Schrade closes, putting 250 out of work
David
By Jonathan Ment , Freeman staff 07/30/2004
ELLENVILLE - After struggling through economic downturns, security
concerns that made it unlawful to travel with some of the company's
products and - to hear neighbors tell it - decades of mismanagement,
knife and tool maker Imperial Schrade sent the last of its production
workers home for good on Thursday.
Company officials could not be reached for comment, but local
estimates were that some 250 employees received letters about the
shutdown and left the U.S. Route 209 plant after a 9 a.m. meeting.
By noon, the smell of mildew wafted through the unmanned window of the
plants' reception area - a room that at that appeared to have been
recently renovated with new carpeting and fixtures.
With crossed arms covering an identification badge, an employee in
shirt and tie said the official company comment on the closing was "no
comment." An officials statement would be released, he said, though
none had come by Thursday evening. Other staff members could be heard
talking behind closed doors.
IMPERIAL Schrade, which turned 100 this year and once was among the
largest private-sector employers in Ulster County, laid off more than
150 workers last year but had recently begun hiring again.
Employment at the Ellenville plant numbered near 700 in early 2001 but
had dropped below 300 in recent months after a series of deep cuts
that began later in 2001.
Schrade's 548,000-square-foot factory was added to the Kingston-Ulster
Empire Zone earlier this year, and Catherine Maloney, zone
coordinator, said Schrade cited employment of 382 as of Dec. 31, 2003.
Among the factors hurting Schrade's bottom line was that knife orders
fell sharply after the terrorist hijackings of Sept. 11, 2001, led to
sharp objects being banned from airplanes.
TALKING outside a coin laundry on Center Street in Ellenville, Susan
Horvath said she used to work at Schrade and that production usually
increased at this time of year to meet demand for holiday orders.
"They really did nice work," said Horvath, who worked for the company
for about 10 years, ending around 1989.
"I think a lot of them were expecting it," said Winslow Wiggins,
another former employee. "Imports really can't compete."
"I worked there four years ago, but only for four months," said
Wiggins, noting it was his second job at the time. "I had to take a
cab there, and if I was two or three minutes late, they docked you."
DOWN THE street, at a bar called The Other Place, a female patron
ordered another drink with, "Howie, you working? 'Cause I'm not."
"She was laid off this morning," said bartender Howie Damms. "Quite a
few guys came in. I don't think they'll be coming in now. ... It's
really going to hurt our business."
"They might as well put a 'Closed' sign on the whole town," said Mike
Barret, also at the bar. "'Shut down due to no industry.'"
"If you don't have a car, you're not going to survive," said Carl
Hoar, on the stool next to Barret's.
"Schrade hadn't given them a raise in three years," he added.
TOWN OF Wawarsing Supervisor James Dolaway called it "a sad day in the
town of Wawarsing."
"We, as the Town Board, feel for the families that will be affected by
this closing," Dolaway said. "It's going to have an effect on our
town." Ellenville is a village within the town of Wawarsing.
FAWN Tantillo, director of the Ulster County Office of Employment and
Training, said Schrade failed to notify the state Labor Department
about the impending closure, and she was surprised by the news because
Schrade had indicated a need for more employees in recent weeks.
"We had people here who hoped to get their old jobs back," said
Tantillo, a former Ulster County legislator.
Dislocated workers from Ellenville are generally eligible for job
training, and will receive it if money becomes available, she said.
Chester Straub, president of the Ulster County Development Corp., said
discussions between Schrade and such groups as Empire State
Development and the Catskill Watershed Corp. have been ongoing in an
effort to help Schrade access money for training or secure government
contracts and other resources.
IMPERIAL Schrade's roots date to the 1870s and the Ulster Knife Co. of
Ellenville. Imperial Schrade is a combination of that firm, the
Schrade Cutlery Co., which was founded in Walden in 1904, and the
Imperial Knife Co., formed in 1916 in Providence, R.I.
The mergers produced the Imperial Knife Associated Cos., later renamed
Imperial Schrade Corp.
http://www.dailyfreeman.com/site/news.cfm?BRD=1769&dept_id=74969&newsid=12542021&PAG=461&rfi=9
kalis
Sad news. Sorry to hear that a good ole' American product couldn't
compete with all of the foreign knockoffs.
Mike
Jim Funk
the foreign knockoffs that were much cheaper.
"kalis" <mike...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:e2e0da76.04081...@posting.google.com...
J Craggs
(kalis) wrote:
>Sad news. Sorry to hear that a good ole' American product couldn't
>compete with all of the foreign knockoffs.
>
>Mike
Nothing personal here, Mike. Your email was
just a covenient entry point into this topic.
