[HO] ACF Center-Flo hoppers and wheel size
Clark Cooper
Allright, I searched through all the materials I have on hand and still can't
determine if an ACF 3-bay Center-Flo hopper has 33" or 36" wheels. Anybody
know? Specifically, I've got several undec Accurail hoppers of this type.
When I put one together, the 33" wheels look too small when I compare the model
to prototype photos. If I stick some JayBee 36" wheels in the trucks, it
looks much better (looks even better yet when I lower the car for the proper
coupler height, to account for the larger wheels).
On a related note, I want to paint/decal several of these in the gray "Great
Northern Grain Loading" scheme (series 171700-171999). There seem to be some
detail differences in the Accurail cars, such as the absence of the triangular
stiffener bar along the upper part of the curved side. Does somebody else
make a model which is more accurate in such respects? TIA.
--
Clark Cooper... Sr. Programmer/Analyst clark-...@uiowa.edu
IMU Information Systems, The University of Iowa
DougTblood
In article <clark-cooper-0...@ccooper.imuis.uiowa.edu>,
clark-...@uiowa.edu (Clark Cooper) writes:
>Allright, I searched through all the materials I have on hand and still
can't
>determine if an ACF 3-bay Center-Flo hopper has 33" or 36" wheels.
Anybody
>know? Specifically, I've got several undec Accurail hoppers of this
type.
>When I put one together, the 33" wheels look too small when I compare the
>model to prototype photos. If I stick some JayBee 36" wheels in the
trucks, it
>looks much better (looks even better yet when I lower the car for the
proper
>coupler height, to account for the larger wheels).
One of the AAR rules for marking on cars is that any wheel size other than
33"
is supposed to be stenciled on the car somewhere. That why when the trucks
need repairs the car knockers KNOW what size wheels are required. It's not
always on the sides however, some roads stuck on the ends w/ the draft
gear
and spring info. Usually 100 ton cars have 36" wheels in my experience,
but
your mileage may vary :^)
>On a related note, I want to paint/decal several of these in the gray
"Great
>Northern Grain Loading" scheme (series 171700-171999). There seem to be
some
>detail differences in the Accurail cars, such as the absence of the
>triangular stiffener bar along the upper part of the curved side. Does
somebody else
>make a model which is more accurate in such respects? TIA.
The ACCURAIL model is a 70's era version of a ACF CF4600 car. The design
is a plate B size hopper; to do this ACF made the car longer rather than
taller.
If you have a Front Range car ( which is a CF4650) and compare them,
you'll
see that the 4650 is about 4' shorter and just under a foot taller. The
70's version of ACF covered hoppers had a ribbed section for a stiffener,
rather than the
triangular one. Modelwise the Front Range car matches GN cars you mention
but still has the wrong stiffeners (the GN cars were 4650's). You could
shorten
a Athearn car to a three bay, change the hopper gates (Detail Assoc
#229-6229)
and the inlet opening to a continous trough and you'd have the old style
4650.
Or if you have or can find an old front range kit, you can scrap off the
stiffeners
and add a bit styrene and you'd have it too.
oh yeah, CF=cubic feet and the numbers are the cube capacity of the
car.....
DougT
Ayer MA
F. DABNEY
Clark Cooper (clark-...@uiowa.edu) wrote:
: Allright, I searched through all the materials I have on hand and still can't
: determine if an ACF 3-bay Center-Flo hopper has 33" or 36" wheels. Anybody
: know? Specifically, I've got several undec Accurail hoppers of this type.
: When I put one together, the 33" wheels look too small when I compare the model
: to prototype photos. If I stick some JayBee 36" wheels in the trucks, it
: looks much better (looks even better yet when I lower the car for the proper
: coupler height, to account for the larger wheels).
You've got a good. Basic rule of thumb is a 70 ton (140,000lb) capy car
takes 33" wheels. A 100 ton (200,000lb) car uses 36" wheels. And a 120
ton car (240,000 lb) uses 38" wheels. There are other more subtle
differences, since the heavier capacity trucks have larger bearings and
other differences in the castings, but there are few commercial kits that
have the right trucks and there aren't many after-market ones either.
