120 engine recommendation
Denis Léveillé
I want a new engine to power my Goldberg Extra 300 and my Great Planes
SuperSkybolt. I have heard good and bad comments on the following
engines: Saito 150, OS 120 Surpass III, YS 120 NC, WEBRA 120. Can anyone
make recommandations on any of these engines?
Brett Jaffee
For 4 strokes, I'd choose either the YS or Saito. Suppesdly, the Surpass
isn't as good. From what I've heard, the YS and Saito produce similar amounts
of power, though the YS has a pump, allowing you to put the fuel tank on the
CG.
I have a YS 120 NC on my Extra and it works great, tho it did have some
initial teething problems (a warped exaust valve).
Don't know much about the Webra. Should be plenty powerfull, tho.
In article <3477A9...@sympatico.ca>, Denis Léveillé
__________________________________________________________________________
Brett Jaffee
Brett's Slope and Power Home Page:
http://www.earthlink.net/~jaffee
The Unoffical Extra 300 Home Page:
http://www.bayarea.net/~nathan/extra300/
REMOVE THE "X" FROM MY EMAIL ADDRESS BEFORE REPLYING!
__________________________________________________________________________
John Ferrell
Saito 150, OK
OS 120 Surpass, more troublesome than you would expect from OS
YS 120 NC, my pick for the power & pump. You do have to get accustomed to
operating a YS.
Webra 120, Considerably more high rpm power than the four strokes. Lugs a
big prop pretty good too. If it is to be a two stroke, do this one, I doubt
the Extra 300 will land at idle, you will probably have to shut down to
land.
The YS120 is my pick.
Denis Léveillé wrote:
> I want a new engine to power my Goldberg Extra 300 and my Great Planes
> SuperSkybolt. I have heard good and bad comments on the following
> engines: Saito 150, OS 120 Surpass III, YS 120 NC, WEBRA 120. Can anyone
> make recommandations on any of these engines?
--
John Ferrell in Julian NC, de W8CCW
Dixie Competition Products
6241 Phillippi Rd
Julian NC 27283
luc...@metrowerks.com
In article <658cmt$5...@suriname.earthlink.net>,
Xja...@earthlink.net (Brett Jaffee) wrote:
The Saito 1.20 is the perfect match for the GP Skybolt; I have this plane
with a 1.20 in it (well, it had a 1.20 in it) and it is (well, was)
ideal. Right now it has my 1.50 in it; the 1.20 has to probably go back
to the factory (it's had the hell run out of it and it's getting old and
rattly), or I may just buy a new one. The 1.50 is too much engine for the
Skybolt (I just have it in there right now so I can fly the thing). The
YS 1.20 has considerably more power than the Saito 1.20. The 1.50 is more
in the power range of the YS. The OS 4 cycles are very good quality, but
there's not much reason to buy one, given that you can get an equivalent
Saito for cheaper, in most cases, and they're lighter and slightly more
powerful. I'm amazed at the price of the new OS .91 Surpass.. 399 bucks
or something like that - you can get a Saito 1.50 for that 8). Or you can
get the Saito .91 for almost half the price... Ok, gripe off..8)))
> For 4 strokes, I'd choose either the YS or Saito. Suppesdly, the Surpass
> isn't as good. From what I've heard, the YS and Saito produce similar amounts
> of power, though the YS has a pump, allowing you to put the fuel tank on the
> CG.
I'm a Saito man these days, so I'll second the Saito recommendation,
especially for the Skybolt. The 1.20 is perfect; it's just the right
weight to get the CG spot on.
Lucien S.
AMA560692
> I have a YS 120 NC on my Extra and it works great, tho it did have some
> initial teething problems (a warped exaust valve).
>
> Don't know much about the Webra. Should be plenty powerfull, tho.
>
> In article <3477A9...@sympatico.ca>, Denis Léveillé
> <Denis.L...@sympatico.ca> wrote:
> >I want a new engine to power my Goldberg Extra 300 and my Great Planes
> >SuperSkybolt. I have heard good and bad comments on the following
> >engines: Saito 150, OS 120 Surpass III, YS 120 NC, WEBRA 120. Can anyone
> >make recommandations on any of these engines?
