###!!!&&***Paint!!
J.A. Michel
have conspired to ruin my life! You ever have a day like that? I have the
inverse "midas touch" where everything turns to sh*t instead of gold.
Here's a few things that I have learned along the way:
1.Rustoleum sandable Auto Primer (#2081) cracks Estes nose cones.
2.Black or White Krylon paint #'s 1501 & 1601 (maybe other colors too) will
bubble on you when the two following conditions exist:
a. you have skim-coated the BT with FnF to fill tube spirals.
b. you have used Krylon #1318 over the F&F
3.Tubes FnF skim-coated will not bubble with Krylon paint if you use
Rustoleum #2081 primer
4.Tubes FnF skim-coated will not bubble with Rustoleum paint if you use
Krylon primer.
5.Tubes FnF skim-coated will not bubble with Rustoleum paint of you use
Rustoleum primer.
6.When clearcoating Rustoleum paint, wait a month (OK the can says 48hrs.)
for the basecoat to dry first. Otherwise it will crack!
7.Quality of the finshed paint job is inversley proportional to effort. The
more you want a nice paint job, the worse it will turn out.
8.While painting, anything that can go wrong, will go wrong. This includes
the following: cracks, bubbles, runs, bugs,
hairs, kids' fingerprints, dirt, fisheyes, and last but not least spit
bubbles. (caused by cussing out loud while painting)
I've had it with puff-cans! I'm going to swear them off and get me a paint
gun! Sorry guys, after the second bad paintjob in a row, had I had to vent!
<sob, sob>
J.A. Michel
Mfreptiles
section landed in the grass with the paint freshly wet after the PVC pipe I had
supported on both ends slipped off its footing.
Boy do I have lots of sanding to do now, DOH!
Mike Fisher
Binder Design
http://binderdesign.com
Robert Rosenfield
Krylon is usually lacquer,(check the label) and should only be applied on
like primers. Do not mix brands or types of paints. The only true exception
is that you can put enamel (or other paints) on top of lacquer, but never
put lacquer over enamels or any other type of paint. It is solvent based and
will ruin what's underneath.
I am very satisfied using Duplicolor paints that can be found in Auto Part
Stores. They have lacquer paints and primers that are all compatible. They
dry very fast, can be wet or dry sanded, and can be clear coated without any
problems except during very high humidity days, where they will fog or haze.
A spray gun is great for very large rockets, but paint is not cheap at the
Auto paint supply. (how about $50 a quart for starters) You also have to
clean up the spray gun between every color, using more thinner and rags and
time. (I have in the past bought the paint by the quart or gallon, and mixed
the colors, only to go back to the paint supply house and put the mixed
paint into the good "rattle cans" that have the fan-tip nozzle. It sprays at
low pressure, high velocity, and the only clean-up is turning the can upside
down and spraying to clear the tip.)
Painting is an art, practice on scrap materials or test objects with each
coat of paint before putting it on the rocket. It is better to ruin the
sample,(like bubbling or wrinkling) than have to re-do the job. By the way,
if you are masking for multiple colors, use the fine-line blue plastic pin-
striping tape as the border, and then put masking tape over most of the
plastic tape with your masking paper. Try not to over-wet the object, as
this can cause bleeding under even the plastic tape. The trick here is not
to build up so thick a coat that it will peel with the tape when you are
done painting. Less is more.
Robert
in article bae7qi$9g9$1...@www.flugmodellbau.de, J.A. Michel at
jm4...@spamnotalltel.net wrote on 5/20/03 2:47 PM:
J.A. Michel
made. I didn't realize that when I was rotating it, the clearcoat was
gooing up and sticking on the front V-block, causing the stick I had it
ka-bobbed on to walk out of the front V-block. Needless to say, "Big Red"
hit the garage floor, wet paint and all. DOH! Yea, it took some sanding to
fix that!!
J.A. Michel
"Mfreptiles" <mfrep...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20030520192444...@mb-m01.aol.com...
hil...@weinerboy.org
<jm4...@spamnotalltel.net> wrote:
>I've had it trying to paint rockets!! It feels like Rusoleum and Krylon
>have conspired to ruin my life! You ever have a day like that? I have the
>inverse "midas touch" where everything turns to sh*t instead of gold.
Automotive paint. 100%...
It takes time to get the techniques correct, and cleaning etc. can be
a pain, but in the long run, your time is spent more wisely, and the
finish just cannot be recreated with rattlecans.
The benefits will far outweigh the cost...