: On a related note, I want to paint/decal several of these in the gray "Great
: Northern Grain Loading" scheme (series 171700-171999). There seem to be some
: detail differences in the Accurail cars, such as the absence of the triangular
: stiffener bar along the upper part of the curved side. Does somebody else
: make a model which is more accurate in such respects? TIA.
There have been some good artilcles on these and other ACF cars in mags
like Model Railroading and Rail Model Journal. The Accurail car may be
too modern for GN- I don't know. Aside for dimensional considerations,
the Athearn car is of the design you are looking for.
BTW- if you compare the otherwise dimensionaly similar Front Range cars
with the Accurail car, you'll note the Accurail is quite different in
shape- it's longer and lower. This is correct and makes an interesting
contrast in a grain train made of all the various commercial grain
hopper models. The ariticles in the mags I mentioned explain it.
Fred D.
Watching the action from BNSF MP 1112, El Paso sub
soflsmug
Yes I'm new. And yes I have read most of the FAQs I could find.
But would someone please explain to me.(laymens terms) why they make a
car but have it available say with 6 or more different numbers and no
number at all?
Thanks in advance for your patience with my questions.
Pat LaTorres
This is the easy one. When you see a train of ten or twenty PFE refers
it's kinda nice to do like the real railroads ("the prototype") and have
differefnt numbers on the cars. On model RRs where some form of car order
system is used for switching industries it becomes a requirement, otherwise
you end up with four or five car #s 45627 trying to get into the same
loading dock. An easy way to change the numbers on Athern and MDC HO cars
is to use a pencil eraser to remove the old number, and use the numbers
from a Microscale decal number set of the correct print type to renumber
the car (I know the "Condensed Roman" set works w/Athern SP and the older
PFE cars).
Keep it in "Run eight"
The Dysexic Dispatcher
Clark Cooper
Thanks, Doug and Fred! Ain't this Internet thingie great? ;^)
Douglas E. Menke
In article <4ra3go$f...@dfw-ixnews6.ix.netcom.com>,
sofl...@ix.netcom.com(soflsmug) wrote:
If you look at the prototype, this becomes clear. The numbers they are
referering to are the unique numbers that each car or locomotive the
railroad has. These numbers are how the railroads and the ICC (Interstate
Commerce Commission) keep track of loads, maintenence, ect. It is kind of
like a licence plate for a car. No car in your home state or country has
the same licence plate, and no piece of equipment on a certian railroad
has the same number. Some model manufacturers offer kits with different #s
on them so you don't have to repeat the same number over and over. The
numberless cars are for modelers to add there own numbers if they have
need for more than 6 or 12 or however many kits they offer with different
#s.
Hope that helps
Doug
Douglas Menke
Past President - Lamoine Vally Model Railroad Club
NMRA #107909
Bill Glass/"BondoBilly"
Some mfg's do offer different road numbers, and some repeat the same
roadnumber due to the expense.
MOst of not all model railroad cars are "pad transfer printed" and if the
manufacturer is doing a long run he needsto use steel plates, which can be
very expensive, say around $200/300 per roadnumber, then there is the set
up, each impression must match the previous one. Some of us, print cars
with the number area empty, when the artwork is extremly convoluted, and
then add the numbers the next time thru.
You also have to figure a 1 to 2% loss on every car you print everytime it
goes thru the printer.
The next problem is that nobody has ever accurately documented say all the
Pacemaker car numbers tha Athearn did, vs. Bev-Bel, Thrid Rail Graphics,
Accurate Finishing etc.
Numbers can be very tricky.
Tim O'Connor
clark-...@uiowa.edu (Clark Cooper) wrote:
> Allright, I searched through all the materials I have on hand and still can't
> determine if an ACF 3-bay Center-Flo hopper has 33" or 36" wheels. Anybody
> know ?
