Wanted info about Robert Bussey
Alex Levitas
Hello !
Can someone please tell me about Robert Bussey ? Thank you.
Regards,
Alex.
Robb
: Can someone please tell me about Robert Bussey ? Thank you.
He's a "ninja"
Robb
Stree...@insideconnect.com
What do you want to know?
Street Ninja
LEESENSEI
Robert Bussey is definitely not a "ninja" He trained briefly with the
Bujinkan dojo until he decided to start promoting himself as a master and
the "king of combat" Basicaly he is a clown who would not dare to show
himself in Japan or at a Bujinkan dojo Tai Kai. He would be laughed ou of
the event.
Lee Drew
Birmingham Bujinkan Dojo
Ray Terry
>> Can someone please tell me about Robert Bussey ? Thank you.
> He's a "ninja"
And the "King of Combat"... <g>
Ray
Jeff Velten
Robb wrote:
>
> : Can someone please tell me about Robert Bussey ? Thank you.
>
> He's a "ninja"
>
> Robb
He most certainly is not a "ninja." Robert Bussey is one of the wannabes
who flocked to Japan after Stephen Hayes came back in the early 70s. He
studied for a short time with Dr. Masaaki Hatsumi, soke of the Bujinkan,
and was granted a shodan, much as one is granted an honorary degree. He
promptly came back to the states and declared himself a ninja master, a
la Frank Dux and Ronald Duncan. You might notice that now the ninja boom
has tapered off he is no longer calling what he teaches ninjutsu...
Curious?
Just a thought,
Jeff
--
____________________
| |
| Dargh QaQ, juH Doj |
|____________________|
R And R Plastics
>: Can someone please tell me about Robert Bussey ? Thank you.
>He's a "ninja"
>Robb
No, he's not. He had some ties to the bujinkan in the 80's (yondan, I think,
hardly a master) and then split for "religious differences" and founded his
manly version of "combat ninjutsu", which is mainly paramilitary style
training with some flashy bujinkan techniques and some
super-macho-flying-devastating-death kicks thrown in to make it "effective".
His taijutsu is very poor and his school is a joke. My instructor was
associated with him until he woke up to the reality of what bujinkan is all
about.
Hope that helps,
Aric
John L. Jones II
What in the world are you talking about? Super macho death kicks? Get
real. Did your instructor leave or was he kicked out? What Bussey teaches now
is an Americanized form of Ninjutsu which does leave out some of the more
traditional Japanese aspects. From what I've seen (I trained under him for a
while) it is an effective art. I believe that he is in fact a ninja, though
I've forgotten how far along the ranks he's gone. There is a biography
available, though I'm not sure if it's still in print.
>
> Aric
--
John L. Jones II E-Mail: bi...@creighton.edu
"The problems that exist in the world today cannot be solved by the
level of thinking that created them."
Einstein (1897-1955)
K. Morelli
Robb wrote:
>
> : Can someone please tell me about Robert Bussey ? Thank you.
>
> He's a "ninja"
>
> Robb
eh.....no. But while we're on the subject, does anyone know if Robert
Bussey trained under Hatsuumi or one of his students?! I've always
wondered exactly where he derived his training (he probably just read
one too many Ashida Kim books :p).
Kev
Pascal n:
a programming language named after a man who'd turn over in his grave
if he knew about it.
David Osegueda
CORRECT EMAIL ADDRESS BELOW!!!
I just thought I would clarify something for people who might be really be
interested. Robert Bussey did achieve the rank of 4th Degree BB in Togakure Ryu
Ninjutsu under Dr. Hatsumi. He stopped teaching Ninjutsu before the Ninja craze died
out. I know this because I am a former student of his. Before I was one of his
students I followed Ninjutsu for awhile. During that time I accumulated alot of
information about Bussey and Ninjutsu. This info did show that he had a valid rank
in Togakure Ryu. There was even a statement published a long time ago(more than ten
years)about four people that Dr. Hatsumi recognized as being his instructors in the
states. On this list he mentioned:
1. Stephen Hayes
2. Bud Malmstrom
3. Robert Bussey
and a Japanese person whom I don't remember at this time.
