Shoes for Hardwood Floor?
Bob D'Amore
Does anyone out there have any suggestions for a training shoe which
is good for a hardwood floor? My school recently moved to a brand
new building. While it is beautiful and there is plenty of room, I
find myself missing the carpeted dojang we had in the old location.
The floor can be extremely slippery once you start sweating, but for
the most part, during forms-oriented classes, my feet start to blister
from all the spinning and turning. The shoe the school sells has a
rubber-like sole, which is totally useless as it prevents any movement
at all. Is there something with a leather sole, or some other material
that will be durable, allow some sliding/spinning movement, but not be
as slippery as a pair of socks? Any info would be appreciated.
advTHANKSance! --BobD
--
US MAIL: Bob D'Amore Concurrent Computer Corp.
FAX: 908-870-5952 2 Crescent Pl. Oceanport NJ 07757 Ph: 908-870-4654
UUCP: princeton!ocpt!catfish!bobd or bo...@catfish.ocpt.ccur.com
Steve Popovich
> is good for a hardwood floor? My school recently moved to a brand
Maybe I'm just a stick-in-the-mud traditionalist, but on a hardwood
floor, I wouldn't think that there would be anything better than good
old bare feet. After the first couple of months, almost everybody's
feet seem to get tough enough that blisters large enough to be a
nuisance become a rarity. And developing your own leather-like sole
on your feet is a lot cheaper than buying leather training shoes, too.
:-) It's very durable, because it's self-repairing (healing), and
allows what seems to be a perfect amount of sliding/spinning movement
on a good hardwood floor. I know this isn't what you are looking for,
but I thought that somebody should stand up for nature here.
-Steve
Charles Yeomans
Bob D'Amore <bo...@catfish.ocpt.ccur.com> wrote:
>
>Does anyone out there have any suggestions for a training shoe which
>is good for a hardwood floor? My school recently moved to a brand
>new building. While it is beautiful and there is plenty of room, I
>find myself missing the carpeted dojang we had in the old location.
>The floor can be extremely slippery once you start sweating, but for
>the most part, during forms-oriented classes, my feet start to blister
>from all the spinning and turning. The shoe the school sells has a
>rubber-like sole, which is totally useless as it prevents any movement
>at all. Is there something with a leather sole, or some other material
>that will be durable, allow some sliding/spinning movement, but not be
>as slippery as a pair of socks? Any info would be appreciated.
>
Charles Yeomans
Steve Popovich
> >
> I believe ballet slippers meet your specifications.
Probably, but can you imagine the snickers and sideways glances? I
guess you could pretend that they were some sort of special MA
training shoe, but if it ever got out that they were really BALLET
SLIPPERS...well, the results could be anywhere from a little friendly
ribbing to being invited to prove your manhood (the original poster is
named Bob [D'Amore], so I feel justified in assuming that he [@#$&*
limitations of the English language -- no "unknown gender" pronoun
apart from the depersonalizing "it"] is a man) every class, possibly
for a long time. Maybe I'm biased a bit too much by having heard the
term "dance" used many a time as a term of derision for bad kata done
with no sense of the bunkai, and usually without speed or focus...
-Steve
Joel Stave
|> > >Does anyone out there have any suggestions for a training shoe which
|> > >is good for a hardwood floor? ...
|> > >
|> > I believe ballet slippers meet your specifications.
|>
|> Probably, but can you imagine the snickers and sideways glances? I
|> guess you could pretend that they were some sort of special MA
|> training shoe, but if it ever got out that they were really BALLET
|> SLIPPERS...well, the results could be anywhere from a little friendly
Actually, I've heard that good ballet slippers are quite expensive.
How about tai-chi/kung-fu slippers (you know - the little black things
with the hard sole). They will probably be cheaper as well as somewhat
less mirth producing.
Although for a hardwood floor, I still vote for bare feet.
--
Joel Stave
st...@ch.hp.com
James H. Coombs
>In article <POPOVICH.93...@prince.cs.columbia.edu>, popo...@cs.columbia.edu (Steve Popovich) writes:
>|> > >Does anyone out there have any suggestions for a training shoe which
>|> > >is good for a hardwood floor? ...
These slippers tend to be very slippery. A little on the dangerous
side if you are practicing applications. I slipped once into more of a
split than my body can handle. I had trouble getting up; although I
was not really hurt, I certainly was extremely vulnerable to a follow
up.
>Although for a hardwood floor, I still vote for bare feet.
Bare feet should not be a problem. They can get sweaty though and seem
slippery, but that is not as bad as slippers in my experience. To
toughen them quickly, run bare foot (outside).
I actually hate wearing shoes, but I am getting used to it, and that
seems to be the practice for kung fu out here in CA.
--Jim
Headers may be wrong. Reply to coo...@parc.xerox.com
Tim Scott
>
>Does anyone out there have any suggestions for a training shoe which
[..discussion of trying to work on his school's hardwoord floor omitted...]
Well, Bob, I'm going to be of absolutely no help to you here--perhaps
someone else has something substantial to offer!
