drams equiv conversion to fps?
eddie
seen the remington dale earnhardt, jr. "hi-speed 8's" are listed at 1390
fps.
i'm also looking for a 12 ga. recipe to reload a similar load of 1 oz.
shot, but the top speed i'm seeing in all the recipes online is only
1290...
thanks,
eddie
Dick
and the other of speed. The drams equivalent on a shot shell box indicates
theat the load with smokeless powder is equivalent to the black powder load
(for example 3 drams)
"eddie" <ed...@22acacia.ave> wrote in message
news:Xns93F0D389DC685...@209.210.176.62...
G. M. Zimmermann
charcge of black powder it would take to achieve the velocity attained by a
given load. Example: you see a box of shells marked as "1 1/8 oz, 3 1/4 Dr.
Eq." this means it would take 3 1/4 drams of black powder to propell 1 1/8
ounces of shot to approximate velocity these shells are loaded to. A 1 oz load
at 3 1/4 Dr. Eq. would achieve a higher velocity then a 1 1/8 oz load at 3 1/4
Dr. Eq. The system is highly outdated and eventually stop useing it and list
the approximate velocity on all shotshell ammo.
-Zimmy
Buzz Chandler
news:Xns93F0D389DC685...@209.210.176.62...
> seen the remington dale earnhardt, jr. "hi-speed 8's" are listed at 1390
> fps.
>
to anything, it should be grains of powder.
Juan Aranda
unit of measurement, used from the time when blackpowder was used to load
cartridges. The grain, on the other hand, is a mass (weight) unit of
measurement. The different densities of the powders would require a
specific formula, to convert each one of them. But only to have the
variations from lot to lot make it useless, the next time buy powder that's
not from the same lot. It is like converting litters into pounds. One
litter of water won't weight the same as one litter of lead, and so on.
Old traditions die hard, that's the only reason we still see dram
equivalents on our shotshell boxes. If you buy European shotshells, you'll
have a harder time finding any reference to dram on their boxes.
C-Sports
"hi-speed 8's" are listed at 1390
fps.
i'm also looking for a 12 ga. recipe to reload a similar load of 1 oz.
shot, but the top speed i'm seeing in all the recipes online is only 1290...
thanks, eddie
If you use hodgdon Longshot powder,
AA Hulls, Winchester 209 primer, WAA12 wads, 1 1/8 oz loads produce
32.1 grains= 1420 FPS, 9200 psi
33.2 grains= 1475 fps, 10,10,100 psi
34.4 grain= 1530 Fps 11,10,100 psi
I have use this load and WOW it is fast !
I haven't shot this one, but it is in the book
if you use Remington R12L wads, with 37.1 grains, you get up to 1585 FPS at
11,000 psi
In the Hodgdon book, there are no 1 OZ longshot loads
Chris
C-Sports Optical
Robert Grizzard
>
>
> "eddie" <ed...@22acacia.ave> wrote in message
> news:Xns93F0D389DC685...@209.210.176.62...
>> seen the remington dale earnhardt, jr. "hi-speed 8's" are listed at 1390
>> fps.
>>
> to anything, it should be grains of powder.
DON'T DO THIS!
One dram is 1/16 ounce. One ounce is 437.5 grains. Three drams, then,
is 82.03125 grains -- a four times overload for a 3 dram equivalent
charge of Red Dot under 1-1/8 ounce of shot. You'd be firing a grenade
six inches in front of your nose.
eddie had it right in the first place; W drams of black powder gives X
ounces of shot in a Y bore gun a velocity of Z feet per second. A
charge weight of B grains of smokeless powder gives X ounces of shot in
a Y bore gun a velocity of Z feet per second, where W, X, Y, and Z are
the same in both relationships. It doesn't matter how big B is; it
*will* vary between powder brands for the same W equivalent, X, Y, and
Z. There is no way to convert directly from drams equivalent to grains.
To answer your question, eddie, there is no way to convert directly from
DrEQ to velocity. There are tables available, and ISTR the Lyman
shotshell reloading manual has one in it that covers 10, 12, 16, 20, and
28 gauge and 410 bore shotguns.
HTH
--
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Gene Nygaard
> Even that conversion (drams to grs) would be tricky. A dram is a volumetric
> unit of measurement, used from the time when blackpowder was used to load
> cartridges. The grain, on the other hand, is a mass (weight) unit of
> measurement.
