Word Origin "ROSCOE"
Tom Line
buy/fire/sell). It was called a "Roscoe". I was wondering what the origin
of the word "Roscoe" is when referring to a firearm.
--
POLITICAL CORRECTNESS IS DEAD!!
Tom Line
tl...@iglou.com
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Bert Hyman
wrote:
# Saw a small Saturday Night Special come into a shop (not safe to
# buy/fire/sell). It was called a "Roscoe". I was wondering what the origin
# of the word "Roscoe" is when referring to a firearm.
Two unabridged dictionaries I checked both just say that "Roscoe" is slang
for pistol or revolver that came into use in about 1914, with the origin
simply being "a man's name".
--
Bert Hyman St. Paul, MN be...@visi.com
Batman
#Saw a small Saturday Night Special come into a shop (not safe to
#buy/fire/sell). It was called a "Roscoe". I was wondering what the origin
#of the word "Roscoe" is when referring to a firearm.
#
I always assumed it was a reference to Roscoe P Coltrain from dukes of
hazzard. I never quite understood what the big deal was about his pistol.
Other than the fact that i knew he had one, i don't remember anything special
about what he carried. Perhaps it refers to a gun that is simply never used.
Or was Roscoe's name an allusion to something else?
-jeff (FSG)
Zen Tao
Tom Line wrote in message <9tun3o$4gv$1...@xring.cs.umd.edu>...
#Saw a small Saturday Night Special come into a shop (not safe to
#buy/fire/sell). It was called a "Roscoe". I was wondering what the origin
#of the word "Roscoe" is when referring to a firearm.
RESORT to ONLY in SERIOUS CASE OF EMERGENCY
Actually, I don't know, just came up with that.
Nick W.
Las Vegas, NV
Barent K. Parslow
slang terms were used 200+ years ago, albeit sometimes in slightly different
form.
Batman wrote:
> ...
--
Sincerely,
Barent
Max Tindell
# In news:9tun3o$4gv$1...@xring.cs.umd.edu Tom Line <tl...@shell1.iglou.com>
# wrote:
# # Saw a small Saturday Night Special come into a shop (not safe to
# # buy/fire/sell). It was called a "Roscoe". I was wondering what the origin
# # of the word "Roscoe" is when referring to a firearm.
# Two unabridged dictionaries I checked both just say that "Roscoe" is slang
# for pistol or revolver that came into use in about 1914, with the origin
# simply being "a man's name".
My "New Dictionary of American Slang" cites it as underworld slang
dating from the late 19th century meaning a pistol; a pet name used for
dissimulation.
--
"A person who doesn't have more friends than I've got ought to be
authorized to carry a gun." Bob Bullock, Dallas Times Herald, July 24,
1984
WJS/wi/usa
the Dukes of Hazard. I seem to remember it in some old James Cagney movies
from the 30's or so.
_________
WJS/wi/usa
Marty Schrader
#
# Tom Line wrote in message <9tun3o$4gv$1...@xring.cs.umd.edu>...
# #Saw a small Saturday Night Special come into a shop (not safe to
# #buy/fire/sell). It was called a "Roscoe". I was wondering what the origin
# #of the word "Roscoe" is when referring to a firearm.
#
# RESORT to ONLY in SERIOUS CASE OF EMERGENCY
#
# Actually, I don't know, just came up with that.
Well, kudos! I'm gonna rip that off and start using ROSCOE the same way
folks use FUBAR. Except nowadays it's "foobar," of course. Wouldn't want to
alienate somebody with delicate sensibilities, now would we?
--
Marty Schrader
Embedded Technology Consulting from
Parsec Systems, Inc.
0N107 Cottonwood Drive
Wheaton, IL 60187
(630) 588-0241
www.parsecsystemsinc.com
Jerry Thomas
a small defensive handgun? When you find out, tell us why you used it
here.
Spinacia
cheap, South-American made revolvers as "Saturday Night .38 Special"'s.
That came about to be "Saturday Night Special".
He was referring to "Saturday Nights" as many violent incidents took place
during that day of the week when laborers got paid and quickly after got
drunk on the weekend.
It is claimed that "Saturday Night Special" bans and legislation caused
criminals to transition to using more powerful and more available guns.
> ...
Adam Kippes
# More important. Who coined the term Saturday Night Special to describe
# a small defensive handgun? When you find out, tell us why you used it
# here.
The full expression is "Niggertown Saturday Night Special" or "A
Saturday Night Special in Niggertown" and it was coined by policemen.
But who are you talking to?
-- AK
--
Please reply to the newsgroup. That is why it exists.
Joseph M. White
wrote:
> ...