Bussey has changed his organization alot since I stopped training in it so if anyone
would like updated info go to www.rbwi.com. You can also send email to some email
address' on that page for more info I believe.
My email address(not the one I am posting from)
jj...@dtn.com
Jon Merz
"John L. Jones II" <bi...@nis.lanl.gov> wrote:
>What Bussey teaches now is an Americanized form of Ninjutsu which does leave out some of the more traditional Japanese aspects.<
It must be extremely difficult to "Americanize" something when one has no
understanding of what one is trying to "Americanize."
Jon Merz
Boston Bujinkan Dojo
New England Ninpo Society
mi...@ais.net
> Stree...@insideconnect.com writes:
> In article <4un0jm$5...@alpha.sky.net>, ro...@sky.net (Robb) wrote:
> > : Can someone please tell me about Robert Bussey ? Thank you.
> > He's a "ninja"
> > Robb
He *thinks* he is a ninja. He really isn't.
Silent-Warrior
actually bussey studied in japan for about five years.....decided to leave
bujinkan and mix it with hapkido/tkd. thus destroying it (personal opinion
heh heh) what i want to know is if the rumor is true that he is almost
crippled now??
Mindbendr
In article <01bb8d6b$e613e060$e588...@animania.tiac.net>,
"Silent-Warrior" <shi...@nethosting.com> wrote:
> actually bussey studied in japan for about five years.....decided to leave
> bujinkan and mix it with hapkido/tkd. thus destroying it (personal opinion
> heh heh) what i want to know is if the rumor is true that he is almost
> crippled now??
Crippled? Dunno bout that one, but my guess is that if he is crippled, it
would have to be from all those retarded 6 ft. high dive rolls he did for
glamor shots in Ninja magazine.
---------------
'Of course I've read the Bible, it's my favorite myth.'
Silent-Warrior
LOL!!!
Mindbendr <shi...@richmond.infi.net> wrote in article
<shikima-2008...@news.richmond.infi.net>...
Silent-Warrior
actually he still does claim to teach ninjutsu and recieved his fourth dan
in bujinkan. not that i support him but get it straight. he teaches
ninjutsu if you consider ninjutsu to be one teaching the 18 categories. as
far as traditional ninjutsu? no way. and not like the bujinkan is true
ninjutsu. it is only 1/3.
bussey doenst claim to teach true ninpo. says his background and doesnt
hide what he teaches. be accurate man.
Silent-Warrior
i wouldnt even say he even does taijutsu. more like tkd with some of the
principles of taijutsu thrown in. just look at his students in
UFC.....anyway would a true practioner of ninpo even enter competition?
hmmm could be a new thread. anyone can be a ninja.....not everyone can
study ninpo
R And R Plastics <r&rpl...@mail.worldaccess.com> wrote in article
<r&rplast.13...@mail.worldaccess.com>...
>
> >: Can someone please tell me about Robert Bussey ? Thank you.
>
> >He's a "ninja"
>
>
> >Robb
>
> No, he's not. He had some ties to the bujinkan in the 80's (yondan, I
think,
> hardly a master) and then split for "religious differences" and founded
his
> manly version of "combat ninjutsu", which is mainly paramilitary style
> training with some flashy bujinkan techniques and some
> super-macho-flying-devastating-death kicks thrown in to make it
"effective".
> His taijutsu is very poor and his school is a joke. My instructor was
> associated with him until he woke up to the reality of what bujinkan is
all
> about.
> Hope that helps,
>
> Aric
>
Silent-Warrior
well fourth dan is a little more than briefly in my book
LEESENSEI <lees...@aol.com> wrote in article
<4uod0c$q...@newsbf02.news.aol.com>...
LEESENSEI
If Robert Bussey is authentic, then I would certainly expect to see him at
the Tai Kai or in Japan on occasion. The fact is that he wouldn't dare
show his face to the people who he claims taught him. I have been in this
art for a long time and have been to all of the Tai Kais and have never
met this man. I do know that he travelled to Japan and for a couple of
trips and trained very briefly with Nagato San. He has offended many of
the shihan instructors and is considered to be no more than a bad joke.