But your post brought up something I have wondered about: I don't have
much experience with different forms, but I have a couple of beautiful
printed books about (mainly Japanese) styles where the dojo had this
gleaming, apparently waxed hardwood floor, and all the students were
barefoot.
Is it just me, or
(a) Is this just about the most impossible combination to attempt to
do any kind of forms or sparring on?
and
(b) Is it very "realistic" to learn your skills barefoot on a
hardwood floor? (Yes, yes, I realize that you could theoretically
have to defend yourself in *any* environment, it just seems like
this "dance floor" one is more artificial than most.)
Any comments? Do most indoor schools have carpets? Is this question
worthy of an answer?
James H. Coombs
>gleaming, apparently waxed hardwood floor, and all the students were
>barefoot.
>Is it just me, or
>(a) Is this just about the most impossible combination to attempt to
>do any kind of forms or sparring on?
>and
>(b) Is it very "realistic" to learn your skills barefoot on a
>hardwood floor? (Yes, yes, I realize that you could theoretically
>have to defend yourself in *any* environment, it just seems like
>this "dance floor" one is more artificial than most.)
I have studied at a dance school with hardwood floors and mirrors; also
in an instructors sloping driveway with very rough asphalt---not
normally rough, but crudely rough. Both those places and most of the
places I have studied required bare feet. Yes, the asphalt would tear
up the feet, so we were had no choice but to wimp through techniques
until we had built up the callouses.
I consider smooth surfaces unrealistic. Whenever I have trained
primarily indoors, I have had a lot of difficulty when I tried to
practice outside. All those little bumps make it relatively difficult
to maintain strong and balanced stances. Going from a rough surface to
a smooth surface does not create problems. Yes, you can get burned on
an unfamiliar surface, but there is no way that you are going to train
for every floor, every carpet, every degree of polish. It may be that
floors are more "realistic" because we are more likely to be on a
smooth surface when we need the techniques. Let's put "realistic"
aside. Uneven surfaces are more difficult and challenging, and the
difficulty provides better training. If you can handle uneven
surfaces, you can handle smooth surfaces. For spinning techniques,
smooth, well polished surfaces do not require as much development of
power and control. You can develop graceful 360 degree spins on a hard
wood floor and then find that you can't keep your balance through 180
on a carpet.
At my current school, some of the classes are on a fairly challenging
surface: carpet on top of hard packed dirt. (The carpet keeps the dust
down and provides challenges at the seams.) The unevenness of the dirt
keeps working the feet at different angles. I frequently go for the
areas that are in the worst shape, even if it means that I can barely
get through the techniques. It's tough to do the Bagua mud step over
seams and ripples, but then what good is the mud step if I start
getting hung up someday when I need it (when I start using it
instinctively because of all of the training).
I suppose a reasonable response would be that classes should be on
smooth surface so that people can focus on the technique instead of the
surface. Students should train on a variety of surfaces so that they
will not be dependent on their classroom floors. "Dependent" seems
like a strong word, but I have felt distressingly awkward when going
outside for the first time after months indoors.
Stanley Krystek
i like training in the martial art shoes now available, i have tried
the kung fu slippers etc but they are not well structured and slip
alot....
i have had several pairs of the martial art shoes from master,
pine tree and adidas. The pine tree are the best for the price
since with adidas you pay for the name. I did not like the master
shoes as much as pine tree brand, korean made.
they list for 39.95 for macho shoes or the pine tree (no master shoes in
my asian world catalog) while the adidas are $49.95
the kunf-fu slippers are $4.95 a bargan for wearing around the house
stan
.
--
Stan Krystek
Bristol-Myers Squibb
kry...@bms.com
Rab Morton
>In article <POPOVICH.93...@prince.cs.columbia.edu>, popo...@cs.columbia.edu (Steve Popovich) writes:
>|> > >Does anyone out there have any suggestions for a training shoe which
>|> > >is good for a hardwood floor? ...
>with the hard sole). They will probably be cheaper as well as somewhat
shoe - decent grip, easy to turn on heel or ball of foot etc.
Steel-toed combat boots have their good points as well.
From Rob Morton
IBM UK Laboratories Ltd, Hursley, UK
DISCLAIMER: THE VIEWS EXPRESSED ABOVE ARE THOSE OF THE WRITER
ONLY AND MAY NOT REPRESENT THE VIEW OF IBM UK LABS OR IBM CORP.
Eric Westreich
Until, someone teaches me how to develop leather-like toes and
"upper soles", I think that I'll stick to shoes.
My self-repairing feet are currently in the process of repairing my
big toe due to an unusual stomping accident that would have been
prevented by wearing shoes...I USUALLY use the century martial arts
shoes because I got a great deal on them (< $20).
--
-Eric Westreich Jeet Kune Do
west...@oc.nps.navy.mil KC6IMI
James H. Coombs
>In <CDGtK...@apollo.hp.com>, st...@apollo.hp.com (Joel Stave) writes:
>>In article <POPOVICH.93...@prince.cs.columbia.edu>, popo...@cs.columbia.edu (Steve Popovich) writes:
> I train on a variety of surfaces and find squash shoes are a good all-round
>shoe - decent grip, easy to turn on heel or ball of foot etc.