Practically all 100 ton cars have 36" wheels (some have 38"). All of your modern
(post-1960) covered hoppers, open hoppers, and most tankcars should have them. A
simple rule is
33" for 50 ton or 70 ton cars
36" for 100 ton cars
38" for 100 ton or 125 ton cars
(A 125 ton car has a "load limit" of 315,000 lbs. Used to be only a handful but
now found on most articulated well-cars, at the articulation joint.)
I won't go into wheelbase and journal size differences since there aren't enough
good model trucks to choose from. But: the Athearn freight car truck is a 70 ton
truck, if you do care. (I don't know what Accurail uses for its truck.)
F. DABNEY
Clark Cooper (clark-...@uiowa.edu) wrote:
: Allright, I searched through all the materials I have on hand and still can't
: determine if an ACF 3-bay Center-Flo hopper has 33" or 36" wheels. Anybody
: When I put one together, the 33" wheels look too small when I compare the model
: to prototype photos. If I stick some JayBee 36" wheels in the trucks, it
: looks much better (looks even better yet when I lower the car for the proper
: coupler height, to account for the larger wheels).
: Northern Grain Loading" scheme (series 171700-171999). There seem to be some
: detail differences in the Accurail cars, such as the absence of the triangular
: stiffener bar along the upper part of the curved side. Does somebody else
: make a model which is more accurate in such respects? TIA.
I was looking at the new Mainline Modeler last night, and ran across a
picture of a BN car, which according to the caption material was
delivered as a GN car, and it is a near match for the Athearn car- four
bays and all. The big difference is that the GN car had the high brake
wheel on the hopper end, the Athearn model has the brake wheel on the low
end of the car on the ladder supports. Can't help with the number since
the picture is of the BN version.
F. DABNEY
Pat LaTorres (duh...@usa.pipeline.com) wrote:
:
: This is the easy one. When you see a train of ten or twenty PFE refers
Exactly. Our club requires a unique number for each car on the layout.
Part of this is because of the operating system (the old car card method)
but it also makes it easier to track who owns which car.
Our practice is that the first person who offers a car gets to keep the
factory number, but if members wish to swap around, that's their
business. With multiple numbers on the cars from the outset, it would
seem less likely this would be a problem. Nope- Murphy predicts that if
E&C offers a gon in six different numbers, and six members show up with
one, they'll all still have the same number. Sigh...
Other places where the multi-number/ no number practice shows up now is
in the new locomotives. Same reasons apply.
Clark Cooper
> I was looking at the new Mainline Modeler last night, and ran across a
> picture of a BN car, which according to the caption material was
> delivered as a GN car, and it is a near match for the Athearn car- four
> bays and all. The big difference is that the GN car had the high brake
> wheel on the hopper end, the Athearn model has the brake wheel on the low
> end of the car on the ladder supports. Can't help with the number since
> the picture is of the BN version.
>
You mean, you get your Mainline Modeler before I get mine?
--Just kidding. Let's not start THAT thread again. ;^)
As a follow-on to this discussion: Doug mentions that I could shorten an
Athearn 4-bay Center-Flo hopper so that it has 3 bays to model the GN car
I was originally asking about. I don't have any Front Range models of the
3-bay (sounds like I should try to find some). But if I have to modify
an Athearn, where do I begin? Cut 4' out of the middle and glue the
rest together? What happens with the roofwalk sections, then? Any tips or
suggestions are welcome, as I've never done a 'bash job before! :-)
This appears to be a relatively cheap project to try, so I'm willing to give
it a go. TIA, again!
DougTblood
>As a follow-on to this discussion: Doug mentions that I could shorten an
>Athearn 4-bay Center-Flo hopper so that it has 3 bays to model the GN car
>I was originally asking about. I don't have any Front Range models of
the
>3-bay (sounds like I should try to find some). But if I have to modify
>an Athearn, where do I begin? Cut 4' out of the middle and glue the
>rest together? What happens with the roofwalk sections, then? Any tips
or
>suggestions are welcome, as I've never done a 'bash job before! :-)
>This appears to be a relatively cheap project to try, so I'm willing to
give
>it a go. TIA, again!
