>357 SIG vs .38-45 auto cartridge
X
it in a 1911. Does anyone know of a source of suitable slides,
extractors and barrels? Thinking about this project, I remember a
wildcat cartridge called the .38-45, which was the .45 ACP case necked
to take .357"/.358" bullets. It was intended for use in 1911's. It
was designed as a target cartridge and the limited published data, such
as in Barnes' Cartridges of the World, lists loads appropriate for
that. If it could be loaded to the same pressures used in the .357 SIG
or .38 Super, the result might be very interesting. If the only
objection is possible weakness of .45 ACP brass, that could be gotten
around with an integral-ramped barrel, and by using shortened .45 Win
Mag brass. Has anyone had any experience with such a project? I'd be
interested in hearing your results.
Glen Swaim
aldo...@wyoming.com (X) wrote:
-::The .357 SIG is a very intriguing cartridge. However, I'd rather try
-::it in a 1911. Does anyone know of a source of suitable slides,
-::extractors and barrels? Thinking about this project, I remember a
-::wildcat cartridge called the .38-45, which was the .45 ACP case necked
-::to take .357"/.358" bullets. It was intended for use in 1911's. It
-::was designed as a target cartridge and the limited published data, such
-::as in Barnes' Cartridges of the World, lists loads appropriate for
-::that. If it could be loaded to the same pressures used in the .357 SIG
-::or .38 Super, the result might be very interesting. If the only
-::objection is possible weakness of .45 ACP brass, that could be gotten
-::around with an integral-ramped barrel, and by using shortened .45 Win
-::Mag brass. Has anyone had any experience with such a project? I'd be
-::interested in hearing your results.
-::
-::
I've been experimenting with this one for the past few months. I am
impressed with this cartridge. Anyone else actually using it?
Jeff K. Munekata
#
# In article <4eif7p$q...@xring.cs.umd.edu>,
# aldo...@wyoming.com (X) wrote:
# -::The .357 SIG is a very intriguing cartridge. However, I'd rather try
# -::it in a 1911. Does anyone know of a source of suitable slides,
# -::extractors and barrels? Thinking about this project, I remember a
# -::wildcat cartridge called the .38-45, which was the .45 ACP case necked
# -::to take .357"/.358" bullets. It was intended for use in 1911's. It
# -::was designed as a target cartridge and the limited published data, such
# -::as in Barnes' Cartridges of the World, lists loads appropriate for
# -::that. If it could be loaded to the same pressures used in the .357 SIG
# -::or .38 Super, the result might be very interesting. If the only
# -::objection is possible weakness of .45 ACP brass, that could be gotten
# -::around with an integral-ramped barrel, and by using shortened .45 Win
# -::Mag brass. Has anyone had any experience with such a project? I'd be
# -::interested in hearing your results.
# -::
# -::
# I've been experimenting with this one for the past few months. I am
# impressed with this cartridge. Anyone else actually using it?
I was similarly taken by the preliminary reports of this
cartridge (see Tim Lau's Unofficial HK Home Page), and almost considered
changing my order for an HK USP 9mm to that of the 40S&W (which would be
357Sig capable with a replacement barrel). However, after doing a little
research, in particular Chuck Karwan's informative article "Factory
Ammunition Tests '95" printed in Handgun's '96 (DBI Books Inc),
I've decided to stick with the 9mm (with it's reported +P, and +P+
capability).
Mr. Karwan identifies that the ballistic data for a 357Sig is
1350 fps for a 125 gr JHP; actual data of 1387 fps and 510 lbf energy
with Federal Ammo in a Sig 229. For a 115 gr 9mm +P Cor-Bon in a Glock
17 he got 1401 fps, and 501 lbf energy. He quoted other calibers that
were even closer and/or eclipsed the 357Sig, in particular, the 40S&W; in
Glock 22, with Cor-Bon +P, JHP, 125gr yielded 1417 fps, and 601 lbf
energy. Interestingly, at the 45 caliber, Cor-Bon rounds of 230 gr JHP,
+P fired from a M1911A1 yielded 954 fps, and 463 lbf energy.
I guess what I am saying from this information relative to your
inquiry is; the 357Sig is probably a very appealing from the 45 shooters
perspective, more muzzle energy, less recoil, and apparently a very
satisfying retort. But in the overall scheme of handgun calilbers, it
does not represent enough of an advantage to succeed as distinctive
caliber.