Wrong. The dram involved here is not the fluid dram. It is the
avoirdupois dram, equal to 1/16 of an avoirdupois ounce, or 27 11/32
grains troy exactly, or about 1.772 grams. (This, of course, is
pretty convincing evidence that the grain is not really a part of the
avoirdupois system; it's just that back in the time of Henry VIII, the
independent standards for the avoirdupois units were abandoned, and
the avoirdupois pound was defined as an exact fraction of the troy
standard; today, it is an exact fraction of a different mass standard,
the kilogram.)
Of course, there was also another dram in the past; the apothecaries
dram is 1/8 of a apothecaries ounce (the same as the troy ounce, but
with different subdivisions between the ounces and the grains, both of
which are the same), or 60 grains apothecaries = 60 grains troy =
3.8879346 g.
An avoirdupois dram is 1/256 avoirdupois pound, and an apothecaries
dram is 1/96 apothecaries pound.
Gene Nygaard
http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Gene_Nygaard/t_jeff.htm
But if it be thought that, either now, or at any future time, the
citizens of the United States may be induced to undertake a thorough
reformation of their whole system of measures, weights and coins,
reducing every branch to the same decimal ratio already established
in their coins, and thus bringing the calculation of the principal
affairs of life within the arithmetic of every man who can multiply
and divide plain numbers, greater changes will be necessary.
U.S. Secretary of State Thomas Jefferson, 1790
eddie
news:20030910193218...@mb-m15.aol.com:
> Dr. Eq. does not directly equate to fps. What it tells you is the
> equivilant charcge of black powder it would take to achieve the
> velocity attained by a given load. Example: you see a box of shells
> marked as "1 1/8 oz, 3 1/4 Dr. Eq." this means it would take 3 1/4
> drams of black powder to propell 1 1/8 ounces of shot to approximate
> velocity these shells are loaded to.
yes, i know this but how can i calculate that velocity so that i can try to
find a recipe that comes close? all the reloading recipes give approx.
velocity...
thanks,
eddie
Rick Courtright
> Dr. Eq. does not directly equate to fps. What it tells you is the equivilant
Hi,
Looking at the replies, I'm thinking the OP asked what time it is, and
we're telling him how to build a watch.
There are "standardized" equivalents to be found in virtually all
shotshell loading info, eg. 2 3/4 dr eq w/ 1 1/8 oz in a 12 ga = approx
1150 fps. So the dram equivalent we see today tells us today's smokeless
load gives us approx. the same velocity as if we'd loaded 2 3/4 dr of
b/p, or approx 1150 fps.
Is this what the OP was looking for? If so, one just looks at the
loading books... one column will usually give the dr eq load, another
column the target velocity, a third column the actual tested velocity.
HTH,
Rick
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To e-mail me is easy: if you send no SPAM in the message, you need no
SPAM in the address.
Will
>
> 33.2 grains= 1475 fps, 10,10,100 psi
>
> 34.4 grain= 1530 Fps 11,10,100 psi
> I have use this load and WOW it is fast !
>
> I haven't shot this one, but it is in the book
> if you use Remington R12L wads, with 37.1 grains, you get up to 1585 FPS at
> 11,000 psi
What if one loaded 000 buckshot using these size loads? Say 7 000
sized lead shot each weighing 68 grains each. Plus a little filler.
That would weigh in at 1-1/8's or 1.125 ounces. That's exactly what
the load data above is pushing. That would be pushing 7 ".36"/9mm
caliber projectiles at 1585 fps! That's a pretty impressive load!
That's roughly 379 foot pounds of energy (fpe) per projectile from the
muzzle! We are talking 9MM para performance! Could you imagine what
a short barreled sub-machinegun set to fire 7 round bursts can do?
Then just load this hot load of 000 buckshot and find out. More
control and better chance of hitting something not to mention
attainable by everyone reading this post. This could certainly be
reliable out to 50 yards...light clothing or not! Opinions/input?
Bet this could fit in a 2.5 inch shell too, but who really cares. Be
nice to carry six rounds in my Mossbergs magazine. Nicer if I could
carry six rounds in the magazine of a Norinco 97'. Sure these would
kick like a mule. Though with a slam fire shotgun (ie...Norinco 97')
you could send 42 projectiles down range as fast as you can rack that
mother. Be nice to keep close to the back door for those pesty
boogermen. Did I mention we had a breakin? Wish I could catch them
in the act with ole' Betsy in my hand.
Stu
eddie
helpful posters kinda got off track a little...maybe my original question
wasn't quite clear.
thanks to all who replied,
eddie