>--
>Clark Cooper...
be forewarned that I haven't done this in years and I sold the one I did
long ago, so this is off the top of my head..... But I am looking at a kit
while I type, so you got that going for you...:^)
You want to cut four feet out of the center; the Athearn car has two lines
that divide the body into thirds to simulate weld marks and you should
sand
them off at some point BTW. Take the underframe and cut out the middle
two bays. When I did this I connected the two ends with some THICK styrene
and then glue one of the bays to the center of that assembly. You'll have
to
come up w/ a new weight and glue that to the top of your rebuilt
underframe.
( cutting the kit weight might be an option, but I'm somewhat lazy when it
comes to hacking up those things) You may also have to shim the middle bay
when
you add that, I'm not sure... You also should add the detail associates
grain
doors around this time.
The roof walks will have to lose four feet also. Looking at it, I'm not
sure
whether you can cut it so the braces line up properly. I figure you'll
have
to remove the braces from the middle and make new ones from styrene
strips.
The hatches are going to be interesting. While I actually found one of
these
GN cars in my slide collection (taken in KC Jul 84 ), I can't see the top
to
know for sure whether they had single continous trough hatch or they used
multiple hatches. The only 4650's I have in my collection are Conrails and
they have three hatches on the roof. Looking through my pieces parts box
I found some spare hatches from a Front Range kit and can cough up enough
for a three hatch car. Yours for the postage if you like.....
A couple of tips....
When you chop the body, leave a little extra for filing so you can get a
good
square end ( I'm somewhat of a hacker and I rely a LOT on using a file to
square things up).
Use styrene to back up the seams. I like to use liquid cement ( testors)
to
soften the ends up on each piece before I actually fasten them together.
Sort of
like plastic welding.....
Use a striaght edge to make sure everything lines up.. ( before the glue
sets ;^))
Sand the joints smooth and use putty ( squadron green) where necessary.
Prime the body and check for any imperfections, fix anything you need to.
BTW the green GN cars that Fred mentioned are GN #171250-171449; change
the bays to grain bays and you'd have a companion to the 4650's. Also I
was
looking thru a Official Equipment Register and noticed that GN had two bay
covered hoppers that were stenciled "For Arsenic Loading Only". Whew......
Lots of dead pigeons around those cars I'll bet.....
Good Luck,
DougT
Ayer MA
Stan Rutledge
Clark Cooper wrote:
>
> Allright, I searched through all the materials I have on hand and still can't
> determine if an ACF 3-bay Center-Flo hopper has 33" or 36" wheels. Anybody
> know? Specifically, I've got several undec Accurail hoppers of this type.
> When I put one together, the 33" wheels look too small when I compare the model
> to prototype photos. If I stick some JayBee 36" wheels in the trucks, it
> looks much better (looks even better yet when I lower the car for the proper
> coupler height, to account for the larger wheels).
> On a related note, I want to paint/decal several of these in the gray "Great
> Northern Grain Loading" scheme (series 171700-171999). There seem to be some
> detail differences in the Accurail cars, such as the absence of the triangular
> stiffener bar along the upper part of the curved side. Does somebody else
> make a model which is more accurate in such respects? TIA.
> Clark Cooper... Sr. Programmer/Analyst clark-...@uiowa.edu
> IMU Information Systems, The University of Iowa
Seems to me cars CAPY. 200000 are all 36" dia wheels. (100 ton
truck). Including most:
Ore cars
Covered hoppers
Tank cars
Center-beam flats
Woodchip gondolas
Coal hoppers
Twin-Stack cars (not necessarily all trucks
are the same, some even 38"
The CAPY 200000 mark will nearly always have a 36"-wheeled
truck beneath it.
Some years back I modeled the "GRAIN LOADING" hoppers by cross-
bashing the Front Range ( now Accurail ) car with the Athearn 4-bay.
Using the Ath body, I cut and fit it to the FR underframe, using
MEK to weld the body together. The FR end ladders, roofwalks were used
on the car. Quite a time-consuming project. But there IS no substitute
for realism.
Using a process like this today, I would add the Kadee 100 ton
metal trucks with 36" wheels.
