Remington 300 Ideal (O/U) ---- any good??
Ahmed Sultan Kashif
I have never own a shotgun before, and have been thinking about buying one
(over/under only) for the last six months (SIX months?? well, it takes a
fortune to get one). After doing some research on the internet and couple of
local gun stores, I liked (1) Rem. 300 Ideal 28" and (2) Brownig Citori
Satin the most. Tell you the truth, I know nothing about them other than
they looked good to me esp. remington 300 ideal (only have seen it on the
internet and the remington official product catalog), and the price
difference between them is around $500 (browning is cheaper).
Now, like all of them have asked, you 'd also want to know what do i need it
for?? And my answer is, like always, since I cant afford to buy/keep more
than one, I want something really versatile. Something i can take out to the
hunting and trap/skeet shooting (dont know the difference) as well.
Additionaly, a gentleman at a local gun store said that he would prefer
silver or gold finish (i dont know if I m using the right terminilogy) over
satin, since they dont turn into blue (or something like that) which could
reduce the gun's worth down the road.
Any advice, experience, pro/cons, ideas or even other recommendations would
be very much appreciated. Feel free to email me directly.
Thanks in advance,
Ahmed Kashif
ah...@u.arizona.edu
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You can learn about rec.guns at http://doubletap.cs.umd.edu/rec.guns
Albanygun
very good guns for some time, and you rarely see them on a skeet, trap or
sporting clays range. The last good one was the Remington 3200. Anyway,
the Browning can be seen everywhere, will hold up for thousands of shots,
and will bring a good price if you decide to sell it. Before you buy
anything, hang around a skeet, trap, and sporting clays range and try to
shoot as many types as possible. You may not even like a O/U, and prefer to
go with a gas operated autoloader, such as the Beretta or Browning. As far
as satin or blue, you'll pay more for the satin, but you'll get more if you
decide to sell. I prefer the satin myself.
Bob E.
You will receive many different answers to your question. The main factor to consider is, "Does the gun fit you?" That being said, beware of the lemmings at the gun range. These people will follow the lead of anybody and change guns on a yearly basis or more frequently because they have the financial means. The Remington 1100 (autoloader) has won more skeet and trap tournaments than any shotgun in history. Yet, the trendy gun today is the Binelli, next month it will be the Beretta followed by the new Sig of HK. The list goes on.
The other gentlemen stated that Remingtons are not good as of late, to that I say hogwash. That is a myth. My son has a "Peerless" predecessor to the Ideal which works just fine. After thousands of rounds at the range it has never misfired.
Good luck in your quest, and try them both. Buy the one that feels the best.
BMoorehrny
I don't follow trap closely so I am not sure of that, but it has not won more
skeet tournaments than any other. Remember that skeet is a game shot in 4
gauges. I know you can get 1100's in all four gauges but it has never been the
best way to go. For the past 20 years the hot ticket on the skeet field has
been the tubed over and under. Before that it was the 4 barreled set O/U. As
far as trendy gun on the skeet field, in the way of autoloader it is the
Berretta 390. Several top ranked shooters shoot a tubed O/U in the 3 smaller
gauges and then shoot the 390 in the 12 gauge. Think about it. For every one
match one with an autoloader there is usually 3 matches won with a O/U.
JOHN GARAND
> ...
While it is true that skeet is shot in all four gauges, not all skeet
competition is shot in all 4, nor do all competitors shoot all 4.
There are, or have been in the past, far more
(certified/accredited/whatever term used for formal) skeet
competitions in 12 gauge than in the other 3 gauges combined.
> ...
The statement that the 1100 has won more competitions than any other
single shotgun may still be a valid statistic, even if your view that
in the last 20 years O/Us have ruled the field is absolutely correct.
For starters, IIRC, the statistic on the 1100 has been around at least
25 or more years (as has the shotgun). No single model of O/U is most
favored by the great majority of competitors, and "O/U" is not a
model, but a type. I certainly remember when the 1100 was considered
the king of the skeet and trap game, but IIRC that was in the late 60s
and few decent O/Us were available at anywhere near a reasonable
price in a time when new homes averaged $24.00 per square foot,
almost all new cars cost between $2,500 and $5,000.00, and an annual
salary of $12,000 put you in the middle class.
> ...
