(CAR) Painting question: primer?
Mustang Maniac!
Car modelers...
What do you use as a primer when you paint your car models?
When painting models that are not made of white or neutral
light gray plastic, I've been having trouble getting good
coverage with both rattle-can and airbrushed paints. I've
recently tried to paint over bright red and bright yellow
plastic and had poor luck. In both cases, I was spraying
dark colors (one was purple, the other was emerald green).
I've had TERRIBLE luck spraying any light color paint over
colored plastic.
I thought about using flat white as a primer, but I can't
get it to cover either.
I once used some flat light gray enamel (a Testors military
flat color) as a primer when I painted the '69 Dodge Super
Bee model (molded in dark blue, wanted to paint it yellow,
modeling my first car from High School). The primer went on
way too heavy and filled in too much detail).
Any serious suggestions will be appreciated.
--
Dean -- THE Mustang Maniac of Texas!
Carlos Farias
Howdy from Austin:
This is a phenomoena called "bleed through." First the color of the
plastic will need to be neutralized. This can usually be done with
automotive primer. Visit the local auto-parts or paint store and
purchase a rattle-can or quart of primer. The rattle can is easiest to
use; simply shake, aim, and spray. However, make the larger investment
and purchase the canned primer that is used by professional automotive
painters. It is very thick so you'll need to thin as much as 1-part
primer to 10+-parts lacquer thinner. When airbrushed, primer dries
faster, harder, and is thinner (important to prevent accidently filling
in fine detail) than its rattle-can equivalent.
Spray the model with the primer being sure to make only light coats.
The model does not have to be done in just one shot. It doesn't even
need to cover the model completely on the first session. Once the model
is sufficiently coated. The "bleed through" effect should be
eliminated, at least from the plastic. The "bleed through" effect may
still occur from the primer, but primer bleed through is easier to deal
with than plastic bleed through as primer is a neutral grey while
plastics may be the yellow, blue, or reds with which you have dealt.
The word "primer" is used in a common but confusing manner in the post,
Dean. "Primer" can be the automotive prepcoat used on metal (and
plastic) to protect the surface and allow a neutral-colored base on
which to paint. However, "primer" as used in this post refers to only
the neutral-colored properties of the prepcoat. In other words, one
"primer" is a protectant and one "primer" is paint. Many people,
including myself, use the term interchangeably, adding to the confusion.
The "primer" method you used would properly be termed "basecoat,"
another word confused with "primer." "Basecoat" is a color placed
between the primer and the finish (the color you want the model to be)
to enhance the appearance of the finish. If a light-colored basecoat is
used (white, silver, light tan) the finish will have a "warm" or bright
finish. If a dark-colored basecoat is used (dark gray, gold, black) a
"cold" or dark finish will result. A light-colored basecoat will turn a
red into a slightly bright red and a dark-colored basecoat will turn a
red into a slightly dark red. This enhancing will be especially noticed
when metallic paints are used. This enhancing will be reduced each time
you apply another coat of color, but will not be completely eliminated.
To keep the color as it is, dark colors can most of the time be sprayed
directly onto gray primer. If the color is light, use a flat basecoat
of about the same color.
Using the basecoat to enhance the finish may not always work with all
finishes. Some are not effected, other are slightly effected, and
others will be greatly exaggerated. Most often, the finish coats will
be slightly effected and even imperceptable, so using a basecoat to
enhance the finish may not be necessary at all times. I, personally,
use a basecoat only when I perceive it necessary.
The "bleed through" effect may still be experienced when using
basecoats. To reduce this, use very light color coats and build up the
finish. Remember the old addage: Two light coats are better than on
heavy coat.
Happy Modeling!!!
Carlos Farias
IPMS 35500
Austi Model Cars
Foxeye
fox...@mindspring.com wrote:
I too use the 131s by Dupont, for primering and filling my airframes
for rockets. Really great stuff, and I have used it sucessfully on
stryenes and many other plastics, when used with a fast or med
reducer. I don't know what you all pay for it, but in my area it is
$36.00 a quart, which goes a long way, but I believe it is cheaper
elsewhere.
foxeye
smud...@aol.com (SmudgeRIO) wrote:
>
>I use Dupont 131S Fill and Sand automotive primer on all of my projects.
>Fantastic stuff but since it is a laquer you need to shoot in a well
>ventilated area. It will cover any color plastic with a smooth neutral gray
>finish.
>Smudge
>IPMS 14147
>
>"You can't always get what you want, but if you try sometimes, you just
>might find, you get what you need."
>
>M. Jagger
Fox...@www.mindspring.com
By sending unsolicited commercially-oriented e-mail to this address, the
sender agrees to pay a $100 flat fee to the recipient for proofreading
services. Take the www out of address to send email.
AAMRESIN
>
>Car modelers...
>
>What do you use as a primer when you paint your car models?
>
>When painting models that are not made of white or neutral
>light gray plastic, I've been having trouble getting good
>coverage with both rattle-can and airbrushed paints. I've
>recently tried to paint over bright red and bright yellow
>plastic and had poor luck. In both cases, I was spraying
>dark colors (one was purple, the other was emerald green).