>Steel-toed combat boots have their good points as well.
Interesting. I found that after years of wearing combat boots, my
ankles were weak. I suppose that training in them occasionally would
not be a bad idea, but I wouldn't want to spend a lot of time in
anything that provides ankle support.
Bob D'Amore
You're right, Steve, I would definitely balk at the ballet slippers.
I just noticed a similar thread about leather training shoes that may
be what I need. Then again, from the e-mails and follow-ups I've seen
so far, "toughen up the bare feet" is getting the most votes. I'm
sure in time I'll adjust. My thanks to those who took the time to
respond. --Bob Testosterone D'Amore (well, it *sounds* Italian)
Bob D'Amore
I noticed this too, in both books and videos. The few tournaments I
have been involved with were also on gymnasium floors. I have no
doubts that it is a good idea to practice and be comfortable on a
hard floor, but it's the repetitive moves of forms and other training
moves like "upper block, chop, roundhouse, punch" while stepping
moving the length of the room that plays hell on the balls of the feet.
We also have a good deal of Hapkido forms where spinning blocks, kicks
and counter strikes are used. For these I miss the carpet!!
curt williams
Charles Yeomans <cyeo...@ms.uky.edu> wrote:
>In article <CDGIr...@catfish.ocpt.ccur.com>,
>Bob D'Amore <bo...@catfish.ocpt.ccur.com> wrote:
>>
>>Does anyone out there have any suggestions for a training shoe which
>>is good for a hardwood floor? My school recently moved to a brand
>>
Perhaps a tongue-in-cheek response, but not far from the mark!
I used to practice on a hardwood floor in (you guessed it) a
dance studio, and I can still sometimes be seen on the hardwood
floors of some of the Fairfax County rec centers. I practice there
just often enough to keep my feet conditioned. Those blisters go
away after a few weeks and are replaced with a real nice callous
barrier. Stick with a bare foot. After all, a ballet slipper is
a close to having bare feet as you can get while wearing a shoe :-)
Michael Peter
a leather upper with a rubber sole with a spin disk on it. It gives you more
traction than a bare foot (especially if that foot is sweating) and still
allows you to spin and turn normally.
Allen Halsell
> In article <CDGIr...@catfish.ocpt.ccur.com> bo...@catfish.ocpt.ccur.com (Bob D'Amore) writes:
> >
> >Does anyone out there have any suggestions for a training shoe which
> >is good for a hardwood floor? ...
>
> [..discussion of trying to work on his school's hardwoord floor omitted...]
>
> much experience with different forms, but I have a couple of beautiful
> printed books about (mainly Japanese) styles where the dojo had this
> gleaming, apparently waxed hardwood floor, and all the students were
> barefoot.
>
> Is it just me, or
> (a) Is this just about the most impossible combination to attempt to
> do any kind of forms or sparring on?
My experience was that it provided good motivation for a strong,
well-balanced stance. Seemed pretty good to me; when I tried it
on a carpet at another place I just about rubbed all the skin off
the bottom of my feet.
> and
> (b) Is it very "realistic" to learn your skills barefoot on a
> hardwood floor? (Yes, yes, I realize that you could theoretically
> have to defend yourself in *any* environment, it just seems like
> this "dance floor" one is more artificial than most.)
I think surfaces could be divided up into smooth (i.e, hardwood,
linoleum, polished concrete) and rough (carpet, dirt, unfinished
concrete). Both seem pretty likely to me. My biggest problem
was how to kick somebody using Nikes; how do I translate the ball
or edge of my foot? The ball gets spread out and isn't effective,
and the edge is padded and in the wrong orientation (would my
ankle give way?).
--
Allen Halsell c...@zeus.jpl.nasa.gov
Stephen...@transarc.com
> concrete). Both seem pretty likely to me. My biggest problem
> was how to kick somebody using Nikes; how do I translate the ball
> or edge of my foot? The ball gets spread out and isn't effective,
> and the edge is padded and in the wrong orientation (would my
> ankle give way?).
How about learning to kick with the heels, toes and insteps as
the striking surfaces?
Stephen Chan ch...@transarc.com |Transarc Corporation
(412)338-6996 |707 Grant St
|Pittsburgh, PA 15219
Allen Halsell
> c...@arsia.JPL.NASA.gov (Allen Halsell) writes:
> > concrete). Both seem pretty likely to me. My biggest problem
> > was how to kick somebody using Nikes; how do I translate the ball
> > or edge of my foot? The ball gets spread out and isn't effective,
> > and the edge is padded and in the wrong orientation (would my
> > ankle give way?).
>
> How about learning to kick with the heels, toes and insteps as
> the striking surfaces?
This is more or less what I came to (except the instep). Thanks.
--
Allen Halsell c...@zeus.jpl.nasa.gov