'02 KTM 200 EXC Suspension Setup
Brian Jahelka
Raced the Black Jack enduro circut as a kid, and now, 6 years out of
college, I finally bought a bike so I can go back and do it again!
My question: I am 5'10" and just over 150 lbs. The stock suspension
settings were WAY too stiff for me! I read up both of the White Brothers
books that came with the bike on the forks and shock. Needless to say, I
didn't have this kind of adjustability on my '86 RM80 way back when! I have
softened up both the compression and rebound on the shock and fork. Not
going into specific 'clicks out', I am now at about 3/4 of the way soft (eg
with 40 clicks worth of adjustment, I'm around 30 clicks out). I got to see
some video footage of me riding fairly aggressively on some pretty narly
(whoops and hard pack/rock) stuff. It appears that I am getting close to
full travel on the front and rear. On one of the local mx tracks, I could
bottom the fork on a few of the jumps. Believe me, I wasn't skying out on
anything huge (im a tree and rock lover, not a hang time lover). The bike
was only on its second day of being broken in, and, oh yea, my body is
getting broken in too! The only problem is, that the initial hit is way
violent. I feel like my arms are taking all the hit on anything sharp
edged. Actually, the suspension makes everything feel like it has a sharp
edge to it. So with that background, I will lay out some specific
questions:
1) Is it 'normal' or 'acceptable' to run with comp and reb dialed all the
way out (soft)?
2) If I dial these all the way out, won't I feel like I am just riding on a
set of boingy springs?
3) The shock and fork manuals both tell you to dial in 'static' sag, with
no rider on the bike. Then, with the weight of the rider on the bike, to
measure the sag. This sag measurement determines whether the spring is too
stiff or too soft. What are the consequenses of going 'outside' of the
recommended static sag and adjusting the preload a little softer than what
the book recommends? Would this help any?
4) Will a lighter weight oil or a lower oil level make the forks feel
plusher without increasing the chances of bottoming?
5) Am I too light to be using the stock springs? Should I just go buy some
softer fork and shock springs?
Thanks in advance,
Brian
2002 KTM 200 E/XC
Simmonsmc
removed by revalving (it's common on KTM's), lots of people can do it i
reccomend WER in new jersey if your back east.
Mike Simmons
99 KTM 300 MXC
AMA/ Dist.36
Hayward Honda/Suzuki/Sea-Doo 510-886-0644
D-H Cycles KTM/Suzuki/Cannondale Modesto
Brian Jahelka
Dying to hear how it turns out. I just got off the phone with my bro-in-law
who works the parts counter where I bought my bike. He recommended
www.pro-action.com. They actually have a local 'franchise' near me in
Kansas City. After dropping 6K on the bike, I would rather not go spend
another $600 on new springs and a revalve job all the way around, but if
thats what it takes to go fast and not wear myself out, I guess I'll hafta
do it!!!
"Sean Goulart" <sgou...@99services.com> wrote in message
news:3C7C1B9F...@99services.com...
Jim Hall
>Sean,
>
>Dying to hear how it turns out. I just got off the phone with my bro-in-law
>who works the parts counter where I bought my bike. He recommended
>www.pro-action.com. They actually have a local 'franchise' near me in
>Kansas City. After dropping 6K on the bike, I would rather not go spend
>another $600 on new springs and a revalve job all the way around, but if
>thats what it takes to go fast and not wear myself out, I guess I'll hafta
>do it!!!
I really don't think you hafta spend that kind of money.
I think your springs are OK. At your weight, you fit in the typical
suspension design envelope. I'm 210# soaking wet. I *need* stiffer
springs.
You need to have your forks revalved - it is a matter of simply
restacking shims, and it really isn't rocket science. I would ask the
first "A" enduro rider you come across who does his forks. Chances
are he does it himself in his garage, but he ought to be able to point
you to someone who can do it for you competently and reasonably. I
think I paid somewhere around $150 to get mine done the last time. It
might cost you a bit more, but you certainly don't need to pay big
bucks to have a name shop do it.
Jim Hall
520 EXC and others
turning Money into Noise...
Brian Jahelka
I measured my sag tonight and I am within the factory recommended 'limits'.
Bro-in-law also said that the stock springs should be for a 165 lb rider. I
can't imagine that my being 10-15 lbs lighter than that is a huge problem.
I went ahead and clicked out the compression and rebound a few more notches.
If it would warm up for the weekend, I can go test it out. Its like 13
friggin degrees here in Kansas now. =)
Pro-action looks like they are charging $225 for a revalve job on the KTM
fork. Since they are so close, I can drive it down to em and wouldn't hafta
pay shipping (or hastle with packaging everything). Is this more reasonable
or should I look to a more local shop (like www.cyclezone.com, they do Race
Tech mods)?
PS Dad was consistantly taking the "A" overall in the Black Jack enduro
circut when I was a kid... Sure hope I can keep the family name goin!!! =)
Thanks so much for your input guys!