I have myself scratchbuilt about 75 HO woodchip cars: NP, BN,
GN, AND MRL- in 7 body styles- and I have found:
- quality improves with practice
- no substitute for shop drawings
- metal trucks, wheels, and a little extra weight helps
tracking quality. (train too heavy? Try helpers!)
Note! Three of the BN pre-merger roads had similar hoppers; if you
can find one, (try a grain elevator??) look at the centersill, in front
of the truck on the right- you may see something like GN 171701.
From GN's west end, (lived at Skykomish for 8 years)
st...@everett.net
Ian Wigle
When responding to Clark Cooper, Stan Rutledge wrote:
>
> Some years back I modeled the "GRAIN LOADING" hoppers by cross-
> bashing the Front Range ( now Accurail ) car with the Athearn 4-bay.
This is a common misconception. The Front Range/McKean 3-bay car is a 4650 Cu Ft car
with Plate C clearance. The Accurail car is a slightly longer, although less tall car
which holds 4600 Cu Ft, and meets the slightly smaller Plat B clearance standard.
These cars are most readily distinguished by counting the full width steel plates which
are welded together to make the sides. The shorter, but taller 4650 has 6 full width
plates between the shaped end plates, while the 4600 Cu Ft car (i.e. the Accurail car)
shows 7 full width plates.
Jim Eager did a good piece on these cars over several issues of Rail Model Journal a
year or so ago.
Ian
Clark Cooper
In article <31DCB8...@mail.westonia.com>, Ian Wigle
<iwi...@mail.westonia.com> wrote:
> When responding to Clark Cooper, Stan Rutledge wrote:
> >
> > Some years back I modeled the "GRAIN LOADING" hoppers by cross-
> > bashing the Front Range ( now Accurail ) car with the Athearn 4-bay.
>
> This is a common misconception. The Front Range/McKean 3-bay car is a 4650
> Cu Ft car > with Plate C clearance. The Accurail car is a slightly longer,
> although less tall car which holds 4600 Cu Ft, and meets the slightly
> smaller Plate B clearance standard.
So, is anybody currently producing the 4650 car using the Front Range/McKean
tooling? On a related note (this thread is wandering, but who cares?)
does anybody know anything about this ACF 2-bay hopper that Detail Associates
(I think) has announced? Will they be producing a 3- or a 4-bay hopper?
David Ryujiro Olsen
On Fri, 5 Jul 1996, Clark Cooper wrote:
> So, is anybody currently producing the 4650 car using the Front Range/McKean
> tooling? On a related note (this thread is wandering, but who cares?)
> does anybody know anything about this ACF 2-bay hopper that Detail Associates
> (I think) has announced? Will they be producing a 3- or a 4-bay hopper?
I have the Detail Associates ad in front of me (from RMC). It
has a picture of a Northern Pacific preproduction model - looks great
to me. It's an ACF 2970 two-bay center flow hopper. The ad says that
the model is based on the original 1970s Ramax kit "upgraded to bring
it up to finescale modeling standards." It included wire grabs,
seperate brake system, scale stirrup steps, and redone end frames and
ladders. The ad lists only Undec, ACFX, and NP, but I remember the
Walthers catalog had a list of about twenty roadnames which are
supposed to be released a couple each month. I think the first kits
are supposed to be released in August, but I'm not sure - does anyone
know?
It doesn't sound like they're planning to do other hoppers
(3- or 4-bay), since this is not really an original model, but based
on another manufacturers - unless maybe they're going to redo the
Front Range kit too (doubt it - they'd have to get the tooling from
whoever has it now).
Dave Olsen
Bx39crle
On 5 July 1996, Clark Cooper asked:
>>On a related note (this thread is wandering, but who cares?) does
anybody know anything about this ACF 2-bay hopper that Detail Associates
(I think) has announced?<<
To which David Ryujiro Olsen responded the next day:
>>I have the Detail Associates ad in front of me (from RMC). It has a
picture of a Northern Pacific preproduction model - looks great to me.
