Preferred Saito Fuel???
Sam and Sonja Sorem
Hi there:
I posted a problem I was having with my two Saito .80's, and have
not gotten any responses. I was at a new field (to me) yesterday and
I ran into the local Hobby Shop owner, test flying somebody's new
plane for them. His shop sells Saitos, so I asked him. His first
question was what fuel I was using. When I told him Byrons, this is
what he told me (paraphrased):
He said that Saito recommends Cool Power. He said that Cool
Power has changed their formula as of January 1, to a formula that was
almost tailored to Saito Engine needs. He guaranteed that if I
started running Cool Power my problems would go away.
So, I went to his store and bought a gallon of 10%. By the
second tankful in my Astro Hog the engine was running noticeably
smoother. I buddy corded about five kids on the plane, and it ran
great. I only ran one tank through my Chipmunk, but it by the end of
the flight, it too seemed to be running a little better, but still
nothing like its original power.
Anybody else out there heard of this?
Norm Cecil
Sam and Sonja Sorem wrote:
>
> Hi there:
> I posted a problem I was having with my two Saito .80's, and have
> not gotten any responses. I was at a new field (to me) yesterday and
> I ran into the local Hobby Shop owner, test flying somebody's new
> plane for them. His shop sells Saitos, so I asked him. His first
> question was what fuel I was using. When I told him Byrons, this is
> what he told me (paraphrased):
> He said that Saito recommends Cool Power. He said that Cool
> Power has changed their formula as of January 1, to a formula that was
> almost tailored to Saito Engine needs. He guaranteed that if I
> started running Cool Power my problems would go away.
>
>
> Anybody else out there heard of this?
I didn't answer the first time because I'm no expert on this, but since
you're not getting response from anyone else I'll give you my input.
I've been running a Saito 80 in an Hog Bipe for several months. Originally
running Omega 10 percent fuel, then went to Cool Power 10 percent. Always
had an idle problem. Had to keep the idle about 3000 to be sure it didn't
quit unexpectedly. Much below 3000 and it would start to vary up and down
and usually quit on one of the down times.
Anyway, some one told me to use 15 percent fuel to solve the idle problem. I
now run Cool Power 15 percent and can get reliable idle as low as 2000 rpm.
I use OS #F plugs in all my 4 strokes. Currently running an APC 13X8 prop.
Hog flies great, by the way. Reasonable vertical, and knife edge as far as
you want.
Norm in New Mexico
Michael Wood
I have also been having trouble with my Saito .65 keeping a reliable idle.
I changed from an 11 X 7 prop to a 12 X 6, am using PowerMaster 15%
four stroke fuel, and a McKoy glow plug, which Saito says is the factory
plug for their engines. Still can't keep a reliable idle. Any suggestions on
needle valve settings or procedures?
Mike
Kelly Steele
Mike,
A couple things that helped me were switching to the OS F plug and
going to an all synthetic fuel such as Cool Power 15%. I've never used
Power Master and don't know if it's castor based or not but Saito will
not warranty an engine that's been run with a castor based fuel. Castor
is such a good lubricant that on a four stroke it cools the
engine/glowplug too much at idle. I've used Cool Power 15% in Saito, OS
and YS fourstrokes and they all run great and look like new on the
inside. Just make sure you run the engine rich. A good trail of smoke
is a good thing with a fourstroke. A friend of mine was having trouble
getting his Saito 100 to idle reliably. One cylinder kept cutting out.
He switched to Cool Power 15% and an OS F plugs and it runs just fine
now. Hope this helps.
Kelly Steele
Miles Bowman
Try a Fox Miracle plug, it will probably solve your problem. Miles
Adam Tucker
>A couple things that helped me were switching to the OS F plug and
>going to an all synthetic fuel such as Cool Power 15%. I've never used
>Power Master and don't know if it's castor based or not but Saito will
>not warranty an engine that's been run with a castor based fuel. Castor
>is such a good lubricant that on a four stroke it cools the
>engine/glowplug too much at idle.
Saito does not guaranty any engines run on straight castor oil, a blend
is ok.
And I too am working on my Saito 1.50 idle, Cool power 15% is ok, But I'm
gonna try Omega 15% next. The only problem with castor is that it carbons
up on the valves, don't know about that cooling part.
Adam
RAZORBLAKE
Hey Adam, I also have a Saito 150 and it runs great. I'm currently
using Cool Power 15% with a Airscrew Classic 16x8 Prop, and OS F Plug. It
really pulls my CG Extra 300 out-of-sight. I used a 15% Castor/Synthetic
for Break-In.
Blake
Sam and Sonja Sorem
Mike:
My general luck with Saitos has been great. Something this year
happened, and I don't know what or why. I've been running Byrons for
three years in one Saito 80 and all of a sudden neither one of my
Saito 80's like the fuel. I too run the McCoy plugs. My intitial
experience with Cool Power has been favorable, and I am assuming that
years of Byrons castor mix has built up some gunk that is slowly being
burned out. In all the problems, though, the idle has always been
good. Both .80's and my 1.50 idle in the 2000 rpm range, very
relialbly. I would make sure that you set the high speed needle to
run slightly rich, leave it until the engine has broken in, and then
set the idle needle. Better to have a smooth idle and a little white
smoke on acceleration. The book says this is a sign of over richness,
but I find it works better this way. Also, make sure that when the
throttle barrel is fully closed, the idle stop screw is screwed in all
the way. That screw is what keeps the barrel in the body, and if its
loose it will allow too much free play. Good Luck.