Just make sure you're using compatible "systems", practice spraying
with an airbrush or a detail gun first, and you'll be in great shape!
tah
--
Tod A. Hilty
Hilty Information Systems
Do not look in the direction of the flash...
Curl up in a ball as you hit the ground...
Please replace weinerboy dot org with adelphia dot net for reply.
Jerry Irvine
hil...@weinerboy.org wrote:
> On Tue, 20 May 2003 16:47:49 -0500, "J.A. Michel"
> <jm4...@spamnotalltel.net> wrote:
>
> >I've had it trying to paint rockets!! It feels like Rusoleum and Krylon
> >have conspired to ruin my life! You ever have a day like that? I have the
> >inverse "midas touch" where everything turns to sh*t instead of gold.
>
> Automotive paint. 100%...
>
> It takes time to get the techniques correct, and cleaning etc. can be
> a pain, but in the long run, your time is spent more wisely, and the
> finish just cannot be recreated with rattlecans.
>
> The benefits will far outweigh the cost...
>
> Just make sure you're using compatible "systems", practice spraying
> with an airbrush or a detail gun first, and you'll be in great shape!
>
> tah
Thanks for the tech post. I noticed it.
Jerry
--
Jerry Irvine, Box 1242, Claremont, California 91711 USA
Opinion, the whole thing. <mail to:01ro...@gte.net>
Please bring common sense back to rocketry administration.
Produce then publish. http://www.usrockets.com
Bruce Kirchner
Krylon is good too, but NEVER mix brands and NEVER use Rustoleum!
--
Bruce Kirchner
TRA L2 #5888
Michigan Team 1 HUVARS
Visit My Rocketry Home Page - http://members.aol.com/balthezar/index.html
Proud Gun Owner!
Stones
had a problem. Start with a clean surface and always give plenty of time for
drying between coats, colors, and/or clear coats. I personally use a light
coat of Future for my clearcoats with excellent results.
--
Stones
OTRFA
"Bruce Kirchner" <balt...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20030520214834...@mb-m12.aol.com...
hil...@weinerboy.org
wrote:
>In article <3ecaca6a...@news1.news.adelphia.net>,
> hil...@weinerboy.org wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 20 May 2003 16:47:49 -0500, "J.A. Michel"
>> <jm4...@spamnotalltel.net> wrote:
>>
>> >I've had it trying to paint rockets!! It feels like Rusoleum and Krylon
>> >have conspired to ruin my life! You ever have a day like that? I have the
>> >inverse "midas touch" where everything turns to sh*t instead of gold.
>>
>> Automotive paint. 100%...
>>
>> It takes time to get the techniques correct, and cleaning etc. can be
>> a pain, but in the long run, your time is spent more wisely, and the
>> finish just cannot be recreated with rattlecans.
>>
>> The benefits will far outweigh the cost...
>>
>> Just make sure you're using compatible "systems", practice spraying
>> with an airbrush or a detail gun first, and you'll be in great shape!
>>
>> tah
>
>Thanks for the tech post. I noticed it.
See now? That's what happens when I get distracted whilst responding
to a post...
My 6yo was asking me for a "nite nite snack". She wanted a "Ho". Of
course, I had to ask what a "Ho" would be, and she responded that she
only wanted *half* a HoHo.. Duh! Of course, somehow I was thinking
Eddy Murphy...
<vbg>
She also started her Estes Amraam tonight... whadda kid!
David Weinshenker
> If you're going to use rattle cans- Duplicolor Van and Truck can't be beat.
I like the Tamiya spray cans... they're a little expensive for the small
size of the can, and require a delicate touch to avoid bubbles and runs,
but the paint dries rapidly to a thin opaque layer, with no "recoat window"
issues or long cure times required.
-dave w
Jerry Irvine
Jerry Irvine
"Stones" <ston...@xxxnew.rr.com> wrote:
> I've used Rustoleum Painter's Choice brand primer and paints and have NEVER
> had a problem. Start with a clean surface and always give plenty of time for
> drying between coats, colors, and/or clear coats. I personally use a light
> coat of Future for my clearcoats with excellent results.
Time is your friend. Ovens are your friend.
Bob Kaplow
> My 6yo was asking me for a "nite nite snack". She wanted a "Ho". Of
> course, I had to ask what a "Ho" would be, and she responded that she
> only wanted *half* a HoHo.. Duh! Of course, somehow I was thinking
> Eddy Murphy...
The Wonder outlet store near me occasionally has HoHos in 3packs instead of
the usual 2. Must be for Christmas: HoHoHo.