Okay... It's always sad when a
long-established business shuts down and people lose
their jobs. (I've been made redundant three times in my
life, so I've some idea what I'm talking about).
But...
Did anyone force anyone else to *buy* the
'foreign knockoffs'. Did gangs of Taiwanese or
whatever strong-arm merchants round up millions of
Americans and march them into Walmart or wherever and
refuse to let them out unless they were carrying at
least one cheap knife/saucepan set/toolkit.
Obviously not...
Nobody *forced* my countrymen to buy Japanese
bikes/cars instead of British either. But they did...
In bloody droves.
To rewrite the guns/outlaws slogan, "When
everyone buys cheap, then cheap will be all you can
buy."
And I've not even touched on the undeniable
fact that *some* foreign stuff is damned good.
Times change, Folks. And for those of us who
chose to live in a time-warp bubble (myself most
definitely included in this group) it costs.
Gyppo
John Craggs - Writer - Adult Tutor - Storyteller
and All-Round Rogue
Need a laugh? Then subscribe to the free Monday Silly Digest:
mail to: gyp...@ntlworld.com With 'MSD SUB' as subject.
Mark South
news:<nlseh01amtmjm7cbo...@4ax.com>...
> > The final cut: Schrade closes, putting 250 out of work
> Sad news. Sorry to hear that a good ole' American product couldn't
> compete with all of the foreign knockoffs.
They weren't knockoffs of Schrade. All I ever saw of theirs in shops was 1930s
type designs. Have you checked how well 1930s-style cars, watches, sound
systems, toys and games, food, and movies are doing in the marketplace? From
the complete absence of them among consumers, probably not very well.
And before some retro-weenie jumps in, the retro stuff that does currently sell
is very high end and high quality, not made like something you stamped out in
your backyard.
You see, you have to make stuff that people want to buy. It's called
Cap-ital-ism, and since not everyone succeeds in making stuff that enough people
want to buy, occasionally a company goes under.
Making stuff that people want to buy: profitable.
Weeding out inefficient weak companies: priceless.
For everyone else, there's Com-mu-nis-m
--
Mark South: World Citizen, Net Denizen
Mark South
news:_F7Sc.16117$Mq1.8...@news20.bellglobal.com...
> schrade might as well have been in china, the quality is about on par with
> the foreign knockoffs that were much cheaper.
That's an insult! I have a Taiwanese knife I picked up in a backstreet shop
somewhere in the Far East. Cost me 12 USD. The steel is generic 410 or 420,
but the manufacturing quality, precision, and finish embarrasses my Benchmades
and Spydercos and makes a Schrade look like it belongs in the gutter.
Bill
Let's not confuse mainland China and Taiwan! They might speak the same
language and the peoples are all chinese, but there's a huge difference
between them in government, economies, and manufacturing.
In my opinion:
Taiwan = good products, good gov't. Our allies. Democracy.
China = bad products, bad gov't. Might be a future enemy. Commies.
Yes, I know it's very oversimplified, but I think you get my point.
--
Bill H. [my "reply to" address is real]
www.necka.net
Molon Labe!
Carl.
news:g41jh0lgn8d26m2rb...@4ax.com...
> In my opinion:
> Taiwan = good products, good gov't. Our allies. Democracy.
> China = bad products, bad gov't. Might be a future enemy. Commies.
> Yes, I know it's very oversimplified, but I think you get my point.
Not really oversimplified. That's about how it is. The only detail not
included is that not all Chinese people are fascist communists (yes, those
two go together, both are used as a lie for the other), most likely just the
government.
---
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Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
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brian w edginton
<usenetcarlTHISP...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>"Bill" <nob...@spamcop.net> wrote in message
>news:g41jh0lgn8d26m2rb...@4ax.com...
>> In my opinion:
>> Taiwan = good products, good gov't. Our allies. Democracy.
>> China = bad products, bad gov't. Might be a future enemy. Commies.
>> Yes, I know it's very oversimplified, but I think you get my point.
>
>Not really oversimplified. That's about how it is. The only detail not
>included is that not all Chinese people are fascist communists (yes, those
>two go together, both are used as a lie for the other), most likely just the
>government.
>
>
But let us not forget that the mainland Chinese government is making
every effort to join the "International Community". At least, in a
trade sense.
Sure....they are trying to hold onto internal power at the same time.
They are becoming a huge power in the trading sense. They are not
going to back away from that.
The best the "West" can do is to keep trading. The further the Chinese
get into the world trade scene, the less of a threat they will be.
Affluence is , IMO, the drug that pacifies the wildest of fascist
beasts.
