Reduced .223 loads
Dick Walker
preferably using SR4759.
I have got copies of Lee, Speer #13, ADI, Winchester and other manuals. Few
recent copies have any reduced load data.
Speer #13 has a reduced load using SR4759 for the .222 Rem (8 - 10 grs of
SR4759 with 55grs bullet), but none for .223 Rem (Only Accurate XMP 5744).
As the case is 15% bigger, I was thinking 9.2grs (start) to 11.5 grs (max),
but I know that the increase in case size does not mean a linear increase in
powder amount. I have purchased some SR4759 and am looking for reduced load
data for .223 Rem using IMR SR4759.
I have seen posts of people safely using Alliant Blue Dot to create reduced
/ Gopher / Squirrel / Turkey / Squib loads (11 - 14 grs), but Blue Dot is
difficult to source in Australia.
I wanted to get the loads down to .22 WMR - .22 Hornet type range. My reason
is, when I go out to shoot kangaroos on our farm and come across rabbits,
the noise scares off any foxes and kangaroos, so I normally leave them.
In addition, when a mob of Kangaroos hears a rifle blast, they scatter
quickly. There have been occasions when I have been shooting rabbits with my
..22LR and have come across Kangaroos. Close range head shoots with
Winchester Power Points will kill them cleanly, but they must be 25 - 50
metres away. The mob hardly moves with the noise of the .22 LR. Ideally a
..22 Hornet, K-Hornet, 218 Bee, 17 HMR or 19 Calhoon (looks ideal!!) would be
good, but I can't justify an additional rifle / scope / dies and sometimes
need the extra range of the .223, and my .223 (Weatherby Vanguard) is an
extremely accurate and reliable rifle, a pleasure to shoot.
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Greylock
not to start reducing the load you are using right now until accuracy begins
to fall off for your particular rifle.
You could load rounds reducing the powder charge by some reasonable
increment (as small as your patience will stand). At some point, you will
reach the minimum accurate loading with the slugs, powder, and cases you are
already using. Alternatively, you could quit when you reach an acceptable
noise level.
If you have stopped at the minimum accurate load, I would suggest that you
then move your charge back up a bit to give yourself a margin for error.
"Dick Walker" <tad...@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
news:b5f7l5$ssf$1...@grapevine.wam.umd.edu...
> ...
Few
> ...
(max),
> ...
in
> ...
load
> ...
reduced
> ...
reason
> ...
my
> ...
be
> ...
Clark Magnuson
lead bullets.
I just talked to her Saturday about it at the Monroe gun show, and they
are still making them.
http://www.libertyshootingsupplies.com/
Hoosierhoser
down to the levels you are wanting. In my 308 pistol, I reduce the loads by
35%-40% using AA2200 powder, but I make up the reduced case capacity with
granulated styrofoam. I experimented with pistol powders like AA #5 and AA #
9 and the granulated styrofoam case filler and got very accurate loads at 1500
+/- fps with a 180 grain bullet in the 308. You could try the same with the
223. I would start out with about 10 grains of powder and fill the rest of
the case up to the neck with the granulated styrofoam.
John Cowart
#
# I was looking to for some reduced loads for my .223 Rem bolt action rifle,
# preferably using SR4759.
#
# I have got copies of Lee, Speer #13, ADI, Winchester and other manuals. Few
# recent copies have any reduced load data.
The older Speer manuals have some reduced loads. The current Lyman
manual has reduced loads for cast bullets which might be adapted.
A completely different solution would be to use an adapter which allows
the use of 22lr ammunition in the .223 rifle. See
http://www.alexcartridge.com for some examples. This would allow you to
also use 22 shorts or even 22 CB caps, which are almost silent in a long
barreled rifle. Plus you get to spend more time shooting and less time
reloading.
I have one of these for my own .223, and it works well. It is a bit slow
to reload of course, and it shoots a lot lower than full power
ammunition.
