comes to
returns
>than CC and especially Drag Specialties.
REALLY!?? You could'a fooled me. I've never been refused a return on a Drag
or CCI part that was within written policy.... in fact, I've never had to
return/exchange a CCI or DS part because I've NEVER had one fail!
But yet I've had 20 Ness items fail! How ODD! How "strange"! That "cheap
Taiwanese CRAP" that CCI/DS sells holds up better then the High Priced
American Made CRAP that Ness sells!
How ironic.
>Check out their policies.
I have. I have stated it here. So why won't they adhere to their own written
policy? That's ALL that I'm asking for. Stick to their own policy. It
doesn't matter what CCI or DS policy is, that's not the issue. But you're
trying to avert attention away from that fact by bringing everyone BUT Ness
into this.
>I know this
>because Ness accepted all returns from one shop for cash,
THAT is BULLSHIT. Ness's policy is NO RETURNS. Exchanges or Store Credits
ONLY. I know, I bought a Ness Taillight that was supposed to be chrome
plated and was labeled as such. When I opened it up it was plain aluminum. I
went back to the store and wanted to return it. Alice told me there were "No
returns" even though by law that has to be posted in plain view of the
purchasing counter, and it ISN'T. My wife was with me and she has 12 years
of management in the retail business behind her. She knows the laws well and
she started to get pissed and started arguing with Alice about it. I wanted
something else anyway so I told her to drop it, I'd just apply it towards
the other parts.
So as far as your "cash returns" you are as full of shit as a horse stable.
You lady, and I use the term loosely, are lying IMO.
>CC only gave credits
>and DS charged a repackaging, reshelving fee and then only gave the credit.
If' that's their "stated policy" then what's the big deal. And it is, look
in any CCI or DS catalog.
>A few chrome notes. Mind you I'm no pro: The chrome plater polishes the
metal
>first which can damage the part if he overpolishes/grinds or the part goes
>flying from the wheel. I just had to return 50% of the parts which I had
>chromed that I bought from a shop because the chrome guy dropped one,
>overground another and pinched the holes in another.
>
>Then they chrome the part. Sometimes they accidentally add too much chrome
or
>chrome the part that's not supposed to be chromed, such as the part that's
>supposed be line up to another part. I had two more pieces that had to be
>returned for these reasons as they wouldn't fit. One guy added thicker
chrome I
>think to cover up the big gash from where it flew off the polishing wheel.
The
>thing chipped and peeled while trying to put it on. These parts were new
and in
>perfect condition when they were dropped off. Chrome is really an art form.
The above story wreaks of lies. Yes, you are NO PRO. At least not when it
comes to Chrome Plating. You should read up on the process before you try to
bullshit your way around a place where there are knowledgeable people on the
subject.
There is NO SUCH thing as "overpolishing(sic)" the bare metal. The better
the base, the better the finished product. Polishing between coatings is
another story but I can't think of ONE chrome plating business that has
someone incompetent enough on the polishing line to over-polish one of the
three coats needed to chrome plate a part. It's critical enough that you
would NEVER put a novice on the buffing wheel.
And that takes away your allegations of the part "flying from the wheel"
too. These guys aren't home platers, they're professionals. If you took
something to be plated to a business that had someone like that on a buffing
wheel, you got what you deserved.
You still try to bullshit your way out of this hole, eh?
Keep going MMMary. You're just looking more and more like a fool.
Preacher - AH #89
Preacher
>Check closely. Last month I helped a friend pack up their entire store. It
was
>mainly Custom Chrome, Drag Specialties, Ness and their own brand name
parts. I
>had to do inventory when I placed the parts back in the box. Some Ness
stuff
>was repackaged. I do know that CC and DS do sell Ness parts and generally
keep
>the label on the parts. CC does contract out for other parts, which are
made by
>Ness and even my friend. You wouldn't know where it was coming from.
More lies. CCI markets Ness merchandise under the Ness logo. The do NOT
repackage it, manufacture it, or otherwise have any interest in the process.