Sean Goulart
Hi Brian,
>
> I measured my sag tonight and I am within the factory recommended 'limits'.
> Bro-in-law also said that the stock springs should be for a 165 lb rider. I
> can't imagine that my being 10-15 lbs lighter than that is a huge problem.
I think it's always 100mm - I would go 10mm either way without worrying
about it tho...15 lbs doesn't make that big a difference - it's more how
you ride it.
> Pro-action looks like they are charging $225 for a revalve job on the KTM
> fork. Since they are so close, I can drive it down to em and wouldn't hafta
> pay shipping (or hastle with packaging everything). Is this more reasonable
> or should I look to a more local shop (like www.cyclezone.com, they do Race
> Tech mods)?
Where are you located ? - you should ask on the Holeshot Message Board:
http://www.holeshotktm.com/home.htm
- it is an awesome resource - I use the place here locally (80 miles
away!) because:
1 - they know this terrain (it's like the moon here)
2 - I rode a bike they set up for a 180 lb friend and it was plush...
3 - cost of shipping forks sucks ass - and Dean already made me a free
custom box
4 - I wanted to be able to take em back if there is an issue
I used to ship my YZ125 forks to California - but that was an MX bike
and I think Kayabas are a LOT easier than WP forks to work on - WP is an
art - they are pretty stiff !!
KSK
Pete P.
shim stacking instructions and spare shims for KTM USD forks. The kit costs
$40. That, 2 hours and a bottle of suspension fluid, and my forks were
revalved. Can't tell how well, just yet, need to go riding.
They were selling the kits on Ebay.
His email is: "Chuck Waggoner" wagg...@cafes.net
When you get it, you'll think you're getting ripped off, until you go all
the way through the instructions and make it happen. Well worth the money.
Pete P.
"Jim Hall" <jdh...@plateng.com> wrote in message
news:8feo7ukq7hn3eboic...@4ax.com...
Brian Jahelka
95mm (book says between 105 and 90). So I guess I should be OK there.
Called the guy at pro-action in Kansas City just now. He thinks the spring
rates should be fine for my weight as well. He quoted me $200 to revalve
the forks. I suppose thats not too bad, and I won't hafta worry about me
messing something up by taking my forks apart and putting em back together.
=) Oh yea, and its only a 50 mile drive for me!
Thanks for all your input guys!
Brian
"Sean Goulart" <sgou...@99services.com> wrote in message
news:3C7CDEFD...@99services.com...
MX Tuner
<sgou...@99services.com> wrote:
>> I measured my sag tonight and I am within the factory recommended 'limits'.
>> Bro-in-law also said that the stock springs should be for a 165 lb rider. I
>> can't imagine that my being 10-15 lbs lighter than that is a huge problem.
>I think it's always 100mm - I would go 10mm either way without worrying
>about it tho...15 lbs doesn't make that big a difference - it's more how
>you ride it.
10mm either way is a huge change. I'd set it at 100mm and adjust it
accordingly to compensate for adverse symptoms that still exist.
MX Tuner
whenindoubt
As long as you are within factory specs, you should be fine. I agree
that 10mm either way is also fine. Compensate for sag changes with
damping changes until you get it right. If you want to open up the
checkbook to fiddle with springs until the sag is perfect then be my
guest. Always start with what your owners manual recommends and adjust
from there. You'll find that it's not always the standard 100mm.
Keith
compression clicker all the way out. Put 2.5 wt. oil in my Compression fork
and 5 wt in the Rebound leg...man, it was like magic. My forks are great
now, both clickers are in the middle and they've handled everything I've
hit. Might not work if you are really fast. I'm a mid-pack B rider and
race enduro and HS. It's cheap so you might try it before spending the big
bucks.
Keith
'99 200 mxc
TORO# B425
MX Tuner
wrote:
>As long as you are within factory specs, you should be fine.
"Factory specs" is a range of adjustment. It isn't a spec like
measuring a used clutch plate.
>I agree
>that 10mm either way is also fine.
Sure, if you want to deal with potential headshake or poor cornering
possibilities. To get a bike dialed as well as possible, one must have
a good starting point. Sure, you may end up with the sag set a
significant distance from the standard 100mm but it is arguably the
best point to start since it won't give you any adverse symptoms that
90mm or 110mm might. It will give you a solid base to judge any other
adjustments around.
>Compensate for sag changes with
>damping changes until you get it right.
Umm, what?!?! Springs and damping do two different jobs.
>If you want to open up the
>checkbook to fiddle with springs until the sag is perfect then be my
>guest.
How about just setting it correctly to begin with. That is free. get
it as close as you can with the spring you have. What's so hard about
that?
MX Tuner
MXOldtimer
Doug
Dudley Cornman
dsc
"MXOldtimer" <mxold...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20020228231813...@mb-fg.aol.com...