John Cowart
Skip Hammond
# I wanted to get the loads down to .22 WMR - .22 Hornet type range. My
reason
# is, when I go out to shoot kangaroos on our farm and come across rabbits,
# the noise scares off any foxes and kangaroos, so I normally leave them.
#
# In addition, when a mob of Kangaroos hears a rifle blast, they scatter
# quickly. There have been occasions when I have been shooting rabbits with
my
# ..22LR and have come across Kangaroos. Close range head shoots with
# Winchester Power Points will kill them cleanly, but they must be 25 - 50
# metres away. The mob hardly moves with the noise of the .22 LR. Ideally a
# ..22 Hornet, K-Hornet, 218 Bee, 17 HMR or 19 Calhoon (looks ideal!!) would
be
# good, but I can't justify an additional rifle / scope / dies and sometimes
# need the extra range of the .223, and my .223 (Weatherby Vanguard) is an
# extremely accurate and reliable rifle, a pleasure to shoot.
Aren't sound suppressors relatively easy to own in Australia? A decent
muzzle can will take the noise of a .223 down to a level where you can shoot
without hearing protection - about the level of a 22 LR. Why not go that
way? Loading down is possible, but creates complications.
John Lyngdal
For a low velocity load try 8.0 gr of SR-4756 and a 45 grain Hornet
bullet(my Kimber prefers the Sierra bullet). The velocity is about
2100 fps. If you want to move it out a little faster, try 14.0 gr. of
2400 and 45 grain Hornet bullet wich will do close to 3000 fps. Both
these loads shoot sub-MOA in my rifle.
John in Oregon
Harry O'Connell
# preferably using SR4759.
#
# recent copies have any reduced load data.
Tell me about it ;?{
#
# Speer #13 has a reduced load using SR4759 for the .222 Rem (8 - 10 grs of
# SR4759 with 55grs bullet), but none for .223 Rem (Only Accurate XMP 5744).
# As the case is 15% bigger, I was thinking 9.2grs (start) to 11.5 grs (max),
# but I know that the increase in case size does not mean a linear increase in
# powder amount. I have purchased some SR4759 and am looking for reduced load
# data for .223 Rem using IMR SR4759.
#
# I have seen posts of people safely using Alliant Blue Dot to create reduced
# / Gopher / Squirrel / Turkey / Squib loads (11 - 14 grs), but Blue Dot is
# difficult to source in Australia.
#
I have successfully tried 4.5 to 5.5 grains of Red Dot with a 55grn
fmj boatail bullet.
Try this page also for some reduced loads:
http://www.accuratereloading.com/223rem.html
however they are also using Green and Red Dot for powders.
The Alliant powers are cheap and easy to get here, in the US. I can
walk into any back woods gunshop around the farm in Vermont and if
they sell powder, they will usualy have at least one pound of one of
the Alliant 'Dot' powders. When used for reduced rifle loadings, they
are fairly bulkey and take up a lot of space in the case. That makes
it easy for me to see any double charges. For a great 100-200 yard
7.62x52 load, the 12.5 grn Red Dot charge works out to about 3 cents
for the powder charge when you buy in bulk. Couple that with cast
lead bullets, and your talking about some cheap shooting.
The best source of reduced loads I've found so far is the Lyman cast
bullet handbook. Since they are keeping the velocities down for the
cast lead bullets, they tend to be on the mild side. I don't have mine
handy. I will not be able to get to it for at least another 2 weeks.
If I somehow manage to remember your question, I'll check it and see
if they have any suggestions.
A quick check of the
http://www.imrpowder.com/rifle/223r_index.html
website shows:
223 REMINGTON
REM. CASE; REM. 7 1/2 PR
SIERRA 45 GR. SPITZER
.224" DIA.; 24" BBL.; 2.190" C.O.L.
IMR Powder Charge (grains) Velocity (ft/sec) Chamber Press (cup)
SR 4759 17.5 3040 51000
223 REMINGTON
REM. CASE; REM. 7 1/2 PR
SIERRA 50 GR. SPITZER
.224" DIA.; 24" BBL.; 2.260" C.O.L.
IMR Powder Charge (grains) Velocity (ft/sec) Chamber Press (cup)
SR4759 17.5 2935 51900
.223 REMINGTON
REM. CASE; REM. 7 1/2 PR
HORNADY 55 GR. SPIRE PT. SX
.224" DIA.; 24" BBL.; 2.260" C.O.L.
IMR Powder Charge (grains) Velocity (ft/sec) Chamber Press (cup)
SR4759 16.5 2745 50100
They say start 10% below these, but no indication of any minimum safe
charge.
Dick W
# muzzle can will take the noise of a .223 down to a level where you can
shoot
# without hearing protection - about the level of a 22 LR. Why not go that
# way? Loading down is possible, but creates complications.
Sound suppressors / silencers are super illegal in Australia!!