Bob Kaplow NAR # 18L TRA # "Impeach the TRA BoD"
>>> To reply, remove the TRABoD! <<<
Kaplow Klips & Baffle: http://www.pleimling.org/le/Phantom4000.pdf
www.encompasserve.org/~kaplow_r/ www.nira-rocketry.org www.nar.org
Save Model Rocketry from the HSA! http://www.space-rockets.com/congress.html
Jerry Irvine
David Weinshenker <daz...@earthlink.net> wrote:
They cannot be beat for "scale colors" on rockets.
Jerry
Eric Benner
--
Eric Benner
TRA # 8975 L2
NAR # 79398
Secretary, ICBM - Tripoli SC
Secretary, ROSCO - NAR section 648
"J.A. Michel" <jm4...@spamnotalltel.net> wrote in message
news:bae7qi$9g9$1...@www.flugmodellbau.de...
a.hornsbyiii
After having sprayed my Binder Aspire not once but twice now and still have
that all so wonderful crinkle I am now swearing off Rustoleum paints all
together as well. The fist time I followed the cans the second time I
followed the tech instructions with the same results. Now no more Rustoleum.
ITS CRAP!
John
"J.A. Michel" <jm4...@spamnotalltel.net> wrote in message
news:bae7qi$9g9$1...@www.flugmodellbau.de...
RayDunakin
brand) white primer; Plasti-kote "Caution" yellow and orange fluorescents; and
Krylon crystal clear. I also use "Bumper Chrome" for silver accents, and black
primer for inside of mirror shrouds, etc. I don't have much experience with
other colors/types of paint.
Lately I've been using paint only on the payload capsules and tail sections,
and coating the main airframe with adhesive vinyl. This is the stuff used by
sign shops -- comes in a wide range of colors and works great. No fumes or dust
to deal with, no primer or clearcoat needed, and it doesn't scratch or scuff as
easily as paint does.
Of course, in my case I rarely have any need to fill spirals, so the only
advice I can offer there is "don't bother, it isn't necessary." The exceptions
would be if you're doing a scale model or some other kind of 'showcase' rocket,
where appearance is of significant importance.
Cliff Sojourner
crinkle-coat right before my eyes. I am so glad to know I am not alone in
"painting hell". conversely the $1.99 OSH brand spray paints & primer work
fine!!
the suggestion to use adhesive vinyl is a good one. we've done that a few
times with great success. the kids like the selection of patterns ...
shoot me if I start talking about getting an airbrush and doing that
stuff...
--
these are the good old days
Cliff Sojourner c...@employees.org
J.A. Michel
crinkle finish. I agree, Rustoleum SUCKS, and has brought me way more grief
than Krylon ever did.
J.A. Michel
"a.hornsbyiii" <a.horn...@attbi.com> wrote in message
news:EPDya.205934$pa5.2...@rwcrnsc52.ops.asp.att.net...
Larry W. Hardin
apply either enamel or lacquer products over lacquer primer (I use Plastikote),
but you cannot apply lacquer over an enamel primer without getting that dreaded
crinkle finish. It takes several days for the primer to really dry, so if you
rush, you'll still have lacquer solvents being released from the primer which
will do a number on an enamel overcoat (or perhaps even another type of
lacquer). With the Plastikote Primer (hint, use the bumper primer on plastic
nose cones and PML Quantum tube), I've successfully used Plastikote classic
lacquers (limited color selection), Testors model enamels, and Top Flite
Lustrekote (nice gloss and brilliant colors) as color coats.
Larry
Karl Martin Joseph Kowert
STD-AGM-78-X, Honest Johns, Saturn V, Phoenix, Interceptors, SR-71, and so
on. Never had a problem with it. Only once where it started to frost on me
because my garage was cold and damp. But I immediately rushed it inside and
the frosting went away. I got lucky.
As pointed out, never mix brands. I did this on some of my static models
and it turned out like doggy do do! :-)
But since my projects are getting bigger (6 feet and over) I will use my
painting toys in my garage with automotive paint. As mentioned, it is the
only way to go, especially on large projects, in my opinion.
KMJK
a.hornsbyiii
first time to have any problems.I even used the Crystal Clear Enamel over
the color coat. After talking to the tech. dept. I don't plan to ever use
the product again. You know it not our problem it you always you it could
never be our products there perfect. YA CRAP!
John
"J.A. Michel" <jm4...@spamnotalltel.net> wrote in message
news:bafmej$qb9$1...@www.flugmodellbau.de...
Bill Rossi
Thats not the reason. Rustoleum just sucks. Ruined the paint job on my 6"
Mercury Redstone. Dont use that crap!!!
