AM B-25B ... Accuracy of "Ruptured Duck" Nose Art
Frank Tauss
>
> Hello all,
>
> Saw a number of the AM B-25s at Grandad's Hobby Shop in Springfield,
> VA this evening, and took a close look at the picture of the "Ruptured
> Duck" on the bottom of the box. The Donald Duck caricature looks a
> little too "professional" to my decidely untrained eye - amost like
> something you'd see on a cell from a Disney cartoon than on the side
> of a warplane. When I got home I pulled out some reference books that
> containe pictures of the B-25Ds used in the movie version of "Thirty
> Seconds" (my understanding is that no photographic record of the
> original "Ruptured Duck" art exists) and saw that there were two
> distinctly different "takes" on the Duck's nose art - neither of which
> match what AM has produced.
>
> I know this is just hair-splitting over what already seems to be
> considered to be one of the finest 1/48 scale aircraft kits ever
> produced - but does anyone else have the same impression as me? Or
> did (as I really hope) AM find some new source for the original "Duck"
> nose art?
>
> --Garth
There is an acknowledgement of the differences in the instructions (I
read through them last night.) They claim they got the master from Mrs.
Lawson, there are no pictures of the original art and the movie was
Hollywood embellishment.
I bet a guy last night that someone would find a nit to pick. I win!
Frank
Kurt Laughlin
> read through them last night.) They claim they got the master from Mrs.
> Lawson, there are no pictures of the original art and the movie was
> Hollywood embellishment.
Wasn't there a picture of his flight jacket emblem in his book, or a drawing
of the logo on the endpages?
KL
Garth Kidman
Frank Tauss
My current copy is a Random House Third Printing Copyrights 1943, 1953.
I'm missing thr jacket, if it ever had one. There is nothing in it. I do
"think" I remember the copy I had as a kid, I sort of remember the duck
image on the jacket. Kurt you may be right but I can't quite remember.
Frank
Sean
Duck" onto the B-25. the pilot, can't remember his name, instantly told the
aircrew's artist to paint something that matched it. so my guess is the nose
art wouldn't match exactly on each side and probably wouldn't of the same
quality as the nose art on some of th other bombers of the world. you try
painting when your on a pitching carrier deck and spray always washing over
you.
Sean Neilan
Rama Lama Noch-Nok
of the glorious Temple Shananana
Fly on!
SVanaken
>
>Frank
I'm surprised it took this long. Geez, almost two days!!
Scott
Steve Faxon
came out to my plane and found that somebody had chalked the words Ruptured
Duck on the side of the fuselage. I grabbed Corporal Lovelace, a gunner I
knew, and asked him to paint some sort of design on the ship. He's a good
caricaturist. Lovelace got out his stuff and and painted a funny Donald Duck,
with a head-set and the earphone cords all twisted around his head. Lovelace
did a swell job in blue, yellow, white and red. Then he added something that
gave all of us another laugh. Under Donald Duck he drew a a couple of crossed
crutches." He then goes on to tell how the other crews got busy painted names
on their planes. I have several very good pics of the movie plane. Also an
e-mail from a fellow who says there is a book about B-25's witha photo of the
real plane next to the movie plane and they are the same, he saw it at the Pima
Air Museum. Also have other Doolittle Raid references........order of take
off, crew names and what plane they were in, names of other planes, serial
numbers, blah blah blah.
Kurt Laughlin
> e-mail from a fellow who says there is a book about B-25's witha photo of
the
> real plane next to the movie plane and they are the same, he saw it at the
Pima
> Air Museum.
I'm assuming that you mean photos of the MARKINGS from the real plane next
to the MARKINGS from the movie plane. . .
KL
Albatrosdv
>
>Frank
What would amaze me would be no nits doing any picking.
Tom Cleaver
Jim Atkins
Doolittle bird!!! Check http://www.pimaair.org/nam_b25.htm -
--
Jim Atkins
Safford AZ USA
"Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend.
Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read."
Groucho Marx
Frank Tauss
>
> Page 25 of "Thirty Seconds Over Tokyo" by pilot Ted Lawson says "One morning I
> came out to my plane and found that somebody had chalked the words Ruptured
> Duck on the side of the fuselage. I grabbed Corporal Lovelace, a gunner I
> knew, and asked him to paint some sort of design on the ship. He's a good
> caricaturist. Lovelace got out his stuff and and painted a funny Donald Duck,
> with a head-set and the earphone cords all twisted around his head. Lovelace
> did a swell job in blue, yellow, white and red. Then he added something that
> gave all of us another laugh. Under Donald Duck he drew a a couple of crossed
> crutches." He then goes on to tell how the other crews got busy painted names
> e-mail from a fellow who says there is a book about B-25's witha photo of the
> real plane next to the movie plane and they are the same, he saw it at the Pima
> off, crew names and what plane they were in, names of other planes, serial
> numbers, blah blah blah.
The Detail & Scale book has a profile drawing of the Duck with a closeup
of the emblem. I don't remeber what the decal looked like, will be
comparing them shortly - thanks to Jim's Hobbies Online - and will check
it out. Of course the next question is where did D&S get thier info?