BMoorehrny
#single shotgun may still be a valid statistic
Your quote of the original statement is incorrect. The statistic you mention
does not exist and was an opinion. I am not knocking the 1100. It is without a
doubt a fine shotgun with a long and honorable history. I am simply saying that
it is not possible to know which shotgun has won more skeet tournaments than
any other without a research project that would have to span the entire 80 year
history of American Skeet. As for what is winning more tournaments today than
any other that is unknown as well.
#There are, or have been in the past, far more
#(certified/accredited/whatever term used for formal) skeet
#competitions in 12 gauge than in the other 3 gauges combined.
This is completely false. I have my records annual right here with me. Please,
before you say something as statistcal fact have something to back it up.
JOHN GARAND
##The statement that the 1100 has won more competitions than any other
##single shotgun may still be a valid statistic
#
#Your quote of the original statement is incorrect.
Pardon me for the abbreviation, but please note that it was not a
quote. The original statement was:
#> The Remington 1100 (autoloader) has won more skeet and trap tournaments than
#>#any shotgun in history.
Obviously you believe my restating of that changed the intent or
content. I respectfully disagree.
#The statistic you mention does not exist and was an opinion.
OK, you say it does not exist, and you obviously have some proof that
what I read (IIRC) about 25 years ago was someone's opinion. As you
know it was an opinion, do you also remember who rendered that
opinion? If so, refresh my memory by telling me who stated the
opinion as I no longer remember in which publication I read it
(American Rifleman is the likely suspect) other than it was probably
about 1975 when I first read it.
# I am not knocking the 1100. It is without a
#doubt a fine shotgun with a long and honorable history. I am simply saying that
#it is not possible to know which shotgun has won more skeet tournaments than
#any other without a research project that would have to span the entire 80 year
#history of American Skeet. As for what is winning more tournaments today than
#any other that is unknown as well.
Honestly, people have mis-spent their time on less worthy projects.
:-)) It would not surprise me if someone actually did go through 55
years (at that time) of records. You are probably correct that it
didn't happen, but it wouldn't surprise me if it did. Particularly
since I believe the vast majority of recorded events would have
occurred after 1946, and probably after 1960. The average John Q.
Public wasn't shooting trap and skeet during the depression and WW II.
After the returning GIs got their education, careers, families and
houses on track in the late 40s and through the 50s there was time and
money to engage in trap and skeet. My recollection may be faulty, but
I don't recollect trap and skeet being extremely popular shooting
events at most clubs prior to the 60s, though the popularity grew
exponentially from about the mid-60s. But I was involved in small
bore and service rifle in the late 50s and early 60s, which might have
skewed my perception of what people were doing. I just don't remember
much in the way of equipment for the shotgun sports at clubs in those
days. I do remember such equipment being installed on new shotgun
ranges in the late 60s - and I still wasn't participating in the
shotgun sports so it may not be a case of selective perception (though
it could be a case of the part of the country where I reside).
##There are, or have been in the past, far more
##(certified/accredited/whatever term used for formal) skeet
##competitions in 12 gauge than in the other 3 gauges combined.
#
#This is completely false. I have my records annual right here with me. Please,
#before you say something as statistcal fact have something to back it up.
I based my statement on the fact that trap and skeet competition held
at clubs I have been a member of over the last 40 years or so were
shot virtually to the exclusion of any gauge other than 12. I
suspect we are speaking of two different situations, and I am probably
at fault for the terminology I used. I see the term "formal
competition" as any competition organized and held by any club or
other organization, as opposed to a couple or three guys going out to
the range. I can certainly see where you could read what I wrote as
"sanctioned" (a term I understand, and avoided using - but can see
what I wrote could be read as including sanctioned), it was late and I
should have either revised what I wrote or stated that I did not
intend to include only competition governed by a sanctioning body, but
any competition overseen by some organization to include clubs. That
might account for the difference in our views. I could be wrong, but
based on the inclusion of every skeet or trap competition held by any
club or other organization in the US, I think the 12 gauge has far
exceeded the other three gauges in sheer number of competitions held.
Or is every club in the country required by some organization to
report the results of every competition held by, or at, that club
whether sanctioned or not?
Anyway, we can always agree to disagree based on differing criteria.