I was interested in the caliber for possible use as an IPSC major
caliber, with +P ammo. I've fired 357 revolvers and enjoy the accuracy
and modest recoil of that round. I've enjoyed firing 1911s, but realized
that it took a great deal more effort to shoot accurately on subsequent
shots.
Have you considered a 357 revolver instead? I'm asking myself
that same question (in addition to the 9mm auto of course).
Jeff Munekata
Bill Tuttle
:>
:>The .357 SIG is a very intriguing cartridge. However, I'd rather try
:>it in a 1911. Does anyone know of a source of suitable slides,
:>extractors and barrels? Thinking about this project, I remember a
:>wildcat cartridge called the .38-45, which was the .45 ACP case necked
:>to take .357"/.358" bullets. It was intended for use in 1911's. It
:>was designed as a target cartridge and the limited published data, such
:>as in Barnes' Cartridges of the World, lists loads appropriate for
:>that. If it could be loaded to the same pressures used in the .357 SIG
:>or .38 Super, the result might be very interesting. If the only
:>objection is possible weakness of .45 ACP brass, that could be gotten
:>around with an integral-ramped barrel, and by using shortened .45 Win
:>Mag brass. Has anyone had any experience with such a project? I'd be
:>interested in hearing your results.
I have a barrel and bushing from BarSto. It shoots like a dream. This
cartridge really comes into it's own with a 5" barrel. I did the conversion
from a Colt Custom Shop 10/Forty Elite. The easiest choice would be to use a
10mm as a starting point.
Mika Jalava
#that. If it could be loaded to the same pressures used in the .357 SIG
#or .38 Super, the result might be very interesting. If the only
#objection is possible weakness of .45 ACP brass, that could be gotten
#around with an integral-ramped barrel, and by using shortened .45 Win
#Mag brass. Has anyone had any experience with such a project? I'd be
#interested in hearing your results.
According to Barnes's Cartridges of the World, this is nothing
new. It's called something like 38-45 (or was it 45-38?) Hard Head.
Mika
Michael Kawalek
Digest" and "Handgun Reloading" (DBI Press) writes a lot about his 38-45
Clerke. He recommends using 45 Win Mag brass that has been shortened and
reamed. You can find his books at local gun shops or find an order form
in the magazine "Shooting Times" He talks about the 38-45 in detail in
"Handgun Reloading" so that's where I'd start. Hope that's informative.
sw...@hiwaay.net
#:In message <4eif7p$q...@xring.cs.umd.edu> - aldo...@wyoming.com (X) writes:
#::>
#::>The .357 SIG is a very intriguing cartridge. However, I'd rather try
#::>it in a 1911. Does anyone know of a source of suitable slides,
#::>extractors and barrels? Thinking about this project, I remember a
#::>wildcat cartridge called the .38-45, which was the .45 ACP case necked
#::>to take .357"/.358" bullets. It was intended for use in 1911's. It
#::>was designed as a target cartridge and the limited published data, such
#::>as in Barnes' Cartridges of the World, lists loads appropriate for
#::>that. If it could be loaded to the same pressures used in the .357 SIG
#::>or .38 Super, the result might be very interesting. If the only
#::>objection is possible weakness of .45 ACP brass, that could be gotten
#::>around with an integral-ramped barrel, and by using shortened .45 Win
#::>Mag brass. Has anyone had any experience with such a project? I'd be
#::>interested in hearing your results.
#:
#:I have a barrel and bushing from BarSto. It shoots like a dream. This
#:cartridge really comes into it's own with a 5" barrel. I did the conversion
#:from a Colt Custom Shop 10/Forty Elite. The easiest choice would be to use
a
#:10mm as a starting point.
#:
#:
Does anyone have the address of BarSto? I've been looking through all my gun
rags and I can't seem to find it. Even better a phone number.
Glen Swaim
sw...@hiwaay.net
Peter Jordan
Jeff K. Munekata <moo...@comsource.net> wrote:
#Glen Swaim wrote:
##
## In article <4eif7p$q...@xring.cs.umd.edu>,
## aldo...@wyoming.com (X) wrote:
## -::The .357 SIG is a very intriguing cartridge. However, I'd rather try
## -::it in a 1911. Does anyone know of a source of suitable slides,
## -::extractors and barrels? Thinking about this project, I remember a
yes, see my attachment below. A modified Delta Elite shoots 3 different
rounds: 10mm, 40s&w and 357sig.