Frank
Garth Kidman
Glad that I could be of help with your wager ... any chance you guys
put some money on it? I figure that if you did, I'm entitled to at
least 20% ... ;-)
Tom:
Sorry to have given you (and apparently everyone else) the impression
that I was nit-picking over what seems to be an outstanding model. My
question was more historical - I first read, and fell in love with,
Thirty Seconds Over Tokyo when I was in 4th grade, and I consider it
to be **the** catalyst for my becoming interested in military history
and aviation modelling. I must've read the book a good 20-30 times in
the past 18 years, and have always wanted a "Ruptured Duck" (albiet
1/72nd scale - I'm hoping that AM does with its B-25 what it's doing
with its Il-2) for my collection. I've seen at least 3 "concepts" of
what the "Duck" looked like ... but nothing definitive, since no
pictures of the original art have ever been published.
So rather than nit-picking (I remember all the griping over the relief
tube in a certain TBF model) I was **really** hoping that AM had found
some sort of definitive evidence about the artwork. In "Thirty
Seconds" Lawson indicates that part of the real "Ruptured Duck" -
including the nose art - was salvaged by the Japanese and put on
display in Tokyo, so I figure that some kind of photographic record
**does** exist out there.
Thanks for letting me clarify.
--Garth
Albatrosdv
Tom Cleaver
Frank Tauss
>
> Frank:
>
> Glad that I could be of help with your wager ... any chance you guys
> put some money on it? I figure that if you did, I'm entitled to at
> least 20% ... ;-)
>
No problem. 8-) Just knowing how you guys can be sometimes it just
seemed to easy to pass up.
Frank
Reed Riddle
gki...@nospamix.netcom.com (Garth Kidman) wrote:
>with its Il-2) for my collection. I've seen at least 3 "concepts" of
>what the "Duck" looked like ... but nothing definitive, since no
>pictures of the original art have ever been published.
One thing to remember is that the copilot, Dean Davenport, was a
technical assistant on the movie, and I remember a picture of him around
the planes they were using. So, I'd bet that the art in the movie is
pretty close to what was really on the plane. Doesn't mean that it's
accurate, but it should at least have the same flavor. I've never seen
a picture of the real plane (and I've looked a lot, I'm a big fan of the
book).
>So rather than nit-picking (I remember all the griping over the relief
>tube in a certain TBF model) I was **really** hoping that AM had found
>some sort of definitive evidence about the artwork. In "Thirty
>Seconds" Lawson indicates that part of the real "Ruptured Duck" -
>including the nose art - was salvaged by the Japanese and put on
>display in Tokyo, so I figure that some kind of photographic record
>**does** exist out there.
From the accounts of the crash, and the aftermath as they see it from
the top of a hill, it sounds like the entire nose of the plane was
pretty much destroyed. If any of the artwork did survive the crash,
it's pretty likely that it was damaged by the imersion. AFAIK, there
isn't a record of which planes were salvaged and taken back to Japan,
just the mention that some of them were put on display.
Reed
--
Reed Riddle rriddle "at" earthlink.net
Ph.D. Candidate, Astronomy, Georgia State University
Homepage: http://www.chara.gsu.edu/~riddle
"This life has been a test. If this had been an actual life, you would have
received instructions on where to go and what to do."
Angela Chase, "My so-called life"
Remove "DAMN SPAM" from my email address to reply.....
Steve Faxon
and the book was at Pima.
Garth Kidman
Steve Pace (published by Motorbooks International). On p.71 there are
two pictures of "Ruptured Duck" B-25(s) ... one has Spencer Tracey,
Van Johnson, Robert Mitchum and other castmembers from "Thirty Seconds
Over Tokyo in costume standing in front of the nose of the plane with
the artwork clearly visible. The other picture is just of the plane -
with no people visible. The caption for the second picture reads:
"The real Ruptured Duck was indeed one of the sixteen B-25Bs (40-2261)
used in the Tokyo Raid. Piloted by Lt. Ted Lawson (who also wrote the
film script), it was the seventh plane to launch that morning.
Rockwell"
This certainly gives the impression that the picture **is** of the
**actual** plane. The nose art is **identical** to the picture
w/Spencer Tracey et al - but positioned on a different part of the
nose (note: this art is significantly different from the AM decals).
Unfortunately, also visible are "bumps" on the planes engine cowl -
which are (please correct me if I'm wrong) individual flame-dampners
for the cylinders of the radial engines. Such dampners were not
present on the "B" (the engine exhaust was vented through a single
pipe on the outboard side of the nacelle) - and was only introduced
later on Cs and Ds. The plane also has what I assume are air-data
probes (they look like two open-ended aerosol cans attached by tubes
to the nose) - which are definitely **not** present in the pre-raid
pictures taken on Hornet. So this can't be the "Duck" - as much as I
wish it was.
--Garth
Barney Lum
Reed Riddle <DAMNrri...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> One thing to remember is that the copilot, Dean Davenport, was a
> technical assistant on the movie, and I remember a picture of him
> around the planes they were using.
I just saw in the Los Angeles Times today (2/17/2000) that Dean
Davenport passed away.
http://www.latimes.com/obituary/20000217/t000015704.html
When I read "30 Seconds Over Tokyo in the 5th grade (20+ mumble) years
ago, I recall being squeamish at Capt. Lawson's description of having
his leg amputated... "grinding of the bone saw, etc...!"
Ever since then, I've been hoping a "Doolittle Raider" model worthy of
the mission would be produced. I settled for the Revell 1/48
offering, but that was it. I ended up setting it ablaze :].
I'm looking forward to getting my hands on this one.... and maybe
even building it in this lifetime!
Barney
darq...@gmail.com
Has news articles of Rodger Lovelace the artist that painted the ruptured duck and includes his rendition of the art.
RobG
> Www.rupturedducknoseart.com
> Has news articles of Rodger Lovelace the artist that painted the ruptured duck and includes his rendition of the art.