If I remember correctly, it was used by the liberal, left wing media
as a euphemism for the type of gun a black pimp would carry on
Saturday night. (His heaviest business night.) I seem to recall a left
coast reporter being called to task about this. His explanation was
that "most gentlemen would own Colts or Smith & Wessons, not some
Saturday Night Special." Everybody got on the band wagon, but, missed
the point, entirely. The point is, everybody has the right to self
defense, not just those who can afford the better guns. That point
never made it into print. They were too busy wetting their pants about
America's New Royalty (the kennedys)(shudder, gag, hurl, upchuck). And
America's New Royalty wanted a disarmed America (so the outraged
husbands or fathers couldn't shoot the ba****ds, I guess). Funny,
cause the kennedys sure work their butts off raising money for the IRA
and other terrorists to buy guns with and passing laws that stop the
State department from keeping terrorists from getting visas. (1996,
Ted Kennedy sponsored bill.)
joe
Robert P. Firriolo
#
# a small defensive handgun?
I'm guessing Mr. Thomas knows the answer by the way he phrased the
question. He probably knows the term's racist roots. See, for example:
http://www.jpfo.org/racecard.htm
--
MOLON LABE
http://firriolo.home.netcom.com/
[Remove "nospam" from reply-to e-dress]
Montell Williams
with you when the chips are down. When your back is aginst the wall, '
Rosco' won't let you down and will be at your side.
Ted Gittinger
"hotter'n a two-dollar pistol" in San Antonio police reports in the 1950s.
This was also the age of zip guns, which were made from automobile attennas,
wood, and heavy rubber bands. All this antecedes the "liberal, left-wing
media" by quite a bit., and has nothing to do with the Kennedys or their
allies.
Why do some folks have to put a political spin on everything?
ted
"Joseph M. White" <joseph...@lmco.com> wrote in message
news:9u5mmd$qn4$1...@xring.cs.umd.edu...
> ...
Cory Brickner
@xring.cs.umd.edu:
# More important. Who coined the term Saturday Night Special to describe
# a small defensive handgun? When you find out, tell us why you used it
# here.
See "Gun Control: White Man's Law" at
http://www.2ndlawlib.org/other/related/wtr8512.html
Excerpt:
The cheap revolvers of the late 19th and early 20th centuries were referred
to as "Suicide Specials," the "Saturday Night Special" label not becoming
widespread until reformers and politicians took up the gun control cause
during the 1960s. The source of this recent concern about cheap revolvers, as
their new label suggests, has much in common with the concerns of the gunlaw
initiators of the post-Civil War South. As B. Bruce-Briggs has written in the
Public Interest, "It is difficult to escape the conclusion that the 'Saturday
Night Special' is emphasized because it is cheap and is being sold to a
particular class of people. The name is sufficient evidence--the reference is
to 'niggertown Saturday night.'"
See "Warren Burger and the Second Amendment" at
http://i2i.org/SuptDocs/Crime/crburger.htm
Exceprt:
In any case, "Saturday night special" is in part a linguistic descendant of
the racist phrase "Niggertown Saturday Night." The obvious implication of the
phrase "Saturday night special" is that it is a gun used by "niggers" to
shoot each other with during their wild Saturday nights. No one denies that
the people disarmed by a "Saturday night special" ban would be predominantly
poor and non-white. Although entrusted with protecting minority rights, Chief
Justice Burger let slip some of his real opinions about minorities when he
used the racist phrase "Saturday Night Special."
David Kopel also writes (see http://www.davekopel.org/davepage.htm for very
comprehensive research):
"The derisive term for inexpensive handguns, 'Saturday Night Specials,' has a
racist lineage to the term 'niggertown Saturday night.' The phrase
'niggertown Saturday night' apparently mixed with the nineteenth century
phrase 'suicide special,' which is a cheap single action revolver, to form
'Saturday night special.'"
Lastly see "Gun-Grabbers: Masters of the New Plantation" at
http://www.webleyweb.com/tle/libe84-20000807-03.html
Excerpt:
Cover your ears if you like, but the origin of this term for the inexpensive
handguns most useful for self-defense to a black or Hispanic resident of the
inner city is the old, derogatory police slang "Niggertown Saturday Night,"
referring to inner city weekend violence not meriting much attention, since
it mainly occurred among the black folk.
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
"Politically popular speech has always been protected: even the Jews
were free to say 'Heil Hitler'". -- Isaac Asimov
Cory Brickner
co...@brickners.com
The Freedom Pages
http://www.brickners.com/
Ric Brandt
| wrote:
|
| > ...
| If I remember correctly, it was used by the liberal, left wing media
| as a euphemism for the type of gun a black pimp would carry on
| Saturday night. (His heaviest business night.) I seem to recall a left
| coast reporter being called to task about this. His explanation was
| that "most gentlemen would own Colts or Smith & Wessons, not some
| Saturday Night Special."
snip snip
Well I don't want to argue with any one but as a young lad growing up in the
50's I often heard the term used to describe small concealable handguns you
slipped in your pocket when taking the favorite lady out on the town, in
case of trouble. Saturday night being the prime night for that in the rural
south where I grew up.