Again, he is welcome to prove me wrong. All he has to do is attend a Tai
Kai and compare his skills to those of us who have legitimately been
studying this art for decades. I consider myself to still be a beginner
at this art but I would have put my knowledge about tai jutsu and the
Bujinkan dojo up against his even back in the eighties.
Silent-Warrior
bussey recieved 4th dan under bujinkan auspices. not sure if hatsumi
directly
K. Morelli <mor...@primenet.com> wrote in article
<321191...@primenet.com>...
> Robb wrote:
> >
> > : Can someone please tell me about Robert Bussey ? Thank you.
> >
> > He's a "ninja"
> >
> > Robb
>
> eh.....no. But while we're on the subject, does anyone know if Robert
> Bussey trained under Hatsuumi or one of his students?! I've always
> wondered exactly where he derived his training (he probably just read
> one too many Ashida Kim books :p).
>
John L. Jones II
Jon Merz wrote:
>
> "John L. Jones II" <bi...@nis.lanl.gov> wrote:
>
> >What Bussey teaches now is an Americanized form of Ninjutsu which
> >does leave out some of the more traditional Japanese aspects.<
>
> It must be extremely difficult to "Americanize" something when one has > no understanding of what one is trying to "Americanize."
I don't suppose you have any support for that allegation. What was
I thinking, of course you don't. None of the people attempting to trash
Bussey has managed to provide any, and I doubt if your post is any
different. If memory serves me he's a 4th dan. Of course if you want to
argue that 4th dans aren't knowledgeable about the art . . .
>
> Jon Merz
> Boston Bujinkan Dojo
> New England Ninpo Society
--
John L. Jones II E-Mail: bi...@nis.lanl.gov
LEESENSEI
Jon Merz wrote:
>
>"John L. Jones II wrote:
> >what Bussey teaches now is an americanized form of ninjutsu which does
> >leave out some of the more traditional japanese aspects.<
>
>it must be hard to "Americanize" something when one has no understanding
of
> what one is trying to Americanize."
>
> I dont suppose you have any support for that allegation. What was I
thinking, >of course you don't. None of the people who are attempting to
trash Bussey has >managed to provide any, and I doubt if your post is any
to argue that 4th dansaren't >knowledgeable about the art ..........
Actually John I have provided quite a bit of support for this allegation
on this newsgroup. The simple fact is that Robert bussey is considered to
be a fraud by the members of the Bujinkan dojo. The very organization that
mr. busseymakes his claims about. I can speak from over thirteen years of
personal expeirience that this man knows next to nothing about the
Bujinkan dojo. I have been to all of the Tai Kais since 1988 and have
never seen him at one. He is afraid to show his face in japan. He
certainly doesn't want to meet the instructor he claims to have learned
from. I can tell you that Nagato san is not a fan of mr. Bussey. ( If
Nagato san were after me I'd go into hiding to) . Robert Bussey is
certainly not recognized as an instructor by Hatsumi soke. This is all
ample evidence that mr. Bussey is a fraud. As I have said before, if mr.
Bussey wants to be seen as a legitimate instructor then all he has to do
is appear at the Tai Kai and compare his knowledge and skills to those of
us that have legitimately been studying this art for years. If you want
the dates and information about the upcoming Tai Kai then feel free to
e-mail me. Mr Bussey can make many claims but being a legitimate ninjutsu
instructor is not one of them. Even back in the eighties he was not
demonstrating good tai jutsu. All of the people that you were referring
to as trying to trash Robert Bussey, are legitimate members of the
Bujinkan Dojo and that should tell you something.
mi...@ais.net
> "Silent-Warrior" <silent-...@martial.com> writes:
> i wouldnt even say he even does taijutsu. more like tkd with some of the
> principles of taijutsu thrown in. just look at his students in
> UFC.....anyway would a true practioner of ninpo even enter competition?
> hmmm could be a new thread. anyone can be a ninja.....not everyone can
> study ninpo
I agree. Anybody can call themselves whatever they want. I can call myself a
Buddhist master of Shinanju and state that the movie Remo Williams was based
on my training of an American student. Whether this is true or not is irrelevant.