Adam Tucker
Ok Guys, my Saito 1.50 now runs at 2 3/4 turns out on the high end needle,
MUCH better than my 4 turns out, But I'm not sure what fixed it, I
changed 2 things at once, went to Omega 15% and an OS F plug, running a
16X10 master airscrew classis, turns 9,000 even. My only concern is the
idle, how low and how long should it idle, right now at best tweaking of
low end I can idle at 2000 for about a min, and at 2500 for about 2
minutes before she loads up, which should be plenty for a landing
approach.
Adam
>
dreid
I am running my Saito 1.50 on 10% Sig fuel for 4 Strokes it is running
great excellent top end smooth slow idle and smooth transition the prop
I'm using is a 15-8 Zinger. I've got 4 16 Oz tanks of fuel through it.
This has got to be one of the best motors I've ever owned!
The motor runs cool to the touch with the above fuel. I have run it wide
open for a full tank (this morning) when I shut it down I felt the
cylinder and it was warm but not hot to the touch. Muffler was hot!!
(ouch)
Try a couple of tanks of the sig!!
Good Luck!
David Reid
jcla...@icaen.uiowa.edu
sso...@pullman.com (Sam and Sonja Sorem) writes:
>Mike:
> My general luck with Saitos has been great. Something this year
>happened, and I don't know what or why. I've been running Byrons for
>three years in one Saito 80 and all of a sudden neither one of my
>Saito 80's like the fuel. I too run the McCoy plugs. My intitial
>experience with Cool Power has been favorable, and I am assuming that
>years of Byrons castor mix has built up some gunk that is slowly being
>burned out. In all the problems, though, the idle has always been
>good. Both .80's and my 1.50 idle in the 2000 rpm range, very
What did the Saitos do that made you decide they didn't like the fuel?
What has changed with the Cool Power (is it the 15% nitro?). My Saito 80
runs fine on Cool Power (15% nitro) although the idle could be a little
smoother. I have 2.5 gallons through it to date. I have been
considering going to a castor/synthetic blend for four strokes (which is
what I believe the Byrons fuel is that you are using). I am concerned
with this carbon build up that you mention. Most of the 4 stroke engines
at our field use castor/synthetic 4 stroke fuel, no problems to date.
Is something special with the Saitos'? I also believe that the
4 stroke fuel has less oil which is dangerous for new engine but once
broken in should reduce fuel consumption.
Any comments. Should I switch to the 4 stroke castor/synthetic blend?
-John
--
*********************************
John D. Clausen
Biomedical Engineering Department
University of Iowa, Iowa City, IA
Mark & Robyn Byrne
>
> My general luck with Saitos has been great. Something this year
> happened, and I don't know what or why. I've been running Byrons for
> three years in one Saito 80 and all of a sudden neither one of my
> Saito 80's like the fuel. I too run the McCoy plugs. My intitial
> experience with Cool Power has been favorable, and I am assuming that
> years of Byrons castor mix has built up some gunk that is slowly being
> burned out. In all the problems, though, the idle has always been
> good. Both .80's and my 1.50 idle in the 2000 rpm range, very
> run slightly rich, leave it until the engine has broken in, and then
> set the idle needle. Better to have a smooth idle and a little white
> smoke on acceleration. The book says this is a sign of over richness,
> but I find it works better this way. Also, make sure that when the
> throttle barrel is fully closed, the idle stop screw is screwed in all
> the way. That screw is what keeps the barrel in the body, and if its
> loose it will allow too much free play. Good Luck.
>
> Michael Wood <woo...@eosc.osshe.edu> wrote:
>
> >I have also been having trouble with my Saito .65 keeping a reliable idle.
> >I changed from an 11 X 7 prop to a 12 X 6, am using PowerMaster 15%
> >four stroke fuel, and a McKoy glow plug, which Saito says is the factory
> >plug for their engines. Still can't keep a reliable idle. Any suggestions on
> >needle valve settings or procedures?
>
> >Mike
Mike,
I have a Saito 80 in a Goldberg Chipmunk and have had no problems as long as
I use Cool-Power 15% with a O.S. plug. I found that with any other plugs I
couldn't get the idle to be consistant and would flame out on a regular basis.
Funny thing is that this engine seems to only like Master Airsrews of 12 x 8.
I've tried others like Zingers and APC's and the engine runs rough and performance
is bad. As long as I stay with with this combination above the engine runs great,
doesn't overheat or quits. Overall I like the Saito product for the price.
Mark
Sam and Sonja Sorem
I have had two people tell me that use of Byrons will void the
Saito warranty, although as a castor/synthetic mix it shouldn't, as
its not specifically mentioned. The new Saito intstruction book says
that if a 20% castor/synthetic blend with 10% nitro isn't available
then they recommend Cool Power, Power Master or K&B Fuels--Two Stroke!
My Saitos started losing power, and running rough in the mid range.
The idle still was good. I re-adjusted the valves and the problem
remained. The suggestion of new fuel was made by the owner of a local
hobby shop, who said he was a Saito dealer. I haven't run enough of
the Cool Power through the motors yet to know if it is making the
difference, but I'll let the newsgroup know how it turns out. If
you're running Cool Power two stroke, with 10% nitro, I would not
switch to Byrons. Saito is a ringed engine, and the CP is designed
for ringed engines. Keep me posted with any news you hear on this,
please. Thanks.
TOM J HOO
The Saito rep told me that to get the maximum power from their engines you
must use 20% oil. I've been using POwermaster 15% nitro 2 stroke fuel and
get very good results.
TOM