\\\///
(O)(O)
--oOO----(__)--------------
: I WILL WORK FOR :
: ROCKET MOTORS :
:-------------------oOO-----:
|__| |__|
|~| |~|
ooO Ooo http://members.aol.com/BULLPUPP/index.html
Stones
news:20030521172712...@mb-m17.aol.com...
> >The number one problem I've encountered is rushing things. In general,
you
> >can
> >apply either enamel or lacquer products over lacquer primer (I use
> >Plastikote),
> >but you cannot apply lacquer over an enamel primer without getting that
> >dreaded
> >crinkle finish. It takes several days for the primer to really dry, so
if
> >you
> >rush, you'll still have lacquer solvents being released from the primer
which
> >will do a number on an enamel overcoat (or perhaps even another type of
> >lacquer). With the Plastikote Primer (hint, use the bumper primer on
plastic
> >nose cones and PML Quantum tube), I've successfully used Plastikote
classic
> >lacquers (limited color selection), Testors model enamels, and Top Flite
> >Lustrekote (nice gloss and brilliant colors) as color coats.
> >
> >Larry
> >
>
> Thats not the reason. Rustoleum just sucks. Ruined the paint job on my 6"
> Mercury Redstone. Dont use that crap!!!
I must be in the part of the country where Rustoleum works. I'll keep right
on using it too. ;-)
Stones
OTRFA
hil...@weinerboy.org
wrote:
<snip bulk of original>
>> Thats not the reason. Rustoleum just sucks. Ruined the paint job on my 6"
>> Mercury Redstone. Dont use that crap!!!
>
>I must be in the part of the country where Rustoleum works. I'll keep right
>on using it too. ;-)
Yep! OK, now in order for this to work for all of us we need a few
details:
1) Which part of *what* country?
2) Moon phase under which you were painting?
3) Position of your feet?
4) Position of your mouth?
5) Local atmospheric composition?
6) Were any family pets/children nearby?
7) What color is your house, and what kind of car do you drive?
8) Are you morally prevented from eating chicken?
9) We're any animals/vegatibles sacrificed prior to painting?
10) Unlike Superman Jim, did you spit into the wind?
Now, we know there's just *got* to be a scientific explaination for
all this, and I aim to find out just what it is...
<vbseg>
a.hornsbyiii
Got a letter in the mail today from Crapoleum saying that their sorry for
the problems and sent me a check for 15 bucks.Funny thing is, I don't
remember throwing down 5 bucks a can at Wally's. I think it was more like
2.79 a can. So hurry up and get yours while their felling generous.
John
<hil...@weinerboy.org> wrote in message
news:3ecc309a...@news1.news.adelphia.net...
Mark Simpson
> Thats not the reason. Rustoleum just sucks. Ruined the paint job on my 6"
> Mercury Redstone. Dont use that crap!!!
OK, here's a revelation from Mr Contact Paper. ;-) I like Rustoleum
better than Krylon. I believe that it has a higher pigment/binder
ratio, hides better and leaves a more mar-resistant, higher gloss
finish. Because of the higher p/b ratio, I believe that it is more
prone to sagging, so extra care should be taken. All rattle can
paints suffer from a common ailment, though. When you use them near
the dewpoint, they will cause fogging, cracking, spiderwebbing and
generally give lousy coatings.
If you live in a high humidity area, paint indoors with good
ventilation or time your painting better. Shoot for mid-day and avoid
times in which dew can be seen on the grass, particularly early
mornings and after sunset.
Mark Simpson
NAR 71503 Level II
God Bless our victorious troops in the Middle East
Stones
news:2ada0da.03052...@posting.google.com...
Tnx for the clear, sound advice. Some of you might have run into a bad
"batch" of paint but, there's no problem, in my book with Rustoleum when
used correctly. I'm very happy with the finishes achieved with this paint.
Stones
OTRFA
Doug Sams
Mark Simpson wrote:
> If you live in a high humidity
> area, paint indoors with good
> ventilation or time your painting
> better. Shoot for mid-day and
> avoid times in which dew can be
> seen on the grass, particularly
> early mornings and after sunset.
What Gus is saying...er, Mark is
saying is: Don't use Krylon in Texas.
Doug
--
doug dot sams at flash dot net
RayDunakin
> area, paint indoors with good
> ventilation or time your painting
> better. Shoot for mid-day and
> avoid times in which dew can be
> seen on the grass, particularly
> early mornings and after sunset.
Good point -- local conditions are a big factor in the successful use of any
paint.
<<What Gus is saying...er, Mark is saying is: Don't use Krylon in Texas.>>
LOL!!