And I certainly wouldn't mind my wife giving me the new Remington
Ideal for Christmas (fat chance)!
arn_werks
During the late 40's and early 50's I worked as a trap boy at
the Isaac Walton League's skeet and trap fields for a man named
Bob Pinnix. That would have been in Norfolk, Virginia. I would
have been somewhere about 9 to 12 or 13 during the period that I
worked there. The best shot was this old man who wore a huge
duffle coat and was always complaining how his coat kept him
from shooting any better. Since I never saw him get under 24 at
any time, I used to laugh and kid him about his coat. He shot
either Merkels or Browning O/U's. A lot of people shot with
over and unders, and a very few side by side doubles. the rest
were model 12 Winchesters and model 31 Remingtons, Given
literally 50 year old memories, I do remember a whole lot of
Remington model 11's and the Brownings that looked like the Auto
5's. Mostly I remember that the over and under folks won the
most money. I shot a Remington 20 ga with a Cutts comp and a
improved cylinder tube mostly. A box of military tracer shells
cost $2.50 with regular shells somewhere from 1 to 2 dollars.
I remember some week ends working from sun rise to sunset so
there were a lot of folks shooting then since there were either
3 or maybe 5 skeet fields and I think, 2 trap fields.
Those are my memories for what they are worth to this thread.
Cordially,
Red
BMoorehrny
#might account for the difference in our views. I could be wrong, but
#based on the inclusion of every skeet or trap competition held by any
#club or other organization in the US, I think the 12 gauge has far
#exceeded the other three gauges in sheer number of competitions held.
That would most likely do it for sure. The inclusion of trap alone would
probably do it. Trap is rarely shot in anything except the 12 GA except for
smaller "fun" matches. I almost never shoot trap as I am totaly addicted to the
game of skeet. If I were buying a trap gun I would very seriously consider a
quality autoloader like the 1100. (Now my pitch for my sport) Try out a tubed
O/U and shoot a few rounds of skeet with the smaller gauges. If you do not
become completely addicted I'll eat my hat.
JOHN GARAND
WROTE:
#During the late 40's and early 50's I worked as a trap boy at
#the Isaac Walton League's skeet and trap fields for a man named
snip
#I remember some week ends working from sun rise to sunset so
#there were a lot of folks shooting then since there were either
#3 or maybe 5 skeet fields and I think, 2 trap fields.
#
#Those are my memories for what they are worth to this thread.
I don't doubt your memory of how many people used a skeet and trap
field during that time. My recollection is that most gun clubs did
not have these facilities, but that could be the result of not being
on the east or left coast. Nor do I recollect most folks being able
to afford a Browning Superposed or other O/U, but that could be the
result of economic group. The only skeet and trap range I can
recollect from that time period in SW OK was at Ft. Sill, and
supposedly was mostly used by officers.
arn_werks
The folks that shot at that club were very well off, mostly
professionals that had made a ton during the Second World War.
Some one else just mentioned the same club on a thread asking
about shooting facilities near Norfolk, Virginia. It is now in
Churchland but I do not know if it has moved or if the area had
been renamed. It still has the same name, but I remember only a
limited interest in rifle or pistol back then.
I do know the folks were well off because I would take home a
lot more than my pay of $1.00 per hour by running errands and
cleaning guns for the members.
For some reason, I think that Winchester Model 12's with a
Factory Cutts Compensator were more common to the west. I am
not sure why I think that but I think it is true.
The Navy used the field during the Second World War to teach
gunners and pilots lead which is the reason for all of the
twelve gauge tracer shells.
One of my best friends in the Corps was from a town called Red
Dog in Oklahoma. Did not like Texas for some reason.
Cordially,
Red
JOHN GARAND wrote:
> ...
JOHN GARAND
WROTE:
#lot more than my pay of $1.00 per hour by running errands and
The club had a good bit of money if they were paying that much per
hour in those days! IIRC my first real "job" (not hauling hay, etc.)
paid $0.50 per hour.
#For some reason, I think that Winchester Model 12's with a
#Factory Cutts Compensator were more common to the west. I am
#not sure why I think that but I think it is true.
The Cutts Compensators were popular long after that time period. I
have a Remington 1100 with a Cutts added - and the 1100 didn't come
out until 1963. I had Herter's add an adjustable choke/compensator to
a Savage pump in the late 60s.
#
#The Navy used the field during the Second World War to teach
#gunners and pilots lead which is the reason for all of the
#twelve gauge tracer shells.
I believe AA instruction introduced many to the clay bird games who
otherwise would not have had that opportunity.
#One of my best friends in the Corps was from a town called Red
#Dog in Oklahoma. Did not like Texas for some reason.
Some call it "Baja Oklahoma" as there are so many of us who have moved
south of the Red River. I've adapted to, and adopted, Texas quite
well. Living on the edge of East Texas I have natural trees which
grow to more than 30 or 40 feet - a rarity in SW Oklahoma. :-))