Dudley Cornman
> Sure, if you want to deal with potential headshake or poor cornering
> possibilities. To get a bike dialed as well as possible, one must have
> a good starting point. Sure, you may end up with the sag set a
> significant distance from the standard 100mm but it is arguably the
> best point to start
Actually I thought the exact point to start was one third of your total
travel. On many bikes that is at or near 100 mm, but if on a particular bike
it isn't, would you still use 100mm?
dsc
GP
stability) and jack it up to 80-ish for hard conditions (to out corner
everybody). But then what do I know, I'm just a slow guy.
I think my springs are saturated with oil, anyway. I probably need
new ones.
Think outside of the box and set it up the way *you* like it. :-)
Greg P
prj...@netzero.net (whenindoubt) wrote in message news:<856f3b36.02022...@posting.google.com>...
whenindoubt
left? Ok, I'll take your advice and give it a try.
gplas...@hotmail.com (GP) wrote in message news:<f6bc7b29.02030...@posting.google.com>...
Debbie and Roger Bess
then set the sag for 1/3 of the total travel the suspension has.
On 125/250's this is around 100mm. I'm not sure about your XR.
"whenindoubt" <prj...@netzero.net> wrote in message
news:856f3b36.02030...@posting.google.com...
David Jones
>If I set the sag on my XR100 to 100mm, I wouldn't have much travel
>left? Ok, I'll take your advice and give it a try.
<snip>
>> > from there. You'll find that it's not always the standard 100mm.
The general rule of thumb:
sag = 1/3 of your total travel.
David - 01 KTM200 EXC
http://www.motosports-boise.com/rmd
"The Very Unofficial RMD Homepage"
MX Tuner
>If I set the sag on my XR100 to 100mm, I wouldn't have much travel
>left? Ok, I'll take your advice and give it a try.
For full sized bikes, use 100mm as a decent starting point. The 100mm
figures into the general rule of using 1/3 the rear axle travel as a
sag setting. If *your* XR 100 has 12 inches of rear axle travel, use
the 100mm. Otherwise you may want to re-think your method.
MX Tuner
Dudley Cornman
"GP" <gplas...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:f6bc7b29.02030...@posting.google.com...
> I set my sag closer to 140 for mud, sand and snow (for chopper-like
> stability) and jack it up to 80-ish for hard conditions (to out corner
> everybody).
Do you want to get anal for just a second... :)
Preping for mud...
Subtract weight of clean bike from weight of mud coffered bike (while still
wet). (Let's say 15 pounds).
Take back pack and stuff with 15 pounds of weight, don your normal riding
gear (helmet, boots, guards protectors, camalpack, tool belt, goggles,
gloves, etc.)
Put back pack on... now set your sag to your normal settings. :)
That should have your sag pretty close if your springs can tolerate the
extra 15 pounds.
I've always read decrease the sag a little to compensate for all the mud you
will carry as well as stiffening up a the clickers a couple clicks.
But that's just what I have read.
dsc
GP
thrust" steep fork angle for dry conditions and switch to a more
stable geometry for stability in the inevitable ruts in the soft
stuff. I don't really care what the mud weighs as it sticks to the
front of my bike as well as the rear.
Don't believe what you read. Unless you're a MXer.
Greg P
"Dudley Cornman" <Dudley....@eku.edu> wrote in message news:<2002Mar4.1...@acs.eku.edu>...
whenindoubt
the handling bad. The damn thing wouldn't turn at all and bottomed
over even the smallest bumps. I'm going back to what my owners manual
recommends. I guess MXer's ride different from us trail riders.
gplas...@hotmail.com (GP) wrote in message news:<f6bc7b29.02030...@posting.google.com>...
Jay C
> the handling bad. The damn thing wouldn't turn at all and bottomed
> over even the smallest bumps. I'm going back to what my owners manual
> recommends. I guess MXer's ride different from us trail riders.
I hope you are trolling... if not, you set your sag to 1/3 of the available
travel. 100mm is the standard starting point only because most (full-sized)
MX bikes have a foot of rear wheel travel. An XR100 has 5.5" rear travel,
so you should set your sag somewhere around ~1.8", or ~45mm.
Jay
MX Tuner
wrote:
Sure he's trolling. He made some remark about adjsuting his XR 100 to
100mm and 3 of us tried to enlighten him. I think it's some feeble
attempt at making a point.
MX Tuner
Jay C
> >I hope you are trolling... if not, you set your sag to 1/3 of the
available
> >travel. 100mm is the standard starting point only because most
(full-sized)
> >MX bikes have a foot of rear wheel travel. An XR100 has 5.5" rear
travel,
> >so you should set your sag somewhere around ~1.8", or ~45mm.
>
> Sure he's trolling. He made some remark about adjsuting his XR 100 to
> 100mm and 3 of us tried to enlighten him. I think it's some feeble
> attempt at making a point.
Yea, well - just trying to keep the bases covered.
Jay
whenindoubt
mxt...@mindspring.com (MX Tuner) wrote in message news:<3c86ab77....@news.mindspring.com>...