Ness on the other hand, DOES sell Drag Specialties items under the Ness/DS
line. And even the employees at Arlen's admit it's pure trash. (look at his
Ness/DS louvered hand controls for a good example)
He is in NO WAY associated with CCI, other then he is a CCI outlet. All that
mean is that he sells CCI merchandise, just like a million other CCI retail
outlets. Hell, my local Harley-Davidson sells CCI merchandise. Does that
make them affiliated with CCI? NO you dimwit!
>Also, if Ness is using the same chromer as CC, it looks like you'll be
getting
>the same chroming anyway.
GET IT THROUGH YOUR THICK FUCKING HEAD! He DOES NOT use the same chromer as
CCI. Paul said he uses the same chrome shop as DS and H/D. NOT CCI.
How fucking DENSE are you woman? Shit, I thought it was blondes that were
*supposed* to be dim. Did all those chemicals you dye your hair with go to
your brain!? I think not, I think you are brainless and therefore just
answered my own question.
>The chroming is the problem, right?
With that part, not THE problem. Can't you get *that* straight either? NO,
THE CHROME IS NOT THE PROBLEM. The fucked up attempt to avoid his
responsibility by Arlen's staff is the problem.
FUCK. I can't believe anyone is so fucking stupid. If the shoe fits, wear
it.
Preacher - AH #89
Larry Boyd aka Roofwalker
wrote:
> Did the Preacher ask me if he could forward my posts to Ness? No. Has anyone
> here ever asked me if they could quote my post in a reply that others could
> see? No. Did the Preacher say that he wanted Ness to know about his posts? Yes.
If you can't understand the difference between someone responding to a
post in the newsgroup and someone forwarding a post to a third party who
isn't involved in the newsgroup you must be stupider than I thought.
> If someone was talking trash about someone you knew, would you go up to the guy
> and say "hey, mind if I tell the fellow you're trashing that you're trashing
> him?" I doubt it. You'd tell your bud what the guy said then help him resolve
> the conflict if he asked. That's what I did.
Doubt it all you want, if someone in this forum was "trashing" one of my
friends you're damn right I'd talk to that person first. Mostly to find
out if he had taken it up with them. If he hadn't I would suggest that he
did. But you can bet your buttinski ass I wouldn't forward such a post
without talking to the author first.
> If the preacher didn't want to make a big thing out of this, he should have
> just emailed the nasty stuff to Ness and his friends instead of posting it here
> for the world to see. If it didn't get resolved, he could have just sued him.
Well damn if the stupid meter isn't creeping even further upward. Why the
hell would Preacher need to email them when he had it out face to face?
I guess you're telling me that you've never had a bad experience with any
company, restaurant, store, etc. that wasn't resolved and then DIDN'T
spread the word to the folks you know. Bullshit. Just another example of
your hypocrisy in action.
Here's some relevant quotations for you:
You said: "Then he wants Ness to know that he's trashing him"
to which
Preacher responded: "Now what the hell are you talking about? I "want
Ness to know that he's trashing him"? Hell, I trashed him to HIS FACE.
How much more can he know?"
> This is a public forum. You don't want the world to see your posts, don't make
> them. Go to dejanews.com There's even a box you can check to "mail this message
> to a friend." If it were illegal or unethical, they wouldn't have that as an
> option.
BWAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAH! I now have a clearer picture of you. You base your
own personal code of ethics on the "they've given me the tool so it's ok
to use it" model. Let me quote you one of my favorite axioms: Just
because it's legal doesn't make it right, just because you can doesn't
mean you should.
Go ahead and rationalize however you wish. I think the majority of folks
see through it.
I'll ask again since you still haven't answered the question.
Did you or did you not discuss this with Preacher before you forward his
post?
A simple yes or no will suffice.
Preacher
MMMary BBBlabbered:
>>> Also, if you don't want the public to see your posts, don't make them.
Big D continued to insist:
>>But you still haven't answered my question.
>>
>>Did ask Preacher before you forwarded his comments to AN?
>>Yeh I know his words are in public but it's just common courtesy to ASK
>>BEFORE YOU BUTT YOUR ASS IN WHERE IT MAY NOT BE WANTED.
>>
>>Based on Preacher's subsequent posts the answer seems obvious.
And MMMary BBBlabbered again:
>Did the Preacher ask me if he could forward my posts to Ness? No.