>
> __________________________________________________________________________
> Brett Jaffee
>
> Brett's Slope and Power Home Page:
> http://www.earthlink.net/~jaffee
>
> The Unoffical Extra 300 Home Page:
> http://www.bayarea.net/~nathan/extra300/
>
> jaf...@earthlink.net
>
> REMOVE THE "X" FROM MY EMAIL ADDRESS BEFORE REPLYING!
> __________________________________________________________________________
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Post to Usenet
DMich27020
Denis,
I have had some personal experience with all of these engines. Here are my
observations:
Saito 150- super strong and torquey. Saito makes a very reliable engine. I
would actually take this over the YS120 due to simplicity. Downside is that you
will probably need a pump if doing aerobatics. I have heard of successes by
attatching a "T" fitting to the vent and connecting a Perry Oscillating pump to
it.
YS 120 NC- YS engines put out awesome power and the pump is included- a
definite plus! The telltale about this engine is that the majority of the
pattern guys use it so it must work! The downside is that I personally see
more flyers tinkering with the YS than with the Saito. I would be very happy
using this engine too.
OS120 Surpass III- My personal opinion (opinion only) is that OS quality has
suffered greatly in recent years. Furthermore, the OS120 Surpasses (pumped)
seem to be dogs and seem to always have a problem. I had a OS120 Surpass II-
it put out only ok power and would load up and quit while going from idle to
throttle advance. I hear the same from most flyers who have used this engine.
For the same price or less, there are better more proven engines on the market.
Also, OS let a lot of flyers hanging with a $400 engine that doesn't work and
now they are asking to trust that it works right on this version. You won't
catch me buying one when I can get a Saito or a YS (who is also owned by
Futaba, by the way).
Webra 120- I have one of these in a Midwest Giles at 10.5lbs. It turns an APC
16-8 around 8900 on 10% nitro. The engine puts out good power, has run
flawlessly and is not expensive. In truth, I would like to have a little more
power, maybe a YS140 or something like that! It will torque roll and climb out
of but not super briskly. On a good engine day it will knife edge loop.
Downside is that it doesn't have the torque or downline braking of a 4-stroke.
On a Goldberg 300, it would be awesome. You do need to use a pump on this
engine too- I run a Perry pressure pump (VP-30) off of crankase fitting.
Bottom line recommendation- any of these will work just fine but I would shy
away from the OS120 for sure. Here's another suggestion and what I would
choose for this plane. The YS91. I have seen this combo (Goldberg 300 and
YS91) and it is way more than enough power to do anything! The plane comes in
under 9lbs and flies great, it has a pump and can be bought for like $250 if
you keep your eyes open!
Dave
>Subject: 120 engine recommendation
>From: Denis Léveillé <Denis.L...@sympatico.ca>
>Date: Sat, Nov 22, 1997 22:58 EST
>Message-id: <3477A9...@sympatico.ca>
Gerald43
> Saito 150, OS 120 Surpass III, YS 120 NC, WEBRA 120.
I'm a Webra fan from way back. That's a horse of an engine!
Gera...@aol.com
"Batman"
Imagicamar
I have found a real nice engine called the GMS2000. The 1.20 is about 500
rpm's stronger then my Webra and is much stronger then the MVVS or Moki
engines. I could not believe it at first but it runs great. I also have to
give the GMS2000 1.20 a 10 out of 10 for quality. When I opened it up it was
clean and you can see the quality in every part.
Give INDY R/C a call that's where I got mine and I am very happy
imagicamar
Tim Mills
>Denis Léveillé wrote:
>
>> I want a new engine to power my Goldberg Extra 300 and my Great Planes
>> SuperSkybolt. I have heard good and bad comments on the following
>> engines: Saito 150, OS 120 Surpass III, YS 120 NC, WEBRA 120. Can anyone
>> make recommandations on any of these engines?