And, frankly, while they are sending us the low-quality products that
we are not forced to buy, they are buying our exports. As far as I
know, China is on the other end of the trade balance.
And, frankly (again), while we buy discerningly, their exports will
get better.
brianWE
I live and learn....mainly, though, I just live.
Mark South
>
> >"Jim Funk" <JIM_F...@AOL.COM> wrote in message
> >news:_F7Sc.16117$Mq1.8...@news20.bellglobal.com...
> >> schrade might as well have been in china, the quality is about on par with
> >> the foreign knockoffs that were much cheaper.
> >
> >That's an insult! I have a Taiwanese knife I picked up in a backstreet shop
> >somewhere in the Far East. Cost me 12 USD. The steel is generic 410 or 420,
> >but the manufacturing quality, precision, and finish embarrasses my
Benchmades
> >and Spydercos and makes a Schrade look like it belongs in the gutter.
>
> Let's not confuse mainland China and Taiwan!
No confusion. They are both "foreign" to me.
> They might speak the same
> language and the peoples are all chinese,
You need to find out more about China's language and ethnicity if you believe
that.
> but there's a huge difference
> between them in government, economies, and manufacturing.
Like many generalisations, the response is "yes, and no".
> In my opinion:
> Taiwan = good products, good gov't. Our allies. Democracy.
Up to a point.
> China = bad products, bad gov't. Might be a future enemy. Commies.
Up to a point.
> Yes, I know it's very oversimplified, but I think you get my point.
Up to a point.
> Molon Labe!
Oh no, you're one of those....
--
"I would recommend Iowa or North Dakota for your dip into reality."
- Ed Dolan in alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent
kalis
I get your point John, I don't like Wal-Mart either. Hurts local
businesses. I stopped going there a while back. I wish others would
do the same.
Thanks,
Mike
Chas
> You see, you have to make stuff that people want to buy. It's called
> Cap-ital-ism, and since not everyone succeeds in making stuff that enough
people
> want to buy, occasionally a company goes under.
If a free market was the standard, Schrade could have competed like anyone
else.
The political posture that allows a country like China to enter a market
without the strictures imposed on other manufacturing nations is
unconscionable.
It isn't 'capitalism' when the market is controlled by government, and
nothing to do with the 'quality of the product'. The access we extend to
them is not reciprocated in the least- China has been a closed market to us;
Japan is effectively closed, Taiwan can't possibly qualify as a trading
partner in equity- particularly as they're on the edge of war with China all
the time. Malaysia, Pakistan, Indonesia, Bhangladesh, India.... they
couldn't compete if we didn't give them the advantage over our own domestic
production.
Chas
Mark South
news:V82dnZ1epJ5...@comcast.com...
Hey Chas, I see you're an expert on macroeconomics the same way you're an expert
on other things.
--
"I'm constantly shocked at how low ARKites opinions
are of me. Probably shouldn't be, but I am."
- Stacia in ARK
Chas
> Hey Chas, I see you're an expert on macroeconomics the same way you're an
expert
> on other things.
And I see that you have no more of note to say than your usual ad hominems-
you're pitiful.
Chas
cco...@yahoo.com
or K-Mart's who are in essence exactly the same thing. Both K-Mart and
Target carry the same made in Taiwan/China/Japan stuff, just with a slightly
different brand name on some items. Fair is Fair and Walmart isn't the only
evil entity out there.
David C.
kalis <mike...@yahoo.com> wrote:
: I get your point John, I don't like Wal-Mart either. Hurts local
Tetsubo
>
>I get your point John, I don't like Wal-Mart either. Hurts local
>businesses. I stopped going there a while back. I wish others would
>do the same.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Mike
>
>
In my area there were no Mom & Pop stores left for Wal-mart to push
out. It was all the large chains, K-mart, Ames, etc. I shop at Wal-mart
because it's cheap and often carries what I need. I do support small
businesses but for items that a chain store are unlikely to carry. I
make a point to buy something at a store I like each time I go.
--
Tetsubo
My page: http://home.comcast.net/~tetsubo/
--------------------------------------
If fifty million people say a foolish thing, it is still a foolish thing.
-- Anatole France
Bill
>"Bill" <nob...@spamcop.net> wrote in message
>news:g41jh0lgn8d26m2rb...@4ax.com...
>> "Mark South" <mark....@null.invalid> Spaketh Thusly:
>>
>> >"Jim Funk" <JIM_F...@AOL.COM> wrote in message
>> >news:_F7Sc.16117$Mq1.8...@news20.bellglobal.com...
>> >> schrade might as well have been in china, the quality is about on par with
>> >> the foreign knockoffs that were much cheaper.