## -::wildcat cartridge called the .38-45, which was the .45 ACP case necked
## -::to take .357"/.358" bullets. It was intended for use in 1911's. It
## -::was designed as a target cartridge and the limited published data, such
## -::as in Barnes' Cartridges of the World, lists loads appropriate for
## -::that. If it could be loaded to the same pressures used in the .357 SIG
## -::or .38 Super, the result might be very interesting. If the only
## -::objection is possible weakness of .45 ACP brass, that could be gotten
## -::around with an integral-ramped barrel, and by using shortened .45 Win
The 357sig brass is highly beefed up to handle 40,000 psi -- saami approved.
## -::Mag brass. Has anyone had any experience with such a project? I'd be
## -::interested in hearing your results.
## -::
## -::
## I've been experimenting with this one for the past few months. I am
## impressed with this cartridge. Anyone else actually using it?
Yes, this is an excellent cartridge that a lot of people are ignoring as
yet another wild cat that somebody dreamed up. Not so.
#
# I was similarly taken by the preliminary reports of this
#cartridge (see Tim Lau's Unofficial HK Home Page), and almost considered
#changing my order for an HK USP 9mm to that of the 40S&W (which would be
#357Sig capable with a replacement barrel). However, after doing a little
#research, in particular Chuck Karwan's informative article "Factory
#Ammunition Tests '95" printed in Handgun's '96 (DBI Books Inc),
#I've decided to stick with the 9mm (with it's reported +P, and +P+
#capability).
Excellent choice. But +P and +P+ is harder on the gun; wears out faster.
You're comparing +P and +P+ rounds against the normal pressure 357sig
round --- apples and oranges. See my attachment below.
# Mr. Karwan identifies that the ballistic data for a 357Sig is
#1350 fps for a 125 gr JHP; actual data of 1387 fps and 510 lbf energy
#with Federal Ammo in a Sig 229. For a 115 gr 9mm +P Cor-Bon in a Glock
#17 he got 1401 fps, and 501 lbf energy. He quoted other calibers that
#were even closer and/or eclipsed the 357Sig, in particular, the 40S&W; in
The 40s&w 135gr does not eclipse the 357sig; it equals it in energy, but is
less accurate than the 357sig round because of its high pressure. There are
a lot of Glocksters really stirred up over this cartridge for some reason.
Maybe if it was called a 357GLOCK they would find it more appealing. JUST
KIDDING. I have a Glock myself. And I'm getting a 357sig barrel for it soon.
Just because it came from Sig, doesn't mean it must be despised.
I don't have any Smith & Wesson guns, but I do use the 40s&w round.
Big deal.
# Glock 22, with Cor-Bon +P, JHP, 125gr yielded 1417 fps, and 601 lbf
#energy. Interestingly, at the 45 caliber, Cor-Bon rounds of 230 gr JHP,
#+P fired from a M1911A1 yielded 954 fps, and 463 lbf energy.
Mr Karwan is correct. But what he didn't say is that the 357sig 125 gr
round is a lot more accurate than the Cor-Bon 135 grain round, and has
less recoil, even though the energy is the same. Yes, if you don't want
to swap barrels, then stick with the excellent 135 gr 40s&w. A
bottlenecked cartridge inherently feeds better than a straight walled
case also; plus one for the 357sig. See my attachment below.
# I guess what I am saying from this information relative to your
#inquiry is; the 357Sig is probably a very appealing from the 45 shooters
#perspective, more muzzle energy, less recoil, and apparently a very
#satisfying retort. But in the overall scheme of handgun calilbers, it
#does not represent enough of an advantage to succeed as distinctive
#caliber.
Whoa! See my attachment below.
# I was interested in the caliber for possible use as an IPSC major
#caliber, with +P ammo. I've fired 357 revolvers and enjoy the accuracy
#and modest recoil of that round. I've enjoyed firing 1911s, but realized
#that it took a great deal more effort to shoot accurately on subsequent
#shots.
# Have you considered a 357 revolver instead? I'm asking myself
#that same question (in addition to the 9mm auto of course).
I believe a half-moon clip is needed to shoot 9mm in a pistol.
The 357sig is the way to go.
----
You have some very good comments and I can generally agree that other
rounds can obtain the same level as the 357SIG, and that there are
already a number of excellent established cartridges out there. But,
I have to disagree when you believe that nothing about the 357SIG
makes it stand out enough to become a successful cartridge.