>
>
>
>John Ferrell in Julian NC, de W8CCW
> Dixie Competition Products
> 6241 Phillippi Rd
> Julian NC 27283
>
Hi John. If a four stroke is what you want, choose the YS. It's the
best of the four strokers on your list by far. Since you mentioned
the Webra, though, I'll add another 2 stroke engine to your list to
consider, the GMS 1.20. You'll get a high quality engine that's
significantly lighter and and much less expensive than the YS. You'll
also get MORE POWER. They've got the carburetor right; it's got a
rock solid idle and excellent mixture control from idle through full
throttle. I just set it, and forget it (I like to fly rather than
fiddle). By the way, did I say MORE POWER? <BG> I'm getting over 16
pounds of thrust using an APC 16x8. Performance in your 10 pound CG
Extra should be awesome with this one Definitely worthy of your
consideration. and dollars (IMHO).
Tim
Garnet Brace
>Denis Léveillé wrote:
>> I want a new engine to power my Goldberg Extra 300 and my Great Planes
>> SuperSkybolt. I have heard good and bad comments on the following
>> engines: Saito 150, OS 120 Surpass III, YS 120 NC, WEBRA 120. Can anyone
>> make recommandations on any of these engines?
>John Ferrell in Julian NC,
I have the OS 120 II with pump. A real pain in the b... Others on this
group have indicated a similar problem You have to bypass the pump and
regulator to get reasonable operation. Extra money spent for pump
is thus wasted.
OS is now offering a 120 III. Do you want to risk your money to find out if
they got it right this time?
--
.... Garnet
return address is fake to try to reduce junk mail
if you wish to send e-mail to me please send to cgbi*ionsys.com
only replace the * with @
Olin K. McDaniel
On 26 Nov 1997 03:11:36 GMT, ha...@cent.com (Garnet Brace) wrote:
y
>I have the OS 120 II with pump. A real pain in the b... Others on this
>group have indicated a similar problem You have to bypass the pump and
>regulator to get reasonable operation. Extra money spent for pump
>is thus wasted.
>
I've tried to stay out of this for some time, but my curiosity had
finally pulled me into the fray. I own an OS 120 II with pump, and
flew it hard and frequently for a couple of years. The plane it was
in crashed, and I've got another kit that never seems to come to the
top of things to do, so the engine is in semi-retirement just waiting.
Just what is all this trouble everyone seems to have with this engine?
I never had the slightest bit of trouble, put probably 25 hours on it
and only had to change glow plug once or twice. It was still a
pulling brute when I put it away, no problem that I could see.
A friend had one just like it that he used for pattern flying. He was
flying the contest circuit, which meant lots of hours on his engine.
He did have a failure with the gears in the fuel pump, but I recall he
just replaced the worn parts and kept on going. OK, is this problem
that all on here refer to, that one? If so, why not just buy new
gears and rebuild the pump? Is it that big a deal? I really don't
know those answers, would like to hear, since sooner or later I'll be
using mine again.
Thanks,
Olin McDaniel
Gord Schindler
In <347c9f4b...@news.gabn.net>, omcd...@flosc.net (Olin K. McDaniel) writes:
>On 26 Nov 1997 03:11:36 GMT, ha...@cent.com (Garnet Brace) wrote:
>
>y
>>I have the OS 120 II with pump. A real pain in the b... Others on this
>>group have indicated a similar problem You have to bypass the pump and
>>regulator to get reasonable operation. Extra money spent for pump
>>is thus wasted.
>>
>
>
through it this summer alone. Runs great as long as you use the correct plug(OS type F)
It does run rich at the low end but has never quit and transition to high speed is as
smooth as silk. A lot of folks have tried to "fix" the low end by putting a bypass
in etc but IMHO there is no need for any of this if idle and transition are smooth.
That little trail of smoke at the low end is very reassuring to me!
Regards,
Gord Schindler
Toronto, CA
Robert C. Haas
no comparison, YS outpowers them all.