>> >
>> >That's an insult! I have a Taiwanese knife I picked up in a backstreet shop
>> >somewhere in the Far East. Cost me 12 USD. The steel is generic 410 or 420,
>> >but the manufacturing quality, precision, and finish embarrasses my
>Benchmades
>> >and Spydercos and makes a Schrade look like it belongs in the gutter.
>>
>> Let's not confuse mainland China and Taiwan!
>
>No confusion. They are both "foreign" to me.
>
>> They might speak the same
>> language and the peoples are all chinese,
>
>You need to find out more about China's language and ethnicity if you believe
>that.
But... you didn't seem to feel there was a difference between buying a knife
from China and one made in Taiwan?
>> but there's a huge difference
>> between them in government, economies, and manufacturing.
>
>Like many generalisations, the response is "yes, and no".
As I said below - I oversimplified.
>> In my opinion:
>> Taiwan = good products, good gov't. Our allies. Democracy.
>
>Up to a point.
>
>> China = bad products, bad gov't. Might be a future enemy. Commies.
>
>Up to a point.
>
>> Yes, I know it's very oversimplified, but I think you get my point.
>
>Up to a point.
>
>> Molon Labe!
>
>Oh no, you're one of those....
Speaking of generalizations...
Anyway, try it, you might like it. There's ~80 million of us.
K Horner
square a few years ago. You remember, tanks versus protestors. I don't
figure I need to send American dollars to a country that treats its citizens
in that manner. Call it voting with my wallet. It may not change anything,
then again, it might.
"brian w edginton" <ed...@REMOVETHISbigpond.com> wrote in message
news:f15jh0tb4h825q57f...@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 11 Aug 2004 03:20:38 GMT, "Carl."
Bill
"K Horner" <k...@comcast.net> Spaketh Thusly:
>
>"brian w edginton" <ed...@REMOVETHISbigpond.com> wrote in message
>news:f15jh0tb4h825q57f...@4ax.com...
>> On Wed, 11 Aug 2004 03:20:38 GMT, "Carl."
>> But let us not forget that the mainland Chinese government is making
>> every effort to join the "International Community". At least, in a
>> trade sense.
>> Sure....they are trying to hold onto internal power at the same time.
>> They are becoming a huge power in the trading sense. They are not
>> going to back away from that.
>> The best the "West" can do is to keep trading. The further the Chinese
>> get into the world trade scene, the less of a threat they will be.
>> Affluence is , IMO, the drug that pacifies the wildest of fascist
>> beasts.
>> And, frankly, while they are sending us the low-quality products that
>> we are not forced to buy, they are buying our exports. As far as I
>> know, China is on the other end of the trade balance.
>> And, frankly (again), while we buy discerningly, their exports will
>> get better.
>
> Well this may be true, but I still can't forget what happened in that
>square a few years ago. You remember, tanks versus protestors. I don't
>figure I need to send American dollars to a country that treats its citizens
>in that manner. Call it voting with my wallet. It may not change anything,
>then again, it might.
I agree with both of you. A fat, prosperous China is less of a threat than a
hungry one with nothing to lose. But I still don't want to support commies
with a miserable human rights record.
I don't think an "easy answer" to this exists.
Carl.
news:411a5c7d$1...@news.bluewin.ch...
> Hey Chas, I see you're an expert on macroeconomics the same way you're an
expert
> on other things.
Going on this and previous discussions, it appears that Chas is a modern
Mercantilist, though not so much as other residents of this group.
---
Update your PC at http://windowsupdate.microsoft.com
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.737 / Virus Database: 491 - Release Date: 8/11/2004
Mark South
news:_KDSc.3348$M8...@fe2.texas.rr.com...
> "Mark South" <mark....@null.invalid> wrote in message
> news:411a5c7d$1...@news.bluewin.ch...
> > Hey Chas, I see you're an expert on macroeconomics the same way you're an
> expert
> > on other things.
>
> Going on this and previous discussions, it appears that Chas is a modern
> Mercantilist, though not so much as other residents of this group.
I'm not a fan of Chas, but even I would never have called him such a nasty name
in a public forum :-)
Mark South
How can you interpret that as an insult[1]? You have previously proclaimed your
expertise on all known subjects right here in this group.
[1] Actually, it can only be "ad hominem" if one is human. Are you sure?
--
"You need to declare a jihad on your own ignorant ass."
kalis
The K-Marts around me went out of business. Now you have these mega
Wal Farts that also serve food, cut hair, give eye exams, rotate
tires, etc. More locals are going to hurt from this. When's it going
to end?
Mike