Let me count the ways:
1.Normal pressure verses high pressure loads. Yes, some different
calibers can be pushed, using +P and +P+, to equal the 357SIG. But
the stand-out key here, is that the 357SIG was engineered to push
its STANDARD 124 - 125 grain rounds between 1330 - 1400 fps, using
NORMAL pressure, and thus having less recoil and better accuracy.
A number of gun writers in the last couple years have learned that
the 40s&w performs more accurately with lower pressures. That's one
reason why Federal created a lower velocity, lower pressure 165 grain
40sw round for the FBI. Also, another very important factor is that
+P and +P+ ammo will wear out any gun faster.
The Speer reloading guide for the 357SIG shows a 124 grain Gold Dot
hollow point being pushed at 1437 fps, still using normal pressure.
The new Sierra reloading guide shows several powders pushing their
95 grain at 1550 fps, still using normal pressures. A seasoned reloader
could create some +P loads that would really kick butt. Remember that
the 357SIG case has been highly beefed up to handle 40,000 psi as the
norm, which is SAAMI approved. You could create loads in the
357SIG that would blow the brains out of a 40S&W brass -- one good
reason not to convert 40sw cartridges to 357sig format. The brass is
the weakest part of the gun.
2. Bottlenecked cases verses straight walled cases. You might say that
your straight walled cases feed fine and always will feed fine. BUT,
engineering wise, a bottlenecked case will feed even more fine, lowering
that minute small malfunction percentage even lower, which could save your
life, or help you win a tournament during a critical moment.
Yes, you have to lube your cases to reload, and wipe the lube off at
the end of your session. The case should be fully resized, expanded
just enough to hold a bullet, and have a firm (don't smash it though)
taper crimp. The 357SIG brass seems to shrink after firing cartridges,
just like the 40s&w. So, it appears that trimming and chamfering is
a moot point. Time will tell. No reloading show-stoppers here.
3. 357SIG complements 40S&W. There is no "verses" here. The 357SIG
handles bullets from 95 grain to 147 grains. the 40s&W handles rounds
from 135 grains to 190 grains. The 40S&W was engineered to excel
with the 180 grain bullet, but it pushes the 135 grain Cor-Bon very
nicely. The 357SIG excels with the lighter 125 grain bullet, but can
work well with 95 grains up to 147 grains. You can use the same 40sw
based gun for both rounds. Just swap the barrel. So if you buy a
40s&w gun, you have a very versatile gun indeed. The 357SIG round is
simply an extension of the 40S&W capabilities, using the same gun.
Apparently, the 357SIG also complements custom Colts. Jan Libourel
had his Delta Elite Colt converted to shoot three different rounds:
the 10mm, the 40s&w, aaaaaannnd the 357SIG. Not bad for one gun. The
gun was converted by King's Guns Works (818) 956-6010.
4. More companies are beginning to support this new 357SIG round besides
just Sig-Saur and Federal: Sierra, Speer, Starline, Alliant/Hercules,
several die companies, and Remington is coming out with low priced 357SIG
rounds this year, just to name a few. Oh yes, barrel companies like Bar
Sto are ramping up production with 357SIG barrels for different models
right now. He's working on Glocks at the moment: M22 and M23 are completed;
he is planning on completing the M27 version within 4 to 8 weeks. Bar Sto
number: (619) 367-2747
I don't think you should write off a round like the 357SIG, which
produces amazing energy at normal pressures, is Extremely Accurate,
feeds better than all straight walled cartridges, is engineered
specifically for light and fast bullets, has mellow recoil, and can
be used in ANY 40S&W gun by swapping out the barrel! A number of
police agencies are now using this round. So stay tuned.
Check out the following web pages, which show reviews and comments by
several well known gun writers, who believe that this cartridge is
possibly the .......
http://eclectic.ss.uci.edu/~jfrost/sig/reviews/357sig.html
The Sig Home Page is quite excellent; Browse around a bit.
http://www.teleport.com/~dputzolu/ (same as above Sig Page article)
go to: Firearm info by type
Semi Autos
Sig section
go to: Comparative firearm Info
calibre issues
Ed Rudnicki
In article <4ermdt$j...@xring.cs.umd.edu> pe...@sequent.com (Peter Jordan) writes:
#In article <310D4C...@comsource.net>,
#Jeff K. Munekata <moo...@comsource.net> wrote:
## I was similarly taken by the preliminary reports of this
##cartridge (see Tim Lau's Unofficial HK Home Page), and almost considered
##changing my order for an HK USP 9mm to that of the 40S&W (which would be
##357Sig capable with a replacement barrel). However, after doing a little
##research, in particular Chuck Karwan's informative article "Factory
##Ammunition Tests '95" printed in Handgun's '96 (DBI Books Inc),
##I've decided to stick with the 9mm (with it's reported +P, and +P+
##capability).