>I've had TERRIBLE luck spraying any light color paint over
>colored plastic.
>
>I thought about using flat white as a primer, but I can't
>get it to cover either.
>
>I once used some flat light gray enamel (a Testors military
>flat color) as a primer when I painted the '69 Dodge Super
>Bee model (molded in dark blue, wanted to paint it yellow,
>modeling my first car from High School). The primer went on
>way too heavy and filled in too much detail).
>
>Any serious suggestions will be appreciated.
>--
Dean, I wouldn't propose to elaborate too much on what others have told
yu, their advice is quite sound. I have used automotive acrylic lacquers
since the early 1960's on model cars, with good results.
Cross my heart, hope to die! I have never, repeart never experienced
"bleed-through" of the pigment or dyes in the styrene, although others have.
I personally use Sherwin-Williams red-oxide primer (this is not a dye or
pigmented color, but the color of the solids, and have never had it bleed
through (I have a number of Chevy's painted "snowcrest" and "ermine"
whites as a testimonial.
There are aurtomotive "primer-sealers" on the market, that act to seal the
substrate (plastic, etc.) over which you are painting. Perhaps you might
wish to use this material.
One note about primers: If you are painting factory stock colors such as
those by MCW Automotive Finishes, keep in mind that red-oxide primers were
used up into the 1970's in manufacturing, and the paint formulas are likely
mixed with that in mind. For a while in the late 70's and early 80's,
black primer was used, with the formulas adjusted as well.
Art Anderson
SmudgeRIO
MIKE STUCKER
>What do you use as a primer when you paint your car models?
>When painting models that are not made of white or neutral
>light gray plastic, I've been having trouble getting good
>coverage with both rattle-can and airbrushed paints. I've
>recently tried to paint over bright red and bright yellow
>plastic and had poor luck. In both cases, I was spraying
>dark colors (one was purple, the other was emerald green).
>I've had TERRIBLE luck spraying any light color paint over
>colored plastic.
I've used Platicoat white primer with good results. You can
buy it in spray cans at automotive supply stores. Don't forget
to sand it before spraying on color coat.
When I was into model railroading I used to airbrush any shade
of dark grey from Scalecoat as a primer. Scalecoat is glossy,
so you don't need to sand it.
The worst primer I ever used was Floquil. Would instantly clog my
airbrush.
Model Car World, in their line of paints, has a "sealer" which is
to be sprayed over colored plastic so it doesn't "bleed" through
the other coats of paint. I haven't tried it, though.
Note: All of the above mentioned paints are lacquer. They can
damage styrene, so you should test them on sprue before using on
the model. (I've never had a problem.)
Michael Stucker | Anadrill Schlumberger, Sugar Land, Texas
stu...@sugar-land.spc.slb.com | Definately not Anadrill's opinion.
Use this email not that in header. | Copyright Michael J. Stucker 1997
"It's all fun and games. Until you break a hip." -- Craig Kilborn
David Redmond
> stu...@aslvx1.sugar-land.anadrill.slb.com (MIKE STUCKER) writes:
>
> When I was into model railroading I used to airbrush any shade
> of dark grey from Scalecoat as a primer. Scalecoat is glossy,
> so you don't need to sand it.
>
> The worst primer I ever used was Floquil. Would instantly clog my
> airbrush.
>
> Model Car World, in their line of paints, has a "sealer" which is
> to be sprayed over colored plastic so it doesn't "bleed" through
> the other coats of paint. I haven't tried it, though.
>
> Note: All of the above mentioned paints are lacquer. They can
> damage styrene, so you should test them on sprue before using on
> the model. (I've never had a problem.)
>
>
These days there is also Scalecoat II which is plastic compatible and Floquil has been
reformulated for plastic compatability (not that Floquil is recommended, but Scalecoat II,
within a limited range of colors, is very good paint for the airbrush).
Opinions expressed herein are my own and may not represent those of my employer.
MoparDeke
Please note that these sealter and Floquil's Barrier are UNAVAILABLE in
New York State and others. These products CANNOT be shipped into these
states, and therefore are ILLEGAL to use.
I found this out when I tried to buy barrier via mailorder and at various
hobby shops.
I have good luck using Model Master primer, any of the military greys,
Krylon primer and flat black as well as DupliColor primer (although a bit
on the expensive side).
Deke, the Mopar Maniac
ho...@umdnj.edu
In article <19970911023...@ladder02.news.aol.com>,
Deke: Have you thought of Kilz stain/primer block? I used it once on a
car model, although I needed to thin it out a bit for the airbrush. I
can only get it in spray can now, but it does what it says, it "kilz" the
color underneath. I do 1-2 coats to block the color of the plastic, wet
sand, and then do 1 or 2 ore coats. Then a glosscoat (usually Future)
then begin application of paint. It sounds like a lot, but the result is
great. Be sure to use light coats, and to re-scribe any panel lines that
get obscured through the kilz.
Carl
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