It's an ACF 2970 two-bay center flow hopper. The ad says that the model is
based on the original 1970s Ramax kit "upgraded to bring it up to
finescale modeling standards." It included wire grabs, seperate brake
system, scale stirrup steps, and redone end frames and ladders. The ad
lists only Undec, ACFX, and NP, but I remember the Walthers catalog had a
list of about twenty roadnames which are supposed to be released a couple
each month. I think the first kits are supposed to be released in August,
but I'm not sure - does anyone know?<<
I don't know which new roads names are to be released, nor when, but I
recognized the name "Ramax" immediately, since the original kit, which
came out about 10 years ago, had been the only accurate model of the ACF
2970 cu. ft. Center Flow.
A short description of this car can be found in the November 1987 Model
Railroading article by Todd Sullivan (with some help from Eric Neubauer),
"ACF Industries Hi-Cube Center Flow Covered Hoppers, Part I: The "2700"
to "4650" style cars." It mentions the following railroads as some of the
owners of this car: BN, C&EI, CB&Q, CNW, CR, DRG&W, E-L, GN, MP, RI,
SLSF, SP, T&P, and WM.
The 2970's still be seen today in Burlington Northern paint schemes are
derived from the GN and CB&Q cars, plus the former Northern Pacific LO's
represented by the model of NP 75068 in that Detail Associates ad. The
January 1996 ORER listed a total of 374 cars in 3 BN series spanning the
numbers 435500 to 435999.
I noticed a couple of these cars in the BNSF Cicero yard just this last
April, BN 435535 and 435595, both of them in a light grey paint scheme
whose large black BN logos were obscured by streaks of the even lighter
grey cement which had spilled from the 4 round loading hatches atop the
roof and dripped down around the curved, pear-shaped sides.
In addition to those cars bearing BN reporting marks, that January 1996
ORER shows a single Northern Pacific car still serving on the BN, serial
number 75071, plus 3 Great Northern 2970's, which I happened to spot
together at that same location during the previous April: GN 173986,
173988, and 173991.
I would imagine that future Detail Associates kits will include those
lettered for the BN and its predecessors, thus making it easy to have an
accurate, detailed model of the cars mentioned above.
Tom Jelinek
Bx39...@aol.com
DougTblood
In article <4rsiom$5...@newsbf02.news.aol.com>, bx39...@aol.com (Bx39crle)
writes:
>I don't know which new roads names are to be released, nor when, but I
>recognized the name "Ramax" immediately, since the original kit, which
>came out about 10 years ago, had been the only accurate model of the ACF
>2970 cu. ft. Center Flow.
I still have one un-built kit hanging around here. It will be interesting
to see
what D-A has done to upgrade this model. The original wasn't too bad to
begin
with, but times have changed. I seem to recall that the kit came out in
the late
70's, but my mind ain't what it used to be....
>January 1996 ORER shows a single Northern Pacific car still serving on
the BN, >serial number 75071, plus 3 Great Northern 2970's, which I
happened to spot
>together at that same location during the previous April: GN 173986,
>173988, and 173991.
I'm very interested in cars that bear predecessor paint schemes w/ merger
reporting marks ( paint outs is what I call 'em). For example here in mass
we still see NP RBL boxcars sometimes w/ both NP and BN reporting marks.
While I have seen these cars in full BN regalia, mostly they struggle on
w/
somewhat ragged NP paint w/ route of the northcoast limited slogan
intact.
Knowing that, I wonder how many of these BN 2970's listed in the ORER
are full re-paints and how many are long lived quickie stencil jobs.....
> Tom Jelinek
> Bx39...@aol.com
Thanks for the info,
DougT
AYer MA
Bx39crle
On 9 July 1996, DougT wrote:
>>I'm very interested in cars that bear predecessor paint schemes w/
merger reporting marks (paint outs is what I call 'em). For example here
in mass we still see NP RBL boxcars sometimes w/ both NP and BN reporting
marks. While I have seen these cars in full BN regalia, mostly they
struggle on w/ somewhat ragged NP paint w/ route of northcoast limited
slogan intact.<<
I'm also quite familiar with those NP RBL's, their paint so dirtied and
faded that until recently I refered to their color as "blackish-blue." It
was only after seeing the early color photos in Todd Sullivan's "NP Color
Guide to Freight and Passenger Equipment" that I realized that those cars
still in service on the BN are, or were, what that author refers to as "a
striking deep green."