#
#Excellent choice. But +P and +P+ is harder on the gun; wears out faster.
#You're comparing +P and +P+ rounds against the normal pressure 357sig
#round --- apples and oranges. See my attachment below.
It's only apples and oranges if you accept SAAMI-spec 9mm as
"normal", rather than underloaded. The fact that SAAMI-spec ammo
will not properly cycle the actions of a substantial number of P.08s
should tell you something there. WW2 German and British ball was at
+P level, and NATO ball is close to +P+. 9mm becomes a very
different catridge when properly loaded. And my Glock has yet to
complain about 10,000+ round of the hot Egyptian surplus, apart from
a little finish wear in places.
#The 40s&w 135gr does not eclipse the 357sig; it equals it in energy, but is
#less accurate than the 357sig round because of its high pressure. There are
#a lot of Glocksters really stirred up over this cartridge for some reason.
#Maybe if it was called a 357GLOCK they would find it more appealing. JUST
#KIDDING. I have a Glock myself. And I'm getting a 357sig barrel for it soon.
Well this Glockster thinks the .357 SIG is an interesting cartridge.
As I don't have any use for the .40, I'd probably have to buy
something chambered from the outset for .357. And it would be just
for fun, like my 7.62x25mm guns, with the 9mm left for serious work.
Though I've been getting other silly ideas lately, like seeing if
it's feasible to convert a 10mm Glock to fir 7.62x25mm :)
Ed Rudnicki
erud...@pica.army.mil
Oculis numquam claudentibus
Fernando Coelho
cartridge case. Using a trimmed .45 Winchester Magnum case is possible
but VERY time consuming. Triton Cartridge is now releasing new unprimed .
45 Super cartridge cases that would make the perfect base for a .38-45
Auto. The brass is available from Ace Custom 45's @ 1-210-257-4290.
The .357 SIG cartridge generates VERY high pressure to achieve the
ballistics it is known for. The .40 S&W 135 grain offers equal ballistics
yet lower pressures.
Generating even less pressure than the .40 S&W and the .357 SIG is the .
45 Super. Now we are talking a 185 grain JHP driven to 1,300 fps from a
5" barrel. What makes the .45 Super superior to the .357 SIG is you do
not have to swap parts to shoot the .45 ACP. Both the .45 Super and .45
ACP can be fired from a .45 Super government model.
Allan J. Heim
If [a .38-45] could be loaded to the same pressures used in the
.357 SIG or .38 Super, the result might be very interesting.
If the only objection is possible weakness of .45 ACP brass,
that could be gotten around with an integral-ramped barrel,
and by using shortened .45 Win Mag brass. Has anyone had any
experience with such a project?
There was a negative review of the process in _Wildcats Volume
II_ (Wolfe Publishing), and you're right--the .45 ACP case and
the standard M1911 chamber isn't designed for high pressures. In
fact, the author of the article had it blow up on him.
Now, with supported barrels and stronger brass, it might be more
practical now--but why bother? Might as well get a Coonan .357.
--
Allan J. Heim NCD Software Corporation Technical Support
all...@z-code.ncd.com vox: +1 (415) 899 7990 fax: 898 8299
Frank Materia
#45 Super. Now we are talking a 185 grain JHP driven to 1,300 fps from a
#5" barrel. What makes the .45 Super superior to the .357 SIG is you do
#not have to swap parts to shoot the .45 ACP. Both the .45 Super and .45
#ACP can be fired from a .45 Super government model.
I believe .45 Super rounds from Triton have specially coated cases, BUT
ballistically, what would be the difference be between the .45 Super round
and a 'hot' .45ACP (+P/+P+/NATO) round? Does anyone know?
--
Frank Materia fmat...@njebmail.mail.att.net. My opinion, not my employer's
Ed Rudnicki
In article <4f5i3d$8...@xring.cs.umd.edu>,
Frank Materia <fmat...@njebmail.mail.att.net> wrote:
##Generating even less pressure than the .40 S&W and the .357 SIG is the .