I seem to remember Bill Jordan describing it the same way in one of his
columns, but I can't remember which one or where I read that.
Later as a Deputy in the 70's we used the term to describe the cheap generic
handguns we took off of petty crooks. Usually .32 revolvers in my
experience.
As we know it is now another spin word...........
--
Ric Brandt
Adam Kippes
# Why do some folks have to put a political spin on everything?
I don't know but the term "Saturday Night Special" goes back a century
or so.
-- AK
--
Please reply to the newsgroup. That is why it exists.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
rb...@fuse.net
wrote:
#More important. Who coined the term Saturday Night Special to describe
#a small defensive handgun? When you find out, tell us why you used it
#here.
#
Am I to understand that you know the origins, and are just trying to
get the people that use the term ot research it? We covered this
a year or two ago. Do a Google search and you'll find it. Yes, its
a racist term. Yes, it was designed to disparage cheap handguns
used by poor and minorities to both defend themselves and to rob
stores and such. The goal then as now is to remove them because
in the eyes of the people using the term, they aren't worthy of the
right to self defense. I don't think you will find a "who" that
coined the term.
Dan Barch
# More important. Who coined the term Saturday Night Special to describe
# a small defensive handgun? When you find out, tell us why you used it
# here.
It has a general meaning of a cheap, small caliber gun with "only"
self defense or murder use. Others point to the racial issue but I
think that didn't come about till the 1920's. I once read an account
of someone looking into the window of a shop in the 1890's or so.
There was a small, cheap handgun with a couple of bullets next to it.
The sign said "Saturday Night Suicide Special".
Dan Barch
Lansing MI
Pete McMullen
Montell Williams wrote:
# Roscoe, is refering to an old buddy that you can count on to stand up
# with you when the chips are down. When your back is aginst the wall, '
# Rosco' won't let you down and will be at your side.
#
That's the best explanation I've heard yet... and its temperament and style
seem to fit the period.
:o)
--
"It is better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than to open it and
remove all doubt."
Mark Twain
nobody
"Ted Gittinger" <TGITT...@austin.rr.com> wrote in message
news:azvN7.3680$R24....@typhoon.austin.rr.com...
# I distinctly recall hearing of Saturday Night Specials and the phrase,
# "hotter'n a two-dollar pistol" in San Antonio police reports in the 1950s.
# This was also the age of zip guns, which were made from automobile
attennas,
# wood, and heavy rubber bands. All this antecedes the "liberal, left-wing
# media" by quite a bit., and has nothing to do with the Kennedys or their
# allies.
#
# Why do some folks have to put a political spin on everything?
#
# ted
Because it was Ted Kennedy that made the term "Saturday Night Specials" a
campaign term. His brother Bobby was shot by one (or so he claimed). He
tried, and almost succeeded, in outlawing "Saturday Night Specials" . In
the beginning the NRA even supported the legislation to ban the sale of
small cheap poorly made weapons that the NRA felt was probably more
dangerous to the shooter than the victim. Somewhere in the D.C. committee
rooms "Saturday Night Specials" became anything with less than a 12" barrel
and costing less than $10,000. NRA quickly saw the light and fought it
tooth and nail. The result was the 1968 gun legislation. If you read your
NRA magazine at the time you'd know this.
Joseph M. White
<TGITT...@austin.rr.com> wrote:
> ...
Because, sir or madam, there is no other way to describe the effect of
labelling an inexpensive weapon as unsafe and unsavory, suitable only
for poor black and hispanic people to kill each other with on Saturday
nights. Not only did it libel the weapon, it described, with a wink
and knowing nod, that blacks and hispanics were too savage and stupid
to be trusted with guns. (Look what they did every Saturday night.)
EVERYONE knew the full name that was implied for the gun. The
Democrats were the chief architects of gun control and the kennedys
were at the forefront of that assault on the Constitution. Each time
that Lee Harvey Oswald's crime was discussed, his mail order purchase
of the Carcano was mentioned, as was the price. Do you think that was
accidental? When Sirhan Sirhan killed the other kennedy, the first
evidence mentioned was the cheap revolver he used. How many times did
you hear how much Ted's Oldsmobile cost. How much did you hear about
the pollution it caused in the Chappaquidic? (An Oldsmobile is very
difficult to deploy as a defensive weapon, but it makes a hell of an
offensive weapon.)