NOW what the fuck are you talking about?? So what post of *yours* did I
forward to Ness? NONE you BIMBO.
Are you talking about *Paul Gomez's* post?? Because (a) that wasn't *your*
post and (b) as far as I know it didn't go to him because my news reader
won't let me send mail due to my fake ID in the "from" header. I explained
that to you in the preface of my second attempt to send you/Paul a reply.
Maybe you should read it. DuHHHHH!
So MMMary, you're pissing in the wind again! And you're getting ALL WET! You
dipshit.
>Has anyone
>here ever asked me if they could quote my post in a reply that others could
>see?
I don't give a shit about anyone else. YOU are the subject at hand. I was
YOU that decided to start shit.
>No. Did the Preacher say that he wanted Ness to know about his posts? Yes.
First, I am not "The Preacher". That implies I am a man of God and I am not.
I don't pretend to be. I never will pretend to be. The tag Preacher means
"to deliver". Look *that* up in your Funk and Wagonals(sp?).
Second, I don't remember saying I wanted Ness to know about my posts, but I
have archived each and every one and WAS planning to send them ALL to him
once I received my mirrors and decided if the situation was resolved or not.
But you took it upon yourself to forward him a select few of all the posts
generated in the "Ness" threads.
Why don't you quote me where I said I wanted Ness to know about my posts?
Can you do that or are you TOO FUCKING STUPID TO FIGURE OUT HOW!?
>If someone was talking trash about someone you knew,
Oh, I see. NOW you claim to "know" Arlen. I'll have to ask him about that.
Maybe it's one of those cases where *you* know him but he has NO idea who
you are. Am I right?
>would you go up to the guy
>and say "hey, mind if I tell the fellow you're trashing that you're
trashing
>him?" I doubt it.
Well you are WRONG. That's exactly what I'd do. I'm a straight shooter and I
call 'em as I see 'em. And right now I see a stupid fucking bimbo and I'm
calling it.
>You'd tell your bud what the guy said then help him resolve
>the conflict if he asked. That's what I did.
Ah, now he's "your bud". Just how well do you know Arlen? Or is it Paul you
know? I'll bet it's Paul but since he doesn't have "a big name" like Arlen
does you have to imply that it's Arlen that is "your bud".
Gold digger.
>If the preacher didn't want to make a big thing out of this, he should have
>just emailed the nasty stuff to Ness and his friends instead of posting it
here
>for the world to see. If it didn't get resolved, he could have just sued
him.
You haven't been listening, have you? What good would it do to send it to
Ness? It would only fall on deaf ears. I certainly have his attention now
that I've told the whole damn world about his shoddy practice. Do I not?
Your logic is flawed. Excuse me. You have no logic.
>This is a public forum. You don't want the world to see your posts, don't
make
>them.
I don't mind that he saw them. I mind that you stuck your big ass where it
doesn't belong. I mind that you took it upon yourself to be my private
fucking secretary and send my mail to Arlen for me. I mind that you really
fucked up my plan to wait and see what condition my mirrors are in when I
receive them before making a final decision on what I'd tell the world about
the "resolution" between Arlen's (via Paul) and I.
That's what I mind. I mind YOU. Butt out, go deal with your own fucking
business bitch.
>Go to dejanews.com There's even a box you can check to "mail this message
>to a friend." If it were illegal or unethical, they wouldn't have that as
an
>option.
I don't have a problem with the "illegal" part, just the unethical part.
Your logic that because there is a box on Dejanews that allows you to send
it to a friend is ludicrous. It's commonly known Netiquette that you don't
send someone else's mail to someone without the authors permission. That's
called "Unethical" in my book. But hell, with your past behavior regarding
the "Easyrider" issue you've already proven that you are both unethical and
manner-less.
You fail to amuse me. You're a bad joke, but still... not amusing.
Stay tuned for replies to all of your dribble. Didn't your last boyfriend
teach you how to keep it in your mouth? I thought not.
Preacher - AH #89
Larry Boyd aka Roofwalker
wrote:
> I will say something for Arlen Ness right now. I've only known him four or five
> years personally. In that time though he has always been an upstanding guy
> personally and in business.
Is that why we're hearing complaints about his company failure to live up
to their commitments?