Still bearing Northern Pacific monads and either the "Cushion
Underframe" or "Scenic Route of the Vista-Dome North Coast Limited"
slogans, all of those I've observed had retained their NP reporting marks
with serial numbers in the 96000, 97570, 97600, 97700, or 97800 series.
The only car I've actually seen wearing both an NP monad and BN
reporting marks was a caboose, BN 10038. A photo of a similarly painted
BN 10040 appears on page 11 of Robert C. Del Grosso's "Burlington Northern
Caboose Book." Its caption reads: "These were the final 25 cabooses
ordered by the NP. They were delivered in Cascade green with a yellow
racing stripe as a proposed BN color scheme."
It usually appears that nowadays when assigned a BN reporting mark, a
older pre-merger car will have all indications of its former owner
obliterated, though I wonder if this was the norm right after the merger.
Pre-merger lines aside, this certainly isn't the case with newer recent
purchases from other railroads, i. e., the former Railbox boxcars, and
those obtained from such smaller lines as the Seattle North Coast, the
Oregon & Northwestern, and the East St. Louis Junction.
Getting back to the original subject of this newgroup thread, which is
covered hoppers, those obtained from the more recent acquisition of the
St. Louis-San Francisco usually have those large black letters spelling
"FRISCO" completely covered over by a coat of green or light grey paint as
they switch from SLSF to BN reporting marks.
Thus, I was recently surprised when spotting a small LO still bearing
the large "FRISCO" billboard, but on a side which had been only partially
touched up with a more BN-like shade of light gray, mostly in the lower
left corner to permit the stencilling of its new identifier, BN 462519.
I've received e-mail mentioning that the next issue of the Friends of
the Burlington Northern Railroad's publication, "The Expediter," will
contain "an article, with photos, about BN's second-hand freight cars
(original paint schemes with BN numbers)." Membership in this historical
society is $16 per year and you can obtain an application by e-mailing
Dave Poplawski at p...@mtu.edu.
In the meantime, I'd be interested in hearing of any other specific
examples of such partial repainting on Burlington Northern cars.
Tom Jelinek
Bx39...@aol.com
David Lehlbach
Tom -
Recently BN has begun to replace the (BN) predecessor marks and numbers
with BN initial/numbers. Don't know why the recent change of heart
either. Of course prior to "recently" premerger cars were left alone or
completely changed to BN identification with marks, numbers and BN paint.
The NP RBLs you were talking about are now also appearing with BN
initial and number but with original NP colors. Saw one last week in
Ottawa IL.
-
DAVID S. LEHLBACH UYL...@prodigy.com
DougTblood
In article <4s4735$p...@usenetp1.news.prodigy.com>, UYL...@prodigy.com
(David Lehlbach) writes:
After I mentioned those RBL's in a prior thread, I went through my slides
to check my memory and sure enough all the slides I have of these cars
have NP reporting marks if they are still wearing NP paint. Boy is my face
red!
I was SURE I'd seen some w/ BN reporting marks. If I had, I didn't get any
pictures... It is nice to know that BN is doing this now, must be the
psychic
energy I was projecting ;^)
DougT
Ayer MA
one awshit wipes out ten attaboys......
Bx39crle
Last night, I read David S. Lehlbach's observation of what is apparently
a new policy regarding the re-numbering of the Burlington Northern's
freight cars still in pre-merger markings:
>>Recently BN has begun to replace the (BN) predecessor marks and numbers
with BN initial/numbers. Don't know why the recent change of heart
either. Of course prior to "recently" premerger cars were left alone or
completely changed to BN identification with marks, numbers and BN paint.