Dick W
# manual has reduced loads for cast bullets which might be adapted.
Had I looked more closely at the Speer manual before posting, I would have
seen reduced loads using SR4759 for the 222 Rem Mag, as well as the 222 Rem.
Given the 223 Rem is in between capacity wise I'll work a load from there.
I'm going to try 9.0 gr SR4759 behind a Speer 40 gr Spire-SP. I'll let the
group know the results.
# A completely different solution would be to use an adapter which allows
# the use of 22lr ammunition in the .223 rifle. See
# http://www.alexcartridge.com for some examples. This would allow you to
# also use 22 shorts or even 22 CB caps, which are almost silent in a long
# barreled rifle. Plus you get to spend more time shooting and less time
# reloading.
But working on a load is fun isn't it? Looks like an excellent cost
effective alternative. The reloading speed looks like a bit of a pain.
Thanks, I'll consider it as an option.
# I have one of these for my own .223, and it works well. It is a bit slow
# to reload of course, and it shoots a lot lower than full power
# ammunition.
#
# John Cowart
Thanks John for your post.
Guess Who?
Are Kangaroos good to eat? It would seem like the tail might have
quite a bit of meat on it, not to mention all the rest...
Don
Dick W
# Are Kangaroos good to eat? It would seem like the tail might have
# quite a bit of meat on it, not to mention all the rest...
# Don
Well, it is very lean, very dark meat. It does get exported to Germany for
small goods manufacture. I've had it once, very rich. We mainly cull them to
reduce competition for pasture. We do cut the legs off and use them for
working dog food. There is an enormous amount of meat in the top of the
legs, right up into the back. On the larger roos we cut the tail and up onto
the back too. There is little to no fat.
We have been having the worst drought in over 100 years and so competition
for pasture was a real issue. We have a lot of scattered timber, State
Forest and Nation Park bordering our property. The roos come into the
paddocks at night to feed. Before Xmas one paddock about 70 acres which was
sown with turnips for feed had 80+ roos on it in the daylight. In less than
a week there was no turnips left!
In normal years kangaroo numbers are not as big a problem, there is enough
green feed for them in the timber and they don't come onto farm land in such
big numbers. Usually we don't miss the amount that they eat. Now that we
have had some rains and there is a green pick all over the paddocks they are
heading back in again. Shooting at them makes them shy and they do retreat
into the bush. Sometimes in open country, in daylight, you may see a mob of
20, you shoot 1 and the rest take off at high speed and you are unable to
get off a second shot. In timbered or steep terrain or at night you can cull
more.
Hopefully the rain will continue, the grass will grow in the timbered areas
and they'll head back deeper into the bush. They are quite an amazing animal
to watch. In normal years we just ignore the few that come onto the farm. No
body wants to eradicate them. We have a smaller variety called a Wallaby,
which tend to be more colourful, reds and blacks with white & black face
markings. Due to their smaller size and smaller groups I never shoot them.
I'm looking forward to not having to shoot any and just concentrate on
rabbits, foxes, feral cats and the occasional (and very destructive) feral
pig.
Cheers, Dick
Lone_Wolf
> ...
Roo's are reasonable to eat. Used to be a restaurant in Huntsville, AL, that
would serve 'roo meat, until somebody made it difficult/impossible for them to
get any more of the meat.
James
> ...
Guess Who?
hind leg, if the meat wasn't too tough.
Seems a shame to waste all the meat.
Don
Harry O'Connell
# I was looking to for some reduced loads for my .223 Rem bolt action rifle,
# preferably using SR4759.
#
41 gr. cast #2 alloy GC, Remington cases and CCI450 primers 2.034" OAL
start Velo Press Max Velo Press
Powder grains FPS CUP grains FPS CUP
SR4759 12.0 1878 18100 15.0 2612 31400
45 gr. cast #2 alloy GC, Remington cases and CCI450 primers 2.060" OAL
powder start Velo Press Max Velo Press
grains FPS CUP grains FPS CUP
SR4759 12.0 1853 18200 16.0 2640 35900
54 gr. cast #2 alloy GC, Remington cases and CCI450 primers 2.090" OAL
start Velo Press Max Velo Press
Powder grains FPS CUP grains FPS CUP
SR4759 11.3 1762 20700 17.7 2611 43600
As always, do not rely on this data. Consult the original source for loading data.
Good Luck,
harry