FWIW I've never used any Ness stuff. So I personally have no comment on
the quality or customer service.
I just find you to be a pathetic loser whose sole purpose here seems to
be to let us all know who you know so you can inflate your own fragile
ego. You know what, I don't care if you're fucking the queen of England
with a strap-on and giving her husband blow jobs at the same time, you're
still just a sad little girl trying boost her own standing by trying too
hard to "be somebody".
Tony
>In article <20000119132035...@ng-cg1.aol.com>,
>mmmar...@aol.comspam (Mary Queen of Scoots) writes:
>
>>All I do know is that there are
>>at least two sides to every story.
>
>I guess we're still waiting for ness's response.
>How long should we wait?
Don't hold yer breath. Suffocation is a terrible death at best.
Tony - GeezerGlide, BS#45
Mary Queen of Scoots
>But you still haven't answered my question.
>
>Did ask Preacher before you forwarded his comments to AN?
>Yeh I know his words are in public but it's just common courtesy to ASK
>BEFORE YOU BUTT YOUR ASS IN WHERE IT MAY NOT BE WANTED.
>
>Based on Preacher's subsequent posts the answer seems obvious.
>
>Big D.
Did the Preacher ask me if he could forward my posts to Ness? No. Has anyone
here ever asked me if they could quote my post in a reply that others could
see? No. Did the Preacher say that he wanted Ness to know about his posts? Yes.
If someone was talking trash about someone you knew, would you go up to the guy
and say "hey, mind if I tell the fellow you're trashing that you're trashing
him?" I doubt it. You'd tell your bud what the guy said then help him resolve
the conflict if he asked. That's what I did.
If the preacher didn't want to make a big thing out of this, he should have
just emailed the nasty stuff to Ness and his friends instead of posting it here
for the world to see. If it didn't get resolved, he could have just sued him.
This is a public forum. You don't want the world to see your posts, don't make
them. Go to dejanews.com There's even a box you can check to "mail this message
to a friend." If it were illegal or unethical, they wouldn't have that as an
option.
Don Teal
<prea...@my.house.in.CA> wrote:
Preacher, ping me with a good email addy. Remove the xspam from mine.
--
Don
98 FXD
AH#87 BS#40 DM#4
http://web2.airmail.net/drt/index.html
Support Eddie Kieger III at http://eddiekieger.com
Mary Queen of Scoots
>>
>>Does anyone know what company/s I can purchase
>>brake and clutch controls and other assorted goodies
>>where that ness guy won't see a PENNY of?
>
> Hum...how about Harley-Davidson <g>?
>
>Phil
You still may have the same chrome problem. The same people that actually make
Custom Chrome and Ness parts also supply Harley. Harley just charges you more
for the same Custom Chrome part with even the same part number. There was even
a thread in here about that. There is no escape from the globalized motorcycle
part market. Yeah, the parts aren't even made in the US.
wolfpup
> This is the response to the original post about Arlen Ness from Ness. I'm
> posting it here as he couldn't get it to the Preacher. Ness sent me this when
I
> forwarded to him the posts from the newsgroup.
>
Mary, Mary, Mary, Mary, you poor benighted thing. No matter how hard you try,
girl, you can't possibly fuck everybody in the motorcycle industry.
But you look cute trying it.
--
wolfpup redh...@earthlink.net
AH#62 BS#69 SENS
Mary Queen of Scoots
>posts to Arlen's too?
>
>If not, WHY NOT? How very odd. Only *my* post "trashing" Arlen's??? Very
>strange if you ask me.
>
>Come on MMMary, I'd like an answer to that question. It's not just a
>rhetorical question. It *deserves* an answer.
>
>Preacher -
I actually just showed Paul how to view all the posts in dejanews. I also
advised him not to bother responding to your drivel in this newsgroup. You guys
are just in a frenzy now.
I will say something for Arlen Ness right now. I've only known him four or five
years personally. In that time though he has always been an upstanding guy
personally and in business. When the rest of the guys are gossiping about
people in the industry, he just listens. If he has a problem with someone, he
just deals with that person. He would not go into a public forum and trash the
guy. That's not his style. He has more class than that. Go ahead. Flame away.