People are smart enough to know that this is bullshit. (If not at first, than with
a little time they will.) In the end, I would only be deluding myself. Ninpo is all
about learning more about myself...being more honest. On this issue alone,
Bussey seems to have failed.
miko
mi...@ais.net
> "John L. Jones II" <bi...@nis.lanl.gov> writes:
> I don't suppose you have any support for that allegation. What was
> I thinking, of course you don't. None of the people attempting to trash
> Bussey has managed to provide any, and I doubt if your post is any
> argue that 4th dans aren't knowledgeable about the art . . .
I think a big problem in M.A. is that students are expected to silently obey the
instructions of their sensei. When a student does something that the community
views as negative, it reflects on the teaching abilities of the sensei. (The sensei
could have done everything he could, but still have a bad student.) This pretty
much leaves quiet word of mouth among the students to get information.
Another factor that is involved is that rank (whether dan or kyu) means very
little in the Bujinkan. It is how well one "performs" that is the criteria. If someone
wants to be a black belt in Ninjutsu, and is foolish enough to pay the money for
the license, his money will be gladly taken. The question of this practice being
correct is not being addressed--this is how it is.
Also, to be promoted into the Godan level, one needs pass a test. There are three
attempts to pass the test, or the test is a failure. The test requires the student to kneel
in seiza and be in meditation. Hatsumi-soke silently comes up behind the student with a
bamboo training stick (shinai--I think) and will strike at the student. The student is
supposed to move out of the way of the strike. Mind you, no sound is made by
Hatsumi-sensei in his movements. Side note: Tradition dictated the use of a real
sword, but things changed with the times.
So, by word of mouth among the Bujinkan and Kasumi-An students has it that
Bussey trained for a while with Hatsumi-sensei. It is also said that he pretty much
bought his ranking; Then he went back to the States to open up his own schools.
I haven't heard anything about what rank Bussey attained. I tend to believe that
it was Shodan, but I don't follow Bussey's activities with much attention. In light
of the Godan test, it would not be any surprise if he did obtain 4th dan ranking.
There is also the issue that it takes about two years (on average) to progress
from one dan to another, but I know nothing about the length of training that
Bussey had with Hatsumi-sensei. Anyway, students from the Bujinkan/Kasumi-An
have seen Bussey's technique, and have said that he hasn't really personalized the
concepts of Budo Taijutsu that most people have when they reach the Shodan level.
There are also the comments that Bussey retains the trappings of commercialism that
brought attention to Ninjutsu in the 80s.
So, it boils down to who do you want to believe. It is your choice.
miko
Jon Merz
"John L. Jones II" <bi...@nis.lanl.gov> wrote:
>
> I don't suppose you have any support for that allegation. What was
>I thinking, of course you don't. None of the people attempting to trash
>Bussey has managed to provide any, and I doubt if your post is any
>different. If memory serves me he's a 4th dan. Of course if you want to
>argue that 4th dans aren't knowledgeable about the art . . .
>
>John L. Jones II E-Mail: bi...@nis.lanl.gov
>
>"The problems that exist in the world today cannot be solved by the
>level of thinking that created them."
>
>Einstein (1897-1955)
Robert Bussey studied ninjutsu for approximately six months. During this
time, he "got" his black belt because Hatsumi-sensei was showing kusari
fundo techniques one night and because there were no practice fundo
around, they used black belts. Hatsumi-sensei tossed one of them to
Bussey to practice with and Bussey took this to mean he had just been
awarded his shodan. Obviously, anyone who has seen his video tapes where
he roars at the camera before leaping into some kind of double
dragon-esque flying barrage of kicks will realize that six months is
about what his taijutsu technique looks like.
Regarding Bussey and his "fourth" dan, before he left, he pestered the
crap out of Nagato-sensei for more rank and Nagato petitioned
Hatsumi-sensei. Hatsumi-sensei, well used to dumb rank-hungry Americans
begging for rank, said sure, give it to him. Boom. Fourth dan. With no
degree of fourth dan experience to back it up. After that Bussey left
the Bujinkan saying the fifth dan test conflicted with his Christian
teachings. More likely, he just didn't want to get knocked out when he
proclaimed himself ready to sit for the godan test.