Lastly, having lived near the Watts riots of '65, the news
coverage was filled with stories of blacks rampaging through Watts,
armed with "Saturday Night Specials", looting and killing. San Diego
also came close to rioting at the same time. The police chief went
into the minority neighborhood and told the residents that SD cops
would not emulate LA cops, they would shoot to kill and would not
tolerate looting AT ALL. Riot never happened. Wonder Why?
EVERYTHING ABOUT GUN CONTROL IS POLITICAL!! There is NO
logical basis for gun control. Every person who supports gun control
is telling you that they know what's best for you. They are telling
you that their right to a warm fuzzy feeling is more important than
your right to life or your wife's right to not be raped and/or
murdered. Heck, many of them have CCPs or bodyguards, so THEY know
they are lying through their teeth. Sharon Stone turning in her guns
for destruction is assinine theatre, at best, as she had armed
bodyguards accompanying her when she did it. The president of HCI had
a CCP, why should he wish to deny his maid the same protection when
she travelled home late at night?
So, sir or madam, ANY discussion of gun control is political
and is colored by each person's political views. Each mechanism or
chicanery employed in the battle for our rights or the denial of said
rights is political and suffers the same coloring effect. Finally, if
you examine the actions and backgrounds of those trying to effect
change, you can often discern the motive behind the desire for the
change. Is that person truly concerned for the welfare of the nation
or do they simply wish to exert control and not wish to be opposed
with force? (Hint: what was one of Hitler's first actions after
becoming the German Chancellor?)
flmflam
Well, I guess I'm just politically insensitive. The big sign in front
of the store on Rt. 19 says " HEY RAGHEADS, MORE TO COME". My small sign in
the window says "HEY RAGHEADS FUBAR ON YOU". Some of the "City Fathers"
have said they don't care for it. Oh well.
Thanks for the definition of ROSCOE. Brings back some good memories.
--
flmflam
A-1 Pawn & Jewelry
1925 S.E.Hwy 19
Crystal River, Florida, 34429
352-795-2777
fax: 352-795-2093
flm...@tampabay.rr.com
GaryDoc
# # a small defensive handgun? When you find out, tell us why you used it
# # here.
It was used to describe a poor man's gun in my youth, but I do not
know when it first appeared. In the South it was at times used to
describe a black man's gun and many people expressed the idea of
taking guns away from blacks. In other areas it was other ethnic
groups. However, it was as much class as race. Saturday night was the
big night out in the rural South and the "bad dudes" of any color were
inclined to use them when fighting over women or cards. The attitude
that guns are only for the upper class is not a dead issue at all, it
is merely that such ideas are glossed over and not mentioned in
public. Just like Rosie O'Dummy who wants guns taken away from other
people but who has an armed bodyguard.
By the way, I saw an interesting aspect of the rich trying to protect
themselves from us dangerous poor folks. One network showed the rising
popularity among the rich and famous of armored cars. They are buying
SUV's that have been bullet-proofed and even bomb-proofed. Armed
bodyguards and armored cars? Why do they need guns for themselves?
Especially if they take guns away from us dangerous po' folks!
Gary Doc
Hal Leahy
Missouri between the part of the Younger Gang and Pinkerton Detectives
http://www.rootsweb.com/~mostclai/battle.htm
Douglabue
#
# I wonder if the word has anything to do with the Gun Battle at Roscoe,
# Missouri between the part of the Younger Gang and Pinkerton Detectives
# http://www.rootsweb.com/~mostclai/battle.htm
#
Just had a hit on Google for the Probert Encyclopaedia:
Slang (J):John Roscoe is American slang for a pistol or revolver.
Doug T
Red
Happy New Year.
The only person in my fairly long time around guns was a Black friend who
was very fond of calling his pocket piece a 'Roscoe,' though everyone in our
group knew what Jamaica was talking about. His family is from middle
Georgia, as is a part of mine, from near Macon in a small town named Gray,
Georgia. We used to speak of knowing the same bunch of people when we grew
up but of all of those people, he was the only one to use the term 'Roscoe.'
Some of the people that we spoke of would have been embarrassed to have
heard us telling their secrets in the wide open, but we did enjoy the
gossip. Luckiest man I ever knew. He had one of those million dollar heart
attacks on the loading dock of the trucking company he drove for, and
managed to have about 6 active insurance policies that covered his medical,
disability, pain and anguish, and he retired then and there and the last
time I spoke to him, he was making more money at home than he ever did
before in his life when he was working. Fine role model for all of us.
Cordially,
Red
--
NRA Endowment,
Sam's Club Member,
Former L/Cpl Tenth Marine Regiment.
michael....@gmail.com
# Saw a small Saturday Night Special come into a shop (not safe to
# buy/fire/sell). It was called a "Roscoe". I was wondering what the origin
# of the word "Roscoe" is when referring to a firearm.
The earliest version of this description I have come across is in the Damon Runyon "Guys & Dolls" short stories of the 1930s