Homemade percussion caps
Gunny_2009
SAFE way of making cap and ball percussion caps. I can make balls from
scrap lead and I can make my own black powder from the primary ingredients.
The caps are a roadblock for now.
I have already tried the little punch kit that you use to punch out the
metal caps from soft aluminum pop and beer cans and then insert a toy cap.
I found these had very unsatisfactory performance due to the poor ignition
qualities of the toy caps. Someone said that you need to use American-made
caps and that the vast majority of caps sold in our toy stores are very low
powered Chinese caps. Since I haven't found anyone selling the preferred
caps, I guess this may be a dead end.
The kit does allow you to punch out the metal shapes very easily and the
caps seem to be the right size and softness. I just need a reliable
ignition compound.
Is it possible to SAFELY make a compound to put in these caps? I do want to
keep my fingers and eyes, so SAFETY is a key consideration. Anyone have any
successful experience in this arena?
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sta...@prolynx.com
Toy caps have been down-rated since the '60s, so have a lot less zip
than they used to. Your government at work, too loud for the kiddies.
Also the mixture in the caps tends to oxidize by itself over time, so
much for loading up while they're available. Look up "Armstrong's
mixture" for what's in it. Lots of safety tips, like don't make it.
I've doubled up on the caps, that helped. The aluminum jobbies aren't
small enough to fit on the revolvers I have, seem to be restricted to
blackpowder-firing singles and doubles. Generally a toy cap doesn't
have enough zip to set off any of the substitutes. Haven't tried
nipple priming with black and using a substitute main charge, that
might work. A lot will depend on the gun and the flame path from the
nipple.
You can find chlorate primer formulas in just about any formulary or
blackpowder-era shooting manual, putting some together these days will
get you some jail time if you don't have the license. Messing with
match-heads can leave you missing parts you might rather have back and
also jail time. Most any primary explosive is dangerous to handle in
bulk. Mythbusters had a segment on one of the recent shows involving
matchheads. If you wanted your neighbors to sit up and take notice,
that would be one way.
The NRA had a book at one time detailing what was needed for ammo
manufacturing including primers and rimfires. The guy that wrote it
was a retired wheel with one of the major ammo companies and knew his
stuff. Making up priming mixture didn't seem like a good way to make
a living wage, to me. Don't think it's still available, but was a good
read. There are also some WWI-era ebooks out there on archive.org that
have details on making ammo. Paladin had some pamphlets on making
primers and primary explosives, I don't think the writers had ever
done any of the proposed mixtures, though.
If you could find out how Eley-Prime works, that would be a lot safer,
probably still not suitable for home use. It's a binary mixture with
two safe components that react when wetted to form the priming
compound. Eley patented it, so presumably the details are out there
somewhere. Currently available in the US in Eley rimfire ammo and
some, if not all, Aguila. Works well enough.
Flintlocks are still legal these days and a chunk of rock doesn't
usually carry any legal problems. Just a thought.
Stan
ingol...@news-2.mpls.iphouse.net
Just BUY a bunch and keep them in a cool, dry place. They are good for
at least 25 years, when stored properly.
Percussion caps, like centerfire primers, are made with what's called a
primary explosive.
That means it's 'easy' to detonate, with an impact, friction, static
electricity, etc.
Making a primary explosive in any quantity is VERY dangerous.
If you try, and don't know what you are doing, you could easily earn the
nickname 'lefty'...or worse.
Don't try it!
Bob Holtzman
Let me know when you're making black poeder or priming compound. I want
to make sure I'm in another county.
Snag
Snag wrote:
# Bob Holtzman wrote:
#> Let me know when you're making black poeder or priming compound. I
#> want to make sure I'm in another county.
#>
# I made some black powder just the other day . Small quantity ,
# around 500 grains for test purposes . It's safe enough if you know
# what you're doing and follow the safety rules - like *ALWAYS* start
# and stop your ball mill by remote , be sure it's properly sandbagged
# , and use only non-sparking tools when handling/processing powder and
# pyro compounds . I worked with explosives/pyro compounds for several
# years , and it's just as safe as you make it . If you don't know ,
# understand , and use the safety precautions that have been
# established over the years by manufacturers and hobbyists , you
# shouldn't be messing with this stuff . BTW , I won't make primary
# explosives , that's way too dangerous for a hobby pyrotechnician .
# Factory produced primers and BP caps are dangerous enough if
# mishandled , no way I'll try to manufacture them .
--
# Snag
# Same precautions go
# for handloading ...
pjlewis
the caps used to have fulminate of mercury in them. I believe they
still do. To make it it has to be heated in a pot.
to the correct tempter, or else kerbloom. This stuff is very dangerous, and
if you make a mistake it will leave
a very large crater ware your house use to be.