Don Teal
<prea...@my.house.in.CA> wrote:
>Don Teal wrote:
>
>>Preacher, ping me with a good email addy. Remove the xspam from mine.
>
>It's on the way... but you've written me before so you *might* have it and
>not know it!
Yeah, I had a Mmmmary moment right after I sent the above. Check your
email.
Don Teal
<prea...@my.house.in.CA> wrote:
>Hey guys, I wonder if "MMMary Queen of Scunts" is forwarding all of *these*
>posts to Arlen's too?
I have it on pretty good authority that this discussion is being
monitored by Ness Inc et al. How much of it gets to Senor Ness is
another question.
Queen of Scunts. LMAO.
Mary Queen of Scoots
>>
>>>Preacher, ping me with a good email addy. Remove the xspam from mine.
>>
>>It's on the way... but you've written me before so you *might* have it and
>>not know it!
>
>Yeah, I had a Mmmmary moment right after I sent the above. Check your
>email.
>Don
Yeah, his MMMARY moment was posting part of this thread on my message board.
Big deal.
Mary Queen of Scoots
>
>>>>if Ness is using the same chromer as CC, it looks like you'll be getting
>>>>the same chroming anyway.
>>>
>>>The chroming is the problem, right?
>>>> _
>>>
>>>NO MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMary.
>>>Can't you get it through your thick skull. I believe the problem
>>>stems from Ness trying to B.S the situation
>>
>>> Hemipower
>>
>>The chrome plating is the problem with the actual Ness parts.
>
>True, the chrome plating is the problem with the actual Ness *parts*. But
>that's not *my* problem. *My* problem is that I'm getting a shitload of
>grief from the Management at Arlen's because (a) the parts are "two weeks
>shy of a year old" or (b) because a former employee that is accused of theft
>is the person that wrote my last receipt.
>
This specific thread had to do with finding parts that aren't made by Ness not
your problem with Ness. Look, I've had Ness stuff before. I had those flame
engraved mirrors and dash and a few other things. Two of the parts pitted on me
in just less than a year or maybe it was over a year. I actually thought it was
my fault for cleaning my bike too much and getting stuck in a sand storm. I
went back to my buddy's shop and the guy replaced it instantly with another one
off the rack. I didn't even have my receipt on me. They just took my word for
it. Maybe you would do better dealing with a distributor or trying another
brand.
I can only think that maybe someone at Ness thinks that something must be up
because you've had so many parts replaced so many times. I'm not calling you a
liar but it does sound a little odd. Having an ex-employee who was a thief sign
your receipt doesn't help matters either. Best of luck in resolving your
situation.
Snarl67
In message-id: <swth4.8$D4....@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net>
"wolfpup" redh...@earthlink.net, sez:
Hmmm, I always thought that when the white stuff started oozin' out of their
ears, it meant they waz full, no?
Snarl...the "nuthin' cute about that" Asshole(tm)
--
Snarl AH#67, BS#37
EKIII Rides with me ...Go Eddie!
http://eddiekieger.com
Mary Queen of Scoots
I'm not wasting any more of my time on this issue. Why don't you just email
Paul directly instead of trying to do it semi-anonymously through the
newsgroup.
The end.
Moses/Ric Flair
Scoots) wrote:
><snipped all the preacher's crap>
>
>I'm not wasting any more of my time on this issue. Why don't you just email
>Paul directly instead of trying to do it semi-anonymously through the
>newsgroup.
MMMMamary why do thrive so much on stirring shit? I mean why do you
screw with so many people? You have to be without a doubt one of the
biggest idiots in the world. How the fuck is it anonymous when Paul
and Arlen Ness know exactly who Preacher is and whats going on. Dont
you have another cause to champion or a company to try and run out of
business? When your current boyfriend dumps you are you going to try
to ruin his company too? Get a life MMMMAmary. At least have enough
decency not to post where preacher lives or a background check on his
mother.
"I want to be the man that killed Hulk Hogan"
Ric Flair. 14 time Heavyweight wrestling champion of the world.