Rumor has it that Bussey so enamored himself to the shihan in Japan, that
if he ever shows his face in Noda City again...well, you know. This may
also be the reason why no one from Bobby's organization ever shows up to
Tai Kai's and other events where Japanese shihan are. Apparently, many
of them would like nothing more than to
IMHO, fourth dans in Bujinkan Budo Taijutsu know a great deal about the
art, and they certainly know a helluva lot more than I do. However,
those are fourth dans that have actually trained for years in this stuff,
not some Nebraska dude who wanted to be a ninja in six months. Bussey is
a bogus ninjutsu fake. Go to him if you want to learn something other
than Bujinkan Budo Taijutsu.
Beauwolf
I agree whole heartedly.
by the way. since when does attending a Tai kai have anything to do with
the fact that someone has studied ninjutsu in the past? That is like
telling a person that he MUST be in church every Sunday in order to
believe in God.
(i dont believe that attending one of these "tai kai s" makes someone a
ninja either.)
When the ninja of ancient Japan trained, they trained as killers. period.
that was their job.(if that same definition holds true, then noone is a
true ninja anymore) Ninpo and taijutsu were modified many times over to
obtain a more effective fighting art.
Do you really think that one of the ninja masters of old would persecute
Robert Bussey for modifying taijutsu? No way. they would applaude him if
his efforts were fruitful in jproducing a more effective fighting art.
Ninja were not concerned with traditionalism. They were concerned with
what worked. What Bruce Lee did with the concepts of Jeet Kun Do, the
ninja were doing hundreds of years ago with Ninpo.
the ninja had to have the most effective fighiting art of their time. Out
of neccessity. they had to fight ougunned and outnumbered against men who
were in my opinion, some of the greastest swordsmen in history. The
samurai.
What i see out of everyone who condemned Robert Bussey, is the same old
"if he doesnt hold true to our style, or changes it in any way, then it
is garbage" mentality.
If I am correct, Tanemura Sensei broke the traditionalism of Bujinkan and
founded the Genbukan. This was because of disagreements with Hatsumi
Sensei about how ninjutsu should be taught.
In Tanemura's opinion, Hatsumi had watered down ninjutsu. Made it too
soft.
They both learned form the same man. Perhaps, they both gained something
different from his knowledge.
( i dont think that any of you RBWI bashers out there has the courage to
put down on Tanemura Sensei) Now do you......?
Jarrett
> since when does attending a Tai kai have anything to do with
> the fact that someone has studied ninjutsu in the past?
It doesn't. Mr. Bussey obviously studied in the Bujinkan in the past.
Unfortunately, it wasn't too long before he had "upset" a few of the
Shihan. The fact that Mr. Bussey won't show his face at one of(if not
the)biggest annual Bujinkan event, alludes to the fact that he knows how
some of the Shihan feel about his past transgressions.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Do you really think that one of the ninja masters of old would persecute
> Robert Bussey for modifying taijutsu?
The fact is: We will never know. Any speculation into this matter is
just that.
-=--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Ninja were not concerned with traditionalism.
No, they were not. I doubt that Mr. Bussey ever learned any actual
ninjutsu though. He was probably shown a handful of techniques from
Koto and Gyokko ryu ha, as were most of the early Americans that
traveled to Japan. These ryu ha are of Samurai decent, and as you know,
the Samurai were infamous for upholding their traditions.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> What i see out of everyone who condemned Robert Bussey, is the same old
> "if he doesnt hold true to our style, or changes it in any way, then it
> is garbage" mentality.
Actually, I think you are seeing the "A man who has only trained in this
art for six months(Jon Merz's words), hasn't put in enough time to
master the techniques of the art; and therefore has no right to decide
which are worthy and which need to be changed" mentality.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> If I am correct, Tanemura Sensei broke the traditionalism of Bujinkan and
> founded the Genbukan. This was because of disagreements with Hatsumi
> Sensei about how ninjutsu should be taught. In Tanemura's opinion, Hatsumi had > watered down ninjutsu. Made it too soft. They both learned form the same man. > Perhaps, they both gained something different from his knowledge. ( i dont think
> that any of you RBWI bashers out there has the courage to put down on Tanemura Sensei) > Now do you......?