--
Robbie Haas
rch...@msn.com
Brett Jaffee wrote in message <658cmt$5...@suriname.earthlink.net>...
>For 4 strokes, I'd choose either the YS or Saito. Suppesdly, the Surpass
>isn't as good. From what I've heard, the YS and Saito produce similar
amounts
>of power, though the YS has a pump, allowing you to put the fuel tank on
the
>CG.
>
>I have a YS 120 NC on my Extra and it works great, tho it did have some
>initial teething problems (a warped exaust valve).
>
>Don't know much about the Webra. Should be plenty powerfull, tho.
>
>In article <3477A9...@sympatico.ca>, Denis Léveillé
><Denis.L...@sympatico.ca> wrote:
>>I want a new engine to power my Goldberg Extra 300 and my Great Planes
>>SuperSkybolt. I have heard good and bad comments on the following
>>engines: Saito 150, OS 120 Surpass III, YS 120 NC, WEBRA 120. Can anyone
>>make recommandations on any of these engines?
>
Jim White
**gords**@idirect.com Gord Schindler wrote:
>I have an OS120 Surpass II with a pump and love it. Flown it for 5 yrs now...4 gals
>through it this summer alone. Runs great as long as you use the correct plug(OS type F)
>It does run rich at the low end but has never quit and transition to high speed is as
>smooth as silk. A lot of folks have tried to "fix" the low end by putting a bypass
>in etc but IMHO there is no need for any of this if idle and transition are smooth.
>That little trail of smoke at the low end is very reassuring to me!
if you think about it, since at the low end there is much less fuel
going through the motor, that means there is much less oil going
through the motor, so that "extra" fuel and oil causing the smoke
trail at low end is a definite plus.... as long as the thing doesn't
drown at idle or stumble in transistion....
Jim White
AMA 2466
WB2WOY
WPMPA/BCF
Treasure Island, FL
Brett Jaffee
In article <uLN3I9v#8GA...@upnetnews02.moswest.msn.net>, "Robert C. Haas" <rch...@email.msn.com> wrote:
>no comparison, YS outpowers them all.
>
I'm not too sure about that. I have the NC, at it is certainly powerfull.
However, I am running 20% nitro. This will turn a 16x8 around 9000rpm. I
keep hearing about people using 15% nitro in their Saito 150's that can turn a
16x10 at 9000rpm. From this, I figure the Saito must of similar "umph".
OTOH, the Saito has no pump, so maybe the performace of the YS is better in
the vertical.
Randy Winter
a 16-10 9000.Me and a friend each have identical CG Sukhoi's,his has a
Saito 150 and mine a YS120NC both with APC 16-8 props.His turns 8900 and
my YS 9000.
I just recently replaced the NC with the 140FZ and it turns the 16-10
APC at 8600.All this is on 15% fuel.
Im not bashing the Saito's-I had the 150 in a 1/4 scale Fokker
triplane for a while,but due to exhuast routing problems I replaced it
with a YS120 Standard.The Satio was a strong running engine,swinging
large diameter props better than the YS120FS,but I much prefer the
pressurized fuel system on the YS. Randy Winter
Red Scholefield
> >Denis L=E9veill=E9 wrote:
> >> I want a new engine to power my Goldberg Extra 300 and my Great Planes
> >> SuperSkybolt. I have heard good and bad comments on the following
ne
> >> make recommandations on any of these engines?
FGMAC members have voted with their pocket books. YS-120 is winner in a
landslide. They are the engines selected to go in our ace scale modeler's
SECOND Ziroli DC-3 to replace one lost at R/C World due to gas ignition
engine failure on takeoff climb out.
Others's in Spacewaker IIs, Lazers, Cubs, Big Balsanova, etc. All pilots
are quite happy with them.
________________ Red Scholefield _______________
\_____________ AMA 951 IMAA 18939 _____________/
\__________ Flying Gators Inc. __________/
\________Gainesville, FL ________/
=20
=20