The NP RBLs you were talking about are now also appearing with BN
initial and number but with original NP colors. Saw one last week in
Ottawa IL.<<
(The "merger" refered to here is not the recent one of the ATSF and BN
into the BNSF. We're talking about cars such as those still in CB&Q or GN
colors held over from before the original merger of the Burlington
Northern over 25 years ago.)
I sent him a quick reply, thanking him for the information and saying
that I'd be taking a closer look at cars in pre-merger paint schemes,
since I hadn't seen any examples of a new re-lettering practice.
Right after posting that e-mail, I thought, wait, of course you've seen
an example of this re-lettering; after all, David's comments were in
response to my description of a car in a message I sent the night before
to a newsgroup thread entitled "Re: [HO] ACF Center-Flo hopper models (was
re: wheel size):"
>> It usually appears that nowadays when assigned a BN reporting mark, a
older pre-merger car will have all indications of its former owner
obliterated...
Getting back to the original subject of this newgroup thread, which is
covered hoppers, those obtained from the more recent acquisition of the
St. Louis-San Francisco usually have those large black letters spelling
"FRISCO" completely covered over by a coat of green or light grey paint as
they switch from SLSF to BN reporting marks.
Thus, I was recently surprised when spotting a small LO still bearing
the large "FRISCO" billboard, but on a side which had been only partially
touched up with a more BN-like shade of light gray, mostly in the lower
left corner to permit the stencilling of its new identifier, BN 462519.<<
I guess I still regarded BN 462519 as a unique case, an oddity rather
than an example of a new re-lettering procedure.
While writing about it a couple of days ago, I refered to a slide I'd
taken just west of the BNSF Cicero yard on 7 June 1996. But just this
afternoon, I got back some more slides from a roll I shot after that.
Amongst them were 2 shots of light grey FRISCO covered hoppers with
similar re-stencilling of BN reporting marks. Both slides were taken of
cars in moving trains, so I didn't have time to record the car numbers,
and even though I thought of them while describing BN 462519, I recalled
them as merely different views of that same unsual car, which is what I
had taken them to be when shooting the slides around the BNSF Cicero yard
about a week ago.
Now that I'm able to view the recently processed slides, I see two
additional FRISCO LO's with only their reporting marks changed: BN 438365
and BN 462507.
Like BN 462519, they are 3010 cu. ft. LO's with 4 gravity outlets on
their underside and 2 rows of 4 evenly-spaced round loading hatches on
roofs which overlap flat sides showing a 5 & 5 rib configuration.
However, each of these cars now bearing BN reporting marks derives from
a different St. Louis-San Francisco series of covered hoppers.
BN 438365 is part of BN series 438300-438499, listed in the January 1996
ORER as having 155 cars; this BN series consists of cars from SLSF series
78200-78399, 27 of which still serve on the BN according to to that same
ORER.
BN 462507 (like BN 462519 seen earlier) belongs to BN series
462500-462724 with 81 cars listed in the January 1996 ORER; this BN
series derived from SLSF series 78750-78974, which still had 133 cars
listed in January 1996.
From which series will a car still in pre-merger lettering and paint
scheme next show up with only its reporting marks and serial numbers
changed to a BN series?
Tom Jelinek
Bx39...@aol.com
The Larch
There's a listing for the car in the Walthers HO catalog, and it lists a
bunch of names (CSX, Seaboard and Monon catch my interest :) Unfortnately
the price really hurts. It's listed as being a retail of like 16 bucks or
something close to that (not in the catalog, which says TBA for the price)
I looked it up at my local hobbyshop in his computer.
Fred
DougTblood
In article <4sh41q$1...@news.news.wmich.edu>, oc...@yakko.cs.wmich.edu (The
Larch) writes:
Maybe I should take bids for my old Ramax version...... ;^)
Unbuilt, in the original box, with the original price, $4.95 ( i paid 2.99
for
it). Although I gotta admit that the car in the D-A ad looks much better
than the original kit did.
DougT
AYer MA
Ayer Ma, country living at it's best; the sound of the cows up the street
mooing gently, the insistent staccato of M16's in full auto....
The National Guard is on the night shift again. Of course the loaded unit
coal train that just went thru town drowned out all of it.