First of all, this is a poor attempt at a rouse. I doubt that any
Bujinkan practitioners will be baited in by such an inane challenge.
It is still unclear if Tanemura was ever a student of Takamatsu. Being
Hatsumi's right-hand man(and senior most student, I assume) for a number
of years, does give Tanemura much more right(than Bussey) to question
the Bujinkan's adherence to the tradition of Takamatsu.
-Jarrett
h...@airmail.net
Nukimi
I once asked one of the Japanese Shihan about Bussy when he was a little
tipsy. I didn't get the story of how Bussy got his black belt, but
according to him, Bussy was always making himself a pain to Nagato. He was
constantly comparing himself to others with him sounding better, he hinted
he should have a higher rank and he acted like a know it all. Finally
Nagato got sick of it and said (In essence) "You think you know it all and
don't need to learn any more? Well, now you're a fourth dan and at
training tomorrow with Hatsumi you can take the fifth dan test. Let's see
how much you know then." Bussy never showed up for any more training and
fled on the first plane out he could. This explains why A) he got his rank
in such a short amount of time in Japan, B) many people refer to his
fourth dan as honorary since it was really dependent on him taking the
fifth dan test and C) why Nagato, who gave Bussy his forth dan, wants to
break him in two should he ever meet him again.
I do not know if Bussy has any certificates of his ranks and I would
question their legitimacy if he did have them. I once saw a picture of him
with a godan patch and I know he never took the test. Someone who saw the
patch up close said it looked like a copy made from a picture of an
original.
One thing that has been over looked in this discussion is the matter of
teaching licenses. In traditional Japanese arts rank does not have as much
import as teaching licenses and unlike rank they can be revoked if someone
starts teaching in a different manner than what the style teaches. Kind of
like a medical diploma is permanent but a doctor can have his license to
practice should he start doing anything unethical. Bussy probably never
has had a shidoshi- ho and if he did at one point it has probably been
revoked. As such, he can't say he is teaching Togakure-ryu unless he has a
current license from Hatsumi. He can say that he has trained in the
Togakure- ryu, but that is kind of like a TKD teacher who takes a weekend
seminar with Rick Gracie and then opens up a Gracie Jujutsu studio
claiming to be competent instructor.
Bussy's style is more Korean than Ninjutsu. Most of his experience is
with Korean arts so it is not surprising that when he "improved" on the
art so much of it came to resemble TKD. Last I had heard, he has at least
two knee operations, is nearly crippled and one of his students lasted
mere seconds in an early bout of the UFC.
As for the mention that none of his students have shown up at Tai Kais
and the like- not true. I remember a person who I can only describe as
being a young punk at the San Francisco Tai Kai. He wore a Bussy t- shirt
and when Hatsumi was showing a hanbo technique he insisted on practicing
with a Kyoketsu Shoge on his own rather than practice anything as mundane
as a stick. He tried to give it to Hatsumi at the end and Hatsumi merely
passed it on to one of the Shihan.
grandmao...@gmail.com
> Hello !
> Can someone please tell me about Robert Bussey ? Thank you.
>
>
> Alex.
He's an arrogant fake who touts his own popularity he thinks he has. He believes himself to be god's gift to the martial arts and women (cuz we all want to f*ck him dontcha know). His first wife divorced him because he couldn't keep his dick in his pants. Class A fake asshole.
bussey...@yahoo.com
> Hello !
>
> Can someone please tell me about Robert Bussey ? Thank you.
>
> Regards,
>
> Alex.
On Monday, August 12, 1996 at 2:00:00 AM UTC-5, Alex Levitas wrote:
> Hello !
>
> Can someone please tell me about Robert Bussey ? Thank you.
>
> Regards,
>
> Alex.
bussey...@yahoo.com
BURKE THE BOLD
> Hello !
>
> Can someone please tell me about Robert Bussey ? Thank you.
>
> Regards,
>
> Alex.