Big Dave
of )him
--
dave 90fl
Snip
MANDKIM
> .-.-.=\-. Mary
> (_)=='(_) Realriders.com
I really dont understand how any of the bike wizards (Ness or private shops
everywhere) make it in the biz world. There is no way that I could ever stay
in business for as long as I have with this kind of biz ethics. I have always
handled my warranties (Shit my warranties are Lifetime). I own a window tinting
business in Arizona (Thetintshopaz.com) for 12 years now. I could never treat
my customers the way that this bike biz does to me and my friends. The story
posted by Preacher is one of many that I have heard many times before.
Different names/faces and all get the same ass- fucking. But the funny thing
about it is that people keep going back. The only thing that I feel that
Preacher should have done is to go up the chain of command. If he didnt talk
to Cory Ness then he should. Paul Gomez did nothing but waste my time. But Cory
took care of me in the end. In all defense of Arlen. He did not get where he is
today by being stupid. He has to rely on employees and not all employees care
about Arlens Success. I will also say that nothing is perfect in production.
People make mistakes. It is when something fucks up, its how you handle the
problem. How Paul Gomez handled it may not be what Arlen would of done. At
this point mmmmmmmary fucked Preacher on any deal that he could have possibly
made. MMMMMMary also cost Preacher alot of money and by his post alot of
discomfort. MMMary I have been watching your post and peoples post in response
to you. Without insulting you, I would suggest that you save face and stop
responding. Your stance is very weak and the toes that you step on are many.
Stone
Troy
doesn't.
Manfun9512 wrote in message
<20000119131922...@ng-cu1.aol.com>...
>That settles it for me. Guess I just ignore Ness products unless I hear of
a
>pretty major turnaround in company policy.
>This internet shit is great!
Troy
Mary Queen of Scoots wrote in message
<20000119144912...@ng-cg1.aol.com>...
>Also, if Ness is using the same chromer as CC, it looks like you'll be
getting
>the same chroming anyway. The chroming is the problem, right?
Pass the buck?
David Watkins
Why don't i see a post from Mr. Ness Here???
John Stafford
worth. Yes, Arlen is (imho), the God of American custom motorcycles. A real
artist. Like many others here I have been following his work since he began.
Arlen Ness epitomized one American motorcycle esthetic. (Of course, if you
don't like that esthetic... and I don't like his latest being a Brit kinda
guy originally, but to give credit to a determined man of vision, I have to
admire Arlen nonetheless. A lot!)
What's apparently happening with his warantee issue, his mass-produced part
is an unfortunate inevitability when the goddamned merchants take over, but
this particular incident may be an outlier. My bet is that Ness is thinking
of it carefully, and probably agonizing, wondering like the rest of us what
the Whole Story really is.
Patience.
John Stafford
Panhead <panmy...@intac.com> wrote in message
news:3885B582...@intac.com...
> Have you seen their website? They're not the
> > most computer literate people around. They haven't set it up.
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>
> No shit again. They probably use it to design their parts as
> well.
Who are you to talk, Bedpan? What have you ever done that was really
original, that had any real soul? You might be a good painter, but we don't
_know_ that, but I do know that all I've ver seen of yours is paint in the
same old everyfuckingday YUPPIE esthetic. If Dupont made paint in themes
like Microsoft makes 'em for web authoring, you would be out of business.
Merrell Wasson
wolfpup <redh...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:swth4.8$D4....@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
>
> Mary, Mary, Mary, Mary, you poor benighted thing. No matter how
hard you try,
> girl, you can't possibly fuck everybody in the motorcycle industry.
>
> But you look cute trying it.
> --
> wolfpup redh...@earthlink.net
> AH#62 BS#69 SENS
my, my, my. wolfpup, you get right to the heart of things don't you?
poor old mary, out of the easy rider frying pan, and into the arlen
ness fire.
--
the big easy. i bet her ass is sore by now.
#39. the jack benny Asshole (tm). BS #39.
Screen Cleaner Emeritus SENS.
Merrell Wasson
Marchant, Jon A. <marc...@marininternet.com> wrote in message
news:2qkd8s0v8kvvl0fc7...@4ax.com...
> On 19 Jan 2000 00:30:21 GMT, mmmar...@aol.comspam (Mary Queen of
> Scoots) sez:
>
> > I guess I would rather be friends with Ness than you guys.