##45 Super. Now we are talking a 185 grain JHP driven to 1,300 fps from a
##5" barrel. What makes the .45 Super superior to the .357 SIG is you do
##not have to swap parts to shoot the .45 ACP. Both the .45 Super and .45
##ACP can be fired from a .45 Super government model.
#
#I believe .45 Super rounds from Triton have specially coated cases, BUT
#ballistically, what would be the difference be between the .45 Super round
#and a 'hot' .45ACP (+P/+P+/NATO) round? Does anyone know?
^^^^
The term "NATO" does not apply to the .45 ACP cartridge. It applies
only to the 9mm Parabellum as produced in accordance with the STANAG
whose number escapes me at the moment :)
It's also unlikely that one would need, or even want a .45 ACP +P+.
It exists in 9mm because SAAMI-spec 9mm (non +P) is substantially
underloaded. +P is more like WW2 ball from both sides, and +P+ is
approximately equivalent to NATO spec
SAAMI std 9mm underloaded
SAAMI +P 9mm normal load (~WW2 ball)
SAAMI +P+ 9mm hot load (~ NATO ball)
Whereas SAAMI standard .45 ACP is the same power level as military
ball
SAAMI std .45 ACP normal load (~military ball)
SAAMI +P .45 ACP hot load
A hypothetical +P+ .45 ACP load may or may not be equivalent to .45
Super, but from what I've read of the latter standard .45 ACP
pistols cannot handle a load this powerful.
Fernando Coelho
Super @1,300 fps. The Super offers down range ballistics superior to the .
45 ACP +P and equal to the hottest 10mm. The NP-3 finish on Triton
cartridge cases has no bearing on the performance of a .45 Super.
-
FERNANDO COELHO QNK...@prodigy.com
Nosy
< In article <4eif7p$q...@xring.cs.umd.edu>, X <aldo...@wyoming.com> wrote:
< If [a .38-45] could be loaded to the same pressures used in the
< .357 SIG or .38 Super, the result might be very interesting.
< If the only objection is possible weakness of .45 ACP brass,
< that could be gotten around with an integral-ramped barrel,
< and by using shortened .45 Win Mag brass. Has anyone had any
< experience with such a project?
< There was a negative review of the process in _Wildcats Volume
< II_ (Wolfe Publishing), and you're right--the .45 ACP case and
< the standard M1911 chamber isn't designed for high pressures. In
< fact, the author of the article had it blow up on him.
The .45 "magnum" folks tend to use special brass with
a much, much stronger web.
< Now, with supported barrels and stronger brass, it might be more
< practical now--but why bother? Might as well get a Coonan .357.
Sure, if one wants to pay $1,000+ just to buy the firearm
and the inherent problems that come from putting a rimmed
cartridge into an autoloading pistol.
Frankly, the thing about .357 Sig and 10mm that appeal
to me is the amount of energy I can get out of *standard*,
that is, NOT "+P" loadings.
Randy Burrous
says...
#
##Generating even less pressure than the .40 S&W and the .357 SIG is the .
##45 Super. Now we are talking a 185 grain JHP driven to 1,300 fps from a
##5" barrel. What makes the .45 Super superior to the .357 SIG is you do
##not have to swap parts to shoot the .45 ACP. Both the .45 Super and .45
##ACP can be fired from a .45 Super government model.
#
#I believe .45 Super rounds from Triton have specially coated cases, BUT
#ballistically, what would be the difference be between the .45 Super round
#and a 'hot' .45ACP (+P/+P+/NATO) round? Does anyone know?
According to an article in "Complete Book of the .45" magazine The .45 Super
shoots the Triton 185 gr JHP at 1200 f/s and the 200 gr JHP at 1150 f/s.
The cases are coated with Robar NP3 finish to increase feed reliability and
reduce risk of corrosion. According to the author Triton cases should not be
reloaded beyond these velocities.
The .45 Super was tested with loads with the 185 gr bullet to 1500 f/s and
pressures at 47000 psi. It doesn't say whether it is CUP or otherwise. They
started with Detonics .451 cases and changed to cases made from .308 Win. The
.45 Super will fit and chamber in any .45 ACP gun. ACE Custom 45's and Robar
are currently doing conversions.
Fernando Coelho
the 185 gr. @ 1200 fps, 200 gr. @ 1150 fps, and 230 gr. @ 1025 fps.
The full house loads are the 185 gr. @ 1300 fps, 200 gr. @ 1200 fps, and
230 gr. @ 1100 fps.
Fernando Coelho
President
Triton Cartridge