Paul J.
Snag
# Hi Snag
# the caps used to have fulminate of mercury in them. I believe
# they still do. To make it it has to be heated in a pot.
# to the correct tempter, or else kerbloom. This stuff is very
# dangerous, and if you make a mistake it will leave
# a very large crater ware your house use to be.
#
# Paul J.
#
And that's exactly why I ain't gonna mess with it . Black powder is
another matter , with care it can be made without making me homeless .
--
Snag
Learning keeps
you young !
jaz...@yahoo.com
Some time ago, when my Uncle was mad at some Vietnamese, He had me
working on things such as these. I learned that there are more wrong
ways than right ways to do these things. Some of the wrong ways
result in explosions during the process, Others produce materials
which can spontaneously explode later on. . .without heat, pressure,
impact, or static electricity. Your container can be sitting on the
shelf in a cool, dry basement, and kaboom!
I believe that at least one battleship blew up while sitting quietly
at port during the early days of smokeless powder because of this
phenomenon.
There is/was at least one amateur pyrotechnics group on Usenet. You
might want to seek expert advice and cites to the better
literature. I haven't looked because my experiences were enough to
last a lifetime. (It's an odd experience to shake hands with a guy
[100 times more experienced than me] who only has a thumb and one
finger left.)
Regards
Jason
Snag
fireworks and other pyro for a living . Some very knowledgeable and helpful
amateurs there too .
--
Snag
Learning keeps
you young !
haraoi_conal
amount. Shouldn't be too dangerous. I know this will work to
reactivate Boxer style brass cartridge primers. This stuff is pretty
corrosive, but then again, so is black powder. Trouble is finding
strike-anywhere matches is getting harder as well. As others have
stated, it is easier by far to just stock-up and store well. As long
as the earth produces rocks, you can keep a flint-lock sparking.
nord...@yahoo.com
Have you considered air rifles, crossbow, bow and arrow, atlatl, spear
fishing, fish wheels, traps, snares, slingshots, slings, bolos,
throwing sticks, matchlocks, flintlocks, or buying a pallet of 22
rimfire ammo?
# I can make balls from scrap lead and
Careful, cap and ball guns are meant to be used with dead soft lead.
# I can make my own black powder from the primary ingredients.
Hmmn, there's a reason some historical powder mills are ruins...
# I was wondering if there is any
# SAFE way of making cap and ball percussion caps.
Safe, and legal, and sustainable? Not so much.
# The caps are a roadblock for now.
#
# I guess this may be a dead end.
Good thinking.
Don Bruder
"Snag" <snag...@comcast.net> wrote:
# pjlewis wrote:
# # Hi Snag
# # the caps used to have fulminate of mercury in them. I believe
# # they still do. To make it it has to be heated in a pot.
# # to the correct tempter, or else kerbloom. This stuff is very
# # dangerous, and if you make a mistake it will leave
# # a very large crater ware your house use to be.
# #
# # Paul J.
# #
#
# And that's exactly why I ain't gonna mess with it . Black powder is
# another matter , with care it can be made without making me homeless .
It never fails to amaze me...
"Oh lawdy! It's explosive! It'll level the whole block!"
C'mon, people, it's conventional explosives, not a fusion bomb! Use some
common sense, already! If you're homebrewing explosives (of ANY
category), only an industrial-grade idiot is going to try to brew an
industrial-size batch! Anyone who does, well... <shrug> The gene pool
needs a shot of clorox every now and again, and somebody's gotta be
declared the winner of the Darwin award.
How much does Hg fulminate is required to put together a batch of - Oh,
let's say 50, just so we've got a number to work with - percussion caps?
I don't honestly know, but I'd be willing to bet that two ounces of
explosive product (forget the inert stuff - the empty caps, any "filler"
material for volume, any "cover" or "seal" material, etc - I'm talking
*ONLY* the actual explosive) would be fairly extreme overkill for the
project.
While I have no doubt whatsoever that with two ounces of mercury
fulminate, someone could earn himself the nickname "stumpy", and perhaps
even wreck the decor of the room he's working in when he does. But I'll
smile and eat a dog crap sandwich on rye if he manages to create
anything that even remotely resembles a "very large crater ware your
house use to be" (All grammar and spelling *NOT* mine in that mess!) or
renders himself homeless as a result of the explosion. (We won't discuss
the possibility of the nanny-state deciding to bulldoze the place
afterwards due to some imagined "contamination hazard" because somebody
used the word "mercury")