>
> Why do I have the feeling that this sentence explains more about you
> than you might want to admit?
^^^^^^
jon, you misspelled everything. they have a word for this. synchophant
comes to mind.
the big easy. but, so does star fucker.
Professor
"Jinks" <glj...@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:lgeb8sgj8jpmp8je6...@4ax.com...
> in the long run. I'm sure this one thread has cost him a lot in
> future sales.
Yep! I'm looking elsewhere for a few items I pick out.
Tud
Larry Boyd aka Roofwalker <larr...@mindspring.com> wrote in message
<snip>
> You know what, I don't care if you're fucking the queen of England
> with a strap-on and giving her husband blow jobs at the same time,
<snip>
Heh, that reminds me of a web site I was on yesterday.
--
Tud "Last Man Standing"
SENS LFS #32
98 FLHPI
Gimpy
:}Panhead <panmy...@intac.com> wrote in message
John,
Please ping me privately.
Gimpy "the tired of the Winter wonderland" Asshole(tm)
AH#94 BS#25 GIMP#1
'99 FXSTS Trike "Midnight Rambler"
Tud
John Stafford wrote
<snip the praise>
> What's apparently happening with his warantee issue, his mass-produced
part
> is an unfortunate inevitability when the goddamned merchants take over,
but
> this particular incident may be an outlier. My bet is that Ness is
thinking
> of it carefully, and probably agonizing, wondering like the rest of us
what
> the Whole Story really is.
>
> Patience.
Unfortunately the story so far has been told from one side, and at this
point, as wrong as I may be, I am skeptical that I will ever purchase a Ness
product. This may not be too discouraging for Ness since I have never
purchased their products in the past, but I'm sure that I'm not the only one
thinking this. Even with two sides to the story, at this point I have to
think that Ness screwed up pretty big to make a customer this mad, and with
all the returns that had to be done I just can't see myself having much
faith in their products. As far as I'm concerned Preacher, and
inadvertently MMMMMMary, have done me a favor. Just my $0.02.
JMark
>
> Mary Queen of Scoots <mmmar...@aol.comspam> wrote in message
> news:20000118171738...@ng-ch1.aol.com...
> > This is the response to the original post about Arlen Ness from Ness. I'm
> > posting it here as he couldn't get it to the Preacher. Ness sent me this when
> I
> > forwarded to him the posts from the newsgroup.
> >
> snipped the whole transparent whinge-
>
> girl, you can't possibly fuck everybody in the motorcycle industry.
>
> But you look cute trying it.
Coffee back through the nose.....should have known better.....definately
awake now!
--
JMark
88FLHS
SENS4,LFS#4,BS#83
John Corliss
Since my IP just fixed the newsgroup servers, I just this morning got all the
thousands of posts I've been missing. This enormous thread contained most of
them. Just want to thank everybody involved for entertaining the shit out of me
for the last hour or so as I play "catch-up" on the posts.
Special thanks to Preacher, Mmmary, and Panhead. (Look, I'm really
serious......I was laughing my ass off.) Good luck to you all in whatever you
want out of this. I mean it.
--
John Corliss
'69 FLH
Homepage at: http://www.ccountry.net/~jcorliss/
Rev. date Jan. 16, 2000 Link to bike repair photos added
Ken Schofield
>
> ><hemi...@aol.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>Does anyone know what company/s I can purchase
> >>brake and clutch controls and other assorted goodies
> >>where that ness guy won't see a PENNY of?
> >
> > Hum...how about Harley-Davidson <g>?
> >
> >Phil
>
> You still may have the same chrome problem. The same people that actually make
> Custom Chrome and Ness parts also supply Harley.
Bullshit Mary.
Do I have to call your bluff and put you in contact with a businessman
who's been supplying MC parts for over 30 years - one who has these
CCI/KA parts manufactured for his own company to prove you wrong? He
imports products for his own generic line of MC parts which are EXACTLY
the same parts that come off exactly the same production line for CCI
and KA, and he CAN NOT get HD parts because (read this slowly) they are
not manufactured by the same company!
Please - just admit that you're blowing as much gas as possible here
Mary.
Ken
HSB#07 WOLF#13 BS#92 AH#70