Snag
# It never fails to amaze me...
#
# "Oh lawdy! It's explosive! It'll level the whole block!"
snipped some ranting
# While I have no doubt whatsoever that with two ounces of mercury
# fulminate, someone could earn himself the nickname "stumpy", and
# perhaps even wreck the decor of the room he's working in when he
# does. But I'll smile and eat a dog crap sandwich on rye if he manages
# to create anything that even remotely resembles a "very large crater
# ware your house use to be" (All grammar and spelling *NOT* mine in
# that mess!) or renders himself homeless as a result of the explosion.
# (We won't discuss the possibility of the nanny-state deciding to
# bulldoze the place afterwards due to some imagined "contamination
# hazard" because somebody used the word "mercury")
#
Don , do you have any experience with compounds of this type ? I do , and
I'm not willing to take the chance . You have to realize that while the
compound in question may not level my house , secondary explosions of the
other stuff I have - caused by the fire we just lit - (blackpowder and XLDB
propellants , primers) may very well do just that .
If you feel the need to manufacture stuff in *your* home that's easily
available on the open market , by all means go right ahead . I choose not to
do so .
--
Snag
Learning keeps
you young !
Gunny_2009
<nord...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:ihamve$be1$1...@news.albasani.net...
## In the goal of trying to be self sufficient
#
# Have you considered air rifles, crossbow, bow and arrow, atlatl, spear
# fishing, fish wheels, traps, snares, slingshots, slings, bolos,
# throwing sticks, matchlocks, flintlocks, or buying a pallet of 22
# rimfire ammo?
#
# # I can make balls from scrap lead and
#
# Careful, cap and ball guns are meant to be used with dead soft lead.
Yes, balls for C&B revolvers and any Minie balls do work best with pure soft
lead. But, since you load subcaliber balls with a cloth patch when you load
a muzzle loader rifle, then the balls don't need to be soft lead. It is the
cloth patch that engages the rifling. Wheel weights and other scrap lead
sources work quite well for round balls in rifles. A correctly patched
round ball of the right caliber from a good rifle is pretty darned accurate
and can bring down most game on this continent. I've shot and hunted with
..54 round balls for over 40 years with good results.
#
# # I can make my own black powder from the primary ingredients.
#
# Hmmn, there's a reason some historical powder mills are ruins...
I suspect those accidents were caused by poor procedures and poorly trained
workers combined with large quantities on hand. As with many things in
life, if done properly, it is not unsafe. I know we did it in junior high
lab class. About a teaspoon was made at a time to prove the formula worked.
The key element is to avoid any spark source. As far as making primary
explosives goes, I have no suicide wish. On that note, we had a TNT factory
just east of Reno go up a few years ago, late 90's. The cause was poorly
trained workers. It seems just about all of the workers spoke only Spanish
and all of the safety placards were in English. The entire factory and a
next door warehouse of completed product just disappeared one morning, in
two big flashes. There wasn't much left besides a couple of smoking holes.
A deputy sheriff passing by a mile away heard it and went to investigate.
Not much there to investigate. They never did find all of the workers. A
bit OT, but interesting. :-)
#
# # I was wondering if there is any
# # SAFE way of making cap and ball percussion caps.
#
# Safe, and legal, and sustainable? Not so much.
#
# # The caps are a roadblock for now.
# #
# # I guess this may be a dead end.
#
# Good thinking.
On that, we agree. That was the purpose of my question, i.e. to ask if
anyone knew of any SAFE method of making percussion caps. I sure didn't.
(Still don't. LOL)
So far, everyone seems to be in agreement that there is no SAFE method.
I definitely want to keep my fingers and eyeballs. Guess I'll have to rely
on my stockpiled (hoarded?) supplies. (It's considered hoarding if YOU
didn't get enough ahead of time. It's considered smart planning ahead and
stockpiling if you were one who did get plenty. LOL)
It never hurts to ask. You never know what you may find out. Thanks for
all of the good input guys.
nord...@yahoo.com
# #
# # Careful, cap and ball guns are meant to be used with dead soft lead.
# Yes, balls for C&B revolvers and any Minie balls do work best with pure soft
# lead.
FWIW, what I've read suggests that it's not necessarily unsafe to use
alloyed balls or bullets, just that it will wear out the guns quicker,
especially the open frames.
# But, since you load subcaliber balls with a cloth patch when you load
# a muzzle loader rifle, then the balls don't need to be soft lead. It is the
# cloth patch that engages the rifling. Wheel weights and other scrap lead
# sources work quite well for round balls in rifles. A correctly patched
# round ball of the right caliber from a good rifle is pretty darned accurate
# and can bring down most game on this continent. I've shot and hunted with
# .54 round balls for over 40 years with good results.
Agreed, I use .54 and .62 roundball flintlocks for most of my
muzzleloader hunting these days. Never bothered with the short-lived
transitional percussion cap ignition system. ; )